Hello and welcome to Edenred Q1 2025 Revenue Conference Call. My name is Rushdie, and I will be your coordinator for today's event. Please note that this call is being recorded, and for the duration of the call, your lines will be on listen only. However, you will have the opportunity to ask questions at the end of the call. This can be done by pressing star one on your telephone keypad to register your question. I will now hand you over to your host, Mr. Bertrand Dumazy, to begin today's conference. Please go ahead.
Good morning. I am Bertrand Dumazy, the Chairman and CEO of Edenred. I'm surrounded by our IR officer, Cédric Appert, but also Patrick Bataillard, our interim CFO till June 2 of this year. Thank you for being with us today for me to share the Edenred Q1 2025 revenue presentation. We'll be together for the next 60 minutes. I will start with a presentation. You should have the slides, and then I will be more than happy to answer any question you may have. I propose that we move to slide two in the executive summary. What are the main messages of our Q1 publication? First of all, we deliver top-line growth in line with our expectation despite a tougher macro environment, especially in Europe.
The operating revenue is up 7.1% like for like, driven by a good performance in Latin America and in mobility, but also by our Beyond Food and Beyond Fuel digital services. The second message is, in fact, we continue to deploy our Beyond strategy, and it gives us an advantage based on this very unique platform serving millions of users, 60 million of them around the world. The third message, page three, Edenred is able to confirm its target for full year 2025. What does it mean? An EBITDA growth like for like of at least 10% and a cash conversion, i.e., EBITDA to free cash flow conversion rate superior to 70%. We confirm our target, but we remain vigilant on any further macroeconomic deterioration. You know as much as I know that we are living in a very disrupted environment.
These objectives are possible thanks to the dynamic we have on our top line, but also it's going to be led by operating performance optimization. What does it mean? Our Fit for Growth Plan, which is focused on cost efficiency, but also our Product Improvement Plan for a few businesses that are performing below Edenred standards. Finally, a rationalization of our portfolio. For example, we exit the B2C bus activities. I propose that now we move to the highlight of the quarters. If we go now into more details, let's move to page six. You see that our operating revenue has been growing by 7.1% like for like, moving from EUR 625 million to EUR 667 million. It is the symbol of our continued success on the core, but also on the beyond solutions, allowing us to drive further market penetration despite two headwinds.
The first one, an economic slowdown in Europe, especially in France and in Germany. I also remember a very high basis of comparison in Q1 because in Q1 2024 versus Q1 2023, we grew as much as 16.9% like for like. If we move to page seven and look at the breakdown of the growth per business line, first of all, mobility representing 26% of our operating revenue in Q1. Mobility has been growing at almost 12% like for like. Benefits and engagement representing 65% of our operating revenue. Benefits and engagement business line has been growing at 7.6%. If we move to page eight and we look at the breakdown of the growth of our operating revenue per geographies, you see that in Latin America, we are growing like for like at 16.3%. Latin America representing 30% of our operating revenue.
Rest of the world is growing double digit as well, 16.7% like for like in this first quarter. As I previously said, we see a slowdown in Europe. Europe has been growing at 5% reported in Q1 and 1.2% like for like in Q1. If we go into more details as to the understanding of the growth, we start page nine with the difference between meal and food and beyond food. In meal and food, when you look at the business volume growth in Q1 2025, like for like and excluding the consumption vouchers in Belgium, it is a program that was launched and stopped, in fact, in 2024. If you look at the performance of the core of meal and food, we have been growing like for like in Q1 2025 by more than 8%.
What is interesting is to look at the acceleration of our beyond food, which represents more than 30% of, in fact, the operating revenue for this business line. You see a strong acceleration of the growth moving from 13.5% to 16.9%, excluding the gift solutions. You know, we have a high basis of comparison, in fact, due to the program that were not as good as we expected in Q4 2024. If we continue the analysis for the mobility business line, page 10, you see that in terms of the core of the mobility, which is our fuel activities, you see a growth that is at 7.7% like for like versus 7.5% in 2024. When we look at the beyond fuel, just like with the beyond food, you see an acceleration moving from 10.5% to 15.1%.
It is the confirmation of the solidity of our beyond strategy. We are serving 60 million users around the world via 1 million corporate clients with a very unique digital platform on which we can serve more and more our clients with additional services, accelerating the cross-selling and the upselling, which is one of the advantages of the platform. Now, if we move into the highlights of the quarter per business line, what are the few things that I would like to share with you? Page 12, if we start with the first business line, which is benefit and engagement, you know that one of the drivers on the growth on top of the penetration and the upselling and the cross-selling is obviously the face value. In fact, I have some good news to share with you.
In 2024, we had 10 countries that increased their maximum legal face value. In fact, in the first quarter of 2025, we already have eight countries that have increased their maximum legal face value in 2025 for an average of 4.3%. What does it mean? If you remember the principle based on our historical observation, it takes about two years to go after the 85% usage of the face value, legal face value increase. The 10 countries that have increased their maximum face value in full year 2024, it is going to contribute to the growth in 2025 as it contributed to the growth in 2024. Now that we are recharging with additional eight countries in 2025, it will contribute to the growth of 2025, but also to the growth of 2026.
If we move now to the second business line, which is mobility, page 13, we selected for you two examples to demonstrate the upselling capabilities of Edenred, but also the cross-selling capacity. As to the upselling capabilities, we took the example of the fact that we became the exclusive fuel provider for Mexican central administration. What does it mean? It is a fleet of 75,000 vehicles. We started a relationship five years ago. Slowly, but surely, we increased our share of wallet, and we are very pleased to have 100% of the total needs of the central administration of Mexico for the first time in our history. In 2025, it means 55 million additional liters that are expected for 2025. It is an example of our capabilities in terms of upselling. We can start slow. We can start low.
Thanks to our digital platform, our innovation capabilities, and our sales and marketing efforts, slowly and surely, we are able to increase our share of wallet and so our upselling capabilities. Second example in mobility in Europe this time. In fact, it's a worldwide partnership, but with a European partner, one of the leaders of the truck business, which is Daimler. We started a partnership many years ago. We started with providing a fuel card to any owner of a Daimler Truck and to have access to a fuel network of 68,000 fuel stations in 37 different countries. Then we were able to provide toll and maintenance, and we are very pleased to have signed a few weeks ago an extension of our partnership with the fact that we will provide for any user owner of a Daimler Truck an EV charging network.
It means 300 truck-compatible charging stations in 28 countries. This is another example of our cross-selling capacity, but also surfing on the electrification wave of the mobility that we are seeing everywhere in Europe. It is true for the light vehicles, but also for the heavy vehicles like the trucks. If we move now to page 14 and for the third business line, the complementary solutions, here we selected an example of our product innovation based on the leverage of our specific purpose payment capabilities and our platform. We are able to deploy new programs and new programs also in complementary solution. Tarjeta Rosa is a new public social program in the state of Guanajuato in Mexico. This state represents 5% of the Mexican population.
It's for almost 600,000 mothers that are cardholders of the Tarjeta Rosa, and they will be able to benefit from health services and additional purchasing power through the usage of this Tarjeta Rosa that is, in fact, issued and emulated by Edenred. It represents EUR 260 of annual subsidy per mother and, as I said, per year. It is a good example of the leverage of our innovation capabilities, specific purpose payment. I took an example in Mexico, but you remember that we are in 45 countries, and specific purpose payment is a technology of some interest for public social programs. You want the founders of the program. They want to know where and when the money is spent. I propose now to move into more details as to the Q1 2025 revenue. If we move to page 16, we post a reported operating revenue of EUR 660 million.
It is a growth of 7.1%. Behind that, you have some scope effect and currency effect. The scope effects are due to the acquisition of IPE, Spirii, PagBem, and RB Servicios, representing an impact of plus 4%. We have a currency impact mainly driven by the weakness of the Brazilian real and the Mexican peso in Q1 2025, representing minus 4.5%, leading to this reported growth of 6.7% of our operating revenue. If we move to page 17, what does it mean in Latin America? We are pleased to post double-digit like-for-like growth in Latin America. Latin America representing 30% of our operating revenue. It means a like-for-like growth of 16.3% in Q1 2025 versus 2024, as reported, almost 8%. If we look per major geographies, and if we start with Brazil, you see an acceleration of the growth in Brazil.
We were at 10% in Q4 2024, and we are moving at 16%. What is behind the 16%? Double-digit growth in benefits and engagement, and for the meal and food core solutions, but also for the beyond food solutions. In mobility, a very dynamic growth as well that has been augmented by the beyond fuel solutions, maintenance, toll, and freight payment that have been growing at double digit in Q1 2025. If we look at Hispanic Latin America, we are able to post in Q1 double-digit like-for-like growth in both benefits and engagement and mobility. It means a growth if we exclude, in fact, the Argentinian hyperinflation in 2024. It is a growth of 14.8% in Q1 2025. If we move to Europe, yes, in Europe, it is a soft start to the year, as expected, and as shared with you during our 2024 results.
First, general comment for the entire continent of Europe. We have a context of macroeconomic slowdown, but we also have something that is specific to Edenred, which is a high basis of comparison. If we move into the geographical breakdown, and if we start with France, the good news is in 2024, Edenred in France has gained market share in the meal vouchers market. Having said that, we post a growth of +0.4%, which varies, in fact, a drag of the gift activity as a consequence of the low performance of our gift campaign in Q4 2024. As you know, the campaign is the last quarter of the year, but it has some economic implication in terms of reimbursement volume in the first quarter of the year after. We have this drag, and we also have a slowdown of the activity in France, leading to this 0.4%.
Once again, the good news is market share gain. If we look at the rest of Europe, and we start with benefits and engagement, we are able to post a steady performance in Southern Europe, but we have a high basis of comparison in Q1 2024. We discussed previously about the consumption voucher program in Belgium. In fact, because the program has been stopped in Q1 2025, we still have this impact in terms of basis of comparison. As to the mobility in the rest of Europe, we have a positive commercial traction of Edenred UTA. It is partly offset by Edenred Finance performance, which is in our portfolio of business where we need to accelerate our development.
I do not have news that I can share with you this quarter, but hopefully for the presentation of the results H1, we will be able to demonstrate the rebound in this activity. That is for the soft start to the year in Europe. Now, if we move to the other revenue, we can confirm another revenue floor at EUR 210 million for 2025. The performance in Q1 2025 is at EUR 57 million, which is a like-for-like growth of 1.9%, but reported it is a decrease because in Q1 2024, we posted EUR 60 million. What are the drivers behind that? The positive one is our float increase, which is due to our BV business volume increase, but also an upward trend in Brazilian interest rates.
On the headwinds, we have a downward trend in the Eurozone interest rates, and we have some negative Forex impact, which explains the difference between a like-for-like growth of 1.9% and a reported decrease of 5.2%. Thanks to these Q1 results and thanks to the wise management of the other revenue, we are able to confirm a floor at EUR 210 million for 2025. It leads to the final equation of revenue, page 20, a total revenue of EUR 724 million in Q1 2025, which is a like-for-like growth of 6.7%. We have some scope effect due to the acquisition of IPE, Spirii, PagBem, and RB Servicios, but then a currency impact mainly led by the Brazilian real and the Mexican peso. A reported growth of 5.7%. After this Q1 2025 revenue results, what does it mean for the rest of the year?
Page 2022, despite a challenging macro environment and the impact of the FICAP in Italy, which will take effect from Q3 onward, we confirm our full year 2025 guidance, which is an EBITDA like-for-like growth of at least 10% and a cash conversion of 70% and plus for the year 2025. As said in introduction, we live in a very disrupted environment. Every week, we all receive everywhere around the world some signals that can be positive and negative, but that creates, in fact, some unstability. As you know, capitalism does not like unstability, and the CEOs, they do not like that as well. We need to remain vigilant on any further macroeconomic deterioration. This growth in 2025 will be delivered thanks to four factors on the top line.
First of all, a business model that is strong and that relies on the recurrence of our revenues. We have a diversified business mix and multilocal footprint, and we see that clearly in Q1 2025. Yes, it's soft in Europe, but strong in the rest of the world. Yes, it's softer on the meal and food, but stronger on mobility. Yes, it can be slightly softer on the core, but we have the beyond products that are accelerating. That is the fourth point. The acceleration of our beyond strategy is one of the pillars of the growth for 2025. Finally, the relevance of our solution offering, thanks to our unique platform serving 60 million users around the world, plus 10 million users, in fact, in three years, we are able more and more to leverage these technological capabilities.
To give you an example, when we talked about the Tarjeta Rosa in Mexico, the solution has been developed and deployed in less than three weeks. The year 2025 is a year of growth on the top line, but also a year of higher operating profitability. This higher operating profitability will be supported by a focus on cost efficiency, the program that we call Fit for Growth, but also the implementation of our performance product improvement plan and a portfolio review. The year 2025 for Edenred is a year of growth of the top line, but also operating efficiency to meet our guidance of 10% growth EBITDA like for like. In page 23, you have an illustration of what it means.
First bucket of growth is the operating revenue growth, thanks to the core, thanks to the beyond, and thanks to the M&A integration, but also focused management actions for operational efficiency, Fit for Growth, product performance, and portfolio review. We also know that we have some headwinds. In 2025, we will have a drop in other revenue, but with a floor expected at EUR 210 million. As you know, we have a FICAP in Italy, and the FICAP estimate is about EUR 60 million. The combination of those elements leads to an equation of 10% and more like-for-like growth for the operating revenue. Thank you for your attention. Page 2024 is a gentle reminder as to our capital market day that will happen in Paris on November the 4th. Thank you for your attention, and I am all yours to answer any question you may have.
Thank you, Mr. Dumazy. As a reminder, if you'd like to ask a question or make a contribution on today's call, please press star one. We'll start off with the line of Mr. André Julliard from Deutsche Bank. Please go ahead.
Good morning. Thank you for taking my question. First one is about regulation. Could you give us some more color about what is happening in Italy and France? Second question, could you also update us on the reorganization of CSI in the United States? At last, about Reward Gateway deployment, could you also update us on how it goes and what are the first takeaways you are having on this part? Thank you.
Good morning, André. Thank you for your question. Regulation.
Regulation in France, the minister, Véronique Louwagie, set an agenda, and she said phase one is what they called consultation or concertation, so listening to all the stakeholders, the employers, the employees, the issuers, the merchants. This consultation phase is supposed to be over by this month. If we understand the minister, she said that there will be the synthesis and a platform of synthesis that is going to be put on the table within, in fact, by the summer, and then go to the Parliament for a vote. Our understanding, based on the conversation we have in the different round tables, is the following one. Priority number one is do everything possible to make sure that there is more ticket restaurants in France because the penetration is only 28%. It's low as compared to many other countries.
How do we make sure that this measure, which is a measure of equity or, let's say, equality between the people who have access to a canteen and the people who do not have access to a canteen, to make sure that more and more people who do not have access to a canteen have access to ticket restaurants? The priority for the government, based on our understanding, is to help grow the business. The second priority is to decrease the cost of operating for the merchants. What does it mean? It means digitalization. The French market is digital at only 80%. The cost of dealing with the paper with 14 different issuers, 14 and more, the cost is not sustainable. Priority number one is the end of paper in France. Our understanding is it should happen in 2026.
2025 could be the last year of paper in France. The second priority is the clarification of the usage. Can we use that in restaurants? Yes. Can we use that in hypermarkets and supermarkets? Yes, but under certain conditions and for certain products. There is still a need for clarification in terms of usage. Our understanding on the third point is clarity on the prices, i.e., depending on the model. Closed loop, for example, for Edenred, open loop from some other players to make sure that the tariffs are clear, especially in open loop, because the interchange does not always appear in the tariffication of the people that are using this kind of technology. It is our understanding of, let's say, the main points of what will be the reform of the ticket restaurant in France. Your question was about Italy.
In Italy, today, there is no change as the cap of 5%. We are getting organized as to the rebalancing. What I can share with you is, as of today, because that's something we follow, obviously, in a very disciplined manner, as of today, in terms of renegotiation, i.e., the rhythm of the renegotiation, and as to the rhythm of rebalancing, we are in the plan we define for the year 2025. Your second question was about the third was about Reward Gateway, how it goes. It's double-digit growth, good success, in fact, in the U.S., in the U.K., in Australia, which is the historical basis of the business, good deployment in France, Belgium, and Romania. For example, in Belgium, we transferred all the users of our platform of engagement that was much more limited than the one of Reward Gateway.
Everything has been, in fact, moved to the Reward Gateway platform with great success because we see a level of engagement, a level of usage, and a level of spending that has dramatically improved based on the quality of the digital service that we are proposing. As to the synergies, you know that in 2024, we were in line with our plan, and for the first quarter of 2025, we are also in line with the objectives we set. As to Reward Gateway integration, synergy generation, migration, and conquest of new markets, so far, it is according to the plan that we set at the time of the acquisition. Your second question as to CSI. CSI double-digit growth for many years, flat in 2024. We decided to change a certain number of things. First of all, a renewed management team. Second thing, a new commercial ambition.
Third thing, reinvestment on the platform to adapt better to the evolution of the corporate payment in the U.S.. We are in the middle of the work in a tough economic environment in the U.S. because, as you know, due to the uncertainty that has been created at, let's say, the commercial level and decisions that were made at the American government, it creates uncertainty, and it creates some negative impact on the level of activity. To make a long story short, CSI, we are in the middle of the work. We are seeing some improvements, and it's encouraging, but there's still some way to go.
Very clear. Thank you very much.
If you find that your question has been answered, please press star two to remove yourself. We'll take the next line from Ed Yang from Morgan Stanley. Please go ahead. Thank you.
I've got two questions if that's okay. The first is, you've talked a little bit, Bertrand, about the macroeconomic situation. I think that's obviously very understandable with everything that's going on, and you've inserted a little bit of clarifying language on your guidance about remaining vigilant. I wonder if you could tell us if you're seeing any changes so far on the client side, and what is it you're looking for in order to gauge what the impact might be on the business? The second one is related to this on the cost side. You've talked about a cost suppression program, and you've spoken that there were some areas around sales or other areas where you're going to protect costs, and otherwise, you're looking to suppress them. Would you be inclined to take more aggressive cost action to protect achieving your target if macro did get worse? Thank you.
Ed, thank you for your two questions. First of all, as to the macroeconomic environment, uncertainty, in fact, increases the decision-making process. You know, we see it everywhere in Europe. As to the middle market and the SMEs, we see the fact that it takes longer time today to close and to sign a contract with the middle market and the SMEs. Myself, I took some time to listen to some of the prospects, and basically, I will summarize it very simply. I want the Edenred solution. Send me the contract. I'm okay on everything, but I will sign as soon as I know that, in fact, what's going on on the international scene and what's going to be the impact for me. We are in a phase where it takes longer to sign on the new business.
The second thing that I see, and we do not see it yet in the numbers, but be prepared for that. Unemployment will go up because that is another thing we look at very closely. We look at our portfolio, and we look at how many orders are done from one month to another, client per client. When the order in number of users is going down, the question we ask ourselves is, does it mean that part of it went to the competition, or does it mean that, in fact, the employer has fewer employees? The good news is we are gaining market share everywhere around the world. It is not as if the business was going to somebody else.
The bad news is, for many clients, especially on the temp business, especially on what we call the ESN, i.e., consulting services, especially technological consulting, we see those employers that, in fact, have fired some people. I can tell you for sure that you will see the unemployment going up in Europe because I see it today in my portfolio. The good news is we are able to compensate that thanks to, in fact, good activities on new clients, so more penetration, but also on our churn, we are very stable. It is not as if we were losing to the competition some clients. Yes, the macroeconomic environment has, in fact, an impact on the unemployment and so the total number of users in the historical portfolio. The last element is the number of kilometers that is driven by the fleet under our management.
If you have a lower growth, obviously, the vehicles are driven less on a daily basis. The good news is we are able to accelerate on the beyond in mobility, as I demonstrated earlier. That is why we are very vigilant on the macroeconomic environment because, for us, the tariffs have no impact because we are multi-local. We do not import. We do not export anything. So we are immune directly from the tariffs. Indirectly, a lower GDP growth is no good for the kilometers driven and the unemployment. Having said that, our job is to compensate via the beyond strategy and more penetration. That is for what we are looking at. As you rightly said, it is a balance between the top-line growth, but also our operational efficiency. What have we been doing?
In fact, we have a program, Fit for Growth, with a certain number of streams on which we want to be more efficient. First of all, at Edenred, we were focused on growth, growth, growth. I remember that we multiplied by two our operating EBITDA in three years. When you do that, certainly, you lose a little bit of efficiency. For example, we will implement shared business services in finance, in HR, in legal as well, which is a source of, let's say, efficiency. The second thing is we have been increasing a lot our investment in technology. I shared that with you. You repair your roof when it's sunny. When we had all this growth, it's the right moment to accelerate for the convergence of our platform and the development of our digital platform. Now we are into a phase where we'll continue to invest.
The tech investment will grow in 2025, but will not grow at 15% or 20% as we did during the last three years. It is the right timing because we need to have a return on investment on everything we invested for the last few years. One thing we do not do is decreasing our investment in client-facing and revenue-generating activities. We need to continue to invest a lot on these activities to fuel the growth. I take an example. Middle market or SMEs, telesales, you need lead generation. The thing you do not want to limit the increase of your investment is less lead. We are on an under-penetrated market. There are still a lot to go after. To be able to do it, marketing investment, for example, in lead generation is key.
After that, you need to have the workforce to transform the lead generation into sales and good contract with the highest face value possible. We are very, very disciplined in where we want efficiency, so the back offices, where we want to invest in the technology, but at a pace that reflects all the investments we did before. The things where we continue to invest full blast, sales and marketing, i.e., client-facing and revenue-generating activities.
Thank you. Can I just perhaps follow up on the cost side? You've explained in a very detailed way the mentality towards it, but what I was wondering about is, would you be willing to do more than you were planning if the top line was worse because of macro? Obviously, you're saying you'll protect revenue, lead generation.
You're talking about the efficiencies, but some of those projects like HR and central services are going to take longer than a few months to do. They're going to be multi-year projects. Is there an incentive there, or do we just sort of think about this as the cost side? You're already planning efficiencies in the shape you think is correct, and therefore, if the top line is a bit lower, that will just have to be reflected in the numbers. How do we think about that?
Yes. Ed, as of today, the equation is balanced, i.e., what we have in our efficiency program. Once again, the operating expenses of Edenred will grow in 2025. As of Q1 2025, we are in our line to be able to deliver the 10% EBITDA for like-for-like growth.
As I said, we live in a very disrupted world. The thing I will not do is compromise the future of Edenred. What does it mean? It means that if the macroeconomic environment becomes so ugly, and if the impact on our business line is more important than we expect, we will get back to you because one thing I will not do for Edenred is to compromise the future growth of Edenred. We will do what is needed from an efficiency point of view, but in fact, we don't do it for 2025. We are doing it for the next three to five years. Shared business services, it's not for one year. By the way, in fact, year one, shared business services cost you more than it brings. We do it for the future of Edenred.
Continuing to invest in our tech, but let's say at a pace that is more reasonable versus the growth of the top line, it's just hygiene. We need to adapt, and we did a lot of investment in the past. No, there will be no compromise as to the potential future growth of Edenred. So far so good. We are in our line, and we'll see how it goes. As you know, the world became very unpredictable. Having said that, we have a very resilient model as well.
Okay. Thank you for the detail. Thank you.
We'll take our next question from Justin Forsythe from UBS. Please go ahead.
Thank you very much. I have a couple of questions from my end here as well. I wanted to hit a little bit on the growth algorithm.
I think, if I heard you correctly, Bertrand, the back-of-envelope math suggests that those three impacts you talked about in Europe, maybe excluding that, you would have been closer to the Q4 exit rate. I just wanted to think about the phasing for European revenue growth throughout the year. Some of that stuff, I think, is not recurring, the negative impacts. How should we think about the puts and takes there? I guess the other implication on the back of that is, and I think you were alluding to this as well, is that a more negative, incrementally negative macro situation, i.e., lower employment as an example, would perhaps be an incremental negative. Maybe you could just re-highlight those two points. Separately, I wanted to hone in a little bit on Brazil and had a question specific to PagBem.
Just wanted to clarify how you were recording that within your numbers, if that was hitting scope at any point in time, because I believe that joint venture has gone live. I guess more holistically, is that helping to fuel some of the acceleration in beyond fuel growth in the business? Thank you very much.
Justin, thank you for your questions. First of all, the link between fuel and beyond fuel. Yes, there is a link because, in fact, you need a portfolio of users of the core solutions to be able to propose additional services. At the same time, when you come with an offer with the core plus the beyond, in fact, in tenders, you increase your chances of winning because many clients love the potentiality of having more than a fuel card or an energy card.
Obviously, there is a link between the one and the other. Having said that, the level of penetration of beyond, let's say the level of cross-selling on beyond, is not yet where we would like it to be. To make a long story short, you need the core business to sell the beyond, but having the beyond when you sell the core business increases your chances to win. That's the first element. The second element, as I said, the level of cross-selling reveals still a lot of potential. I'm sure you remember that for what we shared with you in February 2025, we said that the average number of additional solutions that is sold is about 1.4, and we have some countries where we are at 4 or 5. That's something we are working on. You had a question as to PagBem.
In fact, we made the merge between our cargo/fret activities with PagBem in December 2024. In fact, it is part of the scope effect that you see, and it is where I try to show you have between the like-for-like and the published, you have a scope effect, and the scope, obviously, is not in the like-for-like. For the year one, the merge between PagBem and our cargo activities is not in the like-for-like, but it is in the published. You had a question as to the growth algorithm and the soft start in Europe. As I said, in Europe, you have one element that is due to Edenred, which is a high basis of comparison. If I remember correctly, we were close to 13% growth in Europe in Q1 2024. That is the basis of comparison.
We had, in the basis of comparison, as I said, the consumption voucher in Belgium that is gone. We have a drag as to the gifting activities where our campaign was not as good as expected in Q4 2024. As we said, we have, for now, a below-standard department, Edenred Finance, previously known as EBV, where, in fact, we had a super good ride for many years, and the year 2024 was not as good as expected. It's a good kick in our butt. We are working hard on it. As I said, the rebound is very close. We are very pleased by the performance improvement plan that has been put in place. Those elements are very specific to Edenred and contributed to the soft start of Edenred in Q1 2025. That is one thing. Soft start in Europe.
As I said, the numbers of kilometers driven in Europe is at a low level, but for mobility, we are able to compensate thanks to a very good dynamism in terms of product innovation and sales on the beyond. In the toll, in the maintenance, in the telematics, we are progressing well in Europe. The second thing is, as I said, in food and meal in Europe, we saw it mainly in France and Germany, but it's not super brilliant in the rest of Europe as well. We see some portfolios where, in fact, if you used to order 100, you're going to order 99 the next month. Why? Because you let go one person.
That's why I said to you, you will see the employment rate rising in Europe for sure in H2 because those people are not yet registered, but they will appear in the stats in the second part of the year. By the way, I'm sure you saw the stat of the French government who said that the unemployment rate will move from 7.5% to up to 8%, in fact, in the second part of the year. That's something we need to take into account. Once again, we are here to compensate and grow. More penetration, i.e., very good new sales activities, as low as possible churn, and acceleration on additional services with the cross-selling and the upselling.
Got it. Thank you for the detailed response. Just a quick clarification on that France point. I think that was really good color.
I guess on the benefit side of things, you walked through some of the impacts there. So Edenred Finance, gifting in Belgium. Just confirming, I think all of those have the potential, well, at least we know gifting is like a Q4 and Q1 phenomenon. Belgium, I think, was also specific to a couple of certain quarters. Then you noted the potential offset to Edenred Finance as you've invested in, I think, a potential large contract to come through. It is possible that that effectively could be resetting almost at the Q4 exit rate in Q2 if all of that goes as planned.
Yes. In fact, Justin, you are right. Gifting, we should not see the impact in Q2 of this year. It's behind us. In Belgium, in fact, it should be over, in fact, in Q2 as well.
As to Edenred Finance, previously known as EBV, in fact, the underperformance started, in fact, in Q4. The rebound, we should see it, in fact, commercially, I guess, in H2 2025. In the numbers, the basis of comparison will not be there anymore in Q4 2025.
Got it. That's very clear. Thank you so much. Appreciate it.
Due to the limited time, please kindly limit your questions to two maximum to allow us to take as many questions as we could. We'll take our next question from the line of Pravin Gondhale from Barclays. Please go ahead.
Hi, morning. Thanks for taking my question. Firstly, on France, you previously mentioned that during your discussion, the discussion is around clarity on prices depending on the model, i.e., closed loop versus open loop. Are we talking about a regulation on dual pricing model for those different models here?
Can you please clarify that? Then secondly, on the face value revisions, the eight countries which saw face value increases in Q1, what proportion of revenues does that represent for Edenred's employee benefits? Thank you.
Okay. Pravin, thank you for your question. No, there is no regulation between closed loop and open loop or different pricing. The only thing I was saying is, in fact, you can use many different pieces of technology to serve the clients. Based on the pieces of technologies, and it is very technical, the way it is billed to the client can be via different ways. Sometimes part of the fees, it is not the case of Edenred, but it is the case for certain newcomers, some of the fees are paid via the acquisition cost that is paid by the merchants to the acquiring bank.
To make a long story short, if you go on the Edenred site, as a merchant, you have a public tariff, and that's super clear because you will not pay more than what it is said on our public tariff. For certain newcomers that are using different pieces of technology, sometimes they forget to mention additional fees that will be paid indirectly by the merchants to their acquiring banks. Okay? What the minister wants is a clarity on prices, i.e., what is the total cost of the service that is provided by the issuers. There is no regulation on that. There is no willingness to regulate that. There is only the willingness to be transparent on how much it costs. Your second question was as to the number of countries since, or let's say, in Q1 2025 that have proposed, in fact, a face value increase.
The eight countries represent, let's say, about 20% of our group operating revenue.
Thank you. That's really helpful, Julien. And I'm wishing you all the best for your future in the management. Thank you.
Thank you, Pravin. We take all the encouragement in a disrupted world.
We'll now take our next question from Simona Salri from Bank of America. Please go ahead.
Yes. Thanks for taking my question on behalf of Simona Salri. Both of my two questions are on the contribution of hyperinflation to the organic growth. First, in Argentina, an indication specifically about the contribution to mobility growth, and then an indication about the contribution to Turkish inflation. Thank you.
Okay. As to Argentinian hyperinflation, you have a slide, page 30, in the appendix. As a reminder, we expect, in fact, the impact of hyperinflation in Argentina to be at about 0.5% for the entire year.
It is much less than last year. If there is no devaluation of the Argentinian peso, we should avoid the effect that we saw in Q4 2024. To make a long story short, Argentina is still in hyperinflation, but the impact, in fact, on our total level of growth is now or should be super limited in 2025. As to Turkey, I do not have the answer to your question, so I propose that you contact Cédric.
Okay. Thank you. Any indication specifically on mobility for Argentina?
For Argentina, mobility Q1 2025. Cédric, I need your help on this one.
Yeah. You know that mobility is 25% of our operating revenue, and Argentina is mostly in mobility, which means that if you look at the impact at group level, it is 0.4%.
You need to multiply by about four, so it drives to, let's say, 1.5% contribution into mobility growth.
Okay. Thanks so much.
If you feel that your question has been answered, please press star two.
Maybe we're going to take one last question unless two questions. Okay?
All right. So we'll start with the line of Josh Levin from Autonomous Research. Please go ahead.
Good morning. Two questions. First, just a follow-up on the Argentina hyperinflation. In the last few days, Argentina signed a deal with the IMF that will allow the currency to devalue somewhat. Should we still think that that 50 basis points per quarter is still valid, or should we might be thinking it might be a little bit different given that the currency could actually devalue fairly soon? Second, you talked about in mobility, lower kilometers being driven.
What about lower oil prices and petrol prices? What have you seen there, and what might you see there, and over what timeframe might that impact mobility? Thank you.
Okay. I propose to answer question two and then Cédric will help me on question one. To make a long story short, mobility is 30% of our total revenue. In mobility, 70% is the core, 30% is the beyond. The beyond does not have any link with the price of the oil. If you take the 70% of the 30%, we have different pricing formula depending on the countries. Sometimes it is a mix of fixed fee and variable fees. As to the variable fees, it can be on a percentage on the fuel price, but it also can be the number of times you fill in the tanks. That is one part of the equation.
The second part of the equation is the link between the brand and the price at pump. It depends per country. For example, in Mexico, the pump price is somehow regulated. For certain types of fuel, the government sets a price for the next six months. What does it mean in Mexico? Whatever the level of the brand price, the pump price has been set by the government. In Brazil, it is a price that is at pump that is also, let's say, more or less administrated by the government via Petrobras. Petrobras suffered a lot in the last few years because the oil price was low versus the brand.
We'll see how it goes in Brazil, but we don't expect for today to see the pump price going down because Petrobras needs to, let's say, redo its margins when the WTI or the Brent was high. You have Europe. In fact, in Europe, you have a link between the Brent price and the pump price, but it's in Europe where we are, in fact, the least dependent because it's where we have the formula that depends the least on the pump price. To make a long story short, is the Brent or WTI price going down good news for Edenred? The answer is no. Have we been working on that for the last five years to limit our dependency on that?
The answer is yes, by developing pricing formulas that are not dependent, but also by developing the Beyond Fuel strategy. For example, at the group level, let me, I think the level of dependency to the brand price, i.e., the link is about 6.5%. At the group level, we have almost 94% of our revenue that is, let's say, ring-fenced versus the evolution of the brand price. To conclude, with a brand at 64 today, based on the things in our equation that I shared with you, 64 is not a good use, but that's something we can manage easily at Edenred.
Maybe to complete, and then I will take the first one.
Yes, Argentina.
Yes. First, on the 6.5% of sensitivity to fuel price at group level, it used to be 8.8% last year and more than 10% two years ago.
As Bertrand said, yes, we have decreased our exposure to fuel price. On Argentina, the question is whether this change of situation on the ARS or the Argentinian peso will drive to a higher inflation in Argentina. It is a bit too early to say, but an increasing peso means that we will have a higher scope, a higher FX impact. If we look at how it evolved over the last two days, yes, it increased, but it has not been, let's say, massive. Remember that Argentina is less than 2% of our operating revenue and a bit.
Thank you.
Okay.
We will come to our last question today from Hannes Leitner from Jefferies. Please go ahead.
Yeah. Yeah. You can hear me? I keep it brief.
You mentioned at Q4 results that you went down some of the BAS business in the U.K. Maybe you can talk a little bit about the expected outflow on the float and how that has progressed already. Maybe you can comment on the refinancing of your bond, how come that you had to refinance a higher amount, and for what corporate purposes do you intend to use that? Just then some bookkeeping, maybe you can give us a rough size of the gift solutions and the Edenred Finance, given both had been called out as recent headwinds. Thank you.
Okay. Hannes, thank you for your brief questions. First of all, as to the refinancing, as we present every semester, you see that we have to refinance between EUR 500 million-EUR 750 million every year. There is no debt wall at Edenred.
You will see that it's regular rhythm every year of between EUR 500 million and EUR 750 million. The refinancing is things that we will do every year. We refinance EUR 750 million, and I can announce you that in 2020 next year, there will be also another refinancing like every year. The good news is the bond has been oversubscribed more than four times, and we have been able to reduce the price. If I remember correctly, the price is at 3.25%, which is, in fact, a price that is the right price for an A minus company like us. I'm sure you remember that in the A minus category, we are the smallest companies. It is very rare that a company of our size has a signature of A minus. Why do we refinance?
Because, in fact, it was the end of a bond that was issued five or seven years ago. Expect some refinancing every year on a regular rhythm to finance the activity of Edenred. As to the bus B2C, maybe Cédric, you want to take this one?
I'm not sure I get your question, but I think you mentioned about outflow. I think it's important to mention that there is no free cash flow impact coming from the reduction of the business on the bus B2C because there are two impacts in our free cash flow statements. One is on the working capital excluding floats, and the other impact is on the restricted cash as the cash we hold in this business is in the restricted cash in our balance sheet.
The fact that we progressively exit this business has no impact on our free cash flow.
Okay. The last bit, just on the gift solutions and the Edenred Finance.
Can you remind us your question?
The last question is just like you mentioned gift solutions as being tough comparatives. Maybe you can just quantify how much gift solution is within BNE or within the whole operating business. Then Edenred Finance, you mentioned also as one of the headwinds, maybe just like the annualized number of those two, that would be interesting. You called out that Edenred Finance had been a growth driver and now basically has lost a customer. Maybe just to quantify it.
On the gift solution, one way to look at it, but to give an idea, we do not provide the exact details, is to look at the operating revenue we generate on a Q4 in a given year and compare it with the few quarters before. It is an approximate, and it is not exactly what the amount is, but it gives at least an idea.
Thank you.
Thank you. It is 65 minutes that we are together. Thanks a lot for being with us as to the Q1 2025 revenue of Edenred growing at 7%. Let's go for the year 2025. Thank you. Bye-bye.
This concludes today's conference. You may now disconnect.