Thank you very much, Sergin. I would like to welcome all of you to our conference call to discuss Puma's preliminary second quarter results for 2025. Joining me on the call today is our CEO, Arthur Hult, who joined the Puma team on July 1 and our CFO, Markus Neuber. Markus will set the scene for today's call and take you through a short presentation where we would like to explain the major moving parts of the information disclosed last night. I'm very happy that Arthur decided to join our call as I'm sure he will be keen to share his first observations of the last four weeks and use the opportunity to put things into perspective.
After that, we should have ample time for our Q and A session. Talking about Q and A, I would like to ask you all for favor and limit your initial questions to maximum two questions to allow as many people as possible to ask their questions in our allotted time. Thank you very much for your cooperation. Before we begin, please note the cautionary language in our Safe Harbor statement on the next slide. And without any further ado, over to you, Markus.
Thank you, Oliver, and welcome, everyone. Before we review our preliminary numbers, I want to provide some important context for today's update. As a management team, our priority is to ensure Puma's long term success and to act in the best interest of all of our stakeholders. The factor that Oliver pointed out previously, along with ongoing market trends and Puma specific challenges, are expected to continue affecting our business into the 2025. This has prompted us to review our outlook for the remainder of 2025 and to update our guidance accordingly.
As we transition leadership, it's important that we provide flexibility to assess our strategy and make adjustments where it is necessary. Our decision to update you today ahead of our scheduled results reflects our commitment to transparency and proactive communication. As part of this process, we're incorporating new assumptions for the 2025, which result in several one off items. While these near term challenges are significant, we are taking decisive actions, including additional measures to further align our cost base in the second half of the year. These steps are designed to ensure Puma remains competitive and well positioned for future opportunities.
For now, let me take you through the preliminary business and financial performance. Our sales in the second quarter decreased by 2% in constant currency to €1,940,000,000 ending up below our expectations for the quarter. This performance led to a sales decrease of 1% in constant currency in H1 twenty twenty five to €4,020,000,000 Most regions that we define as our key markets contributed to such performance. Most importantly, we saw weakness in North America with minus 9% in Q2. In particular, the wholesale channel has been challenging for us as well as the brick and mortar business in that region.
Europe declined by 4%. The soft performance was mainly driven by the wholesale business. Greater China declined by 4%. The soft wholesale performance, especially in Mainland China, overshadowed strong DTC growth driven by our e commerce business in that region. When reviewing the sales breakdown by channel, one can observe that our sales generated in the wholesale business decreased by 6%, mainly driven by our footprint in North America, clearly missing our expectations.
The same trend was also observed in Greater China as well as in Europe. Our direct to consumer business grew by 9.2% in constant currency to $6.00 €1,000,000 led by the e commerce business, which grew 19.4%, while sales in owned and operated retail stores increased by 3.4%. The D2C share rose to about 31%, up from roughly 28% in the previous year. Looking at the developments by division, it's worth pointing out footwear sales increased by 5.1% to 1,061,000,000 driven by the running and sports car categories. Let's continue with the operating performance.
In a nutshell, sales were softer than initially expected. Our preliminary 2025 sales decreased by 2% on a currency adjusted basis to $1,900,000,000 Sales in euro terms decreased by 8.3% and include negative currency effects on our sales, mainly from the U. S. Dollar, Mexican and Argentinian peso as well as the Turkish lira. Our gross profit margin decreased by 70 basis points to 46.1%.
Taking a closer look at our gross profit margin. Our gross profit margin was impacted by several offsetting factors this quarter. While we benefited from favorable sourcing prices and freight as well as improved channel and regional mix, these gains were more than offset by promotions and currency headwinds. Our promotional activity was mainly driven by Greater China and North America. Adjusted EBIT ended up at minus €13,200,000 Decline in EBIT was mainly driven by the lower gross profit margin.
Net income performance was driven by the lower than expected adjusted EBIT as well as nonrecurring charges, mainly onetime costs linked to the next level program as well as a goodwill impairment and a deferred tax asset write off. When we look at the second quarter and the H1 performance, we've experienced various company specific challenges that need to be addressed going forward. That being said, if we look at the first two challenges mentioned, it's clear that shifting our brand momentum and improving both our channel mix and quality are really strategic issues. They are not things that we can fix overnight. They require a longer term approach to be addressed.
What we can focus on and address in our outlook for 2025 are the effects of U. S. Tariffs and the high inventory levels we are currently seeing. These are areas where we can and have been taking more immediate action. Elevated inventory levels in our balance sheet are leading to lower full price realization.
In response, we've adjusted our future orders to better match expected demand. We will continue to actively reduce inventory levels. It is clear that we need to improve at selling our products at full price. U. S.
Tariffs. The U. S. Market represents around 20% of our global sales. In other words, the majority of around 80% of our global sales is not exposed to The U.
S. Tariff situation. The vast majority of our U. S. Imports originate from Asia, with Vietnam, Cambodia and Indonesia accounting for the majority of The U.
S. Production. It is important to note that when we decide where to produce, we focus on optimizing the total landed cost. This includes not just the product cost, or FOB, but also logistics and duties. We have managed to limit the impact of the tariffs to around €80,000,000 on gross profit in 2025.
The main levers for this have been optimizing our supply chain, introducing strategic pricing adjustments starting in the 2025 and working closely with our vendors and retail partners. In addition, our China exposure got reduced further for the SpringSummer twenty six collection. Year on year, the inventory increased by 10% in euro and 18% in constant currency to €2,150,000,000 representing 25 of the last twelve months sales. One of the main factors driving elevated inventories relates to North America, where we accelerated deliveries in anticipation of The U. S.
Tariff deadlines. Overall, we see an increase of inventories across most markets. As mentioned earlier, we've adjusted the future orders based on the expected demand. But please keep in mind that such an effort to reduce inventory is a process that takes a while. I would expect this to take up to twelve months.
In response to the developments mentioned, Puma has revised its full year guidance. Currency adjusted sales are now forecast to decline low double digit. We anticipate a negative currency impact of around five percentage points on top line development in 2025. For the EBIT, we expect a loss in the full year 2025, reflecting softer top line development, increased currency headwinds, the impact of The U. S.
Tariffs and additional measures, including one off charges to further align the cost base in the second half of the year. We are providing an earnings outlook for reported EBIT only. Given our second quarter performance and the muted growth outlook for the 2025, Puma has revised its capital expenditure plans for the year. We now expect to invest around €250,000,000 in 2025. Quite a lot to digest.
But with these adjustments, we are fully committed to create a long term value adding strategy for all stakeholders. Great to have Afur on board. With this, I hand over to Afur, our new CEO, who would like to share some remarks. Over to you, Afer.
Thank you, Markus, and I would wish everyone a very good afternoon. I'm very excited that I had the opportunity to join one of the very few legitimate multi category sports brands as their CEO. The heritage of Puma, the legacy, the innovation and the many, many partnerships are exceptional, and I'm very, very privileged to be in this position right now. I would also like to acknowledge the dedication of our management team, and I would like to reiterate that, of course, we do own this outlook together. I would also like to acknowledge the disappointment that we've provided towards the capital market with that announcement.
The first few weeks, three weeks in total, I would like to spend a few of the key observations I've had here when I was listening to the teams, when I was learning about what makes Puma tick, when I was talking to the partners and the various customers. I believe a very thorough assessment is really necessary for me as to the foundation of making any bold moves in the future. We are living in a rapidly evolving market environment. And we need to be ambitious, yet at the same time, realistic with what we can achieve and what we will promise. There are immediate operational challenges, and Markus mentioned some of them.
The quality of our distribution mix, the high levels of inventories, but also insufficient full price sell through are, of course, something we'll tackle immediately. There's tremendous potential of this brand, which has not been unlocked, but it does require a reset and a new way forward to be successful in the future. There will be several key questions I would like to ask myself and the team. Do we have the right products for our consumers and our wholesale partners? If so, why is our brand not achieving the required visibility and engagement?
And how do we increase the focus on creating consumer exciting stories that will strengthen us in our market presence? We will ask ourselves whether we have the right and the appropriate distribution channel mix and of course, as well, whether we have the right quality of distribution. And that's for me clearly a path forward. And the path forward means we have to build the foundation for long term sustainable growth of this company. We'll do that by providing quality financial planning.
We'll be strengthening the quality of our distribution. And we are, of course, revisiting our growth plan for 2026 and beyond. I don't think you'll be surprised to hear that 2025 will be a reset year for us, and 2026 will be our transition period. Our goal clearly will be to establish risk adjusted, financially disciplined framework for operational change and a sustainable, profitable growth. The commitments you'll see from us for the next few months will, of course, first and foremost, to strengthen the team to win in the future.
I'll continue to be deeply engaged with our teams and our stakeholders, starting with travels to The United States as well as Asia with the Track and Field World Cup in Tokyo and our team in China. I'm committed to open and transparent communication with both investors and analysts. And therefore, I'll also share a more detailed road map after completing my initial review and discussions with my team. The date for that will be around October this year. I would like to thank you at this point already for your trust and partnership to write the new chapter for Puma moving forward.
With that, I would like to hand back to Oliver. Thank you.
Great.
Thank you, Arthur. Thank you, Markus, for your remarks and your comments. Sergey and I think we are already ready for Q and A session. So please open up lines for Q
If you wish to remove yourself from the question queue, you may press star followed by 2. If you are using speaker equipment today, please lift the handset before making your selections. Anyone who has a question may press star followed by 1 at this time. And we have the first question coming from the line of Grace Mulli from Morgan Stanley. Please go ahead.
My first question, Arthur, I appreciate it's still early, but I think the previous strategy really focused on brand elevation. And I'd just be interested to hear your initial thoughts on that brand elevation strategy and where you think Puma's positioning should be and just how you're thinking about the Puma brand differentiating itself relative to the competitive landscape going forward? And then my second question, I think you touched on during the presentation there a couple of times this idea of improving channel mix. So we'd just be interested to understand further what you see as the opportunity on channel mix and how we should expect your wholesale and DTC strategy to evolve looking ahead? Thank very much.
Thank you. So first of all, as I've said, I've been in the job here for three weeks, and I'm still very keen to learn to understand what makes Puma, what makes our employees, what makes our brand tick. The previous strategy of brand elevation, we will not continue in this organization. I will take time to assess and take the right steps with my team. And as I suggested in the call, that will be October with a very clear message back to you guys, but also everyone else that needs to be concerned about Puma's future.
On the second point, when it comes to distribution and the distribution mix, I think we have a great opportunity in Puma to strengthen our channel exposure, our own channel exposure, whether it's e commerce or retail. And together with my teams, we are going to work on what I would call the window to the world, the window to the consumers with a better and a stronger offer moving forward. At the same time, we need to look at a healthy mix when it comes to our wholesale partners, and that will apply across all continents. That measure will also be discussed with our teams in next few weeks and months and will be part of our strategy and our plan moving forward. That's going to be communicated in October then.
Thank you very much. Look forward to hearing more in October. If I may, just one follow-up more on the near term. I think the top line guidance for the second half really implies quite a sharp deceleration versus the front half. Could you just help walk us through where that deceleration exactly is coming from?
And to what extent perhaps some of the guidance embeds a degree of conservatism in the second half on top line?
Grace, if I may take that question. As you rightly pointed out, the guidance whether we've given for the full year with a low double digit sales decline in constant currency, I think, implies a deceleration second half. Where this is coming from? If you look at the Q2 trends and what we've seen also in H1, I think, me start with from a regional perspective. We've seen, I think, softness in North America, Europe and Greater China that we expect to continue.
Here, from a channel perspective, we've seen the wholesale channel with being down 6% in the second quarter, being under pressure, also where we've seen also orders increased order cancellations and a lower reorder business. What the challenges that I talked about in my prepared remarks also, I mentioned brand momentum, and let me give you one example also around brand momentum. We talked also about Speedcat previously. Speedcat low profile trend continues to resonate in Asia, in markets like Korea, Japan, Southeast Asia and China, where it sounds very well. If we look at our core markets in Europe and North America, we've good success with selected retailers, more trend setting retailers.
But overall, sellout expectations in these markets remain calmly behind expectations. So we factored this into the outlook, then combined also with the challenges I mentioned around the elevated inventory levels that we have, but also our partners have in selected markets have led to the decrease of the top line expectations for the full year 2025.
The next question comes from the line of Anelo Bismuth from HSBC.
So I have two questions. The first one is thank you first for providing that granularity about how to explain that a big slowdown expected in H2. Is there but can you give us a bit more color about how should we think about the sales development between Q3 and Q4? And is there anything meaningful that we should read into that? And my second question is about the revised EBIT guidance, which implies a big downward revision.
What are the moving parts leading to a loss this year apart from operating leverage and tariffs? If you could provide more detail about how to think about discounting FX and operating expenses.
Thank you very much, Helmut, for your question. First, I think we provided the outlook for the full year and, of course, the implied second half guidance. So I at this stage, I will not provide any further details around the split between Q3 and Q4. Talking about also the EBIT guidance and the adjusted EBIT guidance and the change. Clearly, if you look at the change compared to the previous guidance that we've given, Sales drop, I think, then also is the key contributor in terms of the change in the sales expectations into the overall profit shortfall.
Then to remind you also the previous guidance excluded U. S. Tariffs. So now I've provided you also the impact. We mitigated impact from U.
S. Tariffs that we expect also for the full year. I talked about also currencies, a headwind as well. So looking at these, I think those are the key factors also that explain also to drop in the overall EBIT guidance for the full year. And the additional, I think, and also what I we've had one off charges you have seen in the second quarter that increased.
And we also expect also to work on additional measures also in the second half. We initiated additional measures in the second half of this year to align our cost base with the sales trajectory. And this all has been factored into our outlook for the EBIT for the full year.
The next question comes from the line of Adam Kochrane from Deutsche Bank.
Marcus, the difference between your DTC and wholesale performance, how can you reconcile the relative strength that you're seeing in DTC and the weakness of your wholesale partners and their sell through. Is it really you're just selling the products in your own channel with heavy discounts in order to start clearing the inventory? Or is there something more to it than that? And then secondly, as you see the partners clearing inventory, you're talking about a brand reset and things. How are you going to try and avoid any brand damage for Puma over this period and try and avoid customers getting you want to increase full price sell through.
But in the short term, how do you avoid customers getting used to buying Puma on discount given the clearance that you've got? And if I might sneak in a last one, you haven't mentioned cash flow at all. I know there's been some concerns over the cash generation of the business. There's a number of one offs and a number of moving parts. How should we think about the cash flow and the net debt for the year? Thanks.
Thank you, Adam, for your questions. Let me start first with the second part where you asked about the brand reset and also now going back to also remarks also Arthur just made and the challenges. So our focus is on improving also our distribution quality and distribution mix and addressing elevated inventories and aligning inventories with the expected demand. So clearly, I think focusing on building the brands and also building a sustainable, profitable business. I think that's also the key principle and that also has led us to the challenges I explained earlier, but that's also what we've reflected in our guidance also for the full year.
Then going back to the first part of your question where you asked about DTC trend in wholesale. What we're seeing in DTC, as I highlighted also in my prepared remarks, e commerce business is the strongest performing B2C channel where we see continued success across regions. Brick and mortar, also if you noticed also now from Q1 to Q2, there has been a deceleration in terms of the trends also where you see that also in some markets, and I think you're calling out in North America, also where we see our brick and mortar business being under pressure. I know we've shared previously that our traffic and I think this year, the key challenge that we're seeing coming to our brick and mortar stores, which also translates in lower comp sales, I think, here now in the North American market. And going to the last part and a question about cash generation and net debt, let me give you, I think, what at the we've shared the preliminary results half year report, I think, still to be disclosed at a later point.
What I can provide you is that our net debt increased at the end of the second quarter, increased slightly compared to the 2025. A good part of this increase is coming from our seasonal pattern of paying for ordering of finished goods for the whole autumnwinter season, mainly in the first and second quarter. We've increased inventory that I've shared with you. I assume that this is, of course, the reason for the increase in the net debt. Cash flow discipline is given by overseeing and searing flows from a central level, but also focusing on it through its already announced the next level program.
Currently, the increased bank debt is funded mainly through our revolving credit facility. But also, we just issued in May 2025 a new Schuldschein of €210,000,000 which was again oversubscribed at very reasonable rates. While we consider the current SRCF utilization conditions of all of our financing instruments offer enough headroom for further financing transactions, if we need to do so in the second half or later on. Besides usual representations and thresholds and baskets, no maximum debt levels, no covenants are applicable, making our financing situation resilient in the current phase.
Just in terms of the wholesale versus DTC, I sort of understand your point about saying the sales in ecom were higher. I was trying to get that do you know why they are higher in e commerce and bricks and mortar compared to wholesale? Is it different products? Is it different mix? Is there anything you can tell us as to why there's such a large difference in sales performance between channels?
Yes. One key topic is that we have, and I think we now have the divergence in performance, is brand presentation in wholesale versus the DTC. And then, of course, also you need to look at the yes, that's the key driver, I think, then also for the difference in the performance.
The next question comes from the line of Monique Polard from Citi.
Two, if I can, please. The first was just on The U. S. Tariffs. You've talked about this GBP 80,000,000 impact that's the mitigated impact and talked about potential for price increases.
Just wanting to understand how you're going to balance price increases to offset that U. S. Tariff with elevated inventory levels and wholesale declines and a lack of reorders, etcetera, and cancellations in the order book. And whether those price increases will only be in The U. S.
Or whether they could be global? That's question number one. Second question is just on these one off costs. So when we heard from you two point five months ago, we were told there would be €75,000,000 of one off costs, about €35,000,000 of those falling in the second quarter. Now we're at the end of the 2Q, we've been told €85,000,000 of one off costs.
So you mentioned some other things beyond the next level program, so goodwill impairment. If you could just explain what has been impaired and this deferred tax write off, if you can explain that and whether that makes up the €50,000,000 difference between the kind of €35,000,000 we were expecting and the €85,000,000 in the quarter?
Thank you, Johan, Monique, for your questions. Let me start first with The U. S. Tariffs. The strategic pricing adjustments I referred to in my prepared remarks are for The U.
S. Only. Then I think then also further on The U. S. Tariffs, as explained, we expect the mitigated impact of €80,000,000 of this year.
Talking about the one offs in the second quarter, the €85,000,000 roughly twothree of it relates to next level as we made progress. And here, the major part of the nonrecurring onetime costs associated to next level have been related to the reduction of corporate positions that we talked about earlier. The other third, I think then also of the one off charges of €85,000,000 represents a goodwill impairment in Japan that we recognized had to recognize in the second quarter of this year.
Next question comes from the line of Jurgen Kolb from Kepler Cheuvreux.
Two questions. First of all, the sharp sales decline, which has already been mentioned in H2, does that also include product returns? So you're expecting retailers and you invite retailers to ship back merchandise to your place so that you can channel it through via your own factory outlets? And secondly, maybe a little bit of a further details on your split on performance products on the footwear side and leisure, how these two channels performed specifically? And also a quick comment maybe on the apparel business, which was clearly weaker in the second quarter. What drove that sharp decline there? Thank you.
Thank you, Jochen, for your questions. First one regarding the distribution. As I mentioned and talked about the overall improving the distribution quality, I mentioned also the challenge of elevated inventories that we have, but also we see elevated inventories with our partners in key markets. So we'll focus on making sure that we align disciplined with our sell in and of course, also in line with the sell out. Talking about nothing and also your question regarding sales performance of the performance products versus lifestyle products.
Talking about footwear, I called out in my prepared remarks that running, I think then also was one category, I think that was driving also contributing to the sales growth of footwear, which clearly, I think, as you've seen also our brand campaign also then focused on running, supported also the growth of our running footwear products. Sports style also here in footwear improved as well. Going further into the apparel section here, we see and we have already seen in the first quarter of this year, we've seen softness in apparel. So here, also, we have no in terms of the last year's, we are pumping also events also in on the team sport business that helped also increasing our business, especially in the second quarter of last year that we are now lapping in this year's numbers.
The next question comes from the line of James Krzynach from Jefferies. Please go ahead.
Yes. Good afternoon. Thanks for the time. Two questions, really. I appreciate that clearly the wholesale channel has an over inventory position as well.
But I wonder whether you've got a good sense of how big the problem is and quite clearly I presume there will be some stock take backs at least in China within that guidance for the second half sales? That's the first question. The second question, can you perhaps give us a little bit of a sense of how full price sales ratio has deteriorated in DTC? I presume the much stronger online performance is indicative of the fact that more of the sales online are being done at a discount. But if you can give us a scale of how that has deteriorated through time, that would be very helpful.
Thank you, James, for your questions. And yes, sorry, also not when Jurgen asked the question earlier on wholesale. Of course, clearly, we have from our key accounts, we work with them closely. We receive sellout and inventory information, and we know what their stock position is. And we work closely with our partners also in terms of overall improving also their inventory position and helping them to improve the sellout.
And yes, this also can include also returns also as part of the normal business. And I think then also working with our wholesale partners in key markets. I think that's the common practice also that we've been working with previously. Talking about and when I made my comments about the margin development in the second quarter, and I think that promotions also increased also this applies also not only to wholesale, but also to our DTC channels. And also the need and I think then also what we stressed that with these and I think then all the measures and I think that Arthur and I think I talked about as well that our goal is to improve our full price realizations going forward.
Can I perhaps just ask one last one? Because I presume it's quite a lot to get your arms around. Do you feel that you've got an exact sense for the scale of the issue at this point? Or is the flex in, I guess, the EBIT guidance indicative that you're still trying to put a precise scale on the challenges?
In terms of the Flex in the EBIT guidance that we've been providing, Afur, I think, shared in his prepared remarks that we are currently working on a road map, and we will share further details at the end of the third quarter. So that's also where we would like to work together with Arthur and with the teams also to finalize this road map. And then also, we'll be able to provide further, I think, then also details on the impact. We have on the inventory situation of our partners in key markets of our key partners in the global markets, we have a good visibility.
The next question comes from the line of Warwick Okines from BNP Paribas Xaine.
Two questions of follow ups, really. The first is you talked about some of the one offs in Q2. It would really be quite helpful to get a sense of the magnitude of the additional one offs that you're expecting for the second half above and beyond the roughly €20,000,000 of next level one offs that were penciled in for the second half of the year? And the second question is whether you could just talk a little bit more about your approach to sell into wholesale at the moment in the second half. Is it more you pulling back?
Or is it wholesalers pulling back from buying? And what implications does that have for the risk of you losing shelf space?
You, Warwick, for your questions. I'll take the first one, and then Arthur will respond to your question about wholesale. Regarding the one offs, and I talked about additional measures, I think, we've initiated to align our cost base. I think that's all there were. This may come also with one off charges, And that's also what I shared also in my prepared remarks.
I think an increase has been embedded in our guidance for the full year. Then I'll hand over to Arthur.
Yes. Thank you. The question related to our wholesalers will, of course, be in a partnership conversation. We're very keen to make sure that what the team has established here over the years will continue and that we're taking care together of a healthier market environment. Therefore, the conversations are ongoing, but they will, of course, be influenced by us and our desire for Puma overall to have a cleaner marketplace than what we have right now.
Thanks very much. And so Marcus, if I could just come back, I appreciate it's embedded in your guidance, some additional one off charges, but you've not given us any sense of magnitude, whether it's €10,000,000 extra or €100,000,000 extra. Could you just give us a bit of help with that? Thank you.
At this point in time, I will need to ask for your patience until we come back to you after the with the third quarter release, Warwick. What I can share, and I touched on it in my prepared remarks, if you look at the second quarter results, we have also we have deferred our tax expense. Our tax result has been impacted by deferred tax asset write offs. I think that's all of what I can give you also in terms of the nonrecurring charges. But then besides that, I need to ask for your patience, and we'll come back to you with the third quarter release.
And the next question is from the line of Piral Dadanya from RBC.
So two from me as well, please. The first just relates to North America, clearly a softer than expected performance from a regional perspective there in Q2. Could you just give us an update as to whether the off price cleanup activities that were being worked on last year and perhaps the year before are largely complete now? Are you now in a position where the accounts you're working with are broadly where you want them to be? Or is there more work to do there?
And has that had a bearing on your Q2 results? And then the second question just relates to changes in the wholesale order book. So based on the implied second half revenue outcomes, have you seen any changes to the expected of the wholesale orders that you have in hand for AutumnWinter twenty five deliveries? And can you give us any insight into how the SpringSummer 'twenty six order book is filling up?
Piral, let me answer the second part of your question first. What we've embedded in our updated revenue guidance is that we when we that compared to our initial expectations, Q4 orders can be below expectations. And also, we've seen, and I touched on it in the prepared remarks and in earlier questions, in the second quarter, we've seen higher order cancellations and lower reorder business, which was also contributing also to the lower than expected performance. Talking about North America and the performance we've seen in the second quarter, I talked about that wholesale has been under pressure, but also the brick and mortar business also with lower traffic. In terms of the distribution quality, also here, the quality of our wholesale distribution in North America, there's still work also left for us also to do in the future.
There are no further questions at this time. I hand back over to Oliver Meyer for closing comments.
Great. Thank you very much, Serge. And thank you very much, everybody, for all your questions and your remarks. Very much appreciated. We stay in touch, and we talk soon.
Thank you so much. That ends the call for the second quarter. Appreciate it. Bye bye.