Good evening, ladies and gentlemen. Welcome to Aurionpro Solutions Limited Q1 FY 2024 Earnings Webinar. Today on this call, we have with us from the management, Mr. Ashish Rai, Vice Chairman and Director, Mr. Vipul Parmar, Chief Financial Officer, and Mr. Ninad Kelkar, Company Secretary. Please note that any statements or comments made in today's call that may look like forward-looking statements, that are based on information presently available to the management and do not constitute an indication of any future performance, as future involved risks and uncertainties, which could cause results to differ materially from the current views being expressed. At this moment, all participants are in listen-only mode. A question and answer session will be conducted towards the end of the opening remarks by the management. At that time, you may click Raise Hand icon from the toolbar or type your text questions.
I now hand the conference over to Mr. Ashish Rai for his opening remarks. Thank you, and over to you, sir.
Thank you. Thanks. Good afternoon, everyone, welcome to this earnings call for Q1 FY 2024. I'll go through prepared remarks for about 5 minutes, then we'll open it up for a free format Q&A. We're pleased to announce the results for Q1, which show our continued growth momentum that we've seen across our core businesses for the last several years. Every quarter that goes by gives us yet another proof point on our chosen strategy to build a global products and platforms player centered around creating tier-one IP assets. Our strong performance this quarter is a result of a good demand environment for many of our core offerings and our expansion into newer markets through both strategic partnerships as well as the expansion in sales channel that we've talked about in the past.
This performance is also the result of increasing global competitiveness of our products as they mature, and highly disciplined execution that we saw from our teams across the board, from sales to R&D and delivery. This quarter was an especially great quarter for our R&D teams, with some truly path-breaking product launches hitting the market after grueling multi-year build cycles. While we expect, you know, commercial success every time we launch a new product, what really drives us is solving the hard problems that create net new capability and value for our clients, our partners, and society in general. What the numbers will not tell is that the quarter gone by was one of our most successful quarters from the standpoint of bringing new product and offering to market across both banking as well as TIG. I'll cover some of this as I go through the presentation.
I'm sure by now you've received the deck, which details our performance. Allow me to deep dive into the numbers a little bit. Right. When we started the year, I'd given a guidance of our plans for FY 2024, which said we will grow our revenue between 30%-35%. We will deliver an EBITDA between 20%-22%, and we plan to hit PAT margins of 15%-16%. We believe these numbers put us squarely in the top 5%-10% of the industry in terms of delivering performance. We will do this while funding the R&D spends that, as you know, we fund from the excess in terms of product builds, right, and not really capitalized investments, right?
Revenue for the quarter stood at INR 199 crores, which is a 36% YOY expansion and 4% quarter-on-quarter. EBITDA, INR 44 crores as compared to INR 33 crores, which is 33% on a YOY basis and 10% sequential. EBITDA margin was at 22%. PAT went to INR 32 crores, which is a 33% YOY expansion and 19% on a sequential QOQ basis. PAT margin for the quarter stood at 16%. While we've, you know, we've worked hard over the last few years to reduce lumpiness in our revenue streams by converting where possible to recurring revenue models, such as subscription licenses, for example, there's still some seasonality in our numbers.
I personally think the YOY comparison is a more meaningful indicator of relative performance than sequential QOQ numbers. Overall, we are very pleased with the execution in Q1, and we feel we are in a great place to deliver on our guidance of 30%-35% growth for FY 2024, while delivering the margin numbers that we planned for. If you move on to the key highlights... you know, as I said, you know, our R&D teams had a truly exceptional quarter. On the banking and fintech business, getting the in-principle approval from RBI was a great demonstrator of our ability to not only build cutting-edge tech offerings, but also back that up with a strong, mature operational framework. Aurionpro Fintech in the U.S. launched a brand-new next-generation healthcare SaaS platform called Reviq.
We also had a significant wins across Southeast Asia and Middle East and Africa, as you can see, on the slide for the banking business. What we also saw was a dramatic uptick in the number of deals that we are competing in and our win rates going up. I think that's a function of both expansion in the sales channel as well as demand in the corporate banking segment that's coming through. Similarly, we had significant product launches from TIG. Nothing more prominent than ECR-One that we launched at UITP Summit in Barcelona last month or the month before. This really is a great demonstrator of our ability to do hard R&D and break into large new market segments.
We are the only Indian company to have designed, built, and launched an EMV-compliant card reader. That points to the strength of our ability to do hard R&D. We will continue to enhance our R&D spend this year as we continue to fine-tune our bigger products for global markets, as well as keep backward integrating into the value chain, across both hardware as well as software. Our continued emphasis on building highly differentiated world-class IP, as well as our ability to create joint value propositions with other leading industry players, will continue to strengthen our ability to win on the global stage, as well as drive long-term earnings power for the enterprise. As we go further into the year, we will remain sharply focused on executing with energy, with discipline, to continue delivering strong revenue and profit growth in this year and beyond.
I hope this has given you a useful overview of the overall business context and our strategy and performance. I look forward to answering any questions that you may have.
Thank you very much. We will now begin the question and answer session. To ask a question, please click on the Raise Hand button on the toolbar or the Q&A tab and click Raise Hand. The operator will announce your name when it is your turn to ask a question. Please unmute your webcam and microphone while proceeding with the question. You may also send the question via text from the Q&A tab. Ladies and gentlemen, we will wait for a moment while the question queue assembles. The first question is from the line of Vivek Gautam from GS Investments.
Am I audible? Some issues.
Yes.
Hello? Yeah.
You're audible.
Am I audible?
Please go ahead. Yeah, you're audible.
Congratulations on good set of numbers, sir, continuing. What is the opportunity size in the PIT segment?
It seems that we have lost line for the current participant. In the meanwhile, we'll move to our next question, and that is from the line of Kranthi Bathini from WealthMills Securities Private Limited. Please go ahead.
Yeah. I just want to know about. There are the big IT companies in India, they have been giving a pension and reducing their guidance, and there are some kind of implication about the global slowdown. All these implication are impacting many of the IT companies, and especially many vendors have been reducing their banking and financial services budgets. What kind of impact and what kind of visibility as a company you are foreseeing?
I think if you are a generic IT services company, or a commoditized outsourcer or something, right now, I suppose there is some uncertainty, especially in the Western markets, as the interest rates have gone up. I think that's particular to a very generic services player. We are highly specialized around a few segments that we've chosen. For example, corporate banking transformations, which we work in through our corporate loan modulations product, Collateral & Limit Management, Transaction Banking, things like that, and transit payments. We honestly, for these segments, don't see a demand slowdown at all, I think there's a reason for it. A high interest rate environment in general is. You have to understand the kind of clients we sell to on the corporate banking side, right?
It's typically, you would have to be a large bank, tier one bank, for you to need a specialized corporate loan origination system, for example. A high interest rate environment is, I don't think, necessarily bad for a tier one corporate bank. If you look at the results coming out of U.S., Asia, other markets, most large banks with large corporate loan books are actually doing exceptionally well in a high interest rate environment. Your, your investment banking side will come down, your M&A fees will come down, but actually, banks are doubling down on transformation in the corporate banking space, right? If anything, we've seen a dramatic uptick in the number of deals sort of coming to the table, right? Same thing with transit, right?
I mean, the transformation from closed loop to open loop, we think is a decade-long transformation. We are still in the early stages of it, like we won that deal in California. That's just one U.S. state, which I think is leading the charge, but there is a lot more of the market to come, to come to the table. Honestly, for most of the segments that we chose, we see a fairly decent demand environment.
Thank you. That's it from my side. Thank you. Thanks for the time.
Thank you.
Thank you. To ask a question, please click on the Raise Hand button on the toolbar or the Q&A tab and click Raise Hand. You may also send a question via text from the Q&A tab. Next question is from the line of Mitul Mehta, from Lucky Investment Managers. Please go ahead.
Yeah, good evening, sir. Congratulations on a good set of numbers. Ashish, hi. Can you hear me?
Yeah, we can hear you fine. Hi, Mitul.
Hi. Hi. Well, sir, congratulations on a good set of numbers. You know, just wanted to get some sense on your order book. You know, you've sort of highlighted that you have built a INR 800 crore plus order book. Does this incorporate some of the deals that you have announced in your presentation, like the one in Philippines or the Canberra, I mean, the Canberra deal, or the one in Middle East? Do these deals are incorporated in these numbers or they are not?
Look, we announced INR 800 crore plus order book at the end of last March, basically, right? That is where it stood. We. Typically, most of the order book that we declared, almost 80% of it, is the next 4-quarter order book. Right. We would have retired close to INR 200 crore from that order book in Q1. We added a little bit more than INR 200 crore, so we are at INR 800 crore, plus those deals that we mentioned, these are new deals which will, which are essentially new additions to the order book. The INR 800 crore number was on 31st of March, but the number is still of the same range.
These deals are incorporated in the option?
Deals are incorporated in the options. I mean, they are now in the order book, but not on that number that you're talking from 31 March.
How much you would have added?
We added, I think, something of the order of INR 230 crores in Q1. We were at INR 820. You net out INR 200 that we retired in Q1. The order book went up by about INR 20-25 crores.
Okay. Sir, could you know, speak a bit more on your strategy in the developed country like U.S. or Europe? I mean, when do you really, you know, go there and bid for larger orders? Because currently, most of our business is concentrated in the Asia Pacific region. When do we actually get there and, you know, announce some large deal pipeline?
The pipeline is already building up. Thanks for the question, Mitul. That's a good question, right? I think the way to look at it is this, our first focus is on building out a product/platform which is really finished and can compete globally, right? It's, it's easy, you know, to do project deliveries out in the U.S. If I wanted to supply bodies, want to do work for someone else, I think that's easy. Selling products in U.S. or in Europe, I mean, honestly, if you, if you, if you think of it, right, I mean, how many Indian products do you actually see in the U.S.? I don't even mean software, you know, soap, shampoo, anything, right?
Today, you go out to California, you do a tap in, tap out on a fully finished Aurionpro validator unit that's sitting in the bus in California, right? It takes a lot of hard work, a lot of fine-tuning to get the products to a level where they can play in the advanced market. Same thing with the software. I think with bulk of our assets, we are now getting there. Corporate loan origination, I think by and large, we are at a tier one level in terms of both depth as well as breadth of the offering, and we are building out the sales channels to take it global. On our payment offerings, I think we are especially the licensed technology deals that we do-
The conference is now in silent mode.
I think we're already in the U.S. market. We're already in the U.S. market. For example, Q4 or Q3, I may be mistaken here, we announced an $18 million deal around licensing our payment technology. That is a result of really getting the offering to that level, right? Transit, again, we've broken into California. We announced a couple of other deals. We are now going out a lot more heavily. We've built out the sales team to go out a lot more heavily in the market, right? So I think for a number of our products, we are getting there. U.S. is now up to almost 7%-8% of our overall revenue, right? I fully expect over the next few years for this number to keep climbing up.
I think the way to understand it is, because I know a lot of people do benchmark us against I.T. services, and it's just a very different game to get a fully finished platform or product out. We also launched a healthcare SaaS product last month, in the month before in the U.S. market called Reviq, which is very sharply targeted on practice management sort of offerings, right? We are slowly getting there in terms of launching our offerings. We are also. The other thing we are doing, which not many players do, is license our technology to some of the other global players who will take it to the Europe and U.S. and other markets, right?
For example, we announced, the partnership we have with Synapse where we're licensing our technology. We will do more and more of those arrangements as we go, right? I think we are by and large, getting there from a product standpoint. Now it's a question of really finding the right channel, either through a partnership, or, go directly ourselves.
Sir, as far as your guidance is concerned, you pretty much enumerated about, how do you get to a 30%-35% growth in the current year. Looking beyond 2024, I mean, could you spell out your, you know, sort of, I mean, strategy or some degree of visibility as to where do we go in FY 2025?
Okay. Two ways to answer that question, right? One, last month, we did an investor day where I did present the strategy that we have and articulated what we call the Vision 2030. I mean, if you have time, go down and find the video on YouTube or somewhere, and I think probably that will help. The long-term ambition is very, very simple. We've chosen our segments. We've made four large strategic bets in terms of what we're going after, you know, for transformation in the corporate banking space, we see a long demand runway. Transformation in the transit payment space, we see a long demand runway. The licensing of technology to other global agencies, we've just started, but we see a lot of success ahead, right? We've enumerated what those bets are.
We said in each of our offerings, we want to be a top three player, globally in the segments that we compete in. Now, this is not a one-year, two-year journey. This is going to take time.
Mm.
That is our ambition to get to, right? Hence the desire to build tier one assets rather than something that's good enough to compete in Asia or so far. That's one. 2030, we've articulated where we want to be. In terms of immediate guidance, the numbers have been clear about what we hold ourselves to in terms of long-range planning is target 25%-30% growth, target margins of 20%-22%, on EBITDA and 15%-16% on PAT. This is essentially how we plan for our business. This is what we believe is the right level to keep growing at. We don't want to grow too fast and risk the delivery reputation because product business is fundamentally hard.
You want to really get a lot of pieces together before you grow. 25%-30% is the right level at which we plan for the medium to long term. This year, we had exceptionally good demand environment and a fairly large order book, so we guided 30%-35%, right? I think over the long range, the expectation should be for us to be in the 25%-30% range rather than 30%-35%. I hope that answers the question.
Yeah. Sir, if you can allow me to pose one more question, if you can allow me, sir.
Okay. Yeah.
You know, as far as your banking product revenue business is concerned, so let's say currently we are, you know, quarterly, our quarterly run rate is somewhere close to about INR 90 crores, and, you know, we're gonna build it as we, you know, move along. Out of this total, let's say about INR 400-450, I mean about INR 450 crores of product, I mean, banking product revenue, how much would be the licensing part?
The reason you ask is essentially what is linked to IP and hence a different margin profile than the implementation part. Is that the case? Is it a one-off versus is it a margin question or a recurring versus one-off question?
No, it's a margin question as well as a recurring versus a one-off question. I just want to understand the linearity of your banking product business.
Look, the way to look at it is this, right? When we sell new deals, typically one third is license, and one third is AMC, and one third is implementation, right? License and AMC are both linked to IP, hence a different margin profile than the one third, which goes into implementation, right? On the overall book, almost 65%-70% is what you can call recurring or ongoing, that's going on, and the other 30% is what we sell and deliver in the year. Out of the sell and deliver, roughly half would come from existing and half would come from new. The actual new dependencies is very, very small, right? Recurring, roughly, let's say two thirds, one thirds, recurring and ongoing versus one-off.
In a deal, license is a third, AMC is a third, implementation is a third.
Anyway, congratulations, and wish you all the best, sir.
Thank you. A reminder to our participants, to ask a question, please click on the Raise Hand button on the toolbar or the Q&A tab and click Raise Hand. In the meanwhile, while the queue assembles, we have a few text questions. The first question is from Varun Mohanraj from Caniva Capital: What is the business model in TIG Transit segment? Do we get business from new metro projects alone, or we get business for existing metro projects also? If so, what is tenure of such projects? My second question is on data centers. Which part of the data center value chain are we targeting?
Thank you. Thanks, Varun. Two questions, right? First coming, tackling the transit side. Typically, so we do compete on new projects. I think the way to look at demand for the transit side is there is two sort of parallel movements happening. One is, you've got the whole Western world, which is largely an existing legacy technology, which is usually closed loop, and there is a movement from closed loop to open loop, California being one example, right? A lot of the Western world is closed loop to closed loop to open loop. Old tech to new tech. A lot of the emerging world is where new projects are coming out, so a lot of times it's no tech to open loop tech, right?
Both of them are kind of very strong demand drivers for us. We will play in both of those spaces. California is an example of old tech to new tech. Something like a Haryana Transport or a Noida Metro or Nagpur Metro is an example of almost no tech to new tech, right? We'll play in both of those spaces. The revenue model typically will depend on the nature of the transaction. Largely, by and large, we don't do too many CapEx deals. We've done those in the past. We've also done some recently, but then we will normally find a partner who will provide the capital, and we will provide the tech. Usually outside of India, it's a pure tech deal.
California has proven, Canberra has proven, you know, Central America, Latin America, our wins even in Africa has proven that we can go head-to-head on a tech competition and win pretty much anywhere in the world, right? Globally, we will obviously collaborate with our larger partners like Mastercard, for example. Maldives, for example, if you look at it, is together in partnership with Mastercard. Right, we will find partners where capital is needed, but by and large, we will go and provide the tech. In India, we will do larger CapEx transactions as well, but then find a capital partner to work together with us on it, right? Which is like Nagpur Metro, Noida Metro, Kanpur Metro, Haryana Transport, et cetera, right? That's essentially transit.
The segment has been growing very strongly for us. We see a long demand as the world moves from closed loop to open loop tech. Open loop tech basically is, you know, you used to preload a instrument and go to the metro gate. Now you want to use your card, you want to use QR code, you want to have account-based ticketing, you know, all that stuff. Essentially moving from here to here, and that I don't think is a movement that can be stopped, and that will go on for some time. On data center, this is a specific bet we have on the digitization of India. We see a significant long-term demand as well as we saw a gap in the market, right?
We built out what we believe is one of the strongest data center design teams in the country, one of the strongest teams in terms of project managing a build, right? There is a significant demand. We've announced a lot of wins in that case, including some highly complex, competitive projects that we've won in the space, and we've got some fantastic strategic partnerships with a few clients who've been investing heavily in the space, right? Data centers, we will play across the spectrum. We will normally maintain a mix between design and project managing a build, essentially to deliver the net result, which delivers to the enterprise expectation on margins, right?
Because design would tend to be higher margin, and the rest of the stuff would tend to be lower margin, so you work on a blend which still delivers to the enterprise margin for sure, right? This is a business, again. TIG, on the whole, has been growing exceptionally strongly. This is a business which is probably growing even more strongly than the TIG growth level.
Thank you.
Thank you.
The next question is from Krupa Desai, from Electron Capital. On the banking side, sir, in U.S., Europe, would you be replacing the existing competitor or find new customers? Because I believe large banks there would have already be having such solutions placed.
Normally get involved is where the bank is. If I take corporate banking as an example, where the bank is looking at a transformation on the corporate banking side, right? Whether you go into U.S. or you go in Asia, you will hardly find a bank which does not have existing technology. I don't think such a bank exists. You'll always have some tech to replace. Typically, what would happen in a corporate loan origination space is, this is a space where a large bank believes its competitive source lies in the workflow process, in the origination process. They have built up a system largely in-house or used an outsourcer to build it, which is a reflection of how they ran their process.
There is a need to move to a best practice process, hence, do a transformation of the system, move from a custom-built application to a actual, first-rate product, right? If you see corporate loan origination space, we participate in Chartis, quadrants. We are squarely in the leaders quadrants on corporate loan origination, on collateral management, on limit management, and this is leaders quadrant globally. We are one of the top choices a bank has in terms of if I wanted to incorporate best practice in my origination process and move to a packaged product, we are one of the choices. Typically, the move is not from some other product to us.
Typically, the move is from a custom build job the bank did, and which is 90% of it, or especially the product they bought long time back and move to an Aurionpro solution.
Thank you. The next question is from a participant from Columbus Investments. Please share details of the new product that you have launched in this quarter, especially since you mentioned that it was a great quarter for the R&D team. Thank you.
Thanks for bringing that up. It really was an exceptional quarter, right? I think there are numbers are numbers, but there are some quarters that make you truly feel, I suppose why you jump out of the bed every morning and come to work, right? It's ECR-one, for example, that we launched in Barcelona last month, you know, Sanjay and his team launched that's almost two years of grueling hard R&D to go out and build a card reader, which is EMV compliant. You know, it does several things. One is it completely changes the margin profile of our own validator units that we were manufacturing, because that's a key component of the validator, it immediately improves our margins on it.
The second thing is, you really need high-quality card readers everywhere, right? It just opens up a brand new market, strategic partnerships of a very different scale for us once we roll these out in, and can manufacture them at scale, right? Not just for our own validator units, but even for as a standalone product by itself, right? Similarly, we launched. That is like, I mean, it is really exceptional. I don't think there are many firms, forget in India, even on a wider scale, who can do it, right? That was a great achievement. We launched a healthcare SaaS platform in the, in the U.S. in the week, which again, has gone through a few iterations and finally launched for a very specific segment of the market.
We are already taking in a few clients and fine-tuning the product further. That is a big one. We came up with core sort of new releases for a number of our products. What is happening to Aurionpro right now is, as we go into new markets... We did not really have, till nine months, 12 months back, when we started investing in the sales channels, we had a much smaller pipeline, which was a lot more narrowly focused in terms of geography. Now, as we go wider, we enter new markets. Even when you have the core product deal builds done, you need to fine-tune the product for the market that you're going to. Banking tends to be a highly regulated industry.
Transit as well will, you know, on the application side, will need to do a bunch of work. We actually had new versions come out of a number of our offerings. We also are working with a few strategic partners, so that is on the banking side. We're also working with a few strategic partners, in terms of, so like the Finastra partnership that we announced. Now we have, by and large, we will not announce new partnerships in the space for confidentiality reasons, but we're working on a number of other product releases which are specific to working, licensing our technology to other large global SIs. If I go back to the Finastra example for a second, what is it that we are doing?
We have a cutting-edge risk management solution, so we know how we do that. Finastra has the number one trade finance solution in the world. We are co-creating a real-time limit management functionality, call it a module, inside, which will work together with the Finastra trade finance solution, right? Now, one, we are already working on the first client on that one, and once the integration is done, the product is generally available, it becomes accessible to the entire sort of client base for Finastra if they want to get into real-time trade limits. You know, so arrangements like those need product to be fine-tuned and then released.
We actually got three of our core offerings, new versions out as well in the quarter. I think there is a lot of work that was in the plane for 12, 24 months that came out in the quarter. That is something that we're especially proud of. I mean, numbers are numbers, and obviously, that's what we work for, but we also work for the impact that we make. That's the sort of R&D success that I was talking about. Thanks for the question.
Thank you. The next question is from Vivek Gautam, from GS Investments. What are we doing to improve our perception due to past CG issues? Please highlight our USP and moat, and how is ops size in all our segments?
Past corporate governance issues.
Opportunities.
Honestly, I don't know what I can say about past issues. Or if, you know, the way we are running the business is, our goal is to be highly transparent. Our goal is to create net new value in the world. Our goal is to build out a global IP-led products and platforms player, rooted in India, rooted in Asia. We don't believe there are too many of those, we believe there's a giant market opportunity if we get our deal right. We chose a few bets. We are building against those bets. We are running a highly transparent business. We have a very clean balance sheet. We had, what? INR 170-180 crores of debt.
We retired it down to a fairly low number. We don't capitalize any, you know, with the exception of, you know, the payment side, where for regulatory reasons, we capitalize a very small, not material amount. We expense all of our R&D, so there is no significant intangible assets sitting on the balance sheet. Unless there is something specific I can answer around corporate governance, I think we run one of the cleanest businesses, one of the most competitive businesses in the place. We've been, our products, you know, Chartis like leader quadrants. There is no vendor in India, there is no vendor in Asia, which can claim to be there.
I mean, if you talk of a few competitors, they are far to the left, not even threatening to get anywhere close to the leader's quadrant in the next 10 years, right? We create real value. We run a competitive business. We have been very clear about where we want to be in 2030. You know, I mean, I hope that is good enough, but very happy to take on any specific questions.
Thank you. The next question is an audio question from the line of Sahil Sharma at Individual Investor. Please go ahead.
Hi, sir, can you hear me?
Yes, please go ahead.
Yes, sir. The question is, you know, since we have tier one IP, and when I look at the distribution or geographical distribution of our revenue, most of it comes from India and then from APAC. We get a very small percentage from USA and I think almost none from Europe. What I wanted to understand is what is our strategic direction for growing that by, you know, selling our tier one IP to Europe and USA and increasing that? What could this look like in two to three years or whatever timeframe you can talk about?
Thank you, Sahil. Look, first, our product businesses in Southeast Asia, Middle East, and India, I think that's where we've primarily been centered, are highly profitable, right? I think we can drive margins in these markets which are better than what most players can drive in U.S. or Europe, right? Pretty much, I would say pretty much 98% of the industry would do lesser margins than us than what we can do in Asia. Typically, the reason people don't like being in Asia and India is because they're selling essentially services, which is selling work hours for someone, and you don't get the right realization on those hours in these markets, right? When you are doing product, that is not a big problem, right? That's number 1.
We can run a highly profitable business in these markets. Of course, you are right. We don't, we don't aim to be just in Asia. Our ambition is to get to, like I said, top three in our chosen segments globally by 2030, right? Now, it is a long, hard journey to get there. To compete in U.S. and Europe, there are two things that are needed. One is, the products really need to be very competitive and suited to the banks or suited to the providers there, right? On the transit side, I think we are there. We can go out and compete with the best in the world and win. I keep coming back to California, but if you look at it's a competitive global RFP. There's no choosing favorites on that one.
There is no fixing the game. It's a competitive head-to-head, and we go and win, which means if I can win in California, going head-to-head with pretty much everyone in the world, we can win anywhere, right? We believe from a product standpoint, we are very well-placed on the transit side. On the banking side, we are very, very well-placed in Asia, so corporate loan origination is as deep a product as you get anywhere in the world. We want to be really go market by market, make sure we are suitable, and then go, right? One is that making the product fit for purpose for the bank. It's not a question of depth, it's a question of adapting to the market, and we will go slowly as we do that. The second is building a sales channel.
Building a sales channel, I'm not a huge fan of hiring 10 guys, throwing them in the U.S. and then hoping that works, right? I mean, selling in large banks is, it's... You know, you need to play the long game here. What we are trying to do is we are saying, yes, we will organically build out our sales team. We built it up in the U.S., we don't have any in the Europe right now. We will support those teams to succeed. As that unit succeeds, we'll scale up. We are not in a rush to scale up with, you know, a large sales team day 1. We will scale it up organically as we build a box. That box succeeds, then we scale it up.
double the size, that box succeeds, we'll double it again, right? We will organically grow. To speed our time to market, what we will do is we'll go and focus on strategic partnerships that can take our products global, right? Which is where in every large segment that we exist in, where our products can play together with a large global ISV, we will go and get into an arrangement where we develop IP. Because we are very good at building products, we are very agile, we are very cost efficient. In terms of building it, we know how to play the product game.
We know what it takes to build a product, we know what it takes to manage it, we know what it takes to stand up an implementation team, we know what it takes to surround it with API framework, we know what it takes to make it cloud-native, right? Up there, it's not a game that the commoditized outsourcers can play, right? We use our strengths, strike win-win partnerships, and that will allow our products to go out quickly a lot more. Finastra we announced, we will probably announce a few more, but most likely without mentioning the names of those vendors, right? We'll do more and more of those, and those will also take our products to Europe and to U.S., right? I think those will be...
Once you see the results of it, those results should come out much more sooner than 2030, those would be exceptional win-win situations. It is a win for the client, win for both the partners working together in terms of co-creating those solutions, right? I think that is how we'll go. Strategic partnerships, deep partnerships, expand sales channel in the U.S., grow organically and continue to drive the channel in Asia. Asia is also, if you see, most of our sales expansion is 9 to 12 months. It's very, very new for us, right? We've got a lot of headroom in Asia as well, which we will keep tapping onto. That's essentially the game.
Sir, can I ask one more question? Sir, when we look at the license you got for payment aggregation, can you just share, like, how we would leverage that and what is the business model there? For, I think, AuroPay, right?
Yeah. AuroPay, look, payment, as you know, digital payments is a vast market. We've applied for licenses in India, which we got an in-principle approval from RBI, we applied for license in Singapore, which is still in the process. The goal is not to become the 51st payment gateway in India and join the race to the bottom on margins. The goal is to strategically play in areas we are strong in, right? This is something that I've explained before. You know, what is the key strategy when we go into a segment, right? First is we choose a segment, right? We choose a segment where we believe the demand runway is long.
We believe, you know, the leadership is fragmented or at least contested on a global basis, and we believe we have the ability to build out a tier one asset, right? Once those three conditions are met, we are in that segment, like, you know, corporate banking, transit, whatever, right? We choose a segment. When we go into that segment, then what are we trying to do, right? It's not just building a product. What we are saying is, we're not that keen on sitting in a box that says, software or hardware or services or whatever, right? We are a tech player. We will look at the whole value chain. We will look at how does that client buy.
In the case of a transit operator, it goes from, you know, a validator, to the software around AFC, to the payment stack, to gates, you know, the whole thing. In the case of a bank, you know, it goes from, you know, the software to the implementation to the cloud, right? We look at the value chain. We will try as far as possible to occupy every point on that value chain, right? Become the most cost-efficient producer on every point of the chain. That is what allow us to really build up a competitive advantage over everyone else who's playing that game, who think they're a software vendor or a hardware vendor or services vendor, right? That allows you to drive margins, right? That is the game.
Now coming back to your AuroPay point, transit, for example, we are end-to-end, and the payment offering can play very well with transit, where we already hold the contracts, right? Allows us to expand the margin on the same business that we are doing anyways better, right? Second thing is, for example, the B2B SaaS platforms we have, enabling B2B payments, which we believe is a underserved niche, right? We've chosen spaces where, A, we have a competitive advantage, we think. Second, we have a margin expansion game. Third, we have the ability to really differentiate ourselves and go after the underserved market, right? That is essentially the game for digital payments. We believe this is a huge market.
Even when you get so specialized, you're obviously competing with everyone else, but we are in spaces where we believe we are You know, once we have the offering fully ready. We got the in-principle approval, but we still need to get the final one, right? We essentially play in spaces where we have that unique competitive advantage.
Thank you, Sahil. May I request you to join the queue for any follow-up, as we have several participants waiting for their turn? Thank you. The next question is from the line of Suryansh from Bizx Enterprise LLP . Please go ahead.
Hi, congratulations. I need to ask that after recent capital raise, do we need further capital raise in near time, sir?
Okay. Thank you, Suryansh. The short answer is no. The capital raise that we did is actually a very, very minor capital raise. It's not a significant capital raise. As a business, like I've said on previous calls, we are kicking up enough capital to reinvest back in the business and can support the organic growth of 25%-30% levels, right? The additional capital that we raised is, you know, it sort of improves the strategic flexibility for us a little bit as we go into an environment where we see some very large opportunity, our ability to react to it improves slightly, right? It's not a huge amount of capital raise, it's a very minor capital raise, right? That was the only ambition behind that.
It sort of improves the strategic flexibility over the next 12 months to react to significant opportunities which we think may appear, right? If they don't appear, it's essentially used in general corporate purposes. Do we need more capital long term? This is what is happening to the business, right? What we said is, first, choose the segments. We did that. Second, build out assets in each of the segments that will compete. We've done most of it, right? Third, go out and expand organically in each of those. Be ready for scale, right? If you go back and see that Vision 2030, the period in the middle is that scale readiness period, where we say. Because, you know, product business is not the same.
If I want to grow 30%, it doesn't mean I have to go and hire 30% more people. I need to actually hire far less people, I need to tie the whole thing end to end, right? From, how we design, how we fine-tune, how we manufacture even. We've got a bunch of manufacturing facilities, for electronics out in Southeast Asia, as well as India. How we get the software side, right, how we get the operations side, right? Need to get the whole thing, fine-tuned as we really scale.
We can see a situation where we have built out a lot of products and we are ready for scale from design to manufacturing to software, and we can deploy, you know, more than the amount of capital that the enterprise is kicking up. I would say if we ever reach that situation, that would be to support growth rates more than the organic 25%-30% that we've been committing. The short story, 25%-30%. To support that growth, I don't think we need any excess capital.
Thank you, sir. One last question was that, sir, are we also playing something in insurance side or not? Like we are in banking, are we playing in something in insurance also?
Not in a, any significant way at the moment. We've been talking to a few insurance clients in terms of supporting their digital efforts and especially on the payment side. We are in the U.S., it's by happenstance, but essentially we have become some sort of a key link in the payment chain in the insurance business, because of, you know, our licensed technology being used by some of the very large payment facilitators to the insurance business in the US, right? We've been exploring some conversations in the insurance space around leveraging the payment technology further. That's not an insurance domain offering. That's essentially a payment offering. It's just that a insurer happens to use it.
Thanks for giving the opportunity. Thank you.
Thank you. We'll take the next question from the line of Paresh Doshi. One, Next Generation Treasury Application, NGTA, issuance of RFP. A pre-bid meeting for the captioned e-tender was conducted at 3:00 P.M. on June 23, 2023. This was attended by the company. Two, when can we expect RBI license to operate as payment aggregator? Please throw light on the above 2 matter.
I don't think the two are linked. I think the information that you picked up on the participation in the RFP. If that is an open thing, then just go by what it says. I'm pretty sure it doesn't say anything about the payment licenses. Right? The two things are not linked.
Thank you. Next question is from Umesh Matkar, from Sushil Financial Services Private Limited. Congratulations on a great set of results. Can you explain on Reviq Healthcare SaaS platform and how it fits to your current business model?
Just on the, on the previous one, right? I missed answering the second part of the question, which was how long does it take for us to get the license, right? While I'm pretty sure that actually RFP point made and the payment thing is not linked, we are going through the process in terms of fulfilling the operational parameters that RBA needs for them to come in and do the inspection and do that, right? I think that will take a few months before we get into that inspection. As we get to that milestone, we will, we will inform, you know, in the right forum as we, as we get there, right? Coming to Reviq, it's a, it's a SaaS platform which focuses specifically on specialized kind of practices.
We've built up a platform that, you know, if you are a specialized health practice, or a med spa, you can actually use this as the main software to onboard new patients, to manage your practice, and to enable all the payments around it. Now, this platform has come out of an acquisition we did 12 months. Okay, I may be wrong on the time, but last year, which was called Hello Patients. What we've done is we've combined our payment technology with some of the software that was getting built around Hello Patients. We completed the software, or we completed large parts of it to be relevant to one part of the market and combined that with the payments technologies, and that's what we've launched, right?
This is still a soft launch, where we're going out and fine-tuning it for the initial set of prospects and clients, then we intend to push it a lot harder, right? I think the even if you go after just the med spa space in the U.S., that's a huge space, and there is a clear edge we have on the payment side of things in terms of really enabling a seamless transaction for the client, right? I believe we have some real value to add in terms of the experience that a client gets from the practice, both in terms of onboarding, regular users of the practice, as well as the payment side, right? That's essentially the play.
Thank you.
Thank you.
The next question is from Mayur Damani, as an individual investor. Congratulations on a great set of numbers to team Aurionpro, in spite of the biggies not able to deliver on a high base and business model. What is our strategic planning for future orders that is beyond 800 crores and four quarters from now, expanding in USA, MEA region and others?
Thank you. Thank you, Mayur, right. I would not speculate on where the order book will be in 12 months or 24 months. I think that's, I don't think that's really very relevant to our planning. For the next 12 months, honestly, we need very little sell and deliver to do the next 12 months of revenue. As I've said a few times in the past, when we look in the near term, which is 4 to 6 quarters, demand is less of a problem than capacity. What we need to get is our capacity in order.
What we need to get is end-to-end, make sure the chain is so tight that we are growing while enhancing our delivery efficiency, not putting it at risk as we grow too fast, right? The challenge for us is not that. In terms of new business that we really need to close to deliver the next 12 months, that is a very, very small amount, and 75% of that would come from the existing clients, right? It's really not a big thing in terms of order book expansion, right? Over the longer term. We plan to grow at 25%-30%. The revenue, roughly two-thirds, roughly one-third of our revenue every year is new revenue. Which is basically needs to come from the sell and deliver, right?
To deliver that one-third, you typically need to sell about kind of 70%, 80% more than that, right? I think that is essentially what the sales numbers should be at. But the way we go is we really go bottom up. We go product by product. We set a number of what we can take, honestly, at the moment and then derive the revenue from that, right? We will sell correspondingly what is needed to deliver that number, right? I don't think we are in a situation to really go all out and capture as much of sales as we realistically can, right? I think the way to look at it is this: in most of the segments we are, we are extremely competitive, whether it's transit, whether it's banking, extremely competitive, right?
If your limit is your ability to take business, not your ability to sell, you would want to calibrate sales to make sure you're not sort of invading the capacity, right? I think that is, that is essentially what we are doing. It's not blindly sell as much as you can. It is decide how much you need to sell to deliver the 25%-30%, and then calibrate the sales there in terms of how much capacity you put on the field, right? That does not take into account some of these new strategic partnerships that we formed, because honestly, we don't know what that would drive in terms of future sales, right?
That is one sort of variable which, we're not planning for at the moment, which may increase the amount of sales we may have to take, but we will sort of cross that bridge when we come to it.
Thank you. Ladies and gentlemen, that would be our last question for today. I now hand the conference back to Mr. Ashish Rai for closing comments. Thank you. Over to you, sir.
Thanks, everyone, for joining the call. Q1, I think, was a good demonstrator of, I suppose the continued success of our strategy. The journey we are on is a long journey, so one or two quarters do not really. You know, they are not so material in the larger scheme of things other than as proof points to say whether we are going in the right direction. In that sense, Q1 was an encouraging quarter for us. We will remain focused on delivering to our plan of growing 30%-35% this year and maintain the margins that we are at. I look forward to seeing you in the next earnings call. Thank you very much.