Q4 20/21

May 12, 2021

Good afternoon, everyone. On behalf of Kotak Institutional and Companies, I welcome you all to GoodRx Consumer Products QFY 21 Earnings Call. I will now hand over the call to Pratik Jantara, AVP, M and A and Investor Relations for initial introductions. Operator, you proceed. Thanks, Jay. Good afternoon, everyone. We hope that you are staying safe and healthy. We will be covering this afternoon the results for the quarter and financial year ended 31st March 2021. On the call from JCPL, we have Viktava Gotash, Chief Person and Managing Director V Srinivasan, CFO and Company Secretary and Vipanisha, Head Investor Relations. As Akashumari, we will start with Vipanisha sharing her perspective on the business and an overview on how we are navigating the current environment. Thank you, Priti. Good afternoon, everyone. I hope you and your families are safe and healthy during these very difficult times as possible. And thank you so much for taking the time to be with us on this call today. Let me start with sharing an update on the CEO succession plan, which we announced yesterday. Effective October 18, 2021, Sudhir C. W. Lee will join GCPL as Managing Director and Chief Executive Officer. I will continue to serve our company as Executive Chairperson. So these significant experience and passion for building sustainable and profitable businesses arise very strongly with our partners at GCTL. His value based leadership style also makes him a great fit with our culture. I look forward to this partnership and unlocking the amazing potential of our company and leading its 6 phase of growth. Moving on to the business performance update, let me begin with GCTL's performance for the entire year. Financial year 2021 has been a challenging year for everyone. However, I'm extremely proud of our team members and the remarkable agility and resilience they have demonstrated through these difficult times. During the year, GCPL has grown in double digits at 11% and has developed EBITDA growth of 14%. We have been able to drive a resurgence in household insecticides and digital full year INR sales growth of 15%. Hygiene, including soaps, continued its strong momentum and delivered a 24% growth for the year. Value for money products have witnessed sequential recovery both in India and Africa, USA and the Middle East, delivering a sales growth of 14% for the year. India also witnessed a double digit sales growth of 14% led by strong performance in home insecticides, which grew at 16% and hygiene, including scopes, which grew at 15%. Performance in our Indonesian business was soft and constant currency sales growth of 2%. This was back to a steady performance in household insecticides and significant scale up of the hygiene portfolio under the Sanitizer brand. Our Africa, USA and Middle East business saw recovery and delivered constant currency sales growth of 9%. Specifically in quarter 4, GCPL delivered a 3rd consecutive quarter of double digit sales growth. Our growth was broad based. Overall sales grew by 20 7%, EBITDA grew by 21%, and tax grew by 20%, excluding exceptional items. Hygiene continued its strong growth momentum growing by 28%, and we look forward to strongly building on this category in the years ahead. Value for money products grew by 27%. Growth in household insecticides was up 28%. We also saw continued strong growth momentum in the household insecticides and hygiene categories and sequential recovery in value for money products. From a geography perspective, India recorded a sales growth of 35% led by growth across the portfolio in hygiene and household insecticides. Overall, rural grew at 1.4x of urban. The scale up of the e commerce channel continues. Indonesia witnessed gradual recovery with a 4% constant currency sales growth and a base quarter growth in mid single digits. We had steady performance in household insecticides density and intensity in wet wipes. Our Africa, USA, Middle East businesses delivered profitable sales growth of 36% in constant currency terms. I continue to be pleased with the strategic focus and growth mindset of the team. Consolidated EBITDA margins at 20% decreased by 110 basis points year over year due to a drop in the India, Rentals in America and SaaS margins. In India, margins decreased by 500 basis points year on year driven by the lag between an increase in input costs and end consumer price increases, provision of slow moving inventory on a conservative basis and a onetime variable manpower remuneration reversal in the Q4 of financial year 2020. We continue to have a healthy balance sheet. The return ratios continue to move up as the net debt to equity ratio came down. We are carefully navigating the challenges of the 2nd wave of COVID-nineteen in India by ensuring seamless supply chain deliveries and closely tracking shifts in consumer behavior to respond to. We are leveraging our learnings from the 1st wave and under compared to respond to any supply chain disruptions given our ramped up production capabilities. While localized lockdowns impact online servicing in the replenishment of outlets in the very short term, the 2nd wave is likely to be a tailwind for the hygiene category. It seems to remain resilient and agile. As always, our values matter the most at this time. We are committed to enabling the safety and well-being of all Goji rights and serving our consumers and communities with our full thoughts and minds. Thank you. Thank you very much. We will now begin the question and answer Thanks. My first question is on hygiene segment in India. You launched multiple products in Wave 1 and you also said Wave 2 also tailwind will be there. Could you tell us which are the products where you're getting more confident and which are the lagging products where you may recall? And second, we have also seen a lot of consolidation, a lot of the new players who entered are exiting or already exited. So do you see them coming back and you're new in a lot of the segments? So is there a long term opportunity or is it more of a wave through opportunity? Hi, Adnish. Thank you for your question. I think you mentioned before also what we're seeing is definitely consumers need to stay protected and clean and protect from viruses or other things has become much stronger. We've seen penetration also grow in household insecticides. What we've done in hygiene over the year and as we go ahead is really double down in products where we feel we have very strategic advantages, whether it's soap, magic, handwash and some of the other categories we played in. Last year, we had played a few parts of the business that we launched masks and a few other products that we're actually not even relaunching in Wave 2 or focusing in Wave 2. So I think we have a lot of learnings also from the last year on which of these products and hygiene that we should focus on. And in terms of soap segment market, you do in India said 2 rounds of price hikes have happened around 6% to 7%. In your case, last 1 year, how much of the price hike? And are you also planning one more hike? And if you use on palm oil for the year? Is more of a calibrated price increase and which has worked very well for us because we have seen strong growth as well as strong market share gains. And as the approach will continue also at least in medium term, This also will be a good opportunity for us to gain market share from a lot of small players because they normally fit on the fence in high inflationary environment. So we try to mitigate and involve this kind of gap through structured costing programs as well as evaluating pricing opportunities in the rest of the portfolio in very short term. The vegetable oil prices are more or less at similar levels over next couple of months. We expect timing those levels to sort of continue. It will be one of the longest sort of hurdle for vegetable oil prices, I should say, over last kind of 12 to 16 months now. Let's see over next 3 to 4 months eventually which direction it kind of takes. Sure. Actually, also my last quick question on Africa. Any business or any region you have evaluated where it doesn't make sense from a core synergy, core process perspective long term, anything you can share at this stage? Nothing, Avnish. I mean, if you look at our play, I mean, it's sort of in some of the large markets and the so called kind of Tier 2 markets. I think geographically and even category wise, the portfolio looks pretty complete. At this point in time, the entire thing is in terms of getting those growth building blocks, whether it be marketing campaigns, whether it be seeding in new future growth category as well as kind of driving GTM initiatives in most of the markets we are presenting. Sure. Thanks. That's line of The next question is from the line of Manishwari from Jefferies. Please go ahead. Hi, good afternoon everyone. Am I audible? Yes. Yes, we can hear you. Okay, great. A couple of questions on this new appointment. So, this is what are the areas that you think should be the priority for the new CEO after he takes over across, let's say, India, Indonesia and Rafnika. Are there any thoughts on that that you can share at this stage? Sure. I think the main focus, if you have to say what are the top three focuses, it's probably growth, growth, growth. And I think there are underlying pieces of how you get to the growth. But I think what we've seen this year and last year talked a little bit about getting to double digit growth, the resurgence in household in certain sites. So I think we've made a good start to it. My expectation is that he comes in and now sort of takes this to the next level. I think we all know his background in sort of category management. He's also portfolio around at HUL at one point. So really bringing that more category management thinking across the GCTL clusters and strengthening that is what we'd really look forward to. Got it. And second on your role, you have been the MD for last few quarters. And before that in the earlier meeting as well, you played an important role on product launches and the new initiatives. How do you think how your role will evolve after Sotheej takes charge of this year? I think we'll have to wait to see how he once he comes in. But I'll continue to play the Chairperson role. And support him obviously, as his responsibility for governance, asking the hard questions would still fall on me. But I'm hoping that I can continue to support him on all the knowledge I have of the company and give him that support. But really let him have a very free hand in coming in and seeing what can be done differently. I'm also looking forward my history with GCTL also goes back many years, so over the decade. And I really felt that that time when I first came into GCTL, it was a wonderful opportunity to actually look at it with very outside in eyes. And at the same time, my father was a chairperson at that time. I had a lot of backing from him to go ahead and sort of make bold changes. So I hope I can say that role that cost a deal where he can really come in with the transformation agenda together and then I can really help enable it. And one last thing on since you mentioned about the transformation, so does that mean that in case if the processes start and get into newer categories, so let's say you have had previously strategy a while back and then you obviously expected beyond that date, the frictionless or the I'm not launching a food business. So that was not the point of getting along. No, I think look, I think some of these things in any case, we've transitioned a little bit from 3 from 3 has been transitioned already. And I think with him coming out, he's probably start communicating a new strategic plan. But I still think it will be early sort of big growth in some of our core factory, the right household insecticide, hair care, this hygiene and hair care and fabric care, all quite new categories with more penetration across some of pieces. So I think you can really come and help ignite on those categories. I don't think obviously, we potentially might come into new categories. There might be acquisitions that come up. But I think, really what we're looking for is good strong double digit organic growth. Very good to know, Nisavan. Good to know that you don't want to be into food. So that focus is great. Thank you and wish you all the best. Thank you. Thank you. Next question is from the line of Bhushti Anathakti from IIFLT. Please go ahead. Hi, Nithya and team. Good afternoon. My suspicion again is on the management change here. So when Vivek left, I think as a firm, we took a decision that we would not sort of hire anyone else in this case. You would be sticking into issues. Now within such a short duration of this departure, what really was the thought process behind the change in that sort of decision that we had taken at that point of time? So, Pohsi, I think when we had taken the decision at that time, it was during the pandemic, and I did feel that it was not the right moment to bring in someone from outside at that point that I would run the company myself. We also obviously in these sort of situations do have some very good internal candidates which have also done the role. We eventually decided to go with Sudhir. And I think the idea was that I would run it for a couple of years. And in April 'twenty two, when anyway we're going to split, you have to legally also split the Chairperson and CEO role. We will have a successor appointed by then. Sometimes if seemingly good things are happening to you beforehand, you might as well go ahead and do them. So I think that's been the attention behind this. Right. And on a slightly related note, if I look at the 3 senior positions in your company right now, that is the MD and CEO, which you recently filled, as well as the Head of Indonesia and the Head of Africa, they are all outside high risk. So just wanted to understand, I mean, did you ever consider or do you think there is a concern in terms of what message that sends us internally and whether that is sort of a point that you could address in some way because we've seen the banks as one of the best places to work etcetera. So we do have a very strong internal bench. And in that context, 3 senior positions going to outside guys, how do you sort of look at that holistically? Sure. I'm happy to answer that. So I think, also, if you look at those positions before we got the outside leadership, we were actually sales by internal positions and we've actually taken a lot of bets on very good young people internally. I think if you Indonesia was in recent, it was 4 years ago. And obviously, Africa Peace was 1 year ago. I think what then happened is that we've become global as a company quite recently. So the thinking was then to get leadership because we had sent people from India to run these geographies and people who had a lot of experience in India. And then at some point, we felt when these businesses are performing to the market, we obviously, as you all know, have put in a lot of money into these businesses that we wanted sort of very experienced people from those geographies to come and run those businesses. I think so far, those calls have been right. And I think as long as people internally feel that we make the right decisions, we equally give people internally a chance to see senior roles. We do tend to also benchmark from outside. Thank you. The next question is from the line of Arnab Mishra from Credit Suisse. Please go ahead. Hi. Thanks for taking my question. My first question was on HI. So I think last quarter you had more double digit share in the industry. How has that now settled down? And a related question is a lot of innovation in SIR still seems very competitive minimization like gold flash or new segments like the gold storm. Any thoughts of the penetration gain? Do you need a lot more there in terms of your efforts to high penetration in the low income segments? Sure. Let me answer that for you, Arnab. So I think incentive see at the same level that they were basically during the year. As you saw in the quarter last year, the supply chain shock was so big that they went out. Can you to work very strongly on the sort of legal government side. He actually had a very senior person join us in corporate affairs in the group too, and one of his key mandates is to help on this issue. So as you know, our 80% of our portfolio is in the premium segment or say what 20% of our portfolio is what we call non secuto where growth has been very high, penetration is very low. So even say something like LV or LMD, penetration went up in the category this year, but it's still at about I think 26%, 27%. So the headroom in these and the margin profile in these segments obviously gives us a reason for sort of tier. That being said, obviously, the quality formats is not something that we still continue to be the market leaders in coils by far. I think this year, I mentioned it, I think, in a previous call, we do have a few products coming against these illegal sticks that sort of compete directly against them. Our natural instance and we were obviously waiting that registration cycle, which will happen this year. We had launched those natural fixed agent from an efficacy drop that perspective we're not able to sort of effectively for consumers compete as these in legal and then fixed. But I think you'll see more from gCTL this year on the burning format front. Thanks. That's very helpful. And my last question was on these 2 brands, both Q and A and Protex, which obviously FY 21 was a big year of impact in terms of products as well as new segments. On the full year level, is there anything you can share with us? It's really helpful. I appreciate what you're doing combines which you are scaling up? Yes, Naved, this is Sameer here. This is kind of the same from sharing. Yes, sorry, Adam. We could just talk about the calls. She is just joining in. No, what I was sharing is refrain from giving very specific kind of input. So what I can share with you is strategically this day of hygiene and extended hygiene within cleansing format is extremely kind of critical for us. If you look at our hygiene portfolio other than India itself, I mean last year in terms of CNC was close to around 4 percentage. Also the sensing format was off to a great start and you did see that the Envigorate had the same sort of plan for in terms of past kind of launches, but we sort of recouped also during the 1st wave of kind of lockdown, right. And of course, we will also market up with more interesting innovation over a period of time to make this play very, very kind of strategic and hopefully big for us. So that's the thinking which we have in Navi. These are the categories which are relatively under 10% to 20% where we do feel that we are right to win if we get the right product innovation and in general also leverage our distribution. So, the focus includes ProClean and the sanitizers, I am just trying to understand what all is accounted in that hygiene segment? Yes, it does include, I think, yes, it does include having both ProClean as well as the entire market of the wash and the side of the business. Thanks. The next question is from the line of Agi Mehta from Macquarie. Please go ahead. Hi. I just wasn't clear on the last question on the bookings category. So is this pickup in HI or is the strength in HI largely in terms of the decrease, kind of remaining strong or is it because of market share changes or the infant segment, obviously, changes especially in the bookings? Side? Hi, Avin. Hi. We've done well across all the categories. So we've had good growth even in the burning format. Like I said, we still are the biggest player in coils, which is still the biggest segment in burning format. So actually across all segments, non mosquito, electric, have each been showed good growth this quarter and actually even across if we look at it as a full year basis. So, Nusa, I just let's leave a little more pointed on this. What I was trying to understand is, has there been any change in the competitive intensity from the instance stick manufacturers like with incense sticks or no? Is it? No, no. Okay. And the second, it was on your comment on the second wave. The expectation, are you seeing that being on the ground on the hygiene and on the non discretionary portfolio, any changes as yet? Not too strongly. I mean April was strong. It was a sort of continuation of quarter 4. The expectation is that you will have a little bit of a take off with some of these categories, which have that health, the hygiene, household and pesticides having some amount of tailwind and perhaps the discretionary having some amount of headwind. I mean given what the situation of the country is and what people are going through, it's pretty hard because I don't know. I mean, we normally don't see it, but I don't expect people to be very bothered right now about delivering there and things like that. We haven't seen it yet, but potentially in the first half. The other thing we've seen also is that like the last wave, the wave hits, but then people eventually just go back to normal behavior. What we have seen in some of these categories is perhaps penetration shift or a habit shift that would stay which would last longer. So I've given the example of your hand wash before. Penetration Okay, perfect. And last just a clarification on the leadership change. If I hear you correctly in the start, your thought is that the focus would be to drive the growth and the portfolio changes or any changes would be something that would be on the season with Suji's kind of expertise? No, I think what I said is that I don't see too many portfolio changes happening in that system mandate that he's holding in with. But obviously, not just because he's a new CEO, but he will just relook at the portfolio, perhaps say, here's where we want to invest more, double down, perhaps this is not an area we want to focus on. So I think I'll just clarify that I would say most of the double digit growth would come from our core categories and some of the new categories like air care or even this liquid wash where there's a lot of opportunity because penetration is still low. Okay. So existing categories, but that would be first. Perfect. That's it. Thanks a lot again and congratulations. Thank you. Thank you. The next question is from the line of Rupeshi from IIS Securities. Please go ahead. Hi, sorry, Nisa. I put my mic on mute last time around, so you guys can hear me. Couple of questions on the performance. So I'll put them upfront. Indonesia, what really would it take for us to go back to double digit kind of growth there? And secondly, in Africa, I know that apart from the top line growth, you're concentrating on margins there also. So can you give some guidance on what kind of margins you would like to achieve over the next couple of years kind of timeframe? And also in the longer run, what the stable state margin for the geography that you're foresee? I'm asking this question in the slightly shorter term context where sequentially we've seen a different EBITDA margins in Africa between Q3 and Q4. So I'll answer the Indonesia question of course and then I'll also ask you to jump in from the Africa EBITDA, if you see someone who's worked on that quite closely. I think in Indonesia, if I see it, there has been the growth has been disappointing this year. I think SMCG as a whole in Indonesia has not been sufficiently well disturbed. Let's put that aside. I think where we've done exceptionally well this year is building this sort of 100 crore plus hedging portfolio in 1 year. And it's been quite strategic. The product has been quite strategic in areas where we have competitive advantage. So I really feel that this is a nice new growth lever for the Indonesia business. HI was relatively good, but again can be pushed. And in HI, we have a new sort of what we call long lasting take of working format launch along with this big GT push. And we're also doing magic hand wash and soaps as well as some interesting growth in the world. I think this wet wipes we totally dropped the ball on this year given what happened with the competitive intensity. So we must slowly recover this business going forward. And even in AK, sort of doubled down in sort of the growth of it which we had planned even before COVID. So I think if the recovery happens in some of these categories and the double down in growth and some of these curves, we should see a good recovery. Okay, great. Firstly, I think your question on SG and A margin, we had shared that over the next few years, we wanted to be sort of mid teens to high teens and in some levels of what we would kind of plan for. Of course, it's going to be a journey and this will have shape up over the next few years. Very strong. I mean, it was growth rates to begin with 20% is large. And when in terms of margins, we saw 11.5 percentage up by I think 150 basis points. So that's the plan. I think it will be driven by scale, it will be driven by cost cutting program, it will be driven by category or format mix, which are going to be the larger drivers for that. In terms of sequential margins, what we have to understand is there is a good seasonality in Aspena Business especially in quarter 3, which is a healthy period and hence in quarter 3 there is significant scale leverage as a result of fresh margins historically and also going ahead will be higher compared to any other quarter, That also tends to be seasonally in this quarter. And hence, there is, relating to quarter 3, a scale deleverage and hence, overall margin would be lower in quarter 2 compared to quarter 3. If you look at net margin in that company, which is back internally sequentially, in fact in quarter 4, the net margin which is the gross margin reduced by the digital marketing investments were higher I think by around 10 basis points compared to quarter 3. But the entire related drop is completely driven by change, which in turn is completely driven by the seasonal kind of issues attached to the category somewhere. Understood, Sami. Yes. And this mid to high teens versus your current levels of around 11% or whatever that is, that's about 600 basis points, 4 points kind of expansion over 3 to 4 years. Do you think that's going to be back ended? Or should we like expect a linear 200 basis points or 150 basis points every year? Yes. I think, no, it's definitely not going to be back ended, right? Because you need to kind of demonstrate that right from the word go. And I think we will see it quite evenly spreaded out. And internally, the way we are thinking of it is obviously keeping it more contented than using it do late in the day. But definitely it's not going to be contented. I mean it will be more evenly extended out across the years. Right. Thanks a lot Samir and Neetar. Thanks for the second opportunity. Thank you. Stay safe. The next question is from the line of Harit Saptik from BNP. Please go ahead. Just second question. First thing, you've mentioned in your presentation that the innovation rate is in high teens for this year. Can you just explain that and probably give a sense of either on a global level or on an India level, innovation rate as a percentage of business, how that's going to clash? Yes. I think the rate is very high. This is the 18% number that's in India. And it's very high, specifically driven by this goldflash new machine that we have? I mean, that is our biggest product category. And as we mentioned before, what we did is that we actually replaced because we believe in this product so much and think it's so good, removed all the other machines we were selling and has kept this as the sole machine in the market. Okay. And as a proportion of business, you're saying that how much would the innovation rate be in the last 1 or 3 years? Is that below single digits, mid single digits? Yes, it would be like mid single digits. It depends on your T or credit when we calculate it, an innovation is an innovation for 3 years. So we spend year to year. The second question is on India, the margin. This year is challenging. The second half also, we've seen a sharp inflation in vegetable oil. Can you give us a sense of what are the other categories in terms of inflation in India? And how do you look at the medium term margin, especially since you're talking about a calibrated approach? So specifically, 'twenty two versus 'twenty one, are there enough levers to kind of hold the margin at these levels? Or just want to get some sense on how you're looking at it? Percent on how you're looking at it? Hey, Harit, this is Kavir here. No, so I think the drop in gross margin, especially if you look at auto food was because of one increase in vegetable oil prices and the lag between increase in input price and then consumer price. And I was voicing U. S. Market share gains. We continue with that strategy. We have seen relative increase in food prices also. It's an indirect derivative, but we will be able to mitigate any increase in food prices. We are also evaluating opportunities on pricing in rest of the portfolio beyond soaps. So let's see how that shapes up. In the interim, it will be also judicial and smart in terms of our spending, right, whether it be trade promotion, trade promotion or even marketing investments to see how this overall kind of margin profile shapes up. And last but not the least, let's see, I mean, how the overall commodity inflation, especially in vegetable oil itself is going to shape up? I mean, at least over next couple of months, we do feel that prices Let's see how that eventually kind of moves ahead. Our sense is, I mean, at this point in time, of course, too many variables in moving parts, we should be able to sort of maintain our margins in India on a few years before. Okay. Thanks. That's your mind. Thank you. Thanks, Harish. Next question is from the line of Lathik Chota from JPMorgan. Please go ahead. Yes, hi. Thanks for your opportunity. I have 2 questions. The first is on the other businesses in India portfolio, which accounts for roughly 15%. And I think this will include Protect from Clean and Care and Easy. Could you give a sense on the distribution footprint for these brands today? And how do you see that scaling up? And the second question was on Indonesia margins, which have seen a heavy improvement despite whatever is happening on the top line. So do you anticipate or see positive improvement here on these margins? Or would you choose to reinvest some of these gains back into driving the top line growth momentum? Thank you. Hey, Natika, this is Sameer here. So I think if you look at Tenter's uptake of other categories as you rightly pointed out, it's actually a mix of professional and liquidates and the new age, IT format. These are categories which are relatively undervalued and hence significantly become the opportunity in terms of distribution. But it's not just distribution, it's also going to be kind of product innovation, which will kind of get new consumers recruited into this category. Actually, we are at overall GCSE level, widely distributed 6,000,000 outlets, 1,300,000, 1,200,000 outlets, the direct reach. So I think distribution is quite good. We can very easily sort of have kind of cross sell of categories and brands within our portfolio. So it's going to be a combination of both, I mean, to answer your point in terms of driving strong sustainable kind of growth in some of this emerging basket or category going ahead. In terms of Indonesia's margins, I think to begin with 35 percentages, what was the margin in Q4? My sense is for FY 'twenty one, our margins which are holding around 27%, 28% mark. Still we see there is opportunity in terms of expanding margins, if in fact some of them are listed program, getting favorable category mix will be the drivers in terms of scaling up Indonesia margin in kind of 4 years to come. Sure. Thanks, Avi. Any sense of how should the reach of Protect Ranch in terms of number of outlets? Sorry, Lipik, I mean, we would want to keep a new word at this point. I will be very happy to share more details on some of the emerging process going ahead. Sure. All right. Thank you. Thank you, The next question is from the line of Radeep Svezi from Santiam Capital. Please go ahead. Yes. Hi, good afternoon team and thanks for participating. Mr. Vaati, congratulations that you the market has cheered I have a couple of questions. In my mind, I was thinking, I mean, you have taken about 7% pricing fees also. Would you be able to share what is the basis of inflation we are seeing in HI in terms of cost inflation and also in soaps? And how much we have affected the price? Hey, this is Sameer here. So I think in soaps, if you just look at the vegetable oil prices, if you look at the recruitment rate, pricing is up by 80% to 60% to 60% right. Theoretically, if you had to mitigate the In housing insecticides, at this point in time, as I was calling out earlier, we are not too worried about inflation. Yes, there could be a food impact over there, but I think it will get more than mitigated through driving favorable format mix and really taking selective size increases in some of the formats within the category. Okay. Just a next question on the follow-up. These 2 categories, it would be helpful if you could get the annual number in terms of market share? Well, we are seeing directionally that we are the 2nd largest manufacturer in the country with kind of low teens kind of market share and in housing impact, you said that we are in the half of the market in terms of our market share position. Okay, Samir. My next question, last question on the Indonesia business again. I think we have seen you have taken a lot of activations in terms of distribution and you have also taken some customer intervention like your Tecnema or Sanicare Soap last quarter. My broader question is that again, where do we see Indonesia 3 years from now? There are a lot of expectations, which we have built and there is some things which are changing. But is there any confident answer if you can provide that? Is it a price problem or is it a distribution problem or it's overall economic problem? I don't think so see, I think Indonesia, we've been in the business for 10 years. So I think it's been a very successful acquisition. The categories are very highly overlapped with what we do, and we have very strong relative market positions there and a lot of growth opportunity, whether it's through GT or like the new Sanitur brand. I think as an economy, Indonesia, obviously, we've been invested in, has also done done quite well. I would say that, say, in the past year, there has been a macro impact if you look at all the peer sort of results that we get. They haven't been enrolling. That being said, we haven't been quite open, say, on wipes. It's not been a great show. And something like care, we've gained share, but we are again working to be one of the categories. So we need to be actually driving category growth. Although in Air Care, we've seen all over discretionary categories during COVID have been so I am very positive about Indonesia business. And again, if you look at the strategic position of the business, it's a scale business, high margin, good relative to the chair, strong brand. So I think we have we can be confident about this business going forward. I completely agree with your thoughts on that business. I mean, my only worry is that 10 years we have seen and we have seen at least many cycles of growth and downs. And I think that's one of the important piece when I go back 10 years before when we acquired it legacy. And I think it keeps on worrying that some or the other we have some disappointment there. Is it that you guys are continue focusing on that business or we will divest at some point of time? No, we'll definitely not divest the Indonesia business. And I think let's be frank about business. I mean, you guys come here and ask us every quarter about what's happening. There are business cycles, right? Even the best companies sort of don't grow. I know how much you all hold. HUL and Unilever sort of is the gold mark. But if you look at Unilever's results in Indonesia, they haven't been particularly particularly strong this year. So I and I'm not trying to and please don't get me wrong, I'm not trying to be sensitive about our business. And I do think that perhaps there were things that we could have done before internally. But certainly, there's no question of divesting that business. Certainly, in our eyes, that's very successful, value accretive and wonderful acquisitions by any sort of customer? So don't take me wrong. I'm not taking the shoes of the business. I'm only saying that do we have a clear and complete handle on that business? Don't worry. I don't think you can push me as a business. And I'm not I'm just just to market, I think and please feel free to ask your questions and all your questions actually make us much stronger as a company. I was just commenting on the fact that I actually think Indonesia is a strong business. And over this 3 year period that you spoke of that I actually think will do well. And no, we're not thinking of divesting it. Thank you, Niswaba and thank you and all the best to you. Thank you. Thank you. The next question is from the line of Manoj Menon from ITATA Madhur, I'm not sure I fully understood your question. And our shares before if you break up household insecticides, correct? If you look at things like electrics or aerosols, obviously, our shares would be much, much higher there than it is in the broadening format. But as a market leader, I think we have to pay all segments of the market. I think the opportunity that we've seen is that in the more premium let's say something like aerosol penetration is less than 5%. I think his own non mosquito penetration is about 8% or 9%, right? And so I think the opportunity is to play all formats and probably have a blended approach to growth, right? Like I don't expect a morning format even with these new innovations, maybe if the new innovations are wrong, it gets hit there or then that will change, but we'll see that the boarding format should grow in sort of mid single digits and will you drive all the double digit growth through the other parts of that portfolio? I hope that answered your question. P. Vijay Kumar:] Yes, sure. So financial is up for where has coming from? Yes. No, I think our shares are quite high, Manoj, actually. And our performance is very, very high, correct. So but I do think there's an opportunity for share gain. Now if you look at this gold flash in terms of product innovation and stuff, should be we should be in the sort of medium to long term gaining share in that product category. I think where our share is still very high, very, very high double digit is burn in format. So obviously, if you have a product coming against insulin 6, that could work really well. We're also relooking about some of our oil strategy. So there's products coming in there. So you could potentially see market share growth. My bigger focus on the 50% market share would be really driving penetration, correct? And not because you want more people protecting themselves from Intex. And I think that is growing the opportunity if you get it right. Like I mentioned LMTLV is at 25% sort of penetration, how do you drive that out? Even I don't have the growth goals, I'll put that on some of these things, very profitable gas increase, one of our biggest, how do you drive that 25% to 15% penetration? Just one follow-up and just last question. On the digital launch, the Nokia's plant, which is essentially the increased cost of the increased electrification in villages. Just the top down purposes as well as the level from that, I think we have discussed the first time in history. You're talking about the magic was the magic handwash. People were feeling power chip off. We corrected it. But then since we had gold flash that came about 18 months ago, we only wanted to focus on this piece one at a time. But that's something that you might see us bring back or again look at pricing in the electric category to drive penetration? Thank you. The next question is from the line of Vinay from Suniti Securities. Please go ahead. Thank you for the opportunity. This question is on the LATAM business. Now this business has been challenging for us since the first 2 to 3 years. We've tried to correct it and then there are certain macro factors which pulls down. I understand that there are cross pollination opportunities this business brought for us. But nonetheless, overall consolidated sales mix, it remains very, very small. So is there any thought to go away with this business? Thanks for your question. And actually over the last 2 years, this business has performed very well. So if you look at the rates, both top line, we had 17% in INR for this business and EBITDA was at 200 something percent growth. So I would disagree that it's not done well in the last couple of years. When I look at the last sort of 5 years, yes, I wouldn't say that it's done particularly well. I'd rather not comment on any sort of acquisitions and divestments on a call like this. So thank you for your question. Sure. And second quick question is on the debt repayment. Will that continue in FY 2022 as well? Hi, Benoit. This is Sameer here. That's the plan. I mean, we did see significant reduction in debt and the net debt equity ratio coming down to 0 point 7. I think in very short term, the thinking is to sort of continue with that strategy of increment of debt, whatever is sort of left on the books at this point of time. So is there a target as to where we want to reach in terms of the gross debt level? Because right now, I mean, in terms of the ratio, we are in a very comfortable space, plus we are almost net debt free. So Correct. Yes, as I said, I mean, we will walk on, I mean, a few more than 40 cash flows, multiple avenues, unless you sort of kind of deploy it organically through CapEx or even inorganically, Sure. Thank you. Thanks, Oliver. Thank you. The next question is from the line of Satish Kothalia from Honeywell portfolio management. Please go ahead. I don't think I commented earlier, I think that April has sort of been a continuation of quarter 4. So we'll have to just wait and watch and see what happens. The situation is so dynamic on the ground and so different state by state. So it's very, very hard at this stage to comment on Google. Sameer, you have something to add? Yes, absolutely. And I think my first other point is, I mean, while yes, I mean, the kind of number of infections in cases have been relatively higher, it's still around in Google and small towns. AUM as well as headwinds in terms of driving steady state. Are we with I mean, let's see how at least next few weeks and months kind of shape up. But directionally, I think the recovery which we have seen in rural all of last year should also continue going ahead. Thanks, Sush. Thank you. The next question is from the line of Kiran Nayak from Odi Kincap. Please go ahead. Thank you for giving me an opportunity. I have two questions. Firstly, do you have do the company has some SKUs in small such as like with only in rural areas? And what we how many new products will be launched in the financial year 'twenty one, 'twenty two? Thanks for your question. So we do have very strong product pipeline and we will continue to see a lot of new launches coming in from our end. We were talking earlier of the innovation rate which is a good metric to add new product launches kind of consumer base in small down from rural markets. So that strategy also will continue to be a strong growth in the vector for us in the company. Okay. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. The next question is from the line of Nilesh Shah from Home Capital. Just one question for me on dividends. Just curious to understand what are the cost pressures of not giving out dividends this year. And the context of this question is, there were some talks last year that going forward, international business debt will probably be paid down from the international business cash flows. So given the strong positioning of the company in terms of cash and the recent performance this year, what is the reason for long term retention? I think the Waindilai, this is Sameer here. I think the intent was to find out at least in the uncertain line that we were, I mean, at the start of the year to see a mix of deployment towards repayment of test as well as sort of funding organic growth of the sites and then also evaluating in capital and the growth opportunity and alongside kind of revolve shareholders. I think the strategy which we chose was during the course of the year to sort of use the cash for repayment of sort of dividend. A lot of cash also from our international business which can be upstream, but in a way sort of is getting used as we speak for repayment of debt, which was largely taken to kind of fund those international sort of businesses. And we will continue to get approved. So we will continue with that mix in terms of ensuring that the debt goes down, if there is any kind of interest in organic growth opportunity, I mean it will be deployed towards that as well as in parallel ensuring that our shareholders continue to get rewarded. So, it's going to be a cocktail of all of this 3, Mila, in terms of deployment of free cash flows. Okay. Thanks, Amit. Thanks, The next question is from the line of Amrit Shoye with ADP. Please go ahead. Yes. Two quick follow ups. So one is on premise channel and e commerce. How do you benchmark those markets together? Both are very important in the current context. So, Amish, So, Avnish, so both of the channels are kind of both channels for us. I think Celeste was a big key initiative which the team took last year and I think they have done a fantastic job. So, I think in the channel we saw close to 30% of this growth in 1 off last year. So I think that's shaping up very well. It is very similar to the Phase 2 of our project lead which is go to market initiative in India in the current fiscal year and again Kenneth Kish within that is a key kind of GTM initiative. And in terms of e commerce, you are at 3 tier. And in terms of CLLP, we are close to around So that also is going to be a very important channel for us, not just in current time, but also for many more years to sort of further ahead. And last question on direct reach to India, what would be the target next 1, 2 years? Any rates you will share with us? I think it's going to be a mix of both of these, right, because as of now we reached close to around 1,300,000 outlets. It continues to see an increase. Historically, we have seen anywhere between 6% to 8% increase in the direct reach. Now, for us to meet it also not just direct reach but increase in the throughput, right, in the outlets in which you sort of reach out. So, it's going to be a mix of both, increase in direct reach as well as how do we increase our throughput in the existing outlets and that's going to kind of drive overall The next question is from the line of Vinay from the agency. Please go ahead. This question is on the recent hire of Sudhir Sivapathy. So, you know, Nisaba, you said that in the opening remarks that the top priority is growth and doubling down on growth. So, when I look at GCPL as a franchise, we've done extremely well. Competition has been very well in Q1 over the past 1 year. 2nd is that on the product innovation front, we've been an industry leader. We have the our products also we have a portfolio which straddles repricing pyramid. So where do you think Sudhir would really add value? And how just to get a better understanding on which are the areas where you're looking at adding more value? I think like I said in the beginning and the answer to your question, I think what I said in the beginning, same category, Benjamin, if you look at our household and debt advisory, it's 30% of our portfolio. It grew 15% this year. But if I look at the last 5 years growth, it is below what our aspirations would be for this category, correct? And it's now we had a very successful launch in Nigeria, this year and household insecticide. So when you have these product capabilities, you have this know how in this category, how do you really sort of build on that in country after country? So I'm looking to him to bring some of those category management, category management, marketing skills to really sort of build on that? And I know the market has responded very positively. I can't comment on how the market responds to these things or news, something that's not even happened yet. But really, it's not like Sudhir I have a very, very high respect for Sudhir. I've had wonderful interactions with him and got wonderful feedback. And frankly, today, what intrigued me was much of this sort of market reaction, worked with him in the past, who know me, who have sent a really strong of support. But what GCTL does is not only about Sudhir, right? Sudhir is coming in along with the great team we have, along with the strengths we have and really building on it. So I think he's very what I look forward to him is he has great experience. He's worked on categories, transformed categories. So to use his leadership skills, right, to use his insights on consumers and come with our wonderful team and pass on to this sustainable growth. Just one follow-up on this. So are you looking at any changes in the go to market or distribution with him also coming in? So look, see, when someone comes from the outside, we will come within outside in sort of perspective, correct? I think the best leaders who want to transform the best faithfully understand where are the trends with the company. So you must be not charged or what would I not show really well? Where are the things where I see more efficiency or productivity? And for a consumer product company go to market, Giza Lifeline, so enjoy study these in the different markets and have value to add in that area also. And also across the company, as a CEO, you can't be just adding value on category growth. You have to be looking at it from sort of all lenses. That's very helpful. Thank you. Thank you. As for the last question, I would now like to hand the conference over to Mr. Prashant Bara for further comments. I'd like to thank you all for joining the call today. With that, we'd like to draw this call to a close. Please please give us. Thank you. Thank you so much, everyone. Thank you.