Please note that this conference is being recorded. I now hand the conference over to Mr. Anuj Upadhyay from Investec Capital Services. Thank you, and over to you, sir.
Thanks, Susan, and good evening to everyone out here. On behalf of Investec Capital, I would like to welcome you all to the Q1 FY 2025 earnings call of Inox Wind Limited. Today, we have with us Mr. Devansh Jain, Executive Director, INOXGFL Group, Mr. Kailash Tarachandani, CEO, Inox Wind Limited, Mr. Akhil Jindal, Group CFO, INOXGFL Group, and other senior members of the management. I would now hand over the call to the management for their initial remarks, after which we can open the floor for the Q&A. Thank you, and over to you, sir.
Hi, good evening, everyone. This is Devansh Jain. Welcome to the Q1 FY 2025 earnings call of Inox Wind. I will give you more of a strategic overview before handing it over to Kailash and Rahul for further details on the results. The Q1 results are a testimony of the hard work of the last several years. We are now on the runway, ready for a massive take-off for the massive growth journey ahead. Recently, IWEL, the parent company of Inox Wind, infused INR 900 crore into Inox Wind, making Inox Wind net cash positive, and has strengthened its balance sheet to capitalize on the multi-decade opportunity in the wind sector.
We have delivered on all the targets which we had set out, be it making the company net cash positive within H1 2025, the execution ramp up, and also ensuring we get back our profitability to historical numbers in terms of the margins or better. We are evaluating value unlocking through our EPC arm and also value enhancement through our hybridization of the existing common infrastructure. We are exploring virtually all value creation opportunities across the renewable arm of the group. I am thankful to all our shareholders for their support thus far, and I'm confident of significant value creation as we go ahead. I will now hand over to Rahul, our CFO, to take you through the financials for the quarter.
Thanks, Devansh Ji. Good evening, everyone. I will now take you through some of the financials for the quarter. The company announced its results at its board meeting held today, Friday, 9th of August 2024. The results, along with the earnings presentation and press release, are available on the stock exchanges as well as on our website. For the quarter, on consolidated basis, Inox Wind has reported revenue of INR 651 crores in Q1 FY 2025, versus INR 352 crore in Q1 FY 2024, an increase of 85% YOY. EBITDA of INR 157 crore in Q1 FY 2025, versus INR 35 crore in Q1 FY 2024, an increase of 349% YOY. Profit after tax of INR 50 crore in Q1 FY 2025, versus loss after tax of INR 65 crore in Q1 FY 2024.
Cash profit of INR 92 crore in Q1 FY 2025, versus cash loss of INR 36 crore in Q1 FY 2024. Excluding 110 MW of capacities, which are awaiting commissioning, the revenue for Q1 would have been higher by that amount. The delay is on account of grid connectivity approval at customers' ends. With Q1 financial performance being the highest in the history of Inox Wind, we have set a very strong base for growth in the upcoming quarters. Further, our recent fundraise and operational cash flows have aided us to achieve a net cash positive status on consolidated basis. I would now like to hand over the floor to our CEO, Mr. Kailash Tarachandani, for his remarks. Thanks.
Thanks, Rahul. We have commenced financial year 2025 on a very strong note. Our profits have soared to INR 50 crore for this quarter. This is after our interest payment of INR 58 crore, which is expected to become negligible going ahead. The promoters, infusing INR 900 crore in the company, resulting in Inox Wind turning net cash positive, will only strengthen our balance sheet further, helping reduce our interest rates substantially and providing further boost to our profitability. Our Q1 performance sets us on a robust base to rapidly scale up our execution, backed by our largest-ever order book of over 2.9 GW, with manufacturing capacities and supply chain in place. We are receiving very strong response from the customer for our products. We have already won 611 MW of orders, including repeat orders from market customers.
Active discussion over multiple IPPs, PSUs, and C&I customers provides us large order visibility. The macro outlook continues to be extremely favorable. All India peak demand is 250 GW during the summer, and given India's strong growth outlook, we expect power demand to continue growing at a rapid speed over the next decade, requiring huge renewable capacity addition. In the first four months of FY 2025 itself, around 7 GW of new wind hybrid FDRE tenders have been floated and around 7.5 GW of hybrid FDRE projects awarded. Tariffs have been healthy and competitive, ranging between INR 3.4-INR 3.5 per unit for central sector wind solar hybrid project, INR 3.6-INR 3.68 for plain vanilla wind, and around INR 5 per unit for FDRE.
It is important to note that demand from our C&I segment is over and above these figures. Some of the hurdles faced by our Chinese competitors related to commissioning activities, and also the draft report on domestic content requirement for the wind project by NITI Aayog, provides further impetus to the domestic wind turbine manufacturer. This will only add to the opportunities for players like us. We are also setting up a new nacelle manufacturing unit near Ahmedabad on lease rental basis, which will provide substantial savings on CapEx, as the lease expenses is less than INR 4 crore per annum. The facility expected to be operational within calendar year 2024. The above capacity would enhance our capabilities to address the growing demand of the industry, which is also reflective in our current order book and further order inflows opportunities.
On the technology front, as already highlighted earlier, we have also secured the license of 4 MW WTG platform. We are targeting to commercially launch this turbine by financial year 2026. I would now like to open up the floor for the question and answers. Thank you.
Thank you very much. We will now begin the question and answer session. Anyone who wishes to ask questions may press star and one on the touchtone telephone. If you wish to remove yourself from question queue, you may press star and two. Participants are requested to use handsets while asking a question. Ladies and gentlemen, we will wait for a moment while the question queue assembles. The first question is from the line of Smitesh from Raedan Securities. Please go ahead.
Hello. Good evening, gentlemen. Congratulations on the numbers, and good luck for the foreseeable future. My only question is, are we facing or thinking of any of the execution challenges which we may face on account of the several logistical issues to meet our guidance of this year?
No, we don't see. I think, small, execution challenges are always there on the ground, but largely, the way we are executing right now projects, we don't see any foreseeable future, any problem as such.
Thank you, sir. My second question is: How is the order pipeline or the bid pipeline looking like with regards to the C&I segment?
The large segment right now, the most of the orders which are coming are from the C&I segment, because there is a huge impetus and huge demand as such. But overall, as I said, the demand at this moment is large, and we are getting all kind of customer segments, you know, from all kind of segments, yeah.
Okay. Thank you. This answered my question. Good luck for future.
Thank you.
Thank you. The next question is from the line of Preet Nagarsheth from Wealth Finwiser. Please go ahead.
Yes, congratulations on the good set of numbers. So the question I have is regarding the impact of commodity prices. So what we are seeing is that a lot of steel and other commodity prices are coming down. So I wanted to understand if there is a pass through system that you have, or would you gain because of the prices coming down?
Look, I think internally, our supply chain, we continue... Given the fact that we are ramping up so massively, we have leverage across our suppliers, so we use that to keep renegotiating that. Having said that, in terms of steel, because there are various anti-dumping duties, we are tying up steel on a quarterly basis, six to six monthly tie-ups. But with a six, with a quarterly tie-up, I think we are well hedged. With respect to other commodities, we are not concerned with copper and aluminum, given that we tie up pricing for our components for the entire year. And as I mentioned, given the fact that we are ramping up so rapidly, we're using this incremental ramp-up to further cut down costs as we move forward.
Right. The other thing, Devansh, that we would love to know is that one of the large MNCs is out on the block now. So are we looking to participate in that, acquiring the business of that MNC?
Yes, we are looking at it. We are evaluating it. For all decisions which we take in this company are going to follow a very prudent capital allocation policy. We will not buy just for the sake of buying, and certainly we will not buy anything at absurd prices.
Thank you.
Hello? Hello, are there any further questions?
Yes. Regarding the guidance-
Sorry, sir, your voice is not audible.
A lot of background noise as well.
Yeah. Can you hear me? Hello? Am I audible?
Yeah.
Okay. I was saying regarding the guidance for next year of 1,200 MW, you were mentioning that you may revise it upwards. So could you share what are you seeing that's making you think of revising it upwards? And if yes, how much would you revise it by?
First and foremost, I think, yes, we have said there would be an upside to it, and the fact of the matter remains, there is an upside to the execution guidance beyond 1.2. I think this will be evident from the massive order inflows already in place and which will be announced as we move forward. I won't get into specific numbers, but I think that will be evident in our order books. Secondly, I think, due to operating leverage and a better product mix, as well as cost optimization, margins could improve as well as we move forward. But no guidance, no specific guidance.
So you said over the 14%-15% that you were talking, there's a chance that this could move up?
Right.
Okay. And what about the 800 MW for this year? Do you think that's on track?
Oh, we are well on track for this financial year, but we're not revising anything for FY25.
Great. Thank you so much. Wishing you guys all the very best.
Thank you.
Thank you. The next question is from the line of Gokul Raj from Bhavya Industries Group. Please go ahead.
Good evening, Devansh and team. Congrats on a fantastic quarter run up and the overall three-year turnaround that you guys have done. Two questions from my end. One is on the Resco on the O&M bit. Would this also be broad-based platforms where you will do things outside of Inox turbines, and stuff like that? And also, would it be evolved into broader renewable platforms like solar or stuff like that, or is it just on the wind chain and primarily on Inox and related stuff? And the second question is, what's the update on the Inox Wind Energy merger?
So I'll take the first question and then, Kailash and Rahul, you can take the merger question. We see a tremendous opportunity in value unlocking across hybridization, across cranes, across various other products which we are contemplating under the EPC arm. But this is barring equipment rental, our EPC capabilities will not be offered to others. That's gonna be a moat, and that's gonna be a stronghold within the Inox Wind itself. Equipment leasing or equipment, any other equipment which we may potentially manufacture, could be given to third parties. Point number one. Point number two, there is no question of doing execution on the solar side. So we will do hybridization, which means leveraging the power evacuation infrastructure. But we have no interest in doing a commoditized business with over a hundred players, where your margins are in 1%, 2%, 3%.
We cannot compete with unorganized players where you have, you know, as they call tax chori or wages below minimum wages. That's not the area where we would like to compete in. So execution pure play is gonna be a stronghold of the group, which will be reserved only for Inox Wind. Any equipment manufacturing or equipment rental would be outsourced to third parties as well. On the merger.
Yeah, on the merger, I guess, you know, we have kept, you know, everyone in the loop. So the shareholders' approval is already obtained. The creditors' approval is already obtained. And there's a regulatory approval which is going on, while we speak. There is a hearing which is there in the first week of September. Hopefully, that hearing, you know, some order would be pronounced, failing which, there may be another hearing. So it is a matter of another two to three months that the merger will take place. In any event, our expectations are that before November, the merger will be in effect.
I hope we have answered your question here.
Participant, thank you. We'll move to the next. The next question is from the line of Darshit from Nirvana Capital. Please go ahead.
Hi, sir. Thanks for the opportunity. Sir, when we look at the numbers and, when we say about the historical kind of numbers which you want to achieve in terms of margins as well as top line, so margins, you know, have been pretty high even when we look at historical numbers of 16%, 17%, we are doing roughly 21%-22% kind of operating margins at this 140 MW-150 MW execution. So the, do you think, the new number would probably be higher than what we used to do it earlier in our 2014-2017 period?
So our guidance for the full year is 16%-17%. So broadly, we will remain in that range. On a quarter-on-quarter basis, there could be plus, minuses, but broadly on a yearly basis, we will be on a 16% EBITDA margin.
Got it. And sir, just to follow up on the merger thing, so, you know, the ratio was probably 158 share of Inox Wind for every 10 shares of IWEL. And since after the bonus, so this ratio would be adjusted with the bonus in Inox Wind. Is my understanding correct, right?
Yes. It's now equivalent to 632 shares of Inox Wind for every 10 shares of Inox Wind Energy Limited, post the bonus.
Sure. And so lastly, you know, as the earlier participant also asked on the Siemens Gamesa business, which is up on block. So, and we are considering evaluating the prospect as of now, and, as if you look at the news article, it says probably whatever the valuations asked are around $1 billion. So,
... Are we kind of, you know, capital behind acquiring, you know, even evaluating this business, since our order book and, you know, the pipeline looks quite healthy. So just for the management perspective and understanding, for this.
Okay, let me just try and answer this. You know, firstly, clearly the company, you know, we are evaluating the company, and we are looking into the financials and other things. And, to be honest, the situation of the company looks quite bleak to me at this juncture, given their, you know, their inability to penetrate the Indian market and also, also looking into the, into their O&M situation. So I don't think, you know, any significant interest would be there. However, we would be evaluating the company on a very, I would say, a very, you know, realistic basis. And if it's value accretive for us, we will consider it.
You know, there's no point in us throwing good money after the bet in that sense. So we would be very careful, you know, before we move on to the next step.
Sure, sir. Thank you, and all the best.
Thank you. The next question is from the line of Shweta Dixit from Systematix Group. Please go ahead.
Hello.
Yes, please. Go ahead.
Good evening. My first question would be, if you look at the realization number this year, this quarter is around INR 4.6 crores per megawatt at an execution of 140. Could you split this execution in terms of what were the pure equipment supply this quarter and what were actual installations for wind turbines this quarter?
So, hi. So actually, we cannot give the specifics onto it, but actually we did 140 MW this quarter, and around 110 MW is at pre-commissioning stage as customers are awaiting grid approval. Had this capacity been commissioned, you know, as I told in my opening comments also, the revenue for the quarter would have been substantially higher. So, but we have made the full WTG suppliers' production of all the components.
Sir, in terms of supplies of all the components, we still looking at a realization lower than what otherwise is around INR 6-6.5 crore or INR 5.5 crore for the entire equipment capacity. Still we are on the lower side in terms of realization. Can you explain that?
Yeah. So, as of now, we are saying that INR 6 crore per MW is the total realization, out of which the number you are saying, that is right, it is 4.5. But as I said earlier, there used to be commissioning revenue also, which is actually stuck for around 110 MW. So if you round up the numbers of 110 MW, this will give us around 150 MW-160 MW more, and then it will make up to six-
Oh.
Yeah, INR 150-INR 160 crore, and it will make up, you know, around INR 6 crore per megawatt.
Okay, understood. Another question was, since last year, we've seen a capital infusion of around INR 2,100 crore, approximately into the company. Could you highlight what has been the, debt repayment in this period, consolidated, excluding any, working capital borrowings, which were taken on?
I'm not sure what's the specific response you want, but at this point in time, the company is a net cash company. And, I mean, if you need to see specific questions on working capital or debt, we'll have to get on a call offline with our finance team. I don't think we have the specific answers, but the starting point is, at the consolidated level, at the wind level, we're a net cash group now.
Okay, understood. One last question, if I could squeeze in, regarding the nacelle manufacturing unit. If I missed it, what would be the CapEx for this facility?
Oh, you certainly didn't mix it, miss it, since we've put it out in the presentation as well as in Kailash's opening comment, that it's a minimal CapEx model, where our lease rents per annum are sub INR 4 crore. So we are not investing anything substantial in building this facility. It's being built for us on a long-term lease basis.
Okay. No, I understood the INR 4 crore per annum lease rental, but there won't be any investment in terms of machinery or equipment, et cetera?
No.
All right. Thank you.
Thank you. The next question is from the line of Abhishek Shah from Ambit Capital. Please go ahead.
Hi, good evening, team, and again, congratulations on another spectacular quarter. Just a few quick questions. Firstly, on accumulated losses, would we still maintain that we would essentially be paying no tax, more or less on FY 2025 and possibly on FY 2026? And secondly, on the finance cost this quarter was around INR 58 crore, out of which I think INR 12 crore was a one-time expense. So if you can just kind of give us guidance on what that would look like for the full year.
Yeah. So, on this interest part, so actually, our exact run rate will be INR 35 crore as of now, and going, going-
... Yeah, from Q2 onwards, if you see, so we will have interest earnings also, which will negate the interest expenses. So we'll have a negligible interest outflow, from Q2 onwards. So that's on the interest part. So in FY 2026 as well, you will see a negligible interest outflow. There'll be normal LCBG charges, but that will be offset by the interest earnings on the cash balance which we have in our balance sheet today.
I think just to reiterate, obviously, Q1 has been, in terms of the INR 58 crore, and, Sumant, why don't you share those details? We have 58. Fifty-five was one time, and we had INR 11 crore of earnings. So what was the Q1 run rate?
Thirty-five.
On the exit, the total cost was INR 35, and we are now net cash. So effectively, the exit, or the cost for Q2 should be less than single digits, broadly. I mean, we've guided for the full year finance banking interest cost net to be at about INR 60 crores-INR 75 crores, and I think we're bang on target to achieve that, given we are net cash now.
So on the taxes part, we have actually brought forward losses and a number of depreciation, which will actually, you know, make us to pay no tax till FY 2026. So FY 2025 and 2026 will be actually, you know, pay no taxes on our profits.
Great. Thank you so much. Sorry, if I can just squeeze one last. So, the entire 800 MW on this, most of it in the current financial year would all be the 3 MW, right? And 3 MW turbine going forward.
No, it is largely 3 MW, but it's a mix of 2, some orders which are still there from last year, which we have executed this year. A small number, very small number, but largely it remains at 3 MW. I'll say almost 80%-90%.
Okay. Thank you so much, and good luck going forward.
Thank you. The next question is from the line of Rohan Vora from Envision Capital. Please go ahead.
Hello, thank you for the opportunity and congratulations on the numbers. So two questions. One is just a doubt. So basically, when you say the 110 MW, you know, was just pending for want of certification, so that 110 MW is a part of 140 MW, and that is why INR 150 crores of revenue is not booked. Am I right in understanding that?
No, it is not part. 110 MW is waiting for grid approval, but the supply would have been done earlier, and they are erected and they are ready for commissioning. But then I think Rahul tried to explain that it was like typically in a quarter, you mix both. You know, there are supply revenues, there are commissioning revenues, and since this 110 MW, which is ready for commissioning, is not commissioning, that revenue is still not calculated in that. But they are not the same supplies.
So, on a blended, once, you know, a normalized revenue is booked, on a blended will be reaching around INR 6.6 crores per megawatt?
This is what we said. Roughly 110 MW is there. If you take into almost on a thumb basis, INR 1 crore or INR 1.2 crores, this will add another INR 120 crore-INR 130 crore at least, or INR 150 crore, which will take it to almost,
Understood. Great, great. Thank you. One more question was on the fixed cost run rate. So what is the fixed cost run rate, annual run rate, as of date?
INR 110 crores.
INR 110 crores. As we scale up, you know, massively, how do we see that increasing, any directional idea on that?
Yeah. So this is going to remain same, almost. Hardly 5%-10% increase might be there with the ramp up, but no major change.
Great. Great. Thank you so much, and all the best.
Thank you. The next question is from the line of Subrata Sarkar from Mount Intra Finance Private Limited. Please go ahead.
Yeah. Sir, I have a small, like, understanding that I need to have. Like this, and this is regarding only the merger. So post-merger, can you help me to understand what will be the fully on a fully diluted basis, number of equity here, and what will be the face value on that, so that I can get an understanding of, like, how things will look?
Current number of post-merger, the number of fully diluted shares will be around 162 odd crores.
Okay, this is number of equity share. Face value, can, can you help me on that? Or you are talking about, this is the number of shares?
This is the number of shares, yes.
Okay. And, that will be a face value of what, sir? Like, what will be the equity capital in this case?
Face value, INR 10.
Okay. Okay, perfect, sir. So just one question on the execution side and on the pay. Like, sir, is it possible to at least share us a ballpark number of what is our working capital days right now, or like on that side?
So basically, we cannot, you know, we have guided for the full year, full year on basis, but, you know, telling specifically on a quarter-on-quarter basis, you know, we are restraining ourselves from guiding on a quarter-on-quarter basis.
Full year is 90%.
Full year is broadly 90%, yes.
Okay. Okay. Thank you, sir. Thank you.
Thank you. The next question is from the line of Avishek Datta from Anand Rathi Shares. Please go ahead.
Sir, congratulations on great set of numbers. Just had one clarification I needed. It's like, in the presentation you have mentioned about value unlocking to EPC arm and value enhancements to hybridization of common infrastructure. So what exactly you mean by that?
Again, you want to go? Yeah, so basically, you know, whatever assets that we have, we can, firstly further be utilized, for, you know, for the enhanced capacity on the, on the solar side. I mean, obviously, these infrastructures are there and can be enhanced. That's number one. You know, which is an immediate, use that we can, you know, we can see, on this. Also, you can see that a lot of, you know, a lot of assets are there, which are, in the books of green. So what we are trying to do is to demerge those assets, into, into our EPC company called Resco. And within that Resco, obviously, because the assets would be demerged, it would be automatically listed.
Now, obviously, all these proposals are at a very nascent, nascent stage. The board has decided to appoint a consultant and the registered valuator at this juncture. And once we have the final scheme, we'll come back to you. And to that extent, it would take around 6-9 months' time, which is what we are assuming as a time period.
Just to add, I think we see tremendous value creation opportunities across the EPC arm. I think we're the top two wind EPC companies. This is something which is a very, very strong moat. As I mentioned in one of my answers earlier, solar EPC, you've got hundreds of players doing. There is no rocket science to it, and I don't mean to disrespect anybody. Wind is very, very complex. It's very challenging. It's taken us years to build this, competency, this capability. And what we are now doing is, given the massive multi-decade opportunity we have ahead of us, we are, if I may say so, backward integrating into capturing more value within the EPC arm. So we are getting our own cranes. The returns are phenomenal. The payback periods are phenomenal.
We are evaluating various other assets to be added within the EPC arm, where returns are phenomenal. For example, we buy transformers. Our transformers and cable procurement is almost INR 400-INR 500 crores in a year, given the run rates which we would be on in the coming financial year. We are evaluating whether it makes sense to buy out some of these things, to get into it, to manufacture that in-house. Cranes, as I mentioned, is one key area we are anyways moving into internally. So it's just that we want to unlock value across the EPC capability we've built, also capture more value across some of the key components of EPC, where margins are very, very high, with very low barriers to entry, at least for us.
And third, I think we sit on over 5 GW of project site inventory and land bank, which frankly is not given any due importance or value in reality terms, and that's worth a couple of thousand INR crore, honestly. So by shunting out the power evacuation from Inox Green, not only do we make the Inox Green balance sheet very light and eliminate the depreciation line, which impacts profitability, but by merging that into the Resco, which is our EPC arm, it leads to automatic listing and creating tremendous incremental value for the larger Inox Wind group. Of course, it's subject to board approval, but that's what we are thinking of.
Okay. But at no point you are planning to execute other wind EPC projects?
There is no question. I mentioned that in my previous, to one of the previous questions. It is a very, very strong moat for us. There is no question of, giving a strong moat, which we own, to other third-party players. There is no question. It's absolutely ruled out. We may give equipment if we get into manufacturing equipment or give out cranes on rent, but there is no question of sharing our EPC capabilities, knowledge, land banks with other wind OEMs.
Okay, but just to get it right, like, cranes, already there are players who are leasing the cranes to the EPC players. Now, you want to buy those cranes and do it in-house?
That's right, because the returns are phenomenal. Given the multi-decade opportunity, if we see 30%+ returns on investment, there is no question of us letting that opportunity go out to third-party players.
I see. In the near term, how do you see the PSU order book shaping up?
I think PSUs. There are a lot of PSU bids still coming, and I can see that there is a huge impetus from different PSUs, and a lot of tenders are, as I see, coming up. So, you know, while, as I said, that C&I business continues to build up, but at the same time, we have executed and we are still executing projects like NTPC. We have separate bid already, possibly more than 200-300 MW of separate, you know, different PSUs. And at the same time, we are in the process of bidding as we speak over next couple of months. So I would say that PSUs will continue to be, take some, you know, important pie from our business.
I think just to add to Kailash, I think, historically we had, over the... You know, if you go back about a year, year and a half, we had a lot of dependence only on NTPC, and it was a carefully crafted strategy for us to move away and diversify from NTPC to other customers. And I think if you see over the past 12 months, we've gone out and added close to 2 GW, which is across the private sector. That does not mean we are not focusing on PSU, but I think we had built too much of a portion in PSU when we were getting out of the bad state the industry was in. So it was important to pick up those tenders.
As we are moving forward, we are selectively bidding in PSU tenders and diversifying that across different PSUs, as opposed to having too much concentration only on one PSU.
One more thing, I like you are looking to set up a new manufacturing unit for nacelle and hub. So what is the rationale being given the fact that our capacity is over 2.5 GW, and we are currently targeting to deliver 800 MW and 1,200 MW over the next two financial years, what is the rationale to expand capacity? I know it is the lead times are much lesser, but what is the rationale for that?
It's simple. I think we mentioned there is an upside execution, upside, bias to the execution guidance for FY 2026, and I think this will be evident from the massive order inflows. We're sitting on the highest ever order book in the company's history. Perhaps you missed that, Kailash mentioned that in his opening remarks, there is almost 1 GW which is in advanced stages of negotiation and discussion in the near future. Now, and we set out a vision of making it a 2-GW company in the near future. Now, effectively, every quarter is not going to be the same as every other quarter. As is well known in this sector, Q1 is the weakest, Q2 gets more or less in sync with Q1, given that there is monsoon, and Q3, Q4 are very large.
Yes, it's no longer a Q4 syndrome during, like, in the feed-in tariff regime, where 80% of the market was Q4, but certainly it could be 35, 65, H1 and 65 H2, broadly. Now, within that piece, if our capacity of manufacturing is, say, 2.5 GW or 2 GW, and we've produced 300 MW, for example, in Q1 and 300 MW in Q2, effectively we are left with only another GW for the full year. So what should we do? Not produce turbines. And keeping the future in mind, we are taking decisions well ahead of time to play this multi-decadal opportunity. Again, if you notice, we've not announced INR 200, INR 300, INR 400 crores of CapEx on our manufacturing plants. It's under the lease model, where the outflow for the company at peak is INR 4 crores per annum.
Okay. So, what will be the CapEx for this year?
Sorry to interrupt, sir. I just request you to follow-
Yeah, just this is a conclusion to that. What is the CapEx for this year?
Sir, it will be around INR 50-75 crores.
Next year?
Similar levels.
Okay, thank you so much, and that's it, sir.
Thank you. Ladies and gentlemen, in order to ensure that management is able to address questions from all the participants in the conference, please limit your question to two questions per participant. Should you have a follow-up question, we request you to rejoin the queue. The next question is from the line of Anil Kuppalia from Investec Capital Services. Please go ahead.
Yeah, thank you. Sir, how much NCPRS will remain with the company post-merger? What would be our plan for the same?
So basically, the NCPRS held between IWEL and the company will be squared off, because, you know, the two companies are getting merged, so it will be squared off. So post-merger, the NCPRS which are outside this merger will remain, which is of the order of around INR 55-INR 60 crores.
INR 560 crore?
Yes.
Okay, and how do we plan to-
Sorry, what do you see as the current figure, which is, if I'm not mistaken, around INR 2,000 crore? It would be restricted to INR 560 crore, because as I mentioned, the effect of the merger would be that majority of these will be squared off or canceled, you know, because it would be within the same company then.
The plan on the balance one, you mentioned that INR 560-INR 580 would still remain. How do we plan, the promoters plan to-
So as and when there are surplus cash flows in the company, as and when there are, you know, liquidity in the company, which are, which are not meant for any other, you know, any other use, it would be retired. I mean, that's, that's our ultimate aim. As it is, there is a, if I'm not mistaken, around three years time, and in end for us to, to redeem it. Just to add, I think, I think the majority is till 2027. The promoters pumped in, this money with no return expectations whatsoever, so we are in no hurry to take back the funds. As and when we see.
Yeah.
There's abundant liquidity, far beyond what we need, then we will retire these NCPRS.
Okay. And sir, what market share are we targeting going ahead? Factoring, you know, now the entire wind market share has gone up to, from 2 GW level, to nearly 7 GW-8 GW on an annual basis. One is this, and that, current capacity which we have, how much can we execute or intake order on an annual basis?
So what we believe that market will be closer to 5 GW, in 2025, and possibly grow 7 GW-8 GW in FY 2026. And as we highlighted in presentation also, and we have talked earlier also, ultimately we are gunning like in 2026, something like closer to 2 GW, or next year, 1.2 GW. So you know, you can roughly work out it will be closer to 20%-25%. But again, we're focused on profitability rather than market share. I won't keep increasing and keep taking all kind of orders. We will be taking orders which are meaningful. You know, you know, there is an easiness in terms of execution, and at the same time, decent profitability. And we will take our fair share of select high quality orders with, you know, marquee customers only, and we will not go everywhere.
So that will be our philosophy.
I can only say market share does not drive us. It's profitability, as Kailash mentioned, and obviously, as the market goes beyond 6 GW... 5 GW to 6 GW, 7 GW, 8 GW, we will take our fair share of the market. I mean, we probably have the highest promoter holding across OEMs in India. We have a rock solid balance sheet, so there is no question of us not taking our fair share of market.
Sure, sir. Just one clarification on a question by a previous participant. The INR 50 crore-INR 60 crore CapEx you mentioned is your routine CapEx, or is the CapEx you plan to enter on the newly launched plant, Ahmedabad nacelle plant?
Yeah, again, just to clarify, our INR 50-INR 75 crore CapEx is for molds, which we keep buying as we launch better products or larger blades. The new CapEx on the end, we have zero CapEx on the new Ahmedabad plant for nacelles and hubs. It's under the OpEx lease model. So the cost there is sub-4 crore per annum, which will be an OpEx. There is no CapEx. We are spending zero in terms of CapEx of that plant. And so.
Thanks for the same, sir.
Thank you. The next question is from the line of Sanjay Kular from ACME Private Limited. Please go ahead.
Yeah, okay. Thanks for taking my question. Mr. Jain, first of all, I would like to compliments to you and your team for extraordinary turnaround and rewarding shareholders with a liberal bonus issue in the first year of turnaround itself. You are truly visionary next gen entrepreneur who has created unprecedented wealth on the street. My question is only one, which is very simple. You know, what is the key differentiator we will have with our peer group company, you know, in terms of execution or in terms of profitability? Would you like to share some thoughts? Thanks.
Thank you, Sanjay. Thank you for your kind words. Look, I, you know, I, this is not a boxing session or a punching bag session. All I would say is, I think, there are possibly just two domestic players who are large, who survived, who are growing. But possibly one thing which is, which I believe is different from others, is, for us, credibility and reputation and financial management is absolutely critical.
Mm-hmm. Okay.
Six years of pain in this sector, we struggled for almost INR 3,000 crore of losses, haircuts, left, right, and center payments to banks, but not a single rupee of haircut, not a single restructuring. The promoters were undergoing a split. We pumped in money, whatever we could, as much as we could, with zero return expectation to the promoters, and it continues to remain in the company. Of course, it's different that the company is now on a massive growth, growth track and is financially strong. Having said that, for us, credibility, reputation, and financial management is absolutely topmost priority. Other than that, everyone's going to be plus/minus in terms of technology, in terms of supply chain, in terms of order book, in terms of XYZ.
I think the third differentiating factor for us is, we are net cash now, and a lot of people have asked: "I hope you're not going to get into a bidding war. I hope you don't get into stupid decision making." I think to some extent, I think the entire management team here is absolutely clear, be it Mathu, be it Kailash, be it Rahul, be it Akhil, all our core people, we are in no urgency to deploy capital at absurd rates, at no paybacks. For us, fundamentally, profit, market cap is temporary. I don't know what the market cap will be today, tomorrow, day after, but cash flow and profitability is the most important thing for us, which is reflected in the fact that we're going into our own trades because the returns are north of 30%.
So there is no question of us not doing something which gives us 30% return. At the same time, some people have asked us questions about certain acquisitions, certain OEMs in the market space. We're not going to go and do anything stupid, for market cap reasons or for reasons which give us a 5% return on capital or absolutely irrelevant visibility in terms of return on what we've deployed. I think that's also reflected in one of the acquisitions we have done in our sister company, Inox Green, where we went in and bought out Ifox, IPP, an OEM. It was a third-party IPP, O&M service provider. We bought it at 4x EBITDA, and in one year, the team has doubled the EBITDA and top line of that company.
We're on track for once, and we bought it at 4x EBITDA multiple. So some people would be happy paying 10x, 20x, 30x, 40x. Best of luck to them. That's not how we work.
Mm-hmm. Thank you very much for sharing your thoughts. Thank you.
Thank you. The last question is from the line of Prateek Giri from Shubh Labh Research. Please go ahead.
Hi. Am I audible?
Yes, you are.
Hi, Jayant. Congratulations to the entire team, you know, for an amazing set of numbers. You know, whatever has been promised, it seems, you know, we are on track to deliver that. My question to Kailash is, Kailash, we have been, since last three quarters, you know, we have seen our margins beyond 18%, you know, 18%, 19%, and 20%, even this quarter. That too, in these three quarters, our realization has not crossed INR 5 crore per megawatt, but still we have made handsome margin. So I am just wondering what is holding us, you know, from revising our margin guidance.
I'm not asking you to revise it, but still, if you can, you know, help us with some color, Kailash.
Rahul can answer this one.
Yeah. Yeah.
Hi. So, we are still to actually realize the revenues from the EPC business, around 110 MW is being started due to the grid approvals. So, actually, you will see those kind of, you know, revenues once we see that EPC revenues realizing.
So broadly-
... 15%, that, that could be a little bit higher also, but we are currently sticking to the, that guidance only. And quarter on quarter, it can vary, but, yearly it will be 15%.
No, I totally understand. But since last three quarters, gentlemen, you know, the margins have been crossing that and, the realization has also been low. So, I mean, how should we look into it, then?
I mean, again, I think we mentioned as a company, we're saying look at it as INR 6 crore per MW. We've given a volume guidance. That's what we should... That's what we will stick to. And, I mean, making more profit is not something which is bad. but at the end of the day, we will continue guiding for 15%-16%. We are not upping our guidance at this point in time.
Understood. Understood. Point taken. Good luck, and, you know, again, congratulations once again, to all of you. Thanks a lot.
Thank you.
Thank you. Ladies and gentlemen, that was the last question for today's conference. On behalf of Investec Capital Services, that concludes this conference. Thank you for joining us, and you may now disconnect your lines. Thank you.