Q1 22/23

Aug 8, 2022

Ladies and gentlemen, good day and welcome to the C.E. Info Systems Limited Earnings Conference Call hosted by DAM Capital Advisors Limited. As a reminder, all participant lines will be in listen only mode. There will be an opportunity for you to ask questions after the presentation concludes. Should you have questions during the conference, please signal an operator by pressing star then zero on your touch tone telephone. Please note that this conference is being recorded. I now hand the conference over to Mr. Anwar from DAM Capital. Thank you. Over to you, sir. Thank you, Melissa. Good afternoon, everyone. On behalf of DAM Capital, we welcome you all to Q1 FY 2023 conference call of C.E. Info Systems. We have with us Mr. Rakesh Verma, Co-founder and Chairman of the company, Mr. Rohan Verma, CEO and Executive Director of the company. Without any further ado, I will hand over the call to Mr. Rakesh Verma for his opening remarks. Thank you, and over to you, sir. Yeah, this is Rakesh Verma. Good afternoon to all of you. The quarter that just ended, we have demonstrated, I would say, strong results. Just to summarize, the Q1 on year-over-year basis, revenue was up 50% to INR 65 crores. EBITDA was up 55% to INR 30 crores. EBITDA margin was at 46%. PAT was up 18% to INR 24 crores, and PAT margins were at 34%. Cash and cash equivalent, including financial instruments, went up also from INR 356 crores to INR 392 crores. Effective tax rate this time used has been 28.1%, as against the previous Q1 2022 was 17.3%. With these numbers, I would like Rohan to give you some more color to the performance of the company related to the business. Good afternoon, everybody. This is Rohan Verma here. I will keep it short so that we have more time for Q&A. Performance was good on a broad-based basis. Revenue in A&M, our Automotive and Mobility tech sector or segment was up 65%. On the Consumer Tech Enterprise Digital Transformation segment was up 37%. Again, this is a function of the open order book that we are sitting on. Beginning of the year was INR 699 crores, up 85% from the previous year of INR 377 crores. New launches, new go-lives of our OEM customers, our new fleet in private sector or public sectors embedding our IoT solutions. As well as on consumer tech companies, whether in the delivery side or logistics side or even consumer-facing companies like food tech brands or banks, as well as enterprises such as steel manufacturers or in the Government of India, either national, state or smart city or local governments. Everybody using digital transformation solutions powered by us. For example, analytics for market expansion, APIs for kind of embedding maps and location tech into their apps and enterprise systems or workforce management. So very, very good to see different sort of use cases increasingly coming up for the company. We are not static on the long term as well. We are investing a lot in 3D metaverse maps in our 360-degree panoramic street imagery service, which we call RealView. All of those will also add to the future when we talk about our drone solutions or our low-code, no-code tools and APIs for digital transformation. So good balance between short term as well as long term. The point on, we tried to explain it in the investor presentation, that the acquisition of Gtropy to strengthen our IoT business. Our existing IoT business was functioning well historically, but the purpose of the acquisition with Gtropy was to kind of create a dedicated management, a dedicated business that can scale and unlock the large potential in that mobility segment. So complementing our automotive OEM business where there are 2 crore new vehicles which are produced every year and we are getting our NCASE solutions embedded in those vehicles, in their companion apps or in the backend clouds. The existing base of 20 crore vehicles which can benefit from our IoT and SaaS is what we are targeting with the Gtropy acquisition. That integration is still underway so there is some revenue, some costs that have to be fully integrated and hence we kind of broke out consolidated and standalone to give you a flavor. Standalone business continues to do very, very strong. The indicators growing quite well. With the add-on of Gtropy, you will start seeing that also kick in and over the course of the year will contribute to a better PAT as well. With that, I will conclude my comments, and we can take Q&A. Thank you. Ladies and gentlemen, we will now begin the question and answer session. Anyone who wishes to ask a question may enter star and one on your touch-tone telephone. If your question has been answered and you wish to withdraw yourself from the queue, you may enter star and two. Participants are requested to use handsets while asking a question. Ladies and gentlemen, we will wait for a moment while the question queue assembles. To ask a question, you may enter star and one. We have the first question from the line of Anmol Garg. Please go ahead. Yeah, thanks. Thanks for the opportunity. Just had few questions. Firstly, wanted to get a color on the order pipeline for the quarter. While we have highlighted the type of deals that we are getting during the quarter, it would be great if you can state more into this. Also in our PPT we have highlighted that we have been winning businesses with EVs as well. Does that mean that there is an increase in the pricing given our A&M segment? This is question number one. See, when order booking happens from on one side automotive OEMs, on other side corporates or businesses across sectors including from fleet or logistics companies, but also other sectors like banks, BFSI, tech companies, retail, et cetera. Then on the government, whether it is national, central state or local government municipalities, et cetera. We are seeing order wins across the board, and the pipeline is also quite strong. It continues to become larger and more interesting because just so many more customers, it is becoming hygiene for them to use some product or some solution which MapmyIndia already provides for their normal business. This is not a nice to have. This is now becoming kind of a hygiene as they digitally transform. So pipeline is looking strong. A specific number we report on an annual basis, just because it takes time for orders to materialize, we want to have a full number to give of how the year is looking. But suffice to say that quarter 1 has begun well on a pipeline and order booking situation as well. Sure. Thanks. Secondly, wanted to ask if you could provide any viewpoint on the margins as well, because in the previous quarter, we had stated that the margins will be in the range of 34%-43%, and this time we have exceeded that range despite the contribution from Gtropy, which is a low margin business. Is there any change for the margin change guidance for the full year of FY 2023? See, as you know, as we have talked before, the digital product or platform business and unique kind of in the SaaS space. So very high contribution margins. Our tax historically has been about 30%-35% range. EBITDA has been in the 35%-45% range. We want to maintain that flexibility. But of course, as revenues grow, the operating leverage is there, profitability will grow. We want to keep an eye out for what all investments we can do for the future, for the medium and long term for the company. So that will propel next level of growth beyond what the current orders book or what typically we are just getting based on the current portfolio. So probably if we had to maintain in that 30%-35% PAT and 35%-45% EBITDA is something which we like to be able to have. Okay. Sure. But what I was just wondering that if we can have a shorter range over the margin, so that would be really helpful for us. Let me interject here. We did 46% this quarter. So I guess what we are trying to communicate is we would like to achieve on the higher end, which we already exceeded last quarter. So if you are looking at a shorter range, then look at the higher side of it rather than the lower side of it. Sure. And one last question from my end after I will join the queue. So we have talked about the MapmyIndia's business and the revenue outside of India as a big opportunity. And we have been making investments towards it. So just wanted to understand if there has been any contribution from the same in this quarter and what kind of revenue contribution can we expect in the down line for this year as well as next year? If you can give some color around it, that would be great. Thank you. Yes, surely. In two ways we get the foreign revenue. One is for our India business from foreign customers, your large global companies like these Apples or Amazons or BMWs or Hymers, et cetera. That's one business really for the India products and solutions. The other piece that we've talked about is that look our software and our APIs, SaaS and PaaS, I may say, either for automotive or mobility or consumer tech or enterprise digital transformation, which is global in nature. It can be sold to all markets outside India. We've also said that, look, this is going to be a 1-3 year journey. Not that we are counting on revenue being significant from that in this year itself. Towards that extent, where execution is happening is we have gotten onboard pretty senior folks in various capacity in APAC region as well as in U.S., as well as in Europe. So that we can start exploring or reaching out to customers in those markets. That process is on, the pipeline is getting built, and slowly we'll start seeing some revenues flowing in. In this quarter one, nothing substantial to report on this from a revenue point of view, but good efforts, I would say, from the pipeline point of view. Sure. Thank you. Thank you. The next question is from the line of Gaurav Chopra from Uniac Capital. Please go ahead. Thanks for taking my question. Congrats on a good set of numbers. Two questions from my side. First was on this Mappls 3D RealView maps. How are you planning to monetize these 3D maps which you guys have launched? If you could also help us with some use cases which you guys are using it. What are the costs associated with it? Adding to that, we recently read about Google's partnership with one of the software. Is there any way in which HERE has the ability to fully monetize the opportunities coming in this space? That is my first question. Sure. The purpose of releasing Mappls RealView or our 3D metaverse maps, et cetera, is basically to look at newer interesting kind of monetization opportunities which will come. For example, in the real estate sector, for example, in the VR or virtual reality or real-world metaverse sector, potentially in the smart city or road infrastructure sectors. There are actually type maps. RealView is another type of map. It's a geo-referenced 360-degree street imagery. Plus, we are adding these additional immersive 3D landmarks. On one side, it is to give more help to our map that this continues to innovate beyond what others are doing. The second is, in certain use cases or certain industries, there's more applicability for RealView. Maybe those markets are not necessarily ready today, but they will become interesting market segments or use cases in the time to come. How we plan to monetize is very similar to how we've monetized our products so far. Whether licensing the maps or building APIs and providing that on a subscription or transaction basis, or building different types of SaaS or software solutions and charging based on usage of that is how we'll monetize. As far as the launch of this Google Street View in partnership with a local company, see, if you look at our offering, we believe that our offering is stronger in terms of the value proposition to customers. The coverage is wider, the technology is better. There's 3D metaverse maps. In that sense, for the last 14, 15 years, we have competed in a world where Google exists. We have shown the track record, and we believe we continue to show the track record of being able to build a better product, which is more flexible to meet the customer's needs as well. Again, we're the only Indian company that can do both the data collection as well as the product and platform to monetize that completely. Whereas in other cases, you are seeing this disjointed type of effort that somebody collects data and somebody has a product and platform. I'll leave that altogether as a different point that as per the geospatial guidelines of Government of India, it has to be seen whether that launch by the foreign company is in compliance or not. That's not for us to make a point as MapmyIndia. We are an Indian company. We're allowed to do all this. But that is something to be thought about from this angle. Does it affect our ability to monetize to our enterprise customers? Are our enterprise customers asking us any questions on that? Answer is no so far. Are there any significant costs which are going to come in for the service offering which we have launched or- Yeah. See, I think that's the interesting thing from India's perspective, that homegrown technology, that's our core, building it ourselves, keeping costs most efficient, being innovative. This is how we have historically built. This is how we'll continue to build. We don't see a significant cost to us, but we will keep a watch on what all is happening. And we have talked about building this four-dimensional high-definition information digital map twin, extremely advanced granular map that will service many use cases, including ADAS and autonomy. Or in the government side, a lot of investment is potentially going to happen on the digital infrastructure, which might require high-definition 3D or high-definition maps. So we are keeping an eye out. We will align our investments towards the market opportunities that are coming up, but surely we'll probably be the most cost-efficient and also the most technologically savvy player in this space in India. My second question was with respect to the 15th. In our maps and data segment, we have seen some muted growth quarter-on-quarter on a year-on-year basis. Is it something to do with milestone-based revenue build-up, or it can be lumpy and we will see stronger growth on a full-year basis? Or how should we read about? Sorry, I could not hear the question exactly. If you do not mind repeating it. Sure. I was referring to your disclosure with respect to revenue segmentation into maps and data, which I think you- Okay. I understand the question. You are talking about map and data growth versus the platform and IoT growth, correct? Yeah. Yeah. We have experienced in the past also before, that map and data is driven by contracts, especially on C&E, some on automotive. Sometimes they can be milestone-based kind of revenue. So you will see some lumpiness in terms of that. Really, the numbers, in our type of business, it is the annual number that makes sense because of some of these licensing which happens on an annual basis. Yeah. Okay, got it. Thanks for answering the question. Thank you. We have the next question from the line of Vishnu Teji from Singular Capital. Please go ahead. You had mentioned about the after-sales market in your presentation. I just want to understand what exactly is the value proposition over here. Could you throw some light on the revenue and business model opportunity? What is the kind of revenue and business model over here? Okay, sure. The aftermarket opportunity that we explained, the mobility part of our A&M business is basically, look, there are about 20 crore odd vehicles on the road. Four-wheelers, two-wheelers, commercial vehicles. Many of them are involved in fleet operations, let's say for logistics movement, whether long haul or last mile, as well as for taxi or passenger transport like your taxis or buses, et cetera. Our solutions are twofold. One is IoT led. When I say ours, now I include Gtropy, the company that we acquired. It is IoT led, meaning GPS trackers, now dash cameras, as well as for the consumer market, at least there's infotainment systems, AVNs, audio, video navigation systems. This different range of types of IoT products serve different use cases. Whether to monitor the live location or historical movement of fleets, that can help them see also fuel consumption, which they can optimize the movement of and reduce their logistics movement. We get logistic efficiency in the operations of these fleets. Our software, our SaaS basically addresses these types of needs of truckers, transporters or logistics organizations, whether they're pure-play logistics companies or they're the logistics divisions, transport divisions of large enterprises. For example, just to give few flavor. In this quarter itself, one of the large state road transport corporations in South India, they went live with our IoT and SaaS, where the public transport buses are tracked using MapmyIndia Gtropy, as well as the citizens are getting an app where they can see, if they have to go from point A to point B, then which bus stop to go to and which bus stop to get off, how far the bus is right now from them. That is one case. On the other side, the logistics companies can see whether the truck has deviated from the route they should take, how far they are from the destination, is there a delay, so that they can accordingly set the activities of the loading, unloading staff at the warehouse. Our software orchestrates all that, and we provide IoT devices for the same. That's a large kind of opportunity when you look at 20 crores kind of vehicles. Of course, not all of them will be their customers today. But a lot of them are now going to digitize, because using technology they can become more efficient and that's our play there. Sure. No problem. Thank you. We have the next question from the line of Shristi Jain from Kotak Network Capital. Please go ahead. Hello, sir. Thank you for the opportunity. Sir, I had one question on the fact that, what are the key line items or contracts, make up other expenses, because that has been fluctuating over the last three, four quarters. As a person, you feel that keeps on fluctuating as a bit of a large indicator. Can you help me understand what are the key components around this, and also what the sustainable levels are? If you are looking at the other expenses, then in the Q1 FY 2023, you find it something like INR 11.46 crore as against Q4 of FY 2021/2022, the previous quarter of INR 15.58 crore. It has come down. Now, what constitutes the major numbers where the differences might be happening? One is the legal and professional fee, which came down this quarter to INR 1.71 crore from INR 3.61 crore. That is a reduction in that fee. Provision against bad inventory also came down to INR 0.86 crore from INR 1.36. I think communication expenses, which includes cloud hosting, came down to INR 1.74 from INR 2.08. Advertisement came down to INR 1.57 from INR 3.87. If you look at these expenses, they may vary quarter to quarter, because if we advertise more, there will be more advertisement expenses like that. Sure. I understand that. Do we have a range in mind that we work it out for the quarter, or how does it work? Well- I just want to understand the sustainable levels of it. Like if 20% is to be sustainable. The only item that can vary beyond the normal range is the advertisement. Rest of the items will probably stay within what you are saying, 15%-20%. Sure, sir. Sir, my second question is the 700 order book that we have, does it include Gtropy orders as well? No. Gtropy didn't have this history of order book because in that case, actually, at least that 699 did not have any Gtropy order book. Sure. Sir, just last question. Okay. Out of the new orders that we took in last year in FY 2022 about INR 450 crores, how many are those are not from our 35 key account customers? What other percentage, if you could give to help me understand that? Large percentage. Large percentage in the sense that there are a lot of customers, a lot of active customers. How much percentage comes outside of the 35 customers for this Q1, I do not have that number on hand right now. I cannot give you a specific answer on that. Maybe you can come back with that answer. Yes. Not on Q1, on the full financial year 2023 in general as well, whenever you can come back. Okay. That is it for my questions. We have the next question from the line of Vikesh Iyer from Sequence Investments. Please go ahead. Hello, sir. Congratulations on a good set of numbers. I just wanted to know about this large order book in place. What is the execution timeline for this entire order book? If you could just give me a ballpark number. Yeah. The track record is about three to four years on order book to revenue kind of conversion. Okay. Over a full cycle. Okay. This doesn't constitute revenue that we would generate from Gtropy, right? No. The numbers that we closed with FY 2022, that INR 699, is everything of Gtropy. Okay. Thank you. Can we say that way, we can have an FY 2023 guidance from your side, as in 2-3 crores or what would be the revenue possible in this financial year? Give a guidance. We don't give any specific guidance. I guess a little bit can be seen from the track record. If you saw the Q1 last year, Q1 2022, then you looked at Q2 2022, you saw an increase from Q1 to Q2. Right. You saw the opening order of 2022, and now you see the opening order of 2023. Based on- Right all these facts, one can draw some conclusion since we are not officially giving any number guideline, but we are giving you a color. Right. I got you. Thank you. Thank you. That's all from my side. Thank you. We have the next question from the line of Mr. Selva from STP Research. Please go ahead. Thanks a lot for taking my question. Two questions. First of all, given the news flow around U.S. businesses, where it is said they are cutting their finances. So far with your depiction, have you seen any impact? You mean from the US Fed's cut down in rates? No, U.S. businesses. Maybe your clients or potential clients in terms of what kind of visibility that is coming from, any impact on your business? New age businesses? Yes. Okay. Actually, the Z-Pay made from new age businesses based on growth of their usage and their business. In general, it is actually quite bullish because all these new age companies are doing quite well from the point of view on their app usage or their transactions, their revenue. In that sense, it's good sign for us, and we are trying to continuously explore new and new use cases with these new age companies where more they could use MapmyIndia. We are happy about the situation there. There are absolute opportunities, and that's what we are exploring, and organically also their own business is growing. Okay. Just a bookkeeping question. How should we see the tax rate going ahead? I mean, are you still on the old tax structure or moved to the new tax structure? Because already the effective tax rate has been around 28%-30%. Just trying to understand that. The effective tax rate, we all know the tax rate is 25%, and then you add the surcharge, it makes it 26.5% or something like that. Now there are certain expenses like CSR, as an example, and there are some other items also which get disallowed from tax by the income tax department. So 28.5% what we have taken as, I think we have taken 28.5%, is a pretty reasonable percentage of what the reality is. Okay. Thank you. Last year, 17.3% was last year's quarter. But if you look at the entire last year, it was 25.7%. Understood. Thank you. Thank you. We have the next question from the line of Ashish Chopra from BESA. Please go ahead. Yeah. Okay. I just want to know that the integration of Gtropy acquisition, the revenues over there, would they be largely coming into the C&E business or would they be split between A&M as well as C&E? They will primarily come under A&M, Ashish. I mean, most of their customers historically have been in the logistics sector. So we call that part of our mobility or aftermarket. So it will fall under A&M. Okay. So what is the sense that the entire 8 crores would be largely accruing to the A&M and very marginal or if anything, to C&E? Yeah. That's right. So 8 crores in. The 8 crore was their standalone number from a revenue point of view, but about 5 odd crores was through MapmyIndia standalone, C.E. Info Systems standalone. So, I think, let's put it this way. The entire 8 crores of MapmyIndia standalone when consolidated, most of them, almost majority of them went to A&M. Yeah. Okay. Got it. Thank you. We have the next question from the line of Nitin Sharma from MC Pro Research. Please go ahead. Yeah. One more question. On the Nawgati acquisition, can you please talk more about it? Because it is very small and you are taking acquisition of around, you are taking around 3%. So how does it fit in and what kind of technology benefit basically you are talking about on site? Sure. Thanks, Nitin, for the question. Nawgati is actually in the They have a video analytics product. They have multiple products which focus on the oil and gas sector. Yeah. They have a video analytics SaaS product, which kind of monitors the congestion or wait time or traffic at the fuel station. This is something very important or valuable to both the fuel companies, potentially also to consumers, where the fuel company can see what type of utilization, what type of efficiencies or inefficiencies there at fuel station, get that as analytics. Consumers, you can see whether CNG pump right now is very occupied and hence which CNG pump to go to in future. I mean, one is, of course, the synergies that we saw. One of the reasons why we did this is a lot of interesting joint go-to-market in oil and gas sector. That can be a very large sector from, again, a digital transformation point of view, where a lot of our products are used. For example, oil and gas companies or any retailer can use Mappls to figure out where to set up new petrol pumps or new gas stations or new EV charge stations. Since they had something very specific for oil and gas, we felt that we could even monitor once the petrol pump or gas station is running, then what kind of efficiencies are there? So monitoring that. We thought there is some interesting kind of synergies there for us to go deeper into one segment, oil and gas. There are so many segments of interest to us. Also that product was interesting. There is potentially, not saying it is going to happen, but potentially horizontal applications of their technology which we can leverage for, let us say, other customers or increase our portfolio of offerings, et cetera. So that was the thought behind it. Okay. Understood. Thank you. Thank you. We have the next question from the line of Shiv Gandhi from Astute Investment Management. Please go ahead. Yes. I was mentioning that recently Google has also been trying to venture towards the auto market side now. They've been launching. They've already, I think, launched Android Auto operating system. I was reading that a lot of other companies like GM, Volvo, Kia, Toyota have already signed some deals with them. If they also try to maybe penetrate into India, how you are trying to offer this risk? Because although currently it's significantly a small revenue. Yes. See, there's two parts to this. Actually, if you ask the OEMs, they don't want to go down this handset manufacturer route, where they outsource all the technology in their cars to the big tech companies. While they will provide compatibility for mobile phones with the cars, they are not copying this technology, the native technology experience that they offer to their customers. That's what the NCASE perspective of autonomous, shared, and electric is the technology which OEMs are adopting. So with happened in the NCASE offering, navigation-enabled, connected, ADAS, shared, and electric, this is what we have been pitching for the last couple of years, which has helped us go beyond just staying within a Mappls communication. So, for example, we're doing a lot of things on ADAS, which means that the driver can get alerted using our app, using our maps, using our technology, that up ahead, there's a speed camera, up ahead there's a speed breaker. Your current road on which you are driving, the speed limit is this, and you are over-speeding or something like that. Now, when deeply integrated into the car, this can lead to what is called ISA, intelligent speed assist, which is another kind of feature that OEMs want to bring in. So the car can automatically get the information using MapmyIndia that the current road speed limit was this, but the driver is driving at this speed. So car can automatically press the brake or give a native warning to the user. So there's a lot of things that we're doing on NCASE, a deeper integration into the OEM. So there's multiple reasons why they embed our maps in their cars, in their companion apps and in the cloud. So in that sense, you can think of us as an automotive technology provider not just an app that gets projected or a consumer ecosystem. On that also, I must say that the Mappls app that we have is also compatible with Android Auto and CarPlay now. So users can actually use MapmyIndia's app and compare the experience versus the default Maps app. In many cases, they are saying they are able to appreciate the benefits of MapmyIndia's maps being house address level detail or giving these kinds of safety alerts, speed breakers, camera, and speed limits and other features like this RealView. People are seeing even on an app-to-app consumer business, which is not our core, but even there they are seeing our consumer product is better. Then OEMs, because they are integrating and offering that technology native to their consumers, they are getting that benefit. Thanks for answering my question. Thank you. To ask a question, you may enter star and one. We have the next question from the line of Nikhil Chaudhary from Crisp Portfolio Management Services. Please go ahead. Yeah. Hi, sir. Thank you for the opportunity. Congratulations on the great set of numbers. Sir, I wanted to understand. Sorry if my question is very basic. Wanted to understand customer switching cost. Following on the earlier presentation, say, for example, we are already serving some OEMs, and Google, with the help of a domestic guy, gets on to probably something that we already have, that is MapmyIndia, and it also starts offering similar services. How easy probably it is for one customer to switch to, say, our competitor? And what is usually the exit rate in this industry? Is it a 100% renewal rate or 95% renewable rate, say, at the end of the year? On what basis do the clients leave us? Just wanted to understand a few parts around that. See, at least in the automotive front, these integrations are quite deep, so it's not that easy for anybody to switch out because there are multiple points of integration. Like I said, in the car, in the companion app, in the backend cloud system. Just as I answered your question previously also, the Google solution that they have launched is not really something that is very meaningful for automotive. It might be meaningful or interesting from a consumer point of view, but not for automotive or enterprise per se. So that's kind of on that front. Our approach on retention of customers, and we have a track record of very strong retention numbers. You've seen it in the RHP, DRHP that we had released last year also, is basically we keep enhancing our products and services, so we keep building towards what our customers need for their next generation. We're very much customer-focused, customer-aligned. In that sense, we go along with our customers. So we see pretty strong retention numbers. Understood, sir. Sir, usually you may probably have answered in the earlier comments, but wanted to understand in the vehicle OEMs, how does the billing work? I assume it is per vehicle sold and also probably yearly basis we receive something. Is my understanding right? Yeah, that's right. Okay. Understood, sir. Thank you so much. I wish you all the best and thanks. Thank you. We have the next question from the line of Sharom Kapur from Kotak Securities. Please go ahead. Hi. Thanks for the opportunity. Congratulations on the numbers. I just had two questions, and they are kind of related. From a high level view, what do you see as two or three key headwinds that could potentially your business moving forward and that could significantly reduce growth. Is this competition perspective that more internal and keeping tech updates. Is it any regulatory issues. What do you see as key risks to the business. Our biggest risk for us as a company is if we stop innovating. If we stop innovating, we do not keep coming out with newer products or enhancements on our existing products. That will not hold us in good stead. The other is if we stop engaging actively with our customers, this will also hold us in bad stead. We have built up a pretty strong leadership position and building such quality and comprehensiveness of a map data product and this technology platform, which covers multiple areas. On automotive, we talk about NCASEs. This is not a small area. In mobility, we talk about logistics SaaS or transportation SaaS, IoT devices. Again, these are quite comprehensive offerings. When you look at the digital transformation, we cover everything from analytics and strategic planning to operations optimization, field workforce management. Then we talk for apps, we provide these APIs or widgets, which are either low-code or no-code. These are pretty comprehensive offerings. We do not know of any other company that has this breadth of offering powered with this unique kind of map asset where we are doing a lot of innovation as well. Aniam. I will add something to this. I do not have the exact number, but there must be at least 100 plus small organizations who might be offering some of the things that we do. What I am trying to convey to you is the complex platform and product that we have built on top of the map data that we own is something that organizations are able to get it from under one umbrella. In a ready-to-use manner. In a ready-to-use manner. That makes a big difference and that from a business perspective, from a customer's perspective, that is one big differentiating factor. Got it. No, thanks. I really appreciate the detailed answer to that. Related to that, you said was that first, stopping to innovate as a business might not put you in a good position. Does that mean that R&D costs will continue to remain, will you continue to have a significant investment in R&D in the coming future? Do you ever see that normalizing to a lower rate, or is that always continuous investment in R&D? Let me give you some answer to this with some examples. We launched our Mappls RealView just a few weeks back. The entire data that was collected was over a period of some time, and they were all expensed out. So that was part of the R&D expense that we did. So like that, the expenses will continue. So we are used to those expenses and when we invest or spend, the way we make it cost-efficient is we are able to leverage on some data collection in multiple ways. It is not just that I collected this data and licensed it to somebody else and that is it. It is because it does not work like that. These are the kinds of processes that we have developed in the company and we have expanded our horizon. Got it. Thanks. I really appreciate the answers. Thank you. Thank you. Ladies and gentlemen, to ask a question, you may press star and one. We have the next question from the line of Ashish Kumar from Exinity Securities. Please go ahead. Thank you, sir, and congratulations on the good set of numbers. I see the growth momentum is pretty strong. Coming to in terms of what the last speakers had asked, in terms of growth momentum, do you see any risk or any large investments that you might want to make? The reason where I'm coming from is that we already are sitting on a INR 300 crore kind of a cash balance. So what is the thought process around using this cash balance? Are we The cash balance that one company keeps is for making sure that any opportunity that comes up. See, the small opportunity like we picked up Nawgati, that may or may not be worthwhile talking from a cash perspective. But we definitely want to make sure that we don't fall short of cash whenever any opportunity comes up. Opportunity could be in terms of acquisition, opportunity could be in terms of making our own investment. Investment could be in terms of R&D, something very big, or it could be even in terms of re-energizing the brand. So I don't think the amount of money that we have created or generated, while it definitely is not a small amount, but we would like to preserve it for the growth of the company. Sure. In terms of any large opportunities that you are seeing, do you see any large opportunity gaps that we have from a market perspective? There are always multiple opportunities that we are evaluating in different spaces. I think Vendha had talked about in the RHP, DRHP, there are different spaces in India, internationally, both, that we will look at, different segments, whether on enterprise or consumers. Nothing that we are doing today, but we keep looking at opportunities, and these are opportunities that can further enhance the growth of the company in the future. So there are multiple opportunities, spaces where we can go, but we are careful about which ones to look at. Sure. Last question, just the launch of Mappls. Do you see yourselves pushing aggressively on the pure B2C platform like a Google Maps type of an offering, which is where the revenue profile is much significant rather than an enterprise link? With Mappls app, actually, we have another revenue stream also of selling gadgets with subscription services. With Mappls app, what you also get, which the other Google Maps app type stuff doesn't give, is you can install our gadget in your car or two-wheeler and start monitoring it and its health, whether the engine is working well, et cetera. You pay us a subscription service for that. You pay us for the gadget upfront. So there is a business model already for the app. Right now, the focus has been, especially in the last few quarters, just growing the distribution of our gadgets through retail and auto partnerships. We will look at doing more on the consumer app from both the perspective of brand, technology showcase, but also this gadget-led revenue. Nothing so much on the ad business model right now. So you are not thinking of switching to a free app where your revenues are driven by the app usage, i.e., ads-led? The Mappls app is free to use. It is not a paid- It's free to you, but you're not looking at putting in ads to monetize that as- As of now, no. Okay. Thanks, and wish you all the best. Thanks. Thank you. We have the next question from the line of Anmol Garg. Please go ahead. Yeah. Hi. Thanks for the wonderful session. Just wanted to ask a question on the working capital side. Now that we are planning to increase the government business and also that we have acquired Gtropy, which deals with the logistics players as their customers. Do you think that these two reasons or these two types of customers can increase the working capital requirement in the business? Second to that, what kinds of government business can we expect in this year for the complete consolidated entity? The government revenue, last year we talked about was 5%. This year, definitely, we are gradually building up the order booking in the government because there are lots of opportunities. But we are careful about being a platform and a product player on a SaaS model that we also closely work with the systems integrators. So really the pressure on the working capital from that doesn't come too much. Maybe a little bit, but not much. To answer your question on the other one about the Gtropy, yes, there might be some investments we will require to support Gtropy from the gadget side of it, which leads to generating the business, which leads to the SaaS part of the business. But I don't think it is going to be any alarming number or anything like that. Okay, sure. Thanks. Thank you. Thank you. We have next question from the line of Vineet at Vesto. Please go ahead. Yes. MapmyIndia having data services? Hello? Sir, I believe the participant is unable to hear us. That was the last question. Would you like to make any closing comments, management? No, just wanted to say thanks to everybody for spending the time asking us the questions. We were pretty happy with how the quarter went. It is going in line with what our efforts have been over the last few years, and we remain committed to working hard on our products and engaging with our customers. Look forward to connecting after the quarter. Thank you all for joining the earnings call. Thank you, members of the management, and thank you, Mr. Garg. Ladies and gentlemen, on behalf of DAM Capital Advisors Limited, that concludes this conference. Thanks for joining us, and you may now disconnect.