Ladies and gentlemen, good day and welcome to the Praj Industries Limited Q1-FY26 Earnings Conference Call. As a reminder, all participant names will be in the listen-only mode, and there will be an opportunity for you to ask questions after the presentation concludes. Should you need assistance during this conference call, please signal an operator by pressing star one zero on the touchtone phone. Please note that this conference is being recorded. I now hand the conference over to Mr. Anuj Sonpal from Valorem Advisors. Thank you and over to you, sir.
Thank you and good afternoon, everyone. A very warm welcome to you all. My name is Anuj Sonpal from Valorem Advisors. We represent the investor relations of Praj Industries Limited. On behalf of the company, I would like to thank you all for participating in the company's earnings calls to discuss the first quarter of financial year 2026 performance. Before we begin, let me mention a short cautionary statement. Some of the statements made in today's earnings call may be forward-looking in nature. Such forward-looking statements are subject to risks and uncertainties, which could cause actual results to differ from those anticipated. Such statements are based on management's beliefs as well as assumptions made by and information currently available to management. Audiences are cautioned not to place any undue reliance on these forward-looking statements in making any investment decisions.
The purpose of today's earnings call is purely to educate and bring awareness about the company's fundamental business and financial quarter under review. Let me now introduce you to the management participating with us in today's earnings call and hand it over to them for opening remarks. We have with us Mr. Ashish Gaikwad, Managing Director, and Mr. Sachin Raole, Chief Financial Officer and Director of Resources. Without any further delay, I request Mr. Sachin Raole to start with his opening remarks. Thank you and over to you, sir.
Thank you, Anuj. Good day, everyone. I welcome you to Praj Industries' earnings call for quarter one FY26. Trust all of you to have the opportunity to go through our results for the quarter ended 28 June 2025. We consolidated income from operations to that of INR 6.4 billion in Q1-FY26 as compared to INR 6.99 billion in Q1-FY25. We recruited for exceptional items for the quarter through that of INR 96.09 million as compared to INR 288.8 million in the corresponding period of the last year. Profit after tax to that of INR 53.4 million in Q1-FY26 as compared to INR 841 million in Q1-FY25. Of the total revenue, 60% is from biology, 28% from the engineering, and 12% is from Q3 business. Export revenues accounted for 38% of Q1-FY26. The order intake during the quarter was INR 7.95 billion, with 55% from the domestic market.
Of the total market intake, 80% came from biology, 12% from engineering, and balanced 8% from PSS business. The order backlog as of 30 June 2025 is that of INR 4.45 billion, comprising 62% of domestic orders. Cash in hand was on June 30th through that of INR 4.5 billion. Geopolitical scenario and uncertainty around U.S. tariffs slowed down the CapEx-related decisions impacting the order booking. Customers in the domestic market are facing liquidity challenges, resulting in delayed and extended project execution. Profit mainly impacted by drop in volume, increased site-related expenses because of delayed execution cycles, and generic business expenses with no corresponding revenues with a result for affected the absorption of fixed cost. It is pertinent to note that there are no loss of orders or the loss of market share for Praj.
Effective tax rate for Q1-FY26 in consolidated financials is 44% because the data has tested on the losses of Praj units with a few that is lower rate as compared to the rate of tax for Praj Industries. In FRA's AGM, shareholders have approved the payment of final dividend of 300% per share. With this, I now hand over to Ashish for his comments on the business performance and other updates.
Thank you, Sachin. Good day, everyone. Yesterday, on the occasion of World Biofuel Day, Praj introduced BioVerse. It's a movement to promote innovation, collaboration, and additional applications to further develop the Indian and international bioeconomy. I would like to go to the business updates now. First, on the domestic bioenergy business. As you know, India has achieved its E20 blending target ahead of its scheduled target of 2025 end. The current installed capacity of ethanol production in the country now exceeds E20 requirements. The discussions are ongoing regarding additional blending plans. The industry is anticipating a firm announcement on the post. The excess installed capacity has led to temporary slowdown in conversion of new inquiries into firm orders and new greenfield ethanol projects. We believe this short-term situation will improve once the government announces its plans to increase in ethanol delivery.
Introduction of flex fuel vehicles and engines will also give new impetus. As mentioned by Sachin, despite slow orders, our market share at Praj is intact. The government of Maharashtra has made an announcement of Vikasit Maharashtra 2047. This is a positive development. Two stacks of bioenergy policy that promises INR 28,000 crore in investments over the next five years in various products derived from tuber crops. While we are witnessing slowness in inquiry of greenfield plants, we are focusing on offering plant modifications as well as solutions as core products such as distillers corn oil or DCO, rice protein, etc. These are gaining increasing interest from the existing ethanol producers. On the existing projects and on the inefficient refineries, liquidity challenges are resulting in extended inefficient cycles. In such resources, we are witnessing demands in site preparedness and precondition readiness due to the lack of funding.
Moving on to the international bioenergy business. Despite good inquiry baskets from America, there are some demands in order intake. Some of these are due to the tariffs-related developments. There is now a clarity on 45Z tax credits policy which is a tax credits policy as to confirm in the new BIS 2025. It is an encouraging development for us. However, the uncertainty regarding status may act as a holding CBG business. There is a holding pipeline of inquiries for projection city. The success of our fresh fruit-based CBG plants is well accepted by the customers. New opportunities built from natural gas as the feedstocks are also developing. The decision-making is demanded in some cases due to financial challenges. We have a unique offering of combined compressed biogas and bio-bitumen plants. This unique offering from Praj improves the project ROI and payback period.
We have initiated discussions with customers regarding the addition of bio-bitumen model. Since it can significantly improve the reliability of the compressed biogas plants, we are witnessing increasing traction. As mentioned in the last quarter, we have signed a term sheet with BPCL for developing 10 compressed biogas projects. We are in the process of finalizing the BOVE agreement. Services business. This business is continuing its journey on a stronger growth path with a good performance. Apart from our performance to Nantes Collisions, we also have a healthy inquiry pipeline for biounits through the capture solution. On the SAF business front, we have received an order for design engineering for a commercial-sized SAF in the U.S. This is for a detailed seed engineering package. This is going to help us in portability development in ethanol-tagged solvents.
On the policy front, we see government is expected to come up with sustainable fuel manufacturing promotion policy 2025. This is aiming to establish the state as a leading hub for SAF production in India. In one more SAF -related development, Praj has entered into a partnership with IOTO and ILLU to advance SAF carbon assessment and specification in India. This collaboration aims to conduct a comprehensive lifecycle carbon assessment or LCA of SAF produced from Indian sugarcane feedstocks using the ethanol-tagged pathway. The goal is to determine an accurate carbon intensity number for SAF and establish a certification methodology suited to the Indian context, aligning with the international standards. Moving on to the engineering resources. On unit front, tariff uncertainty and the reduced prioritization of energy transition projects have affected order booking. Several projects are either delayed or on hold.
The fixed cost at the GenX modularization facility, coupled with limited revenue activity, has negatively impacted our bottom line. We are closely monitoring developments on the U.S. tariff front. We expect to be in a better position to comment on its long-term impact on the energy transition and the climate action business by next quarter. It's finding application of modernization across industry, and the geography is going to be the driver for capacity utilization of our next facility. On ethanol front, we have a good pipeline for our solutions for segments of high-capacity fermenters, canned mixed vegetables, and blood plasma. We are also exploring opportunities in emerging sectors like batteries, solar cells, and semiconductors. On the bioplastics front, we have now started discussing other offerings with potential customers, and the inquiry pipeline is building up.
Overall, despite a challenging business environment, our core fundamentals are strong, our growth sectors are intact, and therefore, we remain committed to our long-term growth vision. I now conclude my remarks, and I would like to thank all of you for joining our call today. We will now be ready to discuss any questions, comments, or suggestions that you may have. Thank you.
Thank you, everyone. We will now begin the question and answer session. Anyone who wishes to ask a question may press star and one on your touchtone telephone. If you wish to remove yourself from the question queue, you may press star and two. Participants are requested to use handsets while asking a question. Ladies and gentlemen, we will wait for a moment while the question queue assembles. The first question is from the line of Mohit Kumar from ICICI Securities. Please go ahead.
Yes. Good afternoon. Today's first question is on the domestic education.
Sorry to interrupt you, sir. Your voice is very low.
Can you say that now?
Yes, please go ahead.
Yes. Thanks for the opportunity. My question is on the domestic education. You said it's low in the current quarter. I think it's around INR 3.9 billion or INR 3.9 crore versus INR 5.3 crore in the base quarter. Do you think things will improve in the next couple of quarters or is it going to be a very, very delayed recovery? Is the lack of blending mandate also impacting the education?
Sorry, Mohit, it was a little difficult to understand your definition. Are you basically interested in understanding what is the scenario in the domestic ethanol market?
Bharat Petroleum Corporation Limited.
Am I alright?
Yes, sir.
Okay. All right, Mohit. Certainly, you need some impetus in the current domestic market, as you have mentioned. We would like to see a new additional blending mandate, which is probably being discussed now. Of course, that will give us more traction as far as the new capacities for today's ethanol plant is concerned. Apart from that, we are also looking at other opportunities that can come up. One of them I talked about recently is on SAF, the Sustainable Aviation Fuel, and the pathway that takes ethanol to SAF. That's the other set of opportunities that we will be looking at. The third one is also an opportunity that we are excited about, which is diesel. Today, diesel is not being blended by any alcohol.
If we get that mandate for blending in diesel as well, then that will give us a pathway to increase the alcohol production in India. All of these will positively impact our core business. This probably may not happen in the very immediate future or this quarter, but over a period of time, certainly, this is a positive trend.
Mohit, if I may add to your question related to the prospects for ethanol in the domestic market, there are two ways of looking at this entire scenario. One is completely based on what is going to happen on the mandates. If there are mandates, then what Ashish was referring is going to happen. Rather, there are a couple of more things which are happening. Yesterday, we witnessed on the World Biofuel Day, witnessing the unveiling of ethanol-based mobile gensets and next-gen flex fuel vehicles for both two-wheeler and four-wheelers.
It will also facilitate additional demand for ethanol in the near future. That's one element based on what is going to happen to the ethanol demand. Another element from our offering point of view, if there is no additional blending mandates coming up in the near future, we have a solution of advanced technology and customized services for our customers for enhancing their capacities or their yields or their performances, which is very healthy business. It might not be top-line accuracy, but relies on our bottom line. In addition to that, we have started our services business in a small way in the last couple of years, but it is taking a very big shift now, especially providing the performance enhancers to our customers, providing the services in addition to operations and maintenance.
There is a big bouquet or big basket of services which are also getting provided to our customers. That's an additional element for the domestic market, which will add on a realistic view of whatever is going to happen to our blending mandates.
Understood, sir. My second question is CBG. Of course, we're expecting a very large order of CBG of around INR 500 crore. How has been the experience, and how do you see the finalization of new tenders in the near term?
Okay. Mohit, CBG, I think the industry has been learning over the last few years. That learning has now, at least for Praj, resulted in doing these projects with much more efficiency and much more standardization. Certainly, for the press mode, which is a feedstock for CBG, we now have three successful projects which are producing CBG at capacity. That is certainly good news. There are more inquiries coming up. Certainly, there is an interest in a feedstock like nuclear gas. We are working on our proposal and working with the customers to see how we can take care of that market as well. Overall, it is still a developing market, CBG, and it will take some time for it to become extremely stable. We are engaged with that market, so we will keep you posted.
Thank you, Mr. Sir. Thank you.
Thank you.
Thank you, sir. Ladies and gentlemen, in order to ensure that the management is able to address questions from all the participants in the conference call, please strictly limit your question to two per participant. The next question is from the line of Atul Tiwari from JP Morgan. Please go ahead.
Yes, thanks a lot for the opportunity. My question is on order inflow. If the extension of the blending mandate has not come beyond 26th, say, for this year, can we still maintain about INR 800 crore of quarterly order inflow and release, or do you expect it to shift further from there?
Yeah, good question, Atul. You have seen that our current order booking is in that range, what you mentioned. We, of course, aim higher based on the inquiry pipeline that we see, but the decision can sometimes be a bit delayed. That's what I can say at this point in time, that it is fair to assume that type of run rate.
Atul, just to add on, while answering your question of Mohit, I was very specifically saying that if there is no additional blending mandate, maybe our top-line growth will not be there to that extent. Indirectly, that means there will not be a run rate of domestic order book in that zone which we are discussing right now, because naturally, there will be very few greenfield orders coming up in the picture in that case. There will be other opportunities which are available to us in the form of advanced technology, which may not add on to our top line, but that will add on to our bottom line. We will not see the numbers on top line, but we will see a number on bottom line.
Okay, sir.
How do you imagine, you know, in this quarter, we have seen like at a bigger level, 4.9%. As far as I can see, you know, it is probably the lowest over the past, you know, at least 15, 16 quarters. In this kind of environment, I mean, assuming that the mandate is not extended beyond 20% and the tariffs and uncertainties continue for some more time, is this the new normal or the new normal is more like 8%, 9% or even the double digit?
From the margin point of view, yes, you're right. This quarter happens to be the lowest one, mainly on two accounts. There will be minus a couple of more, but major two. We have seen a drop in top line by almost INR 2.20 billion as compared to last quarter. We have contributed very beyond not having the margins because the fixed costs to that extent are not hitting each of us. One too, the subsidiary of our service facility, which is completely operational, completely functioning, but not correspondingly generating revenue at this point of time. That is the second one. In the other expenses, we have seen some kind of spike in the site-related expenses because of a couple of sites where the work was continuing. We had some challenges on getting the labor for those particular sites, which actually added into our costs. That's another reason.
Whether this is a new normal or new normal is going to be different, according to us, yes, new normal is going to be completely different. This is like an aberration in this quarter, which we are seeing, the top line dropping to this extreme, cost going up to whatever extent we can mention. We are not expecting this situation to continue definitely. Some things might continue till quarter two, but from quarter three, from H2 onwards, we are not expecting the situation to continue. For the new normal, which we are expecting that can be in a little larger single-digit EBITDA margin, I think that's what we will be looking at going forward.
Okay, sir. Thank you .
Mr. Sharapu, sir?
Okay.
We request that you answer the question queue.
Thank you.
Thank you, sir. The next question is from the line of Sandeep Sabharwal from ESK Investments. Please go ahead.
Hi, Mr. Gaikwad. I've been running the company for almost 25 years. In the last few years, there have been several growth opportunities in the company as part of which we're supposed to become big, starting with the 2G ethanol to CBG to SAF to bioplastics, etc. All of these largely seem to be remaining on paper, and the company seems to be involved. The company shareholders seem to be working for the employees of the company, like the salary-to-turnover ratio of your company is extraordinary. You have set up a new facility, a few new facilities, which is not executing anything. I haven't seen any company ever do such kind of thing. What are shareholders supposed to expect from it?
If you actually go and listen to your company transcripts when you were not there, the conference call transcripts, last four or five transcripts, this sort of decline in turnover and the challenges you are talking of, these were never talked of earlier.
Yeah. First of all, Mr. Sabharwal, you tracking that company for 25 years certainly is a good thing. I appreciate your comments that you have given. See, we are also a technology company. You know we develop a technology. We develop that in the field of the bioeconomy, and it is a developing economy. There are timelines which are extended. You talked about 2G, CBG, SAF, and also bioplastics. 2G, for example, our technology is now working as far as 2G plants are concerned. We are quite hopeful, and we are working towards making our first 2G plants to be operational by the end of the year. I think that will build more confidence. There are two more projects that will follow, which are already being executed by Praj after the first one that I talked about. There is a timeline we have in mind.
Technologies like 2G, we are quite excited to really make them successful. Bioplastics is the same thing. It is driven by a little bit of regulation tied as well. We believe that these trends are correct, and these are difficult technologies to work with. Praj has always done a difficult thing, even ethanol. Several years ago, when Praj was talking about ethanol, nobody else was talking about it. Now you clearly see the success of bioecology being blended in the fuel. Ethanol-tigged has the pathway, etc. Patience to it, and especially in the technology field that we operate in, there is a definite reward to the patients.
I don't think you covered the aspects which I talked of, but in any case, now Mr. Chaudhari came out with a vision in 2013 where he said that you are looking to triple turnover and I think grow profits by certain levels, which I don't remember now. Immediately after that, the growth of the company has started declining. Can you just comment on that? What are the assumptions which went into giving that vision 2030 and how you're going to achieve it?
Certainly. First of all, the vision that was set by our Chairman, Dr. Pramod Chaudhari, we still are very much committed to delivering that vision 2030. The reasons for that, Mr. Sabharwal, are pretty well known. The reasons for that are the fundamentals. The core fundamentals are still the same. Our growth vectors, which I will quickly touch upon, are also intact. Therefore, while we see some of these hurdles like the tariffs that we talked about or some of the slowing down of the domestic ethanol greenfield demand, etc., those will be overcome when we are looking at a five-year view. The growth vectors that we are still quite gung ho about is, number one, we believe that ethanol will have more pathways for sure. Right? I touched upon a couple of them already.
We also believe that CBG as a market will develop, and we will have a third share within CBG. Number three, in our growth aspirations, we are internationalizing our offerings and our services. Certainly, we will have opportunities to grow it beyond the borders of India. Bioplastics also, although it has moved slowly, it will have the market opportunities developing. We can see those opportunities developing as well. When you look at the growth vector that we are talking about, both in the biofuel side and the renewable chemicals and materials side, which is how our portfolio is balanced, those are going to take off. On the equipment and the modularization side, you had this slowness, which Ashish mentioned, but we will explore new opportunities to use new industries as well as new geography so that we are able to better utilize our GenX facility.
I hope some of your points that you raised, and these are valid points, some of those are addressed by my answer.
Thank you. Just one observation because I have covered my two questions.
Please do.
That your company, when it was much smaller, used to have margins in the late teens or early 20s if you go back into history. As it's become bigger and bigger, the margins are actually declined where it should work the other way. I hope that you take initiatives under your guidance as you have just taken over to improve the profitability of the business.
Certainly, sir. I think profit remains one of the thought leaders for us. As you mentioned, you know we will certainly take actions so that we can maintain a certain level of bottom lines.
Thank you, sir. The next question is from the line of Shivkumar Prajapati from Ambit Investment Advisors. Please go ahead.
Yeah. Hi, Shivkumar. Thanks for asking my question. My first question is, in the presentation, you have highlighted that the current capacity exceeds the ethanol blending rate of 20%. I just want to understand, is the capacity marginally extra or is it something that can climb up to 25% of blending rate? If possible, would you be able to share the split between the greenfield versus the brownfield parts of the ethanol order book? What's part of overall ethanol production is being made from sugar, thin rice, or any other thing?
Okay. The composition of sugar and grain is more or less reaching to a 50/50 kind of a proportion from the production point of view. Is the current capacity good enough to take care of 25%? You get a question mark because there are so many regional imbalances still there. Because of which this extra capacity looks like to be an extra capacity, but that extra capacity so-called will not be in a position to take care of additional blending mandates. Even if it happens to be 20 %- 23%, we will immediately see the capacity requirement coming up from all the corners. We don't think that existing capacity will be able to take care of the additional requirement because there are multiple factors which play a role in the installed capacity and the utilized capacity, and that's to reason by reason.
I don't think that we will see that kind of a scenario. What was the other component of your question?
Sir, the order book split for ethanol, between greenfield versus brownfield?
Yes.
Right now, we have majority of our order book coming from greenfield. There is a small component of brownfield, and that brownfield, what I was earlier referring to from the advanced technology kind of a scenario where people are looking for capacity tweaking or shift stock, adding the new line in their existing sugar line with the grain line or the field improvement. Maybe 30% will be greenfield, 20% will be brownfield, more or less.
Okay. My next question is on GenX. So far, GenX has contributed around INR 20 crore of top line. What's the overall expected contribution from this segment? We aim to drive no contribution even in Q1 so far. If you can provide any further updates on a new audit that has been conducted and any new long-term contracts that have been signed because I think eight audits have been done and three contracts have been signed. If you could also highlight the order book that we'll be able to execute in the remaining nine months of this year, given we have INR 4,500 crore of outstanding order books.
Okay. In the GenX, it's a very peculiar situation in GenX. Let me first tell you that we also added two more framework agreements during this quarter for the GenX, which are basically based on the new client's inspection of our facility and then signing this framework agreement. That's the positive news on that front. On the overall opportunity which we are looking for from the GenX in the next year's point of view, we have more than INR 1,000 crore from proposals sitting with our customers where the decision-making is yet to happen. In the last call, we mentioned that we are working on RFQs, that is requests for quotations, which we have submitted to our customers as a form commitment. We are waiting for finalization. The crucial part of this INR 1,000 crore is that almost 70% are for the U.S. customers and 30% are for non-U.S. customers.
The majority of them are for U.S. customers, but the export is supposed to happen to U.S. to the extent of 70%. 30% is supposed to happen to the European region. That's the mix of what I can say from commitments which are sitting in the market from our side. What we have to see is how this current scenario towards things dies and the uncertainty towards that is delaying the decision-making for my customers, how it is going to pan out over the next couple of quarters. That is what is going to decide to what extent out of this INR 1,000 crore is going to get materialized in the order booking for us. That's one segment. Is that the only segment which we are concentrating on? That's not the case. Currently, we are working on multiple other requirements of the requisitions from other regions too.
If you look at GenX facilities, not meant for a state of customers, which is actually a modularization facility which can cater to different industries too. Our focus is now looking at what has just recently happened in the month of August, especially in the form of tariff. We are working out the alternatives to utilize this capacity. Maybe it will take a quarter more time for finalization of the entire new divisions or new industries for us, but that's the work which is going on. It is a little premature to answer the question whether what will be the order booking for GenX at this point of time for a simple reason because that additional 25% tariff is supposed to kick in from, what, 26th of August.
We would like to wait and watch for some more time to find out how this entire scenario is going to play out for us.
All right, sir. My next question is on.
Sorry to interrupt you, sir.
Please allow me this last question. Please.
Okay. Go ahead. Go ahead.
Yeah. Thanks. Thanks. Basically, if you can exclude the opportunities, okay, we will exclude the U.S. tariff impact. I just want to understand, currently, U.S. contributes around less than 10% of our revenue. Suppose this approval of 45E and 45Q announcement. What opportunity size do we look in the U.S.? In the last year, same quarter, you have highlighted that we had the opportunity to convert 20 plants to low-carbon ethanol plants. Is there any update on this? Plus, Brazil has also, you know, raised their mandates from 27% - 30% for gasoline, whereas for biodiesel, it has been raised to 15% from 14%. I just want to understand how much does Brazil contribute to us and the opportunities after this mandate update from Brazil?
Okay. I will try to answer this question in detail in short because there is a long queue of questions which are standing in the line. The answer is very simple. For U.S., 45Z, rather big of a missed batch for us. 45Z is a very positive development because it's an extension of the credits which are supposed to be available from 2027 to 2029. That's one positive. Second thing, there is a complete clarity in how the credit is to be given to our customers. That's another positive for which we are waiting actually for the last two and a half years. These are very, very positive developments on the low-carbon ethanol and credits available under 45Z. Only the downside, which is coming up in the form of this 25% plus 25% tariff at this point of time. That may delay some decision-making till we have clarity.
What I answered in my earlier question, in your earlier question, that tariff is going to give some kind of a clarity in a clarity zone by the end of August, I think that will tell us what is going to happen on the opportunity which is available to us on the 45Z. Second question is related to Brazil. Brazil, we believe that there is an increased blending mandate which will definitely be an open opportunity for us in the Brazil market. Again, we like to see if it's not only India and Brazil. There is a U.S. again sitting between Brazil and the U.S. What is going to happen from the export of ethanol from Brazil to the U.S., which is a very common factor? What will be the impact on their export because of their tariffs? They are also in a very large kind of a tariff number.
What kind of a capacity expansion they will be looking at? Again, we like to wait and watch. There is a very minuscule, not minuscule, maybe 10% - 15% kind of an impact, as you rightly said, from the direct U.S. business of ours. There are many factors which will indirectly affect us because of this kind of a scenario. We like to wait and watch on this front at least for a month till we see what happens on the balance 25% tariff.
All right, sir. Thank you so much and best of luck.
Thank you very much.
Thank you, sir. The next question is from the line of Amit Anwani from PL Capital. Please go ahead.
Thank you, sir. Thanks for the opportunity. My question pertains to, again, the GenX modularization facility where you did highlight the particular situation, which is currently there. Just wanted to understand, this is a prior comment that you would be bringing two orders, and then the execution can happen in H2. Is that situation there? The second thing is you talked about geographical diversification and some of the diversification for GenX. In the event of 50% tariff, are we also exploring the option that since this was 100% export-oriented, the unit will be looking for domestic orders? Which other industry diversification are you talking about, if you could explain in more detail about the GenX modularization facility in the event of tariffs?
Okay. Maybe I can take that question, Amit. Thank you for your question. First of all, we are right now resuming the sort of moving on the U.S. tariffs, and that's why it is important to say that the facility, which Sachin also mentioned earlier, is not just only for the U.S. It is certified and will be certified for multiple geographies as well. The customer base that we are trying to target is in the U.S., but also outside of the U.S. Secondly, we would like to have a proper analysis of the other markets other than the U.S. so that we will be able to, in the next call, give you more qualified answers based on our study that we are doing. Naturally, like us, many other companies are also struggling with the tariff, and we will have to find new geographies to start working on.
The third thing that we wanted to know was about new industries. Firstly, we were focusing in the last couple of years when there was a lot of discussion around the energy transition and climate action type of projects. They were mostly green hydrogen or blue hydrogen or green ammonia related. Somehow, those projects are either slowed down or on hold. Therefore, the other industry which can be certainly looked at, and the facility at GenX allows us to manufacture these modules or equipment for them, will be the non-ETCA or non-energy transition and non-climate action type of industry. Those are the ones that we will be exploring. As far as the geographies are concerned, we are looking at the Latin American geography where we have a presence, and of course, Europe and the U.K. as well.
Right, sir.
Those are our second questions.
Yeah. Yeah.
Okay. Second question, sir. You talked about the liquidity challenges faced by our customers. I assume this is, I think, we're working with sugar and then grain-based plants. Why is this arising? Are we sensing any impact on the working capital? Is this challenges for the current order book? What is the exposure of current order book where we are facing liquidity challenges from the customer? Since now 1G has kind of dried up, we at the peak used to get about INR 3,000 crore order intake typically from 1G. Are we expecting less than INR 1,000 crore since there's no orders? Even EDP for the mandates will take a lot of time to materialize because of different challenges. More clarity on these points here.
Yes. I think your first question related to working capital, I must first admit that yes, there is some kind of a strain. We are seeing to some extent accumulation of inventory and receivables in this quarter, but not alarming. Rather, that was the main reason when we took a decision that we don't want to keep on dispatching the goods to our customers without having cash on table. That's what has actually affected the revenue coming down from last quarter's topics 60, 50, 40 of this quarter. That was a very conscious call which we took that if we are not seeing the money on the table, we will not continue with dispatches of the goods. Let's understand what this liquidity problem is. All of our customers technically have sanctioned loans from their banks.
It is not that they don't have money in that sense, but they have a pension loan. These cases are completely backed by financing. The problem which my customers are facing is very simple. As you know, Amit, we generally do 30% or maximum 50% of the entire greenfield projects of any of our customers. Let's assume a project size is INR 100 crore and I'm doing a project of my component is INR 40 crore. The sanctioning of the loan is for the entire INR 100 crore. What bankers are saying is that we would like to see the development happening on the project across the project and not only what Praj is doing.
If there are any delays in other vendors' work which they are supposed to carry on or the civil work which my customer is supposed to take care of, it is affecting the disbursement of loans for my customer. That is the reason why we are working with them. We are helping them to figure it out how they can move forward so that our components can also get dispatched. That is what has impacted from the execution cycle point of view, what we had mentioned in our opening remarks, that the execution cycle time is getting longer because of that. Your question is right. We have seen some kind of a strain on the inventory being getting piled up because of the expectations we are not happening. That is a running inventory, so we are not worried on inventory.
We didn't allow our receivables to grow completely out of our hands. We are working with our customers for recovery of that money too. Sorry, Amit. What was the second part of your question?
The second part was on the since 1G orders were dropping INR 3,000 crore by 2023, 2024, 2025. Since there would be absence of 1G orders, are we seeing the order book order intake drastically declining on 1G front? Since you said there would be only serviced orders and I'm assuming that the non-ethanol-based or non-EBV-based order would be maybe INR 200 crore-INR 300 crore more per liter.
Understood.
Yeah.
Understood. I may not be able to exactly give what that number is going to be, whether it is going to be less or more, but we are only right now talking about domestic ethanol. We are also working in other geographies. U.S. happens to be one of that, but other geographies which Ashish was mentioning, especially in the Latin American market. Rather, this quarter, we got an order, a big order from the Latin American market in the international segment. We are looking at not only domestic market, but we are looking at international markets. Rather, let me put it in another way. We are not only looking at U.S. and India. We are looking at other geographies where a lot is happening because both countries are looking for increased mandates also.
There is a possibility of I may not be able to comment whether it is going to be INR 3,000 crore or INR 3,000 or INR 4,000, but there will not be a drop to that extent when we are looking at. I don't think that that is the scenario which we are aiming for. We will not be getting into that kind of a zone. Only the composition of my bioenergy basket may change. Yes, there might be some drop in domestic, but we will get compensated from some other baskets. That's what we are looking at.
Understood, sir. Thank you so much, sir, and thanks.
Thank you, Amit.
Thank you, sir. The next question is from the line of Shiwani from Monarch Networth Capital Limited. Please go ahead.
Thank you for the opportunity. Am I on the list?
Yes, Shiwani.
Yes, ma'am.
Yeah.
Hi. Most of my question is already taken up, but a quick one. One is that we've already talked about bioenergy and engineering, but can you briefly tell us then for what we are doing in the value-added area when we can see revenue realization kicking in? That's my first question. The second question is on diesel ethanol blending. Although we have been hearing about it for a long time, what is the scenario on the ground if you can give us some sense?
Sure. Thanks, Shiwani, for the question. The first one is on the value-added products or co-products, as we call them. What we are trying to do here as a technology company is to see an existing asset and to get more and more out of that asset. Therefore, we have add-on modules to an existing plant. For example, if you have a corn-based ethanol plant, we can provide what is called a distillers corn oil module, DCO, as we call it. Therefore, the producer can get an extra income by producing that distillers corn oil, which then gets into various applications, one of them being the input for biodiesel. Right? There is also something called rice protein.
If you have an ethanol plant that is working on rice as a feedstock, then we are able to extract a good quantity of protein from that, which is human edible and also something which is very beneficial. There are multiple such add-ons that we are working on, which will help the existing assets and get more return from those assets. That's the first part of your question.
[crosstalk]
The second part. If I can intervene, can you also talk about the bio-bitumen and bioplastics bit because we have been doing KPIs for that? When can we see the revenue realization coming in for that? I understand most of it is also in the R&D phase, but some visibility or some commentary on that?
Sure, Shivani. For bio-bitumen, bio-bitumen comes from our CBG plants right now. This is a unique offering that Praj is developing where we are able to give a combined offering of production of CBG as well as bio-bitumen, which enhances the return on investments and also reduces the payback period for the CBG plant investors. This is something that we want to give to our customers as a differentiator from Praj. That also is a value-added product, the bio-bitumen. Its use, as you know, is in the highways and the road building. We can blend up to 10% - 15% of bio-bitumen into the calcium-based bitumen. That also helps in reducing the intake of bitumen in India. It is a good product. It's a good offering, and we would like to promote it more as we go forward.
Bioplastics also, it was a developing technology in the past, but now we have a collaboration with Uday, who is a part of the Cliffton Group company. With that collaboration between Praj and Cliffton Group, we are able to give a complete room-to-range facility for what we call as PLA, which stands for polylactic acid. This is a polymer, which is a bioplastic, which is biodegradable. It can be industrially, you know, sort of degraded or composted if possible. That is available right now as a technology. We are mentioning firm offers to some of the customers as we speak. We are hoping that this is a market that will develop going forward.
Thank you. On the next question, on diesel ethanol blending.
On the diesel blending and update you wanted. Yes, we also believe, just like in the case of gasoline or petrol, we are able to blend alcohol. That is a very successful program in India, as you know. It is a company called Bharat Petroleum Corporation Limited. We believe that diesel can also have a similar blending mandate. We can blend alcohol into diesel. As you know, the diesel usage in India is two and a half to three times more compared to petrol. That's another pathway for other types of technology, which produces alcohol that can use a blending into the diesel. This is a drop-in fuel, as we call it. There is no necessity to do anything with it. It just blends into the diesel, and therefore, it can be used without any problems in the diesel engine.
The other thing I would like to mention here is, while EVs can be popular, electric vehicles, they are for short distances. The diesel engines, which are used to instruct for long-distance freight, you don't have a very good alternative for as EV. Therefore, blending such as what I'm talking about, the alcohol blending in diesel, can be really helpful for our nation to reduce pollution as well as to find an alternative to the fossil diesel.
Thank you so much, sir. All the best.
Thank you, ma'am. Our next question is from the line of Vikram Suryavanshi from Philips Capital India. Please go ahead.
Good afternoon, sir. Just wanted to check on this multiple disparity opportunities for other companies, given their pricing rates have come down. How is that standing up? Should I ask another question?
Yeah, you can go ahead, Vikram. You can ask your second question.
Okay. In terms of opportunities with the new raw materials which are evolving, how is that coming from the bamboo as an opportunity? Will it be scalable? How much time will it take to extend at this? I think these are the two questions.
On the first question, the states across India are stepping up the support for the bioenergy sector, as you know. You've seen that in Maharashtra, there's a new biofuel and bioenergy policy that is expected to attract approximately INR 20,000 crore over the next five years. There is an incentive being given with this policy here. The state is offering incentives such as capital subsidies, interest subvention, 100% USD refund as far as the state's USD is concerned, and those are on electricity and stamp duty as well. Cooperative mills will also benefit from this equity support.
With provisions for the PPP and the BOOT model, the build, own, operate, and transfer model, this will encourage some private investments to what we are expecting right now. Does that answer your question? Yes. Can you highlight further on this multi-free dictionary CapEx for the sugar companies, how it is setting up.
Vikram, just to answer that question, people are looking at it. They are very, what I can say, very much interested into it. We have not yet seen a very meaningful kind of an order booking building out of that. That opportunity is definitely finding some kind of an attraction for the sugar mill for having that additional, what I can say, line for grain too. We are actually discussing with our state of customers. We are holding the seminars and educating them to let them know what benefits they can derive by having this additional line. It's right now more of a development kind of a stage as to yet to result into some kind of a concrete numbers for us.
Okay. Understood. Another question was on how is opportunity coming on the bamboo.
May we request you?
Sorry. Yeah. Sorry, Vikram. Your question was related to bamboo. Yes, right now, everyone is talking about it, that we can use the, what I can say, the excess land which is available for cultivating bamboo for converting it into ethanol. Actually, at the moment, we'd like to see how this moment catches up and how the development can happen. I can just assure you from the Praj point of view that from a technology side, yes, we are ready to offer those kinds of solutions. We will see how the opportunity develops under this segment.
Got it. Just one clarification I made. Should I go ahead?
Yeah, go ahead, Vikram. Go ahead.
Okay. Thank you. This diesel blending, what you are talking about, we are primarily looking as an opportunity with ethanol with a binder or isobutene?
Yeah, I think it's a good question, Vikram. Thanks for asking. We believe that with a binder, etc., it could get even more complicated. Given a choice, we would say that we should have a material that is easy to blend and is a drop-in fuel, as we call it, and that is isobutene at this point in time. We are doing some experiments with different agencies who can certify it. The test results are really encouraging, but more we will share with you as we go forward.
Thanks for clarification. Thank you, sir, and all the best.
Thank you .
Thank you all.
The next question is from the line of Ramesh from Nirmal Bang Equities. Please go ahead.
Good morning and thank you very much. When you mentioned about advanced technology being a profit generator, can you mention some indication of what would be the scale of profit you can do over the next one or two years or what percentage of your earnings will come from that? Because your turnover may not improve much. Can you give us some sense on that?
Sure. I think what Pramod already covered in the previous answers was that while the current quarter looks extremely challenging, the one that you see the numbers for, our aim is to go for high single-digit EBITDA percentages. I think that is what we are working on. There is much more action behind it, but if we are to just look at what is it that we are going towards, it is that single-digit high ppercen of EBITDA. That's where we are aiming for.
We understand that, but when you mentioned advanced technology, you said it will add to the bottom line. It will be difficult for us to estimate EBITDA. If you can't get a sense from the top range, you can give the broad indication of what would be the bottom line you can expect in value or percentage of your earnings for one or two years after you go forward. It will be difficult to give an exact percentage, but like I said, it is the high single-digit percentages of EBITDA that we are looking at. Okay.
In terms of your order details which you have given in terms of the current order book and order inflow, what is the kind of order book and order inflow which you would expect to see by the end of FY2026, assuming some progress in the execution of the orders over the next three quarters?
Ramesh, we generally don't give any kind of a specific guidance. We basically tell you the scenario, how it is building up, and how we are working on that. Unfortunately, we don't give a number saying that, "Oh, we will do X crores of rupees on order book and Y crores of rupees on EBITDA." Extremely sorry. We don't have a policy of giving that kind of a guidance. Please excuse us on that.
The only reason I asked is you see the last three years' financials kind of, you know, being flat compared to the growth you saw in FY2023. Structurally, you know, I know you're going through some challenges. When do you actually see the growth momentum recur in terms of all the three segments? If you see some additional traction in the high-purity chemical segments, where there is an increase in the share of your overall, you know, order inflow, where do you see at what point in time can we expect, you know, some kind of growth momentum to come back?
Okay. Ramesh, your question is valid. Let me just tell you why we came out with 2030 kind of a vision picture in the most 2020 space. Seven years' kind of a gap issue we're looking at from 2023 to 2030. That was mainly based on what kind of qualitative changes or the structural shifts which we are going to see in our businesses. Initially, we were only looking at ethanol and ethanol, and we said that, "No, it's not going to be ethanol, but there will be something more which is going to happen over a period of time." As Ashish mentioned earlier, we are absolutely intact with those kind of targeted numbers for us for 2030.
Completion means since here and there because the business models are also going to undergo a complete change over a period of time depending on how the market is going to react to our offerings. Having said that, the growth not necessarily is going to be in a linear form. It will have its own challenges, and exactly those challenges we are seeing at this point of time. We are confident that we will be able to add on to other avenues of growth, irrespective of all these current changes which we are seeing at this point of time. We are aware about those challenges. We are working on that. We will see that these growth vectors come into the picture, the way in which we had already said.
That's what I can say at this point of time, Ramesh, instead of giving you some kind of numbers kind of a thing, how the entire game is going to get played out or its hypotheses.
Yeah, I appreciate it and wish you all the best. Thank you very much.
Thank you very much, Ramesh.
Thank you, sir. The next question is from the line of Shailesh Kanani from Centrum Broking. Please go ahead.
Good afternoon, everyone, and thanks for the opportunity. Is my voice audible?
Yes, sir.
Yeah, just one clarification. This is the first time where we are saying that it may happen that EVP program would not get extended beyond 20% price. We are talking about services or product announcements, product plant announcements. Is there any pushback from the government side?
Yeah, very fairly. We are not saying that there is no movement. We are saying that through extreme scenarios, one extreme scenario, no movement at all. It is from the planning point of view. It is not from the policy point of view. We don't know whether there is definitive talk which is going on for improving the blending mandates. Whether it is going to happen today or tomorrow and whether it is going to happen X% or Y%, we don't know. We are saying that we have a plan B ready for if blending mandates doesn't happen. That's what we were saying. We were not commenting on whether there is an increase in blending or not.
Okay. Just want to verify.
That is the first time I was hearing something on that front because in the past, correct me if I'm wrong, our earliest commentary has been that the blending would not end at 20% and there is a rollback already as well. That means, Rinir, that there is no change in that.
No, there is no change in that year .
Okay, that's comforting. The second part, on the Bangalore facility. There has been some delay for the last few quarters. We have been discussing for various reasons, right? Some of them are uncontrollable. I just wanted to know from the management side, what are the controllables in the sense that how we can kind of control over it over there or any other measures, any other levers that we have, apart from what you mentioned in terms of exploring new products and geographies?
Yeah, that's a fair question, Sesh. Yes, of course, there are some controllables that we need to relook at. We will relook at, or first of all, we will have a relook at our order pipelines, right? Because some of these orders are there. We have made proposals. Sachin talked about having a curve worth of proposals still in the play. Maybe some of these will get on hold or they will get delayed. We have to analyze that pipeline. We will have to look at our cost structure and we will have to see where we can perceive to be controllable. Accordingly, we will try to readjust ourselves as far as our Zenith business is concerned. That's the process that is going on right now. I will not be able to comment on that right away because that exercise is not yet completely done.
The tariff scenario is just evolving. As Sachin mentioned, depending on what happens during August, we will be in a better position to talk about it in our next conversation.
Fair enough. Just to clarify from that side, when you say thousand crores of firm orders, that means we have that order, we are L1, what does it imply?
No, no, I said thousand curves of pipeline, which means the request for quotations has come to us. We've made proposals to our customers who have certified our facility. Now they will be evaluating different bids, including project bids, and there will be a success out of that. Some projects, because they were oriented towards energy transition and climate action type of projects, may get sold out or may get delayed.
Fair enough. Just last question from my side. Any compressed biogas orders we have bagged during the quarter or are we L1 for anything? How is the industry position in terms of meeting the blending target packaging next year?
the compressed biogas (CBG), if we are selected or L1 but not yet announced, I will not be able to comment on that because, as you can appreciate, I will not be able to dive. We have not booked any firm orders in the past quarter that we are talking about as far as CBG business is concerned.
What are your other questions? Sorry, I forgot.
How is the industry in terms of capacity to meet the blending benefits you are getting from January 2026?
Yeah, I think you're talking about compressed biogas blending?
Yeah, yeah, compressed biogas blending.
Yeah, I think the industry is hoping that it will go in that step-wise approach of 1% - 5% in the steps of 1% each year. The industry is getting yield off for it, both in terms of infrastructure as well as the plant. We are also aligned here.
My question was, is the pipeline kind of robust? Is the pipeline building up or is there?
The pipeline is building. I think a short answer to your question would be yes, the pipeline is building up and it is looking good.
Okay, thanks for your time and best of luck.
Thank you. I appreciate it.
The next question is from the line of Aditya Mongia from Kotak Securities. Please go ahead.
Thank you for the opportunity. I hope I'm not too long.
Yes, yes, sir.
Thank you. I think two parts to the first question. Both the E20 program, and then our pickup from there, on what issues is it getting stuck? Partly of this question more links to the compressed biogas kind of process. Between certain customers, we are clear getting orders most likely at higher pricing, slightly crossing an area which would also be otherwise fairly decent for the developer and such. In that case, compressed biogas is stuck. Two things which are stuck for now and what aspects are just stuck from a developer's perspective?
Okay, I'll try to address that, Aditya. Thanks for your question. The first one of them, E20, and what is coming in the way? That was your question, right?
Yes, expand it from that number. Is it a feedstock issue? Is it a mileage issue? Where is it? Is that the point in the discussion with the government?
No, I think maybe I need to recalibrate this. There is no problem with E20, which is 20% blending into gasoline or petrol, right? There is no problem there. In fact, India achieved this target.
We're ahead of the talking about one. I'm talking about the further targets than 20.
As far as we are concerned, and we are going by the science experiment and everything else that we have the data for, there is no technical or any other problem as far as the higher blending of another 7% - 10% that can be added. In fact, the vehicle and the engines that they come up with nowadays are able to take that fuel, which is the blended fuel, up to 30% of ethanol. That's what is my information. There is no technical challenge at all. It's a question of how the policy comes out and how the additional blending mandates are announced by the government.
Thanks.
Yeah, that was the other point that you asked, sorry. Feedstock may also not be a concern because, you know, there is enough feedstock both in terms of grain as well as extra fuel that will be available to make the ethanol, enough ethanol to meet those mandates.
On the compressed biogas front, as in otherwise good for developers, a 20% CNG sales are export for the biomaterial, they need support inside and should the scale-up not happen and say for the sector itself?
I think the scale-up earlier was not happening, possibly because, you know, many of the plants took time to reach their 100% capacity for which they were designed. There is a fair bit of success on that. As I can speak for Praj, and like I said, FredMud plants have already reached and exceeded the capacities for what the plant was designed for. We believe that for other feedstocks, the plants are yet to come, like NatureGraph, there is, you know, no plant yet in the commission. I will not be able to comment this for gold. We at Praj are confident that we would be able to deliver those capacities. The biometry impact, that was the second part of your question. We believe that the ROI and the payback period will be even better when we combine the CBG and the biometry together.
That's what is a unique offering from Praj.
Understood. I think the second question from my side, over here, I think somewhere there was a comment made on profitability, meaning shipping and soldiering in the second half of the year. Any specific assumptions and certain software that are being taken when that kind of prognosis is being thought about at this point in time?
Sure. Aditya, the second half, we are seeing that the existing orders, which are taking some time in the execution cycle, will continue to come into the execution period in early June. The execution will start happening on that. Some of the orders from the international market, which we received in the March quarter and this quarter, will actually start to have a full-fledged execution from the second half of this year. These are the basic assumptions which we are considering from the improvement in profitability point of view. Of course, there are other factors, but these are the two major ones which I am right now highlighting because we are looking at, in some pockets, some order booking to happen. We are executing some designing orders for our customers. Those will start giving the numbers from the bottom line point of view.
There are many factors which are going to start contributing from H2 onwards.
Thank you all .
Thank you, Aditya.
Thank you, sir. Ladies and gentlemen, due to interest of time, that was the last question for today. I now hand the conference over to management from Praj Industries Limited for closing comments. Over to you, sir.
Yes, thank you again for your time today. I'm sure there are many more questions, but I request you to write us at info@praj.net, and we will assess your questions. Thanks again for your time, and we look forward to interacting with you very soon. Thank you.
Thank you, sir. On behalf of Praj Industries Limited, that concludes this conference call. Thank you for joining us, and you may now disconnect your lines.