Good evening, and welcome everyone to this earnings call post announcement of Q2 and H1 FY 2025 results of VA Tech Wabag Limited. On the call today from the management team, we have Mr. Rajiv Mittal, Chairman and Managing Director, and Mr. Skanda Seetharaman, Group Chief Financial Officer. Kindly note that during this call, the company may make certain forward-looking statements concerning the business prospects and profitability, which may subject to risks and uncertainties, and the actual results could materially differ from those in such forward-looking statements. The conference call will be archived, and the transcript will be made available on the company's website. The company's results update presentation has been uploaded on the website and stock exchanges, which provides an overview about the core offerings and analysis of the results for this period. We trust that you had an opportunity to look through the same.
We will start with the opening remarks from the management, post which we will open up for the interactive Q&A. I now hand it over to Mr. Mittal to take you through the key business highlights. Over to you, Mr. Mittal.
Thank you. Good evening, ladies and gentlemen. We extend a warm welcome to you all to the earning call post announcement of Q2 H1 FY 2025 results of VA Tech Wabag Limited. Joining me today for this earnings call is Mr. Skanda Seetharaman, our Group CFO. We closed another strong quarter of earnings, continuing our growth trajectory. We stayed on course in our profitable growth journey while remaining steadfast to the cornerstones of our long-term strategy: advanced technology projects, emerging market focus, net cash positive position, and asset-light approach. This quarter marked a number of significant milestones from an order inflow perspective. Recently, we secured a prestigious 300 MLD Sea Water Desalination plant in Yanbu, Kingdom of Saudi Arabia from Saudi Water Authority, worth INR 2,700 crore.
Saudi Water Authority, formerly known as Saline Water Conversion Corporation, SWCC, manages over 15 million cubic meters of water, mainly in 40 desalination plants, and also some ground and surface water purification stations. The plant will employ state-of-the-art technologies and will be engineered for exceptional water quality and power efficiency. Scheduled for completion within 30 months period, this project commences our relationship as a reliable water partner for Saudi Water Authority. Wabag has also secured a mega order value of INR 1,000 crore from Indosol Solar for 100 MLD sea water desalination plant, marking our entry into the solar PV sector. This project will provide water security for the 10-GW integrated solar PV manufacturing facility of Indosol. The EP project, which is to be delivered over 38 months, will be followed by 15 years of operation and maintenance.
Further, reflecting our enduring client relationship, we secured a large repeat order from Reliance Industries to deliver water system for their Dahej and Nagothane facility, and also a repeat order from Chennai Metropolitan Water Supply and Sewerage Board worth INR 415 crore to operate and maintain the Nemili desalination plant, which was built and commissioned by Wabag in 2013 for a further period of seven years, reaffirming the trust and confidence our client place in Wabag's reliable performance and expertise. Looking ahead, we are further enhancing our presence and efforts in the emerging markets like Middle East, Africa, Indian subcontinent, Southeast Asia, and CIS countries. With promising order pipeline, we are confident in sustaining our growth momentum through the second half of the financial year and in line with our medium-term outlook.
Our focused business development efforts are yielding remarkable results, as demonstrated by the order inflow of over INR 4,600 crore secured in H1, with 57% coming from international clients and 31% coming from industrial sector. You would recall that we had informed our preferred bidder status in projects worth INR 6,000 crore, and you can see that we have already converted more than 75% of the same. As we speak today, we are happy to inform you that we are preferred bidder in the orders worth over INR 3,500 crore, which we expect to convert through the next couple of months. With over INR 8,000 crore order inflow outlook already in sight for this financial year, we are on track to reach an order book position of over INR 16,000 crore by the end of this fiscal year.
Our order book position, which stands today at over INR 14,500 crore as of H1 with a healthy mix of 59% EPC projects and 41% O&M projects, provides a robust revenue and growth visibility. I would also like to share some updates on our key projects. Our prestigious 400 MLD Perur desalination project in Chennai, funded by Japan International Cooperation Agency, is on track with peak engineering activities underway, civil works progressing well, marine intake and outfall pipe material are received at site, and equipment deliveries will commence from H2 this year. Our 200 MLD Sewage Treatment plant in Pagla, Bangladesh, where we had a couple of months of temporary disruption, is largely back on track with construction activities resuming swiftly. Procurement activities are also progressing well. Projects like Cebu and Senegal, where deliveries are largely complete, have entered the installation and commissioning phase and are on target.
I am also happy to inform that Kolkata HAM project, our first HAM contract with National Mission for Clean Ganga, has achieved COD, commercial operation date has started. As we advance our mission to shape the future of sustainable water solutions, we are also taking a moment to honor the journey that has brought us here. This year, Wabag reached its centenary year, and we commenced the celebration of this landmark milestone with a grand event in Vienna in August, honoring a century of innovation, leadership and sustainability in water sector. Continuing this centennial festivities, we hosted our key customers, business partners, bankers, and other stakeholders across the Middle East with a vibrant celebration in September in Riyadh, Kingdom of Saudi Arabia. As we look into the future, Wabag remains committed to building on this 100-year legacy, combining innovative technology with resilient strategy to drive growth across emerging markets.
Thank you once again for your continued support and confidence in Wabag. Now, I will hand it over to Skanda to take us through the financial highlights. Over to you, Skanda.
Thank you, Mr. Mittal. Good evening, everyone. I hope you have had a chance to review our results update presentation, which has been shared on our website and with the stock exchanges. Let me walk you through our performance highlights for the half year and quarter ended 30th September 2024. Before I move into the numbers, I am pleased to note that we continue our profitable growth journey into this half year as well, with our EBITDA and PAT growing at a rate faster than the top line, as envisaged in our long-term strategy. With a strong order book position as of H1 and a robust pipeline visibility, we are confident of revenue and profit expansion to continue along with a net cash positive position as we step into the second half of this fiscal year. Now, let me take you through the key financial highlights.
Our consolidated H1 revenue, which stood at INR 1,327 crore, grew 11% year-over-year compared on like-to-like basis, excluding divested European entities. The strong order book position provides us a good visibility of revenue expansion. Our standalone revenue for H1 stood at INR 1,159 crore. For the quarter, revenue on consolidated and standalone basis stood at INR 700 crore and INR 613 crore respectively. Our consolidated EBITDA for H1, which stood at INR 184 crore, grew by around 19% year-over-year compared on like-to-like basis, excluding divested European entities. We continue to maintain EBITDA margin in line with our medium-term outlook. These strong margins reflect our focus on efficient execution, a good mix of EP, industrial, and international projects, as well as a growing share of revenues from O&M. Standalone EBITDA for H1 stood at INR 171 crore.
For the quarter, EBITDA on consolidated and standalone basis stood at INR 103 crore and INR 92 crore respectively. Our consolidated PAT for H1, which stood at INR 126 crore with a PAT margin of 9.5%, grew by around 31% year-over-year compared on like-to-like basis, excluding divested European entities. Standalone PAT for H1 stood at INR 108 crore. For the quarter, PAT on consolidated and standalone basis stood at INR 71 crore and INR 58 crore respectively. As you would know, we have been a net cash positive group for the last four years consecutively. Notably, this quarter marks the seventh consecutive quarter that we have maintained a net cash positive position driven by disciplined cash and debt management. As of H1, our net cash position stands at INR 222 crore.
Excluding debt on HAM entities, which is transitory in nature considering our asset-light strategy, our net cash position stood at INR 338 crore. We closed H1 with a gross cash position of INR 645 crore, which consisted of INR 294 crore in cash and bank balances and INR 351 crore in term deposits. We are well-placed on the cash front to infuse funds into projects to expedite necessary progress. We are also in the process of enhancing our bank lines, both from Indian and international banks, to be ready with the non-fund limits to support the next wave of order book growth. We remained steadfast to our asset-light model, delivering a return on capital employed, ROCE, of around 18%. We continue to create long-term shareholder value, generating a return on equity, ROE, of over 14.5%.
Turning to the order book front, our international business remained robust with 54% of H1 revenue delivered by overseas projects and international projects constituting 39% of our order backlog. We continue to build our O&M business with 41% of our order backlog coming from long-term O&M projects. Our order book remains robust at over INR 14,500 crore as of H1, with a healthy mix of EP, EPC, and O&M projects backed by adequate payment securities. We will continue our emerging market focus on advanced technology projects, particularly in desalination, recycle and reuse, and effluent treatment. We have also identified future growth opportunities in ultrapure water for semiconductor manufacturing, solar PV, and green hydrogen, and also generating clean fuel from biogas, which will propel the group through its next growth wave.
Business development efforts are being invested on these opportunities and already the first success is witnessed through the desalination order for Indosol Solar. These opportunities are perfectly in our sweet spot of contributing to creating a greener, cleaner, and bluer planet. We are deeply grateful for the trust and support reposed in us by our bankers, investors, Wabagites, and all stakeholders who continue to champion our vision. With this, we will be pleased to open the floor for questions. Thank you.
Thank you very much. We will now begin the question and answer session. Anyone who wishes to ask a question may press star and one on the touchtone telephone. If you wish to remove yourself from the question queue, you may press star and two. Participants are requested to limit the questions to two per participant. If you have a follow-up question, you may rejoin the queue. To use answers while asking a question, ladies and gentlemen, we will wait for a moment while the question queue assembles. The first question is from the line of Nidhi Shah from ICICI Securities. Please go ahead.
Hi, thank you so much for taking my question. First of all, I'd like to congratulate you on the excellent order inflow that we've seen this quarter. I had a couple of questions on the new projects that we have won. Firstly, the Indosol plant, this 100 MLD is for the entire 10-GW line that we're putting or is it only partial and we can expect more orders from this plant?
This is for the complete line. This will be implemented in about four or five phases as they keep on investing towards that. That's the reason the timeframe we mentioned will be over 38 months. After we have built this plant for the full 100 MLD, then our O&M period of 15 years starts.
All right. On the Saudi Arabia order that we received recently, basically in the order that we have received there, what is the timeline for execution of that order?
As I mentioned in my speech earlier, it's about 30 months.
The 30 months, do we see that there will be, say, execution in equal parts, say, in six or 10-month blocks, or do we see that execution is heavier towards the second half?
It's never projects of this magnitude, and if you have been following the company over the years, the first part, which is 15%-20% of the time, it's normally for engineering it.
Correct.
During that time, the numbers you see, the invoicing you see will not be proportionate. Then the phase comes up about 50%-60% of the project time, where things pick up, the construction, the supplies and everything. Then again, towards the end, 15%-20% of the time, it's the installation and commissioning phase. Again, it will slow down. So it is like a slow start, picking up, and again slow end.
All right. Also the company that we have received this order from-
May I request you to please limit your questions to two?
Sure. I will do that.
Thank you. We will move to the next question, which is from the line of Mahesh M., an individual investor. Please go ahead.
Thank you. Am I audible?
Yes, you are.
Yes. First of all, congratulations for the orders won in this quarter and the visibility of the great order book that we have in FY 2025. I have noticed that we have been winning orders. The order book has always been multifold. It was around INR 9,000 crore in FY 2022. It has crossed INR 15,000 crore now. But the execution has remained the same, close to a bit less than INR 3,000 crore every year. I just wanted to know the reason why the execution pace hasn't increased the same as the order book, and what are we doing to increase the execution pace, and what could be the revenues in the coming years?
Very good question, and it's for all our listeners here. I'm sure the question you have is very valid for many of our other friends. As I said to the earlier participant, that whenever we get an order, as it is a design, construct, and operation and maintenance, almost half of our order book is because of operation and maintenance, which can only start generating revenues after we finish the construction and commissioning of the plant. Generally, it takes anything between three and a half years to complete the construction and commissioning of the plant. So now we talk about the rest of the half of the order book or new orders even we get.
The first 20% odd of the time, as I said, will take to set up the project, to do the site investigation, to do the design, get the designs approved, then start ordering, and then start doing the civil construction physically at site. So that is the reason you will see a little lag in the initial phases for any orders to pick up. But post that initial 20%, 25% of the time, it picks up exponentially. That goes on for the 50%- 60% of the time when construction is happening, equipments are getting delivered. Then again, towards the last 20% odd , when installation and commissioning are happening, again, the revenue is going to come down.
This is the nature of the business we are in, and you will see that some of the large projects which we got almost a year back have finished that initial 20% period. Now it is picking up because the construction, as I said in my speech, was in full swing, say, in Perur, in Chennai. The ordering has started. The orders will start getting delivered in the H2. Naturally we'll see the revenues picking up from the orders which we booked over the last one year. The orders which we have booked in this quarter, maybe it will take another two quarters to start generating appreciable revenues.
Thank you for this clarification. What kind of revenue visibility do we see in the next two years, considering the backlog of the orders we already, or we are going to execute in the next few quarters, and then we start the maintenance for the same?
This, we have discussed with all of you when we had a physical meeting in Mumbai after our annual results in the month of May and earlier this year. We had given a clear medium-term outlook. That we said that we are very bullish on not only our order intake but also the revenue growth. We had given a number of 15%-20% CAGR for a medium-term, which is three to five years. This is the number we expect the top line to grow.
All right. Thank you very much for the answers. That's all on my side.
Thank you.
Thank you. The next question is from the line of Aejas Lakhani from Unifi Capital. Please go ahead.
Yeah. Congratulations team on the order. Mittal sir, I had two queries. First one being that if I take your revenue guidance of 15%-20% for the year, that effectively means that the second half delivery of about INR 2,000 crore in the second half. Could you specifically talk about your projects? You had mentioned in the last quarter, for example, of how two projects were coming on stream, where you were executing. Similarly, could you just sort of call out which projects are coming on stream, or revenues of which you will book in the second half?
I think, earlier I said, and to just before you, the participant, I mentioned that the biggest project we have today in our order book is Chennai Desal project. That will start now peaking. For the next four quarters, we will see this project really peaking, because that is where next four to six quarters you will see lot of construction happening. Luckily, the monsoon is out of our way. Peaking will start. The marine work where we have to go offshore, that should start early next year. Our equipments will start getting delivered from next quarter onwards. A lot of this will happen. Same will happen with our Pagla project in Bangladesh. It would have started a few months earlier because of the reasons known to all of us. Couple of months, there was disturbance and the work has to slow down, but luckily everything is settled.
We are back on the track. Our people are back on site. Work is happening. Reliance projects, which we recently won, Reliance projects are always on fast track. We will see good revenues coming in. Indosol, at least the first phase, we have a very challenging timeline to do the first phase and give them some water. So that will start peaking, at least a part of that project. This, we are very hopeful and very rightly said that we expect it to close to INR 2,000 crore of revenues.
Got it, sir. That was very helpful. Sir, we had three HAM projects and congratulations on COD of one of the Kolkata project. Could you just call out now? We had debt against all the three HAM projects. Has the Kolkata project debt that we had invested, have we plowed it back? That's point number one. What is the stage of the other two HAM projects, and when do you expect COD and when do you expect the release of our funds there?
Aejas, I think first to clarify, of the three HAM projects, two have been already divested. There is no HAM debt on our books. Number two, the way that the concession agreement works here is that we can plow our cash out only at COD plus three years. So we have already invested only a small amount. We have explained it earlier also. Our strategy is that we take minority economic interest, and we are there only to put our skin in the game. Maybe 3%, 4% of the project value is the maximum we invest. This amount is also plowed back at COD plus three years. Let's say, our remit in the project or our interest in this project is only because we get the EPC and O&M them. We are a technical partner and there is a financial partner who holds majority.
Even in this case, we have reached COD and the financial partner has an option to buy us out at COD plus three. This is the same case for the other two HAM projects. Out of the three projects, two are divested. There is no HAM debt. The third project also we will look to divest very soon. The first project has achieved COD, Kolkata. The second project, Digha and Kankarbagh, and the third project is Ghaziabad. Ghaziabad is largely complete in terms of the project activities. Digha also is in a very advanced stage of completion. So we would expect also to complete these projects in H2, more expected in H2. So our interest would be that all these projects are completed within this year, Aejas. So that then we have three years of stabilization and we will pay back our capital.
Got it, Skanda. Thanks. Just a follow-up. So the INR 117 crore of debt today is against Kolkata or all the three?
Only Ghaziabad is consolidated today, and that also once divested will go out. That is why I mentioned in my speech, Aejas, that the debt is excluded since it is transitory in nature. Our core business has close to an INR 340 crore net cash position.
Got it. Thanks so much and all the best.
Thank you.
Thank you. The next question is from the line of Mihir Dhami from Sharekhan. Please go ahead.
Sorry. Thanks for the opportunity. I had a few questions on financial line items. The employee expenses has increased this quarter from the previous quarter, and other expenses has gone down. Sir, particularly, what was the reason for this?
I think the reason, as we are informed to the stock exchange a few months back, this is our centenary year, and the Board had approved an ESOP scheme for our employees for motivating and retaining them. A part of this increase, what we are seeing, is because of the provision as per the rules we have to provide for the ESOPs, which we have granted to our employees.
Okay. So they have been offering these, right? The employee schemes.
Also, I think some of the other expenses which you are seeing is reduced, is also because of the three European subsidiaries which we have divested. So some of the cost of those subsidiaries you are not seeing in this quarter.
Okay. On the working capital side, the payables have reduced this quarter because of some payments which are made. Do you see your payable days continuing at this number? Also, if you can give some guidance on the receivable days as well. Would they remain at a similar number going forward?
See, Mihir, usually H1 versus H2, if you see, H2 is the more stronger quarter. H1 is more in terms of putting in cash into the projects, expediting it, because you have the monsoon, you are just off the budget. So there is requirement of working capital investment. In any case, our payables have remained on track. We have been very timely in paying our vendors, because we know that is going to expedite the progress, number one. Number two, you would see that this will also pay off into the H2 when monsoons are done, deliveries of some of the projects which Mr. Mittal also mentioned will start. Construction can run at good pace. So this is a cycle. H1 versus H2, 40/60, 35/65, the usual mix of revenues. We have more pumping of cash in H1 and more recovery of cash in H2.
So I think what you should also see here is despite this trend, we have, even in H1, maintained a net cash position. We had about INR 340 crore, if you see, in March, excluding AM. In September also, we have a similar number. So we have also managed our cash well. We have also improved the collection cycle. You would also see that the trade receivables have come down by 5%, despite our revenues growing by 10%. So the cash cycle is improving. The vendors are being funded for expedited progress, and you would see that H2 revenue expansion will also start as a result of this.
Okay. Thanks for that. It's all from my side. Thank you.
Thank you, Mihir.
Thank you. The next question is from the line of Chirag Khasgiwala from Neo Asset Management. Please go ahead.
Yeah. Hi. As you just explained regarding the working capital position, if you look at your operating cash flow, that has continued to remain in negative territory. Given all the working capital investment that you are talking about, is there any roadmap to bring this operating cash flow into positive territory, or it will continue to remain in negative?
See, I think history is testament of what we deliver. You have seen in the last years, we have generated free cash. Last three, four years, you can check, even the recent history. We have generated free cash. We have generated operating cash. I have explained H1 versus H2. Usually, this is the case. Look at it at a full year basis. You will surely see that we will generate cash, number one. Number two, as I said, the vector trade receivables reduction, you are seeing cycles improving. H1, you have to invest cash. This is the nature of the business that contractors have to be paid to keep the project ongoing.
We have also still kept a net cash position. That means on an overall basis, we are doing well from the working capital front, considering the context. But yes, you should see it on an annual basis. You should also compare how historically we have done. We have generated free cash, and we will continue to generate because that is the core of our business.
For execution of the future projects, are you sufficiently funded or will you be required to go for fundraising?
We have 600 plus crore of cash, Chirag, and we have liquid cash in our bank, which will fund the projects. We have long-term deposits of INR 350 crore. I mentioned this in my speech, which we will use at appropriate time. We have INR 4,000 crore of bank lines. We have already applied for another INR 1,000 crore. We came to the shareholders for enhancement this AGM, and we have an enhanced limit of up to INR 6,000 crores. So there is enough and sufficient buffer for all the order book growth that we are envisaging. We do not need to raise any cash.
And lastly, sir, as you have been guiding that your revenue could grow by around 15%-20% CAGR over the next three to five years. But on a quarterly basis, if I look this last quarter, so its revenue growth has been just mid-single digits. So this quarterly variation will be there or is it something one-off?
I think we have explained enough this thing. We are not into a consumer business as a quarter-on-quarter company. That is the reason we have not even given an annual guideline or guidance. We have given a medium-term guidance for three to five years. So if you track the company that way, and as we said, that you will see the growth over the next two quarters and H2. You will see that we achieved this 15%, 20% number which we have given, and we expressed our confidence. Yes, we know we have to achieve INR 2,000 crore revenue in the next two quarters, and we're confident of it.
And just to supplement, Mr. Mittal, Chirag, you would have seen our investor presentation. You've seen in the last four years, our PAT has grown at a CAGR of 45%. We concentrate on profitable growth. Sales is a consequence, but profitable growth, cash growth is what we focus on, and that is what is our strategic value.
And also, we had mentioned earlier that our strategy is to move away from EPC to EP. So we may see a little subdued top line. In spite of that, we are still given an outlook of 15%, 20% growth. Because what we are as a technology company, we excel in advanced technology where we hold patents and trademarks for more than 125 products and processes. This is what we want to leverage and improve our margin and working capital, and we have demonstrated that in the last few years.
Okay, thank you.
Thank you. The next question is from the line of Jainam Jain from ICICI Securities. Please go ahead.
Thank you so much for taking my question. Sir, can you expect the margins to touch 15% in FY 2025?
Can you please repeat your question?
Yeah, sure. Can you expect the margins to touch 15% in FY 2025?
Sorry to interrupt you, Mr. Jainam, but your voice is not audible.
Okay, Rituja, I have got the question. Jainam, we have guided a 13%-15% EBITDA margin, and this is for the three to five-year period. We are confident and comfortable that we will be in this range.
Okay, sir. How is the Middle East market looking like in terms of orders?
Can you complain about this market? There is enough and more. It is so abundant that we are lucky to choose projects which are in our sweet spot.
This we had also mentioned, we were also lucky as India was going through general election, we expected a slowdown in India for two to three quarters, and we could shift some of our resources to this market. You can see the results, the resources which we shifted timely to the Middle East market is giving the necessary results what we expected to give. I think, of course, we were smart to shift it, but we were also thankful that the country was going through a general election.
Okay, sir. Sir, how does the margin profile look like in the new order that you received during this quarter that is pertaining to 300 MLD plant in Saudi?
We do not do a project-wise margin guidance. I think if you have been in the previous calls, we have always said that we pick projects only which meet our threshold margin requirements. We are in no desperation to pick projects for the sake of top line. We want advanced technology projects, we want good cash flow projects, we want projects to be in the emerging markets and with adequate payment securities, either backed by multilaterals, backed by bilateral funding, sovereign fund, or letters of credit. These are our criteria, and any project that we pick will meet a certain internal threshold margin. You have seen in the past years how our contribution margin and EBITDA have grown. This project will be no different.
Okay, well, that answers my question. Thank you so much.
Thank you.
Thank you. The next question is from the line of Dheeraj Ram from Ashika Institutional Equities. Please go ahead.
Hi, sir. Thank you for the opportunity. First of all, congratulations for the-
Mr. Dheeraj, may I request you to please speak a bit louder?
Can you hear me now?
Yes, please go ahead.
First of all, congratulations, sir, for the fantastic results. Just wanted to know, what is the amount of client retention money that is expected to be released in H2 FY 2025?
See, this is a cycle, Dheeraj. At least two, three projects, where we see retentions are there, should get liquidated. If it is okay, you can connect with the team to understand it a little better. I don't have a number off the cuff now, but our team can help you on this.
Got it, sir. One last question. Sir, are we facing any receivable delays from this particular Senegal project?
Not at all. This is again, a multilaterally funded project. This project, as soon as the work is certified by our client, our bills are sent to JICA, Tokyo, and the payments are received directly from JICA, Tokyo.
Got it, sir. Got it. Yes, sir. That's it. Thank you. All the best for the H2.
Thank you.
Thank you. The next question is from the line of Harshil Parekh from Acuitas Capital. Please go ahead.
Hi, sir. Thanks for the opportunity. My question was mainly related to our domestic execution. If I see this quarter, we de-grew by some 7%. Is it related to election-related execution issues, or there is anything specific that you would like to disclose?
Also, we have seen a trend. Our order intake has also moved more international. Naturally, the revenues will also come more international. This is obvious. There is no delay in India, and we have not seen delay because of election, because there were adequate budgets available. Whatever we have executed, we are getting paid as per our expectation.
My question was that the domestic revenues have de-grown by some 7% in Q2. I understand the international mix going up because of higher growth in international. My specific question was on the domestic revenues being de-grown.
Domestic revenues can only grow if our order backlog will also grow. Here, our order backlog has not grown to the same extent as international order backlog. Naturally, you will see the international revenue growth will be higher, and maybe the Indian de-growth will happen. As my colleague, Skanda, mentioned, this second quarter is always a little difficult quarter from two points of view. One, the construction activity has slowed down because the country is going through monsoon, where the construction gets slowed down. Second, also the budgets are getting approved towards April, May, and finally, they get implemented. The speed of that execution, because of budget, is also a little bit slower. Always in the second quarter, you will see this happening.
Harshil, just to supplement Mr. Mittal. He also kind of explained earlier. It is also the stage that the project is in. We are not a quarter-over-quarter company. We could have projects in procurement phase in the last year. They are maybe in the installation and commissioning phase this year. It depends on the mix of projects, and the phase in which the projects are. One is the international project mix, and second is also you have to see us more on an annual basis. Look at us more in a one to three year range, at least, instead of just looking at it quarter by quarter segmented so much.
Understood, sir. Thank you.
Thank you.
Thank you. The next question is from the line of Omkar Chitnis from Trade Brains Private Limited. Please go ahead.
Sir, my first question is, with operations spanning across multiple countries you have, how are you managing geopolitical risk that might impact present executions and profitability in the coming future? What are the regulatory challenges you are facing in different countries as of now?
As you know, Wabag has been a multinational company. For decades, we have been doing this business. Somehow we have mastered this art of managing this geopolitical risk. Simple, rather than giving too much detail into our business USPs like we do. Simple is we take the payment security. Like Skanda mentioned earlier, we take contracts where the payment guarantee is there. Like multilaterals, I told that some of this, it goes to Tokyo and JICA is paying directly. It is not coming through local governments. That is number one. Second, we take sovereign guarantees, like Saudi Arabia. It is directly government of Saudi Arabia who is placing these orders on us, and they will pay us directly. Thirdly, where we do not have both this available, we go for letters of credit. Plus, we always try to split the contracts to the extent possible between offshore and onshore.
We try to take a local currency for onshore activity, and we take in US dollar for offshore activities. That also protects us against currency risk, payment risk, and we have seen over the years that this strategy has fully worked for us and protected us against that. Where we find that there is some risk, the Indian government provides us with ECGC coverage for the projects, which protects us against both the commercial risk and the political risk. These are some of the instruments we use to mitigate this risk.
Okay, sir. My second question is, are you expecting any projects in energy generations, like in thermal or nuclear, from PSU companies in India over the upcoming financial years?
Are you asking us whether we would get into this?
Are you expecting any projects from PSU companies, sir?
From PSU companies.
Yes, in thermal and nuclear wastewater management.
Yeah. If you are talking about the PSU companies, yes, I think we see some traction starting on, again, thermal. Okay? And thermal plants need a tremendous amount of water. There is a clear guideline from Government of India and NITI Aayog that all these plants will have to use recycled water for their core plants from a sewage treatment plant, which is in a radius of, I think, 25 km or 50 km. Okay? So if they are going for expansion, they are not going to get fresh water. They are going to depend on recycled water. So naturally, these are all going to give us a tremendous business to provide them water, which is the core of our technology, recycle of water. So this is what we have done. If you see other oil and gas sector companies like Indian Oil Corporation Limited, companies like Mangalore Refinery and Petrochemicals Limited, they are investing in the growth.
As we speak, we are working for few projects in Indian Oil Corporation Limited, where they are putting up the additional capacities and additional lines. Same is with Mangalore Refinery and Petrochemicals Limited. They have gone for desalination plant to have a water security. So yes, we do work with PSUs and have successfully executed these jobs.
Okay, sir. Thanks, sir.
Thank you. The next question is from the line of Dhruv Joshi from Nuvama Wealth and Investment. Please go ahead.
Hello. Thank you for taking my question. I just had one query on the future prospects of the business that you are getting into. Primarily, we had tied up with the Peak Sustainability Ventures, where we are planning to establish about 100 CBG plants. Just wanted to understand when and how much can this contribute to our business.
It is not about, again, a topline. It is more about our commitment to sustainability, our commitment to climate change. These CBG plants are not which are going to give you a huge top line, because what we are trying to do, this is a value add for such plants, is getting this power or fuel, which is green, clean, and sustainable, rather than going for conventional thermal fuels. To reduce the greenhouse gases, to have a cleaner environment, that no smoke is there. That is where we are coming in as a sustainability company. I think these plants, we have started educating the clients to see that it is also win-win for them. There is in it something for them also, not only for us. I think that is working very well. There are at least four projects which have moved well.
I hope in the next few quarters, we will be able to announce a few orders based on this CBG technology that we have.
All right, sir. That's basically what I wanted to know. Thank you.
Thank you. The next question is from the line of Samarth Khandelwal from ICICI Securities. Please go ahead.
Hello. Yes. Thank you for taking my questions. Sir, most of my questions have already been answered, and you have answered them very patiently. Sir, I wanted to understand how ultrapure water would be different from the current desalination potted water that we are supplying.
See, ultrapure water is an ultrapure water. Now, obviously, there are industries which need ultrapure water is growing. Take an example of semiconductor. It is growing at a brisk pace. Take an example of PV. That is growing at a brisk pace. The new line of business, which is green hydrogen, which is again growing swiftly and very soon it will be economically viable. All this needs ultrapure water. What is ultrapure water? Ultrapure water is like a distilled water where you do not have salts, inorganic salts in the water. You remove those salts so that it does not result in scaling. Scaling of your cells, scaling of your electrodes, so that the life and efficiency of your plant goes up. That is our business. Like desalination. We have 40,000- 50,000 of salt in a seawater. We bring it down to 200- 300.
Now ultrapure water, we will have to bring that 200- 300 down to what is required by client. Some may insist for five, 10, 20. That is what we say is ultrapure water. We see a huge transaction in ultrapure water, UPW, as we call it short form. You will see in the next few years, this business will really pick up globally.
Okay, sir. That was very helpful. Thank you, sir, and all the very best.
Thank you. The next question is from the line of Kaushik Poddar from KD Capital Markets. Please go ahead.
This year, going by the figures you have supplied, it looks like you will be getting INR 8,000+ crore worth of orders. Can we have similar run rates for next few years?
Why not? As we are now in Middle East, we say God willing, why not?
Okay. In that case, your guided level of three times your turnover being order book, it will be exceeded by a substantial measure.
I think that is good, no?
Okay.
That we over-deliver than what we commit.
Can we take it that whatever the table you have given at the end of your presentation, these are the medium-term goals? That is the minimum we can expect?
I think we are not saying that, but I am sure you are smart enough to make your judgments.
Okay. Thank you. That is it.
Thank you. The next question is from the line of Vasant Bansal, an individual investor. Please go ahead.
Yeah, thank you for taking my question. When I see your segment results, I see that the margin on the rest of the world is increasing, whereas on the India operation, it is coming down. Last year, that is September 2023, the margin was around 24%, which now stands at around 14%. Can you give some color on it?
See, India is a mother company. There are a lot of corporate expenditures which are booked in India. Because we don't break up so much on India and international, because we are submitting our consolidated results. If the revenues of India are coming down, our overheads will not come down proportionally because some of the overheads are fixed. Okay? That should not be at all a concern area. Those overheads will remain. That doesn't necessarily mean the project margins are coming down.
Mm-hmm. Okay. Got it. Second question is, your billing in the Rest of the World is all in US dollar or they are in different currencies?
Some of them or most of them is US dollar, but some of the subsidiaries where we have in the Central and Western Europe like Austria and others, they do billing in euro.
Mm-hmm. Okay. How do you hedge your receivables?
Sorry?
How do you hedge your receivables? I mean, from foreign currency fluctuation point of view, how do you hedge your foreign currency receivables?
We do a lot of imports also, and also we borrow in foreign currency, packing credit foreign currency. So there is a natural hedge that is created, and hence we do not have too much that is left unhedged.
Okay.
A lot of hedging is done. I mean, it is a natural hedge. You do not need to typically hedge your receivables.
Okay. Thank you very much. That is all from my side.
Thank you. Participant who wishes to ask a question may press star and one. As there are no further questions, I would now like to hand the conference over to Mr. Mittal for closing comments.
Thank you, friends, for your active interaction. I thank you once again for your participation in our Q2 FY 2025 earnings call. We have uploaded the analyst presentation in our website. In case you have any further queries, you may get in touch directly with Adfactors PR Pvt. Ltd., our investor relations advisor based in Mumbai, or you can also get in touch with us directly. Thank you. Bye for now.
Thank you. On behalf of VA Tech Wabag, that concludes this conference. Thank you for joining us, and you may now disconnect your lines.