Wallenius Wilhelmsen ASA (OSL:WAWI)
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Sep 22, 2026, 4:29 PM CET
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Earnings Call: Q1 2021

May 11, 2021

Torbjørn Wist
CFO and Acting CEO, Wallenius Wilhelmsen

Good morning to everybody. On behalf of Wallenius Wilhelmsen , I would like to welcome you all to this webcast for our first quarter results. My name is Torbjørn Wist , and I am the CFO as well as acting CEO of the company. First, I would like to start off by covering the key highlights for the quarter. While the COVID-19 pandemic and its impact on the world economy is not over, demand in our core markets have more than returned since the first quarter of last year, and continues to develop along a positive underlying trend. From the beginning of this year, we have introduced three new reporting segments: Shipping Services, Logistics and Government Services. This is, of course, an effort to try to increase the transparency in terms of our underlying numbers and how the segments develop.

Our mission, as you know, is to provide sustainable logistics for a world in motion. In Q1, we established a science-based target to reduce the CO2 intensity by 27.5% by 2030, using 2019 as the base year. In addition, we introduced the Orcelle Wind, which will be the world's first full-scale wind-powered RoRo ship concept. The rising volumes that we have experienced across the global supply chains have, however, led to inefficiencies, tight capacity, parts shortage, and ramp-up costs for companies involved in manufacturing, logistics, and trade. For the Wallenius Wilhelmsen group, this has translated into higher costs for chartering fleet capacity, and higher fuel consumption as the fleet speed has increased alongside a growing number of port calls, as well as cost relating to reactivation of vessels in cold lay-up.

We ended the quarter with EBITDA of $132 million, which is flat year-over-year, but reduced since Q4 due to the higher fuel and ramp-up costs. Our liquidity position of $898 million remains comfortable, and is $180 million higher since the end of Q1 2020, which was the first quarter impacted by the pandemic. We firmly believe that what is good for the environment is also good for the business. With vehicle logistics as our core competence area, we will drive sustainability in our customers' value chains, expand our reach to include operations, and involvement in the entire value chain through the whole life cycle and usage of vehicles. Our sustainability approach involves a gradual and continuous reduction in emissions driven by innovations to decrease fuel consumptions. Innovations include vessel design, new bio-fueling techniques, engine performance optimization, as well as advanced weather routing.

At the same time, we are actively engaging in projects to develop technologies that can deliver leap improvement in emissions. For example, we rolled out a weather routing software solution developed in collaboration with StormGeo across our fleet to reduce emissions and improve onboard safety for our crew and cargo. We've also taken some big strides ahead in Q1 in our ESG initiatives. We set the greenhouse gas targets to ensure that we put our business on the right heading using the Science Based Targets initiative methodology, and have committed to reducing CO2 intensity by 27% by 2030 from 2019, as I said, subject, of course, to the SBTi's approval, which is the process that we have entered into now. We introduced, as mentioned, the Orcelle Wind, which is an exciting project which we'll come back to on the subsequent page.

Using wind as her main propulsion, Orcelle Wind will be able to reduce emissions by as much as 90%. The vessel is the RoRo segment adaptation of the Oceanbird concept from Wallenius Marine. Her key features include an average speed of some 10 knots, 7,000 car capacity. It's about 200 meters long and 40 meters across. They will have telescoping masts for the bridge navigation. Right now, we're in the process of conducting an evaluation of technical, operational, commercial, financial aspects, and I'm pleased to report that this work is proceeding as planned and according to schedule. Important issues or discussion areas in this regard includes the propulsion alternatives, because we'll still need some form of propulsion on board. This is from the perspectives of operational emission.

We're looking at cargo hold design, safety, regularity, economy, engine size, and of course, the effect this would have on the vessel design. The main fuel options being discussed as we speak are LNG, ammonia, as well as hydrogen. The goal remains to have a design ready for contracting with the shipyard by mid 2022, and a finished vessel ready for the high seas by 2025. We will of course, update the market as we proceed on this journey. As usual, we have a fairly busy agenda, but our presentation follows a structure and format which should be familiar to our regular audience, including a review of our business performance in the quarter, a market update, and a review of our financial performance.

We will have a Q&A session at the end of the presentation, and viewers are encouraged to submit questions in writing during the presentation, which we will then aim to answer towards the end of our webcast. To the extent we don't answer it online here, we will, of course, ensure we come back to you in writing with an answer. Before I delve into our business highlights, I would like to mention that we're fortunate to be joined here today by Erik Nøkleby , who is our EVP and COO of our Shipping Services segment, and he is based in Seoul, Korea. He and I will together review the key business and market developments during the quarter. Before we dive into the business update, I thought I'd say a couple of words about the CEO situation.

As you all know, Craig Jasienski stepped down in March as the company's CEO following an agreement with the Board, and I took over as the acting CEO, and I would again like to take this opportunity to thank him for his long service to the group. The Board has now engaged an executive search firm that will manage the process of identifying and securing the best CEO candidate for the group. This is, of course, a process that is exclusively handled by our Board, and any further announcements will be made as and when the Board has concluded on this selection process. We have now introduced three new reporting segments to further improve the transparency in our reporting. These are, as mentioned, Shipping Services, Logistics Services, as well as Government Services.

The activity in the Government Services segment was previously mainly recognized in the ocean side, or the Ocean segment, as we called it before, but also partly in the Land-based segment as it was called before. Shipping is, of course, engaged in ocean transport of cars and roll-on/roll-off cargo. Its main customers are global car manufacturers as well as manufacturers of construction and other high and heavy equipment, in addition, of course, to select industrial break bulk cargo. The Logistics segments serve mainly the same customer groups as Shipping Services, but on land. Customers operating globally are offered sophisticated Logistics Services such as vehicle processing centers, equipment processing centers, inland distribution networks, as well as terminals. The Government Services segment provides ocean transport, again, of roll-on/roll-off cargo and break bulk, as well as Logistics Services.

Their primary customer is the U.S. government, but also commercial cargoes that require U.S. flag vessel transportation. Revenue and EBITDA is primarily driven by government activities, often linked to world events and U.S. government objectives, they do not necessarily follow the regular seasonal patterns or quarterly trends that we have in shipping and logistics. With that, I thought I would hand over to Erik for an update on the Shipping Services operations and the market. Erik?

Erik Nøkleby
EVP and COO Shipping Services, Wallenius Wilhelmsen

Yes. Thank you, Torbjørn, let me get into the business update that this time around focuses on the Shipping Services segment. Demand in the group's core markets has returned since the first quarter of 2020, as you heard Torbjørn mention, it does continue to develop along a positive underlying trend. The prorated shipping volumes improved 14% year-over-year, though it fell 3% compared to Q4.

However, actual demand continued to increase quarter-over-quarter. The tight tonnage situation that we currently find ourselves in, mixed with the trade route imbalance and also inefficiencies in most major supply chains, actually meant that we were not able to lift all the available volumes. Also, as a side note, the larger portion of the volume we could not lift actually represents the higher margin spot cargo. Going back to the trading patterns that then remained imbalanced in Q1 for us as an operator, but also for the market, and we saw a solid demand and volume increase out of Asia, and that was then countered by weaker exports from Europe and then in the Atlantic trade, both east and westbound.

The strong demand from Asia stretches across most cargo segments and also partly driven by the increased production of popular auto models, including EVs from China and Korea. When we look at volumes ex-Europe and the Atlantic in particular, they were partly down due to seasonality, but it's also due to the parts shortages that the auto manufacturers are currently experiencing, specifically in January and February, but the activity did pick up for these trade routes during March. Looking at the cargo mix for Q1, it has normalized again back at a level of 28.3% high and heavy mix. It's down from the spike that we had in the first quarter of 2020 when high and heavy volumes did prove to be more resilient than the auto volumes during the initial stages of COVID-19.

Our shipping business for automotive and high and heavy clients, it's largely categorized by one to three-year contracts with pre-agreed pricing and also fuel adjustment clauses. For us, this means that we do not see the same fluctuation in rates when the supply-demand balance changes as experienced, for example, by the container lines. Only a smaller share of our volumes are generated on a spot basis. For 2021, the contracts up for renewal amounts to approximately one quarter of the 2020 revenue, and at the end of this quarter, 25% of the renewals were concluded with a small positive impact on contract rates, and most of the renew contracts will then commence during 2021. If we go into the fleet side of the operation, the rising volumes across global supply chains have led to inefficiencies and, of course, tight capacities.

The parts shortage plays into this general disruption, a longer ramp-up cost then for companies involved in the trade, including ourselves. For Wallenius Wilhelmsen, this has translated into higher costs relating to reactivation, and also vessel capacity and fuel consumption. We saw a continued need to access the short-term charter market during Q1 at increasing rates. Given the tight tonnage situation that we are in, we are likely to selectively continue to utilize the short-term charter market going forward in order to regain both optimal fleet efficiency and be able to lift all volumes that are available to us. The fleet reverted to a more normal speed average at approximately 16.5 knots, up from 15.9 in Q4. As you know, we have decided to reactivate all 16 vessels from cold lay up, eight of which re-entered service then during Q1.

The core fleet today, excluding short-term TC, stood at 117 vessels at the end of the quarter, accounting for about 20% of the global car carrier fleet. The core fleet consists of vessels on long-term charter as well as owned, and the total number includes vessels in cold layup, the numbers that you see on the slide. The fleet was reduced by one vessel since Q4, as a vessel about the age of 24 was sold for recycling in January. Of course, the recycling is then done in line with the Group's longstanding policy of recycling as per green policy, and is reported according to the Ship Recycling Transparency Initiative. Finally, on the fleet, the Group's final newbuild, a post-Panamax HERO-class vessel with a size of 8,000 CEU, is scheduled for delivery in Q3 2021 and also has bank financing in place.

I would then like to move over to the market update. We'll go into the automotive light vehicle segment first. The solid 19% recovery in light vehicle sales, including deep sea volume, continued in the first quarter, with volumes growing year-on-year. Main drivers for the growth include pent-up demand, incentives such as reduced VAT on EVs, and also increased consumer purchasing power. The light vehicle sales development, as you can see on the slide, is higher than that of the light vehicle deep sea volumes as sales was more hit in the beginning of COVID-19 in 2020, lowering the base and increasing the percentage change year-on-year. For the rest of the year, we expect the recovery to continue as vaccination rollout continues and also OEMs ensuring sufficient inventories and also consumer spending returning to normal.

I would like to get a little bit deeper into each of the main regions that we serve. If we start with North America, the sales were down early in the quarter due to weather issues and some other supply chain issues. We definitely saw solid sales rates in March. Inventories could lack certain models and trims. OEMs have, in this process, prioritized the most profitable models. That has resulted in record high average retail prices supporting then the OEM's profit. Of course, the $2 trillion stimulus package is expected to stimulate the economy and also auto sales eventually. Moving on to Europe, light vehicle sales has been a bit soft due to the COVID-related lockdowns and also a slightly less number of incentives and size of incentives. However, most incentives continues and are still related to low-emission vehicles.

Brexit uncertainty and diesel values still dampen off some sales. That's then covering overall for Europe. Just a couple of comments towards the end on China. We still see a solid sales in terms of light vehicles, and that's on the back of both pent-up demand and also stimulus fuel sales for that marketplace as well. If I can then move on to high and heavy, which is a market that's also recovered and continues to recover, driven by construction, given its relative size, but with volume growth across all segments. We expect this to continue in the near and medium term, driven by buoyant end-user demand and also inventory replenishment around the world. We believe that for construction, that machinery demand will continue to recover from last year's low base as residential markets remain buoyant with low interest rates. Also non-residential recovery continues.

It's a little bit more uncertain. We do expect stimulus spending around the world to support this segment ahead as well. For mining, the fundamentals are strong, and agriculture following the very strong commodity price inflation over the last 12 months. Metals and minerals prices have not been this high in 10 years. We see miners are now able to reap the benefits of the increased capital prudence that we saw since the cycle busted last time around. Also significantly reduced debt. Mining companies now have ample cash to continue to replace aging machinery fleets that were in commission actually in the mid-20s. We have seen them sweating the assets in a fairly big way. If we move on to the agricultural sector, the same goes here, as global food prices have not been this high since 2014.

Farmers are now making more money than they have for years, and that is then reflected in strong sentiment readings around the world. While the inventories are beginning to look tight, especially in agriculture, high and heavy has for now gone clear of the biggest supply challenges. This is, of course, something that we continue to monitor closely. If I move on to the final slide of the market updates, and that's towards the global PCTC fleet. The solid demand recovery has contributed to the tight tonnage situation. It's not just us who experience this. The tonnage situation is mirrored in the global fleet figures that you see here, where we then only saw one recycling in Q1. There are still a substantial number of recycling candidates out there.

If you look at the order book, it consists of only 10 vessels, which is at an historic low level. It also contributes to expectations of a continued tight tonnage situation. Markets are forecasted to be tight, with a utilization rate of 88% next year. This is an increase of 2 percentage points since the last quarterly update. Just as a side note, a global fleet utilization of between 85%-90% is considered to be a fully utilized fleet, given that there are always some inefficiencies in running a global operation. Okay, I think I will leave it at that and then send this back to Torbjørn, who will then cover the financial performance section.

Torbjørn Wist
CFO and Acting CEO, Wallenius Wilhelmsen

Thank you, Erik, for that update. Let me then proceed with the financial performance section. We start off with, call it the key financial highlights for the quarter.

What you can see on the left-hand side of the chart or the page is the total revenues was $838 million, which is slightly up quarter-on-quarter, about 2%, and year-on-year, about 1%. The Shipping Services revenue increased 5% over Q4, despite the small reduction in volumes on higher net freight rate and fuel surcharge revenues. Revenues were flat in Logistics, but a bit down in Government Services. The adjusted EBITDA ended at $132 million, which is down $18 million since Q4, but flat year-over-year. In the middle, in Q1, we posted a net loss of $5 million. The EBITDA margins came under a bit of pressure for the reasons already mentioned, falling to 15.7%, and we'll get into some of the more underlying explanations on the following pages.

Our cash position remains solid at just under $600 million, and net debt increased to $3.5 billion. On the right-hand side of the chart, the annualized return on capital employed was 0.8x, which is down since Q4 due to lower EBITDA generation, as well as a slight decrease in the value of the U.S corporate call option, which basically affected both the numerator, a decrease in the numerator whilst the denominator is stable. The equity ratio is basically flat from Q4. With LTM EBITDA now carrying a full-year COVID-19 impacts, net debt to EBITDA ended at 6.5x. During the quarter, we did experience diverging developments across the segments. The Shipping segment experienced continued margin pressure in Q1, ending at 16%, down from 18.8% in Q4. Rising volumes in the global vehicle supply chains led to pressure on fleet capacity and operations.

Fuel prices continued to rise in the first quarter, meaning higher costs, while the cost recovery through fuel surcharge revenues will lag. However, the underlying volume and demand trend remains positive, and revenue increased $30 million in the same period. The Logistics segment margin is slightly up in the first quarter on seasonally strong high and heavy activity for Keen in North America. The segment has seen a significant recovery since Q2 2020, when several sites around the world had to close due to lockdowns caused by the pandemic, and this particularly affected our land-based operations. The Government Services margin fell in Q1 due to lower activity versus Q4. In Q4, EBITDA was bolstered by activity under a storage and logistics support services contract, which generated periodical monthly business.

The segment revenue and EBITDA is primarily driven by U.S. Government activities, as mentioned, and again, are very much linked to world events and government objectives and will, as a result, not follow, call it the regular seasonal patterns or quarterly trends. We will now dive a little bit into the quarter-on-quarter EBITDA development. The EBITDA ended at $132 million, which is a 12% reduction quarter-on-quarter, despite a $16 million improvement in revenues. The lower EBITDA derive from the $12 million reduction in Shipping Services EBITDA and a $5 million reduction in Government Services EBITDA, as well as certain holding effects. Looking at the EBITDA development for the group compared to Q4 2020, the key impacts can be categorized as follows. If we start from the left on the volume effect side, the 3% reduction in volumes led to a negative effect of about $9 million.

If we look at, call it, a profitability per CBM measure, what we saw was that the net freight rate improved on higher high and heavy share and improved trade mix. The positive effects is dampened by ramp-up costs, which include reactivation costs of about $2 million. We had congestion issues at ports, and we of course, had the Suez Canal blockage, which caused some delays, as well as increased cargo and voyage expenses as we tried to catch up to make up for the stresses that we have seen in the supply chain. If we look at the net fuel effect, the main reason for the EBITDA margin pressure in Q1 was increasing net fuel cost. The fuel price per ton increased approximately 25%, which is the weighted average based on each type of fuel consumed quarter on quarter, while the fuel surcharge revenue lags the cost impact.

As you know, the fuel adjustment factor is calculated based on the average fuel price over a historical period and then fixed during the volumes of an application period, and this creates a lag effect. In other words, in periods of rising fuel prices, the segment will not be able to recoup the higher prices then and there through the FAF. Conversely, in periods of falling fuel prices, this segment will benefit from the adjustment factor, as you will then be locked in at higher prices. Fuel consumption increased on the pressure on fleet operations from speed increase. Reactivation of vessels, we of course, had to transport vessels from whichever fjord they were in, whether in Norway or Malaysia, to the place where they need to be going to dry dock. We had the fuel increase due to trade imbalances as well as congestion in ports.

The charter expenses had about $1 million of negative impact quarter-on-quarter on continued use of the short-term charter market at rising rates due to the tonnage demand. Vessel OpEx was flat quarter-on-quarter. SG&A improved $7 million from Q4, with contributions across all three segments on things like lower IT, pension, and consultancy costs, as well as the absence of some of the one-offs we saw in Q4. Other Shipping includes improvement quarter-over-quarter. That reflects the higher operating revenue, which includes commissions, TC income, et cetera. The Other Logistics is the residual changes in the Logistics EBITDA deriving from lower internal operating revenue compared to Q4. Other Logistics also include profitability improvement, leading to a slight improvement in the Logistics Services EBITDA margin during the quarter. Other Government is basically the reduction in EBITDA not covered by SG&A.

If we look at the liquidity development in the quarter, total liquidity reduced by $83 million to $898 million, where cash decreased by $55 million to $599 million, and unutilized credit facilities around $27 million to $299 million due to a net drawdown on revolving credit facilities during the quarter. The key reasons for the reductions in liquidity are the lower EBITDA experienced in the quarter compared to the fourth quarter. A significant increase in working capital reflecting the positive underlying business trend, but also the increase in fuel prices, as well as settlement of customer claims related to antitrust during the quarter. The return to normal debt repayments after the partial installment holiday in the second half of 2020 is also a reason why the financing cash flows have contributed negatively in this quarter.

When looking in further detail at the cash flows, the cash flows from operations at $79 million is explained by the adjusted EBITDA of $132 million being offset by a negative change in working capital of some $48 million quarter-on-quarter. As mentioned, the increased business activity and higher fuel price led current assets, including fuel inventories, to increase more than current liabilities with approximately $24 million. Relating to antitrust, the settlement of customer claims during the quarter and recategorization from non-current to current provisions increased working capital with $24 million. We had some taxes of about $6 million. The investment cash flow of $9 million mainly consists of $2 million in solutions maintenance CapEx and $7 million for dry docking and installment of ballast water treatment systems.

On the financing side, we had a net debt repayment of $79 million, which was basically an uptake of $92 million, but a repayment of $171 million. We had a net drawdown on RCF of $27 million. We had a $52 million refinancing of two vessels, Morning Lily and Morning Lynn, as well as a scrubber on Lily with net proceeds of $8 million. We had regular bank debt installments of $80 million, regular lease payments of $47 million, and interest paid of some $46 million. All in all, EBITDA in Q1 was sufficient to cover financing items and CapEx, but the change in working capital had a negative effect. Turning to the balance sheet, we maintain a solid balance sheet and a comfortable liquidity position at the end of first quarter. Total assets are stable at $7.6 billion.

Equity is at $2.6 billion, and decreased by about $10 million in the first quarter due to a $5 million net loss, as well as some currency effects, and this caused a 0.1% decrease in the equity ratio. The net debt increased $70 million to $3.5 billion, this increase is mainly due to the reduction in cash, as well as non-cash adjustments on long-term leases in [inaudible]. We had $52 million in vessel refinancings that were concluded in the first quarter. The group has cash on hand available to cover the $63 million in maturing debt for the remainder of 2021, $56 million of which relates to the bond maturity in September, $7 million relates to a small balloon on vessel financing in WW Ocean.

Remaining maturities through the year consists of regular installment on leases and bank loans, again, will be covered by cash flow from operations. If we turn to our prospects, we see that the markets have recovered significantly since last year. We do expect the supply-demand balance to remain favorable mid-term on global fleet reduction, as well as volume rebounds. Potential risks from further disruptions to global supply chains, fleet capacity constraints, and virus intensity are potential risks that could affect, of course, the trajectory. What is clear is that stabilizing market conditions will help provide more financial flexibility going forward. On a final note before we open up for question, I would like to point out that we have a vessel that will be arriving in Drammen on Friday. This is the Morning Lady, that is the same ship that is shown on this slide.

This is a ship that is coming in and is loaded with new electrical vehicles destined for the Norwegian market. The ship will arrive on Friday morning, the final few hours of the voyage and approach to Drammen will be broadcast live on NRK2 and nrk.no, starting at 5:30 A.M., for those of you who are early birds. Unless you're an early riser in Europe, please don't forget to set your alarm clocks. That concludes the presentation we had planned for today, we will now open up for Q&A via the web application. Anette, our head of Treasury and IR, will be managing the questions. Some questions we'll try to cover here, and what is not covered here we will cover offline. With that, open up for questions, Anette.

Anette Maltun Koefoed
VP of Corporate Communication, Wallenius Wilhelmsen

Hi, yes, this is Anette Maltun Koefoed. We have received some questions already, but if you have further questions, use the Q&A function on the site and send in your questions. I will start off with a couple of questions relating to the market, specifically on light vehicles. Erik, for you, we have received these two questions. The first is, this is from, by the way, from Pål Dahl in SpareBank 1 Markets. "Hi, what are you seeing in terms of disruption related to the lack of semiconductors regarding Kia's reduced volume guidance in, example, Q2 and Q3?" If I can continue with the next question, that is also from Pål Dahl. "Continuing to the light vehicle related question, will a possible disruption in LV production impact volumes? Is it a risk related to margins? Are certain routes more exposed than others?" Erik, over to you.

Erik Nøkleby
EVP and COO Shipping Services, Wallenius Wilhelmsen

Yeah. Thank you, Anette. Yes, if I can actually start with the experience we have now in Q1. First of all, though, I think quality holds and order holds on volumes from OEMs. It's not a strange happening in our business. That happens quite often. Of course, the shortage in the semiconductor industry and for the automotive industry, of course, has exacerbated the whole situation. We have seen volatility in the volumes, and we do continue to expect to see that going forward, given then the OEM's indications as of now that they will see factory shutdowns and also volume reductions overall. It's of course hard to read into this exactly which markets that will be affected. Quite often it's more regional and domestic markets and then that the overseas markets are prioritized. We have seen those trends in Q1.

At the same time, I mentioned before about the trade imbalances that we experience right now, meaning that when the volume reductions comes in Asia, this is actually giving us the opportunity to do other types of cargo that we don't lift right now. There's no real effect on volume reductions at the moment out of Asia. Of course, if it's out of Europe in particular, then it then increases and expands the overall imbalance that we have. This is not something that we are unused to. The pandemic showed probably a type of volatility that we have hardly seen before in this marketplace. We did manage that, I think, quite okay. We will just have to continue to plan with the volatility and disruption.

Of course, we are monitoring it very closely together with our customers, both on the Logistics Services side and also on the Shipping Services side. I can mention that, of course, when it then comes to regional and domestic impacts, our Logistics Services operations, especially in the U.S., of course, is more effective than on the Shipping Services segment. I think I will end there.

Anette Maltun Koefoed
VP of Corporate Communication, Wallenius Wilhelmsen

We receive further questions. Question from Lukas Torss. One second. Sorry. Do you intend to provide more historical data for the newly established business segments? Right now, there is only one year of directly comparable historical data for Shipping and Government, which is not a lot. That question I can answer. We have restated one year back, and that is the longest restatement history we will be able to provide for those three segments. At the same time, we know that the Shipping and the original ocean Logistics segments are quite close to the current Shipping and Logistics segments. Let's see here. We have a question on whether we can quantify the impact of contract renewals in USD million. Torbjørn, I guess, or Erik, I guess that one goes to you.

Torbjørn Wist
CFO and Acting CEO, Wallenius Wilhelmsen

Yeah, no. We don't provide specific guidance in terms of what the contract renewals will represent in millions of dollars.

Anette Maltun Koefoed
VP of Corporate Communication, Wallenius Wilhelmsen

A question on the Government segment for you, Torbjørn. How should we think about the Government segment? Any seasonality? Is it bumpy? Is it stable?

Torbjørn Wist
CFO and Acting CEO, Wallenius Wilhelmsen

Yeah, as we said when we talked about the segments, this is not something that follows the more normal seasonal patterns that, say, you see in Shipping Services or Logistics Services. It tends to be very activity driven. That, of course, is again related to government activity. I think it's important because that also shows that it's a slightly different side of the business and then that, call it transparency, is important because it doesn't mask any underlying developments in either the Shipping or Logistics where it was included before. I think in terms of transparency and reporting, it's good to have in order to just show that this is a slightly different segment in terms of how things develop throughout the year.

Anette Maltun Koefoed
VP of Corporate Communication, Wallenius Wilhelmsen

Now we have received another question relating to the global light vehicle sales. This is from Jonas Ström, Swedbank . I guess, Erik, this one is for you. You are indicating that global LV sales will rise 10% in 2021. Do you have indication of the growth for the deep-sea volumes?

Erik Nøkleby
EVP and COO Shipping Services, Wallenius Wilhelmsen

Thank you, Anette. I don't think I have a specific % in front of me here. Of course, it's not directly translating into the same growth in deep-sea necessarily because different markets are sourced differently. Is it regional growth? Is it the growth from overseas and imported vehicle side? In general, it's fair to say that we do expect also deep-sea volumes to continue to grow and get back towards 2019 levels.

Anette Maltun Koefoed
VP of Corporate Communication, Wallenius Wilhelmsen

Another question relating to the deep-sea market, and this one also goes for you, Erik. Have you seen any spillover effects from the currently very strong container market into your own market? This question comes from Petter Haugen in Kepler Cheuvreux.

Erik Nøkleby
EVP and COO Shipping Services, Wallenius Wilhelmsen

Yes, thank you for that. I actually just got the note in front of me here. We do see an 11% year-on-year growth for 2021 in deep sea. That then follows fairly much the growth overall, sales growth that we expect. Yes, that is a good question. We have historically actually looked up on parts of the container type of cargo actually as opportunity for us. We are seeing a lot of inquiries coming to us during Q1 for the type of cargo that usually ships in containers, and they are seeking all other kinds of transportation modes. We do see that. Of course, our break bulk segment is already closely correlated with both bulk shipping and also liner shipping or container lines. It's been partly a competitive area for both of us, for both segments for quite some time.

We do see some increased spillover effect, I would rather say, because historically there's always movements to and from RoRo and containers for all types of break bulk cargo. Yeah. Yes, we do.

Anette Maltun Koefoed
VP of Corporate Communication, Wallenius Wilhelmsen

Thank you, Erik. Yes, I see there is a question, and I think that is actually concluding the questions we received that we will cover on the call. Unless there are any last-minute stragglers here, I think that closes off the question and answer session. I see there may be some movement here, so one second, please. Torbjørn, I think that concludes our Q&A, and I hand it over to you then.

Torbjørn Wist
CFO and Acting CEO, Wallenius Wilhelmsen

Yes. No, thank you for that, and thank you for participating today. It's a slightly new presentation format we tried out this time, mainly because we're in different jurisdictions to participants on this call. Again, if you have any questions pursuant to this call, feel free to reach out to our Investor Relations. We will, of course, also endeavor to answer some of the questions that were not covered on this broadcast itself. Again, thank you very much for joining today, and look forward to catching up with all of you in the future. Have a good day.