Ladies and gentlemen, welcome to the CTEK audio cast teleconference Q1 2022. For the first part of this call, all participants will be in listen only mode, and afterwards there will be a Q&A session. Today, I am pleased to present CEO Jon Lind and CFO Mathias Sandh. Dear speakers, please go ahead.
Okay. Good morning, everybody. This is Jon Lind speaking. I'm the CEO, and I've been the CEO since 2013 for CTEK. With me today, I have Mathias Sandh, CFO for the company, joined in January this year. Let's continue our presentation here. We flip to the slide 3 in this presentation, and I will just calibrate a little bit what we do at CTEK and the different segments. I think that is important to take with you in to understand the dynamics in the industry and who we are. If we start then with the EVSE side, we have split it into three different main areas here, and we start with home chargers. Home chargers for us has not been the focus area.
We continue to drive sales into that segment, but we also talk to the industry and the market that we are developing other products that is coming in the future for the home charging side parallel to the existing units we have. The second one, the destination charging, that is continued to be the focus area for CTEK going forward. Destination charging, to explain that in the easiest way that is that it's bigger infrastructures for electric and hybrid cars, where you'll find a number of charging points together. When you look at those infrastructures, they also are connected to a backend that we are supplying.
It's a combination of hardware and software and quite high demands to have a robust, scalable system. The portable chargers is a little bit of a niche, but a growing market, and we have represented our NJORD GO that was launched last year, as a part of that journey, of the portable chargers. Portable chargers in the EV industry, that is, if you take NJORD GO, it takes you up to 11 kW. That is what you normally also find in your home charging environment and also in the destination charging side, even though if we go up, we go up 22 kW there. Portable means that you can hook it up to a power outlet, and you can take it with you.
It's also a connected connectivity part built into this, so you can connect it to our app and other type of backend systems, both Wi-Fi and Bluetooth. That sort of frame in the big picture, the EVSE side. The low voltage has a number of different segments, and we are pointing out four different ones here. We have the consumer side, mainly related to the automotive and powersport side. We have the professional side, and when you leave your vehicle for service today, this is seen as a diagnostic tool actually. That is something that you need to have in the workshops to be able to do software updates and so on. Portable low voltage, that is also a new segment that we launched last year.
In that case, we're talking about the CS THREE , which is a portable charger and fully portable. You don't have to have a power outlet to charge your phone, your computer, take a flat battery in your car to a level, so you can start the car or maintain a battery and also use our solar panel technology that is also built into this product. The fourth one, that is what we call the integrated solution. That is when CTEK is on board and we have a product that is built into the vehicles in different ways. It could be heavy trucks, it could be service vehicles and so on that support the charging of 12 and 24 volt applications. I would like to go to slide four.
A little bit about how we are structured and how we operate this company. If we go from the right to the left and start with the divisions. If we start with OE that you see on the bottom there, that is the division that goes towards the core manufacturers mainly, but also other type of manufacturers. What we do there is that we carry out low voltage and EVSE products. In the case of this division, we normally do tweaks and in some cases, special, fully special products for the customers. It's more tailor-made products in the OE division compared to the others. Go to aftermarket.
Aftermarket is our biggest division, and we have a little bit more than 200 retailers, online, onliners and distributors now. We reach about 70 countries today through this distribution setup. In this division, we have carried out the low voltage since the start of CTEK. We celebrate 25 years today. Now we're also going in with the EVSE products. We have said we have started with the NJORD GO in the Nordics, and we'll continue to do a rollout on a more global basis as we go in that field.
Also in this division, you will see more EVSE products coming in, and it's quite natural with this type of distributors now that you see in this picture and others in the same category that they also want to have that possibility to sell EVSE products. On the top you have Energy & Facilities. Energy & Facilities, the division that have customers in the field of charging point operators, electrical wholesalers, installers, property owners, parking owners, et cetera. We are focusing on, as I said earlier, the destination charging here. That sort of frame and define that division. In outcome of Q1, we had 17% of the sales was related to EVSE and the rest to low voltage.
Our organization, we continue to develop our products. We continue to invest in our organization that is very much related to R&D product development. Then sourcing, we are sourcing the main part in mainland China today. We have our own team localized there close to the supply chain to have about 30, 40 people now related to the supply chain and part of the R&D and so on and quality assurance in that region. We also have other, I would say, production capabilities and assembling capabilities in Sweden. That takes us to slide five, and just some highlights on the numbers. We already covered a share of EVSE compared to the low voltage. In the middle you see the sales per division.
As I pointed out earlier, we have Aftermarket as the biggest one, and then fairly split between Energy & Facilities and OE. Looking at the world map and how we are distributing our revenue stream into the different regions, we see that DACH and rest of Europe take up more than 50% of the total revenue stream. What we see, we see potential in the other areas also going forward. We switch over to slide seven, and I will give you some highlights on the Q1.
We continue to see a strong market climate in the Energy & Facilities and EVSE field you could say, and that is also connected to the OE division. An interesting point here, we have said that we had a 14% growth in the OE division here in Q1 compared to Q1 2021. We see a continuous big demand of the low voltage product portfolio and ramping up in the EVSE side. In the Energy & Facilities side, we had a growth of 80% compared to Q1 2021, and I think that speaks for itself on the market climate and the needs out there and the demands.
We had a higher demand that we could deliver in some areas here during Q1, and that is due to the shortage of components and production challenges and partly also logistics challenges. An example on this one is the NJORD GO that we launched last year, the portable EV charger, and where we had a high demand, but we were facing production challenges, and that also took us to certification challenges. What we are seeing the last part here, that we have gradually corrected this and see signs of a little bit better situation on the need of stock by lower air freights and so on, and that is also connected to that they have taken active decisions on building stock over time.
That is something that I would like to point out at this point. In the Aftermarket division, that targets the consumers and customers through our distribution network, it was slower activity after the invasion of Ukraine from Russia's side. We could see that the retailers, our distribution channels started to be a little bit more careful to build, continue to build stock. We're waiting for the consumers and see their reactions before they started to buy again. Lately we have seen a little bit of more positive signals in that field. Worth mentioning also is that, we're talking about the Ukraine and our direct impact there is very minor.
We have very little sales, and we have no own operations or employees or other assets in that region. I believe it's important to remind us that even though that we see maybe now the war as the main thing in news and so on, we continue to see how the COVID restrictions in China affect us in different ways. Lately now with the lockdown in Shanghai and so on, we have impacts in our business in different fields due to these kind of lockdowns and the COVID restrictions. Also here, we don't know yet, but a little bit better situation the last period here.
If we then look into the split here again, I was mentioning it before, but do it again here that we had about 70% of the total revenue in Q1 was related to the EVSE products, 11% last year. During the quarter, we have also signed up with Polarium, another Swedish company, to develop sustainable energy storage capabilities for EVs in order to facilitate the EV usage in more locations. What we're talking about here is that we want to be an active party to more systems out there.
I think we all see where the world is going, that it's quite interesting to see everything from the solar panels to energy storage and, of course, charging is very much connected to that. I also think the coming capabilities when we go to vehicle-to-grid, when the vehicles that has batteries on board can really be a part of the whole systems and the ecosystem when it comes to to energy storage and and also cut peaks. For us, it's this is a part of the strategy, of course, to be a part of these different type of systems and connect to interesting, good companies in that field. That takes us to slide number eight.
Thank you very much, Jon. We could see organic growth negative by 3% during the quarter due to tough comparable versus last year, mainly in aftermarket division, as well as negative impact of shortage of components and production challenges. The gross margin dropped by almost 9% and landed at 48%. This was due to general market condition and with higher logistics costs, larger share of purchases outside framework agreement, but also changed production mix versus last year. Adjusted EBITA margin decreased to 9%. The development was mainly due to lower gross margin. The larger share of sales from E&F continuing investment in the organization for future growth. Financial items amounted to SEK -1 million versus SEK 26 million last year, explained by refinancing during the autumn and connection with our IPO.
Profit for the period amounted to SEK 11 million, corresponding SEK 0.22 per share, and last year it was SEK 0.52. Next slide. Net sales decreased by 15% for the aftermarket division and amounted to SEK 151 million versus last year, SEK 177 million, which was all-time high with a growth of 60%. The organic growth was negative by 19%. Furthermore, we have seen a slower market activity after Russia's invasion of Ukraine, since retailers and distributors have had the reluctance towards building up their own inventories. Adjusted EBITA amounted to SEK 48 million, corresponding to a margin of 32.2% versus SEK 84 million and 47.3% last year. This was negatively impacted by higher logistic costs and a higher share of purchases outside the framework agreement, and as well as decreased volumes.
When we come to the OE division, we increased by 14%, and it was SEK 35 million for the Q1 versus SEK 31 million last year. The organic growth was 8%. The performance was due to generally higher demand from a number of leading automotive manufacturers in different geographies after a weaker period due to the pandemic. Adjusted EBITA amounted to SEK 10 million, corresponding to a margin of 30% versus 29% last year. For the E&F division, net sales increased by 79% and amounted to SEK 37 million versus SEK 21 million last year. The organic growth was 77%, driven by primarily higher domestic sales from a new version of EV chargers that was launched last year. The export side also continued to perform positively in line with the enhanced internationalization focus for the division. Adjusted EBITA improved to SEK -8 million versus SEK 11 million last year.
Even if higher volume had a positive impact on earnings, it was offset by increased cost for activity and product launches in new markets and further investments in the organization. Next. Cash flow and CapEx. Cash flow from operating activities improved during the quarter to SEK -1 million versus SEK -9 million last year, despite the lower operating profits and higher inventory levels. CapEx for the period amounted to SEK -228 million versus SEK -12 million last year, and we still invest a lot in next generation of products. Net debt ratio for the period was 3.6. At the end of 2021, it was 2.6. This higher leverage is mainly driven by lower EBITA performance during the Q1 .
Cash and cash equivalents at the end of the period amounted to SEK 51 million, and this was in line with the level at the end of 2021. Effective from April, we have extended our revolving credit facility with another SEK 100 million to be in position to meet the working capital needs and ramp up some specific projects in the coming quarters.
Okay, we go to slide 14, current trading. As we said earlier, we see a continuing strong EVSE demand. I think we can see it everywhere now. It's taking off, and we believe that we are just at the starting point in the global industry here. As we said earlier in Q1, we had a situation where we had a higher demand that we could fulfill with deliveries. If you look at the different products and also bring in the low voltage side, we see that we have a good platform to stand on in the different segments where we're focusing.
On the low voltage side, worth mentioning, we see a continuous big demand there in different segments. As we have described before in our material to the market is that, the 12 V and 24 V applications, they continue to grow. We can of course also see a switch of where these products and battery needs, they're getting into also other type of applications now going forward. In the end, it's a question of charging 12 V and 24 V applications. I also mentioned before that we have seen positive signs during the Q2 in the aftermarket division. We hope that we can take that momentum with us going forward.
Talking about GM and that brings us also back to the situation in the world regarding components and this situation where we need to buy more and larger number of components outside the framework agreements. I believe that everybody that develop products now in the electronic industry and design products for long-term and in the high-end segment, we are facing these challenges now to pick the right components for going forward and get them to us on time and to the right price. That has also caused some delays in the deliveries. We have earlier said that we had a rollout during 2022.
What we see now is that we will see a rollout of the base variant in the end of the quarter two and the premium in the H2 of the year. We've also been talking about the COVID restrictions. We see signs of a little bit better situation here, but during Q1, it has been an impact on it, and I hope that we can move out from this now in a better way going forward. With the situation on logistics cost, the spot buy and the general higher cost level in the industry, we have also decided to go for another price increase to compensate for it.
That will be from May now. How do we then look at our investment side and going forward? You know, we will continue to invest to secure the future growth based on that we see the demands, and we follow our strategy going forward. For us, it's important to continue to focus and invest in product development and customer support, and in connection with our marketing activities in more and more export, especially in the EVSE segment. That takes us to slide number 14. No, 15. There. Just a quick one on the strategies we have with us on how we are looking at that part.
In the Aftermarket division, we continue the rollout of the NJORD GO on a more global basis going forward and over time. We have in 2022 and in the end of the year, we launched also the CS ONE, the new low voltage product, and in mid-year, we launched the CS THREE. We have a good platform to stand on the low voltage side that now we are driving the sales in towards those products parallel to the existing product portfolio, and we continue to do some investments in that field as well. On the OE side, it's quite straightforward strategy.
We continue to drive the sales in the low voltage side and have a number of ongoing product developments towards existing and new customers in the low voltage field. Parallel to that, we are also then accelerating the focus on supporting the EVSE side towards the OEMs. Energy & Facilities, we continue our journey to expand into new markets, and I've been mentioning it as before, we have an organization in U.K., we are in the Netherlands, and France and Germany. We have also some other activities in other countries. We are focusing on product development and extend the hardware offering together with developing more and more backend platforms and also improve the service offering. Here we've been talking about achieve the profitability from operational scale effects.
We have seen signals in the right direction. If you compare Q1 2021- 2022, we see that it starts to go in the right direction there. On top of this, we have the M&A strategy, and we've said that we believe that our journey towards our financial targets can be reached without an M&A need. But we see M&A as an opportunity to speed up and secure some parts, and it can be, you know, for technical reasons, it can be markets that are of interest and so on. We have it on the agenda and try to make that agenda a little bit more and more clear for us. That is how the strategy looks for CTEK going forward.
Thank you. I think we open up for questions.
Thank you. Ladies and gentlemen, if you wish to ask a question, please press zero one on the telephone keypad. Our first question comes from Johan Eliason, Kepler Cheuvreux. Please go ahead.
Yeah, hi, Jon. Hi, Mathias. Just a question on the low voltage business. You talk about a bit negative organic growth here, but you see some improving signs from the retailers. How is the seasonality there? Is Q1 typically sort of a big quarter and from a seasonality point of view, Q2 will typically be a lower quarter in terms of revenues, or how does it look like?
I would like to describe it like this to be very transparent now that it's a little bit upside down, the whole thing now in the world based on how you roll out both price increases, the war, the pandemic effects, and so on. You have different behaviors from different distributors and different markets. We said that last year was exceptionally high, and I don't think it's a relevant benchmark or a data point to take with us that it's a 60% growth like it was in Q1. Normally it's lower than that. As you know, we had a 22% growth during last year. That I cannot give you a better answer.
You maybe have another question that can bring more clarity to you, if you, depending on what you want to analyze.
Yeah. I mean, I'm just trying to figure out sort of on a sequential basis if-
Mm-hmm.
If Q2 low voltage revenues are normally down on Q1, and then that's what you see this year as well, or how is the short-term outlook for that part? Not necessarily.
I think-
In a year-over-year perspective, because year-over-year I understand it's tricky with the comps.
Depending on the Q4, of course, depending on how they have built stock or not stock. Generally, you could say like this, how we have moved over the years, if you look at our figures over the years, we have tried to minimize the seasonal effects by being closer to the distributors, to have a better flow instead of trying to bring in or sell in big stock. That has changed over the years, as we see it. Maybe to give you more hard facts, we maybe can come back with some figures on how the seasonal part has been to clarify it, so we have clear data on it, back to you.
So we-
Mm-hmm.
We can do that. Mm-hmm.
On LV, if I understand your comments right, there the top line hasn't really been restricted by component supply, if I understand you correct.
I will try to give you the right color on that one. The main part that has been affected in Q1, that was related to EVSE, so that is right.
Mm-hmm.
A smaller part related to the low voltage side. That is correct, so I can confirm that.
Okay.
The volume drop in aftermarket that is mainly related then to low voltage, that was due to the war when that took off, then we
Yeah.
Can see that the distributors and the retailers started to be a little bit more careful in the beginning.
Yep. There's no sort of component transfer between these two businesses that you can see going forward that you might prioritize EVSE a bit more than low voltage. It's not the same components or how does it look like?
I will not try to be the expert in selecting components and obviously in exactly our products. There are of course some components that could be in both products. If you take the main part of it and the most important parts, we don't have the same in
Mm-hmm.
in the products. I don't want to speculate in details. If you take the big picture of it, that is how it looks.
Yeah. Going into EVSE. I mean, you mentioned here that component supply is obviously a hindering factor to the top line development here. Can you give any indication on where the revenues would have been had you been able to supply all you wanted in the quarter? I mean, Hexagon, for example, they said organic growth was 10%, but it would have been 6% higher if they've had all the components that they wanted, for example.
I cannot quantify. I can only say that we have landed mainly in the Energy & Facilities side that is connected to the EVSE side. We had a drop in the top line compared to what we could achieve based on the demands out there.
Uh, uh.
That is, yeah.
You mentioned prices, that you are hiking prices now as of first of May. Was there any positive price component already in the Q1 revenues?
I could say like this to give you sort of the last 12 months, we had a small increase in April, May last year, and then had one in September. We have done some price increases in the beginning of the year. Depending on the different divisions, customers, agreements, and so on, it takes some time before you see it in the books of course. The activities and sort of the change has taken place during Q1, but you cannot see them yet in the books.
Okay. Excellent. You mentioned you think you are seeing some improvement in the component supply, but I guess that's hard to predict for you. On this major GM order, do you have the components now in supply that you need to fulfill this new scenario end of this quarter and then in the H2 of the year? Is there still risk associated with that from the supply side?
I think unfortunately we have learned over the two and half years we have been in this situation now that it's dangerous to speculate, and then you want to grasp the positive signals immediately and take them with you as a positive signal forever. We have learned that it can come setbacks. I would like to give you color on how we are working, and I can be open about that. This is a collaboration with GM, meaning that we are working together with the product development. We're working together to secure supply hand-in-hand. This is a little bit different from the after-market side, you could say, when you launch your own product and you're by yourself. This is a common product development and supply.
That doesn't answer your question fully, but it gives hopefully a color on how we are working together with a quite big company to get help also to secure and try to look forward regarding how to shape the forecasting and make sure that we do our best to fulfill the needs through as smart a supply chain we can in this environment. That is how we are working with that one.
On that specific contract, I mean, it's also related to their own EV rollout, I suppose. I think there have been some delays there as well. Are you sort of at least matching their own EV rollout to some extent, or are you a bit worse off than they themselves are?
Yeah, I think, again, this industry is really hard to judge now and we are seeing a number of car manufacturers, both some of them are very transparent, otherwise they just come up with a signal now we stop the production due to component shortage. We have seen companies in that field deliver actually cars without some components and mount them afterwards. You see everything now, so it's hard to judge.
Mm.
I don't want to speculate about their rollout. That is not my agenda. But we have also, it's also important to educate each other about how the market looks like when it comes to the charging side. You always have an after market that we are also playing in, depending on the customer needs. In some cases, you buy a car and you don't need and you cannot buy a charger because you don't have a house to hook it up to or.
Mm
other facilities. You go to the public charging places and charge your vehicle, depending on what kind of customer you are.
Mm.
You always have a share in the aftermarket side, where you are supplying the off-the-shelf products. In this case, we are preparing for supplying the Ultium GM own charger, which will be a part of their rollout in some areas. That is how the industry looks like for all vehicles and all charging industry in total.
Okay. Thank you. I think that was all my questions.
Thank you.
Thank you. Our next question comes from Kenneth Toll Johansson, Carnegie. Please go ahead.
Yeah, thank you. Sorry, a couple of questions. First, you talk a lot about that you're adding R&D and sales resources to drive sales growth in the EVSE products and so on. But now when the availability of components is weak and the outlook for exceptional growth in that industry is slower than it was some time ago, do you believe that you are investing too much or that you should delay hiring of people and so on?
I think it's a very good question, so we have a chance to explain our thinking here. Again, we are going for the long term and the midterm strategy of course, and continue to follow that one.
Mm.
For us it's not the question of looking too short term and we see where the industry goes and the needs of EV charging overall, and we believe that it has a good position in the different fields. We will continue to invest, but like you are pointing out, it's always a balance actually between.
Mm
the capability in getting the products to the market. You also have a long sales process in a number of areas where we are playing, as we've been mentioning before, working with the OEMs. That is years of work. It can be two-three years of development before you go to market with the products. In the energy and facility side, also there, when you are focusing on destination charging, it can be projects that starts to be sort of in a project phase now, but delivered in two years from now.
Mm.
For us, highly relevant question, but I hope this answered the question a little bit.
Yeah. Okay. Great. I was thinking, could you elaborate a little bit about your the Chinese situation, and your manufacturing operations and shortages and so on? As far as I can judge, it seems like the lockdowns of different cities and so on is easing a little bit. It seems like we might have passed the peak lockdown of Chinese cities and Chinese citizens. Are you feeling in China that the situation is easing a bit or is it getting worse or yeah. What do you see?
The thing I know here, again, I don't want to point and say that I'm an expert, but we're trying to follow it as close we can. Again, it comes back to the political decision to have a zero tolerance.
Mm-hmm
against the COVID, yes, on the COVID restrictions. That is, of course, extreme. What we have seen in Shanghai is super extreme, what they have done.
Mm-hmm.
I don't know, but maybe they have learned some from something from it and so on. We also see that it's EBITA up a little bit, and it seems like it goes in the right direction.
Mm-hmm
We must also remind each other from having a city like that on full total lockdown, and then it's open up. You have some effects that you have to take care of. I mean-
Mm-hmm
If you look at the number of ships that is now in the harbor in Shanghai, that they need to sort out where they were supposed to go and what they should load and offload from those ships. I mean, it will take time before it's sorted out. You will have effects from these things for a certain time.
Mm-hmm
That is for sure. Of course.
Mm-hmm
Different amplitudes depending on how you have set your supply chain.
I saw a press release from an electric vehicle charger manufacturer in the US that they were supplying General Motors dealers with the electric vehicle chargers. Can you talk a little bit about that and why they wouldn't bring on GM products instead?
Absolutely. Good that you asked that question. That brings us back to, again, how I tried to describe the market, how it looks when it's up and running. You will always have.
Mm-hmm
You will continue to be reading about different types of suppliers and will supply to different vehicle manufacturers. That is how they position themselves. In this case, it's Blink, and it's an off-the-shelf product. It's not the tailor-made GM product that goes out to some of the dealerships.
Mm-hmm
... we have also been very open here and said that we are continuing the development for the specific GM product for a rollout in different segments. Dealership is one. Other are
Mm-hmm
are the fleet side and others are private and other commercial setups as well. We will always see a mix of this. Now they rolled out some of the cars, I don't know, earlier or at a certain point. At that point, the GM chargers were not available that time.
Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.
That is how it looks.
Mm-hmm
Going forward, you will continue to read it in different areas as so.
Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.
I'm okay. Let's continue to follow that and discuss it going forward as well, because we are learning both you as analysts on an analytic side and investors and us as well.
Mm-hmm.
So.
Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Yeah.
Worth mentioning also is that the OEMs always calculate with a certain take rate that I was referring to earlier. They never say that they are going to supply everything and every time a car is sold.
Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Yeah. You might be able to sell electric vehicle chargers to car manufacturers that have sort of cooperated with some of your competitors. You probably can get some volumes back, if I put it that way, in the future.
Yeah. Yep.
Also, the discussions with the other car manufacturers that continues, you write in the report. Is it only for the very high premium segment, or do you also have discussions with more volume oriented manufacturers?
Yeah. I mean, if we are, if we're honest here, the journey of the electrification has just started. The segmentation of these vehicles and the customer segments connected to that starts to be more and more clear.
Mm-hmm
We have said that we will be as selective as we can when we move into new businesses related to OEM. We have a match between the demands and what we can supply and who we are as a customer. Meaning that, I think, based on your question, I'll try to answer that, we will probably land more towards the premium segment than.
Mm-hmm
I say low end, maybe the wrong wording, sorry for my English, but compared to the other part. I think you will see that positioning from our side going forward.
Mm-hmm. Yeah
This landscape and the needs are changing now as we speak also with different needs. We have been talking about this vehicle-to-grid, other demands and so on, that comes into play now. We've been talking about the OEMs, how they have also described that they try to get something from the market, in the beginning of their journey. Then over time you learn what you want and what you need and make it sort of also unique for your vehicle, and connect the-
Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.
The chargers in an intelligent way to your vehicle.
Mm-hmm
A super hard, but interesting and a fast growing segment for sure.
Yeah. Great. Yeah, sounds good. That's all from me. Thank you.
Thank you. Our next question comes from Johan Eliason, Kepler Cheuvreux, please go ahead.
Yeah. Hi again. I just had some other points I thought of. We saw Alfen reporting the other day saying they sort of produced 65,000 charging points, which was growing 200% year-over-year or something like that. What's your volume in the EVSE side? Do you have any indication? I think you've historically talked about an installed base of 50,000 charging points or so.
Yeah. We have not given official figures. Like you said, we represented that we are over 50,000 charging points. I need to come back how and when and if we present it, and it's also a question of the different segments. It's very important to clarify what kind of segments that we are supplying to. That is back to, I say, to guide the market in a correct way, where are we focusing and what kind of volumes, so you can also compare in the right way. Let me take an internal discussion about that and see if we can give you a more clear picture.
as we said earlier, we gave the information that we have passed 50,000 charging points, and that was some time ago.
Okay. Another small question. You mentioned something about certification taking some extra time. Has that hampered your international rollout to any significant degree?
Yeah. Also a very good question. I like that you put it on the table, so we have a chance to also describe that part. I believe everybody that is in this field now, especially the electronic EV side and so on, there is a queue to get through the testing houses out there. If you look into that business now, there is a high demand on those external testing institutes to get through. We should also take with us that part of the industry are also on a learning curve. We are trying to learn together what are the demands, how should we test, et cetera, and so on.
The bottom line of that is that it is a timeline there to get the certification, get through the testing and so on that cause delays, yes, when you develop products in this field. I mean, the way we do it now is that we use the external test facilities for the certifications.
Was there any specific market that has been really impacted by this, like Germany or some other geographic area?
No, I cannot specify that, because this is different where you are in the product development. Sometimes it's modules that you test for international market that goes into specific market, and then you have some special features for that market and so on. It's a kind of a matrix. It's hard to say that it was one market and so. It's more of a general queue to get through.
Okay. Excellent. Thank you very much again.
Yeah.
Thank you. Ladies and gentlemen, as a final reminder, if you wish to ask a question, please press zero one on your telephone keypad. We have no further questions. Dear speakers, back to you.
Thank you so much. Take care.
Thank you.
Ladies and gentlemen, this concludes today's conference call. Thank you all for attending. You may now disconnect.