Earnings Call: Q2 2021

Aug 17, 2021

Good day, and thank you for standing by. Welcome to the presentation Q2 Report of 2021. I would now like to hand the conference over to your speaker today, Mr. Thomas Widstrand. Thank you. Please go ahead, sir. Thank you very much. Very welcome to this presentation of Troax Group second quarter financial result or presentation. I think most of you are used to this kind of presentation. Nevertheless, I will inform you then that you can find this template that I will work from. You can find it on the troax.com homepage or webpage, and you will find it then under investors, and then you find then the presentation for Q2. If you don't have it, you will be able to follow, I think, what I'm saying in any case, because I will follow my usual presentation, which means we will go through a number of the figures, and I'll try to comment on some things which have influenced them positively, negatively than our development, especially in the second quarter. To start then with Troax, I guess that most of you, as I said, are well acquainted with Troax, but as you know, we try to stay safe, and that's what I'm starting with, and we try to set that our customers are safe. That's really our business idea. Just quickly to go through a little bit of the background. We are working in 3 different, what we call segments, and the biggest one is called machine guarding. As you see from the picture, it shows then obviously what we are doing. We are protecting people and from dangerous objects, in this case, robots who are working along a manufacturing line for cars. This is approximately 65% of our turnover. If you take next page, it's called warehouse partitioning. It's approximately 21% of our turnover. As you can see from the picture, we're talking then about dividers or guarding them, protecting them. For instance, what you have on the shelves from falling down on people who are perhaps working in the aisles or people who are working in the forklift trucks. I think that's all self-explanatory. The third and the smallest segment that we work with, nevertheless, very important, it's what we call storage solutions or Property Protection. It's primarily, I would say, in Northern Europe segment. It's approximately 14% of our turnover. As you can see, it's not so much about protecting the people. It's more about protecting, of course, what you tend to have in your storage area, like skis or bicycles or whatever you got, and to protect that from burglary, at least within a reasonable amount of effort. Then if you go to the next page, we actually have something which is a mix between machine guarding and the warehouse part, and we call it automated warehouse, surprisingly enough, where you can see then that we are focused then on, as the word implies, automated warehouses, which is growing substantially at this moment and has been doing so for several years now actually. That's of course something which we are profiting from. As you see from the picture, it's basically then a warehouse, but it's of course automated to a major extent. You have long lines of aisles who are then picked or the goods that are on these aisles or on these shelves are picked, of course, then by some sort of robot or some sort of machine. This is collecting then the items and puts at a place then where someone probably manually or automatically puts it on a car and then brings it on to distributor or retail market or whatever. This is something which then is growing very much, and I will come back to that a little bit later. Next page shows the year-on-years from 2020. I think I can skip that. For those of you interested, you've seen then the development of 2020, which a little bit was a difficult year for obvious reasons with the COVID. You see also the split up then of the sales to region. I think you can read that for yourself if you're interested in. We also have next page where you see also the year-on-years, where we say then that we are the global leader of the indoor Property Protection. We're approximately two and a half times larger than the number 2 player. We are a growth company, even if of course 2020 was difficult to grow. We are approximately two and a half times of a bigger presence in 42 countries. Historically, we've had a growth of, let's say, 8%, 9% organically and including some few acquisitions that have been made, then the growth per year has been 11%, 12%. Going to the next page, I talk a little bit about financial targets. We don't, as regards to the first one, which is called sales growth, we don't really say exactly what our target is. We definitely aim to grow more than the market is growing. Over a business cycle, our estimate is that the market is growing with some 4%-6% per year. That means, of course, we should grow more, which we have done, as I said before, historically done. Coming back to what we did now for the first half year, I would say that we've been growing substantially. We've been actually having a, I would say, very good second quarter, and I will come back to that. Organically, we've been growing 40%, and we then had the acquisition that we did 1st of November in Poland, called Natom Logistics. That has added another 9%. In total, we've been growing with some 60% or so compared to last year, which nevertheless was negatively influenced by the COVID. You have to take it that these high percentage figures are, of course, positively influenced by this rather easy comparison. When you go to profitability, we should be on 20% on EBITDA margin, and due of course, mainly to good volume and good cost control and good utilization of factories. We are now actually exceeding this for the first half year, so we're up to 21.6%, which is then so far, as we say, a good figure. Regarding the capital structure, which is the third target that we have, we are saying now that the net debt in relation to EBITDA should not exceed 2.5 times, and we are below that, so we are on 1.2. I think we paid the dividend in May, June. It's a good figure, I would say, showing then that we both have good possibilities for further acquisitions should such occasion arise, and of course, also to do further investments in our activities if we should like to do so. Dividend is not relevant. Normally, we have the target to pay out 50%, and if we've paid out this for this year, we'll have to come back to that next year when it becomes relevant again. Right, we come to some summary of Q2, and I will do that in some sort of summarized way. You can say then that the Q2 of 2021 continued with a very strong, I would say, order trend. We started basically in Q1, towards the end of Q1. We could see some signs of it already towards the end of Q4 last year, when we returned then from the physical COVID period, with somewhat, I wouldn't say normal situation, but at least it's a better situation than it was previously during 2020. I think there is a certain effect then of what I call a catch-up effect on the very good figures of Q2. You cannot really estimate how big it is. Of course, the market has been very good, and as I said, there is a certain element of this catch-up effect. Basically, I would say that Q2 is characterized by good demand from customers, more or less in all parts of the world, in all parts of our different segments. On top of that, we probably had some sort of effect then, as I said, of this catch-up effect coming from projects which have been delayed then because of the COVID. Nevertheless, we have seen then, as I write in this summary, that the demand has been, I would say, especially strong then, of course, with automated warehouse, which is continuing the very positive trend from before. Also machine guarding has been improving during second quarter. I think I wrote somewhere down that the automotive has started to be more active, and I'm not saying that it's fantastic because it's far from that. We clearly see then that the automotive activity was much stronger in the second quarter compared with the previous half year, and that's a good sign. Because of them, we had very good order intake in the second quarter. We had quite good also in the first quarter, at least a decent one. That, of course, was turned into a major extending to sales during the second quarter. That means, of course, then that if you get good sales levels, you invoice a lot and you manufacture a lot. This was, of course, creating then a good result. If you look at the result, which we will do in a second, basically then for the quarter, the operating profit has more than doubled for the quarter. If you look at the first six months, it basically has doubled the results, and this is a very strong development. We're not used to having those kind of growth figures, actually. Earnings per share then are actually then more than double. Going from EUR 0.08 last year to EUR 0.19 this quarter. Just a few words on the working capital. It's on the expected level. Inventory is still high. We've done some precautions, as we say, in connection with the COVID effect. We intend to keep it like that until we see that things are really stabilizing. We think that at the end of the year, we'll still be able. Some turbulence with deliveries of steel and especially, of course, on prices. I think we intend to keep it on this level. Otherwise, we have a stable working capital. I think nothing which otherwise is worth really mentioning. Because of the good sales level, which I touched upon before, I also said then briefly that all the manufacturing units have had a very good development in Q2 with very good volumes. Despite the fact then that the steel prices continue to be, as I call it, turbulent, meaning going up substantially. We have been able to, I would say, basically to compensate that. There are some delays in the price increase because the surplus has been gone up so considerably in a very short time. Nevertheless, I would say that we have, on the whole, been able to have this thing in a good way, in cooperation with our customers, because obviously, we don't want them to suffer more than usual, what is really necessary. I think we've had a good dialogue with most of our customers. Nevertheless, there have been increase the price. Going to our acquisition, Natom in Poland, also Poznań, that had continued to have a very good development also in the second quarter, especially then with good inflow orders coming from the warehouse segment. This is where they are, that's not strange for there. That if anything, they've been even stronger, I would say, in quarter two than in quarter one. So far we are quite pleased with our development, obviously this has also been turned into good sales and also a reasonable result. We are, as I said, quite pleased with it so far. We are working with a new facility. We are intending to merge the two factories, which are existing today, into one. The first factory, or at least the start of the first factory, will be starting to be transferred now in the fourth quarter, moving into a bit, I think, into 2022. We take the next one a little bit later in 2022, depending on when we can get the proper electricity into the site. We have also then, as we have informed separately, purchased the guarding activities referring to aluminum from ABB. The product name for that is QuickGuard. We purchased that on 1st of July, and there's been some transfer now of machines during the summer period. We do intend now to start the same manufacturing deliveries from 1st of September. We already got some orders from ABB customers. We will see how quickly we can take this up, but I think we will be prepared to start working with this in an operational level from 1st of September. Going to the next page, we talked then about the financial highlights, and in some way I already touched upon them, that the results was substantially improved. If you go through the excuse me, the 3 months period, you see there's a substantial increase in order intake. I will within a second share with you then where this comes from, and more or less the same is valid for the sales. Gross profit has been more or less almost double, even if the margin has slightly decreased. Already talked about the operating profit and the margin. The operating margin, and as I said, cumulative for the six months, if you look a bit to the middle of the page there, generally give you 21.6%, and it was 22.8% for the last quarter. It's a good figure. We're actually quite pleased with that. That means also that earnings per share for the first six months are EUR 0.33, it's more or less doubling then, of course, compared with last year. We come to the next page where I think we mentioned that this is some sort of regional development in order intake and sales, and this is quite interesting because you can see both in the order side and on the sales side that we have very strong figures then in all regions. I would say that's partly the effect then of the products we've been doing, which has been coming in and on a rather high level, but also which may be even more encouraging than that the small and medium customer, which previously had been here on a rather low level during the corona situation. Now things have come back even more or less in a full-fledged way, so that things are, if not back to normal, so at least from a figure point of view, it looks like it's rather normal. If we really point out something, I would say then that is a very strong order intake, I would say continental Europe, obviously some sort of catch-up effect there, but very strong. Of course, if you go to North America and you see that this kind of quarter is very strong. The figure, of course, was last year negatively influenced, of course, by the COVID. This % figure is, I would say, is a bit on the too high side. New markets also relatively good. Totally approximately 59%, 60%, and then plus the acquisitions, 27%, you come to 84%. If you then look at the same figures for the first half year, you see then that's what I talked about before. Organically, we've been growing with, let's say call it 40%, including some currency effects and then some acquisitions. In total, roughly 60%. On the sales side, you see similar development, but also the things which is maybe a little bit deviating there is that you see, of course, that North America is doing very well. The United Kingdom is also increasing quite much. They had a lot of order intake in the first quarter, which of course manifests itself in a higher sales in value during this quarter. Quite a strong development, I would say, in all regions, even of course that a few of them have higher figures than the rest, but some of those are not as mature as the other one, which you also have to take into consideration. Totally, we have invoiced after 6 months, EUR 132 million. If you take that to the rolling figure of 3 months, which you see to the right on that picture, you see then that it's on the safe side, EUR 209 million, and on the other side, EUR 230 million. Obviously, this is continuous. We're going to make a substantial increase then in volume and activity level compared with 2020. Go to the next page, which tend to be some sort of conclusion. We have this quarter, previous quarters, we have received several main orders of different segments, but of course, the really more bigger ones are within automated warehouse and machine guarding. We're very pleased with that. We see those that there is some sort of catch-up effect, even if we can guess how much that is. We also see that the small and medium-sized customers have come back now. Hopefully, that will continue. It means that there was an all-time high development in result in this quarter, which was reflecting, of course, the order and site travel, some good utilization of the manufacturing and synergy effects. Going to United States, both Troax, which is the Troax Portland, Oregon, are continuing to develop well and shall continue to improve result. I would say especially Troax Link is growing substantially, and it's probably then approaching Folding Guard, I would say, as regards to size. This is continuous. All factories continue to develop well. There is a continuous turbulence with steel price. We do think that the increase of steel price will continue in the third quarter. Maybe there will be a leveling out on the fourth quarter, and hopefully we can see some stabilization, maybe some tendency of going down during earliest first quarter next year. We are calculating with and taking measures that the steel price will continue to be very turbulent in the remaining part of the year. Integration of Natom was continuing, and it's done in a good way, so we don't see any major problems there. In total, the development with a substantially better result, even if, of course, when you compare with the same quarter last year, as I said, it is of course, negatively influenced by COVID. For the rest, we have some comments normally regarding those factors. I won't go through that in detail because they don't change from quarter to quarter. One thing I could touch upon that is that the item 2 or what is called here onshoring or manufacturing, which we have seen for, I would say, many years, but maybe has not had a big influence. I do think that that will have a bigger influence now because we do see, of course, that customers of ours are thinking and realizing now that to have many sub-suppliers in China could create problems. The lead times are very long, and of course, especially now, all of them, and you have also seen that the freight prices are extreme now. That's taking, of course, away some of the benefit of producing there. I'm personally convinced that the onshoring of manufacturing will increase in Europe and in North America compared with before. Otherwise, what's driving the growth for us is still increased industrial automation. Again, if anything has happened after COVID, this is positive as regards automation because it will continue. The same goes for e-commerce, which, if anything, again, is also taking a new step based on, of course, that we as consumers have learned to shop online in a much bigger quantity or much bigger way than we did before. Next page shows the estimation of us as the market leader. We don't think that market has changed so much during between 2018 and 2019. We will, I think, do a new analysis now towards the end of the year so that we can take into account, obviously, what a strange year of 2020, where obviously the market went down, and now we are very positive so far six months, which where the market seems to come back to the old level. Next page shows a little bit of our competitive set situation. It's our assessment. It's no external company doing this, so we have to realize it's our best assessment of the competitive situation. Moving into the next page, which is our production units, and we added in Poland last year, where we now have a capacity of some 500,000 or something like that, and we do intend to increase this capacity as time goes by. Next page shows the different brands that we're working with. In some cases, some people are very happy with Troax. In some other cases, with some other brands. We do intend to continue to work with this because they have different product ranges, different product qualities, and also different distribution channels. Now, moving into a little bit of what we call Safer Tomorrow, which obviously we've been doing since 1955. We, of course, work a lot with sustainability. I don't think any company cannot work a lot with that today. We work a lot with, which I said before, not only climate compensation program rather than transportations, which is the classical one, even if it's not solving perhaps the issue. We work a lot with the energy consumption. We have regional manufacturing, which decreases transportation, et cetera. We try to work, of course, with the ISO 14000, try to minimize use of plastic products. Then we have a good point, which is that 99% or maybe even higher, it's recyclable steel and minimum 30%, and we will probably change that to a high figure. We'll redesign and have recycled steel in our products. That, of course, is the main, let's call it, problem in when we analyzed and the CO2 content that we are giving away to the environment that's coming from the process of steel. If we can either help sustainable means or at least buying recycled steel to bigger quantities, then of course that will help sustainability for us in a major way. That's much more important actually than what we do in our own factories, even if we shouldn't, of course, in any way neglect what we are doing. It will also have, of course, an effect on our environment. Right. Next page, Troax test centers, where we do a lot of development work. We also, as you see from the next page, are certified by TÜV Rheinland, which of course I may say it's very good because that does mean then that the customer not only have to trust our Troax family life and stands for everything, but actually we have someone who's certifying us and keeping an eye on us, which I think is very good from a customer point of view. In essence, you see here on the next page, this is our main factory in Hillerstorp, but we have, as you saw from the other pictures before, a number of factories now all over the world, more or less. Our aim is, of course, to protect people, property, and processes. Being the original since 1955, we think that we are best suited to continue to do that. Just to end my presentation, our aim is, of course, to protect what matters. Obviously, that's the family. We want to help all companies to protect the people who are working in the organization. Obviously they can have safety when they shift or they're working as always. That's what we aim for. With this, I end my little presentation, and I hope I will, as usual, get some very good questions, and I will do my best to answer. Please go ahead. I'm listening. Thank you. Ladies and gentlemen, we will now begin the question and answer session. As a reminder, if you wish to ask a question, please press star one on your telephone and wait for your name to be announced. If you wish to cancel your request, you can press the hash key. Once again, please press star one if you wish to ask a question. Your question comes from the line of Kenneth Toll Johansson from Carnegie. Your line is now open. Yes. Thank you. I'm impressed by your growth and I remember you took some time to expanding your capacity both in the U.S. and also major plants in Europe. Kenneth, I'm sorry to interrupt you, but I hear you very bad. Okay. I think there's some sort of problem. Okay. Is it better now? Yes, it's better now, Kenneth. Okay, great. You invested a lot in production capacity a few years ago, but now your growth is very, very strong. I was wondering, are you getting close to capacity, full capacity utilization? In that case, how quickly can you expand production capacity more? Good question, Kenneth. No, we still have machine capacity, at least available, especially we have both in Hillerstorp and in Italy, because there we made some substantial investment in the last, let's call it, five years. We still have some machine capacity over. We don't short-term need to rush away and do imminent investments to cover this. Even, of course, that because of the very good volume development, that the slack in machine capacity will, of course, even up to a certain extent, which of course is very good and we're happy with. The problem from the machine capacity is actually our new acquired business in Poland later, where this demand coming from automated warehouse may extend that they actually have had to turn away some orders, where we are in the process and are investing more. These investments will not come into process due to deliveries of machines until earliest end of this year. There will be, unfortunately, a bit of a deficit then in that part. The, let's call it, the ordinary Troax part does not suffer short-term from any problems with machine capacity. Okay, great. On steel prices, you talked a little bit about sharp increases and that it might affect your margins going forward, but that it would have affected your earnings already in the second quarter, and you are raising prices. Do you think that the net effect between your own price increases and higher input costs will be a lot more negative in the third quarter than it was in the second quarter? It depends, of course, how they will. What we know to date, I think it will be some sort of similar situation. Hopefully we can compensate what they intend to do in the third quarter in a similar way. That's how we see it. We will see the effects when we talk again then in October. So far, with the information we've got, I think we can handle this situation. Okay. Finally, last year, of course, you were negatively affected by the COVID-19, but there might have been some costs that have also been a bit lower, such as traveling costs and costs for trade fairs, and et cetera. Correct. Yes. Yeah. Do you think that those kind of costs are increasing in the second half of this year already, or are you staying course until next year? No, you're right. That's an obvious conclusion. Of course, we'll be slightly higher during second half of this year. Not perhaps so that we will do a lot of exhibitions and so because those won't come back until next year, but the traveling will restart and some other costs will come back, so that will be a little bit higher. Because of the volume increase, I would say in general, we have to strengthen the organization in certain cases. We are actually then pushing the organization right now with the present volume a little bit too high, I would say, so we have to do some increases here and there, which of course will have some influence on costs compared to what you see now during the second quarter at least. That also goes for salespeople? Are you adding salespeople? Yes, we are adding some salespeople. Correct. Finally, the capacity utilization. As I understood it's quite evenly spread between the different plants you have and so on. Is that true? It was at least true. It has changed a little bit now, I would say, in the last 3, 4 months. If I tell you then that there's overcapacity still possibility in Fjelie and Italy, whereas for the module to the increased demands in the last of the 3 quarters, they're always struggling with capacity problems. Sandefjord next, not maybe generally, but Sandefjord next. As I said, maybe Thomas is really up to having no excess capacity, basically. That should mean that profitability for the Folding Guard operation should be better now. Yes satisfactory. Yeah. Correct. Yes. The utilization of course helps in the profitability. Absolutely. Correct. Yes. Okay, great. Thanks. That's all from me. Thank you. Thank you. Once again, for the participants over the phone line, please press star one if you wish to ask a question. Your next question comes from the line of Adolphi Baraderid from Danske Bank. Your line is now open. Yes. Hello. Thank you, Thomas, and good afternoon. Just the first question will be on your comment regarding the catch-up effect on order intake. For me, it's hard to understand, so I need a little bit more color on it because you had, of course. a type of order intake before the COVID between EUR 40 million, and I would say a big picture, EUR 40 million, EUR 45 million, and then two quarter with something like EUR 38 million. Since Q4, almost EUR 60 million in order intake. Why should we still be in a catch-up effect? For me, it's already done. Do you still see that? Yes. It's also a good question, Adolphi Baraderid. I think, clearly, that there is some sort of catch-up effect because not only we have seen them, but it's more the medium-sized customers have come back during second quarter, and they brought with them then a number of course, maybe not spectacular orders, but nevertheless, a number of smaller orders, which obviously has been put on ice then since last year or maybe even earlier. I think there is a certain effect of that, even if, as you said, it's difficult for us to assess how big it is. Even if I can't give you a figure, I would still say then that maybe the second quarter figure is slightly on the positive side because of this. The underlying market is very good, so it's not so that it is. We're not talking about 30, 40% or so, but we are talking about some sort of effect which we estimate is a catch-up effect. In terms of competition, do you see the competitors are growing as quickly as you, or are you taking market share because of the COVID situation when it was difficult to deliver on time and these type of things? Right. We think that is our own estimate, that we took market share both last year because of what exactly you explained, Alexis. This year, we have clearly been taking, of course, market share because we've been profiting from these bigger projects where there has not been so many of those out in the market. Obviously, we've been growing more than most of our competitors. I think that's a fair effect. Okay. My last question will be in term of mix, because you are saying that these small clients are coming back. You are giving a positive comment on automotive. I know from the past that you were saying that small clients are always very positive in term of margin effect. What can you say about the automotive sector? Is it still very competitive or less? Automotive? Yeah. Automotive is always competitive. I would say that at least for the first part of this year, if anything, they were even more competitive because they were struggling, I think, with cash restraints or liquidity restraints. We felt that was even tougher with pricing in the automotive than before. Perhaps now that things are getting back, if not to normal, so at least some sort of positive development, it will then also normalize and perhaps not become that price sensitive as it was from the beginning of this year. It's been a bit tougher, I would say, this year, price-wise, and maybe there will be some slight improvements during second half year because then it's a more positive situation for them as companies. Okay, good. Maybe last question on M&A. You did 2 great acquisitions lately and still a strong balance sheet. Are you still looking at some bigger target in APAC? Do you see that there is some competitor who are growing and becoming bigger, and that might be very interesting for you to buy them? Is it still a very fragmented market and APAC is still a very fragmented market. There are no big competitors at all that you can buy because they don't exist. There are a number of smaller ones, I would say three, four, five of them, which we are interested in, and hopefully we can get our hands on one or two of them over time. As regards the more mature market in Europe and the U.S. or North America, we are indeed, of course, always interested to make acquisitions as long as that they are right, so to speak, from the strategical point of view. If something comes up, we are clearly interested. When something comes up, it could take two, three years before something really matures, we are clearly interested. If anyone out there is interested to sell a good company within safety fences, we are really interested. That's our conclusion. Great. Thank you. That's all for me. Thank you very much, Thomas. Thank you, Alexis. Bye. Thank you. Your next question comes from the line of John Putner from Enter. Your line is now open. Hello, Thomas. Can you hear me? Yes, I hear you, John. Nice to talk to you. That's great. Nice to talk to you as well. First time in a while you said something positive about the auto industry. Can you elaborate a little bit more? What do you see in terms of bigger projects? We've seen a lot of new car models coming out, but not really big investments in your field. Are those about to come now with all the new models that we see on the market? I think generally speaking, as far as I can understand, the financial situation and this problem, which were last year with a lot of layoffs and then what have you in that type of market, has stabilized now. I think they look more positively to the future. That, of course, has a healthy impact also on smaller supplier like us, which maybe has had a certain impact on the safety side for their investments. We have seen, and it started on a positive trend with automotive in North America, and then it came also a bit back in the second quarter now in Europe. We have not seen so much in APAC or the Far East yet. We can see that it's coming in different phases. We do clearly see then that more and more at least question is coming up regarding this kind of safety issues in the investments that are in. I would expect maybe not a straight line in automotive, but I would expect that it is growing now step by step, but probably a little bit slow, not any really big increases. It's based then, of course, on their financial situation and general situation has been stabilized. They probably know much better how to handle the different segments, hybrids and electrical cars and diesels and what have you. Of course, they also need to do a lot based on the explosion, or what you might call it, on the demand for electrical cars, which of course, they need to invest a lot in. I've been a little surprised before that the obvious output of electrical cars did not manifest itself in Are you interested in other types of fencing? It seems to come now, but it was a bit slower than I at least expect. Have you seen any changes that perhaps they are better in reusing fences or maybe adapting the production line? We haven't seen that yet. Okay. Yeah, we haven't seen that. I don't think that's changed, that the investment they did in our types of fences, to be frank, it's such a small part of the total capital spending. I don't think they put in a lot of efforts to take that apart and clean it and put it back, and then buy some additional parts and what have you. They will buy that from either us in complete packages or from their sub-supplier, their machine supplier, which supplies the line that they are installing, and they will buy that. That thing is because they need to get the line operating in such a short time, and they don't have the capacity to do a lot of these small changes that we sometimes design. Okay, good. Finally, around what share of sales goes to automotive during this first half of 2021? I used to say that last year was 10%-15%, so it was on the low side. I haven't calculated yet on what the first half year will be. It was rather low for the first quarter and higher for the second quarter. I would say that probably we are coming close now to 15% of the turnover, which is related to automotive. All right. Interesting. Well, thank you very much, Thomas. Yeah, thank you. Thank you. Once again, for the participants over the phone line, please press star 1 if you wish to ask a question. Still no further question that came through, sir, please continue. Yeah. Thank you very much for your interest and for your attention. I appreciate it very much. Of course, also the question. I look forward to talk to you again, maybe end of October, something like this, or maybe beginning of November, when we are then explaining our third quarter results, which, of course, will be interesting if this good trend continues or not. We will certainly then do our best to fulfill the expectations. Thank you very much for listening and see you then. Bye-bye. Thank you. This concludes today's conference call. Thank you for participating. You may now disconnect.