Welcome everyone to Chroma's 2020 second quarter earnings conference call. All lines have been placed on mute to prevent background noise. After the presentation, there will be a question-and-answer session. Please follow the instructions given at that time if you would like to ask the question. For your information, a webcast replay will be available within an hour after the conference is finished. Please visit www.chroma.com.tw/investor/index under the investor relations section. Now I would like to introduce the CFO, Paul Ying. Mr. Ying, please begin.
Thank you, Jason. This is Paul Ying and Jennifer from Chroma. Thanks for your participation of this second quarter of 2020, our financial results release. Well, 2020 second quarter, the sales revenue for parent company reached at the TWD 2,313,000,000. This is Q-over-Q, 13% up, and 14% up on a Y-O-Y base. The gross margin of the second quarter of 2020 is approach at 52%. Operating margin reached at the 25%. Our net income, the final outcome is the TWD 584 million. This is Q-over-Q, 24% up, and another 23% up by Y-O-Y base. For the second quarter highlights, the major growth in this quarter is contributed from the semiconductor and photonics sectors. This represents a growth of 21% on a Q-over-Q base, and 43% growth on a Y-O-Y base.
Well, as to the summary of the second quarter, we give the guidance for the year 2020 like the following. Our first half consolidated sales revenue reached at the TWD 7.2 billion. This represents a growth of 20% on a year-over-year basis. The parent company sales reached at the TWD 4.4 billion, this represents a growth of 22% growth on the year-over-year basis. This is mainly contributed from the semiconductor and photonics testing solutions again, which increased 57% compared to the last year.
As to the business outlook for 2020, the first bullet point we show that this is directly a development of the AIoT, convergence of the AI and IoT, and increasing the application of higher performance chips, such as CPU or GPU, sensors, RF connections, et cetera, which will be continuously driving the sales growth in semiconductor and photonics testing solutions, particularly from several areas. The first one would be the high reliability testing solutions. This including a burn-in test and SLT system level test and thermal control and temperature stimulation. The second sector will be like the VCSEL and the ToF testing for 3D sensing. Another one will be like the OFC, stands for the optical fiber communication testing.
The other area will be the testing instrument and ATS for power testing solutions, launching new generation power electronics testing, which will enhance the power density and functional testing for using in green energy, including EV-related components, battery module, battery pack, and the smart grid, and 5G server-related power testing. We still maintain a pretty good outlook at the third quarter. Well, again, third quarter is the traditional peak of the year for seasonalities. Well, as to the fourth quarter, we still look at that. There are probably some uncertainty, like the COVID-19 still stay there, and it seems that in some countries still got very serious conditions. That will be one of the uncertainty. The second uncertainty is regarding to the elections in the U.S. presidency.
The third one is the conflict between China and the U.S. still let the economy in very unstable status. I think these are the uncertainties that we look at the fourth quarter. We don't see anything that clear yet. This is the outlook for 2020. Now open for questions.
Yes. Thank you, Mr. Ying. Ladies and gentlemen, we will now begin our question-and-answer session. If you have a question for any of today's speakers, please press zero one on your telephone keypad, and you will enter the queue. After you are announced, please ask your question. If you find that your question has been answered before it is your turn to speak, please press zero two to cancel the question. Thank you. The first question is coming from Jeff Ohlweiler of Macquarie. Go ahead, please.
Yeah. Hi, Paul. Thanks for taking the question. You said third quarter is the normal peak season, and it looks like it's going to happen again this year. Can you maybe talk about the sequential momentum for ATEs, semi-photonics, turnkey, and then the other subsidiaries? Anything that's particularly growing faster or slower than the rest of the company sequentially in the third quarter? Thank you.
Hi, Jeff. This is Jennifer. Yes, I think our second quarter performance is still better than first quarter. We actually expect the third quarter will be better than the second quarter. I think this year we probably will enjoy the so-called seasonality pattern, which is the third quarter will be the peak. Major delivery in the third quarter, number one, mostly comes from the SLT testers delivered. Then, we do have at least one turnkey project, which is for battery cell, to deliver in the quarter. I wouldn't say uncertain. We need to keep an eye on the fourth quarter due to the U.S. election and also the U.S. and China tensions. Maybe so far, we have a little bit concerned about the fourth quarter. Third quarter, our order delivery is pretty much on track. Okay. Back to the product sector.
We have a guide that our semiconductor and photonics sectors, last year, we present a 20% growth rate. This year we probably will enjoy a similar growth rate. Far, based on order, hence, should be better than we guided 20%. First half, actually, we delivered more in the photonics sectors versus IC tester, like SLT testers. The second half, SLT will be better than photonics sectors. ATEs so far is not very much changed. I think they will present another year of stable growth. Turnkey. We do have two turnkey solution products, one with a down pay already, and we hope to have similar sales as last year if there is not much changes. Yeah. This is so far we could guide about our product mix.
Okay, great. Thanks, Jennifer. I guess maybe another follow-up question. On the photonics side, you put the VCSEL, TOF and the OFC testers. How different technology or products are those three? Are we seeing any competition in those areas at this point?
You mean the VCSEL comparison?
No. If I look at photonics, essentially you list VCSEL, TOF, and OFC, and I'm just curious. One, is there much difference in the testers for those three products, or they're very similar in terms of technology?
Okay. Yes. The OFC is different to the VCSEL because VCSEL apparently is just ToF. Okay. We highlight also 3D is because recently we received this U.S. customer, the next generation of products with a different design of a ToF.
I wouldn't say this is for iPhone. They are developing another product. The optical fiber one is the EO wafer testers. Yes, they are different models.
Just the last question, kind of related, are you seeing any competitors for you, anything in the photonics area at this point, or do you still essentially dominate that space?
We pretty much dominate it, especially for the gallium nitride applications. Android count, they are expecting to redesign their TOF, so since we cover most of the iOS and the EO wafer testers, so you can say we pretty much dominate the market so far.
Okay, great. I guess one last question before I jump back in line is SLT. I know historically a lot of those sales have been for auto-related ICs. Going forward, can you talk a bit more, where are you specifically seeing end market growth for Chroma specifically in SLT?
Actually, SLT application, you can simply break down to three large sectors. First one is for mobile, which is the mostly related volume. The reason for that is, as you may notice, the 5G mobile. We move on to 5G, due to complexity and the integrative designs, which will be more demanded for these SLT testers. We believe this is the market where Advantest and Teradyne focus on because of volume, so they can bring out their testers price because of having a large number of testing. Second one is a niche market. Anything you consider about HPC market. HPC, because you're looking forward, your target is zero defect. You have to use SLT. The issue for a niche market, including GPU, single image sensors, AI processor chips, and autos, or EV or others, first thing is they couldn't be consistent size. Okay?
They all come with different size, different pin count, different solution. You largely need that for back-to-back design. This is where the growth market is situated for the markets. Okay? Currently, we have the biggest portion of market share for the niche market part. As you may notice from the TSMC, the guidance, the HPC application will gradually increase. This is where we benefit from HPC market. Last one is CPU. CPU, when you design these testers to fit into CPU, these type of products, the design of the tester tend to be inelastic. Which cannot be really fit into first two markets, which is fast turnover and upgraded spec, this kind of testers design. So far it's only OEM which is being supported with Intel only. Sometimes we will be crossed the line.
For example, sometimes we sell our thermal temperature simulation to the CPU, which is Intel, for testing their Auto CPU. Sometimes we also sell some of the testers, which is covered for 5G mobile chip, because they need to isolate this kind of 5G signal to complete the testing. We do SLT five or six years earlier ahead of market. If you talk about applications, the design phase, we have patents, we have much more special technology compared to the other competitors.
Okay, great. Thank you very much.
Thank you.
Thank you.
The next question is coming from Angus Lin of HSBC. Go ahead, please.
Hi, guys. I wanted to know, you had a gross margin fall off in second quarter, despite your semi-photonics actually going pretty strong. Can you give us some color around the gross margin movement in second quarter and maybe going into maybe second half, the direction or why? Thank you.
Your question is based on the gross margin, right?
Yeah. For 3Q or outlook. Yeah, thank you.
Gross margin, we still pretty much target on 50%-55%, and I would say it's not really certain product that is low margin. First quarter, I think because we delivered large number of 5G or server-related high power testing. As you know, we have a pretty good strength in the high power testing. Maybe this could be a reason why gross margin is around 55%.
It's still the product mix.
Yeah. In the second quarter, I checked the numbers. I think mostly come from the semi-photonics and semi SLT. I don't think SLT is really picking up in the second quarter. I think it's just based on thermal products from the semiconductor sectors, I would say. Yeah.
As long as it's over 50%, it seems healthy to the management.
Yeah.
Yeah, maintaining 52%, 53%, I think is quite a normal margin.
I pretty much agree with you because that third quarter, if we deliver battery cell orders, maybe gross margin will be not very much different compared to the second quarter. For July and August, I would say mostly SLT, and then August and September, we will battery cell orders. Maybe blend everything together, still able to over 50%. Yeah.
I see. Because the reason why I asked it is because, I think traditionally, your test instrument business gross margin is higher than turnkey. I don't know if semi-photonics-
That's true.
whether gross margin is higher or below test instrument, because I see your semi-photonics actually going pretty strong in 2Q. You are coming off from 1Q to 2Q with gross margin dip. Now with 3Q coming in with a turnkey project ticking in, and along the end of it, the test instrument actually continues to be stable. No longer you may be gross margin, though your top line will still grow quarter-to-quarter to seasonal peak. Gross margin, from this might see some pressure despite growing top line, right?
Oh.
Directional-wise, I guess.
Because the turnkey is a blended gross margin. Sometimes there's no way every project can ensure you fix with a 50% gross margin. If we review what we going to deliver in third quarter, blend semiconductor factors and then plus with turnkey together, I think supposed to be able to over 50%, still pretty much in line with the corporate average.
I see. Okay. My second question is with regard to your MIS. The run rate now seems to be below TWD 1 billion for this year. Can you help us give some color about what's going on in MIS segment now, is the current run rate of MIS seems to proceed through this year and maybe even go into next year? Yeah. Just some color around MIS and how should we think about it.
Looking to the next year will be a little bit too far, but for this year, I would assume that the MIS will perform pretty much like the first half and maintaining the ordinary business of MIS. I think mainly is on the market at the mainland China and looking at the panel and the solar cell, and also some other kind of mechatronics, mechanical design and end product.
Okay, great. I'll go back to the queue for now. Thank you.
Thank you.
As a reminder, please press zero one on your keypad if you would like to ask the question. Thank you. We are now in question-and-answer session. Please press zero one on your keypad if you would like to ask the question. Thank you. The next question is coming from Willy Chin of J.P. Morgan Asset Management. Go ahead, please.
Hey, Paul and Jennifer. Two or three questions by side, if it's possible. The first one is also related to gross margin. If we look at more historical numbers, longer-term trend, the gross margin for our parent testing business actually declined from 54% in 2014, all the way to around 50% in 2019. I understand that you mentioned the 50% is actually a pretty decent margin, and I also agree that. Just understanding that, because you mentioned there's an increasing power output, the testing should have higher margins. I think if I look at the past few years, that should be the case. I was just wondering that why the margin trend over the past five years has been in a decline trend, despite still pretty strong. Can you just help me to clear about this? That's the first question.
Your first question, the question is related to consolidated, right?
No, the parent testing, not consolidated. Parent testing.
Oh, parent testing, the gross margin?
Yeah. It must decline from 55% level to about 50%. It was still pretty strong. Just wondering, over the past four or five years, despite this rising power output, you mentioned how high power testing should have higher margin
Yeah.
Why the margin for the overall parent company show a decline trend over the past three, five years?
Our corporate gross margin target is always want to maintain around 50%. Okay. Honestly, the gross margin stream is sometimes mostly come from the customer's design. Sometimes we want to gain some order, and the customers would like us, besides this order, they want us to help them to integrate some of the tools into the testers. This is some kind of value added or extra service to our customers. In this case, customers notice those integration is come from their request, it's highly not possible to just raise up the gross margin because this is their additional services. Lately, three or five years, we do a lot of cases. Going forward will be the same situation. Sorry. Direct design to those large companies. Those giant companies. We cannot say this kind of situation will not happen again.
Honestly, these do happen in some of the VCSEL cases and some of the SLT cases. Sometimes gross margin could not stick with always 50 factors. Even we grant this technology as the first runner or first adopters, but sometimes we will do extra service, helping customers to integrate some tools, just to meet the customer satisfaction and then create the
I see. Do you have any specific sectors that you are seeing hitting the margin pressure? Is that more correlated to the test instrument or semiconductor? I think for IC, they are in a decline trend. I think for key contributor will be the instrument and then also photonics and so on. Do you see any specific sector that face this margin headwind because of the design complexity that you mentioned on the extra design effort?
Okay. I wouldn't say it's a gross margin pressure, because this, I would say, this is product natures. If you look at the turnkey, you blend a lot of different automation phases. Of course, gross margin blended. For a project, this is nature. You look at the project's gross margin, you don't look at individual attachments gross margins. I would say turnkey project is a blended gross margin. For cases that I just mentioned, providing extra service or extra integration, this normally happen to the semiconductor.
I see. Okay. Thank you. That's very clear.
Thank you.
Second question is.
Yes.
Okay. Second question is related to the semi testing you mentioned. In the first half, your run rate is actually close to 60% year-over-year growth. You mentioned that your target of this year will be 20%, and there will be some upside potential. For the second half, you mentioned there's also semi and photonics, but how about the run rate of growth compared to first half? Are we seeing a similar growth rate versus the first half, or we will probably see a slowdown of the run rate?
You have gross margin in right? Not the 50%.
No, I mean the growth rate. Yeah. Sales growth rate.
Sales growth rate? Okay.
Yeah.
I can tell you second half sales will be better than first half.
For semi and photonics.
Semi and photonics.
That's the second question.
Okay.
I think the second question is semi and photonics.
Last time we guide is a similar growth rate as last year, 20%. TWD 2.3 billion. Now we forecast will be better than 20% growth rate. You can use last year numbers and times more than 20% growth rate. 20-something growth rate. Yeah.
Right. If I use that, it implies that the second half growth rate for semi and photonics, probably in low teen, right? Like 10 level, or low digit level. Is that the implied growth rate for the semi and photonics in the second half?
You mean the first half we only have TWD 1.5 billion, maybe it should be less than TWD 1.5 billion. This is what you mean, right?
Yeah. I was just wondering, give me some because you just said there's some upside, right? I was just wondering, because the first half growth rate already 57%, close to 60% of the growth rate, right? If you apply even 30% growth, that actually, if your second half will be slowed down to about 15% year-over-year. But still pretty strong. Is that the case? I'm just wondering the directions. I understand probably our project issue is a common expectation, but just wondering, is that the trend we are looking for?
Our SLT and photonics, these two factors, first, second half. If you add the SLT and photonics together, first half and second half will not very much change. I need to double-check with our local team captain about this, how they determine. I think the determine factor is compounded. Yeah.
Okay. Sure.
Maybe not too far from the first half. Anyway, this is the best we could say.
Oh, okay. That means that'll be very strong, though. That'll be way beyond the 20% growth.
Yeah.
Okay.
Yeah, because photonics order already firm.
Yeah. Okay. Thank you. It is very clear. Last question, if possible.
Yes.
Is regarding to the test instrument and ATS, because at second quarter, we see a year-over-year decline about flattish sales in the second quarter. Can you elaborate a bit why cause the flattish? Is it because of HPC, because of any other segment that caused the flattish sales?
Flattish for ATS quarter-on-quarter?
No, I mean year-on-year. Yeah.
I think based on capacity allocation, because actually our second quarter, mostly capacity need to prepare for schedule for photonics and then the SLT factors. Actually, we don't deliver all the products in one quarter. Sometimes we need to allocate some resources between semiconductor factors and then ATS. You can say from my numbers, I would say second quarter, the major deliver is supposed to be photonics related.
I see. It's not an end demand issue, right? I mean, for the ATS and test instrument in the second quarter, it was not because of demand issues, more like the internal resource allocation. For now, the demand, I think that will happen in the second half.
Yeah, I would say the best way to look at ATS is look at year to date. Yeah.
Okay. Understood. That's very clear. Thank you so much.
Thank you.
Thank you.
We are now in question-and-answer session. Please press zero one on your telephone keypad if you would like to ask a question. Thank you. The next question is coming from Angus Lin of HSBC. Go ahead, please.
Hi, guys. I think in the year 2020 outlook page, you said that you are going to launch new power testing equipment for EV power, smart grid, and 5G server.
Yeah.
Sorry, I know you guys probably mentioned this in the very remark, but I dialed in later, so probably I missed it. I'm wondering from this, is it going to be a strong second-half test instrument segment driver? Because you mentioned that first half, you have capacity constraints, so you guys allocate more to semi-photonics. Test instruments was a bit weak in 2Q. From your launching new equipment to EV power testing part, are you seeing the test instrument to pick up in second half from first half?
I think overall this year, ATS will maintain just a stable growth. I am expecting over 10% growth this year. Well, this is a pretty much very constructive view because as I mentioned in the beginning, we do have some concern in the fourth quarter because the election and also the Chinese and U.S. tensions.
Okay. I think I'll move to a longer-term question instead of just near-term dynamics.
Yeah.
I think you guys have a very solid growth this year, potentially for semi-photonics. If you look into next year, we're not going to talk about the bottom or whatever of this, but next year, are you going to foresee any re-acceleration or even deceleration for your three current segment business? For me, it's like you have spent photonics, especially ToF, pretty much ramping in the past nine months already with SLT to kind of catch up the momentum from here going through the year-end. I'm wondering, going to next year, what would be some drivers that you see would actually persist or being much stronger? Yeah. Some thoughts about it for next year.
Whatever guide in the beginning of the year, I think is the major role for this year, which is we pretty much deliver for what we guide in the beginning of the year. The same SLT as the biggest growth drivers, then followed up by the photonics, like EO wafer testers. We even give a guidance regarding next three years, we expecting our semiconductor combined with photonic factors altogether will be close to 50% of the testing equipment business. Despite that, there will be no decline from the ATS, which is power testing. In this case, semiconductor sector needs to maintain certain types of a growth rate for coming next three years' time. We see the drivers actually come from HPC markets application continues to increase, which leads increasing demand for SLT. Especially this year, we launched this product.
The reason why we gain so much order for the SLT this year is because we launched some of this kind of very flexible design for the SLT, which increase the throughput for the SLT for testing the niche product like a GPU, AI processors chips, and even start to cover CMOS image sensor. We see some other applications, for example, like wireless, like Xilinx, and then Skyworks also interest to try out our new testers because no matter on the temperature simulations and then also the size, it is the maximized numbers in the market. We do see the continuous increase of demand for these applications for HPC markets, which is also lead to increase the demand for SLT. I really think our design is very competitive. Secondly is gallium nitride applications, which is we already mentioned, like a ToF.
I think going forward, I think couple new products that customers pass on to us the designs, mostly related to TOFs. You will see more applications from TOF designs. Besides this EO wafer. EO wafer, I think this is volume driven. I think after this kind of tension is settled, I think 5G will continue to develop. We don't have too much concern about the EO demands. I think we are pretty much on the right track. Not only this generation, the TOF ones, we also got another two designs of the TOF.
Okay. I understand.
I wouldn't say like future is hard to predict. I wouldn't say 100% sure. We already pretty much I think for semiconductor development, we are pretty much on the right track.
Okay. Got it. Okay. I'll go back to the queue for now. Thank you.
Thank you.
As a reminder, please press zero one on your telephone keypad if you would like to ask the question. Thank you. The next question is coming from Willy Chin of J.P. Morgan Asset Management. Go ahead please, Willy.
Hey, Jennifer. Sorry, just one follow-up question from me. You mentioned SLT testing demand is pretty strong, and then you also comment a bit on the three end market, right? Just wondering, can you just share a bit SLT as a percentage of all semi and other testing, like how much that account for upsales in 2019? You mentioned the three segments for SLT. I would think that how you position the niche market, and then can you specifically, what's the proportion, I mean, for SLT market, can you break down a bit, like mobile niche markets to you, what's the size of each market or the percentage of the size of each market, and then who are you competing with in the niche market?
Okay. Last year, we generated total semiconductor and photonics sectors, around TWD 2.3 billion, and TWD 1 billion that is photonics related. I only could say last year, I think over 50% come from EO wafer. You can see the pie is pretty much beat up. This year to date, I would say, let me calculate. First half, I think IC testers and vertical photonics, I would say pretty much even. EL still more than VCSEL. Let me brief a little bit, because photonics sector first quarter, we mostly deliver to Android. Android, after seeing the iOS launch are deciding to redesign GUIs. In the second quarter, when we deliver photonics, the VCSEL is mostly to iOS. However, for photonics sector, most of it still comes from, I would say, raw EO.
Remaining IC testers, I think the SLT start to pick up on second quarter, but I don't think I will give a precise number for SLT sales contribution. We do every comment, SLT this year will reach the first set of milestones to over a billion of sales.
I see.
Second half will be, if you talk about SLT testers, second half will be more than first half. Sorry, what is your second question? I just missed it.
You mentioned the three end markets, mobile, niche market.
Oh, okay.
What's the proportion of and which competitor in the SLT niche market?
Three years ago, we passively gave out to 4G mobile because we don't have time to deliver to more sites. We were homegrown as a big die SLT makers. At that time, it already gave to Teradyne. Remember, Teradyne acquired Universal Robots. This is the first time they step into mobile. The reason they can bring that order and sell it for TWD 2.5 million is because they can design a tray which is fitting the biggest numbers of mobile chips. A mobile chip is usually very small, which pretty much economical to fit into Teradyne and then test their business models. Move on to 5G this year, we start to get into 5G markets because some of the niche testing methods they don't cover.
Maybe the reason we do receive several from MediaTek, Qualcomm, prefer some of our testers, I mean, SLT testers, maybe single function or multi-functions. The reason for that is because we're able to design a good feature with a better, very competitive price. We're able to design SLT price range very big, from TWD 200,000 to TWD 2 million. This kind of business model cannot fit into niche market, which is a big-size chip markets because the chip cannot be modularized, I mean, tester cannot be modularized, and chip cannot be standardized. For this kind of big-size, how could you fit into as big number as possible if everyone's tray is pretty much the same? Not possible.
How could you sell a tray which can only fit 16 dies, and you want to sell for TWD 2 million? Which is cost only sell TWD 200,000. Not possible, right? Also not to talk about, okay, for the niche market, which is the HPC market, you need to have a special technique. For example, if you talk about wireless, no matter you are talking about wireless, AI process chips, or auto, you compress forward. You need to compress the chips with a force over 100 kg - 300 kg, so your chip is able to link up with the motherboards to do testing. If you couldn't reach this kind of force rate, it cannot connect. Okay, when you connect, the temperature gets really high, sometimes over 90 degrees. All the pin cap will start to melt, and you couldn't do thermal control.
To test the niche market, you need to have several special techniques. It's not simply just economy or you just compete with price. That's why I mentioned in the beginning, if you want to cover niche markets, you need to have the capability to do back-to-back design for all different types of chips. I serve GPU, I couldn't use for AI process, even I deal with the same account, which is NVIDIA.
I think because Advantest and Teradyne also mentioned their SLT development is strong. I think that strongness is actually mainly from the volume or the mobile business side.
Yeah, I agree.
Like they focus more on the volume because DRAM is their strength. DRAM memory and IC are their strength.
No, DRAM, you don't need SLT. SLT design is because the complexity of the chip. If for this kind of standard model, you apparently don't need the SLT. Only granting the mobile market can fit into their business model. If you look at their business model, they at least need to sell touch over TWD 2 million. If you don't trust me, you just cross-check with Teradyne. All their touch is something over TWD 2 million. I think the biggest threat for Teradyne is Advantest, because Advantest they do have the key design. Going forward, if you look at 5G market, what is really a key? First one, burn-in system. Second one, temperature simulation. This is a problem we all have had for many, many years. Teradyne, they don't have these two key, burn-in and thermal control. Why is that?
If you look at 5G markets, it's all high power consumption. You definitely need burn-in. Three years ago, have you ever heard any chip need to have burn-in? None. Nothing. Now most of the 5G-related chips, not just only for HPC, including mobile, probably all need to have a burn-in process because 5G is all about power consumption. If you also want to step into photonic compound semi-related, you need to have a skill about thermal control and temperature simulation. To gain a compound semi market, temperature is the key. Far, Advantest, if you look at their sales, mostly is consolidated stuff from the company they acquired. They haven't really elaborated or integrated those features and come out with a solution. Most of the Chroma testers is all integrated for the company we acquired. Sales we consolidate in.
I see. That's very helpful. Thank you so much. Super helpful, yes.
Okay, thank you.
Thank you.
Ladies and gentlemen, we thank you for all your questions. There are currently no questions. I'll hand it over to the CFO, Paul Ying, for closing remarks. Mr. Ying, please proceed.
Well, thanks everyone. It seems to us that we have a pretty good second quarter and first half. We are waiting for the next half, and let's move forward. Thank you, and bye-bye until next time.
Thank you, Mr. Ying. Ladies and gentlemen, we thank you for your participation in Chroma's conference. There will be a webcast replay within an hour. Please visit www.chroma.com.tw/investor/index under the investor relations section. You may now disconnect. Goodbye