Good morning, everyone. My name is Alan, and I will be your conferencing operator today. I would like to welcome everyone to the FTG fourth quarter 2023 analyst call. All lines have been placed on mute. There will be a question and answer session following the call. If you would like to ask a question during this time, simply press star followed by the number one on your telephone keypad. If you would like to withdraw your question, please press star two. Please note that this call is being recorded. I would now like to turn the call over to Mr. Brad Bourne, President and Chief Executive Officer of FTG. Mr. Bourne, you may, you may proceed.
Thank you. Good morning. I'm Brad Bourne, President and CEO of Firan Technology Group Corporation, or FTG. Also on the call today is Jamie Crichton, our Chief Financial Officer. Before we go any further, I must caution you that this call may contain forward-looking statements. Such statements are based on the current expectations of management of the company and inherently involve numerous risks and uncertainties, known and unknown, including economic factors and the company's industry generally. The preceding list is not exhaustive of all possible factors. Such forward-looking statements are not guarantees of future performance, and actual events and results could differ materially from those expressed or implied by forward-looking statements made by the company. The listener is cautioned to consider these and other factors carefully when making decisions with respect to the company and not place undue reliance on forward-looking statements.
The company does not undertake and has no specific intention to update any forward-looking statements, written or oral, that may be made from time to time by or on its behalf, whether a result of new information, future events, or otherwise. 2023 continued to improve as the year progressed, and it ended on a high note. Revenues increased each quarter throughout the year, with Q4 revenues totaling CAD 40 million. The fourth quarter sales were FTG's best quarter ever, and 2023 sales of over CAD 135 million were also a record for the company. It was a great year for FTG and was achieved by a great team of people at our company. I'd like to thank everyone at FTG for their hard work and their contributions to our success.
Throughout 2023, FTG accomplished many goals that continued to improve the corporation and position it for the future, including FTG's full-year bookings were 149.5 million, up 32% over 2022, and the book-to-bill ratio for the year was 1.11 to 1. FTG's backlog increased from 65 million at the start of the year to 97 million at year-end. The two acquisitions added approximately 18 million of backlog as of their closing date. FTG's full-year revenues increased by CAD 45 million, or 51%, to CAD 135.2 million, including CAD 22.9 million from the acquisitions. FTG achieved EBITDA of CAD 22.5 million and Adjusted EBITDA of CAD 19.4 million in 2023, compared to EBITDA of CAD 8.6 million or Adjusted EBITDA of CAD 8.8 million in 2022.
The adjustments in 2023 included a reduction to eliminate CAD 3.8 million in government support received early in the year, offset by an increase to add back CAD 0.6 million in acquisition-related costs. FTG achieved net income of CAD 11.6 million and Adjusted Net Earnings of CAD 7 million for fiscal 2023, compared to CAD 700,000 or adjusted CAD 900,000 , respectively, for 2022. The adjustments in net earnings were the same as noted for EBITDA, plus eliminating CAD 1.5 million in deferred tax recoveries from the acquisitions in 2023. In 2023, FTG had positive cash flow from operations of CAD 12.9 million. Included in this is the sale of the Chatsworth facility and the government support received early in 2023, offset by the acquisition-related costs.
The reported cash flow is after investments in CapEx of CAD 6.5 million and R&D of CAD 5.9 million. FTG also invested CAD 25.4 million in the two acquisitions in 2023, which is not included in cash from operations. FTG maintained a strong balance sheet with net debt of CAD 3.6 million at year-end, after in-noted investments in CapEx and R&D and the CAD 25 million for acquisition. This debt represents a debt to Adjusted EBITDA ratio of 0.2 to 1. Other accomplishments in 2023 included: in April, we completed the acquisition of Holaday Circuits based in Minnetonka, Minnesota. This business is now operating as FTG Circuits Minnetonka and brings U.S.-based advanced circuit board technology to enable FTG to grow its presence in the defense, HDI, or high technology market.
Also in April, we completed the acquisition of IMI, based in Haverhill, Massachusetts, north of Boston. This business is now operating as FTG Circuits Haverhill and brings RF substrate offering to FTG's customers in the U.S. Planned integration activities at both acquisitions progressed well through 2023, with improved throughput, improved pricing, cost savings, and FTG ERP information implementation well underway at Circuits Minnetonka and cost savings, equipment investments and growth plans at Circuits Haverhill. More activities and full FTG ERP implementation for both sites are planned for 2024. FTG added approximately 220 staff in 2023, with about 175 being the result of acquisitions and the remaining 45 were to support growth across the company.
In support of the new acquisitions and the overall growth of FTG, Leo LaCroix was hired as Executive Vice President of Circuits to oversee FTG's U.S. Circuits operations, including the newly acquired sites. Leo has extensive senior management experience in the circuit board industry, selling into the defense market. FTG received CAD 3.2 million in additional funding for a total of CAD 5.2 million under the Canadian Aerospace Regional Recovery Initiative, and CAD 500,000 from the Ontario government under their Advanced Manufacturing and Innovation Competitiveness, or AMIC program. In June, FTG was approved for a second NCIB, following on from the one in place over the previous 12 months. FTG is authorized to purchase up to 5% of its common shares outstanding over a 12-month period. Minimal shares were purchased during 2023.
Jamie will provide more details on the full year results as well as Q4. Let me turn to some external items. Our end market demand remains strong. Air travel continues to rebound. Airbus delivered about 650 aircraft in 2023, but more importantly, they're looking to ramp to almost 1,000 aircraft annually in the next few years, and this is a 50% production rate increase. Airbus has a backlog of over 8,000 orders, which is over a decade worth of production at current production rates. At Boeing, they shipped just under 500 planes in 2023, and have plans to ramp their production by about 40% to almost 700 planes in the next few years. Boeing's backlog is almost 6,000 planes, so also over a decade's worth of orders at current production rates.
But the FAA has told Boeing to halt their production rate increases while they ensure there is sufficient focus on quality. But overall, it is clear why both companies are looking to ramp their production. In the business jet market, Bombardier is expected to report low single-digit or low double-digit shipments, production rate increases for 2023 when they report their results, which they did this morning. In the helicopter market, Bell Helicopter reported a 31% revenue growth in 2023, and are projecting near 10% growth for 2024. All of this bodes well for us as we look to future demand in the coming years. I've also looked at results from key defense contractors in the U.S., and all of them reported revenue growth in 2023 of between 2% and 7.5% over 2022.
Looking at the longer term, Boeing's most recent 20-year forecast shows long-term industry growth, and it continues to show 20% of all new aircraft deliveries going to China and close to 40% to Asia, as has been the case in their recent forecast. The business jet market has already seen traffic recover. A recent business jet market forecast from Honeywell similarly predicts growth in this market in the coming years, with near-term double-digit growth rates for the sector. The simulator market mirrors the end market application. But as we always remind everyone about this market, it is lumpy, so large year-to-year variations do occur. As we have said for many years, FTG's goal is to participate in all segments of the aerospace and defense market as each moves through their independent business cycles.
It's not often all segments are growing, as seems to be the case now. Beyond all this, let me give you a quick update on some key metrics for FTG for 2023. First, as already noted, the leading indicator of our business is our bookings and new orders. As noted earlier, our bookings were CAD 149.5 million a year, plus we acquired $17 million in bookings when the acquisition closed, for a total of over CAD 166 million in new orders for the year. This resulted in a backlog of CAD 97 million at year-end. In 2023, sales were CAD 135 million, which is CAD 45 million above 2022 sales. About half the growth came from existing sites, while the balance was from the two acquisitions. Excluding the acquisitions, FTG's organic growth in 2023 was approximately 25%.
The organic growth was closer to 15% at our circuits business and 35% in our aerospace business. Aerospace saw a rebound in simulator activity in 2023, and we won some significant new high-level flight assemblies that converted to revenue late in 2023. In our fourth quarter, aerospace sales grew by close to 40% as a result. For the acquisitions, sequential revenue growth was approximately 12% from Q3 to Q4 as we worked to ramp them to the expected revenue level. In particular, at Circuits Minnetonka, the run rate in Q4 was over $27 million. This was about halfway from where they were in 2022 to their pre-pandemic level. They're showing good progress towards getting them to revenue levels where they will materially contribute to FTG's sales and profitability.
In our aerospace business, sales were up 35% or CAD 12 million in 2023 compared to last year. All sites were up. On the circuits side of our business, sales in 2023 were up CAD 32 million or 53% on a year-over-year basis. Just under 70% of the growth came from the acquisitions, and the balance of 30% was from organic growth at existing sites. Overall, at FTG, our top five customers accounted for 56.1% of total revenue. This compares to 55.7% last year. Also interesting to note, of the top 10 customers, six are customers shared between circuits and aerospace. We particularly like to see the shared customers, as it means we are maximizing our penetration of these customers by selling both cockpit products and circuit boards.
In 2023, 33.7% of our total revenues came from our aerospace business, compared to 38.6% last year. The aerospace business share decreased, partly due to the impact from the acquisitions, offset by growth in simulator and other high-value assemblies. I would now like to turn the call over to Jamie, who will summarize our financial results for 2023, and afterwards, I will talk about some key priorities we are working on. Jamie?
Thanks, Brad, and good morning, everyone. I'd like to provide some additional detail on our financial performance for 2023 and Q4. On sales of CAD 135.2 million, FTG achieved a gross margin of CAD 39.3 million dollars, or 29.1% in 2023, compared to CAD 21.3 million or 23.8% on sales of CAD 89.6 million in 2022. Excluding government subsidies, the gross margin was CAD 36.1 million, or 26.7% in 2023, as compared to CAD 21 million, or 23.4% in 2022. The increase in gross margin dollars and the gross margin rate is the result of higher sales volumes from the newly acquired circuit sites, operational improvements, including favorable pricing actions and favorable foreign exchange rates.
Revenue per employee was 225,000 in 2023, as compared to 194,000 in 2022, which is a 16% increase. In Q4 2023, on sales of CAD 40 million, FTG achieved a gross margin of CAD 10.7 million, or 26.7%, compared to CAD 5.7 million, or 24.2% on sales of CAD 23.8 million in Q4 2022. The increase in gross margin dollars for Q4 as compared to Q4 last year, is primarily the result of increased sales volumes in both the circuits and aerospace segments, operational improvements, including pricing actions and favorable foreign exchange rates. From a geographical standpoint, FTG has achieved strong sales growth in each region in 2023, with the exception of a CAD 0.2 million decrease in Canada and flat sales in our other region.
In 2023, 78% of FTG's sales were derived from customers in the United States, which is up from 73% in the prior year, as both the businesses acquired in 2023 principally sell into the U.S. market. SG&A expense was CAD 17.0 million, or 12.5% of sales in 2023, as compared to CAD 12.7 million, or 14.1% of sales in the prior period. The increase of CAD 4.3 million during fiscal 2023 includes expenses from the acquired businesses of CAD 1.6 million, increased headcount targeted at operational leadership, and increased performance compensation expense. Acquisition and divestiture-related expenses were CAD 0.6 million for 2023, as compared to CAD 0.5 million in 2022.
In Q4 2023, SG&A expense was 11.9% of sales, which is down from 13.3% in Q4 2022. R&D costs for 2023 were CAD 6.6 million, or 4.9% of sales, compared to CAD 5.9 million, or 6.5% of sales for 2022. R&D efforts include product and process improvements at the Circuit segment, and efforts to develop and qualify products for near-future aerospace programs. FTG is exposed to currency risk through transactions, assets, and liabilities in foreign currencies, primarily U.S. dollars. The average exchange rate experienced in 2023 was CAD 1.35, compared to CAD 1.30 in 2022, which equates to a weakening of the Canadian dollar of 4%.
We estimate that for each 1% weakening of the Canadian dollar, FTG would experience increase in pre-tax earnings of just over CAD 400,000. In 2023, the positive impact was approximately CAD 1.7 million, reduced by realized losses on foreign exchange forward contracts of CAD 0.1 million. Adjusted EBITDA, as described in the press release, was CAD 19.4 million for 2023, or 14.3% of sales, compared to CAD 8.8 million, or 9.8% of sales for 2022. Adjusted EBITDA is up 120% over 2022, as a result of growing the top line organically and through acquisitions, operational improvements, including pricing actions and operating expense control.
Adjusted EBITDA in 2023 excludes the benefit of ERC government assistance of CAD 3.8 million, and adds back acquisition expenses of CAD 0.6 million . Adjusted EBITDA for Q4 2023 was CAD 6 million, or 15% of sales, as compared to CAD 2.9 million, or 12.1% of sales in Q4 2022. For 2023, FTG recorded net earnings of CAD 11.6 million, as compared to CAD 0.7 million in 2022. In addition to the increase in pre-tax earnings over last year of CAD 11.7 million, FTG also benefited from a lower effective tax rate. The income tax provision of CAD 2.2 million equates to an effective tax rate of approximately 16%, as compared to 67% in 2022.
The 2023 tax provision included a deferred tax recovery of CAD 1.5 million, which was triggered by a step-up in the tax value of certain assets following the two acquisitions completed by FTG in 2023. The availability of U.S. tax losses and the fact that the accounting benefit of these losses had not been previously recognized in the financial statements, resulted in a deferred tax recovery. Adjusted net earnings for 2023 was CAD 7 million, or CAD 0.29 per diluted share, as compared to CAD 0.9 million, or CAD 0.04 per diluted share. Items adjusted for net earnings are the same items as adjusted for EBITDA, as well as deducting the acquisition-related deferred tax recovery. Our net debt position as of Q4 is CAD 3.6 million, as compared to a net cash of CAD 12.3 million as of Q4 2022.
Decrease in cash position is after investments in capital expenditures of CAD 6.5 million, R&D of CAD 6.6 million, and acquisitions of CAD 25.4 million, partially offset by the proceeds from the sale-leaseback of the Aerospace Chatsworth facility of CAD 8.4 million. Free cash flow in 2023, as defined in our MD&A, was CAD 1.5 million, as compared to CAD 4.1 million in 2022. Free cash flow in 2023 was negatively impacted by the increase in non-cash working capital and, to a lesser extent, the increase in CapEx. A key focus area for FTG in 2024 is an improvement in inventory turns. As at the 2023 year-end, the corporation's primary sources of liquidity totaled CAD 72.2 million, consisting of cash, accounts receivable, contract assets, and inventory.
Our revolving credit facility includes $10 million for working capital and $10 million for CapEx, which is committed through July 2026. As of the 2023 year-end, outstanding term loans under this agreement amounted to $3.4 million, leaving nearly $16.6 million, or CAD 22.6 million, of credit availability. Other sources of financing for qualifying investments include loans with the government of Canada and Province of Ontario. There is CAD 1.8 million in incremental funding available from the government of Canada through the CARI program. FTG has received CAD 5.2 million to the end of Q4 2023 from this program, and all such funding is repayable over five years without interest, starting in 2025.
We have received CAD 0.5 million to date from the Ontario loan, with additional proceeds of up to CAD 2.1 million in 2024 and early 2025. Working capital at November 30, 2023, was CAD 41 million. Accounts receivable days outstanding were 64 at the 2023 year-end, same as the prior year. Inventory turns were 3.2, compared to 3.7 in 2022, and accounts payable days were 78 at the 2023 year-end, as compared to 73 in 2022. We entered Q1 2024 with a record level of backlog of CAD 97 million, which is an increase of 49% as compared with the start of 2023. Our focus will be to complete the integration of acquisitions and improve acquisitional, sorry, operational efficiency.
Our complete set of year-end and quarterly filings are now available on sedarplus.com. With that, back to Brad.
Thanks, Jamie. Let me delve into some important items in the quarter and/or for the future performance of FTG. 2023 was a strong year for FTG. Our sales ramped significantly. We continue to work hard to ramp further in support of the demand we are seeing. This included the need to add staff. We have now achieved our target headcount across the company to support current demand. While we might tweak it slightly from site to site going forward, the majority of our staffing challenges are behind us. Looking forward, a key item for us remains the integration of our new sites. For Haverhill, we acquired them to grow our presence in the RF circuit board market for aerospace and defense application. While they are small, with a historic run rate of $4 million-$5 million, we like their capability.
The integration is relatively straightforward, as we intend to continue to operate it in its current facility with its existing staff. Our focus will be to engage our sales team with them to find new customers and to grow the business. This is not an overnight process, but one where we can generate incremental margins and profitability to the benefit of FTG. Going along with this will be some focused CapEx to address a few production constraints to enable future growth. Holaday, or FTG Circuits in Minnetonka, was a larger acquisition. Their sales were over $30 million before the pandemic. They were hurt by the pandemic like we were. We see the long-term positioning of Minnetonka to be a source of high-technology circuit boards, similar to our Toronto facility, but with a U.S. footprint.
This U.S. footprint is critical, as we will look to grow our share of the U.S.-only advanced circuit board market in the defense market. In the short term, we have three priorities as we integrate Minnetonka into FTG. First, we need to ramp their throughput and sales. Since February, they've added about 20 staff, going from approximately 150 to 170 people. In Q3, we hired two key people. First, we hired back Paul Godbout, who had run our Fredericksburg facility until early in the pandemic. He is back on a temporary basis, but with his operations skills, he has helped immeasurably. It will give us time to find the right person for the long term. A week or so after hiring Paul, we hired Leo LaCroix. He is a senior executive from within the circuit board industry with strong aerospace and defense experience.
His immediate task was also to focus on Minnetonka, but he has now moved into a larger role and is responsible for FTG's U.S.-based circuit board business. I am confident he will be a huge benefit to FTG for the long term. In Minnetonka, the second priority is to reduce material costs. We have identified cost-saving opportunities that can benefit this site as they are now part of a larger company. It will take some time to achieve all the savings, as in some cases, it requires customer approvals and internal engineering efforts. But when complete, we expect to achieve savings on the order of $1 million annually. We continue to make progress on this initiative. Our third priority is to improve pricing. We believe Minnetonka had not been sufficiently proactive in adjusting prices up as costs went up.
We have had some successes already, and we will continue to address this. We want to ensure any inflationary costs incurred at that site over the past few years, whether material, labor, or other, are passed through to the customers and not squeeze our margins. While I'm on this topic of pricing, I have been very impressed and pleased how everyone involved in this at FTG has proactively pursued improved pricing at customers throughout 2023. Across FTG, we have done a great job in avoiding any margin squeeze from increased costs due to the recent period of high inflation. We did a detailed dive in some of our key contracts and the price changes achieved, and overall, it was on the order of 30%. This analysis was done on approximately 20% of our total revenue.
While not specifically pricing, we did receive some significant expedited purchase orders from customers due to their urgent needs for our product. Some of these expedite fees were taken into income in Q4, and some are remaining for Q1 2024. As we enter 2024, we see continued strong demand across most sites. Our backlog due in the first quarter is over CAD 48 million, including the new sites. We ended the year with CAD 12.5 million in past due orders, which is down from CAD 18 million at the end of Q3. Our goal is to continue to reduce this in 2024, but the strike at our Aero Toronto facility in December and January did not help. As always, there are possible downsides or headwinds that could impact our future performance.
As just mentioned, the contract with our representative staff in Aero Toronto had expired in August last year, and the negotiations did result in a strike for three weeks in December and three weeks in January. This will impact Q1 by an estimated CAD 3 million-CAD 4 million in delayed revenue and the commensurate lost profit. But the good news is, there is a new contract for the employees that has been ratified and work has returned to normal. Also, just to ensure everyone is aware, we have now increased our SG&A costs by approximately CAD 1 million quarterly on about CAD 10 million in incremental quarterly sales from the acquisition. This included in this is about CAD 250,000 per quarter in higher financing costs compared to Q1 last year. We are expecting to grow in 2024.
The easiest aspect of our growth will be having the acquisitions for the full 12 months, that's compared to seven months in 2023. This should add an estimated CAD 12 million in sales for 2024. If we can ramp production and sales at the newly acquired site, this would further add to the growth. Beyond this, we continue to see strong customer demand, as I discussed earlier, and we will still see further benefit from the higher value assembly orders first booked in 2023, as we will have these for the full year in 2024. These assemblies go on Boeing and Airbus aircraft, and we will see the benefit of the C919 program in China moving into production. We shipped our first production orders last year, and we expect to see production rate increases in 2024 and beyond.
With the more complex geopolitical situation in China, I'm sure there are still concerns about our activities there. But in 2023, both our operations in China had their best years ever in terms of sales. We repatriated cash back to Canada during both 2022 and 2023. In total, we've now brought back CAD 2.2 million in cash. By doing this, we don't have as much surplus cash stranded in China, and it reduces our exposure if anything's deteriorated further between China and the West. On a more positive note, in China, the C919 development program achieved CAAC certification in 2022, and we are finally in a position to see production orders after our 10 years of development. This will benefit our Chinese operations going forward and will be less susceptible to geopolitical uncertainties.
Notwithstanding this good news, we are being cautious about our operations in China and any further increase in tensions between China and other countries, as that could impact our operations there in the future. We continue to assess possible corporate development opportunities that could fit with either of our businesses, but our near-term priority remains focused on integrating our recent acquisition. With a focus on operational excellence in all parts of FTG, our strong financial performance in 2023, our recent acquisition, and our key sales wins, we are confident we are on a long-term growth trajectory. This concludes our presentation. I thank you for your attention. I would now like to open the phone for any questions. Alan?
Thank you. Ladies and gentlemen, we will now begin the question and answer session. Again, if you have a question, please press star one on your touchtone phone. You will hear a three-tone prompt acknowledging your request, and your questions will be pulled in the order they are received. If you would like to withdraw from the question queue, please press star two. If you are using a speakerphone, please lift the handset before pressing any keys. One moment, please, for your first question. Your first question comes from Nick Corcoran of Acumen. Your line is already open.
Good morning, guys. Congrats on a record quarter.
Thank you. Thank you.
There's been a lot of headlines related to safety issues with Boeing. Have you seen any changes in the level of orders related to Boeing, or they've remained relatively stable?
They are stable, and, you know, here's the way it's working right now with Boeing. So there's really two things that you can track at Boeing. You can ship, you can track deliveries, which are definitely halted while they sort out their latest challenges, and you can track production rates. Boeing has not changed their production rates yet, as a result of any of their challenges, so the demand down into the supply chain is driven by production rates, so we're seeing no change. The only thing I would say is, going forward, as I mentioned, Boeing had plans to ramp, you know, specifically on the 737. I think they're at 38 planes a month. They're trying to get to 40, then get to 50 in 2025.
The FAA has explicitly told them to not ramp their production until everyone's confident that they have their quality under control. So, you know, there could be a risk to the increase in production rates, but I don't see much of a risk to, you know, decreasing production rates as of now.
That's helpful. And then you indicated the strike will impact the first quarter by CAD 3 million-CAD 4 million. Do you think you'll be able to catch up on those orders through the balance of the fiscal year?
Yes, I mean, it's. You know, we're getting lots of pressure from our customers. You know, they all need the parts. The demand has not gone away. So it's delayed, but definitely I do expect it to be caught up in 2024.
Then the last question for me: How will the lost revenue in the first quarter impact your operating leverage? And can you maybe comment on what the magnitude of the wage increase for the salary employees was at Circuits Toronto or Aerospace Toronto?
Aero Toronto, right. Yeah, and I don't have great answers on either of these. In terms of, you know, the profit impact, and my simplistic analysis is, you know, I think the revenue is impacted CAD 3 million-CAD 4 million. Normally, we say our contribution rates around 30%, so you could say that 30% of that lost revenue hits the bottom line. In terms of the wage increase, I don't have a dollar amount, but, you know, wages are typically running at 20%-30% of my cost at a site, and that's all wages. You know, the operator level is gonna be a smaller percentage of that.
And so even if we say the operator wages are 20% of my total cost, and if the increase was 10%, which it wasn't quite, but if it, you know, in this year, I'd be hitting my margins by 2%, basically 10% of 20%.
That's helpful. Thanks for that for one.
Okay. Thanks, Nick.
Your next question comes from Ashvin Moorjani of Edward Jones. Your line is already open.
Thanks. Congrats, Brad and Jamie. It's good to see everything ramping up very well. Given the large backlog, are there any thoughts on ramping production above the existing capacity, even if you take into account the acquisitions running at full tilt? Just want to hear your thoughts on that, because you have about CAD 48 million, I think you said so.
Yeah.
Yeah, just thoughts on that.
Sure. Yes, definitely there's thoughts on continuing to ramp our production. And, you know, I did say we're, you know, we're kind of staffed at a comfortable level now. You know, last year we were struggling to get staff to ramp up. We're happy where we are, but, you know, if we continue to see the strong demand and we continue to win opportunities, with 100% certainty, I would love to continue to ramp our revenues and our production in the coming quarters and years. So for sure, we would love to do that. And I believe the market demand is there to support that.
Definitely. Thank you.
Ladies and gentlemen, as a reminder, if you have a question, please press star one. Your next question comes from Austin Beutel of Oakwest. Your line is already open.
... Brad, can you elaborate a little bit on the receipt of subsidies or loans or whatever from the government? It was a substantial portion of the gross margin in the last quarter. I admire it, and it's wonderful. How do you feel strongly about it being continued proportionately?
No, I guess a couple comments. We have two types of government support. Early in 2023, we had government support that hit the PNL, and, you know, increased our margins. That was basically in Q1 last year. Since then, most of our support has really been to help our balance sheet. It's low or no interest loans. So those are not going through the PNL, in the last few quarters. And I guess, so that's what we had. Then to comment on going forward, I don't see much in terms of government subsidies that are gonna help the PNL going forward, but, you know, these interest or low-interest loans we have from the government, both Canada and Ontario, will stay on our balance sheets.
That the loans from Canada, that hopefully will total about CAD 7 million, will carry through till 2030. So those will be a benefit to us on the balance sheet and on financing for a number of years still.
Thank you. Congratulations on a great quarter!
Thank you, sir.
There are no further questions at this time. I would hand over the call to Mr. Bourne for closing comments. Please proceed.
Thank you. The replay of the call will be available on the numbers noted on our press release until March 8th, and it will also be available on our website in a few days. I thank you all for your interest and participation. Thank you.
Ladies and gentlemen, this concludes today's conference call. Thank you for your participation, and you may now disconnect.