Welcome to the Recruit Holdings Business Strategy Presentation Call about Help Businesses Work Smarter. This call is a simultaneous translation of the original call in Japanese, and translation is provided for the convenience of investors only. Today we have Yoshihiro Kitamura, Managing Corporate Executive Officer and Head of the Media & Solutions SBU, and Junichi Arai, Corporate Executive Officer in charge of the Corporate Planning Division. We will play our prepared remarks around 15 minutes, then move to a fireside chat with Yoshi and Jun. The presentation video will be uploaded shortly after this event. The slides have been uploaded to our IR website. Now let's move to the video presentation.
I'm Yoshi, Managing Corporate Executive Officer and Head of Media & Solutions. Today, I'd like to explain the Media & Solutions business strategy, Help Businesses Work Smarter. I'd like to discuss our plans for future business expansion. [Foreign language] The last time I presented was in November 2017.
I'm excited to share our progress and updates to our strategy. Media and Solutions consists of two sub-segments in Japan, Marketing Solutions and HR Solutions, where we maintain the largest market share in many of the verticals in which we operate. In each vertical, we offer online matching platforms to connect individual users and business clients. We also offer software-as-a-Service across these verticals and others to help business clients operate more efficiently and improve their productivity. In FY 2021, revenue in Media and Solutions was JPY 658.6 billion, and adjusted EBITDA was JPY 102.4 billion. As we disclosed on May 16th, revenue in this fiscal year is expected to recover to a level similar to pre-COVID. Help Businesses Work Smarter is the second pillar of Recruit Holdings' three business strategies.
Its goal is to create an ecosystem of solutions that support the operations of businesses in Japan to help improve their productivity and profitability. In Japan, the labor force continues to decline due to a low birth rate and an aging population. We estimate that Japan will need to increase productivity per capita by 15% just to maintain the 2019 GDP level in 2040. Therefore, I believe improving productivity is a top priority for Japan. Through our matching platforms, we have been operating a two-sided marketplace business model. For individual users, we provide highly convenient services which offer the best options and peace of mind. For business clients, we help them attract customers by maximizing the number of matches on our platforms. While we are leveraging data and technology to further improve our matching platforms, we're also providing cashless payment services.
We aim to simplify the entire business process for business clients by replacing complicated administrative and operational processes with our SaaS solutions called Air BusinessTools . We aim to maximize the number of matches between individual users and business clients, as well as the number of actions that lead to increased sales for our business clients, such as reservations and payments. In other words, we are building an ecosystem that enables business clients to more quickly and easily respond to more actions from individual users. By leveraging technology, business clients can increase operational efficiency and improve the overall performance of their business. Air BusinessTools provide sales management and payment functions, customer relationship management, human resource management, and cash management, including a wide range of payments and working capital solutions, all within a single ecosystem linked to one ID.
We aim to become an indispensable partner to our business clients by efficiently circulating the flow of people, goods, and services and payments within the ecosystem. As a result, we are creating a simpler, faster, closer world for both individual users and business clients. We will measure our success using three KPIs, the number of actions by individual users on our matching platforms, the number of registered accounts utilizing our SaaS solutions, and the gross payment volume that accumulates as a result of the completion of payments. We believe that we can grow our revenue by having more individual users and business clients continue to utilize our ecosystem for a longer period of time, thereby maximizing the lifetime value of both parties. [Foreign language] We are in a unique position to achieve this, as we've already established matching platforms with a huge amount of individual user actions.
[Foreign language] In order to reflect this vision, which is centered on our matching platforms, we are changing the name of the SBU and business segment to Matching & Solutions. Before discussing our future strategy, I'd like to briefly explain how we have evolved our business over the last six decades. Since our foundation in 1960, we have expanded our business from job advertising to marketing, from print to online media, from online media to matching platforms, and from matching platforms to an ecosystem that includes SaaS. Today, we are providing matching platforms and solutions that not only help business clients increase awareness and customer acquisition through advertising, but also help increase the number of individual users taking an action and the number of matches between individual users and business clients.
[Foreign language] In FY 2021, the total number of actions by individual users was approximately 300 million, an increase of approximately 10 x compared to 33 million 10 years ago. This increase is the result of our shift from paper media to online matching platforms and the continuous focus on improving the satisfaction of individual users and business clients by optimizing matching through the collection and analysis of action data. Through this transition, in addition to an advertising-based revenue model, we have introduced cost per action models where fees are linked to individual user actions and flat rate fee models so that business clients have flexibility, giving them comfort that they can use our services for a long period of time. Now I'll discuss what we're working on right now.
We aim to help business clients improve their business performance after the actual matching stage, for example, by facilitating reservations, orders, and payments. Our SaaS solutions connect the actions of individual users and the operations of business clients in real time through online reservations on Hot Pepper Beauty or Hot Pepper Gourmet. We want our business clients to be able to complete their entire range of business processes within our ecosystem using a single ID. SaaS solutions are now being used by business clients beyond those who are already using our vertical matching platforms. As a result, this has led to an increase in the overall number of SaaS accounts. The number of registered accounts using our SaaS solutions in FY 2021 was approximately 2.45 million.
We had previously estimated that there were roughly 2.9 million business locations and stores in Japan that could be potential users of our Air BusinessTools . However, today, we believe that the expansion of our SaaS solutions, including the introduction of AirWORK ATS and other solutions, may enable us to reach a broader range of potential clients. We now estimate the number of potential users at roughly 4.53 million business locations and stores in Japan. We currently offer approximately 20 SaaS solutions, primarily within Air BusinessTools, and we recognize that there is still significant white space to expand the number of accounts as we continue to launch new services in the future.
We believe that expanding the number of SaaS accounts will increase the number of business clients whose business operations we can track in a real-time manner, which we expect will further contribute to an increase in the number of actions on our matching platforms. In the future, as our ecosystem takes shape to streamline the flow of people, goods, and services and the flow of money with payments as the entry point, we're aiming to expand further into fintech services to simplify and improve the efficiency of complicated processes related to payments and cash flow management. AirPAY, a cashless payment service, was initially launched by targeting potential Air BusinessTools users. However, we now believe that this service can be used by many business clients, regardless of the size of their business.
AirPAY has allowed us to enter a part of the cashless payment market, which has a total gross payment volume of approximately JPY 100 trillion. As we continue to expand our fintech services, we believe it is crucial how simply and how quickly we can utilize the payment volumes that accumulate in our ecosystem from payments made mainly through AirPAY and AirPAY ONLINE to help our business clients improve their performance and operational efficiency. Therefore, we view GPV as one of our most important KPIs, and we currently expect annual GPV to reach approximately JPY 1 trillion in the fiscal year ending March 2023. One example of our expansion of fintech services is AirCASH. There are many SME owners who are not sure where to go for funding when sudden working capital needs arise and are unfamiliar with the time-consuming processes that must be completed.
Additionally, there are small and medium-sized business owners who have large personal advances or have incurred personal debt for their businesses. This April, we launched a service called AirCASH, which is a fintech service for business owners that allows them to obtain cash in advance based on their future revenue. AirCASH was created with the idea to support business clients' sustainable growth by offering cash in a safe, easy, and timely manner and varying the amount deducted from settlements in line with their expected monthly revenue. We also aim to expand our services into the payroll sector in the future.
Each month in Japan, there are long queues of employers at banks on payday making payroll payments, and on the same day, employees form long queues in front of ATMs to withdraw cash. We are excited to imagine how much more efficient and convenient this would be if these two processes could be completed with a single click. Lastly, we would like to share with you how we expect the financial performance of the Matching & Solutions business to progress in the future. As you can see over the past five years, Matching & Solutions has been positioned as a segment that generates significant cash flow, maintaining a mid-20% Adjusted EBITDA margin while achieving a slight increase in revenue.
However, since FY 2020, Adjusted EBITDA margin has remained around 15% due to the impact of COVID-19 and increased strategic investments, including marketing expenses to reinforce and expand HR solutions and SaaS solutions. Adjusted EBITDA margin is expected to stay around this level in FY 2022 based on our May 16 guidance. Going forward, as we expect the number of actions on our matching platforms to increase due to the expansion of SaaS solutions, we aim to increase revenue and Adjusted EBITDA margin. As a result, our medium-term target is to achieve revenue of approximately JPY 1 trillion and an Adjusted EBITDA margin in the low 20% range. Contribution to financial performance from our new Fintech service offering is expected to be limited as we plan to focus on product expansion in the medium term.
However, once revenue from the SBU exceeds JPY 1 trillion, we expect Fintech services which are based on GPV will gradually contribute. The demands of business clients to increase operational efficiency and improve the overall performance and productivity of their business cannot be met through matching platforms, a single SaaS solution, or Fintech services alone. We will continue to evolve our ecosystem of solutions to help businesses work smarter. By solving the long-standing challenges of SMEs in Japan, we will become a true long-time partner to our business clients. This concludes my presentation. Thank you.
Now we would like to start the Q&A session. Questions from Mr. Arai to Mr. Kitamura based on the content of the previous presentation, something that I'm sure you are all interested in. After that, we will take questions from sell-side analysts and the media. Kitamura-san, Arai-san, please start. Thank you.
Thank you for the presentation. We would like to dig deeper into what you said. Kitamura-san, I understand that you joined Recruit as a new college graduate, and it marks the 25th year. You have launched various new businesses, large and small, and led them to success. I also heard and understand that many of those successes have been achieved through your close collaboration with Mr. Idekoba. We hear about all those successful stories.
Now, how do you position this new challenge compared to your past successes as the company and as your personal challenge? I'd like to start from there. You have done much research and you have high winning success probability or not such a big success probability, but you will take on the challenge anyways?
As mentioned in the video, from 2014, this matching platform has been our focus, and we've been focusing as our strategy. Personally, in Recruit, we planned to create another Recruit in Recruit. That was the core of our challenge. Hot Pepper Beauty and Hot Pepper Gourmet. What was so-called media to action platform. We've been focusing on building that. It was like creating new Recruit within Recruit.
Now it is becoming one Recruit. Chance of success, I don't want to sound so arrogant, but when we build businesses like this, there were successes, there were failures in the past. These initiatives and experiences, we try to tilt them by half a degree, half a circle. We use the track record for the half and the new challenge for the other half. We are proud of having successfully grown this way. To answer your question about the chance of success, I wouldn't be taking on this challenge unless I have this confidence. The hurdles and the themes that we need to overcome and address are challenging, so I want to continue working on them. Just one actual example. It was a great experience as a user. Due to COVID-19, one restaurant in Nakameguro was facing difficulty.
After the restriction for the activity was lifted, they were having hard time hiring the part-time workers. They were wondering what to do to close the business or what. We heard the troubles and introduced our business tools. They introduced our Air BusinessTools. We came to experience with Hot Pepper Gourmet. It was a booking. At the time of booking, I fix when I will get the seat, on which time, which day. I go to the restaurant and I was guided to the seat, and the order will show the menu. I ordered the menu one after another. I tried and noticed. I don't have to say hi to the sales staff. I can just order one after another, and the dishes will come very quickly.
Each smartphone, if you read the QR code, the order comes in. You can choose the order. I can just order a new drink while we are talking, right? Without stopping the conversation. Exactly. You don't have to look for staff and say, "Hi. Hello." After we are done, we pay AirPAY and leave the restaurant. I heard from the staffs, by introducing this system, they had seven staffs. They can do this in three staffs. In addition, as we often hear, restaurants, guests, sometimes hesitate calling on the staffs because they look so busy, but they don't have to do that. The pay per customer increased by 20%. On the other hand, staffs is down from seven to three. I heard from the owners.
They said they increased the staff salary by 25%. Even then, they have more profit. They can think of using this, they can think of the new format. I think there are a few key points here. One is the so-called Restaurant Board, which is SaaS attached to Air BusinessTools. You can gather the information real-time. This allows real-time matching. After you go to the restaurant, Air BusinessTools can be used. What was done face-to-face in the past is automated. Efficiency goes up. This real-time matching and the improvement in the store operational efficiency improves the profitability. This can be used as the next investment or increase in salary of the staff, or when they want to hire new part-time workers, they can offer higher hourly wage, which means more competitive.
This is a good virtuous cycle. When I heard this, I felt that what we have been doing, there were many visible, invisible things, but we are changing the way the stores, the business clients are running business and how they think about business. I came in contact with those who are actually using our system and felt this winning formula or the winning method, and we think we can hone our system even more by understanding this. I think this is where our raison d'être, reason for existence lies.
As you mentioned, the word media has been changed to matching. If the word speaks for itself, how is matching different from media? It's a very simple question. Especially from the viewpoint of our clients, business clients, why would they choose Recruit as their long-term business partner? From our viewpoint, there's long-term value for each client, and why would we be able to maximize each client's LTV?
Initially, Recruit within Recruit Japan, there was business on media, and also there was business on referral or counter business in SUUMO, to support customers who like to purchase houses, or we have Zexy, who also offers an over-the-counter service, to introduce wedding venues. It was not only a media.
We used the word media, but what we always focused on is the growth of PV for each client and how much the awareness was raised. Rather than that, what we have focused on is how much the users and clients matched with each other, how much our clients were able to sell their product or services more. That has been the shared understanding, and this time we decided to change the name of the SBU to Matching because it better expresses what we do. We can maximize the LTV of each business client by focusing on matching, because business clients' revenue is something we commit to. If we are only committing to raising the awareness of the business clients, we would be only a part-time business partner which will be chosen only when they want to raise awareness.
Revenue is something they need to constantly grow. In order to constantly grow the revenue, what do they need to do? There is a simple consulting service or proposal of solutions, and we commit to the revenue growth of our business clients. That has been our business model. As a result, we can build a long-term partnership with our clients. Are there any other companies that offers this a similar solution? Well, perhaps consulting firms, maybe they have a similar business model. For small and medium-sized businesses, I believe that there are not many companies who offer similar services for those types of business clients.
Exactly. Which part of the operation is creating revenue? Which part of the operation can be eliminated?
That is the point of view we have in building our partnership. We want to minimize the unnecessary portion of the operation or a simple task or routine work that doesn't create revenue so that they can focus more on the revenue growth. Maybe this is a unique approach that we have. The word is not media. Yes, from our viewpoint, it is matching, and we commit to the revenue growth. Revenue growth means we offer a high quality experience for our clients, and I believe that is important.
In today's presentation, you talked about three KPIs. The number of actions by individual users, the number of registered SaaS account of corporate clients, and the GPV, Gross Payment Volume. You talked about the ecosystem, the circulation. I think this links to the circulation in the ecosystem. What kind of synergy effect or the positive spiral, the upgoing spiral will this create? Can you elaborate once again?
The starting point is the client, business client SaaS account number. Because when we do the online matching, for example, there are online shopping malls. When you think of buying something there, if it says, it's not in the inventory, it takes a week to get the product. If that product exists only there, then you may go and decide to buy from there.
If you want it right away, you will find another shop that already has inventory, has the product in the inventory. I'm sure we often experience waiting for a week or 10 days, but the dynamism of the Internet is such that when you want to do it right now, you decide now and come up with the execution plan. The speed is the key point here. If the number of registered SaaS account of corporate clients increase, then the sales status using SaaS or the seats in restaurants, the availability, open seats, such real-time data, that's real-time, I see. Real-time data, we can capture such real-time data. By using that, the individual users can immediately decide what to do today and tomorrow. Fix what you do today.
We often hear that you reserve a seat, but then if you receive an email later on to say, "No, the seat was not open after all," you get very disappointed. This is how the action number will increase. If these two increase, then in the middle,
you have sales, the revenue, and that is GPV, Gross Payment Volume. This GPV, from business clients' point of view, this is part of their revenue. This will be source of their future business, source of investment, and source of cash flow for them, their business. Cycling them. By having the client real-time information and the action, we can increase the GPV. That's the mechanism I see.
Many of the audience today recognize that we first had HR Solutions and then expanded to Marketing Solutions, and I believe they are expecting the SaaS business to become the third pillar of revenue in long term. According to your presentation today, I understand that you're looking at opportunities in the new ecosystem, including SaaS business, and that is the means to achieve our strategy. Perhaps this is unique to this particular business, but can you please elaborate on some background and philosophy behind?
Well, in the SaaS business, we increase the efficiency of operation of business clients, and that is one effect. For instance, there is SaaS to solve challenges around the process, and that will make the work easier, probably. In a longer term point of view, monthly subscription model for a particular SaaS platform, even if we had such business model, that fee is going to be generated from the reduced cost, therefore the TAM, or the size of our revenue, will lack dynamism. By using SaaS, as I said earlier, real-time sales data can be collected, such as vacant available seats or what is available at the moment.
By knowing such information, we would be able to contribute to a larger point of revenue, and we have such idea. It's not just monthly fee charged for the SaaS, but we would like to utilize data in an effective manner, transitioning data to, elsewhere so that we can go after a larger revenue. We often talk about offering a SALON BOARD alone or AirREGI. We can charge per unit. We often hear such voice, but that's not the case exactly. We have a science around monetization. There are different patterns. In our day-to-day life, we all experience various fee models. The mindset of the decision-maker who's actually paying the money has also been studied through science. For instance, if it was a subscription. If it was not a subscription, if it was a transaction fee.
We currently have the transaction fee model, but if it was a subscription model, I believe we wouldn't have been able to collect this much data around availability. From the business client's viewpoint, they would be paying more if the matching number increases. At some point, they would calculate the amount of inventory, and they would probably choose to offer information that is needed only to acquire the new clients. The CPA is going to be lower as the matching number increases in this new model, which creates motivation. Having a transaction fee model is not necessarily a benefit for the clients or the customers. We would like to be flexible in thinking about our fee model.
I have two more questions I'd like to ask. Of course, we will be taking questions from the audience today as well. Today you talked about using data and technology to improve the quality and the efficiency of the matching and drive that with the three KPIs. The strength of Recruit is the strong sales force, I understand. Using technology and data and the existing very compelling sales force, how can they coexist with each other or interact with each other?
One example episode is I was doing sales in the past, and I always asked the customers what the impact was. You posted the ad, what was the impact? How many actions did you get as a result? Now, we don't have to ask the question. There's data. This month is up or down vis-a-vis last month.
Maybe we can do this differently to increase the action. That is the change in our sales activity. Furthermore, outside of matching, there is the business status. We can look at the business and see this part can be compressed, and instead, sales or the customer service resource can be opened up and be more available. The sales marketing style has changed significantly. However, this is a very detailed work that has to be customized. We have pride and confidence in our sales activity, but maybe it's not so much sales, it's more business consulting. We are evolving as business consulting to improve the contribution to the customers, the business clients.
Thank you. That's something to look forward to.
Last but not the least, in the end of your presentation, you've shown the three to five-year outlook for the revenue and the adjusted EBITDA for the first time. In the beginning, you said that, "I wouldn't say it if I didn't have confidence," but let me ask, how confident are you in achieving these goals? About the fintech business that is also exciting, but what is your expectation for the future outlook for the fintech business?
To a certain extent, through the existing or the new platforms, our value is to be enhanced. What we've shown as the outlook is one hurdle that we need to achieve. The adjusted EBITDA, well, we've had COVID, and we have changed, transformed our business model to enter the new field, and we have been making investments for that.
Therefore, temporarily, the adjusted EBITDA margin is seemingly low. As the scale expands, the revenue is going to grow, and we are expecting the Adjusted EBITDA margin to improve as well. It's not that we don't have any visibility, but we wouldn't be disclosing this information unless we are confident that we can achieve. Therefore, under the current circumstances, this is achievable as a target. With regards to the fintech business, the matching volume is expected to increase, so the improvements can be made automatically to a certain extent. Perhaps we may be hindered by some regulations or laws, but rather than continuing the conventional fintech business, we would like to stand by our business clients in offering F intech services going forward.
Thank you very much for waiting. Now we would like to take questions from those participating through the telephone line. We are going to take one question per person at one time. BofA Securities, Kinoshita-san, please.
Yes. This is Kinoshita speaking. Can you hear me?
Yes.
Yes, okay. It's one question per person. I understand. I will ask just one question. Sales and marketing you talked about. About the sales structure, I have a question. Traditionally, you had the sales for each domain, but now the service structure is changing, and you are unifying. The current sales structure and the agents, I think you've used a lot of agents. How do you deal with them? Like you said, you are now moving in the direction of the consulting, so the sales reps' skill need to move in the direction of business consulting. How do you plan to secure and train and educate your talents? If you could elaborate on these points, I'd appreciate it.
Thank you for the question. Our sales structure. Like we had before, we have the vertical teams for each division. In addition, we have Air BusinessTools. That's another team. This Air BusinessTools sales reps visit the customers and identify challenges and propose, which tool can be used to, for the improvement. That is the sales activity they are doing. This know-how will be fed back to the business side right away. Of course, Matching & Solutions sales team do not understand. If they can understand their business to 100% when they propose, it will be ideal. In order for us to have high-level proposal, we have the prior teams, and they cut across divisions, and they share knowledge and information to all of us.
Through cases, case examples, we can find out how that can be used, how, what kind of savings impact can be enjoyed, and then lead that to customer's proposal. That is how we pursue. The way we deal with the agents, like we did before, we still have the relationship and starting the Air BusinessTools and AirPAY. New agents or the smartphone mobile phone carriers are increasing. When the Air BusinessTools is introduced, the internet line and the terminal has to be purchased together. Therefore, in order to introduce the business, the mobile phone carriers and agents, there are more opportunities where we introduce our Air BusinessTools. Therefore, the sales network is now on the expansion. It's expanding. Lastly, we have to shift to a consulting way of thinking.
How to attract such talents? Of course, sales, it's not just about hiring former consultants. Our proposal is based on improvement results, improvement examples, and how to equip the sales reps with such theory is the key. It's not hiring particular type of talents. We want the same kind of talents who can work together with the clients, and at the same time, the sales tool, the tablet, will be equipped with them, along with the expertise and the knowledge.
Thank you. Next, we'd like to move on to the next one. UBS Securities, Fukuyama-san, please.
This is Fukuyama speaking from UBS. Thank you for this opportunity. I have a question related to the JPY 1 trillion revenue target. To what extent are you planning to expand the number of actions per individual user? Well, currently, there are 300 million actions for JPY 650 billion revenue, so we can calculate backward. If it's going to be flat, it could be 500 million actions, but perhaps there is an upside more than this simple calculation. In order to achieve JPY 1 trillion revenue, is there any specific target for the number of actions?
Thank you for your question. JPY 1 trillion revenue target and how much individual user action is targeted cannot be disclosed unfortunately today. As you just mentioned, cost per action is higher in some areas, and in other areas, they should be made lower. Depending on the market, we assume certain CPA, and in order to increase the number of actions, we need to increase the number of business clients, and we need to collect the real-time sales data, and that's what we are aiming to reinforce. We make a simple calculation, you were correct in terms of numbers. JPY 2,000 on average can be high in some areas, and it could be low in some areas.
If we try to increase the number of actions for matching, we need to move more toward the daily consumption field. CPA goes down, but the action volume could increase above your calculation. That will help us achieve the revenue target in a realistic manner. Thank you very much.
Next question is The Nikkei Newspaper, Tankai-san, please.
This is Tankai from The Nikkei Newspaper. My question is SaaS. The current number of used account, 2.45 million. This may overlap with the previous question, but, as you aim for JPY 1 trillion, this 4.53 million, will you acquire all this or?
Thank you for the question. 2.45 million. This is the original Air BusinessTools TAM that they were aiming for. It is the number of accounts extracted from the TAM that we were after. Back then, we were thinking that HR SaaS was not included, and now we added HR. Now it exceeds 4 million TAM. Now, as we aim for JPY 1 trillion, how much does this need to increase to? I cannot mention the actual number, but in Japan as a whole, we want coverage around the country. We want to increase this number to cover the entire country. In some areas, the usage may be close to 100%. As we focus on action, there are areas that can easily link to action.
We want to increase that part. We want to focus on that part.
Thank you. Next is Watanabe-san from Mito Securities.
This is Watanabe speaking. Can you hear my voice?
Yes.
According to your presentation, clients who are outside your ecosystem, compared to the clients within the ecosystem, will they be inferior in terms of profitability according to the example you mentioned earlier? Will they have no choice but to go on the ecosystem of yours? Is that your assumption? You have the media and the business tools, and you have done matching all the way. I believe there's an entry barrier for the other peers. Your business model, is it eventually going to be something like a platformer's business model, where clients have no choice but to use your ecosystem platform in order to be profitable?
Thank you for your question. It's not something we want to be. We, well, we don't want to sound arrogant by saying that our clients need to choose our ecosystem to be platformed. It is true that there's a track record. If there's more track record of clients who becomes more profitable by choosing our ecosystem, maybe that will become the truth. Raising the hourly wage, there are many thoughts, but improving profitability and profit margin, unless they're improved, those ideas cannot be realized. If we want to realize those ideas, we need to have business clients focus more on profitability. If that happens, we hope that we will be the one to be chosen.
We have high awareness and the high number of actions on a real-time basis. These are our strength that we understand. By using these strength, we would like to expand into a matching platform moving forward. It is not simply being the online media to raise awareness, but some kind of purchasing activity happens there, or some actions are completed on our platform. For example, making reservations, placing orders, buying something, but also the payment itself. All of those processes are completed on our matching platform. That's what we hope to expand into.
Thank you. Next question is JP Morgan. Mori-san, please.
Yes. Thank you for this opportunity. I have one question about your profitability, JPY 1 trillion and 20% margin target. Maybe I missed, but what is the timeline that you want to achieve these targets? In your presentation, you said, it's not necessarily transaction base or monthly payment. Not one single answer is right. You want to be flexible. As an image, media, it comes from the sales promotion expense in many cases, I think. But once you reach JPY 1 trillion, this transaction base or the pay for the solution, will this continue coming, be coming from customer's sales promotion expense? What is your image into the future? Thank you.
Thank you for the question. An image, we say medium- to medium-term. This is three to five years. We have a range. Because, as I said earlier, the expansion of matching volume, at what speed, is the determining factor. Recently, due to COVID-19, the restriction on action was applied. The revenue 90% was lost all of a sudden, for example. Without such events, we say three to five years timeline. At present, it comes from sales promotion types of expenses, you said. Given the size of the business clients, advertisement or sales promotion companies that look at such expenses in such detail, if the company's large, maybe yes, but it may not be broken down that precisely. That is my impression.
Our ideal is, if it came from sales promotion, for example, that expense, is like same as paying for infrastructure, like utilities. Utilities, electricity and water. If they think of those two as similar, then this JPY 1 trillion becomes more realistic. Adding SaaS to action platform, it becomes directly related to sales revenue, and it will be linked to revenue, and it will also improve the operational efficiency. This will encourage the clients to continue using it. Then it no longer becomes sales promotion fee. It will more become like, more like an infrastructure. I think we're starting to see that. How much increase we can see there is the key. Maybe the fee structure can be easier to use in the future. We want to come up with something that is easier to use.
Next, our transaction data. There's nothing I can disclose at this point. Once we reach JPY 1 trillion, our transaction fee volume will depend on the fee structure that we choose at that point in time. It's not something I can disclose at this point. Nothing to offer at this point.
Thank you. We have addressed all the questions we've received, and we still have a few more minutes, but maybe we can take one more question from the audience. Does anyone have any question? No.
Kitamura-san, as I listen to the questions, I think they're interested in how we are going to achieve the JPY 1 trillion target, especially the capital market audience focuses on that point.
The 20% margin, well, we say low 20%, we want to emphasize that it is not just 20%, but JPY 1 trillion revenue with margin in the range of 20%-25%. Creating a model, building an outlook for our business. I believe for those audiences, this point is very important. You mentioned that you wouldn't disclose if you didn't have a confidence. This SaaS business, according to your presentation, I think is based on the existing business as a foundation. Well, there's been SaaS and the media, but today they were explained as transforming into one ecosystem. I think maybe this was the information they heard for the first time for some of them.
When do you think they will realize what you're speaking today was actually true?
Making reservation on Hot Pepper Gourmet is something I would like to recommend to feel what I'm talking about. If you're using Hot Pepper Beauty, you can peek into how they are using their cash register. Business SaaS is in the background, so it is not really visible from the customer's viewpoint. Mori-san, we encourage you to use those services and it may be difficult for you to feel it in reality. Before COVID, when we integrated the business, I talked that we decided to integrate the businesses because we thought there's a limit in the revenue we can achieve with the existing business structure.
During this pandemic, it was an easier environment for us to transform because we took this as an opportunity to transform into a new structure because the performance would have deteriorated in any way. Because we've gone through such experience, because we've changed the business model, we will be able to acquire larger cost per action, and we are now prepared for that new journey. There are developers, sales reps within the company, but the motivation, the morale, have they been elevated? Yes. We are trying to transform like a chameleon. We are trying to transform into something new, and I think there's higher level of commitment now.
Thank you. It is 5 P.M. now, so I would like to ask Kitamura-san for a closing comment to add to your response so far.
I would like to encourage you to experience. As I've experienced our own services, I've given feedback that this was not good and this was good. I'm not trying to advertise ourselves, but I would like to encourage you to experience our services. If you're residing overseas, when you come to Japan, please, use our services. With this, we would like to conclude today's program. Thank you very much for joining.