Director of Finance Division, Piotr Sudoł, and Director of Investor Relations and ESG, Piotr Szczucki. I would like to welcome all those who arrived here to the headquarters of PGE, and those who are following us online. In a moment, I will hand over to the CEO and directors, and after the presentation, we will have time for a Q&A session. Mr. President, the floor is yours.
Good morning, ladies and gentlemen. I would like to welcome you cordially. It is another occasion when I have the pleasure to participate in the presentation of our results. This time, these will be results for the first quarter 2024. Good morning again, and without further ado, we go to the presentation with an overview of the first quarter, the market situation, as well as the financial situation of the group.
Financial results of the group show that we continue to be a strong group that has experienced a strong pressure as a result of the operating situation in coal energy generation. Our EBITDA went down 25% compared with the previous quarter, but if we exclude the result of conventional energy, which last year generated over PLN 900 million EBITDA, now it is about PLN 500 million loss, our result would be a quarter higher than last year's results. In the context of the market situation, we can see that we are dealing with growing consumption of electricity. Unfortunately based on significant imports, and this is not reflected in a greater consumption of national sources. That is linked to the additional pressure on domestic producers to deliver electricity for consumers.
All that confirms that the future functioning of conventional assets is confirmed by the operating results of the segment, and consequently, the results of the entire group. This conventional part of our assets is unable to function based on market rules. It is necessary for the functioning of the foundation of the electricity generation system, but it cannot function under market rules because it is pushed out from the market, and the results are as they are. Therefore, I'm all the more satisfied to see the directions of activities that are undertaken together with the government. We are working very intensely on developing the concept of setting off coal assets from our ownership assets, and that will change the functioning of the foundation of the electricity system that is now based on conventional energy sources.
As regards the market situation and the electricity market, as I have said, we see an increase in both generation and consumption domestically. That is almost 3% up, more than 1 TWh. And we can also see the delta, the results from imports. That is the difference between production and consumption, which represents imports of energy to Poland. In the first quarter, that accounted for almost 1.5 TWh. We recorded a slight growth in production compared to the first quarter, 2023. A slight growth, just by 1%, but we can see a dynamic change in the structure of this production. So if we have a look at the structure of energy production with regard to wind energy, we see an increase by 19% with good wind conditions in the first quarter.
Only, 0.3 TWh increase in production from those sources. Photovoltaics over 17.5 GW, which, in my opinion, brings about serious questions regarding the structure of electricity generation. I would like to remind you that in the plan for electricity generation by 2030, the share of this type of electricity generation was to be much higher. That leaves some questions open regarding the target structure of electricity generation with regard to renewable energy sources, in particular, and our offshore projects, wind energy on inland onshore wind generation and low gas prices.... lower than last year also caused 18% higher generation of gas units.
So that is a simple consequence of low prices of gas and greater profitability of production from those sources. All those factors together, that is conventional energy situation, and year-on-year decrease on coal production by 8% and 7% on lignite, compared with the same percent, the same period last year. Prices. The trend which started in 2022 of dropping prices of contracts for electricity contracts continues. The prices for 2025 dropped to about PLN 400 per MWh. That was the drop we saw in February. Now, it rebounded slightly as a result of change in the CO2 emission rights, and now it's about PLN 475 . Those lower prices of energy, this trend is due to the factors that I have mentioned.
That is decrease in gas prices, quite significant drops in coal prices, and as far as coal is concerned, coal prices in our contracts dropped to about $110 per ton. Last year, that was about $170, which obviously translates into market prices. Gas prices dropped from levels of above PLN 400 last year to about PLN 180 per MWh on the term contracts with deliveries for next year. As a result, we see continuing price pressure, which is very good for consumers, but not so much for producers. In fact, for us, it is a great market and operational challenge. CO2 in the first quarter last year were about EUR 85 per ton. Now the prices are fluctuating.
In February, the prices were relatively low, about EUR 55 per ton. Now it is about EUR 70 per ton, that is for emission rights. So macroeconomic conditions continue to be a major challenge. The market situation is developing dynamically, especially with regard to renewable energy sources. And that is accompanied by growing pressure on conventional energy, and this confirms the need for restructuring, ownership restructuring, asset structure restructuring. We need to transfer this segment of our activity to another owner, which should be the State Treasury.
Then we will talk about directions of investments, in particular concerning generation aimed at an optimum structure of generation sources, large scale offshore wind projects, but also, well, thought through structure of other asset development that is wind on land and photovoltaics, as well as everything around it, and that is related to the distribution network, which must be prepared for a completely different structure of generation sources. And variability in the amount of electricity delivered to the system, and that is again something we can discuss later.
This will also cause changes in the market related to production or preparation of energy storage, and a different functioning of the entire distribution network, as well as the whole system, which must be capable of absorbing any surplus of energy generated from renewable sources when the conditions are very good. So for example, when we have a windy and sunny day, instead of turning off those renewable energy sources, we need to catch as much of the energy as possible because the prices are negative, and we can store this energy then, and then flatten out the supply curve and then deliver this energy once the sun is down, and there is no more wind. That will be it from me as regards the general background and macroeconomic situation.
After the presentation, I will be at your disposal for any additional questions. Now, over to Director Sudoł , who will talk you through operational and investment activity of the group.
Thank you, Mr. President. Ladies and gentlemen, let me start my part of the presentation with showing you the situation in our strategic investments that are underway or in the pipeline.
... Some are already being finalized. I will start with offshore wind farms. Now, we have several percent share in this, but this is a project, even though we only have about 50% stake there, that will be the biggest project completed by the PGE Group. But any group in Poland, in fact, any energy group in Poland, we have contracted all key contracts, both for offshore and for land, for transformer station, which will collect the energy and then distribute it further. We have a full set of permits, including one obtained in the first quarter to build the offshore part. We are finalizing the elements that regard cooperation after the final investment decision with our partner.
We are updating the final version of the entire documentation, regarding due diligence for the funding, and that is preparing us for the final financial decision to be made in the second half of this year. Other projects are on track. Importantly, we would like to communicate to you that we are preparing to develop a long-term strategy. Apart from Baltica 2, we also have seven permits to build artificial islands. This is a project for over a decade, so we want to prepare well for running it, at which pace and what configuration, and how we should fund those projects. Another element is also linked to renewable energy, but this time on land, regarding photovoltaic farms. In the first quarter, we handed over one farm in Augustynka with 25 MW capacity.
We also informed you about starting 15 projects for the total capacity of 180 MW. A large part of that power, about 140 MW-150 MW, will be handed over still this year, just like the largest one-off project for 100 MW in Jeziórko. As for the second element where we plan to spend a lot of money, is modernization of our water assets, that is power plant in Dębe. The project is to be completed this year. Porąbka-Żar Power Plant is a long-term project on a large scale, and here we are talking with the European Investment Bank about financial partial funding of this investment in the REPowerEU facility.
We are trying to combine it so that it could be combined with PV farms. The next segment, district heating and decarbonization, is progressing as planned. Recently, in April, a reserve peak boiler room with 90 MW thermal has been commissioned in Gdynia. Likewise, in Gorzów Wielkopolski, recently we have 18 projects in 12 locations. The three closest to accomplishment are Kielce, Lublin, and importantly, for the Wrocław agglomeration, the next heating season will be powered by Nowa Czechnica, the new CHP. We're presenting... When it comes to gas energy, we are presenting a new segment, as part of which we have two major units powered by natural gas. Gryfino with two units, with total capacity of 1.4 GW.
The current status in the Unit 9, the first one out of two, was launched in February 2024 and synchronized in March 2024. Currently, it's already in operation, although it still reaches the balancing market. As regards the deadlines, the contractual deadline of acceptance, we're talking about with the general contractor on the final commissioning of those two units. We assume it's gonna happen this year. Importantly, that's the first power station, 1.4 GW, very flexible, three times lower CO2 emissions than comparable units in lignite or hard coal, and importantly, very flexible from the economic point of view, a very flexible power station owing to the market's conditions, the surplus of PV electricity.
Such a unit, can just fill it in when the sun is not shining and the wind is not blowing. And another project at the scale of almost 900 MW in Rybnik, the south of Poland, next to the current hard coal power station, we have a building permit. We're preparing to lay the foundations. At the same time, on three continents, key components of that power station are being built. The turbine in Germany, in China, components of the boiler and some other components in the U.S. The unit should be commissioned at the end of 2024. Since as of 2027, this will be connected to the capacity market. And the last component, distribution, over PLN 900 million worth. We're talking about 45% of CapEx incurred in Q1 2024.
What I'd like to draw attention to is that it's near on 100 km long, power lines. Meters have been exchanged. That's 25% of what we, what we are obliged to do in the perspective of four or five years to replace, or, or install such meters with all the recipients. And the next component I'd like to draw attention to is that we are accelerating, increasing the volume of CapEx, supported by subsidies. We've concluded PLN 90 million worth contract with the fund to support eastern Poland, and we're closing a contract worth PLN 36 million. We're trying to achieve, to achieve it in five out of seven, out of seven, branch offices. So there's still some leeway to obtain that financial support for the group.
As regards the operating volumes in four areas, as you can see, two of them are showing a negative trend. That's the production or generation of electricity, as well as district heating, correlated with the temperature. Q1 2024 versus Q1 2023, the average temperature was one degree centigrade higher. Whatever you do, these are facts. Temperatures are growing, so decarbonization is the direction that we should continue. As regards to distribution of, electricity, and trade, we'll still have some turmoil when it comes to comparability, owing to the segments of railroad electricity, which became part of it only in Q2 2023. So Q1 is not comparable in that respect with 2023.
If we take off 1.1 TWh of the energy distributed, we will be showing a slight increase at the level of 100 GWh in terms of energy distributed, which has been contributed to by a group of recipients such as households. When it comes to trade, if we subtract 800 MWh sold by railroad energy, the trend is negative, and it has been shown in Tariff A. That's the largest customer base in terms of electricity, where that increase is visible from 1.6 TWh in 2020 to 1 TWh this year. And this has meant that our total volumes, having subtracted railroad electricity, dropped by 600 MWh. The next GWh.
The comparison of Q1 2024 to the comparable result last year, the first component that made it the EBITDA lower, these are four or five components which most largely impact the EBITDA with regard to power generation. Four of them are in green. These are not small amounts. We have had fuel prices lowered by PLN 2.16 billion. And the revenue component, the drop in revenues with a negative surplus, meant that the EBITDA dropped by PLN 1 billion. We're talking both about the volumes as well as the drop in price by PLN 300 per MWh, as well as the dropping generation volume almost 1 TWh, which translated into the drop in revenues.
Another component which impacted the conventional generation, this is the drop in reallocation of power. That's what we already informed you about during the previous conference, that at the turn of Q4, the operator changed the principles of remuneration due to that, which caused on a quarter-over-quarter basis a drop by PLN 480 million. And above PLN 12 million less owing to Capacity Market. In the sundry item, there's a group of smaller components that offset each other, but it means that the total drop is by PLN 280 million, and the drop in revenues owing to highly efficient cogeneration. At the turn of 2023, we had that already, and now by definition, it has been eliminated. The information is important for the analysis of the district heating analysis.
And personal costs, inflationary pressure, almost PLN 400 million increase in the costs owing to that on a year-on-year basis. Next slide, please. CapEx, the result of over PLN 2 billion incurred in Q1. We're continuing the process of decarbonization, and we're trying to implement green changes. As you can see, all the bars are in green, excepting conventional generation, where the CapEx is lower by PLN 38 million. And renewable energies, low emissions, that's gas-based, but we call it here distribution. District heating, as mentioned before, Rzeszów, Nowa Czechnica, the second line... the second thermal processing line in Rzeszów. And railroad energy, Energetyka Kolejowa. But this stems from a low base because in Q1, 2023, it was not part of the group.
In total, that's the increase by PLN 441 million in terms of CapEx incurred by the group in Q1, 2024. When it comes to indebtedness, indebtedness at the end of Q1 increased versus December 2024 by PLN 4.5 billion. On the slide, if we were to compare the first, second, and third bullet, they actually net off each other, which means that the EBITDA enabled us to cover the CapEx, the CO2 provision, and the income tax. But the provision, which is much lower, as the President CEO mentioned, the CO2 prices dropped significantly by 30%, which means that the short-term working capital is shrinking and automatically translates into the increase in indebtedness.
Because to take care of the payments, we had to deal to amortize them for 2023. We had to incur debt with, financial institutions based on the contracts in place, hence, the increase mentioned. But if we take a look at economic indebtedness, which in inverted commas, cleanses, the issues connected with the CO2 provisions, they dropped by PLN 400 million . So you could say that given the PLN 20 billion, it's roughly stable , and hence, the goal to communicate with you in this respect, to clean the situation when it comes to, CO2 or the currency that we are buying it for. When it comes to the increase of, Q1 2024 versus 2023, on top of that, we had acquisitions performed in, 2023.
That was the acquisition of PKP Energetyka in Q2, and the purchase of wind farms, probably, unless I'm mistaken, in Q3, hence, the increase is so significant among the quarters. In the next quarters, it will be much flatter. The last slide of the presentation, we met five weeks ago, as we presented the annual results. By definition, the trends have not changed, as well as the reasons behind those trends. Conventional generation drop in the EBITDA versus 2023, a drop in regulatory system services volumes. District heating, as I mentioned, decrease in terms of highly efficient cogeneration, lower prices, causing lower margins, which were so significant that even the result generated will not be enough to level off the previous result.
Renewable energy, relatively stable, lower prices, but increase in capacity trade was presented here as provision burdening the fourth quarter distribution increase as a result of regulatory worth of the assets and significant return on capital at 11.75%. Railway energy, we have an increase in WACC. In 2023, we had a significant one-off increase as a result of connection fees, but we do not expect anything of that kind in 2024, hence the forecast for 2024 is lower. We recognized three quarters of railway energy last year. This year, that will be full 12 months. So that's it from me. Thank you.
Thank you, Director. Thank you, President, for your presentations. As promised, we can now move on to the Q&A session.
If you allow me, I will start with a question that we received online, and then I will hand over to those present in the room. The first question we received was, how the new regulations approved in the Act on Energy Coupon will affect prices?
The new regulations, which are not binding yet, that needs to be stressed here, we know they went through the parliament, but there are two elements. One is maximum price of PLN 500, and here I do not expect any positive or negative impact on the results, because a possibly higher price will be offset, as in the past year, so we consider this element to be neutral. The second element, which is related to the change in tariff. The currently valid tariff has been effective since January this year.
According to the proposed general legislation, the next tariff is to remain valid for at least 18 months. That will start in mid this year, beginning of July, and will continue till the end of next year. We are now waiting for the final decision. We will either engage in talks with the regulator regarding those G tariff costs. If the entire volume is not closed for next year, then we will act accordingly. But today, we are unable to say to what extent the new tariff will affect our results. If it turns out that in the second half of this year, when the energy had already been contracted and we can see even more negative impact, we will consider establishing additional provision at the end of the second quarter, 2024.
Thank you. Maybe one more question: What might be the CapEx on offshore this year, and what was it in the first quarter, 2024, within the renewable segment?
For the time being, those expenditures are not significant. The amount that we spent in the first quarter, 2024, is slightly over PLN 100 million, so 5%-6% of the total CapEx of the group. But those expenditures will indeed go up. I'm unable to tell you right now any precise to give you any precise amount, because the relevant investment decision has not been made yet, and this decision will, in turn, determine the dynamics of CapEx spending. However, the dynamics of CapEx will be greater than what we saw in 2023 or in the first quarter.
Taking into account the date of handing over this farm and the first delivery of electricity in 2027, the expenditures are likely to grow very high very soon. It will be very significant growth as a consequence of the need to pay in advance for maintenance for all things related to the project. From the perspective of the scale of the group's operations, as of now, those capital expenditures are not very significant, but they will grow very fast in the upcoming years.
Thank you. I would like to give the floor to those present in the room. Please raise your hand, introduce yourself and use the microphone. ...
Rafał Zasuń with WysokieNapiecie.pl. I have three questions. The first is about distribution.
Have you counted the average increase on a bill as a result of de-freezing distribution tariffs in the second half of the year? Well, the tariff has been approved, so it's just conversion calculation, what will be the impact on the household bills. The second question is about the dividend. Will there be any, and if so, in what amount? The third question regards the power market and its expiry in 2025. Have you checked the financial gap, unless this power market is not extended under the new regulation, if there is any delay in legislation? So what will be the financial gap for the second half, 2025?
As for distribution, I cannot really show you the impact on individual electricity bill, but distribution increase was already experienced in 2023 than in the first quarter. This does- did not affect individual or municipality consumers, but 55% is the average increase in the rate. Taking into account the distribution rate growth in 2023 and 2022... I do not remember the starting point, but we can find this piece of information, or you can check that in the tariff.
Too many components.
We will try to clarify this after the conference. As for the dividend on distribution, for the time being, no decision has been made. PGE still has the time till the general meeting is held, and that is still the end of the second quarter.
The priority of distribution remains investments, so, for sure, no profit generated by distribution segment will affect operating results and investments planned there. This is one of our key segments and one of the major beneficiaries of CapEx that is needed for modernization of the network, and that is we are doing on a regular basis.
We have ambitious investment plans, and for sure, these will be secured financially. As for the capacity power market, I would like to tell you that, basically, we have the overheads that are covered by from this segment, but if there is no income here, we will have additional burden, but that will be discussed with the new owner.
Any other questions, please?
Paweł Puchalski, Santander.
Let me start with the major issue that is setting off some assets. We had a few communications from the minister. They changed from one month to another. Allegedly, a certain governmental committee is working on this. I would like to find out if there are any preliminary meetings. At which stage are we right now? This is a very essential project of PGE at the present. And the second auxiliary question: Has PGE considered the possibility of select units remaining within the group?
That was the suggestion of Mr. Onichimowski voiced back in October 2023.
So let's start with this segment. Of course, it is rather complicated and complex process. We had a series of meetings in which we outlined the concept and the project.
We have already selected advisors who will develop the financial model, as well as proposed regulatory solutions, related to the offsetting of the assets. So organizationally, our conventional segment is prepared for this operation. You referred to this interministerial team for state assets. This body or this team will work with us in designing those solutions. We will, together, elaborate final solutions in this regard. We would very much like this transaction to be finalized no later than next year. And this year, the upcoming months, we'll see preparatory works that consist mainly in developing the financial model. As you can see, the market situation is extremely dynamic. Everything has to be translated into financial forecasts.
We have to address some public financial aid issues or standalone functioning of this segment. We plan to finalize all those works by the end of this year, including the development of regulatory proposals that the physical setting off of those assets should take place next year. I reiterate this in the-
... all situations where I have a chance to talk about it, would very much like this to happen in 2025. But it has to be noted that we are not the final decision maker, and it all has to be done in dialogue with the government. We need to take into account the position of the government, the position of the minister. We are working on those solutions, and I hope that we will devise a formula that will allow us to achieve our goals by next year. At present, we don't want to adjust the existing plans. Well, there are various comments on the topic because the concept is the work in progress, so various options are being tested as for its feasibility. But the general direction is clear and defined.
From my perspective, it should be feasible. For the group, it is absolutely vital that we strive to achieve this solution by next year. That is linked to the ambitious investment plans. The development projects cannot wait, and that has to be the sequence of events. First, the ownership restructuring that will release the potential of the group, the capacity for individual projects, especially regarding investments in distribution and, in particular, in offshore projects.
Bartłomiej Sawicki, Rzeczpospolita / Parkiet. I have two questions. The first one relates to the information contained in your report on the PGE GiEK assets value, and it's estimated at less than PLN 1 billion, PLN 979 million. I'd like to ask you whether it means that the value of the power station, after all the write-downs we've witnessed, is that amount, if that repre- amount represents that, or the write-downs for the Opole Power Station, 5.6, have already been made when it comes to the valuation of that entity? And the second question I wanted to ask, Mr. President, the last time when we talked, the last time you talk... we talked at the press conference, you talked about the project in Konin. We talked about the nuclear project, that it's contained in the calendar defined by the previous board.
I'd like to ask you, when that timeline defined by the previous board ends, and when you'll be starting making your ultimate decisions as for the further pursuit of the project in Konin or its discontinuation? Thank you.
To address the question on the assets of PGE GiEK, PLN 1 billion are net assets, i.e., equity. So this is not asset value, because we have assets versus equity and liabilities. So the assets after the write-downs, we're talking about PLN 20 billion+ . If I remember, Units 5 and 6 have not been subject to impairment yet. But you always have to... It's not on a net basis. So here we have net assets, and we still have a significant liability level. The asset value lowered from PLN 1.8 billion to PLN 1 billion, owing to the losses realized. Yes, there were losses realized. The assets were higher, but the losses realized in Q1 lowered them. But we're talking about net assets rather than fixed assets, which are at the level of PLN 25 billion.
The second question, the timeline for the nuclear power project. I would avoid the personalization of the timeline. There was the timeline for the project developed by the previous board, but it's still the timeline of the project that the group is involved in. It's very preliminary. You talked about the final decision, decisions. It's still very long way for such a complex project as nuclear energy. We're at the stage of very preliminary analyses of applying this technology in this location, and preparatory work is underway. Recently, we made the decision to install the meteorological mast, which is involved in tests, weather tests, and connected with the environmental decision. So currently, the project is at a very preliminary analysis stage.
The analyses of the feasibility of using that technology, and we're very remote from the decision to be made. This is a project distributed over years, and we are still at a very preliminary stage.
Yes. Yes, please.
Tomasz Brzeziński, Clean Energy Green Hub. I have a question on strategy. There was a hard decision presented, that you are making the decisions on... that you are pursuing your work on, on the strategy. When can we expect that document? And will this document contain a clear declaration on, the, the nuclear energy? Because I can see that the CEO is not decided. And what sort of nuclear projects, large nuclear units or smaller nuclear units, and whether there will be a significant allocation when it comes to energy storage? Because you mentioned that there should be more of them to stabilize the grid, and currently, the strategy and currently in place assumes some CapEx level and, power reserve in this segment.
Ladies and gentlemen, let me just say, address it on a one-by-one basis.
We are analyzing large-scale nuclear energy projects. We're not involved in small nuclear projects. Such projects are being analyzed in different entities. We don't have such projects in place as regards to the strategy. In my opinion, well, perhaps we haven't had an opportunity to interact on many occasions. I'm a very specific person. I like things that have a specific dimension. I would very much like that the new opening of the group, the new group strategy, should be the moment once we've closed the conceptual and regulatory work connected with the separation of hard coal of, of coal-based assets, because that will be the new opening of the, structure, the asset structure. So that's my dream.
So we could prepare the strategy where the large opening of the most important component will be the change of the ownership structure, new structure of generating assets and based on RES without conventional generation assets. So that's the moment when I'd like to announce the new strategy, announcing the new, new direction and new strategy of the group. So hopefully, this will happen as soon as possible. Yes, I confirm what you said, and I confirm your observation. The components connected with energy storage facilities will have a significant share in the new strategy because it will stem from the new power generation market and generating assets. In the next decades, they'll be characterized by high variability stemming from the RES nature, the nature of the RES.
As regards the supply in the market and the amount of energy in the market requires flattening. The amount of strategy has to be the same on windy and sunny days, and at night, as well as at night or on cloudy days. Energy storage facilities will play an important role, and this will be one of the most important components to the group's development and the development of new components of the group. That will be a component of the new strategy. So as part of the RES development, and the group will also be developed. We are at the stage of preparing the most, the largest project connected with energy storage, funded from the... or co-funded by the REPowerEU project, the national project of it.
That's energy storage with a power of 200 MW that will be performed in Żarnowiec, along with a fund for environmental protection. So this defines the direction. We're talking about PLN 2 billion worth of CapEx to be allocated in that. We are also assuming several dozen smaller energy storage facilities, both commercial, working on a market basis, as well as those that are not connected with investments in the grid, because they have to be prepared by the grid operator. They are more directed at the stabilization of the grid, so to provide energy stability in those areas where it would not be economically feasible to provide energy on an ongoing basis to recipients. So we are pursuing several dozen such minor projects.
So yes, this is a component which will be playing a, an important role in the ultimate projects. We are pursuing the largest project when it comes to the largest energy storage facility, 200 MW, in terms of its capacity in Żarnowiec. And I'd like the new strategy to be showing a new group, a new opening of the group, that will be based on the new generating asset structure and the key developmental projects. Today, we can say we can be modifying the dates. We can say that we'd like to separate the generating assets, we'd like to separate conventional energy.
I think it would be much weaker and less specific than what we'll be able, hopefully, to communicate soon, once we've reached the solutions and we've coordinated the regulatory and statutory solutions that will involve a change in the conventional assets ownership structure. This will be a new opening, perfect opening for the PGE Group that will be pursuing its strategy in the new energy sector, which at the Polish and European level, we are trying to build. That's my plan. That would be my plan and recommendation. Of course, if the situation gets extended, and if the situation, those projects are extended, then perhaps the best solution will be to perform a minor energy update or adjustment.
But I'd like us to meet in the large event and a large meeting where we'll be showing the group's new future, new start of a group which will be substantially changed, with a substantially changed structure and the developmental plans that you're aware of today. We're talking about investments in distribution stemming from the change in the electric energy system, the generation sources, changeability, seasonality, greater flexibility. This is the pursuit of large scale offshore energy generation that should be the base load for the years to come. And the district heating where and its decarbonization. And that's roughly the directions that we'll be working on.
One more question, but it's off the mic.
Please wait for the mic, otherwise, you, the listeners can't listen, can't hear it.
I'm sorry. The last part of the presentation mentioned several segments. I'm interested in gas-based energy. This is quite modest, PLN 22 million in revenues after Q1. Why, why the conservative approach when it comes to that? It's quite large when it comes to the energy installed.
I'm not sure I understand the question.
Well, you said that you don't, you didn't know, but you were expecting that the issue with the general contractor.
That's a different thing, the closure, the formal closure of the project. But I was saying that we were pursuing work, the start-up work, but it's still as part of the CapEx process pursued, so the energy is reaching the balancing market.
When can you expect this project to be fully operational? Do you know where it will be launched in full swing?
Given that we're at the end of May, if you look for the full operational capacity and the full results, we're talking about 2025. So we'll be talking about a whole of 12 months after the launch.
If we're talking about the impact on the annual results?
Yes. I mean, the full year will be next year, but the operational capacity will be this year.
But we're talking about Q3 or Q4. When is it gonna be operational in full swing?
It will be on a sequential basis, block Unit 6, Unit 9. I mentioned that. Unit 9 was synchronized in Q1, and Unit 10 was synchronized five days ago, roughly.
Thank you very much. Paweł Puchalski, Santander.
I'd like to ask you about the offshore segment. The first question is, as part of the project pursued at the beginning, will all your expenditure funded from equity, or will the debt-based funding, debt funding kick in at the same time? That's question number one. Question two, on your further licenses, whether you'll be able to present the first project for the auction in 2025.
To answer your first question, by the time the final investment decision has been made, we provide funding from our own sources, and afterwards, we will provide funding in such share as pro rata will be established in the structure of the total funding. As for the auction, we plan to participate in it in 2025.
We are now reviewing how individual areas are attractive to us, and we arrange them in a queue in our pipeline in terms of the best potential contribution to the overall result of the group. The market situation of offshore investments is extremely dynamic.
The costs have been growing significantly in recent years, so we need to have a careful look at our portfolio to identify those projects which represent the highest potential in terms of the contribution to the overall profit of the group, and start with those projects which do represent this highest potential. We are now at the stage of carrying out those analyses. The whole idea is to arrange them in a line which is optimum for the group.
Thank you very much. Irek Chojnacki, Wirtualny Nowy Przemysł.
Director Sudoł said, or maybe the president said, that you had a an advisory company helping you to develop the strategy of setting off the coal assets. And who is your advisor? That is my question. Which company advises you on this?
The second question is related to the information about the final decision on offshore, that this final decision is going to be made about Baltica 2. And what about Baltica 3? When do you expect a similar decision with regard to Baltica 3? And then a negative EBITDA in coal, did you also record a loss on operations there? And do you expect a negative EBITDA in this segment for the whole year?
As for conventional energy, indeed, the results are negative. If the same trend continued, naturally, the result can be negative unless there is snowfall. Energy prices rebounded, but the snow would have to fall right now, let's say, in mid-July, no later than mid-July,
No later than 22nd of July. That would be a new celebration.
But the prices are growing. In the spot market, we came to the level of below PLN 300 , but then, as CO2 prices increased, the overall energy price also increased. That's all driven by volumes. If there is snow, volumes will go up.
And otherwise, we will have negative impact.
In the first quarter, you had an operational loss, negative CDS?
CDS was positive. But PGE GiEK is a different company from Enea, for example, because we still carry the cost of lignite. The share of fixed cost per unit of lignite is growing. CDS are positive. The margin, the first margin is positive, but then if we include.
So, in other words, you have a loss on operations?
Yes, negative EBITDA. We are transparent about this. The first margin was positive.
And what about this advisory company and FID? Final investment decision?
For, we talked about the third. We are planning to make a decision in the second half this year. And Baltica 3 is undergoing the process of reconfiguration analysis and seeking of solutions that will boost the economic attractiveness of the project. I cannot give you any prediction on when the investment decision will be made. We are just bound by the Offshore Act with regard to the funding provided. And in CapEx, we have the market situation as it is. We know by when we need to generate this energy. That is the timeframe that we have.
Then one more question related to gas. You mentioned the expected date of handing over the units in Gryfino. What about Nowa Czechnica? When is it going to be handed over for operations? For winter 2024, 2025.
So sometime in autumn. Yeah.
Unless winter starts early.
Paweł Puchalski, Santander.
Please, just one question. You, and then we have also a lady here and Mr. Zasuń.
Distribution cost of capital. This year, we have a 3% premium, and that is absolutely key. The amount of this premium is absolutely essential for the following years. When an analyst works on a model, should such an analyst also include the 3%, assuming your high CapEx for this segment, or can anything change either in plus or in minus? Because we know the basic level of weighted cost of capital, but the premium becomes essential. So what should an analyst put in their model for the following three or five years?
Well, professional judgment, it's hard to discuss this level. There was also a discussion on the distribution rate. Accumulated growth was 50%. But on the other hand, we have other requirements. Well, actually, I'm not able to say whether you can add or remove the 3%. Anyway, we are happy that we can assume 8.5% return.
So far, we have functioned without this, only taking an annual perspective. Okay, so, now additional question: What timeline do you have for PwC, by when they supposed to finish their analysis? Will PwC value those assets for you?
Yes, if we want those things to be finalized next year, they need to finish this year. They should be done in the third quarter. I hope we will do all this in a dialogue, so we do not expect concept to be put on the table in the third quarter, and this concept turns out to be unacceptable to us. So, both with regard to regulations and with this interministerial team, and the advisor, we want to do that together so that the concept that is elaborated by then is final and viable. So we are now preparing for this dialogue, but we want the work to be likely to function.
We don't want to come up with a solution that will later need to be discussed for another six months. So we want, on a working basis, to develop the concept that will be prepared together with other stakeholders.
The financial model regulations, valuation and offshore, do you plan to take part in this auction, in the second part of, the offshore project?
We are now elaborating our approach and developing our pipeline and defining the formula in which we want to participate. We are now working on a solution on our approach. We are currently working on it, and I hope... Well, now we are focused on FID for Baltica. But the key element will be in the developing of the formula of cooperation, because there can be various types of cooperation, potential partners, and then the approach to sequencing the projects that we want to pursue in terms of their positive or maximum optimal contribution to the group value. But it would be premature to suggest any concrete solutions. There can be various approaches.
Thank you. Thank you very much, Mr. President, and thanks to the directors, and thanks to all those who have come to visit us here, as well as those who have watched us online. And for those of you who are here with us, behind this gray door, there is a small treat and beverages, so you're all invited to take advantage of them. Thank you.