Just double mic myself. Good afternoon, everyone. My name is Margaret Kaczor. I am the research analyst at William Blair & Company, who covers Dexcom. Thank you, guys, for all being here. Obviously, we got too small a room, we will work on that next year. I am required to inform you that I personally own shares of Dexcom, and beyond that, you can obtain a complete list of research disclosures or potential conflicts of interest at williamblair.com. With that said, pleased to introduce Jereme Sylvain, CFO of Dexcom.
Thanks, Margaret, and thanks, everyone, for being here. Certainly excited to be back, another year, at the conference. Wonderful conference and pleasure to be in front of everybody again. We wanted to take a little bit of time, run through the organization, run through a little bit of background, leave a little bit of time, potentially, for Q&A, but really talk about where we've been, where we've come over the past year, and really give maybe some line of sight as to where we think this industry goes. With that said, you know, we have our safe harbor statement. I won't read it unless you guys really want to. I think we start off. This is something that we changed at the beginning of this year.
We're a company that really started in the origins of managing diabetes. It's really where the company was originally founded, managing glucose levels. Certainly, that was the origins of continuous glucose monitoring. As time has moved on, we've really changed our mission statement to taking control of health. There are so many opportunities associated with glycemic control, so many health side effects associated with glycemic control. We made a change this year, we're going to talk a little about what that means over the course of the next 30 minutes or so, it's really important to understand that glycemic control impacts so much more than we ever thought was possible. You'll see it as it plays through.
Just to recap where we are today, 2022, about $2.91 billion, organic growth of about 20%. We grew our patient base by about 35% over the course of 2022. A lot of this is available publicly. One thing just that we're very, very proud of, and we'll talk about it a little bit more, is we also increased our scale and our capability. We expanded our operating expenses as a percentage of revenue by 500 basis points over the course of 2022. For those that recall, back in 2017, we were about a 400 basis point loss from an operating income perspective, and 16.7% as we operated last year.
Over 2,000 basis points of expansion over that time period. It just really demonstrates the value of scale here over time. We launched a lot of products, and we're going to be talking about those in the upcoming slides. Specific to guidance, just to give a ground set, and then we'll get into the details here. We guided to between $3.4 billion - $3.515 billion, 17%-21% growth. We raised that last quarter. Op gross margins of 62%-63%, operating margins of 16.5% and an EBITDA of 26%. At the end of the day, just a really great year ahead of us here. We have a lot of product launches.
We'll get into those over the coming slides, but just really proud of where the organization has come and really proud of where we're going to continue to be able to go. A lot of the conversation revolve on G7 and Dexcom ONE. We'll talk about that. Two new major product launches for us over the course of 2022 and into 2023. It'll form a lot of the basis going forward. Why? Why all the growth? Why are we here? What's ultimately driving it? We've talked about this slide in the past, for those that have seen it. It's important to ground before we get into the details.
Diabetes alone, not even the other types, prediagnosis, prediabetes, other related glycemic issues, but diabetes alone, about 537 million people in 2021, ultimately afflicted with the disease globally, and growing to approximately 783 million people by 2045. It's not getting better, and the cost of treating it continues to go up. We spent nearly $1 trillion in 2021 globally to address this pathology that continues to grow over time. As more and more products become available, more and more drugs become available, I'm sure most folks in here are aware of GLP-1s and all of the impact that that's having. Those costs will continue to grow unless we do something to arrest it. It's why we're here today.
It's why we know CGM has a massive place in managing it, and we'll talk about some of the reasons why. This is why we're here. It's out of control at this point, and CGM is a tool to do so, and a few slides explaining about how. This is some of our favorite slides. We talk about it. This is what would happen in the daily life of an intensive insulin user, someone that uses mealtime insulin. You'll look at this, and you'll take four finger sticks a day, and what you would say is: "Well, gee, I'm borderline in the morning, and in the evening, I'm great. In the afternoon, I might have run up a little bit, but boy, I think I might be okay here." The reality is, this is what the glucose levels look like.
These are real charts that we see from folks. This is a very common chart, where for most of the day, 17 hours of the day, this individual is outside of their glycemic range and above 140 for 13.5 hours. Not only do you have the risk of hypoglycemia, and those folks that are impacted over the course of the night, which can be deadly at any point in time, but the long-term effects of being hyperglycemic are massive. It's massive to the population, cardiovascular issues, certainly limb issues, nerve issues, sight issues. Think about all the things that are comorbidities associated with this, and this person's going down that path without that knowledge. You fast-forward it to a Type 2 basal user, someone who might take one finger stick a day. This is a very familiar chart.
It's a familiar chart in my family. I have folks in my family that are basal users. They would take 1 finger stick a day. They'd wake up in the morning and then say, "I'm good. Look at this. I'm in range. I must be doing an incredible job." This is what it really looks like. While, yes, there was a point in time when you took your finger stick, likely in the morning when you're fasting, when you're likely at your best, over the course of time, you were out of range for most of the day. 17 hours out of range. This person is not gonna end up longer term in a wonderful position. There are health outcomes associated with this, which are very dangerous. This is where I think you think about what CGM can do.
You have readings all of the time, in real time. The feedback is there. This technology can do more. This is what we're here for. This is what the opportunity represents. We're really excited about what Dexcom has to offer in this space and where the future is. You can tell it goes well beyond your most intensive user. It starts to really go down the acuity curve. With that, this is our new product. We launched this in 2022 outside the U.S., in 2023 in the U.S. It was really kind of kicked off with a Super Bowl commercial in February, available shortly thereafter. G7. It's a new standard in technology.
You can see all of the features on here, but I think the most important takeaway from G7 is, while we continue to have the high levels of accuracy, what I would call it the professional level, monitoring capabilities, the professional level accuracy, the professional level connectivity, the one thing we did is we made it much simpler to use. It's easier to use, easier to interact with, better connectivity, fully disposable. You can throw it in your bag and go. This is what we believe is the new baseline for where CGM goes over the long haul. We're very excited about it. It provides a platform in which we can then go into more markets. One of the great things about this product is it's based on an entirely new software feature.
That software was designed with ease of use in mind, but it was also designed with iteration in mind. We can change the software experience over time to tailor the needs of the individual. These are all of the features that are embedded in this technology. It's gonna be the basis for where we go. Just to give you some early feedback, the feedback's been incredible. One of the big challenges we've had in G6 is it was a bigger form factor. G7 is now. You don't know you're wearing it. I forgot I'm wearing it most of the time when I wear it. It's such a small form factor. It's well-located. You forget you're wearing it, but at the same time, you get the fast warm-ups, the technology advancements of it. A lot of times, sensors require a warm-up period.
Competitor products, up to the first 12 hours, has to be adjunctive. Our product was a 2-hour warm-up period with G6. This is a 30-minute warm-up period. In many cases, it's less than that. You put it on and very shortly thereafter. For those folks that are impacted by diabetes, that are taking insulin, having that warm-up period is some of the most dangerous times of the day. You don't know where you are. The speed of this is incredible. Comfort and convenience, ease of use, you know, that's a big thing. That was really important and is part of the design here, is how do we make this available to everybody, not just those that study it? That becomes important as you move into more adjacent markets from your intensive insulin base. At the end of the day, it does not hurt.
It is easy. People think about invasive, yikes. This thing, if you put one of these on, you barely feel it. It's incredible. That quote at the bottom is the biggest one. 97% of customers find it very easy to use, and that's a wonderful thing as we think about it. What's next for G7? We're going outside the U.S. in more international markets. We've launched already in 6 markets. This quarter, Q2 of 2023, we will launch in 7 more international markets, and so there's a real opportunity here to go into more and more places. That's next for us, and we're very excited about the opportunities there. In the U.S., where we did launch in Q1 of this year, we're building access.
As you think about it, you launch a product, one of the big challenges is getting folks onto the product. What we've done is a couple things. We created a bridge program that allows folks to access it in very near term. We're working on coverage, and to date, Medicare has provided coverage. The commercial DME channel, for the most part, has provided coverage, and we're ahead of expectations on the commercial pharmacy channel. Very excited about providing access to G7. It's a wonderful opportunity for us. We're building the world's most continuing, most connected system. We already had the most connected system. G7 will be an expansion of that. We're working with multiple different health partners, and we are working with our pump and pen partners to integrate G7 as soon as possible. It's a real opportunity there.
In terms of sizing the immediate market, just to give you some context as to why we're so excited, this is the core U.S. market. It's a slide that represents coverage and adoption. If you look back at the history of CGM, and this really does a good job of showing it, the green represents adoption over time. For those that follow the space, both us and our competitor have really experienced times of incredible growth. It really has been a wonderful past 5 years. What we can tell you is, with the expansion in basal coverage, which took place this year, this is probably the least amount of adoption relative to coverage we've ever had. That's incredibly important. All the success, the adoption, the uptake over the past few years, and with this new coverage, we're at the least amount.
It's an incredible opportunity ahead of us in our core markets. I think a lot of times people ask, "Well, how long does your core market have to go?" Well, it's got a long way to go. We're really excited about the opportunity in the basal market. For those folks, that just a little bit of a background, CMS covered basal recently this year, started in April 16th, and we're looking to expand that coverage into further Medicare Advantage plans and then ultimately to U.S. Commercial. Real exciting opportunity ahead of us in our core markets. This is where we're going with these opportunities, is making sure that we are the most covered and easy-to-prescribe CGM on the market. How we're doing that? is we're making it easier and easier to prescribe.
When you think about our product, we are lowering barriers to entry. We've provided this bridge program to make it easier. We're knocking down prior authorizations. The whole goal here is as you start to meet people where they want to be met, whether it's in the pharmacy, the primary care physician, the endocrinologist, or the DME channel, we wanna make sure it's easy to get access to our product. It's an important part of getting folks onto therapy. We also wanna have broad customer access. What I mean by that is whether you want to be covered in the DME, you have a high deductible health plan, it's beneficial for you to go through a durable medical equipment provider, or whether it's easier to go to the pharmacy. We wanna provide opportunities for both of those, and we'll continue to push for both of those access channels.
We have great DME partners. We have great pharmacy partners that ultimately support getting access to the product. Through all of this, we're continuing to look at an efficient service model, that's either leveraging DME providers or pharmacy to get it to the end user in the way they get their products today. By doing so, by leveraging these service models, we can ultimately drive the cost down over time. Driving the cost down hopefully increases access. We're working on all of those as part of our longer-term strategy. At the end of the day, we know we are the most reimbursed CGM on the market today. Commercial execution.
Thinking about what we've done from a commercial execution perspective over the past few years, you know, first and foremost, the coverage of basal and Medicare was really driven by our study, driven by the MOBILE study. It's something we knew was coming, we knew it was an opportunity. We started this study in 2018. Ultimately, that study came out and was the basis for CMS providing approval. We've doubled the size of our sales force because we knew it was coming, and we knew primary care was the likely space where most basal patients were going to be seen.
We doubled the sales force. In doing so, we've been making inroads into that primary care space to the point where we've doubled our primary care base. Over 75% of our calls at this point are to primary care physicians, no longer endocrinologists. That's just important. That's where our basal population is seen. That's where a lot of the growth is ultimately going to be. We introduced the sampling program. If you go to your doctor right now, you can sample a G7, you can sample a G6. It allows you to get onto the product to understand the value of it while we work on getting prescriptions in the background. That was new to us in 2021, and we continue to expand it today to make it ever easier to trial the product.
Maybe lastly, we empower the sales team with digital tools. If you ever see a sales team come into a physician's office and you ask them to see what's on there, they will know what the coverage is at that physician's office. They will know what that physician prescribed, both our product and competitor product. They will know what each copay was. They will know what the average copay by patient was. They'll know who to go to make it easier for them. By doing so, that workflow has been incredibly important, really allows us to execute at the opportunity in front of us. While we're really, really excited about the U.S. market, and like I said, we're the least adoption we've seen since 2017 after the growth run we've had, we're as just as excited about the international market.
We've been taking share outside the U.S. for some time, very excited to see that. We've entered new geographies, we've reduced the barriers, we've gained reimbursement. We've got an e-commerce platform where it allows us to expand efficiently, maybe we've gone direct in certain markets. All of that is under the whole concept of. We started as a U.S. company, we started going where we had the most reimbursement. As we've expanded capacity, we've expanded our ability, we've really focused on really going where we need to go in the future. In the international markets, we expect to be, talked about this in our LRP, 30% of our company's revenue by 2025. Started off very, very small. I think it was $40 million back in 2016, something along those lines.
It was a really small part of our population. Last year, I think we were close to $800 million. Just goes to show the growth there, and it's going to be one of our growth drivers in the future. How are you gonna do it? We have a portfolio strategy, and this is our first foray into software, so we're really excited about it. There's broad reimbursement, we go with a product called the G series, the G6, the G7. That's where we go. Germany is a great example of a country with broad reimbursement. Where there's tiered reimbursement, very common, especially in European markets, where you have a high and a low acuity, where tender markets tend to take the lower and there's specified funds for the higher. We have a tiered reimbursement strategy.
We have our G series. What we talked about was Dexcom ONE. Dexcom ONE is a software differentiated offering, a service differentiated offering on the same platform or chassis that our G series sits on. Really important as we go after these opportunities where maybe there isn't pump connectivity, maybe they don't need that, but there's a reimbursement at a certain level, so we offer that. It's been a great opportunity for us. We've won many tenders to date, and it'll continue to be a core part of our product offering. We have a limited reimbursement market where there isn't much reimbursement, but there's an opportunity there. I'll use Dexcom ONE as an example on the e-commerce platform in the Baltic countries, so Bulgaria, Estonia, Latvia, and Lithuania.
We use an e-commerce platform, and within four months, we already had reimbursement in two of those countries, and as of today, we have reimbursement in all of those countries. There's a cash pay option and now reimbursement available. In many ways, we go into markets where there's limited reimbursement, we create reimbursement via awareness, via cash pay option. We'll continue to lever that e-commerce platform as we move forward. It's a real opportunity for us. To that point, we've unlocked real access for 3.5 million for people in the past 18 months. That's 3.5 million of good access, people that have low to no copays, people that are able to get the product where they want to get the product in these countries. This is something where we're really proud of the work we've done here.
It's been a lot of effort around tiering the markets, entering into these tenders, thinking about product portfolio, and it's something we're gonna continue to do for years to come, focusing on how to unlock the opportunity of CGM in these markets. Maybe I'll shift to maybe one other element then is in the Type 2 space. We've talked about our core markets in the U.S., our core markets outside the U.S.. The real big opportunity at the end of the day is as you move further into Type 2. What we know is user engagement, health outcomes, and return on investment are going to be the three big pieces of it. As you size the population in the U.S., there's about 30 million people in the U.S. with Type 2 diabetes. That includes the basal population as well.
All of these folks could use therapy, and as we meet with primary care physicians, a lot of the primary care physicians, we have them in our office. They say, "I want to put every single diabetes patient I have in my practice on CGM. How do I do that?" There's economic reasons that are challenges, there's reimbursement reasons that are shown, there's getting folks in there's stigma associated with it. What we can do is, through this process, we can demonstrate why this is the right product, this is the right way to do it. We can be more effective than other therapies. I'll explain exactly how here. User engagement, what we've done is we've demonstrated with MOBILE, the study that ultimately gave us basal coverage, is that folks wanted to wear the product.
94% of the folks wanted to continue to wear the product after it was over, and they wanted to wear it full time. This is a population that we're targeting. These folks want to wear it, and if you've had a chance to wear one, the insights that come back to you, the feedback into how you operate, is incredible. It changes how you interact with food, health, exercise, it, medication. All of those really play through. Health outcomes. We have to demonstrate that by putting on sensors, you get better. Makes sense, but we're using real-world evidence to do it, pilots and partners, and demonstrating that clinical evidence. What we've demonstrated is there's broad cardiometabolic outcomes associated with wearing a CGM.
You know, I personally have worn them, and I tell you, it changes how I interact with food. It changes my exercise regimen, and when you put it on, ultimately, it changes in my case, it changed my weight. Return on investment. We have to demonstrate that the ROI back to the system is incredible, and that's ultimately what we know. We've been able to demonstrate that $400 + per month cost savings by just putting on a sensor in this Type 2 population. That's significantly more than the cost of it, and much less than the cost of some of the other drugs that are being used to treat this population. It's a real opportunity to expand it, and we feel like there's opportunities for us in this space.
Maybe lastly here, we also use connectivity as a competitive advantage. You know, as we move into the space, you imagine this world, right? This world of what product am I gonna use? One of the things that is pretty obvious is folks are gonna wanna do what they wanna do. Which app do I wanna use? Do I wanna use yours? Do I wanna use somebody else's? How do I want my insulin to be delivered? What weight loss app do I wanna use? How do I follow a loved one? These are all the customers that we work with today, and we work with many more even behind the scenes. We are the most connected CGM in the world. It's part of our strategy.
Years and years ago, we built this back end of connectivity because we knew the world, the future of the world would revolve around CGM, is identifying glucose, but then how you wanna manage your glucose would be up to you. You can see we're connected to AID devices, pens. We've partnered with Tandem, Insulet, Lilly, Novo, Garmin. Signos is a weight loss application that uses our product levels, certainly metabolic outcomes. We are connected via follow apps, Clarity to caregivers. That's the other thing we thought is, well, gee, how could this product be better? Well, if your child has diabetes, what a better way than to follow them, whether they're at school or sleeping or at a sleepover at someone else's house. How do you do that? How do you care for a loved one that's a parent that needs to be on therapy?
How can you follow them? How can your physician follow you? That's where you can use Follow or your Clarity report to ultimately demonstrate how you're doing and provide those insights. Lastly, we are looking for healthcare providers. How do we connect via Glooko or others to healthcare providers at all times? We are looking at ways to integrate into employee health records and make sure that you can have that data at your fingertips at any given time. That connectivity solution has been the basis for where we think this market is going and how we're thinking about this product in the future. It kind of circles back to the end, right? Where are we? The left-hand side of this slide is what we've been talking about, a little bit from the existing markets today.
When we get into a financial modeling question, I'm gonna stay on the left side. That's where we stay in 2023, and that's where we're focused, which is your Type 1, your intensive markets, your core markets that we're in today. It's where we are, but where we're going, the market there is incredibly large, and it's incredibly exciting and ultimately what we think we can do to change healthcare and allow people to take control of their health. We do believe the Type 2 population is in need of a change. We do believe that prediabetes, there's up to 90 million people in the United States that have prediabetes, that are on their way to Type 2. That's a massive opportunity that if we can reverse the course of that through education, we absolutely wanna do that.
Gestational diabetes, we haven't talked about it in this presentation, but ultimately, we plan to disrupt gestational and reverse the use of the oral glucose tolerance test. We had a child about 6 months ago. My wife went through an OGTT test, almost crashed her car on the way home because it spiked her up, and then when she came down, she came down low and ultimately parked the car and passed out for a few minutes. We just put on a sensor, didn't have to do it again. That's the vision for that. We also believe in patient monitoring. After either at a hospital admission and/or a hospital discharge, why are we still finger sticking?
Ultimately, if you're in the hospital and you're administering steroids or you're, you have diabetes and you're admitted into a hospital, part of the regimen is monitoring your glucose levels, and that's typically done via finger stick. There's no need to do that. There's no need to have a nurse check on you every hour. You can monitor someone remotely. Then when you're discharged, what's one of the biggest reasons of non-healing? It's elevated glucose levels. It's one of the big challenges in healing. We can ultimately monitor that and give the feedback, both to the doctor and to the individual, to monitor that. Then, obviously, the big one is health and wellness. We talked a little bit about that. We're not going to hit on it specifically.
Our product isn't necessarily approved for that at this point, but glycemic control, it's obvious, is part of many, many things that we do today. For those folks that are out here following GLP-1s, you understand that folks are using diabetes drugs to manage health and wellness. Our product can do that, but the one thing about our product is it doesn't have any side effects. It's an interesting opportunity to use that, to understand how the body interacts with what you do every day to drive it. Ultimately, if we can address that, we can address health, and that's what we're really here for. Maybe lastly, this is our why.
You know, one of the things that if you came into our office, you'd see these are all people's pictures that are on the wall everywhere we go, and you can see them in the background here. It's a little hard to see on the screen. What's really important to know is all of these folks are folks that we help, and it's an incredible mission-driven culture that we have at the organization. Every time we struggle to get up in the morning or every time we have an opportunity, that we just think about all the millions and millions of people we do help and the millions more that we can. It drives us every day. I hope you see us that we're a pretty passionate organization, and I think you'll see us continue to drive that passion going forward.
That's all the prepared. I don't know if you had any Q&A you want to address. I know we only have a few minutes, but happy to take any questions.
I'm just gonna say I'm happy to talk on the right side, even if he's not happy to talk on the right side. We'll try it anyway.
Sure.
You know, I think the first question is, you guys just got basal reimbursement for CMS at, you know, mid-April. I'm not sure if you're gonna be willing to talk about how that is so far, but, you know, I guess just bigger picture, do you guys have the capacity to bring on a significant number of those patients if you haven't maybe added reps in a period of time?
Yeah.
How do you do so?
Yeah. Great question. So far, I'll tell you anecdotally, it's gone very well. There's been a lot of interest in it. The challenge, of course, is it's generally sold through the DME, it'll take a little bit of time to quantify it, anecdotally, people have been very excited about basal coverage. In terms of capacity, when we doubled the size of the sales force, the focus was calling on high-decile prescribers of all insulin, including basal. The inroads have been made there. From a coverage perspective, while we may want to expand coverage a little bit from the sales force, it wouldn't be a material step change in how we're going. It'd be normal as part of our thoughts around investment. We do have a sizable sales force. Could expand a little bit more it may.
In terms of capacity from product availability and how much we have, you know, for those folks that have followed the story, back in 2018, 2019, we didn't have enough capacity, and we struggled with G6. That was off the launch of G6. We learned from that. We've built a lot of capacity ahead of time with G7, and we have a lot more capacity about to come. We've built a Malaysia facility. It's 1 million sq ft. 1 million sq ft, so it's a very, very, very large facility, which comes online in Q3 of this year. It's June, so relatively soon. We're progressing very nicely there and expect that to provide an absolute needed shot of additional capacity should we need it.
Okay. Maybe let's keep going on this trend of growth and these, you know, basal G7, our pitches, we've been waiting, you know, for 15 years plus for G7 to arrive, as it finally has. Is it as meaningful, I guess, to patients? You know, as you think about, you know, that capacity question again, can you grow 20%, you know, on volume I guess for three, five years with the capacity you have, or?
I'll start with the capacity question, then I'll talk about the product, 'cause you're right. I've been with the company now 5 years, and it feels like I've been waiting for the product for 25 years. Yes, it's an absolute game changer. It's a wonderful product. It's something we've been focusing on as an organization. We talked about Malaysia. Malaysia will double the total company's capacity right out of the gate, and there's a real opportunity there, and then for those folks that have been paying a little bit of attention, we also announced we are going to be building a factory in Ireland. The second Malaysia is up and running, we are now building a factory in Ireland that will come online, you know, probably 2 years , 3 years from now.
Yes, we have enough for the next couple of years. We obviously have done the math to make sure we do, and clearly, we're prepared for the next phase of growth a few years out through that Ireland factory and beyond. In terms of G7 and what it provides as an opportunity for meeting that capacity, think about a form factor that can be used across all the different pathologies we've talked about. That's why it's so important. It's not just important from the markets we're in, which it's incredibly important. It's easier to use, and we talk about, for example, supporting veterans, right? Veterans who have challenged putting in G6, and while it's pulling the transmitter out and putting it in, it may seem like common sense for those that have been injured in war.
That's a much more difficult proposition. G7 really takes all those barriers and really moves those to the side in our core markets. As you move beyond your core markets, ease of use, simplicity, an easy app, and how you engage with that app, that is a critical part of that growth, and G7 provides that framework. Maybe the last piece about that's why I keyed on software. We are imagining software as a differentiator in terms of going forward. I think you'll see us spend a lot of time with that form factor, reimagining the customer proposition in the form of software. It's a very exciting time for us, and we think it's the basis for our future growth opportunities.
Okay. I have to ask the question on the right side, and I'll keep it away from modeling, maybe then you'll answer it.
Yeah.
I guess bridge me from, you know, this eight million population of core users in the U.S. today to 30 million people, and then you mentioned 90 million pre-diabetics. You know, these are very large markets. How achievable do you think that can be? I think what's been surprising to us is, you talk to your competitors, we talk to you, there's actually a lot of adoption for people that are non-insulin users o utside of your core today, you know, how do you get those people online, and how do you get them on a Dexcom?
No, I think first and foremost, it's gonna start with the education of what it can do, the demonstration of outcomes and the demonstration of outcomes across the gamut, right? When I say demonstration of outcomes, demonstration of outcomes to payers, that it reduces costs, demonstration to clinicians that it provides outcomes, demonstrations to patients that they're going to be healthier. As we educate folks in these spaces and get the word out there, that's the first part. The second part is accessibility and making sure folks can access the product. That's something we're working on.
I think if you ask yourself and ask you and ask your neighbor, would you want to wear this product if it gave you line of sight to your glycemic control, even if to trial it for a week, a month, 6 months, whatever it ultimately is? We ask that question all the time. There's absolutely interest. If I could tell you right now what you ate for lunch, whether that was good or bad for you, whether you were going to gain or lose weight, whether your glycemic index was gonna go up over the long haul, whether that was going to help with your longevity, you might not wanna know. The point is you start to have that line of sight as to what's going on. The opportunity's out there.
It's about the education and really starting to draw those parallels to the general population.
Last question: When will you guys start to feel comfortable to start either talking about the modeling or kind of bridging towards that number?
You know.
It's not a modeling question, it's just a time question.
You know, at the right time. It's not really an answer. We'll get out in front of it. We talked about it today because of the interest. What I really wanna do, and the reason why we don't wanna do it, we wanna be very responsible about how people make investment decisions. While we'll talk about it in generalities, what I'd hate to do is give someone information without having the, you know, not perfect, but a very good crystal ball to give you that line sight and have those. The opportunity is huge. We're very confident that there's a business there. We'll get back to you on the modeling.
I'm gonna try harder in the breakout. If you guys wanna come, feel free. Thank you for being here.
Thank you very much. Thank you.
It'll be another 15 minutes.
Nice to be here.