Hi, everyone. Welcome and good afternoon. Welcome to our 25th annual growth conference here at Needham. Certainly, thanks for joining us today. My name is Scott Berg. I lead our enterprise software and SaaS research efforts here for the firm, for the, I guess, one or two people on the call that might not know who I am. Today with us we have Five9, who coincidentally is my top pick this year. I'm looking forward to the conversations. We have with us today the company's relatively new again CEO, Mike Burkland, company's President, Dan Burkland , and the company's CFO, Barry Zwarenstein. Thanks, everyone, for joining us today. I will, before we get started, I know Barry wants to go over the safe harbor statement. I will turn it over to you, Barry, to start.
Thanks, Scott. Want to remind everyone that our discussion today will include forward-looking statements about events and trends that affect our industry and our company and its operations. Actual results may be materially different from what we discuss, including risks relating to various things. Look at our 10-K and 10-Q under the caption Risk Factors to get detailed information on that could cause our results to be materially different.
Well, great. I guess to, start, how about giving a brief overview of who Five9 is to the, you know, to anyone on the call that might not be familiar with the company?
Yeah, happy to do that, Scott. Five9 is a leading provider of cloud contact center software. We help large enterprises and large brands reimagine their customer experience. We refer to our space as contact center in the cloud, CCaaS, as well as CX. You'll hear people talk about the CX platform space, that's us. Again, we're enabling our enterprise customers to reimagine that customer experience. We replace legacy solutions, on-premise solutions that have been around for decades, like Avaya, Cisco and Genesys in the contact center. Interestingly enough, CX has become more and more strategic to these large brands and large enterprises as they use it to differentiate. We've all experienced poor customer experiences when reaching into call centers and contact centers.
Many of these brands have come to the realization that they've got to get better at that. They use it to differentiate, but they also are very aware that consumers today demand more. Quite frankly, their loyalty to these brands is dependent on a great customer experience. We're helping them change that game and change that experience into a very good one. It's a large TAM, where, you know, if you look at cloud penetration, it's still early innings. We estimate 10%-20% cloud penetration into this massive on-premise legacy market. We're still in the early innings of a massive opportunity. Five9's becoming a recognized leader in terms of our 100% native cloud offering from day one. Our scalability.
We're winning because of scalability and our ability to handle large agent populations. It's why we've won some of these recent mega deals. Our AI and automation portfolio that we've added over the last couple of years is truly putting us out ahead of the market. It's an exciting time in the contact center cloud software space.
I wanted to start out by focusing on Mike for a second because, Mike, you've been out of the CEO role for about five years. For those that don't know, Mike was a longtime CEO of Five9, took them public in 2014, so you know, very familiar with the space. During that five years, how has the space evolved, you know, relative to, you know, 2017 versus what you're seeing today? Is it the same or is there something different that you're noticing in the environment?
Yeah, a lot has changed, Scott, and it's not just the environment. A lot has changed with Five9. I'll first give you a kind of, you know, what's changed at Five9, and we'll talk about what's changed, you know, in the market and in the industry. We as a company have reached new heights in terms of our platform, in terms of scalability and reliability. It's why we're winning today. You know, we made an acquisition a couple of years ago of Inference, which allowed us to, you know, have an AI and automation portfolio that drives self-service capabilities into these contact centers, and we've innovated on top of that acquired solution. It's a true differentiator for us. Those are the types of things that have changed within the company.
If you think about what's changed outside of the company in terms of the market, large enterprises are finally adopting cloud. It's become mainstream for the very, very large enterprises to shift to the cloud. A lot of the drivers of that have been our improvement in maturing our platform, for example, for scalability requirements that they have, but also the importance of CX, as I mentioned earlier, the strategic nature of it. The only way to deliver that great customer experience is by moving to the cloud. The legacy providers that we replace are not innovating. In fact, they're end-of-lifing their on-premise solutions in some cases, as we've all seen. It's a very different market, especially up into the large enterprise.
We've marched up market, large enterprise, $1 million+ ARR customers now make up over half of our revenue. It's, you know, it's an exciting time to be in our market. As I said, early days still in terms of penetration, that hasn't changed. I mean, as an industry, we've penetrated the market more, it's still relatively early days where we're 10%-20% cloud across the entire market.
I think the, probably the number one question I've had in the last two months, Mike, with you coming back into the CEO position, is trying to understand how the company may or may not act differently. If you look at the company and its recent execution, do you have the view that you need to make any wholesale changes? I don't know, product, sales execution, whatever it may be. Are you coming in and really more enabling what the company's already had success with?
Yeah, good question, Scott. Absolutely no wholesale changes. The strategy stays the same. As Chairman of the Board the last five years, I've been very involved in setting that strategy. You know, we are gonna continue on the trajectory we're on. This is more of the same, so to speak, but it's also gonna evolve. We'll obviously continue to keep a leadership position in this market. You know, we're gonna continue though with the strategic growth priorities that we have had for the last couple of years, marching up market, going to the large enterprise more and more, which is where, as I just said, we get 50% of our revenue, and it's growing rapidly. We are gonna continue to expand internationally. We had 78% growth in bookings in Q3 internationally.
We're gonna continue to invest in the platform, especially around the AI and automation solutions that we're delivering to these enterprises because we're delivering a hard ROI in those cases where they can actually make a labor arbitrage move, which replaces live agents, if you will, with virtual agents, or we, you know, allow them to hire less live agents and put in place virtual agents as they grow.
All right. Let's move to product and the industry a little bit. I've dedicated a lot of time to automation in the contact center over the last couple of years, you know, partially 'cause it's a new technology. It's interesting, it's exciting, there's a big vision there, and you all have had success with different products there. Overall, automation is generally, I think, well understood by the investors in Five9 and other companies in the space today. I guess the question is: where do you take automation from its current product set? You have two primary products there that you seem to be selling well. Have we reached the end, or what does maybe that next phase of automation potentially look like?
Scott, we are just at the beginning. First of all, that is the most important part to understand here. In terms of an industry leveraging AI and automation to provide things like self-service or virtual agents on the front end of an interaction, things like Agent Assist during an interaction where you've got a live agent and someone on the phone or someone in a digital channel, where we're using artificial intelligence to help assist the agent to know how to respond to an inquiry, for example. Post-call or post-interaction, we're using workflow automation to follow up, you know, with things like SMS messages for appointments and so forth. These are still pretty early days in terms of the capabilities and the potential for AI to do more in the contact center. Let me give you an example.
We will be delivering a product that we call AI Insights, which allows our large enterprise customers to use artificial intelligence to evaluate and analyze all of their customer interactions, whether they're digital or voice, through transcribed phone calls, to understand where different types of transactions are occurring or how many of the transactions might be of a flavor that can be automated with a virtual agent, for example. If you've got 10% of your customer interactions that are looking to track a package and its location, that's a very simple, repeatable, automatable, if you will, interaction. You can think about AI as not just helping pre, during and post-interaction, but helping these enterprises strategically decide which interactions are great candidates for automation and self-service.
That's just an example of where things are headed. Then on top of that, you've got core technologies like GPT-3 that are allowing these large language models that are actually. We're using those in our future products, where they're in the R&D part of our, you know, part of our business right now, or they're in development. We're using those core technologies to deliver even more powerful automation solutions in the future. These are, you know, things like GPT-3, you're gonna see over the next few years, you know, more and more progress, obviously, in this area of AI. Just buckle up. It's gonna get really interesting, and it's gonna be an interesting five+ years.
You know, I think one of the kinda the key themes is how AI is taking over the contact center. At least it was a key theme at Enterprise Connect this last March. I guess kind of two questions along those lines are: Has the early hype paid off? Are customers, you know, getting the ROI that these technologies were promising? Second, if the value really is that high, has the introduction of these technologies changed the demand curve for cloud contact center deployments at all?
Yeah. I think it's safe to say that it has, Scott. I mean, the ROI is such a... You know, if you think about what the example I just gave around IVA, right? The virtual agent taking-
You know, call it even 5% of a large enterprise's contact center traffic and deflecting it to self-service, that ROI, where an enterprise might pay $4,000 for a live agent today, you know, our virtual agent is $400 a month. $4,000 a month for a live person in terms of compensation expense, $400 a month for our virtual agent. That's a pretty hard ROI if you think about that, you know, 10/1 ratio in terms of cost to get those transactions handled. It's a very interesting catalyst for a lot of these large enterprises to move to the cloud because they're not able to get this type of feature functionality and automation from the premise solution.
It's a nice catalyst and a nice tailwind for us, and I think it'll be there for, you know, again, for a long, long time in terms of, for, you know, in terms of creating a durable growth opportunity for us for many years.
You had touched on customer engagement earlier. You know, customer experience and contact or customer engagement have been hot themes for a couple of years now. Is this increased focus driving any specific product changes within your product suite outside of what we're seeing, you know, with automation?
Yeah. I'll take that, Scott. Thank you. You're absolutely right. Customer experience, customer engagement have been hot, and it absolutely has been driving our roadmap for product introduction. That's reflective of what we've done even over the last several years. The introduction, like we just said, and as Mike just alluded to, you know, we acquired Inference, so that we could deliver a better experience and deliver choices to the customer, so our customers could deliver an opportunity for their customers to either self-serve or speak to a live agent, whatever their preference might be.
It also drove us to deliver things like Agent Assist, where we're delivering AI-driven actions based on what's being said in the conversation in real time, fetching information from various data sources, and then feeding the agent with kind of a cheat sheet so they can be more effective and more efficient as they have their live conversation with the consumer. Workflow automation. We acquired a company called Whendu to give us workflow automation, so we could then close the loop and improve that experience by not having to use manual labor to call back and ask if they received their whatever it is, their package, and have they installed it, and is it successful, and will you take a survey? We can now automate all of that as well.
The introduction of that automation has been driven by the really the requirement that enterprises have to differentiate and deliver the best customer experience they can. That's become more and more strategic, and it continues to be more strategic. Mike alluded to one factor, which is the AI Insights. You know, now by being able to use AI as a prescriptive tool, we cannot guess what's the most common questions being asked in the contact center. We can actually pull the summary data from those calls and say, Aha, 22% of your calls are asking this specific question. That's a candidate for potential automation. Lots of things are being introduced. It's driving the product roadmap, and it's all about what you just said, which is the customer experience and customer engagement, and how we can improve it.
Like we said, we're just getting started. There's a lot of not only the automation increasing, but the use of that is getting more and more comfortable by consumers.
Improving that customer engagement, or customer experience, I think is kind of an interesting concept in the space at least. I think a product area that we're seeing, in terms of demand from some customers is around having a truly combined platform to service, you know, all customer channels, whether it be voice, chat, mobile, social, et cetera. You know, Five9's made a, I would say, maybe a subtle but important or big push to add more best-of-breed, let's say chat functionality, for instance, over the last couple of years. I guess where does the Five9 platform sit in this utopian view of combining all these channels?
Can you ultimately get there, do you think, over a period of time, or does the customer support or engagement requirements still sit in some sort of a, you know, a, I don't know, fragmented technology environment?
Yeah. That is a wonderful question because... That's been one of the barriers to entry in our space. When you look at, you know, in the small and mid-size enterprises, as we've grown up as a company and sold into those markets, we had to build a solution that was truly end-to-end and had the full comprehensive solution, like you said, with all the different channels, inbound, outbound, chat, email, social, you name it. You've got to have a complete solution that the business buyer cannot have to develop or integrate into anything else. That's very important for the business buyer to have that end-to-end.
However, as you move further and further upmarket, you also need to make sure that your platform can be inserted into an enterprise where they may have already invested in point solutions for those things, whether it's from their CRM vendor, where they may have put chat or email in, or have a knowledge management database where they're getting their data from. The key there is being able to have an open system that has the APIs and built on microservices so that you can insert into an enterprise without having to say, Oh, I'm gonna put this in, but you gotta use ours. You gotta use our chat or our email or our... You wanna be able to integrate to best-of-breed that they may have already invested in. That's one flavor all-in-one, and we have that.
We check all the boxes with all the, all the capabilities. Second is, they're not required. You can use your best-of-breed ones you already invested in. Third is really being able to have a platform that they can develop on top of if they wanna build their own customizations in addition to that. You kinda have to feed all three of those different types of buyers.
One bit of housekeeping. I did forget to mention that we will take audience Q&A when we're done here. If you wanna ask a question, there's a Q&A field box on the presentation window. Either enter your questions there or email them directly to me at sberg@needhamco.com, and then we'll take them in about probably 11 or 12 minutes. Lastly, on products, you know, I've seen the company deliberately add the functionality and complexity to walk upmarket to larger customers, you know, at what's been a very predictable pace. You know, Mike, you mentioned some of the large contracts that you signed last year, some of these really mega deals, which kind of proves out your product strategy there.
Is Five9 missing any functionality to serve the largest contact centers, maybe even the outsourced BPOs, as they think about migrating to something from their, you know, outside of their current perpetual implementations?
Yeah, you know, not at all. When you ask the question, are we missing something? You know, validating and demonstrating that we can serve the largest, most complex contact centers globally in any geography, is something that we take great pride in being able to do that. We're not missing anything. However, there are solutions that are extensions of our platform that we may choose not to build. We have a great ISV partnership program that allows companies where we may have a particular customer, especially at the high end of the enterprise, that may be one of a very few that would ever add a capability, but, they need it.
It's important for us to have not only the open platform, but also create partnerships to be able to leverage their solution. An example of that is in analytics and reporting. You know, we have a very robust analytics and reporting engine, but we also have customers that say they wanna use what they've had and what they've been introduced to. The ability there is we can either, you know, OEM in some cases and sell that to our customer, or integrate to it if they've already got it in place. It's important to note that we wanna have the full portfolio. Most of it's provided by us, some is leveraged by third parties.
lastly, on the industry, the contact center industry, I think competitively, in my own kind of work in the space, I've seen Genesys and Talkdesk have more success selling their respective cloud solutions, you know, than three or four years ago. I know the company, you all like to talk about your high win rates, which have been extremely consistent over the last, you know, six, seven, eight years. Is that competitive dynamic changing at all from the way that you see it? Is this market just really big at the end of the day, and multiple vendors have a chance to win?
Yeah, Scott, I'll take that one. You know, the win rates, our win rates against our two key competitors, remain above 75%. This is a massive market, and there is room for a lot of players, but there are really only three of scale, of significance that are competing day in and day out for these replacements of legacy, Avaya, Genesys, and Cisco. It remains a three-horse race. Our competitive win rates remain, as I said, above 75%. You know, again, this is a high barrier to entry market. There's a reason that there are only three of us, and there have only been three of us for quite a long time.
There are some noise, there is a little noise around the fringes, these are companies that wanna associate themselves with the contact center space from a CX perspective. What they're, what they will realize, if they haven't already, is the barrier to entry is significant. That's why, again, it took some of our competition, even the, you know, amongst the three of us, a long, long time to get into this space.
Wanted to touch one question on go-to-market. It's kind of a two-part question. When I think of the company's go-to-market strategy over the five+ years or some of the evolution of it, two items really stick out. The first is the increased involvement from partners to directly sell, not just refer. You all have had good statistics on, you know, 50+% of your deals are influenced by partners, but you have enabled partners to actually directly sell over the last couple of years. The second is adding the right personnel on your own direct sales team to target these really large customers on these mega deals that you've discussed.
I guess starting on the partner side, is the company at the point where the partner strategy is properly set, or do you need to continue adding more and more regions you're targeting?
Yeah. Great question. On the partner side, we've established a foundation and put in great expertise at the leadership level to go after and really leverage partners as much as possible. That involves a whole lot of different types of partners, whether it's the big global SIs that are oftentimes the trusted advisors and really the consultants in these large companies that wanna do digital transformation. They're helping not only select the platforms that they put in place, but also help implement and, you know, design what goes in. It's very important for us to have those partnerships. We also have the VARs that traditionally and historically have large install bases of premises solutions that they're actually replacing and moving to the cloud.
We wanna be front and center in those positions, and they oftentimes have influence there. We've got referral partners, technology solution brokers, as they're often referred to. We've got other, a variety of different routes to market to get there. We think we have a good formula for success, but it's still in its early stages as far as the potential for building that up and gaining true leverage. It's primarily been a route to market, meaning that they've opened up doors and given us greater at-bats. The next chapter or the next phase of those partnerships is to really enable them to take on more and more of the services.
Early on in the infancy of, you know, the cloud adoption, it's hard to do that 'cause they didn't have enough volume on their own to be able to have predictable revenue streams and to train all the people. They weren't getting the pull from the customers saying, w e need you to go build a practice around cloud. They're now getting that, they're knocking our doors down to say, hey, we want to invest, we wanna get trained, we wanna get certified so that we can deliver the services on the platform. Do we have the right formula? We believe so. Do we have the right partners? Yes, and that list keeps growing. Third, we think we have the right trajectory for what it needs to evolve into.
Flipping over to the other side, talking about the direct personnel that we have. I get that question quite often. Now that you've moved up market, do you need to establish or bring in a new sales force to be able to accommodate that? We've actually had quite a lot of folks, including myself, I've waited more than a decade for the market to open up, 'cause many of us have sold up market into the largest contact centers in the world. We have relationships and know what is required to sell into those companies. The patience of the folks that have, you know, been here for eight+ years, my entire leadership team, seven of my eight SVPs have been here for eight years+ .
We've now gotten to a point where we were patient, we sold smaller systems, we're working with the companies we're used to. The long answer to your question is no, we haven't had to revamp the sales force. What we have done is move people into swim lanes so that they're in their comfort zone, so we have the right people working the right deals. You know, it's a very different sales process selling a, you know, mega deal with tens of thousands of seats in a global Fortune 50 company than it is to go do the more transactional sales. We have folks in separate teams for our net new logo acquisition, our hunters, if you will, selling into commercial, selling into mid-market, selling into enterprise, selling into strategic.
I think it's been a great way to get the most productivity and make sure that we're not losing any opportunities because we have the wrong people, assigned to the account.
All right. We got couple minutes left, at least for my questions. I have two more. We're going to take a financial bend here, at least. We have Barry on the call. We have to ask at least one or two. They're questions that I've had a little bit over the last several weeks. The first one, Barry, you know, the company signed two of really large notable deals last year. You have all discussed multiple times. Knowing these larger deals require more time to completely go live, just given the, you know, complexity and number of seats, is there anything to be mindful of on these large contracts that could potentially impact ramp time or revenue recognition in calendar 2023?
Yeah. Thanks, Scott. Bear in mind, the replacement of these mission-critical systems, the enabler of enhanced customer experience and a generator of big ROI, are decisions that are taken at the very highest level of these companies, and they're not decisions that are taken lightly or they are subject to chopping and changing. It's also of mutual interest to us because we have to plan and commit resources to do this. Typically, these things are steady as she goes. Just to level set to make sure that everybody in the call remembers what we said on the third quarter earnings conference call, which is on the parcel delivery service, half is already live, and the other half will go live in the course of this year, practically pretty much all of it.
On the healthcare conglomerate, start will be made in the fourth quarter of 2022, and then, the rest of it will come live, in the course of 2023 and early 2024.
Okay. My last question is one that I've had a lot for as well over the last month or so. You all invested very heavily in sales and marketing the last couple of years to go capture new parts of the market that were opening up. I would certainly think large enterprises is a component of that. You've invested in the burgeoning partner strategy, Dan, that you mentioned and discussed a moment ago. Adjusted EBITDA margins have modestly backed off from the 20% level the company had previously achieved. In general, if revenue growth were to slow into a more modest range that you've seen historically, would there be any reason why the company couldn't see some margin expansion over time?
Well, we certainly do expect both gross and EBITDA margin expansions, Scott. As a testament to that, we put out our 2027 model, which calls for the gross margins to go from 61% to 70%+ , and the EBITDA margin the last quarter, 18%-23%. You know, we feel comfortable with our operating expenses where they are. We might want to increase R&D a little bit, actually, counterintuitively. It's below our range. But both sales and marketing G&A are at or within where we want that model to be.
The gross margin has taken a detour, and it's taken a detour deliberately, and as we think wisely, to both invest in the professional services that we needed to take these mega customers across the world into areas we just hadn't been before and doing things that we hadn't had to do before. That now, that rapid increase in doubling really of our professional services headcount increases from the 30s to the high 50s or 60s is now basically over. If you look at the other element of it, cloud operations, that hasn't faded. It's still got some residual amounts to go. We said on our third quarter earnings conference call that we end at 61%, and we see a resumption in due course, not necessarily in 2023.
We haven't given guidance on gross margins yet, but towards that long-term 2027 70%+ as a result of that leverage of our approximately 80% of our revenue that goes against fixed and semi-fixed costs. The same we did slowly and steadily, and we'll resume doing.
Very good. That's helpful. Thank you. We have several questions from the audience here. I will moderate those. I'll take this first one because I think it's interesting. Can you ask about why they think their competitive ranking by certain tech rating companies like Gartner have been deteriorating over the last couple of years versus other competitors?
Yeah, I'll take that one, Scott. I think it's safe to say that, again, when you think about Gartner, we, you know, they've chosen to use a criteria that unfortunately for us just doesn't line up with where we focus most of the business. They chose to put a lot of emphasis on international seat count. As you know, historically, as a company, we have always had the discipline of investing a marginal dollar where we know we can get a predictable ROI. For the 15 years I've been here, we've always run the business that way. We purposely and strategically chose not to go international till more recently. You've already heard from us the international bookings growth at 78%. It's a huge opportunity.
It's for us going forward, it will become a bigger percentage of our business. In this case, unfortunately, Gartner chose to create a threshold to, you know, for their analysis that you had to have so much of your business internationally. Again, that will be resolved over time. I gotta guess the best net-net answer I can give you.
All right. Next question is on investments. Many tech companies are slowing employee growth rates. I mean, we've seen a lot of news articles on those, obviously, including significant layoffs. You all are already highly profitable, not that you're gonna lay off anyone, but you continue to invest in areas like sales as aggressively as you have the last several years.
Again, Scott, we've always taken a balanced approach, right? Of top line and bottom line performance, if you will. Top line growth and bottom line profitability. Fortunately, we've been very disciplined through the years. When you look at macroeconomic backdrops like the one we're in, obviously we throttle our hiring or our employee growth. We're pretty scientific about it. We like to say we invest on top of the curve, you know, right on the curve, as opposed to out in front of the revenue curve or behind it. You know, again, we believe so much in this opportunity. You look at our long-term target of $2.4 billion by 2027, you can look at the growth rate that that implies.
That is all about, you know, the market opportunity and the size of it, the replacement of these large legacy on-premise solutions and the number of seats available to us over the next 10- 15 years. It's a durable growth opportunity. We're gonna invest in it. At the same time, we're gonna be very, very smart about how we invest in it, given this, you know, uncertain macro backdrop.
Next question I like: Any thoughts on ChatGPT? Is this a risk at all to the contact center vendors?
No. In fact, it's a huge opportunity. We are using it in our research and development right now. We, you know, we've always taken the approach with our AI and automation that we're leveraging core technologies from Google or GPT-3, which is OpenAI. We do not wanna try and reinvent that wheel. Those are technologies that are gonna continue to improve at a very rapid pace. We leverage those technologies to deliver our AI and automation applications. Those are actually enhancing our solutions to customers, those advancements. If, you know, I will say that some of our competitors have actually made the mistake of trying to build some of those AI building blocks themselves. They're wasting their time and their money, quite frankly.
Next one's probably for Barry. Can you help us understand the philosophy behind your initial outlook into calendar 2023? Is the methodology similar to prior years, or have you changed anything structurally in that guidance?
Yeah. Interesting. Let's skip over the pandemic years and go to pre-pandemic, where we always gave 16%. We give a initial prudent look, outlook on the year, because there are uncertainties in terms of seasonality back then. Now we've got additional uncertainty in terms of the macro. What we've assumed in, by the way, in that, in our numbers, is that the macro stays pretty much where it is. The, you know, weakness, soft landing or even no recession, not a hard landing. Okay? Why, you know, why were we still at 16% versus the prior years when we didn't have that macro environment?
The answer is that Five9 is a much, much stronger company than it was four years ago. In terms of going way up into the market, something that we would not have contemplated back then. International, AI portfolio, clarification of our international data centers, et cetera. We felt that that balances the macro out. The last comment I would make is that I can imagine there would be a degree of frustration in terms of people trying to build models, looking at the half of our revenue growth that comes from new logos and half that comes considering the backlog and the mega companies, and the other half being install base, which is also not immune from a recession or slowing down the economy.
Where there have been headwinds. You would have to get to a very low dollar-based retention rate to make those numbers work. We're not endorsing any dollar-based retention rate. We want to remind you that 16% for us is a starting point. Top-down starting point. As the year unfolds, we'll be able to update it based upon particular conditions at that time.
Fair enough. Last question, because we only have about a minute left, is, do you plan to invest to further develop your workforce management solution?
Yeah, I think, Scott, it's safe to say that that's a, you know, it's a key component of our platform. As you know, we have our own solution, and we also have partner solutions. It's a, it's a market that has been around for a long, long time. These solutions, you know, have been around and have been pretty, I won't say, you know, fixed in time. There are definitely things around the edges, but our partners continue to invest in theirs, and we continue to invest in the one that we, the one that we own and the one that we acquired. It's an important part of the overall solution set for these enterprises to be able to manage agent performance, for example. That's really what they're designed to do.
It's around quality management, recording and, you know, workforce engagement management, as we, as we call it these days. It's an important component and, you know, it'll continue to be a very important component for us.
Well, with that, we have hit the end of our time. I wanted to thank everyone for joining us. Mike, Dan, and Barry, it was great to see everyone back together again on one of these.
Thank you.
Looking forward to catching up soon.
Thanks a lot, everyone. Thanks for joining.
Thank you. Bye-bye.