Good afternoon. My name is Dustin and I will be your conference operator today. At this time, I would like to welcome everyone to the Las Vegas Sands Corporation 4th Quarter 2012 Earnings Conference Call. All lines have been placed on mute to prevent any background noise. After the speakers' remarks, there will be a question and answer session.
Thank you. I'll now hand the call over to our host, Mr. Daniel Briggs, Vice President of Investor Relations. Sir, you may begin.
Thank you. Before I turn the call over to Mr. Adelson, let me remind you that today's conference call will contain forward looking statements that we are making under the Safe Harbor provisions of federal securities laws. The company's actual results could differ materially from the anticipated results in those forward looking statements. Please see today's press release under the caption Forward Looking Statements for a discussion of risks that may affect our results.
In addition, we may discuss adjusted net income, adjusted diluted EPS, adjusted property EBITDA and hold adjusted adjusted property EBITDA, which are non GAAP measures. A definition and a reconciliation of each of these measures to the most comparable GAAP financial measures included in the release. Please note that this presentation is being recorded. We also want to inform you that we have posted supplementary earnings slides on our Investor Relations website for your use. With that, let me please introduce our Chairman, Mr.
Sheldon G. Adelson.
Thanks, Dan. Good afternoon, everyone, and thank you for joining us today. Joining me on the call today are Mike, Rob, Chris and Shinn, and we look forward to addressing your questions in just a few minutes. Well, we had a record quarter. On a hold adjusted basis, we generated $1,100,000,000 in EBITDA and $0.63 of earnings per share.
But first, I would like to provide a progress report execution of our 4 principal strategic objectives. 1, deliver organic growth from our existing property portfolio 2, deliver additional go through loan investments in our current markets 3, identify new integrated resort development opportunities in geographic areas outside of our current markets of Macau, Singapore, Las Vegas and Pennsylvania. And 4, increase the return of capital to shareholders. I like that one. 1st, organic growth.
I will highlight our record performance in Macao, where our industry leading scale and infrastructure investments enable us to deliver robust market leading growth in the world's largest and most profitable gaming market. For the quarter, our market share growth gaming revenue on account was 21.1%, up from 15.5% last year. That's a 36 percent growth in our compute. Rolling volume was up 37.1% this quarter to a record $39,000,000,000 That represents VIP market share of approximately 18% of rolling volume for the quarter compared to just 12.8 percent 1 year ago. That's a 40% increase in market share rolling volume.
Equally impressive is our strong growth and momentum in the last market in Macao. Due to its high margin structure, this segment is far more important to our future cash flow and bottom line results. That doesn't mean that we're going to ignore the VIP or any other segment, but we just want to point out that this is a very robust potential. Our mass table win of account for the quarter was up a whopping 52.6% to more than US759 $1,000,000 another company record. Our unrivaled strength in this segment allows us to lead the pack in EBITDA generation in the Macao market today as we always have.
Looking ahead, our investments in our portfolio of integrated results on the Cotai space in Japan, featuring dining, retail, entertainment and the hotel room capacity so vital to serving the Mass Gaming segment, uniquely position us to deliver strong cash flow growth in the company. Our mass table game productivity again improved meaningfully this quarter with US9 $716 per day. Our mass win per table per day was a record at every property in our portfolio with the 4 seasons increasing 68% and the Venetian Macao increasing 47.8%. While I'm full of figures today. Sands Coke Data Center continues its steady ramp.
With the mass table and slot businesses each reflecting meaningful growth this quarter. Total mass flow per day, which includes revenue from mass table games, electronic table games and slot machines increased by 65.4% compared to the quarter ended December 31. We welcomed over 13,000,000 visitors to our Posthouse Strip properties in the 4th quarter, including over this is why over 5,000,000 dollars in the month of December alone. When you annualize that, you're coming to twice than every visit at Cipacao came in at least twice. We recently opened a fully enclosed climate controlled pedestrian walkway with escalators and moving sidewalks to promote greater interaction of and accessibility between our Cotai strip platform.
The pedestrian walkway links Sands Cotai Central and it's almost 6,000 hotel rooms on the east side at the Cotai strip with the Venetian Motao and Four Seasons on the west side. Promoting easier access between all our Cotard Strip properties. And as additional amenities mature, including the 2,100 new Chevenan hotel rooms and the additional gaming capacity that came online earlier this week and as the massive infrastructure projects underway to our China make it easier for more people residing outside Guangdong province to efficiently and conveniently reach Macau. We believe our interconnected Cote d'Azk Group properties will complete comprise an ideal platform for growth in the world's largest and the most profitable gaming market. Stepping back to the opening of the pedestrian crossway between the east side of the Strip and the west side of the Strip.
We have, as expected, increased the retail sales 1st week or 2, 1st couple of weeks, I think almost the whole 1st month by about 45% on the 2nd floor of the Four Seasons. It's also increased the 1st level. And we significantly increased the retail sales on Cotard Centro on the 1st, 2nd and 3rd floors. Turning to what which provides additional value to us when we get to the point of monetization of our retail assets. Turning to Marina Bay, The US68.5 billion dollars was enrolled.
It was the 2nd highest quarterly total of record and missed setting the property record by owning a slim margin. If we held 2.85% against that rolling volume, we would have produced EBITDA of $406,000,000 this quarter at Marina Bay Sands. Let's turn to strategic objective number 2, development growth in our current market. In Macao, we will also develop the Brizin, which will be our 4th integrated resort property on the Cotas strip of Macao. The Brizin will add another interconnected integrated resort property to our portfolio on the Cotai Strip.
We've received the requisite government approvals and announced starting construction of the Parisian. Our site preparation work has been underway. We are targeting the open in the Parisian for late 2015. Let's turn to strategic objective number 3, development of integrated resource in new markets and geographic areas. We're committed to identifying and executing our new development opportunities in Asia.
And as we have we've had teams on the ground for some time in Japan, Korea and Vietnam. And we will continue to work on these promising efforts. We've also been investigating opportunities elsewhere around the globe, including in Europe, North America and South America. In December, the government of the region of Madrid passed legislation that outlines a regulatory framework to enable integrated in the Madrid region. There are a variety of step floods in the development process, which continues to move over.
As we've said in the past, we will only pursue projects with EBITDA returns in excess of 20% on investment. As the company's largest shareholder, I naturally have a vested interest in pursuing only the highest value projects that will maximize shareholder returns. Your interest and my interest are aligned. Turning to strategic objective number 4, return of capital to shareholders. The Board and I were pleased to be able to return nearly $3,100,000,000 of cash to our shareholders through dividends in 2012.
It's gratifying that we have now built our business in cash flows and strengthened our balance sheet to the degree that we were able to return such substantial sums, while retaining sufficient liquidity to fund our promising future growth opportunities. We have every intention of increasing the recurring dividend in the years ahead, hopefully in the month of May. And our business and cash flow steadily grow. Before moving to your questions, I want to point out an asset of the company that we will continue to highlight, our retail mall business in Asia. We generated over $128,000,000 in revenue.
That's a 16.9% increase over the results from 1 year ago. Net operating income reached a record $110,000,000 in the quarter. We believe our Asian retail model assets are among the most valuable retail assets of their type in the world. And at cap rates for similar assets in Asia could easily approach $9,000,000,000 to $10,000,000,000 of that. Eventual sale of monetization of those assets, which is an important component of our fundamental business strategy, will fill our coffers and allow us to greatly increase the return of capital to shareholders in the future.
In closing, let me emphasize my confidence about the future of our company. With our outstanding strategic positioning and the disciplined experience we've seen we have in place to execute our strategy, I couldn't be more optimistic about the future. So with that, let me turn the call over to Mike to begin the Q and A session.
Thank you, Sheldon. Operator, may we please have the first question?
Our first question comes from Shaun Kelley with Bank of America.
Hi, good afternoon everyone. Solid results. I just wanted to see if I could start by asking about Singapore. Looks like the volumes there were very strong. Could you give us any color about just the trends that you guys saw across the quarter, how Western New Year looked and just kind of what you guys saw at the rebound particularly on the VIP side that drove that big number?
Sean, it's Rob Dolson. We obviously, a good quarter on the volume side as far as the rolling segment. I would caution you that it's a very concentrated market. We're not sitting next to Mainland China. And so again, it remains concentrated, but we're seeing obviously happy with results in terms of the volume.
More important from my perspective is the mass the non rolling in the slot ETG number was I think a nice bounce from the bottom. Our high was 4.6 a day. We were north of 4.4 a day and we see recovery there, which I think that's more to me, that's more important to us for long term opportunity that represents $1,100,000,000 of departmental income that annualized. So, to me, the rolling volumes will continue to vacillate. We could see some real growth or we could see it diminish.
It depends on the players that visit that quarter. But to me, the critical part for Singapore was to bounce back up to a number above 4, 4 a day And I hope we can trend back up. As we've mentioned previously, we have a sales team and a strategy in place to address the premium mass, because we drive that premium mass from a tourist perspective and not be dependent on local Singaporeans, I think will bode very, very well in the future in Singapore. Clearly, a $400,000,000 normalized quarter is a damn good quarter. We're very happy with the numbers.
And just one more, Nit, on The $400,000,000 does not adjust for the $24,000,000 So we would probably add that back on a recurring basis as well, correct?
That's correct. That's correct.
Great. And then switching over to Macau, obviously, some really impressive property level margin numbers. I think that the question that we're getting from folks is just as we look forward here, you guys look like you're really starting to take some share. Just any sense you can give to us about how you're kind of seeing customer behavior, maybe starting to look at things more like bookings as we think about Chinese New Year and looking a little bit ahead here given just how strong the rebound seems to have been in December and into January?
Even our new property we opened 2 days ago is 100% full for the new Sheridan tower of 2,100 rooms approximately is completely booked for a change and all the properties.
Sean, we should take share. We've got the best products there to take share because we have the most rooms, the most gaming space. I mean, look, we're in a very fortunate position having enormous exposure in Macao and we should take share. Our retail, our footprint both in Cotai and the Peninsula, we're in a very privileged position. So, yes, we're very happy with the quarter, but we think the best is ahead of us.
Look, it's an extraordinary market from any perspective, best in the world. We've got the most exposure there as far as game positions, retail space, sleeping rooms. So, to Sheldon's point, it just keeps getting better. As you know, the greatest predictor of a mass gamer's place to gamble is where sleeps. And in our case, with all these new rumors, we are
in a position we should
be taking share and doing very, very well in the future. And we're very fortunate, obviously, to have not just the mass, but the premium mask going our way as well. So feel very bullish about what we did last quarter in Macao.
And it's last everybody except the homeless.
Great. And I guess the last one for me would be just a big picture strategic question, but you did bring up the in your prepared comments the retail space. Any timeline or any sense of timing you guys could give to us about how you're thinking about that? I mean, I think generically, we've heard in the past that you did want to get Curtissential probably ramped up a bit further on the retail side before you looked to to maybe something more strategic, but any color or glimpse you guys could give to us on that?
Sean, we've made no decision in terms of the timeline for retail disposal. I think as ramp ups take place both in Singapore and Macau, they're always under consideration. We are getting our work done organizationally for when the time comes so that we'll be prepared for whatever disposal matter will take place. But there's no real indication now. We have still a long way to go in terms of building that business.
And we're seeing very significant increases in retail still in Macau. And of course, the other thing is that we are planning to do an additional shopping center in Macau, subject to government approval. Those plans are being submitted as we speak. So there's a long way to go before we'd actually put it on
the marketplace. That piece of land that we're talking about putting up a standalone retail mall, a big one with about 800,000 net rentable square feet and potentially another 300,000 plus in the Parisian net. The only question facing my mind right now is whether or not we see a change in the cap rates coming up in front of us because that would motivate us to move quicker. Or we should wait till we put up the new mall and the freezer before we sell all the retail in Macao. We can also make a deal that we sell the current retail, the Four Seasons, the Grand Canal Shops and the shops in Cotai Central.
And then with an understanding that somebody else will buy, somebody will buy with a predetermined cap rate and a certain EBITDA number. The new mall, by the way, we already own the land for the mall, already owned. And we don't have to worry about getting a new piece of land.
That's helpful color. Great quarter guys. Thanks. I appreciate it.
Our next
question comes from the line of Joe Greff with JPMorgan.
Hey, guys. Good afternoon. I have a couple of Singapore questions put a little bit differently. Rob, you mentioned Singapore rolling chip, it's still a concentrated area. Is it getting less concentrated by looking at either geographic sources or number of players?
And the big volume increase relative to what we're expecting on the rolling chip, is that more players or is that more wagering per player? Then I have a couple of follow ups on math and credit.
It remains unchanged. It's again, you're down in a different part of the world. We're very dependent on Mainland Chinese, Indonesians and Malaysians as well as PRs from Singapore. But I would say that it's a very concentrated market. And unfortunately, I don't see that growing as quickly on the spread of customers.
We want to see it grow. That's our intent. That's our design of our program. But frankly, I don't see a whole lot of change quarter to quarter to tell you otherwise. I do see it changing on the premium mass segment.
I think we're seeing significant movement. I think our team there is starting to unearth some opportunities outside of we want to move to a more tourist based segment in the mass premium mass. And again, I think that's where I think there's real growth potential to add more customers, add more desirable mix of people.
Okay. That partially answered my second question on Singapore. Looking at the slide As
you know, Joe, probably redundant here is that, that segment from my perspective, that's where the real because of the margins and all that, the opportunities there are much more material to us than the rolling segment.
Did you guys see a tangible benefit in the Q4 from some of the new hires that are trying to target that higher frequency premium mass gamer?
I wouldn't say we saw a tangible benefit. I think we're starting to see it in the Q1. I think we'll see it progressively throughout this year. Frankly, we're doing 2 things. We're revisiting our database and the premium mass, but also opening offices and I think you'll see that progressively in 2013.
I do think there's real opportunity to grow this segment materially as we get into 'thirteen and into 'fourteen. I think this is a very good move for us. It's very fortunate we're doing this. I think that's where our big upside in the short term is.
Got it. In the slide deck on your website, you have the slide regarding Singapore credit collections. One thing there maybe you could help answer is the aging of those credit collections. Are you seeing improvements there, I. E, are you seeing the older credit outstanding start to come down?
Or is it the relatively newer issued credit that's in that collections number more recently?
It's a mixed bag. I mean, I don't think it's I wouldn't characterize it either way. There are some easing issues in Singapore because we found that market like Las Vegas is that customers will go somewhere else if they want to wait longer to pay. So, it's a longer cycle we ever anticipated. On the other hand, we collected $377,000,000 in the 4th quarter, which is up significantly in the previous two quarters.
I feel our balance is pretty good right now with our receivable mix versus our we've taken the balance against in terms of what has been a long year for us, let's be honest, our reserves have grown significantly, but now we're at a point where we feel much more comfortable. I wouldn't characterize, I'd be clear with this Singapore is the most challenging credit market from a perspective of A, highly concentrated, B, very little legal help in the region to collect and C, there is no junket buffer. So, as I said in the past, I remain optimistic, but cautious. It's a we are giving away a lot of credit to a smaller number of people and you don't have the legal remedies you have here in the U. S, it still remains a challenge.
I don't want to represent that it's easy, it's not. But we're seeing nice collections. We keep ramping them up. I think we're in a much more balanced place vis a vis collections and our what we've done in the last 12 months, I think, was the right approach. Yes.
The one thing
I'd add to that is, we've issued a big number in terms credit drop, almost $13,000,000,000 We've collected almost $12,000,000,000 of that. So when you think of it in terms of kind of size of issue, as we've talked about in the past, any collection issues we have are really specific to isolated accounts as opposed to systemic problems across the portfolio. And our receivable balance now, if you back out the open programs, it's about almost 30% of the reserve is almost about 30% of the receivable balance. I think we're in pretty good shape as we talked about before that number will continue to grow a little bit, but we're getting up there where it will get to that 35% or so, which we think will be about a stabilized reserve percentage in relation to receivable balance.
Would you say on average, it's that you're seeing collections on average shorter to collect? And are you seeing the average aging come down as well? Or is it has it been pretty consistent?
No, I think the collections have been very consistent. I think the issue with regard to the aging is just those kind of those isolated accounts that are problems, those obviously age out until we get collections on that. But the vast majority of it is pretty consistent from a collection standpoint. And if you look out kind of going back over the last, I don't call it 8 to 10 quarters, when you get out about 6 months and you look back in terms of collections, we collect about 95% to 97% of the amounts that are outstanding. So it's those things that are in essence problems that end up aging longer.
But I don't think it's really the bulk of the accounts, the bulk of the accounts are collected within in essence that first 6 months. The majority of them even shorter than that. But after 6 months, we're about in 95% to 97% collected.
Okay, great.
And then switching over to Macau, this will be my final question. You referenced in the Q4 at the Venetian Macau, there was some renovation disruption from the work that you're doing at Paisa Club. Do you think you're able to kind of capture that business at your other properties? Or were you able to are you able to quantify the net impact there? In fact, what may have been even a stronger quarter in Macau absent those 29 fewer active rolling tables?
I think it's hard to quantify, Joe. The one nice thing though now, I haven't been there this month, the one nice thing about it is that you can now access across that bridge right into Four Seasons, right in SCC. So, I think you have a lot more access. So, people are comfortable with Venetian, they couldn't find that place to play. I think we have a hard time quantifying, but anytime you get to numbers we're doing, The Venetian is the it's the most potent product in Macao.
It's hitting on all cylinders, all gaming segments, lodging, retail. The scale and theme of the building just translates well in the market. And no matter where the Macau market goes, the Venetian will participate. So, I think it's by far the most important part of our portfolio right now. And I don't think that 29 tables had a major impact either way.
I do think the Venetian as it gets more tables in the floor and these numbers coming out of the mass and the VIP, I mean, the balance in the Venetian is staggering to me. It's just the most balanced product in Macao by far and our results speak to that.
Great. Thanks guys.
Our next question comes from the line of Steve Kent with Goldman Sachs. Hi, good afternoon. A couple of questions. First, Ken, should we no longer use Singapore this range of hold of 2.7 to 3, which is I think historically what we've been assuming because essentially over the past 11 periods, you've been all over that. And I think it's only 1 in 11 where you've come in there.
And I understand the issues, but should we just start to widen out the range? Is that how you're starting to think about the whole percentage in Singapore? Or will at some point start to narrow down? And then second question, dollars 24,000,000 property tax assessment. I'm sorry if I've missed that.
What is that for in Singapore? And then finally, expansion, in particular, the hotel stock, at some point, you've talked about trying to do something with that.
Let me talk to the normalization. I'm sure Rob will want to comment on that in the property tax and then I'll turn it over to Rob. But I think that 2.7% to 3% range is still an appropriate kind of range that for Singapore. And when we normalize, we use the midpoint of the range. With regards to the property tax, the issues that we got at basically at the very end of the year, we got an additional assessment from the government of about $24,000,000 At least a third of that pertains to 2011.
The balance pertains to 2012. We're still going through that to see what it pertains to. But certainly, the balance of the $13,000,000 that's specific to 2012 doesn't all belong in that 4th quarter. It would have to be spread basically ratably over the years. So obviously, it was impactful to our 4th quarter numbers and part of it, as I said before, doesn't even pertain to 2012.
Steve, it's Rob. On the range, I wouldn't change a thing. Since you opened the property, I don't know if you know this, but our life to date since the day we opened in 2010 is 2.7% and it will remain at 2.73% property. The only difference in Macao than Singapore is the volumes obviously in Macao are deeper. The player base is deeper.
But when it's all said and done, we're at 2.7% even after experiencing a horrific year this year on a few small customers who still the math is the math is the math. And in the end, those people who want some money will come back and lose it back. It isn't that complicated. I wouldn't change a thing. I would leave your range at 2.7% to 3% because you're in the range after all this after a lot of bad quarters.
So even though the quarter is what you're saying then and it's truly you're saying is that they all offset each other. So from the 2.18 to the 3.34, so 3.58, they all offset and you're saying when you add them all up, it's 2 it comes out right to 2.7 or so?
Yes, it's 2.7 and Macao is over 3. And frankly, it's going to be I'd say honestly, I think it's going to be bigger than I think Singapore is I mean, here is my bet. If you have a lot of Asian people betting a lot of money for a lot of time, you are going to do just fine. In Las Vegas, we are at the Venetian Palazzo, we have handled 1,000,000,000 of dollars. We're holding 27% lifetime here.
It's the greatest market in the world with the greatest gamers. I wouldn't worry one bit about it. The map will prove out just fine. 1 quarter, we're going to hold 4.5% on these quarters and be back up at 3%. It's just the business we're in.
All right.
I'll take the expansion question, Steve. It's Mike. This is Greg. Yes, we have we've been talking about Tower 3 putting a new VIP facility up there for some period of time. I was in Singapore just a few weeks ago and we're in the we did receive requests for information from the government, from certain government agencies about putting more details on the request, which we are now submitting.
But I don't expect you'll see something like that happen, because there is about a year construction period where it would happen. As far as additional rooms are concerned and additional buildings, we've had some conversations, but nothing is quite moving forward at this point. So in terms of projections and what have you, I would not feel comfortable that you would have projections of that for some period of time. And we'll give you updates as soon as we get them, but the construction periods would be really a year for the tower and probably considerably more than that for the room addition and the building addition.
Okay. Thank you.
Let me just add one other thing. We are investing significant capital in the building now, doing more facility work inside the casino, in the movie room and others, redoing it, expanding it, making it better. So there are capital investments going into the building, which will expand our capabilities when inside. So those are different than the room additions that we've been talking about.
We also we've also applied to the government to build another tower. The lots, the available lots that are unused at this time and they're right abutting our quota per share. And we're hoping to get approval to we don't know how long it will take to put in some more ballroom space, some more exhibition space and another 1400 to 1500 rooms because they're running at such high room occupancy. But we don't have any sign that it's imminent. We don't have any sign that it's far away.
But Singapore moves at its own pace and we'll just have to wait until they give us an okay.
Our next question comes from the line of Felicia Hendrix with Barclays.
Hi, good afternoon everybody. Switching gears back to Macau, your table efficiency improved nicely in the quarter. That's obviously been a goal of yours, so that's been great to see. Just wondering if you could discuss some things that you're doing to continue to drive table efficiency in the market. And if you could, perhaps Rob, this is a question for you.
Just discuss your plans to improvegrow your premium mass presence in the market?
Sure. Thanks for the compliment. We feel making progress. I think Ed and David have just done a terrific job and our goal over there is to make all our tables work harder. To your point, the only property we have that we feel very balanced with right now despite our great results is The Venetian.
I mean, the wind furs both on the premium mass and the junket are just terrific. And we feel that the balance is really right at The Venetian and that's why that property is just knocking the door down. But we have opportunities throughout the portfolio, both downtown and in the in Cotai to do a lot better in my opinion. I think if the segment we have 1500 tables with the additional 200 tables we were given by the government this week. And so our goal is to we're agnostic as far as what segment we're in.
The highest performing tables or segments get the tables. I think the growth is clear. Downtown, we think, although our 10th year of operation, the place has found a real audience, especially in terms of the food program that Jeff and his team has put together downtown. We're embracing the high frequent natured market like Guangdong. We think that we have we found a nice niche downtown in
the peninsula and we are
going to keep growing our business there. The focus there will be mass, premium mass for sure. We'll have some junket, but we're not going to compete with people downtown. We're going to focus on mass, premium mass. The plaza is the most I think of all of our opportunities that might be the greatest because clearly our junket performance is very strong.
What David has done there is exceptional from where it began 2 years ago, where it's at now. But what has happened is we're winning $19,000 a day on the mass side and of course, that's premium mass. So, if you multiply that times, let's say, 50 or 60 or 70 tables, there could be huge potential growth there and David and his team are looking at that today. And so we think there is big upside there to do better. Our slot win by the way was over $1,000 per unit per day at the Four Seasons.
To me, you have got to rethink the balance there. As good as the junkets are, we will look at that opportunity. And then of course SCC, we're starting to really hit it there, but I think as you as to our lowest performing in the portfolio in terms of the win per from a nonjunket, non rolling performance where our mass tables are the most sluggish in our group. With the new rooms opening, with the market booming, I think you'll see that improve dramatically. But like The Venetian, Sands SCC will remain more of a mixed product with lots of variety.
The big focus obviously is there is remain return on table and with so much exposure to the market, we can do better and we will do better. I think there is a clear indication that our room base, our retail base, our food offerings and the plethora of things we offer in all these properties puts us in a very unique position to do better. And that is our sole focus, Felicia, as far as Macau. We see terrific upside. We're privileged to be in the market with all that growth.
And frankly, we're not tied to any one segment. We're tied to making money and productivity. And one thing I will say is one market we're in that almost no one else is in and that's the mass mass. Our exposure to pure mass, not premium mass is incredibly important to us. So, when you look around and see the SEC or the Venetian, we can get those places to making 8,000, 9, 10000 a day on a pure mass play, it's going to be very, very important to our growth.
And people right now are all focused on premium mass. We're there, but we're really focusing as well on the mass mass. We have kind of a monopoly due to pricing and table count.
Great. That's really helpful. Thanks. Sheldon, you had a nice announcement recently, obviously, with the 200 incremental tables. Can you update us at all
on where you are
in the discussions with the government regarding, returning tables for the Parisian?
You want me to
Yes, I'll let Mike.
Yes. Hi, Felicia. I we're in constant conversation, Ed, Tracy and myself have just met with the government a couple of weeks ago when I was in Asia. I think that regarding Cotai and all of the new products that are coming on Cotai, you're not going to see any real conclusion on distribution of new tables there for a number of months since. I think the government has assured us as well as others that they're going to operate appropriately with these hotels and that's where and casinos, which you're going to see developed.
But there's no firm commitment yet as to who is going to get what. But we've been told I assume the others have been told the same thing that in their own time, they will make up their mind and treat everybody adequately. That's how we're going today as we get to financing on-site 3. We're in the ground now and we're going forward with the project on the anticipation that all will be well, but it will be some period of time before you see an absolute commitment for us as well as others, I believe.
I think the government is we trust the government. They're going to treat everybody fairly. They have a there's been more publicity about our competitors buying their land. They make a big deal about it when they close the land. But we've owned the land since 2,007.
We've owned Lot 3 since 2,007. And so however they treat everybody else, they're going to treat us. We're confident in that. And just like the 200 tables was allocated to us 7 years ago, because we couldn't get the financing without the assurance of tables and they kept their commitment. We're very happy over that.
And I'm sure that we'll be treated the same, but sort of like in a different category because everybody was talking about getting the land and what they're going to build. We already own the land. So we've been assured by the government we're going to be treated like everybody else. And they seem to be giving they said they're going to give preference to those companies that build more non gaming. And of course, that's our specialty.
We developed them a little.
Okay, great. And then just my final question, Rob, back to Singapore. You definitely talked about mass win per day and how you're pleased with the level you have in the quarter. But I'm also assuming that you'd love to grow that. So how should we think about the kind of optimal levels there or your goals rather?
Yes, Asar, our goal, if you recall, a year ago was we were trending, we're at 4%, 6% a quarter. Our goal is at 5% and it all came apart. So, our goal is to get back to keep growing again. I can't define where we want to get to, because I don't know how high up really is. I have a belief that we have been given an opportunity to go after the tourist based market and not be dependent on the local market.
And I think there's a lot of people in Jakarta and KL and obviously in the region in general that are premium mass customers. I don't know how high which we think about that. I just think we do a lot better than 4.4 a day. I am pleased we got back to that. But I think the team over there, we have hired some very good people and we're putting a management and sales team in place.
I feel there's a lot of potential to grow that segment. I don't want to define is it 4, 8 a day, 5 a day, I don't know. I just believe we're going to get more out of that region we have in the past and more of that segment and that's a 65%, 70% margin segment. So, to drive marine based sands to a higher level, that's going to be the most important indicator, most important metric is that wind per unit per day, non rolling table, slot EPG.
Okay. Thanks a lot, guys.
Our next question comes from the line of Robin Farley with UBS.
Great, thanks. Two questions. One is, with this tremendous growth you have in Asia, I wonder if you have any thoughts about some of your U. S. Assets maybe being kind of non core and just your thoughts on that topic?
There is nothing new that anybody doesn't know about as far as the U. S. Assets are concerned. We just continue to operate them and maximize them as best as we can.
I think that a lot of people are talking about possibility of different emerging markets coming out. We are of the opinion that a lot of the U. S. Markets have been oversaturated or about to be oversaturated. And we keep our eye open, but we don't want to get it.
We don't want to compete with the job that Caesars is doing on the riverbed market and the small casino market out there. We know that we're the experts in integrated results. And I think anybody we approach, the various governments understand that and what it can do for them and their tourism efforts. But there's no reason to we don't want to liquidate. We don't want to sell any of our assets because we don't want to sell the keys to the kingdom.
Our basic differentiation beside the integrated resort model of a multidiscipline resort offering is how do we fill the hotel rooms we dig is because of the MICE crack, the meetings, incentives, conventions and exhibitions. That is very critical to us. So we sell off any one
of our
properties. Somebody is going to learn how to make the key to our kingdom. We don't want that to happen.
Okay. And I wonder I know you made a reference to Japan in your opening comments, but I wonder if you could give us a little bit more color on how active are the conversations you're having in Japan and that kind of thing?
We have people there on a constant basis. And we're constantly talking to the powers that be and to be. But as you can see, the Japanese just reelected another. They went to the opposite party and from the one that was governing. And they in the past have been favorably inclined to doing IRs with consumers.
There's absolutely no reason why Japan should welcome IRs with open arms. They want more tourism. And there's a great, great fantastic location there if we could get it. And I think if they got serious, very serious about it, which they may be now because there is an interparty, about 125 members interparty commission that's been put together to on a non partisan basis to study the issue of IRRs. So we're just going to have to wait.
The Asia is going to move as fast as we can here in Las Vegas. But we're on it. If there's anybody that's on it and anybody that's doing it and that's keeping their finger in the pulse, it's us. We know how good with Singapore, we know how good one of these locations could be.
Okay. Great. Thank you.
You're welcome.
Our next question comes from the line of Harry Curtis with Nomura.
Hi. Good afternoon, guys. Several quick follow-up questions. First on the Parisian, there's not a lot of clarity, it sounds like yet on the table on tables. But when you open in late 2015, would there be any restrictions restricting you from installing slots or ETGs?
Not at this point, Harry. The restrictions are tables, not on slots or ETGs.
Okay. And what has been your experience in Macau just over the past 6 months on customer reception to ETGs? Harry, it's Rob. It's been terrific and it keeps getting better. We're really pleased with the ETG market there.
And I think the team keeps growing the balance. And to Mike's reference point, you are not as restricted as a live table games, but the Asian market is very receptive. You look at our numbers in Singapore, they're unbelievable and they're getting better by the day in Macau. So, I think there's no reason to think that market doesn't continue to boom. We're very bullish in ETGs.
And then just last question on Parisian. Can you give us a sense of what you would expect to spend yourself for the Parisian in 2013, 2014 and 2015?
The total project cost, Harry, we're estimating at somewhere around 2,600,000,000 dollars all in. It could range up a little bit, but that number has actually been approved by our Board as for the capital cost building. That's including what we put in before. In terms of the investment as to how the cash will go out, probably we'll be using about $700,000,000 of property of SCL cash and the rest will be financed.
Hello? Hello? Yes, we can hear you.
Okay. And Ken can speak a word about that to you.
Yes. So to answer your question with regard, 2013 is going to be probably just over about $400,000,000 2014 is going to probably be around $1,000,000,000 maybe a little bit more. The answer is,
I think, Harry was referring to our equity portion.
Exactly, the cash outlay. Oh, I see. Well, then as Mike talked about, it's going to be around $600,000,000 to $700,000,000 and it should go up.
You've just cut out.
Yes, dollars 600,000,000 to $700,000,000 and then that for the most part will go out ratably, a little bit more upfront in 2013 and then the balance kind of spread over 'fourteen and with a little bit in 'fifteen.
Okay. And then the last question that I had is really a housekeeping item. Going back to Singapore, you made a that you feel like your reserves there are essentially where you think that they're appropriate. Do you think that at this point or from this point on that your actual dollar outlay for your reserve can actually decline?
As I mentioned before, we're still building up on a percentage basis. We're kind of about 29%. We are going to get about 35% or so in terms of the receivable balance. And so, yes, I do think over time, it could come down
a little bit, but we're still going
to be spending a fair amount each quarter, maybe a little bit less than what we've done in 2012, but it still be fairly close to that. Because if you think about it, we're still issuing a tremendous amount of credit on an annual basis and we want to make sure that we're appropriately reserved. So we'll be booking reserves consistent with the amount of credit that we're issuing. So it comes down, it will be incrementally down, but it should be just marginally lower, if not the same.
That's very helpful.
And it does it for me. Thank you.
Our next question comes from the line of Cameron McKnight with Wells Fargo.
Hi, thanks very much. Good afternoon. Hi, Cameron. So a question for Rob or perhaps Sheldon, as we think about and one thing that seems to become clearer is that more and more of these developments on Cotai are going to be much more heavily branded and much more heavily themed. The feedback we've had on the Parisian and Eiffel Tower theme has been very strong.
What's your sense when you talk to customers about how that brand and theme will resonate as the property opens?
Well, we can only point to The Venetian and its property theme has been very well received. And the Chinese people are curious, interested in foreign locations and the appearance of it. And I think that the uniqueness of having an architectural icon like the as the Eiffel Tower, I think it's going to be very well received. People speak very optimistically about the fact that the Chinese people will like it. They'll flop to it.
We it was challenged me to get a walkway or elevator. It's getting it over to the where the restaurant is at the base of the about a third of the way up the tower. We're trying to be as authentic as we can. We learned from building the Venetian here that what brings the feeling of being in the thematic location is the construction and the development of the landmarks and the icons. And certainly, the Eiffel Tower is the most iconic structure in the world and we're going to do a good job on that.
I think they're going to come there. We listen, it's going to be gangbusters. It will be tremendous.
I think to Sheldon's point, you look at the scale and the theming of The Venetian, the only place might make more sense and the only place they want to visit more perhaps than Venice is Paris. And I think our research indicates that the Chinese folks want to get to Paris like just like my wife wants to get to Paris. And I think you're going to find it I think it's a great theme, a great concept. And if you look at The Venetian's performance, it's so nimble and it works on all cylinders, because it's not just theme, it's got scale, it's got the food product, it works on all different levels lodging, retail. I think what's been designed to the Parisian honestly is as good as the Venetian maybe better, pretty extraordinary product.
We have total confidence our customer feedback on the Parisian team is exceptionally strong and positive. And to your point, I think it's a lot like Vegas was in the 1990s when we built the Venetian here. There's a desire to see a themed property, a themed experience that speaks very, very well to the mass market as well as the high end.
1 of the one of our designersarchitects is a pretty he's a very well known designerarchitect in Paris And he was brought into one of our consultants and we're using him to get some authenticity for the entire property. It's going to look very authentic. And I think the Chinese people, the Asians are going to be very excited about it.
Great. Thanks. And a lot of that dovetails with what we've heard on the ground. I'm just moving on, Rob, a question that relates to your earlier comments on the mass mass business. I mean one thing that surprised us was the strength in slot and hotel revenues in Macau in the quarter.
How should we think about growth in those two segments going forward?
I don't know how you think about it, but I'm wildly bullish. I think that Macau is in its infancy. What Sheldon did in the Cotai Peninsula enabled the mass. If you think about it, if it hadn't been the Cotai development, you would have been stuck as being landlocked on the fence. So I think we've done this open up the floodgates to build these magnificent multi 1,000 room hotels that enable the customers to have a place to sleep, a place to gamble and we're just lucky enough to have, yes, we're premium mass segment, yes, we're junket segment, but we're kind of in a really weird place because of pure mass.
And to your point, having just come back from there, when you look at the pure mass, non premium mass, it is just extraordinary how much they're gambling and how much they're sleeping there, eating, it's a whole experience. I think it's I'm strictly bullish on Macao and the mass business, not just the premium mass. Great.
Thanks very much, guys. Ladies and gentlemen, we have reached the allotted time for questions. I'll now hand the call back over to management for closing remarks.
Thank you very much everybody for joining the call. As we close the call, it was a wonderful year for Las Vegas Sands Corporation. I think everybody realizes that. I think this is a year where we opened close to 6,000 hotel rooms in Macau, 2 additional casinos, a variety of food and beverage restaurants, expanded our capital investments, rehabilitate our Venetian Hotel in Las Vegas, moved our Bethlehem numbers up to be the most successful property in Pennsylvania. I think the management team and the company's employees have done a marvelous job.
I hope all of you recognize the work that they have done to get to these kinds of results. So thank you very much.
Ladies and gentlemen, this concludes today's conference call. We thank you for your participation. You may all disconnect.