My name is Katrina, and I will be your conference operator today. At this time, I would like to welcome everyone to the Las Vegas Sands First Quarter 2021 Earnings Conference Call. All lines have been placed on mute to prevent any background noise. I will now turn the call over to Mr. Daniel Briggs.
Thank you, Katrina. Joining me on the call today are Rob Goldstein, our Chairman and Chief Executive Officer and Patrick Dumont, our President and Chief Operating Officer. Also joining us on the call are Doctor. Wilfred Wong, President of Sinch China and Brandt Cheung, Chief Operating Officer of Sands China. Before I turn the call over to Rob, please let me remind you that today's conference call will contain forward looking statements that we are to the Safe Harbor provision of federal securities laws.
The company's actual results could differ materially from the anticipated results in those forward looking statements. In addition, we may discuss non GAAP measures. A definition and a reconciliation of each of these measures to the most comparable GAAP financial measures is included in the press release. Please note that we have posted supplementary earnings slides on our Investor Relations website. We will refer to those slides during the Q and A portion of the call.
Finally, for those who would like to participate in Q and A session, we ask that you please expect our request to limit yourself
to 1 question and one follow-up question, so
we might allow everyone with interest the opportunity to participate. Please note that this presentation is being recorded. With that,
let me please turn the call over to Rob. Thanks, Dan, and good afternoon and a very early good morning to our colleagues in Asia. Some brief comments, then we'll write the Q and A. Our results reflect the pandemic's impact. We did generate $241,000,000 of EBITDA for the quarter and we continue to have a strong belief in the Macao to the recovery because the March numbers were very different from those in January February and the recent visitation numbers and revenue numbers for April reflect continued acceleration.
Obviously, we cannot define the timing of the full recovery, but it's underway and we believe we'll continue in 2021. At this time, Singapore is in the $500,000,000 to to $1,000,000 range annual EBITDA. There is no visibility as to an air traffic return to Singapore. And Unlike Macao, it's more difficult to project additional or incremental EBITDA from MBS until resumption of to the material air travel. Our investments in Macao continue to take shape as the market recovers 4 seasons in London, will present, I think, large growth opportunities for us.
We continue to have the largest footprint in this incredible market of Macau. And China continues to demonstrate economic resilience, the spending Macau is very strong to the mass level from both the gaming and the retail perspective. You referenced that on Page 29, 30, you've asked from a retail perspective. There's some pleasant surprises there. Okay.
Again, we have no reservations, but our ability to perform to pre pandemic levels once visitation returns. Our company Today is sort of dividing the 3 different areas, the Asia portfolio in Macao and Singapore, and while we believe Macao will accelerate this year and lead the recovery, Singapore will follow-up on resumption of air travel and participate in the recovery as well, and we anticipate a return to a $5,000,000,000 plus EBITDA from Asia in the future. Our sale of Las Vegas assets enable us to have huge optionality to explore large sale land based destination resorts in both United States and Asia. And finally, we have an eager to have a material digital presence for future. We are exploring multiple opportunities at the present time.
This is obviously the departure of my historical approach, and we'll update you at the appropriate time. So let's go to Q and A and our first call, please.
First question, we have Carlo Santarelli from Deutsche Bank. Your line is open.
Hey, guys. Thanks for taking my question. Rob, appreciate there's probably some sensitivity around it. But In your prepared remarks, obviously, you talked about some of the Asia opportunities. And clearly, upon the completion of the Las Vegas sale, which obviously It came at a very nice multiple for you guys and
I'm sure you'll have a
very nice proceeds coming out of it. How do you think about the use of those proceeds in light of some of the You're obviously kind of eyeing in Asia relative to obviously the return of a dividend, Potential for buybacks longer term, potentially owning more to fill in China, all of the above. How do you kind of prioritize that pecking order and acknowledging you to do several of those things kind of with the balance sheet
and the
position that it's in.
Sure. We look at obviously, greatest opportunity for return. I think we Continually, there'll be something happening in Macao at some point in the future, which will enable us to reinvest in Macao on a non gaming basis. We're hopeful that will happen sooner later. You know that our project in Singapore, our Phase 2 project is we're still continuing to work through those issues there.
We continue to look at other Asian opportunities, large scale Asian opportunities. And then of course, we think in the U. S. There may be some opportunities for us here. And lastly, digital, I think we looked at everything individually and look at the returns and but our priorities remain getting back on our feet in Asia and back to a to 5 plus 1,000,000,000 EBITDA and maintain that's the backbone of our company.
That's where we'll start first. If something opportunistically opens up in the U. S, obviously with the bet, There's something that opens up digitally. We're deep into a digital deep dive to figure out how to deploy capital intelligently to get a return. And I think there'll be some Nice opportunity to the future there.
As far as the dividend, I'd like Patrick to address that issue, the return of dividend. Patrick?
Sure. Thanks, Rob. So I think, as Rob mentioned, we look very cautiously at the way we deploy capital and we're very patient and we look for the way to maximize our returns shareholders. And so when we look at the dividend, it really was and hopefully will be in the future, really the cornerstone, and you've heard me say that before, of a return of capital And I think where we are today is that we're going to look for operations to return to a baseline level and get a sense of where those operations are trending and then make an assessment with the Board and with management looking at our long term potential to where the dividend should be given our ability to reinvest and allocate capital to other projects that are higher growth. And so I think it's pretty consistent what you've heard us say before on calls and nothing's changed from that perspective.
Great, guys. Thank you. Thank you, Patrick, for that. And then if I could, Whoever kind of wants to take this, it's more of an opinion question than anything else. But obviously, there is some consternation in the investment community around to the status of VIP in Macau and the direction of VIP going forward in Macau and whether or not there's a perception that, that will have a positive or negative impact on the premium mass segment.
One could obviously make the case that VIP customers who are having a harder time accessing capital who do like
to jump, obviously, move into
the mass segment or premium mass segment, which wouldn't be the worst thing to happen or the fact that maybe some That's still overplayed from VIP. VIP is softer, doesn't show up in NASS. Rob, maybe what's kind of your view and view from your folks in Macau on how that how they would expect that going out.
I have a very strong view, but since I woke up, Grant, at 4:30 in the morning, I want Grant to take that call. Grant, Are you there?
Yes. Thanks, Rob. Yes, we're here. Yes.
Yes. Sure.
On the question of VIP and premium mass, I think you've clearly Seeing the segments have diverged in terms of the recovery. Clearly, premium mass is has made a very significant recovery and already approaching 50% of pre to the pandemic levels. VIP on the other hand is still struggling at around 20% or sub 20%. So The segments are actually following very different trajectories and we would expect that to continue And of course, your question about whether there's Stovo, whether there's migration, I don't think those dynamics have really changed Since a few years ago, there is a structural change over time Where more of the customers and more of the new customers are dealing directly with the casino operator's to the program and of course the great assets on the integrated resort that all of the operators, including us with Buildup, have attracted more and more of these consumers to the premium mass program, and we expect that to continue over time As these non gaming lifestyle assets and products continue to attract people to play in our programs.
Great. Thanks everybody. I appreciate it. Sure, Karl. Thank you.
Next question,
We have Joe Greff from JPMorgan. Your line is open.
Hey, everybody. When you look at your advanced bookings for the Golden Week holiday in Macau, Do these bookings suggest or imply a further acceleration in visitation or mix quality might be tough on sort of spend or GGR level relative to April March and anything underlying that suggests that maybe people are anticipating any where Macau patrons are anticipating any further incremental easing of travel restrictions.
John, I don't want to share with you our bookings for Golden Week. I think the best reflection of it right now is the acceleration of people. I think across the board, Both visitation revenue is growing and we remain convinced Macao is in a recovery mode already. I think the term came in March, very encouraging. I think it's full of trust to try and call the shots, so to speak, as when this thing grows.
I would think it might be And then to find it, but I think instead of slow process of gradual growth and I think the market is disappointed the way we put inflection point It's just like Golden Week tops the numbers to a materially different level. I think we're seeing a gradual growth. The easing restrictions obviously is a government decision. People are getting there as evidenced by the numbers coming out of the table and revenues. And I think we believe that this will just continue to accelerate With the only caveat being hopefully you don't see return to any cases of virus.
Wilfred, Grant, any thoughts on that?
Yeah. I think what Rob said is absolutely right. The time really started in March. In March, we started to experience to a pretty meaningful rebound in visitations versus January February. And as you've seen from the figures post pandemic highs in the middle of April.
So the acceleration is seen across very encouragingly across all the different segments whether they're talking about premium mass, mass, but the encouraging thing is that since March, we've really seen an acceleration in the base mass As well as the leisure FIT guests at the hotel, of course, retail, especially at the high end consumption activity in March and bookings for Q2 look encouraging for the mice as well, which is a surprise. But I think what you can see is a broad based recovery in the different segments since early March.
I don't think we're going to get very emotional if there's not as big a number that comes out in May, rolling it. I think it's more it's a Slow but steady growth upward. Here in Las Vegas, it looks like the weekend was pre pandemic levels. It's amazingly busy here and demand is back. I think the capital will follow soon.
Las Vegas is still waiting for the return of the The group business, that's inevitable. I think U. S. Is obviously a different place than Asia. But I think China and Macao are just going to Continue to move forward accelerate.
I think we'll see a slow gradual return in the second half year to be very positive for everybody over there.
Great. And then my follow-up question is maybe for all of you, those on Las Vegas and those on the ground early in the morning in Macau. And I just wanted to ask a question about a topic you guys love to answer, sort of Your thoughts on the timing or process for the concession renewal. And I think I'm going to ask it in a way that's answerable. If the government was thinking of renewing or extending 12 months in front of that extension, Right.
And we're knocking on that. And even if that was an extension for relatively short periods, would they have discussions for that with you by now and maybe I'll have a I'll let you sort of open endedly answer that
Yes, John, I don't think we want to speculate because we don't know we're not very good government, we don't know what the thinking. But as we said, Ad nauseam in the past, we remain strong believers in our position there. You know the story of LVS and what we've done in Cotai and The $15,000,000,000 investment and the non GAAP assets we've built, we just aren't that concerned about when the government tells us, they tell us, but we don't have insight And we have any idea when they will do that, but we feel renewals will happen. We feel very confident of our position. And other than that, I don't have any other insight.
Wilfred, maybe you want to add to that? Is that fair to say?
Yes. All the 6 concessionaires waiting eagerly for the government to make announcements as we draw closer to the expiration to the concession. But as ever, we stand ready to cooperate with the government once they announce the to the timeline and what we intend to do over the next 12, 18 months.
Thank you, guys.
Sure, Jim. Thank you.
Next question, we have Steve Thompson from Goldman back. Your line is open.
Hey, good afternoon. Thanks for taking the question.
Hi, Steve.
As a follow-up, I think to Carlo's question on the proceeds from Las Vegas, I guess where would raising your ownership of Sands China Factor into that list and can you just remind us what the process or limitations might be if you did want to go down that path?
Sure. Pat, do you want to go ahead?
Yes, sure. How are you, Steven? So I think from our standpoint, we feel very strongly about the long term future and success of Macau as the world's leading leisure to the Investor Relations. And as Rob has said before and as you heard on these calls, we're very interested in investing more there in non gaming. We feel very strongly in the future in Macau.
So definitely something that we think about and consider over time. I think where we are now is we don't have the proceeds yet. We're looking at all the options and we're going to consider everything. We're going to be very focused on returns. And so I think we're looking at new developments.
We're looking at how to increase And develop more in the markets that we're in. And I think that will be something that we think of. And I think really for us, there's a lot of opportunity in front of the company and we're being patient. We're looking at it all and to look through the lens of maximizing returns. So it's not something that I'm going to say we're going to do now, but it's something that is in the things that we consider as we look across the way we might
And so just to clarify, is there a maximum ownership percentage that you can go up to for Sands China?
So I think technically, they want to have 25% of the float outstanding for the exchange, but there are exceptions.
Got it.
Grant, I want to make sure it makes sense. I just want to ask Grant, I want to make sure I didn't miss anything there.
That's helpful. And then as we think about the model going forward, I realize that you broke out the Las Vegas assets within the EBITDA count. But is there any impact that we should be thinking about and this is more of a modeling question, but as we think about corporate expenses Going forward, is basically what you reported this quarter kind of the right run rate to think about? Or is there other things that might be in there?
No, I think what you should see over time is that corporate expenses should adjust post sale. But I think in the long run, We will continue to have a corporate office that manages the activities of the enterprise as a whole. So there's nothing in there that's noise right now, but you should expect to see some changes going forward after the completion of the sale.
Makes sense. Thanks so much. I'll jump back in the queue.
Thanks, Stephen. Thanks, Stephen. Appreciate it.
Next question, we have Thomas Allen from Morgan Stanley. Your line is open.
Hey. So just on Marina Bay Sands, the performance of the property improved quarter over quarter. Obviously, they're not getting any more Chinese visitors there. So can you just talk about some of the drivers of that?
Yes. Surprisingly, slot business business is an exception. The biggest drivers of slot performance has been I mean, last year, not yet against pre pandemic levels in slot floor. And I think that reflects the couple level to the table. It's more difficult in the table side to do that.
There's more spacing on the table side, it's basically difficult. But as you referenced, not having that Foreign participation is very hurtful because Singapore traditionally the residents there and the visitors and the current residents all It was a strong spot market before we got there. It just has gotten better over the years with our ability to provide good quality product. But that's the driver, no question about it. But without that foreign limitation, it's hard to grow the premium mass in the high end to the business.
So we can do a struggle and I think we'll stay in this range until things improve. And unlike the Miqiao White team, we're going to see a move this summer and fall. I don't think you can see that any reason to believe that happens in SABOR. The neighboring countries are still struggling with the vaccinations, be it Malaysia, Indonesia or Japan, there's no real evidence that this is going to change in the short term. But it's a slot business over there that's been really exceptionally strong.
The other thing to note, and this is Patrick, is just keep in mind that while the pandemic related restrictions have eased the actual activity levels of the people in Singapore has gotten more back over time across the quarter. Right. So as people get vaccinated, as public health initiatives bear fruit, people who are in Singapore are more out and about. And so we've benefited from some of that as well. So it's not as if there's a change to Rob's point before, it's not as if there's a change in visitation, But there has been a change in activity in Singapore as things return more to normal there.
Makes total sense. And then just as my follow-up, it seems like you're getting more and more serious about your digital strategy. Can you just elaborate a little bit more of that?
I really can't because we're not there yet, Thomas. We have we're like the new guys have locked, but I think the game is just beginning and we're looking at from many, many aspects. We've spent a lot of man hours, a lot of people looking at the opportunities. We have a big appetite. But as you know, that market is still developing.
I think we're looking not just in the sports or in the fall of digital financing and very, very complementary to our land business. But We're just not ready yet to disclose more of the evidence. So not much color there, but I think you'll be hearing from us this year and next year about Thank you. Perfect. Thank you.
Thanks, Thomas.
Next question, we have Shaun Kelley of Bank of America. Your line is open.
Hi, good afternoon, everyone. I just wanted to go back to the kind of question around some of the to possible reinvestment back in Asia as you've got so much cash or liquidity available on the balance sheet and obviously heading into the concession process. So my specific question was that there was some press recently about to possible investment in the broader Greater Bay Area being a potential criteria or potential result of the concession process. And I would just kind You peaked my thinking around, would that be something that LVS would consider potentially investing in non gaming, let's call In the broader region, but outside of Macau directly, is that something you how would you react to that?
Positively. Again, we're staunch believers in the rebound of Macao. It's coming back and to the people who somehow don't believe it, that's Yes, we'll have to wait and see, but it's going to come back in a strong way. We'll be the leading player in that space. London and ForeSeeings investments are going to be, I think, very well received.
If the government wants us to invest in the region, we'll do it. We have capital, we have appetite and we remain committed to Macao in a big way. We believe it's And despite all the distractions and all the pandemic, all the issues, Macao still remains from a land based perspective, the most to the opportunistic and advantageous market in the world. And we plan to be there for a long time and invest more capital. And Again, the government's directions will be paramount to our thinking.
Great. And just maybe as a quick follow-up, to potential reopening of Hong Kong. Just kind of curious on the latest there. I think the case counts have been, I think, very low And there is some positive news there, but I think the vaccination rate is also very low. So just curious on color from that Part of the market and that is a possible avenue for reopening some of the travel in the region.
Sure. Wilbur, if you can grab that since you guys are right there or right in the middle of it?
Yes. I think it is gratifying to note that the cases Every day has dropped to single digit. And I think yesterday, there was no home case in Hong Kong. The both governments of Hong Kong and Macau have announced that if there is A continuing period of 14 days of 0 cases, they would open or consider opening the border between Hong Kong and Macau. And I think the Hong Kong government is working very hard to achieve that.
And hopefully, that if that happens, They're going to help our business
a lot.
Thank you very much.
Thanks, John.
Next question, we have Travin from Macquarie. Your line is open.
Hi, good afternoon. Thanks for taking my question. I know it's early on the Londoner opening of Phase 1 here, but just wanted to ask about the makeup of the or how you guys are running that right now between Londoner and Venetian. Is there Major difference in terms of the customers that are visiting 1 versus the other from a base or premium standpoint? And are you deciding to comp certain players Into one versus the other, just trying to get some additional color in terms of how that's running since it just reopened.
Thanks.
Mr. Chen?
Yes. Yes. On the subject of London, well, I think if you take a step back, we opened our first to the new product in the 4 Seasons of Grand Suites last year and that has progressed exceptionally well in terms of customer feedback. And so clearly, that is more targeted at the premium mass and the long stay Our leisure, family guests. And then when we got to early part of 2021, As you referenced, we opened the 1st phase of Londoner.
That's really the main Londoner Hotel and the north side of the building with the Crystal Palace Atrium and some of the signature food and beverage outlets and some of the attractions that we've opened up so far. And I think it's important to remember that A large part of the building, namely on the south side, the Sheraton side, is still under heavy construction, actually both on the interior as well as the exterior facade because we have been bringing forward the construction works on that side of the building to take advantage of the low levels of traffic. So in terms of your question about segmentation, It really follows the trajectory of the initial recovery that we see in Macau right now. Therefore, not very much in terms of base mass traffic, and that's both because of the demand side, but also the fact that The south side of the building is undergoing large scale construction and is really focused more on the premium mass in the various hotels that we have in the London and Macau. But clearly, there's a lot more to come in the remainder of the year into early part of next year in terms of the products that are coming online.
We've got a second Allsuite Hotel London Accord opening up later on in the year. The Sheraton side, we're going to have the 2nd Wow! Space Atrium Shakespace hall coming online imminently in the Q2. Obviously, we still have the London Arena and another, call it 6, 7, 8 food and beverage outlets together with the themed attractions in the property as well as the retheming of the to retail shops. So hopefully that gives you a sense of where we are today.
Okay. Yes, that's great. And then separately, just regarding your retail mall business in Asia, which is on Slide 29, you've outlined that rental concessions Have come down sequentially, which should be a positive just in terms of the health of your tenants. Is there anything that's going to change dramatically going forward just in terms of to the turnover versus base component of the makeup of this business or when visitation kind of gets back to more normalized levels, Do you still expect for the profits of the retail mall portfolio to kind of mirror what you saw pre pandemic? Thank you.
That's absolutely expected to be very much like the pre pandemic levels. I mean, what you're seeing now is similar to the U. S. Outside spending by affluent people Driving these crazy good numbers out of luxury of 4 CDs and other, but I think we expect a full recovery. We have no concerns or trepidation that As visitation Macau returns and to Singapore, our malls are going back to pre pandemic levels and perhaps even beyond that.
I don't think we have any concerns that you've seen the correction on the rent recessions, you've seen it go in the right direction. But We're very pleased with the caveat that we want to see a return to mass traffic as well as really affluent people driving these large performances. But yes, we expect it to look a lot like pre pandemic levels hopefully as the year continues. In Macau, Singapore, a little more difficult to go again. And so the resumption of air traffic and foreign travel, I think Singapore is going to lag their pre pandemic levels.
And Again, we feel much more aggressive in the return of Macau than we do at Singapore at this time, because we don't see the Vaccination is kicking as large in the region, northeast air traffic, any visibility into the zumps of air traffic. So It's hard to see Singapore getting back to pre pandemic level this year.
Thanks, Rob.
Sure.
Next question, we have Robin Farley from UBS. Your line is open.
Hi. Thanks. A lot of my questions have been asked already, but I'm curious on the online strategy. It sounds like it's going to be a little while from your comment earlier before there would be some Announcement about LVS involvement. Is it fair to say given that there's so much activity around getting market share when new markets open that if you're kind of maybe coming to the online markets a little bit later than others that Maybe your strategy would be kind of M and A focused rather than kind of building from scratch your presence in those markets?
Robin, it's fine as we can go either direction. We can build it on an idea. We can build it organically. But at this point, again, I don't think we're late at all. I think the challenging businesses, despite the valuations, they're still challenging businesses and It's early innings, maybe it's actually national anthem time in terms of some of these businesses.
I mean, online U. S. Is still very not an online gaming, which has been a positive, most positive Still in a few states, and I think the sports betting remains a conundrum to some extent to what's really happening there. So and there's also a lot of room outside the U. S.
Europe and there's North America, there's all kinds of opportunities. So I don't think if you got one, we'll come back to you. But we're trying to again assess to How to be smart and targeted, not just obviously with the kind of balance that we have, the optionality is endless and we will be careful and do it the right way. We have the finest land based business, so we want to get that back and healthy. But we'll come back to the right time and the right strategy and right I wouldn't want to obligate ourselves and say it's going to be organic towards M and A, but we'll get there.
I promise you that. We have A pretty gracious appetite to be in that world. And it may be different than you think it's going to be, but we'll let you know we're ready to talk about it.
Okay. All right. Great. Thank you.
Sure.
Next question, we have Steve Wissenski from Stifel. Your line is open.
Hey, good afternoon guys.
Good afternoon.
So the guys on the ground earlier in the call to touch on the favorable talked about the favorable case counts they're seeing in Hong Kong. But I guess the question is, can you guys provide any color around the actual The nation progress in key feeder markets like Macau, Hong Kong, Guangdong. Obviously, it's very tough for us over here to get Good understanding where they are today versus maybe like the U. S. Is right now.
So any color there would be pretty helpful.
Wilbur, Graham, can you help me with that
one? Yes. I think the situation on the ground In China, they have started the vaccination program, but there's no really no hurry for people to to get the vaccination because China has been very safe for the last months. And for Hong Kong and Macau. Macau has no incidents for over 380 days.
So the feeling of comfort is causing a lot of people to adopt the wait and see attitude. But It's getting there. People are slowly taking up the vaccination. Same with Hong Kong. I think Hong Kong is There's unfortunately a few cases of people suffering after to the vaccination.
So again, there are people adopting a wait and see attitude. But slowly, slowly, people are beginning to realize the importance, especially if they are thinking of traveling overseas that the travel bubble may require vaccination certification. So I think people are beginning to take up vaccination.
Got you. Thanks for that. And Rob, there's been some talk or some rumors out there about Macau potentially moving to a digital currency down the road at some point, try to combat money laundering. Do you have any high level thoughts around Something like that being implemented and then if something like that would get implemented, maybe the impact you potentially could see across certain business segments?
I think couple of thoughts on that. One is, I don't some people are concerned. We're not. We think it's an additional form of liquidity into the market. 2, What preempts other currencies are ways of having funds to gamble.
But also I think some of the problem we have in our industry, we think that Everything is done in Beijing. They're actually thinking about casinos in Macao. I'm not sure if the case is a different thought process there. I think sometimes we are very Thank you. I don't think Macao is a target on as we mentioned, anti money laundering, much of it's a digital currency strategy by Beijing.
And I don't think it's hurting Cal whatsoever. I think it's just adding additional liquidity. And Grant, do you want to weigh on this at all?
No, I think you said it well. I think it's a big and complex topic. It's really more about the digital currency strategy Of China more broadly and also how Macau can fit into that. So probably most helpful is to refer to the comments by the Chief Executive recently in the question and answer session Basically, this digital currency China has been looking at since 2014. And so Macau will also adjust and adapt in order to accommodate this broader strategy on digital currency, but a prerequisite of that is also getting prepared in terms of amending the existing relevant legislation.
So this is Still an early stage process from perspective of Macau.
I think the assumption has been by a lot of people, this is a negative thing. We view it As a positive, as again, we would love to have more cross currency and more cross border currency. So To me, along with the petite, the Hong Kong dollar and the renminbi, it's not a form of currency. And for those of you concerned, look, our business is not built on Money laundering, no one on necessarily a junket profile. We're looking to focus on the mass customer, premium mass customer, that's our bread and butter, that's who we are.
We want to go in the future and we believe we build a business that keeps growing in the back of that, more visitation and more penetration in China, more ways of getting Keep it a gamble and visit the cow is we're looking for. So this is another value add to me. I think it's positive. I know the common wisdom as well is going to be terrible. I don't understand people think that way.
It's not an immediate concern nor I think it's a long term concern. It might be a very positive thing for the CAL market as it becomes More traditional, more integrated into China and more consumer friendly will be very positive for us.
Okay, great. That's great color. Thanks, Rob. Appreciate it.
Our last question is from David Katz from Jefferies. Your line is open.
Hi. I appreciate you taking my question. Rob, I just you used the term voracious appetite for digital before and I wondered appreciate it and wondered what Intelligence you have or what survey work that gives you a sense that your people, your customers here in the U. S. Or you have an audience in the U.
S, particularly in the context of Las Vegas going away, that audience is there for you?
Well, everybody, Mike, I guess the word veracious is the description of how we feel about that digital marketing. You look at it, You can't deny the cumulative power of all those different businesses. And I think we have to figure which one we want to enter, which queue you want to enter. I'm not that concerned about the fact that some people are late to the party or we have a sports betting presence because I don't think it's all that Difficult to enter them. If you want to buy something good, you want to build the path we could.
But I think we're looking at right now, it's a good time to reflect on what's making money, what's going to grow. I don't think it's necessary in our thought process, just simply in the U. S. It may be outside of Europe, it would not be in Asia, but we would not Do something that upset the governments we do business with in Asia, but it could be in Europe, it could be in South America, North America, as well as markets have to be on the U. S.
It could be the U. S, it could be B2B, it could be B2C. I just think the market, we are spending a lot of time learning and with our on the balance sheet at the sale of Las Vegas again, we have outsized capital to look at these things. When we build organically, we buy something remains to be We won't do something just to do something. We'll do something intelligent, well thought out and profitable.
And I think we all see, not just LES, but we can see the opportunities there for digital market that grows to 20, 30, 40, you know the numbers. The numbers keep growing in people's minds. And I think there is a belief that the digital market will become probably the huge opportunity for people like us, but we're planning So again, it's really being trustful just running the business. And I don't think it's quite some selling Las Vegas things to have to take effect. I I think the sale of Las Vegas puts us in the game even further because it provides the capital and the incentive to grow.
At the same time, I think people have this either work or the land based, you can't be digital. You have to be we're not either we're going to be a land based player for years to come making Probably 5 plus 1,000,000,000 in Asia in the near future. We're in the digital planner and we'll still look at there's some speculation we'll leave the U. S. Market, which is absolutely untrue.
We just felt there's a better place to earn more returns on our capital than in Las Vegas. And we think that we can be in multiple businesses. We need digital, land based, Asia, U. S, we'll have the opportunity to grow and actually we'll grow and we'll have to tie to any more strategy or any more thought process.
Understood. Appreciate it. Thanks very much.
Appreciate it. Thanks, David. Thanks.
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