Good afternoon, and welcome to the Netflix Q3 2022 Earnings Interview. I'm Spencer Wang, VP of Finance, IR, and Corporate Development. Joining me today are Co-CEO Reed Hastings, Co-CEO and Chief Content Officer Ted Sarandos, COO and Chief Product Officer Greg Peters, and CFO Spencer Neumann. Our interviewer this quarter is Douglas Anmuth from JP Morgan. As a reminder, we will be making forward-looking statements, and actual results may vary. With that, let's jump into it. Doug, over to you for your first question.
Great. Thanks, Spencer, and great to see all of you, and thanks for having me join you again today. So let's jump in with advertising. Obviously a lot of discussion here heading into the launch. You announced details for the new Basic with Ads tier last week, launching in the U.S. and 11 other markets. Can you help us understand how you arrived at the price point and the product features for Basic with Ads?
Yeah, Doug. You know, a lot of what we're thinking in terms of setting pricing for Basic with Ads and how we think about pricing in general anchors on you know, what's the value that we're delivering to consumers. We're trying to work very hard to translate the dollars that they give us into incredible shows. You can see sort of, you know, in Q3 some great examples of the series that we're delivering there, the films we're delivering there, and the Q4 slate, it looks incredible as well.
With, specifically with regard to ads, we modeled out essentially what we think the expected revenue is on the variety of different countries that we're launching in to make sure that, you know, in a combination of the subscription price that we're charging for Basic with Ads, plus that anticipated monetization, we'd be roughly, call it, unit economics-wise, revenue positive to neutral. When we look at the fact that we think that this lower price, consumer-facing price, will bring in a lot more members, we're quite confident in the long term that this will lead to a significant incremental revenue and profit stream.
I guess just to clarify there, when you talk about kind of getting neutral and perhaps more accretive over time, you know, what are you comparing that to on a unit economic basis that's essentially more to the basic tier?
Yeah. It may be relevant to note that we don't see a lot of members switching plans. Oftentimes when they, you know, come in and they select a plan for a given feature, let's say that's the 4K resolution, you know, we see that to be a pretty sticky choice. You know, when we're thinking about unit economics being neutral to positive, we're really comparing to the like, you know, feature set in the Basic without ads.
Okay, great. Maybe you could talk a little bit about what gives you confidence in that advertising arm, and how would you frame advertiser demand thus far? I know Jeremy last week talked about having hundreds of advertisers on board and ad inventory almost sold out.
Yeah. We started with, you know, a bunch of models that were informed by obviously, you know, the ads activities in those different countries around the world. You know, now we're at the point where we get to take those models and we get to bring them actually to advertisers and sort of see what's working in practice. It's been great to see both our partner, Microsoft, and their sales team as well as our small but crack ad sales team in actual action with brands and with agencies working through that. I would say that the initial demand that we're seeing is very strong.
People are very excited about the proposition of bringing their brands and their ads to a bunch of, you know, consumers around the world that are watching our shows. They're excited about the positioning against the incredible content and the titles that we have. That demand has been very, very strong. We're seeing sort of a lot of the expectations that we built into our models come through in that actual sales process. That's great. I think it's also worth noting, though, that we're, you know, very much in a, you know, crawl, walk, run kind of model that we talked about before. We're sort of iteratively improving.
You know, we're building in a lot of capabilities over the next couple of quarters that we think are important to advertisers to make that advertising offering increasingly attractive and sort of check a bunch of boxes that they have. You might have seen the verification partners that we announced. That's a pretty good example of that. We got a lot more on that roadmap to go do that we're excited about delivering for brands.
In terms of those capabilities, targeting, obviously very important here as well. I think you've talked about having broad targeting, by country and genre and I think within the top 10 shows, and I believe you'll also ask for age and gender, at the time of sign-up as well. You know, early feedback from marketers and agencies has been that the targeting options at launch are fairly limited. You know, what's your view on that, and how will that targeting evolve over time?
Yeah. Again, I think we're starting. You know, part of what we wanna do is actually get this out to market quickly. You could see we went from basically the point we announced it to delivering it in about six months, which has been testament to a lot of hard work on internal teams and to Microsoft. We do have relatively basic targeting capabilities in terms of contextual targeting, genre, et cetera. That's sort of consistent with what we see with television as well, right? Obviously now our job is to, you know, move from that into more of what we, you know, expect from a digital world where we have, you know, 100% signed in audience, you know, fully addressable, fully targetable, and so we can start to layer in additional targeting capabilities over time.
I think it's also worth noting when we talk about that we're very cognizant of privacy, and we wanna make that paramount in how we think about this offering. All of the data that we use will just be used to basically deliver a more relevant ads offering on Netflix, and we're not using that data in any way, shape, or form for profile building off Netflix or anything like that.
Okay. There's been a lot of discussion in the press about CPMs that are really 2-3x those of CTV or other AVOD players. Is that accurate? What justifies the much higher pricing for Netflix?
I'm not gonna comment on any specific pricing, but I would just say that I think we've got a very attractive offering. That's a combination of the audience that we have, that we're delivering to, that oftentimes, you know, is hard to access in other ways, certainly harder to access in traditional TV in many cases. It's a result of the incredible content that we've got. Ted's team is doing an amazing job at producing titles that advertisers wanna be next to. That's, I think, what you see is driving the demand and the pricing that we can get.
Okay. You've talked in the past about wanting the ad offering to be innovative and somewhat different over time. If we think about the range of 4-5 minutes of ads per hour, it's certainly lower. You've talked about tight frequency capping. What else do you think is innovative, at least in the initial offering, and then how does that evolve more over time?
Yeah. As you noted, we wanna start with a experience that's very pro-consumer, you know, consumer-centric, and so that's definitely informed both our ad load, and thinking about the frequency capping. What I love about those things is the more we talk to brands and advertisers, there's actually a high degree of alignment between sort of what their desires are and what we think is great for consumers. They're enthusiastic about not, you know, having high frequency caps and having sort of a, you know, a sort of more unique offering there. Also limited ad loads, you know, sets their ads apart, you know, more distinctly. I think I love that alignment, you know, to begin with.
Over time, you know, we're gonna access a bunch of the capabilities that you've seen us leverage over the last 10 years to think about innovation in the space. Personalization, I think, is a great example where, you know, we don't need to think about, you know, the ads experience as being uniform across all of our members. We think about, you know, we can leverage the personalization capability that we've built in terms of titles and how we present titles, and also in terms of how we present ads. I think that's an exciting dimension that we're gonna work on as well. Additionally, we're also excited to work with sort of partners and our advertisers to think about what is that ads experience, the ad format that, you know, is really best suited for premium connected TV.
We're starting with meeting the market where it's at today. That's important to access sort of all the capabilities they've got. We don't need to, you know, stay there, and I think we're looking forward to over a couple of years understanding, you know, what is the, you know, the right, you know, native format for premium connected TV and figuring out what that looks like.
Hey, Doug, I might just add also just part of the innovation was just for us, the business innovation of speed to market. As you know, Greg said, getting from announce to launch within 6 months and to doing so in every region in which we operate, so 12 markets that represent, you know, well over half of our revenue today. Part of it is just that nimbleness and speed, which hopefully we'll bring to our innovation paths going forward as well.
Okay. In terms of subscribers, how do you think about just this concept of kind of new net adds versus trade down from existing subs on the Basic with Ads tier? It's obviously a pretty frequent discussion with investors.
Yeah. Again, I think it's important just to reiterate that we don't see a lot of plan switching, you know, on the existing plan set. That's, I think a, you know, worthwhile point to note. Obviously as we, you know, stated before, we're not really trying to steer our members to one plan or another. We're trying to take a pro-consumer approach and sort of let them find and land on the right plan for them. You know, as we stated, we modeled out that expected performance on ads monetization and factored that into our thinking around price point for the Basic with Ads. We really anticipate that this is gonna be a, you know, a pro-consumer model that'll be more attractive, bring more members in because the consumer pricing price is low.
Again, the economics and the revenue will be fine as a result, even if some of those consumers switch plans. Again, you know, just to restate this, when you factor in then those extra members, you know, we expect this leads to a significant and incremental revenue and profit stream.
How do you think about the impact in terms of reducing churn, and perhaps how that plays out across some of the different markets, given different characteristics and levels of penetration?
Yeah. You know, I think generally what we've seen is that obviously lower price, you know, helps with churn, and so I think that there'll be some, you know, positive dynamics there. But again, you know, we really, you know, we're in early days now and we've got to launch this thing, and we'll learn so much more over the months to come.
Doug, much of that is tied to engagement. I mean, the best way to reduce churn is to keep them entertained.
Right. Which you've clearly done in this past quarter, and we'll talk more about that in a minute, Ted Sarandos. At the Code Conference last month, Satya Nadella said that the Netflix Microsoft ad deal is one of the biggest ad deals ever. Are there any particular components of the deal that give you confidence in the advertising revenue outlook here and how it compares to subscription over time?
Well, one of the big factors for us in picking Microsoft is that we felt like we were highly strategically aligned. You know, they had an approach that was similar to ours, which is that we wanna, you know, launch and then learn quickly and iterate quickly, and that there was a lot of flexibility, both in terms of innovation around, you know, the formats and approaches that we've just talked about. Partly it was a lot of flexibility in thinking about how do we leverage the combined go-to-market capability that Microsoft has a lot of right now and that we have very little, but we're gonna build over time. You know, frankly, when I see the demand that we're in right now, you know, we're stretched between the two teams to really support all that.
I'm actually excited about our ability to grow that capacity on the Microsoft side. I think they're gonna do some hiring and building, and we're gonna do some hiring and building, and then through that joint capacity growth, be able to better serve more advertisers, which we actually can't even, you know, we're turning some folks away right now 'cause we just don't have the go-to-market capacity to serve everyone.
Doug, at that same conference, Bob Iger said that linear TV was going off a cliff.
He did.
What I underappreciated was just the impact on advertisers. They're just being able to reach fewer people, and then the 18-49 demographic is even faster than the decline in paid TV. This is what is really fueling the cycle, is the real collapse of linear TV as an advertising vehicle outside of a few properties like sports.
Reed, maybe that just brings up the question, and for you as well, Greg, I mean, when you're going out to agencies and marketers, do you feel like you're going after linear TV dollars, or are you going after digital dollars right now?
Yeah. I'd say when you look at the capabilities of our, you know, the current, you know, offering that we have as a publisher, I think we're mostly competitive with linear right now. Obviously, I think that we'll build into that over time, and a lot of what makes digital attractive will be part of our offering, you know, as we go. Obviously, I think, you know, when you think about sort of demand capture and those direct response ads versus sort of the more brand side, we're probably gonna be leaning for, you know, some time more into that brand side of things where we can be more competitive. But I think those roles are gonna blur over time, realistically.
You know, our job is to be, you know, highly competitive with the components, the technical components that we can add in in terms of targeting, et cetera. But also then, you know, be very competitive because we have really incredible content and an incredible audience that advertisers wanna connect with.
Okay. Spence, in terms of ad revenue, it feels like it should be very high margin. Maybe you can just talk about some of the key costs or investments in running the ad business, given that Microsoft is responsible for the bulk of ad sales for now.
Yeah, yeah, I'd agree with you, Doug. Again, we need to build this out over time. As Greg said, on a unit economic basis, we feel good that this will be kind of net neutral to positive out of the gates. When you add in the incrementality on subscribers, we think we can build a big incremental revenue and profit stream. There are some costs. Obviously, there's some cost to our partnership with Microsoft. There's some cost of building out our side of the internal team to kind of build out our capabilities with Jeremy and Peter. Obviously, you know, some other costs here and there.
Overall, I'm not gonna get into specifics, but we believe this can be margin accretive over time. It's gonna be pretty small out of the gates. It's kinda reflected in our Q4 guidance, as you can see. It's an intra-quarter launch. We're not expecting any material financial impact in this first kinda partial quarter, but we'll build over time, and it'll be additive to the business.
Okay, great. All right. For the record, we're not hitting subscriber numbers until about 15 minutes in here. You added 2.4 million subs in the third quarter. You're expecting 4.5 million in 4Q. Maybe you can just kinda walk us through how you're feeling about core subscriber growth before you kind of get into the dynamics in 2023 around, you know, advertising and paid sharing.
Well, thank God we're done with shrinking quarters. That's the big feeling of we're back to the positivity. You know, obviously, this quarter and the guidance for Q4, you know, are reasonable, not fantastic, but reasonable. We gotta pick up the momentum. Everything the company's focused on, whether that's on the content side, on marketing, lowering prices of the ad-supported, the paid sharing, the thoughtful approach we're doing there, lines us up for a good next year. We still got FX, so that's a huge hit, you know, as we've explained. That's not gonna go away. But other than that, all the stars are lining up very well for us. Spence, you wanna add to that?
Yeah, Reed, no, you're doing my job for me, which is great. I appreciate that. Yes, we're as Reed said, you know, we're still not growing as fast as we'd like. Yeah, we're building momentum. We're pleased with our progress, but we know we've got a lot more work to do. We're pleased with Q3. We saw acquisition growth a bit more than we had been the past few quarters, which is great across every region. Churn remained slightly elevated, kinda similar to where we were at the end of Q2. Overall, when you combine those two things, we delivered paid net adds of 2.4 million, which was a little bit above our guide, so we kinda underforecast there obviously. Then for Q4, as we talked about, as
As Reed talked about, you mentioned, we're guiding to 4.5 million paid net adds. Reflected in that guide is, you know, what we talked about. We're off to a nice start. I'm sure Ted will talk about the strength of the content slate. We started with Dahmer – Monster: The Jeffrey Dahmer Story and into The Watcher and others that are building. It's a strong seasonal quarter. But some of those revenue accelerators that we know we're focused on in the near term, whether it's ads, we just talked a bunch about that.
We don't expect at least a big financial impact in this first launch quarter. We also, as we talked about in the letter, have a solution that we'll be rolling out in 2023 for paid sharing and monetizing all that unpaid viewing we've been talking about. Again, that doesn't even start rolling out until early 2023. There's some other near-term limiters to our growth. Take currency out, we still have penetrating the connected TV market and the sales cycle there. We got competition. We got some macro strain, whether it's higher inflation, energy prices, and some of the geopolitical strain around the world. All those things are factored into our guide.
It's a little bit less visibility than we typically would see. Overall, we feel really good that we're building that momentum. We've set a path to the growth. You're seeing growth in paid net adds both in actuals for Q3 and into the guide to Q4, and most importantly, a path to accelerate revenue growth and hit the ground running in 2023.
Okay, great. You had your two biggest English language series ever, I think in the span of 3-4 months with Stranger Things 4 and Dahmer. Do you believe the content cadence is becoming more normalized here post-pandemic? How much of a factor were those titles in driving 3Q subs and now more momentum into the fourth quarter?
Look, big shows that folks engage with and talk about drives a lot of growth. I do think people come to value that. For us, our goal is we've gotta get them to come to expect it. Right after they finish something great that they love, that there's an expectation that there's something ready right behind it. You described it pretty nicely. You come out of Stranger Things season four, you roll right into a big movie like The Gray Man or a real movie that you fall in love with, like Purple Hearts, or a great animated feature like The Sea Beast. You're done with that, and you roll right into Monster: The Jeffrey Dahmer Story. Right out of that, I mean, back-to-back hits from Ryan, going right into The Watcher.
I think it's that cadence is something I do think we're getting better at, as you know, as we get more and more mature in our creation of original content. Remember, Doug, we've only been at it for 10 years.
Yeah. The other thing is.
So, uh, just-
Oh, go ahead, Reed. Sorry.
Ted, maybe just talk a little about the smoothing of content monthly, kind of what state we're at this year, what you think we can get to next year, you know, sort of easing-
Yeah
out of that COVID concentration.
The COVID got a lot of content jammed up in the later parts of the year, and then that impact rolls out because even when people are getting back to normal work, they were all working on those projects during COVID. It'll take several years to completely unwind the COVID logjam. Historically, Q4 tends to be a little heavier than Q1 and Q2, mostly because of the historical legacy of the fall TV series and the fall film cycles with film festivals and award cycles and all those things that are kind of unnatural to viewers watching. We're trying to be more and more aggressive about smoothing that out to make sure that the content is available when people are ready to watch it.
Just to add to that, it's really kind of smoothing it out across all of our content categories, so there's always something great to watch, whatever your mood or taste. Even just to build on Ted's point, it's not just kind of the English language titles, and I'm sorry if I missed some of what he said, but even if you think of in this last quarter, whether it's every region, you know, Sintonia in Brazil, it's The Empress in Germany, High Water in Poland, Narco-Saints in Korea. More and more of those big local titles with big local impact as well that can also have the ability to travel. It's really kind of getting that cadence in every country and region around the world.
Probably none was a better example this go around than Extraordinary Attorney Woo from Korea. You know, 400 million hours of watching around the world. Just a real phenomenon that we can take a show that other folks would view as being extraordinarily Korean, and make it work around the world.
Ted, there's a lot of discussion just around the philosophy around content, and I guess the question is: Is your process or selectivity changing at all in terms of the greenlighting of content? Does it need to?
Look, let me go back to what I was saying earlier. We started this about 10 years ago. We had no IP. We had no library. We moved as quickly as we could to build a library of our own IP and to build our own library. In those 10 years, that library now gets more viewing, more revenue, and more profit than all of our competitors who've been at it for over 100. When I look at that and think, "Okay, along the way, we probably made a lot of mistakes," and we learned a lot.
Today, when I think about what we learned today, we've kind of developed a lot stronger skill sets and partnerships and processes to ensure quality of delivery and working with our creators and to give them the tools to deliver for the audience. Some things that are fairly proprietary and some things that just benefit from the scale of our business so that they can really do what we wanna do, which is please audiences. You gotta remember as we go to do that, it isn't just making prestige shows in English. It's also making very kind of pop culture television across every genre, across every format imaginable. In doing that's the thing that I think we can bring scale and creativity and audience connectivity that others can't compete with.
For me, that's the biggest thing that when you say, are we sharpening our tools? Are we getting better? We're definitely getting more mature about the process. I mean, if you go all the way back to the beginning of time, we didn't have any staff who'd had any experience in creating original anything on Netflix. We built that up to where we're at today, which is, you know, in the last quarter, we've released 7 of our most popular releases of all time, just in this last quarter.
Okay, great. You've talked last quarter about content spend staying kind of flattish around a $17 billion or so number in annual cash spending.
I realize that that's up this year when you kind of take out the incremental COVID costs from last year. Does the discipline around content spending push you to do anything differently? I guess what's your confidence that you can deliver both the quantity and also the quality of content that you want within that number across all regions?
Look, I think what we're seeing, Doug, is that both the scope and scale, as well as the range and the cadence of hits is improving. So that I feel better and better about that $17 billion of content spend, because what we have to do is be better and better at getting more impact per $1 billion spent than anybody else, and that's how we're focusing on it. I think we're spending at about the right level. As we re-accelerate revenue, we'll revisit that number, of course, but, you know, we're a pretty disciplined bunch about that.
Okay. The Knives Out sequel, Glass Onion, so pretty highly anticipated. You're gonna release it in a limited number of theaters, I think for a week around Thanksgiving, before hitting Netflix, I believe on December 23rd. There also seems to have been a push to perhaps run it for a longer period of time in theaters. Maybe you can just talk about some of the debate there, what the rationale is to just do it for one week, and how do you think that kind of release will drive viewership on Netflix?
Well, first, I'll tell you, we're in the business of entertaining our members with Netflix movies on Netflix. That's where we focus all of our energy and most of our spends. Our films are always heavily featured in film festivals around the world because they're in demand, made by the greatest filmmakers on the planet. For all those folks who can't get to a city where a festival is, this one-week release on 600 screens is a way of creating access to the film and building buzz, the same thing we're doing in those festivals. I would look at this as just another way to build anticipation for the film and build buzz and reputation for the film ahead of its Netflix release.
There's all kinds of debates all the time back and forth, but there's no question internally that we make our movies for our members, and we really want them to watch them on Netflix. Of course, with one week of release in theaters, most people will see them on Netflix, just like they see all movies. Most people watch most movies at home. We think that there's plenty. I think this particular release sits somewhere between that week we have to run movies to qualify for awards and the time that we run them in a film festival and the time that we travel them around, but it's a way of condensing that into a louder event.
Got it. Okay. Pretty clear. Let's shift gears a little bit, talk about paid sharing. You announced profile transfer yesterday, which facilitates non-paying members shifting their recommendations and history, and other settings to a new account. Maybe you can talk about how this is a potential precursor, you know, to having borrowers, you know, kind of become either having their own accounts or adding to an existing member, and just how we should think about timing of the rollout there.
Sure. The profile transfer, I mean, supports a couple different use cases, right? I mean, there's obviously situations where you can imagine, like, you know, you have a kid at home who is gonna go off and become an adult and get their own account, and it supports those ones. It does enable a key thing that we learned around how we think about paid sharing. We've been, you know, working really hard to try and find essentially a balanced position, an approach towards this, one that supports, you know, customer choice and frankly, you know, a long history of customer centricity that we think has informed how we think about establishing our service. Balancing that with making sure that as a business, we're sort of getting paid when we're delivering entertainment value to consumers.
You know, as we try to do with pretty much all of our product changes where we can, we try and try different approaches and listen to our members and use their reactions to help us understand what's working and what's not working. We've tried a couple different approaches in different countries. You saw that. Based on the customer feedback that we're getting, we sort of landed on an approach towards paid sharing that we think strikes that balance. A key component of that is the ability for borrowers, people that are using somebody else's account right now to access Netflix, to be able to create their own separate account.
Part of that is transferring their profile and their viewing history and all the great, you know, information that basically informs, hopefully, great recommendations for them. We think that that sort of separate account path will be especially attractive in countries where we're launching that lower-priced Basic with Ads plan. That lower, you know, price obviously makes that more attractive. Another component of this, though, is allowing account owners to be able to pay for Netflix for some, you know, friend or family, someone they want to share the service with. They're able to create a sub-account, which we're calling Extra Member to enable that model too.
We're trying to come up with a range of options that supports, you know, customer choice, balances those considerations, but also ensures that we've got a sustainable business model that allows us to invest in more of that great entertainment that, you know, Ted's team is always focused on for all of our members. We're looking forward to getting that out in early 2023.
Do you think extra member and kind of new accounts could that be bigger than advertising in 2023 for Netflix?
I'm wanting to say, you know, which is to be bigger or better. I think they're complementary in many ways. What we're seeing is that there's a number of different consumer needs, right? You know, paying for Netflix for somebody that you want to share that service with, that's a legitimate need. You know, creating a lower price that balances out for us as a business with monetization from ads, that's a legitimate, you know, need to get to all the great content that we're making.
I just think of this as a range of options that try to speak to a range of different consumer needs, the right price points, the right feature set, and we're really just trying to do a better job at expanding that range so that we can serve more consumers on the planet in the right way.
Okay. Spence, maybe you could talk a little bit just about the decision to no longer provide guidance on subscribers starting next quarter.
Sure. Spencer, you wanna take that one or?
Sure. Happy to take it. Appreciate the question, Doug. Maybe just to start, focusing on subscribers in our early days was helpful, but now that we have such a wide range of price points, different partnerships all over the world, economic impact of any given subscriber can be quite different, and that's particularly true if you're trying to compare our business with other streaming services. That's why we've been increasingly focused on revenue as our primary top-line metric, as you've heard us talk about over the last several years. This is gonna be, I think, even more important as we head into 2023 and we develop new revenue streams, like advertising and paid sharing, where membership growth is only one aspect of the revenue picture.
Just to be clear, we will continue to report our global membership every quarter when we release earnings, as well as the paid net adds. We'll also continue to disclose our regional membership, as we do today. In terms of our revenue guidance, you should expect that we'll give you some color on the underlying drivers of the revenue forecast, but we just won't provide a pinpoint paid net adds figure per se. Then lastly, we'll continue to provide guidance for all the other metrics, Doug, that we do today, namely revenue, operating income, operating margin, net income, EPS, and share count. In the grand scheme of things, you know, pretty minor change.
Okay. That's great. That's helpful. If we look at the Q4 guide, 4% operating margin, it's heavily impacted by FX pressures. I think it's 10% ex FX, and I guess on a year-over-year basis, kinda up from 8%. Maybe you can just talk about some of the factors there. Is there anything fundamental in terms of the business that's kind of perhaps weighing there a little bit more on Q4 margins, or is it kinda all FX?
It's really all FX, Doug, as you said. I mean, year-over-year FX neutral constant currency, we're actually up. We'd be at 10% margin versus 8% prior Q4. It's the FX drag is significant. We mentioned in the letter if we look at, you know, you can do the math on our four quarters now, and you kind of roll it out to a full year number. We're still holding to what we're calling FX neutral to the beginning of the year, January 1 of this year, to that 19%-20% margin range FX neutral. You'll see it's actually it is in the mid to higher end of that range. On a reported basis, it's just a little over 17%.
There's about 2.5 points of FX drag in our margin that equates to about $1 billion of revenue drag, about $800 million of margin drag. The bulk of that is being felt in the fourth quarter as it's built up through the year.
Okay. I guess maybe you can just talk about cash content spending, just to confirm. It sounds like you're kind of reiterating the same thing around the $17 billion type of level going forward. What does that mean for free cash flow generation over these next few years?
Yeah. As you said, we're kinda maintaining the guidance that we had. We think the $17 billion is about the right zip code, ±, to spend based on our current revenue trajectory. As Ted said, as we hope and expect to reaccelerate revenue, we'll revisit those spend levels. For now, given all those learnings that Ted mentioned, we think we can deliver more member value per dollar of content spend than we have in the past. We expect our content slate to get better and better each quarter and each year over the next couple of years.
The way that then translates to cash flow for this year, we're maintaining our roughly $1 billion of free cash flow guide, ±$200 million, as there's always movement at the end of the year for timing. Next year for that free cash flow to substantially improve beyond that. We expect it to be, you know, hopefully, a materially above the roughly $1 billion this year. We won't put a specific guide out now, but it'll be significantly larger.
Okay, great.
Doug, we have time for about two last questions, please.
Okay. Reed, you talked about according to Nielsen, right? Streaming time now surpasses both broadcast and cable. Of course, Netflix has played a major role here in driving that transition. What does this next period of streaming look like in your view? Clearly more competitive, more ad-supported, but how else do you think it evolves?
That's a great question, Doug. I mean, clearly us and Disney, you know, are investing heavily and, you know, will be two big brands in the premium space. YouTube is very strong on connected TVs, so they'll continue to grow. I think depending on how Sunday Ticket lands at, you know, somewhere, Apple, Amazon, somewhere else, you'll start to see a bunch of people focus on sports, you know, and bringing that over to on-demand. Then think of how, you know, mobile telephony just slowly replaced fixed line telephony, you know. That was even before smartphones, right? Just in the convenience. You're just gonna see it grow every year for many years ahead. You know, makes TV, you know, a lot more convenient, more enjoyable.
You know, a smart TV now costs less than a mobile phone. You know, it doesn't have a battery, it's got a smaller processor, it's easier to manufacture. You know, smart TVs are getting ubiquitous and lower cost. You know, there was the supply chain slowdowns, but generally I think you'll see around the world smart TVs continuing to get to, you know, every home in the world that has a TV. That's all very positive vectors. Again, think of it on, you know, basically pretty steady every year climbing share. Then, you know, a lot of us battling it out for do we have the best content in the world? Do we have the best suggestions in the world, the lowest prices? You know, all the classic competitive dynamics.
We're pretty excited about, you know, this next phase, which is competitive excellence. You know, it's straight ahead execution, you know, if we can just be better than everybody else and, you know, we're pretty driven at that.
Okay, to close out, I'm not gonna ask you about 4Q content, but I'd like to ask each of you the single most important thing for you and your teams to accomplish in your respective roles over the next 12 to 24 months. I'll leave it to you guys for whatever order you'd like.
I'll go first. I mean, you know, for me, it's the overall direction of, you know, what we're doing, and that there's kinda clear context for everyone that if we execute down this particular path well, then we're gonna win. That's very exciting, and we're on target for that.
Doug, we have to continue to deliver enormous quality at scale. The volume of releasing that we're doing, it's not that we're putting out so much, just dumping the content into the world. We're actually trying to super serve hundreds of millions of people with individual tastes and individual relationships with content. To do that at scale is something that's never been done before, and we continue to kind of sharpen the tools to deliver on that every, not just for the next 12, 24 months, but for the foreseeable future. I think this time right now is just as important as it ever has been.
Doug, for me, two suggestions. One is, as you've heard us say, we wanna build a really big but also very profitable business. In our role in corporate strategy and planning, you know, we wanna help the company build and refine the muscle around, you know, big profits over time. Secondly, you know, we've been doing more M&A over the last, you know, year or so. Again, just getting better and better at that in terms of integration and making sure those deals live up to the expectation.
Yeah. I'll add to Spencer's point. It's, you know, we're really in kind of that support role in finance and operations across the company. Helping to really scale and mature that combination of creative excellence and operational excellence in our support roles and support our ability to become truly an increasingly global company around the world with increasing kind of financial discipline to get more and more of that dollar of spend onto the screen for the enjoyment of our members.
Doug, I'll cheat and give you two. I mean, tactically, we are sprinting at ads, and it's been super fun to see teams engaged and doing incredible work to make that happen in such a short time. Behind the scenes, we're doing amazing stuff on improving the, what we call the choosing experience, which is the content discovery and recommendations and all the things that essentially, I think, takes all the work that Ted's teams do and tries to magnify the value of that for the users we have around the world. Sometimes those things are subtle, because they sort of happen behind the covers, if you will. You know, every quarter that we see improvements there, I know we're doing a good job for our members around the world.
Okay, great.
Thanks, Doug. Since you didn't ask, I'm gonna take another couple of seconds to tell you about Q4 anyway.
Go for it.
The Watcher is already turning out to be enormous. We have a returning season of The Crown, Emily in Paris, Manifest, Dead to Me, Firefly Lane, Ginny and Georgia, an origin story from the world of The Witcher. We have an incredible new action series starring Noah Centineo called The Recruit. We have Tim Burton's television directorial debut with Wednesday. We have a new series from Guillermo del Toro called Cabinet of Curiosities. And from around the world are some of our most successful shows like Alice in Borderland and Barbarians and Elite are back for new seasons too, all just in Q4. Let me say first and foremost, we have a lot of work to do to continue to re-accelerate revenue.
We're really happy with our levels of engagement, the number of hit series and films that we're able to put to our members at prices that they think are a phenomenal value, in these strained economic times. We're growing even in those strained economic times and with the extraordinary levels of competition out there for streaming dollars and for hours of viewing. We stood up an ad product in six months with this, and with the tremendous demand on that product and with the great partnership with Microsoft and with Greg Peters and this phenomenal team that runs that effort, our Basic with Ads tier is gonna help us open up Netflix to a whole new audience of folks who are attracted to all that great content at an even lower price point.
In Q4, we look forward to bringing this incredible slate to everybody. As we continue to grow, in this world of film and television and games, which we believe that the future of television, of films, and of games is streaming. We're working hard to continue to grow our lead in this area, while we continue to bring healthy returns. We can only do that by bringing the shows, the films, and games that people love. Wait till you see Glass Onion: A Knives Out Mystery, and wait till you see the new season of The Crown, and you'll know just what I'm talking about. Thanks, Doug.