Welcome to the Alm. Brand Interim Report first half year of 2021. For the first part of this call, all participants will be in a listen- only mode. Afterwards there will be a Q&A session. Today, I'm pleased to present Rasmus Werner Nielsen. Sir, please go ahead.
Thank you. Good morning, thank you for taking the time to join us on this call on the Alm. Brand results for the second quarter of 2021. With me today I have our CFO, Andreas Ruben Madsen, and Head of Investor Relations, Mikael Bo Larsen. It is a strong set of results that we have announced today that demonstrates that we are successfully executing on the things that we have planned. We have had a very busy agenda in the second quarter of the year, and we have spent a vast amount of both time and resources on the process leading to the successful bid for Codan. This is indeed a very big thing for us that will transform our company and define our roadmap for years to come.
We have still been able to maintain a strong focus on executing on the day-to-day business, and this is exactly why I'm most satisfied with the results. Let me walk you through our results for the quarter. Please turn to slide two. In the second quarter, we have witnessed a very positive development in our business. We have seen a return to a more normal business environment following the reopening of the society, and we welcome this as it allows us to meet face-to-face with our customers again. Also, our partnerships are making progress, and they start to contribute meaningfully to our overall premium growth. The ongoing operational changes that we are making to our business is reflected in our profitability.
The initiatives that we have been implementing are making the core of our business more efficient, and eventually this flows down to the key numbers like the claims ratio. Our focus will remain on both growth and cost initiatives as we strive for improving profitability further. Please turn to slide three. The group made a pre-tax profit of DKK 244 million in the second quarter of the year against DKK 328 million in the second quarter last year. As you may see from the table on the right side, non-life is up quarter-on-quarter, life is slightly down, and other activities are significantly lower. The key takeaways are that the underlying profitability and cost development are very satisfying, that non-life profit includes a one-time positive contribution from change in risk margin, but are lower than last year positive contribution from investment result.
That other activities includes a one-time negative contribution for primarily costs associated to the acquisition of Codan. That is both consultancy fees and warranty and indemnity insurance, as well as a negative investment result. All in all, this has been another quarter where we have demonstrated that we are advancing steadily on all factors that we can control. This means that the half year pre-tax results amounts to DKK 381 million, which is slightly up compared to last year. Back in June, we increased our full- year guidance reflecting a strong development in our underlying business. We hold on to the overall guidance, but we make some change to how we see the different parts moving in the rest of the year. I will, as always, get back to this at the end of my presentation.
Now, please turn to slide four for a short comment on the development in Codan. Yesterday, Codan announced their first half results, and we are of course pleased with the positive numbers that indicate that progress is being made on a broad scale. Premiums growth total 1.7%, and at the same time, combined ratio improved from 100 to 92, i.e., a notable improvement of 8 percentage point. The positive development was driven by a huge change in the commercial lines following some of the initiative launch to restore profitability, but also private had a fine development leading to a combined ratio just below 83. The technical result increased by more than DKK 100 million, and excluding run-offs, the technical result increased by close to DKK 200 million. These are numbers pointing in the right direction. Now, please turn to slide five.
We have a process in front of us that we will follow step by step in the coming months. On top of this, we have launched a full catalog of actions to prepare ourselves for the acquisition of Codan next year, thus facilitating a swift takeover. The next step we are looking at is the upcoming AGM in early September, where we will make the formal decision to allow for the capital increase in Alm. Brand, which will take place within the next month. On a special note, the association has informed us that they expect to participate with an additional DKK 500 million, thus increasing their stake in the forthcoming capital increase to DKK 4.25 billion. Now, back to the Q2 results on slide seven.
The non-life business made a very strong pre-tax profit of DKK 346 million in the second quarter of the year, which is comprised of a very satisfactory technical result of DKK 326 million and a positive investment result of DKK 20 million. The technical result benefited from a good development in underlying business as well as a favorable development in weather-related claims. Also, the COVID-19 pandemic and the subsequent lower activity in general had a direct positive impact on earnings of an estimated DKK 20 million, just like we expected. Last year, we applied to the Danish FSA for an extension of our partial internal model for insurance risks. This has been approved, and the model change has a direct one-time positive economic impact on earnings of DKK 64 million. However, after adjusting for this, the technical result came in at DKK 262 million, which corresponds to an increase of DKK 25 million against second quarter last year.
The run-off results was again of DKK 25 million in the quarter, which corresponds to 1.8%, thus at par with what we would normally expect. Our investment strategy is a conservative long-term strategy with respect to overall portfolio exposure, consequently, we have profited from the continued positive development of the financial markets. Now, on slide eight. Premium income grew by 1.7% in the quarter, i.e., an improvement relative to what we have seen in previous quarters. Growth has been very positive in the commercial segment. We have seen premiums climb by more than 4% as a result of both influx of new customers and adjustment of prices within especially workers compensation. In the private segment, we witnessed a general fierce competition in the motor insurance space, which has affected growth.
Although we have adjusted our pricing somewhat and increased the amount of campaigning, our main focus continues to be on profitability. After the reopening of the society and return to more meetings with our customers, we now see our business momentum improve. On top of this, our partnerships with both Sydbank and Volkswagen Semler Group are up and running, and I'm confident that this, coupled with various pricing initiatives, will further accelerate growth. The claims ratio excluding run-off gains was 65.7% against 67.9% in the second quarter last year. Included in this is an improvement in the underlying business as well as a positive, although lower than last year, effect from fewer claims due to the COVID-19 situation. The expense rate was 17.1% and in line with our expectations through the cost savings program we launched last year.
As mentioned, the extension of our internal partial model has a one-time positive effect on our result. In terms of the combined ratio, the effect is 4.7 percentage point. All in all, this leads to a combined ratio excluding run-off gains and change in risk margin of 82.8% compared to 85.4% in the second quarter last year, i.e., a very strong number driven by recurring underlying improvements. The combined ratio including run-off gains amounted to 76.3%. This is an exceptionally low number that reflects the continuing work with the underlying business as well as the tailwind we had in the quarter. Now, please turn to slide 10. For the weather-related claims, we have also in the second quarter seen a very favorable development. Weather has been mild with no especially wind events and claims amounted to only DKK 14 million.
Likewise, the major claims has developed within the normally expected range and amounted to DKK 74 million. Adding the two together, total claims amounted to DKK 88 million, almost flat against DKK 85 in the second quarter last year. Now, please turn to slide 11. For the private segment, the claims ratio was down 4.9 percentage points in the quarter against second quarter last year. Again, this is the combined result of, on the one side, the initiatives we are doing to increase profit on the underlying business, and on the other side, the positive impact from the extension of the partial internal model. Run-off gains amounted to a decent 1%, but modest compared to the previous years. Lastly, the expense ratio ticked up as expected as we continued to invest in the roll-out and implementation of the new partnerships.
For the commercial customers, the combined ratio improved to 73%, i.e., significantly lower than in the second quarter last year. Included herein is also a one-time positive impact from the extension of the partial internal model. Aside from this, underlying performance has been good on the back of the various initiatives implemented, including both price adjustments on several policies, where we have found that some customers had been paying too low a premium relative to the expected risk profile, and also a tight control on the cost development. The expense ratio amounted to a satisfactory level of 14.7%, sharply down against the same quarter last year. Please turn to the life business on slide 14. Pre-tax profit for the first quarter of 2021 amounted to DKK 23 million against DKK 30 million in the second quarter last year. The technical result amounted to DKK 27 million and reflects a continued satisfactory expense and risk result, which amounted to DKK 13 million.
On the negative side, the investment result came in at a loss of DKK 4 million as prices on bonds eased down. The bonus rate increased to 17.5% compared to 15.2% at the end of last year, as higher interest rates had a positive effect on the life insurance provisions that exceeded the losses on the investment portfolio for the policyholders. Premiums totaled DKK 360 million in the quarter and were made up by DKK 174 million in regular premiums and DKK 142 million in single premiums. The development in regular premiums was flat in the quarter relative to the second quarter last year. Although this is partly explainable by the specific situation around COVID-19, it will take some extra effort to succeed in reaching a respectable growth this year. For 2021, we still have a deposit rate of 3% for new customers.
Some months ago, the FSA announced a regulatory change to the minimum technical rate of interest to - 0.5% will effect from July 1st this year. We have applied for and been granted a postponement of implementing this until end of this year, and we will then have a setup in place so that we also in the future can cater for customers that prefer our value proposition. Just to be clear about the future of the life business. Before summer, we announced that we are investigating various strategic alternatives for life, and we are progressing on this as planned. Please turn to slide 17 for the outlook for 2021. Based on the development that we have had in the second quarter, that is the strong development in the underlying business as well as few weather-related claims and a continued positive investment result.
We increased our full year guidance back in June. Following this, we have had two additional items that will influence on the result this year. Firstly, the extension of our partial internal model is adding DKK 64 million to our profit in non-life. This means that the new guidance for non-life is a pre-tax profit of DKK 800 million, i.e., up DKK 75 million compared to the guidance provided back in June. Secondly, other activities includes a vast amount of expenses related to the acquisition of Codan. That is both consultancy fees and warranty and indemnity insurance, as well as losses on non-listed equities and redemption of subordinated capital. Bottom line is that we change guidance for other activities to a loss of DKK 175 million, i.e., down DKK 75 million compared to the guidance provided back in June. No changes to guidance for life.
Consequently, our guidance for the group pre-tax profit stands at DKK 700 million -DKK 750 million, excluding any run-off results for the remainder of the year. Just to be clear, the cost rate in non-life is suspected to pick up a little compared to last year to between 17% and 17.5%. Regardless of this, the combined ratio is now expected to be around 87%, thus reflecting the increase in our earnings guidance. In total, our guidance reflects a business with all major parts moving as we would like them to. With this, I conclude my presentation and hand over the word to our moderator. Thank you.
Thank you. Ladies and gentlemen, if you have a question for the speakers, please press zero one on your telephone keypad. Please hold until we have the first question. The first question comes from Asbjørn Mørk at Danske Bank. Please go ahead. Your line is now open.
Hi, good morning, and congratulations on the good numbers, and thanks for taking my questions. I have a couple of questions on the operations side to begin, and then a little bit on the rights issue. If I may start on the actual non-life performance, the DKK 64 million of one-offs and then DKK 25 million of run-offs in Q2, and I guess weather ended up being a little bit better at the end of June versus your guidance. That basically gives me around 2 percentage points of improvements to your combined ratio, which is also what you're lowering your combined ratio target for this year. The question really being, how should we interpret this versus the June guidance upgrade?
I guess it means first that the summer has been [large] as expected, and secondly, it doesn't really seem to indicate any major changes to the outlook versus what you saw a couple of months back. Is that sort of correctly interpreted?
Hi, this is Andreas here. Yes, Asbjørn, I'd say that is correctly interpreted, to put it shortly.
Okay. On the growth in the non-life, premiums in private down again in Q2 and the same kind of happened in Q1. I understand your comments on the reopening and the sales process going into the second half. If I compare with the targets that you have for growth next year, it seems very much like corporate is delivering as we could have hoped or expected, but premiums in the private side, of course, much, much less. How should we look at the growth target for next year? Will that be completely dominated by the corporate, or should we expect the Sydbank and the other agreements to sort of mean that private will contribute their fair share of the growth?
Asbjørn, I think growth in commercials, we are very happy with that, very satisfied, and it's almost at par with what we expect for this year. It will also be somehow at that level expected next year. Growth in private, of course, we've discussed that for some quarters, is not satisfying. We need to see that the overall profitability also in private is very, very good. Now, of course, and we have worked with that for some quarters, is to find exactly the balance between profitable growth and a long-term proper relationship with the customers. That is what we're working on.
Coming into next year, private will also take their part of our growth, and it is exactly the partnerships with Sydbank, which has come in very, very good. We have received more than 11,000 leads in first half. It's on target. That will continue into second half and also the speed up of Semler Gruppen coming in. Please also have in mind that now the initiative we have launched in the partnership area with the customers in Sydbank will be very soon able to view their insurance policies in their bank app, so to say. It will definitely indicate for a change in the sales environment and the same goes for the Semler partnership.
We are very confident that also with the reopening of the society, growth next year will come both from private and corporate.
All right. That's very clear. A couple of questions on the transaction, hope that's okay. First, you mentioned, Rasmus, the Codan first half figures, which look pretty solid. First, do you have any more insights than just the announcement that came from them, or is it basically just you commenting on the press release yesterday? How does that compare to sort of the base case in your business model when you made the offer earlier this year? Just a little bit of a comment on that, please.
Andreas here. We're not able to bring a more specific numbers or splits at this point than what we have seen from Codan. I will say as much as I think the overall story here is that the numbers we're seeing are showing exactly the narrative that we talked into when we came out, which is that Codan has historically struggled, especially with elevated large claims and profitability in the commercial lines. There has been some, let's say, delay in when we would expect to see the full effect of the initiatives they already have in place. What we see in H1 is basically the traction we were expecting, and we are happy to see that.
To comment on the last part, I would say to put it roughly, actually it is a bit better than we had been planning for what we see in H1.
All right. That's very helpful. If I look at your slide five in today's presentation, I know that first of all, that you moved your Q3 reporting date one week forward. I guess that's because you want to get the transaction done as soon as possible. I see that you will have to wait for antitrust approval before you can actually do the rights issue. Just wondering why do you want to move that one week forward? Secondly, could you comment a bit on what the deal is subject to? I seem to be getting a little bit different communication from you and the seller in terms of what sort of clauses you have in terms of this agreement, whether you are still legally bounded to actually acquire the asset even if the antitrust turns down the deal.
A little bit of comment on that too, please.
I can say we moved it forward one week is simply to be more flexible in terms of the timing for the rest of the year. That is basically it. On your question, in terms of legally binding, we simply wait for the antitrust and the Danish FSA to come up with their approval of the deal. When that is done, then we can move on.
But for this-
Sorry, Asbjørn, just to supplement here. We're not waiting for these approvals in terms of when we can go out with the rights issue.
Okay, just this one, because theoretically, I agree that there shouldn't be any major issues with the antitrust. Theoretically, assuming that they turn down, so basically you won't be able to merge the two companies. Would you still legally be required to actually buy the asset, or will you be out of that deal, so to speak?
To put it roughly, I would say we bear the risk on the antitrust approval, and we will have to make the mitigating actions that they require to make this deal come through.
Okay. That was a very clear answer. My final question, basically, Rasmus, you said something about life insurance, the strategic options, I guess you referred to the June announcement. You didn't give us much more than that. Could you just give us a little bit more flavor on what has happened since June on that part?
Actually, I cannot give too much saying. We are just investigating possibilities, either for a sale or for keeping the assets and continue the good development in here. I think that is what we can give at the moment.
All right. That was all from my side. Thanks for taking my questions, and congratulations on the good numbers.
Thank you, Asbjørn.
Our next question comes from Martin Gregers Birk at Carnegie. Please go ahead. Your line is now open.
Well, thanks a lot. Just digging into some of the questions that we've already addressed. First of all, on premium growth, 1.7%, still struggling in the private area. I guess this is with you being born with 2% premium growth, to start with, and this is also you coming from easy comps giving that you have Semler and Sydbank somewhat up and running. There must be some kind of drift here. I mean, where is that coming from? Does that still come back to your distribution model or how should we think about this?
I can say that you are touching, I would say, the soft spot in our accounts this time. Please have in mind our distribution model which we have is a challenge, of course, under COVID-19. We have seen that. We had hoped for earlier reopening than what we have seen. We are struggling with that, and that's why we are so happy to see that now the society is opening. I think that is one thing. The cooperation with the Semler Gruppen is not really into our accounts yet, and it's not expected to be in our accounts yet. That we cannot really take anything from. Then you can say with Sydbank, it's very well underway. We are very happy it's on track, but of course it takes some time to get the premiums into our books.
There's a certain delay there of maybe around three months or so. All in all, I think we are pretty much on track. We have challenges in the distribution area, which we have discussed for some quarters now, but we are launching initiatives especially on price and certain geographical areas as well in order to make things more profitable, but also in order to increase sales.
Okay. Just to get sort of an underlying view of how your premiums are developing, if we are subtracting the Sydbank deal from this, what would the 1.7% be?
I don't have the figure here, but it would be a little bit lower.
How much is a little bit lower? Is it 50 basis points?
What is difficult, of course, is to see what is like the warm and the cold water. What is definitely with Sydbank would it not have come through if we had used the efforts on other things? I think it's difficult to say. What I can say is that we have received more than 11,000 leads and more than 50% of these we have harvested as new customers. We are pretty well- off in that area.
Okay. In terms of your distribution model, I guess, Rasmus, we have been discussing this now for quite some time. What if clients, they prefer to sit home and have Teams meetings opposed to having meetings in physical presence? Is that going to be a continued challenge on your distribution model?
No, but, of course, I think it's the new way that customers react, and we of course need to follow that. We have very strong outbound teams that are only working with meeting face-to-face via medias. Also some of our distribution people that are meeting people physically are now also able to take these meetings if a client wants it, a customer wants it instead do it also via iPads and all that. We are shifting, you can say, the very traditional model to a little bit more modern model as well. Then we are looking into, you can see the new and greater Alm. Brand with Codan coming in. There, I will say that then we will see a whole other distribution power, a more broad distribution power than what we have in, you can say old Alm. Brand today.
Okay. When we talk about, sorry to stick around this premium growth area, but is there an element of you being squeezed in sort of the Topdanmark, Nordea, Danske Bank client swap?
I think there's an element at the moment what we are facing, and I've said that for some quarters. In certain areas, there's a very fierce price competition. You can say that is an element of changing provider. In our case, Topdanmark was the former provider for Sydbank, and of course, they're not just letting customers go. We see a very fierce price competition in that area, and that is just one case among others.
Okay. If we look one year forward, that number was supposed to be— well, the number next year is supposed to be or was supposed to be 5%, now it's 4%-5% premium growth. Why is that not going to be 2.5% or 3%? What are sort of the building blocks from the 1.5%-2% up to the 4%-5%? I sit back with an impression that you need a great deal of tailwind to make this happen.
I think if you look at our business is 50/50 commercial and private, with what we see in the commercial side, we have 4%-5%. With all the initiatives we have in our book, the turnaround we have made, we were very far down last year in the commercial side. It's picked up. We are doing all the right things. We are meeting customers. We're expanding a bit on the size of the customers we are meeting. We are getting an inflow from Sydbank, which is a very strong commercial bank and all that. The commercial side, I'm very happy about, and it may be that they can do more than 5%. That is half. The other half is the private part.
I think we talked a bit about it already, but all the pricing initiatives we have, Sydbank coming in, Semler coming up, I'm quite confident that we will be in the upper range of this.
Okay. All right. Thank you. I would like to continue with a couple of questions on life. I guess the announcement that you made on, I guess it was the 13th of June, regarding the strategic initiatives, usually when an announcement like this comes out, a sale seems to be imminent. We haven't really seen anything yet. Is there no way that you can give any kind of insight into this? I assume that you want to have a sale in place before the rights issue commences. Is that fair to assume?
I cannot give any comment on that, Martin.
Okay. From a buyer's perspective of your life insurance business, what's the value proposition here? You have a business that is struggling on premium growth. You have a health and accident business that is profit-making, which probably also means that or could suggest the prices are too high. Finally, you have a very old legacy IT system, which could also signal rather large implementation costs from a buyer. I'm sort of struggling to get my head around this. Is there any way that you can help me here?
I don't know. I don't share your views on all your statements. I think we have good growth in the life company. It is of, course, a little bit demanding at the moment with COVID-19 and with the kind of customers we have in life, being smaller customers which are struggling a bit with the liquidity, and therefore they can stop the premiums at the moment. Otherwise, I think we have a fair amount of growth here. I also think we're driving a very profitable life company, the most profitable, at least I know. There are things we can do in order to improve profitability if we really wanted it. Now, we are driving this as a going concern, and we will continue to do that. Over the many years, it's been driven very cost effective.
You are right, we have a legacy system. It's old, but it's running, and it's very easy to change. You can say, is that good or bad? At the moment, I think it's actually quite good with all the demanding actions coming from FSA. We can incorporate that in systems, because we can do that fairly easy because it's well known. Of course, you can put a negative or positive, but I think we have a very good asset and a very attractive asset as well.
Okay. Let's assume that you're going to stick with your life company because you can't get the multiple that you want. What kind of imminent levers would there be to push up profits in your life company?
I think I will not get back into that right now. What we see now is a very good bottom- line, so to say, in life, which we are happy with, and that can maybe increase a bit. For now, it's steady business. It's good business, and it's a profitable business.
S elling the life company, isn't that a vital tool in order to complete this Codan transaction?
No.
Of course, you can live without it, but it would be easier with money in the bank to pull it off.
No, it has nothing to do with each other. You can say what we are aiming for, if something, is to have a more streamlined group. That's also why we sold off the bank last year, in order only to focus on non-life. With Codan coming in, we get twice as big in non-life. Life will be an even smaller percentage of the total group. I think that is the most important thing.
Okay. Very clear. Just a final question for bookkeeping. The DKK -125 million, what's the split here on the different components?
I think I can try to help you out there. The main components are, as we've already touched upon, cost related to Codan.
How much is that?
I'd say it's about DKK 90 million, as we also put in the H1 statement. That covers, just to be clear, the total amount of costs we expect from these types of transaction costs for 2021. We have had some adverse developments. We had a single unlisted equity, called the Bella Hospitality Group, which you can go in and if you followed that story, the existing investors basically were written down to zero following their cancel rates recently. That explains most of the difference up to the total number.
Okay. All right. Appreciate it. Thank you so much.
You're welcome.
Our next question comes from Per Grønborg at SEB. Please go ahead. Your line is now open.
Thank you. I think I will limit myself to three or four questions. First of all, the big picture, it looks like Q2 underlying is just as good as Q1 underlying was bad, at least on the numbers we can see. Is this pure luck, unluck? Are there other drivers we should be aware of?
Hi, Per. This is not luck. It is, as you say, the underlying business we're talking into here. If you adjust for COVID-19, we're almost 4 percentage points better in terms of underlying combined. I would say that is the effect from the profitability initiatives we've had in place, both in terms of securing the right premium versus risk levels, but also I would say the continued improvements we see in the claims handling area, with increasing ambitions also for this year. We start to see the effects there. As we've touched upon earlier, we're also able to deliver costs in order with our expectations. I think it's definitely something that reflects the underlying improvements.
What you're telling me is that if Q2 was not luck, then Q1 was not bad luck either.
Right.
Q1 was just very bad management, and now all your initiatives-
No.
... started working in one same quarter. That sounds-
No, but I'm just saying that-
... a bit strange.
I know. I can follow you that way. We have to obviously be careful over-interpreting on single quarters. I think that's a general statement.
Okay. That was exactly what you did, and that was what I asked about. Is it fair to say that there was a portion of unluck in the first quarter and also a portion of luck in the second quarter?
That's fair enough.
Okay. Thank you. Just on the approval process, I assume you still are in Phase I process. Is that correct?
Yeah. That is correct.
When do you expect to have delivered the final papers for the authority for them to have their 25 days to make their Phase I decision?
I think we're not quite ready to commit to a specific date there, Per. As we state here also, it will be in Q4.
Does this imply that if it goes to Phase II, then the [rights issue] might be postponed to 2022?
We're not the rights issue, if that's what you're asking about.
If you haven't finalized Phase I yet, then they have 25 working days. If they push it into Phase II, then it sounds like it would be hard to actually get the approval before, at the earliest, very late in Q4. If we go into Phase II. Of course, we don't know whether they will need a Phase II, but taking into account they needed a Phase II for Tryg, so it probably can be ruled out they also need a Phase II for this deal.
I agree on that, Per.
Okay, perfect. To Codan's numbers, you state that you had limited insight. Last time we talked about Codan Denmark, the story was that there were a lot of large claims in 2020. That seems to have been a key driver of the impressive improvement they seem to have delivered. What's your perception? Is the large claims level in the first half now at a normal level, or are we still above, or have we ended up below a normalized level? Do you have any insight to that?
I would say it's a bit hard to comment on exactly, also given that we're not able to provide the absolute levels at this point in time. I would say it's slightly elevated to what I would consider a normal level, but not far from it.
But still-
With respect to the business they run at present.
Still a bit above what you would perceive to be a normal level in the first half.
Likely. Yeah.
Okay. Last time we also talked about Codan, to solve the large claims issue, they need to do some pruning there. It's a bit surprising to see that they actually grow their premiums quite nicely. What happened to the pruning story of Codan? Has that been canceled, or is it still to come?
I'm a bit limited by what numbers I can give you at this point, Per. I would say, again, this is earned premiums, obviously to get a clear picture of where we are at this point in time, we'll probably go to look at written premiums. To put it softly, I would say that would probably closer reflect the story of still some pruning being made.
We should still expect some pruning to happen on the portfolio.
Yes.
Okay. Very final. The model approvals have now come through in non-life. There is nothing pending in the life. Is that correct?
Yeah.
Perfect. Thank you.
As a reminder, if you would like to ask a question, please press zero one on your telephone keypad. We haven't received further questions at this point. I will hand back to the speakers.
Thank you very much for joining us, and thank you for the very good questions. I'll talk to you later. Thank you for today.