Commerzbank AG (ETR:CBK)
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Earnings Call: Q2 2021

Aug 4, 2021

Operator

Good morning, ladies and gentlemen, welcome to the Commerzbank AG conference call. Please note that this call is being transmitted as well as recorded by audio webcast and will subsequently be made available for replay on the internet. At this time, all participants have been placed on a listen-only mode, and the floor will be open for questions following Manfred Knof's and Bettina Orlopp's presentation. Let me now turn the floor over to our CEO, Manfred Knof.

Manfred Knof
CEO, Commerzbank AG

Good morning and welcome to our earnings call for the second quarter of this year. I will provide you with the overview of the strategic and financial development before Bettina will guide you through the details of the financial performance. Overall, we have made good progress in the strategic transformation of the bank and reached a solid operating result of EUR 570 million in the first half of the year. Q2 standalone came in with an operating result of EUR 32 million. It benefits from the benign risk result and from our robust client-facing business but has been burdened by significant one-off items. I would like to stress that these one-off burdens and also the booking of further EUR 511 million restructuring charges have not impacted our sustained strong CET1 ratio of 13.4%.

Thus, we can confirm our financial outlook for 2021, including a slightly more positive view on our risk result and capital. Also, our cost guidance of EUR 6.5 billion for 2021 is operationally still valid. On top, however, we have to account for EUR 200 million extraordinary write-off, on which we have released an ad hoc statement two weeks ago. On the Strategy transformation of the bank, we have made good progress in line with our plan and effectively tackled upcoming issues. Let me be crisp and clear. The execution of our Strategy is on track, and I make sure that any roadblocks are removed ASAP, be it the Federal Court of Justice ruling on pricing changes or the malfunctioning of a large project. This leads me to the next slide and recent key topics on our management agenda. Firstly, we have reached further key milestones in the transformation.

With the appointment of 300 level two managers, we have reduced the number of positions by 27% and completed the selection of the senior management team. This team is going to be the backbone for the transformation of Commerzbank, and I'm looking forward to working together with this group. Furthermore, we have already concluded almost 50% of the detailed negotiations with the Works Council. The recently started offering of overall 1,700 voluntary redundancies shows good response from employees. Secondly, we had to handle the Federal Court ruling on fee changes, which basically declared recent pricing actions as invalid. We immediately set up a task force to tackle the issue. On the one hand, we had to identify the amount of reimbursements to customers and book the provision of €66 million.

On the other hand, we had to define a process going forward that ensures the continued rollout of our planned pricing measures. This includes the solicitation of active consent with the current pricing for products such as current accounts or securities accounts. We expect some temporary revenue losses in the next month. We are confident to compensate this shortfall and keep our revenue guidance. Thirdly, we stopped the outsourcing projects for security settlement. The implementation risk would have been too high and the benefits too small in a market environment with strongly increasing transaction volumes providing internal economies of scale. This decision stands for the clear focus on the transformation of our bank. Such a large project that does bottom line not contribute to the strategic plan must not eat up scarce resources. Put it this way, we take necessary decisions even if they are painful.

There is no way of muddling through. Our transformation towards our targets in 2024 requires strict focus and clear decisions. Now, let's move on with the view on all four cornerstones of our strategy. Regarding digitalization, I would like to highlight that the team is really fast in delivering new functionalities. We have added 10 new major client features in the quarter.

Especially the enhancement of our mobile app stands out, which now allows for the mobile purchase of security savings plans, including ETFs. This will further support the strong growth in this product category. On sustainability, we have accelerated our efforts to seize the opportunities from the increasing client demand for sustainable products. After roughly EUR 100 billion at the end of last year, volumes stand at EUR 141 billion as of Q2. Based on that, we feel very comfortable to reach our target of EUR 300 billion by 2025.

On the slide, you can also see the drill down of our target with Corporate Clients accounting for EUR 200 and Private and Small-Business Customers accounting for EUR 100 billion in sustainable business volume. Overall, it is of utmost importance that we support our Corporate Clients in their transformation process. We believe it is better to finance the path towards a greener economy rather than withdrawing from certain clients right from the beginning.

In Private Clients, let me point out that since March this year, more than EUR 30 billion of securities volumes qualify as sustainable products according to the Sustainable Finance Disclosure Regulation. Finally, I would like to provide you with an update on the development of our operational transformation KPIs. In Corporate Clients, our efforts to increase RWA efficiencies show further results. In the second quarter, we have reduced client business in the low-yielding bucket from 33% to 31%.

Here, our strict management approach using list of single client names pays off. We have reduced the portfolio in the low-yielding bucket by EUR 2.2 billion RWAs or 65 client groups, respectively. In PSBC, we accelerate the closure of branches by additional 40 branches this year. Hence, we will have 550 branches and three remote advisory centers when we start into 2022 and close a further 100 branches in the course of next year. Of course, it is still early days in the transformation of the business model, and it remains to be seen how the churn evolves. In the redundancy program, we have also made further progress.

From the planned gross reduction of overall 10,000 FTEs, 3,400 are already off payroll or have signed the contract to leave. On the other hand, we are hiring 2,500 FTEs and nearshoring stands for a large share of this number. Our location in Sofia is now fully operational and is step-by-step taking over tasks for much more expensive external consultants in Germany. All in all, our transformation is well on track, and we are completely focused on the further execution of the strategy. Stumbling blocks will be tackled and removed to make sure that we head towards our targets. Let me now hand over to Bettina who will provide you with a more granular look into the financials of the second quarter.

Bettina Orlopp
CFO, Commerzbank AG

Thank you, Manfred, and also good morning from my side. I will walk you through the financials before we move into Q&A. Let's start with the overview on Slide 8 . As Manfred already stated, we had a good performance in our customer businesses in line with our expectations. The underlying net interest income is unchanged to the first quarter. Commission income continues the good trend with +7% compared to Q2 2020. This is testament to the viability of our business model. The risk result came in at a low EUR 87 million. This reflects the high asset quality of our portfolio. I want to stress that we did not benefit from the release of our COVID-related Top-Level Adjustment. It remains unchanged at EUR 495 million. Costs have been managed in line with our targets, with the exception of the extraordinary write-off.

This write-off has been one of several one-off items in the quarter that have reduced the operating result to EUR 32 million. I will cover these in more detail later on. We also booked the vast majority of remaining restructuring charges in the quarter. The net result amounts to negative EUR 527 million. We maintained our strong capital ratio, which stood unchanged at 13.4% at the end of the quarter. Following the issuance of an AT1 instrument in June, the buffer to MDA increased further to nearly 400 basis points. Let's briefly look at Slide 9 at the year-to-date view. Revenues are above previous year's level with benefit from the TLTRO offset by other one-offs and despite the ongoing drag from the rates environment. The operating result improved to EUR 570 million due to better revenues and a significantly lower risk result.

The net result reflects the EUR 976 million restructuring charges we have booked for the implementation of our Strategy 2024. As the quarterly results have been strongly affected by one-off bookings, we have broken down the effects on Slide 10. As mentioned, the quarter was overall negatively impacted by one-off events. In aggregate, they reduced the underlying operating result from EUR 208 million to EUR 32 million. The one-offs can be separated in two buckets. The first is the usual exceptional revenue items that add up to minus EUR 22 million. TLTRO benefits of EUR 42 million were more than offset by the EUR 66 million provision for the German Federal Court of Justice ruling on fee changes, where we will have to reimburse some fees to our customers. The second bucket contained three significant one-offs in the underlying result, adding up to minus EUR 154 million.

On the positive side, CommerzVentures contributed EUR 101 million, on the negative side, mBank increased reserves for Swiss franc loans by CHF 55 million. As mentioned, we have also booked a one-time write-off of EUR 200 million for the stop of the security settlement outsourcing project. In addition, we have booked a double-digit million provision associated with the write-off but have not separated this out. Let's jump over Page 11 with the exceptional revenue items and quickly look at Slide 12 on CommerzVentures. CommerzVentures continued to contribute to revenues. The IPO of the portfolio investment company Marqeta has led to the revaluation of our holding. We have not taken the full valuation in the Q2 results but have applied a prudent discount to reflect the fact that we currently cannot sell our stake. Also, the increased valuation of Bought By Many, following a funding round, has contributed.

While obviously uncertain and setbacks always a possibility, we expect further upside in the second half of the year. Given our good experience and track record, we plan to continue investing in startups and will most likely increase the funds made available to CommerzVentures by setting up a third fund. We will report on the progress in the next quarters. Slide 13 gives an overview of the restructuring charges. We booked EUR 511 million in Q2, slightly lower than originally anticipated, as we have not yet fulfilled all formal requirements to book the restructuring charges in some foreign locations. The majority of the remaining around EUR 170 million will be booked in the second half of the year. Slide 14 shows the overall group P&L with revenues by line item, excluding exceptional revenues. The impact of one-off items is especially visible in other income and the operating expenses.

I will cover NCI and NII in more detail on the next two slides, starting with net commission income. PSBC Germany and also mBank have strongly increased commission income by overall 14% year on year. This has been driven by the strong securities business in Germany. While trading volumes have not been as high as in the exceptional first quarter, securities and custody have significantly increased. Commission income in Corporate Clients is slightly lower due to a slower bond and syndication business. The payment business is still affected by the pandemic. This leads us to NII and Slide 16, where we show the underlying interest income excluding TLTRO benefits. As expected, underlying NII has been on the same level as the previous quarter. In PSBC, NII growth in mBank and loan growth in Germany have offset the drag from deposits.

German loan margins have been broadly stable for both private and corporate customers. Lower volumes in Corporate Customers in line with our strategy have led to a slight decline in NII. For the rest of the year, we continue to expect the underlying NII, excluding the TLTRO benefit, to remain roughly at the current level. Let's carry on with costs on Slide 17. We managed our operating expenses in line with our full-year target. While we continued to invest in our digital transformation, spending around EUR 270 million of the planned EUR 600 million in 2021 in the first half, we reduced administrative expenses. We kept the burden from compulsory contributions on the level of last year by using payment commitments to compensate for higher contributions due to deposit growth and the Greensill Bank insolvency.

While the operational cost management delivered as planned, we had to book the unforeseen one-time write-off of EUR 200 million due to the project termination. To be absolutely clear, this is a burden on the 2021 cost base, but it will not impact our strategic cost measures and midterm targets. Let's move to Slide 18 and the risk result. With EUR 87 million, the risk result is the lowest since the start of the pandemic and reflects the resilience of our loan book with largely stable ratings and a low number of defaults in the quarter. This is also clearly visible in the cost of risk on loans, which stands at a low 18 basis points in the first half.

While the first half was clearly very encouraging, the trajectory of the pandemic, with the still unknown effects of the virus variants and the possibility of a fourth wave later in the year, cannot be predicted with certainty. An increase in pandemic-driven defaults can't be ruled out for the second half of the year or possibly next year after government support measures have ended. The EUR 495 million top-level adjustment remains unchanged. We will continue to review the top-level adjustment quarter by quarter. Let's carry on with the operating segments and let me start with Private and Small-Business Customers on the next two slides. We have continued to see a strong increase in securities volumes by EUR 11 billion in the quarter. Of these, EUR 3 billion were net new money invested in securities.

The trend that Germans invest more in securities continues and should continue in an overall friendly market environment. Mortgage volumes also continued to increase in the quarter at a steady pace and as planned. In contrast, the consumer finance business has been flat. Given the still high savings rate due to the pandemic, we do not expect a significant change in customer behavior in the near term. In the deposit business, we have made good progress in the quarter. We managed to reduce the overall volume of deposits and increase the volume of deposits subject to pricing to EUR 13 billion. So far, we have signed agreements for deposits above €100,000. From August on, deposits above €50,000 from new clients will be priced. We will also apply this threshold to new agreements with existing customers.

Deposit pricing has helped to somewhat reduce the ongoing drag from deposits, but it is not enough to fully compensate for the effects from the interest rate environment on deposit-related income. Overall, we expect the contribution from deposit agreements to be around EUR 50 million in 2021. As Manfred mentioned, we are currently obtaining active consent from our private customers to our fee structure, as required by the German Federal Court of Justice, ruling on changes in fees for banking services. However, given the good overall development of customer business, we expect to reach our revenue targets for the financial year. This brings me to the performance of PSBC on Page 20.

PSBC reached an operating result of EUR 138 million, up nearly 30% year-on-year, despite significant one-off bookings based on stable customer revenues and a low-risk result. Looking at underlying revenues year-on-year, these were up by 3% in Germany, driven by the strong performance of the German securities business. This, together with loan growth, compensated for the drag from deposits. We also had some revenue attrition from customer churn, as expected with the implementation of our strategy. So far, this churn has been lower than anticipated, both in terms of number of customers and revenues lost. The departing customers had, on average, not contributed much to revenues, meaning we have lost the right customers so far. mBank has also performed well in a challenging interest rate environment, with underlying revenues on the same level as last year, excluding the addition of legal reserves for Swiss franc mortgages.

The addition of EUR 55 million to mBank's legal reserves is mainly driven by higher than expected new court cases and changes in loss levels in case of mBank losing cases. The sitting of the Supreme Court of Poland on Swiss mortgages that has been scheduled for early September will be important. We hope this will bring more clarity and allow mBank and the whole Polish banking system to establish a workable solution. Let's move to Corporate Clients on the next two slides. In Corporate Clients, we have continued our active portfolio and RWA efficiency management. While volumes in Mittelstand have slightly increased, we reduced volumes with international corporates in line with strategy. This has led to an increase of the average RWA efficiency to 5%.

In the next quarters, we do not expect a further improvement in RWA efficiency as there are some adjustments to the regulatory models, including from TRIM. While lower volumes in line with strategy reduced credit risk RWA, this was offset by higher RWA resulting from model adjustments. As the first changes only became effective at the end of the quarter, they did not yet have a notable impact on the average RWA efficiency. In the deposit business, we have seen a strong increase in volumes from our customers. The increased volume has been fully priced, thereby ensuring no negative impact on profitability. We currently charge our corporate customer 50 basis points, while we partially charge higher rates to institutional clients. We are planning to also introduce higher rates for large corporate deposits beyond our thresholds to ensure that these deposits are not a drag on P&L.

Overall, we expect to see the contribution from pricing to increase from around EUR 150 million in 2020 to around EUR 200 million this year, offsetting our cost to hold these deposits. Underlying revenues are around 4% lower year-on-year. This is mainly due to lower revenues from international corporates in line with the strategy. Mittelstand could increase revenues by 3%, with revenue contributions across all product areas. With a significantly improved risk result and lower costs, Corporate Clients reached an operating result of EUR 244 million. Let's move to Slide 23 and the development of Others and Consolidation. The operating loss of EUR 349 million in Others and Consolidation is driven by exceptional items. These are reflected in the fair value and other income line, as well as the operating expenses, where the write-off from the stop of the outsourcing project is booked.

While we had positive contributions from CommerzVentures to the fair value result, these were offset by valuation effects, largely driven by moves in basis spreads, reversing some of the corresponding gains from the first quarter. Other income includes the usual items like effect from hedge accounting, also increased provisions. These provisions include related to the stop of the outsourcing project and potential tax claims for prior years. Based on the H1 results of EUR -158 million, assuming that we can receive TLTRO benefits as well as some contributions from CommerzVentures in the second half, an operating result of Others and Consolidation of around 0 for the full year could be achievable. Of course, the result could also be affected by changes in valuations over the course of the second half. Let's move to Slide 24 and the risk-weighted assets. Quarter-on-quarter, RWAs were overall slightly reduced.

This is driven by reduced volumes with Corporate Clients. The reduction has been partially offset by increases at mBank and regulatory effects. Operational risk RWA increased due to changes in the loss database. In the next quarter, we expect a further increase. As mentioned before, we also anticipate a regulatory-driven increase in credit risk RWA from TRIM and adjustment of models. Regulatory capital decreased slightly, mainly due to the net loss. Overall, the CET1 ratio remained at 13.4% and provides us with a comfortable buffer of 400 basis points to MDA. Now let me wrap up the financials of the quarter. Q2 was burdened by one-offs, and this is clearly visible in the results. At the same time, the underlying business and strategy implementation have developed well, and this is reflected in our outlook on Slide 25.

Based on the premise that there will be no extraordinary burden from Swiss franc mortgages in the course of the year, these are our updated objectives and expectations for 2021. Given the strong first half results, revenues should slightly exceed the 2020 figure. With further progress of the transformation, we maintain our target of an operational cost base of around EUR 6.5 billion. In addition, we have the EUR 200 million one-time write-off booked this quarter. While uncertainty of further development of the pandemic remains, based on current observations and assuming an unchanged top-level adjustment, we improve our guidance and expect a risk result below EUR 1 billion. This assumes that the current wave of the pandemic will not have a further adverse effect on some sectors. Given the aforementioned, we expect a positive operating result.

Based on the first half result and considering the expected regulatory-driven RWA increases, a CET1 ratio of around 13% is likely. Thank you very much for your attention. Manfred and I are now very happy to take your questions.

Operator

Ladies and gentlemen, we will now begin with the question-and-answer round. If you would like to ask a question, please press nine followed by the star key on your telephone. After pressing nine star one time on your telephone, you will hear an automatic announcement over the phone. To withdraw your question, please press nine star again. Please give in the key combination nine star one time only to raise a question. The first question for today comes from Benjamin Goy, who's calling from Deutsche Bank. Over to you.

Benjamin Goy
Analyst, Deutsche Bank

Yes. Hi, good morning. Two questions, please. One on mBank and one on fees. Starting with mBank, I think it's core for your 2024 guidance and in particular on the revenue growth. I was wondering when we get more details on how the EUR 600 million is split, and also whether you could comment on these press reports in June that it might not be core going forward anymore. Secondly, on fees, you mentioned the temporary impact from the active content. Maybe you can quantify it and staying with fees, retail brokerage, it's up 12% in the first half year. Maybe you can give us an indication how this looked Q2 versus Q1 in terms of growth rate. Thank you.

Bettina Orlopp
CFO, Commerzbank AG

Thank you, Benjamin. I start with mBank. If you look on the numbers and you need to keep in mind that interest rate environment in mBank looked still very different in the second quarter of 2020 because the sharp decline basically happened in the second quarter in Poland. I think they have shown a very good result, and they continue this trend. In the moment, they see strong growth across their customer groups, across all product groups, and that's also the basis for their assumptions until 2024. This is basically also based on the customer base they have, a very young one, growing one. It's growth across the group and that at a very low customer churn ratio.

Overall, we are very confident that they will achieve the targets, specifically because there are clear signals, given inflation in Poland, that there will be interest rates and increases earlier than you would expect for the rest of Europe. That's on mBank. On fees, we now booked the provisioning of the EUR 66 million. That's definitely backward-looking and also take into account the fees which we have now booked and will rebook to our clients since the ruling end of April. We miss this year a lower double-digit revenue, or we will see a double-digit revenue impact on that, because we assume that we will only see the price model increases next year. However, given the overall very good customer business development, we will stick to our revenue plans in private clients. Yep.

Benjamin Goy
Analyst, Deutsche Bank

Thank you. Sorry, just quickly on the retail brokerage fees. Plus 12%, but I assume some slowdown in Q2. Can you contrast the developments here so as well as Q1?

Bettina Orlopp
CFO, Commerzbank AG

We said that already after Q1 that nobody should expect Q1 to be repeated because it was exceptionally high. I think it's better and more fair to compare your net commission income and private clients with the previous quarters and also Q2 2020, and there you see that we have a continued trend of increased net commission income, regardless whether you take Q2, Q3, Q4 of 2020. Q1 2021 was clearly an exceptional, but we see strong growth in the securities business.

Benjamin Goy
Analyst, Deutsche Bank

Awesome. Thank you.

Operator

Thank you. The next question comes from Izabel Dobreva who's calling from Morgan Stanley. Over to you.

Izabel Dobreva
Analyst, Morgan Stanley

Hello. Good morning. Thank you very much for taking my questions. I have two of them. My first question is on the Corporate Clients division. If I look at the net interest income in the division, it's down about 11% year-on-year, and also the fees are down about 4% year-on-year. I wanted to ask you how much of that is due to the restructuring program? I think at the Capital Markets Day, you quantified about EUR 300 million of revenue attrition. Of that amount, how much is in the run rate so far? If you can give us a number, that would be very helpful. My second question is on capital return. Capital is now solid at 13.5% nearly, and you have taken the bulk of the restructuring charges. There is also the EUR 500 million of top-level adjustment in the back pocket.

With all of this in mind, what are your views on starting the capital return early in 2022, perhaps in share buybacks? Are you open to it, and if not, what are the obstacles in your mind? Thank you.

Bettina Orlopp
CFO, Commerzbank AG

Thank you, Isabel. On Corporate Clients, as you rightfully said, there are what you basically see are the first effects of the strategy implementation. Mittelstand is up year-on-year by 3%. That's exactly like planned. We would even like to see more. We all know that Mittelstand is still very cautious with respect to their investment programs. Specifically, international corporates have been down. There are 2 reasons for that. One is that if you compare Q2 2020 with this year's quarter, we had a very strong bond issuance quarter last year due to the pandemic, and that has not been repeated this year.

Also it follows our strategy that we exit some locations, that we exit certain clients with an insufficient RWA efficiency, and that is specifically attached to international corporates. I think it's tough to say out of the EUR 300 million, how much you see already. Unfortunately, probably not everything, given that the sale of our locations and the rundown is still to come. You will see more in specifically 2022, I would assume. On the second question, capital return, I know 13.4% is a very nice number, specifically given that we now have booked nearly EUR 2 billion of restructuring costs and still stick to 13.4% because that's exactly the number we had last year. I know that this creates increasing questions about share buybacks, dividends, et cetera. I think we should really make progress first on the restructuring, on the transformation.

We should show decent operating results, decent net income. If this is the case in 2022, I'm pretty sure we will also start a debate on dividends and capital share buyback.

Operator

Thank you. Moving on to the next question. Next up is Jeremy Sigee, who's calling from Exane BNP Paribas. Over to you.

Jeremy Sigee
Analyst, Exane BNP Paribas

Thank you. Two questions, please. The first one, really just following on from the previous one about capital. I just wondered if you expect any change in capital requirement after the recent stress tests and the possibly heavier Pillar 2, P2G requirement, following on from that and from your results in the stress test. Second question on a different topic, operating costs. If I look at the costs in the divisions, you're up slightly in PSBC and you're down quite nicely in CC Corporate Clients. I just wondered if you could put those developments on costs in the divisions in the context of your medium-term plans. Are you happy with the underlying reductions that you're achieving relative to your medium-term plans? Are you ahead of plan in Corporate Clients? That looked like quite a good number.

If you could just talk about the cost trends in divisions, that'd be great.

Bettina Orlopp
CFO, Commerzbank AG

Okay. Let me start with the 1st question on P2G. You will have seen that we have been classified for the 2nd bucket, which means that P2G will be in the range of 50-200 basis points. In the moment, we do not say where we are. Most likely that will change. We'll see how things are developing. I can assure you that we feel pretty relaxed on that we do not believe that we will be at the lower or upper end of this range. I would rather expect something which is very nicely in the middle of that. On the 2nd question, operating costs. The costs are developing absolutely according to plan in the moment. Why is PSBC slightly higher? 2 reasons for that.

We have seen tariff increases, which just have an immediate effect, and the voluntary programs, et cetera, will only show off by the end of the year, and we plan that. The second thing is we integrated Comdirect, and by the integration of Comdirect, we saw first an increase in HR-related cost because of the fact that employees of Comdirect were integrated in our tariff system, to say it like that, tariff model of Commerzbank. That's the key reason. That is also according to plan. We have clearly calculated that into our plans. You will see the reductions also on the private client side in the course of the next months and years.

Everything really as we plan, and we would expect that by the end of the year, we will most likely have already find solutions or have people left of more than 5,000 out of the 10,000.

Jeremy Sigee
Analyst, Exane BNP Paribas

Thank you. On the Corporate Clients side, it looks, if anything, better than expected. Is that real? Is that recurring, that lower cost level in Corporate Clients?

Bettina Orlopp
CFO, Commerzbank AG

Corporate Clients has clear targets, and they are a little bit ahead of plan. We hope that this will continue, but we should also keep in mind that some of the cost items you would normally see in Corporate Clients are a little bit depressed due to the pandemic, travel costs and stuff like that. Overall, we are very satisfied with the development of the costs in Corporate Clients.

Jeremy Sigee
Analyst, Exane BNP Paribas

Okay. Thank you very much.

Operator

Thank you. Next up, we have Nicholas Herman calling from Citigroup. Please go ahead.

Nicholas Herman
Analyst, Citigroup

Yes. Good morning. Thanks for taking my questions. 3 from me, please. 1 on NII reference here. Do you mind just providing a breakdown of that outlook by division, PSBC, Germany mBank, Corporate Clients, and O&C? 2nd, you announced the portfolio with RWA efficiency less than 3%. That's ahead of your target. Continue pushing that down this year?

Operator

Mr. Herman, I'm afraid we didn't quite catch most of the question there because of your connection. Could you repeat your questions, please?

Nicholas Herman
Analyst, Citigroup

Hello? Hello, can you hear me?

Bettina Orlopp
CFO, Commerzbank AG

It was tough to understand you, Nicholas. I think the first question I got, it's the outlook by division on NII. The second one I think was on RWA efficiency bucket, whether we believe that we will be even come down further than the 31% we currently have and reduce this share of less than 3% even further. We just wait for your third question.

Nicholas Herman
Analyst, Citigroup

Sorry about that. Third question is on capital. Would you be willing to disclose approximately what CET1 ratio you were expecting at the end of 2022 as part of the plan that you announced back in February? Thank you. That would be helpful.

Bettina Orlopp
CFO, Commerzbank AG

On NII our expectations is overall that it will be flattish in comparison to H1. If I split that now by PSBC and CC, I would say PSBC should be slightly up because we expect stable margins loans slightly up, and we also expect some upside from the deposit facility fee, and clearly also mBank will contribute to that. NII on Corporate Clients might be lower slightly, just because of the fact that we continue our RWA efficiency program, and that will show effects on our NII. That also basically is a perfect fit for the second question. We continue our RWA efficiency measures, meaning that we do not stop now at the level we are currently, just because we have already surpassed the target for this year. How much we come down, we'll see. Definitely also depends on what's up for prolongation, things like that.

The third thing, a prediction on capital ratio end of 2022. Honestly, Nicholas, I'm happy to give you a forecast for this year and as you have seen, we increased it to 13% and I feel very comfortable on that. I will not do any prediction on the capital ratio now for the end of next year.

Nicholas Herman
Analyst, Citigroup

Just to clarify, the last question was more just as part of the plan. Obviously, the world is different now. I'm not asking for your current prediction. It was just what the previous prediction was.

Bettina Orlopp
CFO, Commerzbank AG

The previous prediction was basically, we started to say that we would be this year around 12%-13%. We always planned to have a full booking of the restructuring costs in 2021, meaning that in 2022 we expected already a decent operating result, but also clearly positive net income, which would then also have a positive effect on the capital ratio.

Nicholas Herman
Analyst, Citigroup

Fair enough. Thank you very much. That's really helpful.

Operator

Thank you. The next question for today comes from Anke Reingen, who's calling from RBC. Over to you.

Anke Reingen
Analyst, RBC Capital Markets

Thank you very much. Good morning for taking my question. Just firstly on the cancellation of the outsourcing. I just wanted to make sure, EUR 200 million is not insignificant in terms of impairment, that you stick to your original plan of bringing costs down on absolute basis year by year as you announced last year. I think at the time you announced the EUR 200 million charge, you also talked about a legal provision and other income. I don't think you specified this one as a one-off, I just wonder if you can give us some broad indication. Then secondly, on the court ruling. How does it work in practice? People need to actively consent. Is there a risk that it actually becomes more of an issue as it currently suggests?

Just in terms of the benefit you were indicating in your strategic plan last year, is it basically part of the EUR 300 million fee uplift you were indicating, but that's not only because of the higher fees? Just if you can give a bit more indication about the potential risk from the ruling to your plan. Thank you very much.

Manfred Knof
CEO, Commerzbank AG

Yeah. Hi, Anke. You are absolutely right. The EUR 200 million is not insignificant. I think I had a very deep look into the project and when we discussed that into the board in detail, and we found that it's better now to stop it and to take a hit now, also because of the changes that the business is now stronger and we feel comfortable to do it internally. You are absolutely right. It has an impact on the cost base for this year, but operationally, all our plans and transformation efforts are in plan and for the midterm, we are fully on plan also with regard to the costs. On the court ruling, you have asked how is that really working.

It's clear that the automatic increases is not possible, so we are now with the clients going for an individual consent, either digital or in the branches in a one-on-one consent. That's why it takes time, but I can assure you that we are already working and are in contact with our clients to negotiate an individual pricing model and to ask for the consent. So far, the reactions of the customers are good. For the large amount, it is not a problem for the customers to agree on an individual consent on the pricing measures, also offering new accounts.

Bettina Orlopp
CFO, Commerzbank AG

Perhaps on your first question, legal provisioning. Yes, there is something embedded under other income. We didn't reveal that. It's clear if you end a contract with a partner, there are costs attached to it. I can only say that it is a double-digit million amount, and leave it for now and you will understand why. On the second point. The EUR 300 million uplift, which we calculated in our plans, this is still valid. As I said, it has a short-term impact this year, which is balanced out by better customer business overall in PSBC. We expect that we will get the consent of the clients within this year, and therefore there is no change of plans with respect to revenues and also revenue increases due to price model changes for the coming years.

Anke Reingen
Analyst, RBC Capital Markets

Okay. Thank you.

Operator

Thank you. Next up, we have Johannes Thormann, who's calling from HSBC. Over to you.

Johannes Thormann
Analyst, HSBC

Good morning, everybody. Johannes Thormann, HSBC. Two follow-up questions and one other, please. First of all, on follow-up, how far is the competitive pressure in corporate business changing in Germany as you and several other banks are exiting relationships which you call unprofitable? Do you see an impact on your business margin or on the behavior of corporates in general, or is the competitive landscape unchanged? Secondly, sorry to come back on the BGH ruling, do you actively ask for consent of the customer also you want to fall back on usage consent like other banks are doing in Germany? Are you thinking about additional price changes due to the recent ruling? Last but not least, what needs to happen to reach EUR 1 billion risk cost as a, I don't know, bad case scenario, worst case, we never know.

What would also be needed to reach current or what should happen if you maintain current cost of risk this year? Thank you.

Manfred Knof
CEO, Commerzbank AG

Okay. First, with regard to the landscape of corporate business in Germany, our strategy is absolutely clear. We go profitability first. This is more important than growth. That's why we're talking with our clients either on up-pricing, up-selling products. This is clearly part of one of the transformation programs also in Corporate Clients with regard to RWA efficiency and margin increase. Therefore, profitability comes first. That's fully executed. On the court ruling, yes, we are going only on individual consents. That's what we're doing. Bettina is now answering on the risk.

Bettina Orlopp
CFO, Commerzbank AG

Yeah, there are no additional price changes in the moment in the planning. We just announced two price model changes, one for Comdirect and one for Commerzbank, and we stick to that for the time being. On the third question with respect to the EUR 1 billion, yes, indeed. If you take the first half with the EUR 235 million, this is quite a way towards the EUR 1 billion. This is why we also add less than EUR 1 billion, specifically if you keep in mind that we have the Top-Level Adjustment of EUR 495 million. We stay cautious. We all know there is Delta, there is Lambda. We do not know how winter is developing, and we should also all not forget that government measures will end by the end of this year, and we really need to watch out on that.

That might have some sectors are vulnerable and very exposed due to the pandemic, and we just stay cautious. There is a lot of upsides also, I would say, if you're an optimist on what's happening in the coming months. We just stay cautious for the time being and keep our buffers where they are, and then we are very happy to release the buffers if they are not needed.

Operator

Okay, thank you. We'll move on now to the next question, which is from Timo Dums, who's calling from DZ Bank. Over to you.

Timo Dums
Analyst, DZ Bank

Hello. Good morning. Can you hear me?

Operator

Yes, we can.

Bettina Orlopp
CFO, Commerzbank AG

Yes, we can.

Timo Dums
Analyst, DZ Bank

Great. Thank you. I've got two questions, if I may. First would be on, you laid down in the presentation that you expect further restructuring expenses of roughly EUR 170 million by the end of 2022. Can you give us an indication on how these expenses will be spread over this period? This would be the first one. The second question would be, you mentioned in the press release your customer satisfaction. Can you give us some more color on how you measure the customer satisfaction, and is there any difference among the different brands and customer clusters? Thank you.

Bettina Orlopp
CFO, Commerzbank AG

The EUR 170 million, very simple, EUR 140 we will most likely see in the second half of 2021, and only EUR 30 will be left over for 2022. Now I hand over to Manfred.

Manfred Knof
CEO, Commerzbank AG

For customer satisfaction, we have a usual process of pulse checks we're doing on a regular basis. There's no change of what we did, and it's consistent all over the bank in all areas.

Timo Dums
Analyst, DZ Bank

Okay, thank you. Is there any difference, for instance, among or between Commerzbank clients and the Comdirect clients, for instance, maybe?

Manfred Knof
CEO, Commerzbank AG

No. Method is the same.

Timo Dums
Analyst, DZ Bank

Okay. Understood. Thank you.

Operator

Thank you. Moving on now to the next question from Hugo Cruz, calling from KBW. Over to you.

Hugo Cruz
Analyst, KBW

Hi. Thank you for the time. I have four questions, if I may. First, on the loan loss provision, the EUR 495 million overlay, when do you have to decide on whether you're going to use it or release it? Can you give guidance for the TLTRO benefit for the second half and also for the tax rate? Finally, with the last results, you gave guidance for EUR 3 billion-EUR 5 billion of RWA growth in the rest of the year. Can you update us on the new guidance, please? Thank you.

Bettina Orlopp
CFO, Commerzbank AG

Yeah. The EUR 495 Top-Level Adjustment as set. If we can, to be very honest, we will even keep it for next year, 2022, as a buffer just to make sure that we have this buffer given that government measures in the end by December 2021. We will see. We will review that quarter by quarter and evaluate the situation. On TLTRO, we have now a volume of roughly EUR 36 billion. The 50-basis point means you're talking again about more than EUR 180 million of revenues, and we will book it according when we have achieved it. First share you will see in the fourth quarter this year, and it will be approximately EUR 95 million. Tax rate, very difficult guidance.

Really, to be very honest, I am not giving any guidance on tax rate because you all know that there are so many different effects impacting that, so it is very tough to predict. I would say something either slightly positive or slightly negative is probably the right assumption. On RWAs, we are now at 13.4%. We expect something around 13%. Why is that? That has to do that we expect specifically some changes in the RWAs. We will see some volume increases, hopefully, but I would say we will see some model changes, potentially, that will lead to RWA increases. We see TRIM, which is good for nearly a little bit more than EUR 1 billion of RWA increase, that are basically some op risk model changes. That are the key drivers for the RWA increase until the end of the year.

Hugo Cruz
Analyst, KBW

Thank you.

Operator

Thank you. Next up, we have Riccardo Rovere, who's calling from Mediobanca. Over to you.

Riccardo Rovere
Analyst, Mediobanca

Yes, good morning. Good morning to everybody. I hope you can hear me well. Three questions, if I may. The first one is on the risk cost guidance that is more a conceptual one. Before the guidance was a range between EUR 800 million-EUR 1.2 billion, which was a fairly large range. Let's say the current of less than EUR 1 billion is even more vague, I would say, than it was three months ago, while you should have now a better visibility. Can you narrow down a little bit what less than EUR 1 billion means? It could be EUR 300, EUR 700, EUR 999. Considering that we are in July, 7 months out of 12 are run out, you should be in the position to have a better visibility than 3 months ago.

Still related to that, is the use of TLA somehow factored in in the guidance you're providing of less than EUR 1 billion, or are you expecting to carry this amount, this EUR 500 million over till 2022, and then take a decision only in 2022? The other question I have is still on the guidance. When you say expectations are based on the assumption that there is no fundamental change affecting the Swiss franc loan portfolio at mBank, what does it mean? Does it mean that you expect kind of EUR 50 million provisions every quarter, as we have seen so far? Does it mean zero provisions in the second half of 2021? What that means, let's say, numerically. Last question I would have, is it possible for you to list all the one-offs that have affected this quarter?

I don't think that is really clear to the people that are listening to this call. We have the TLTRO, then we have CommerzVentures. TLTRO, EUR 40 million positive. Commerzbank, EUR 100 million positive. You got CHF 55 million mBank provisions on Polish FX loans. You have an unspecified amount, if I understood it correctly, on the ruling of pricing models. You have an unspecified amount on the provisions related to the outsourcing. You have EUR 200 million costs related to the cancellation of the outsourcing. Is that all? Am I missing anything here? If you do not want to provide numbers related to the court ruling and so on, could you be able to give us an idea what would be the profit before tax if we excluded all these one-offs in the Second Quarter? Thanks.

Bettina Orlopp
CFO, Commerzbank AG

Okay. I start with the last one, Riccardo. If you just go on Page 10 of the analyst presentation, there we basically have done that, and the EUR 32 million of operating result is then turning into a EUR 208 million operating result if you exclude these one-offs. The only puzzle missing in there is the one related to the provisions which we booked related to the stop of the contract with our outsourcing partner, and that we do not reveal. Clearly also, tax topics, et cetera, we also have not included in that. That gives you, I think, a good guidance on the exceptional items on Page 10. First of all, I think it's important to say last time we set basically a risk result of less or equal to EUR 1 billion is likely. What we now say it's definitely below EUR 1 billion.

I would say at least it's an improved guidance. I know that there is quite a bandwidth between first half EUR 235 million and less than EUR 1 billion. We always know that the second half, specifically the fourth quarter, is a longer one than the rest, so you always have higher LLPs also in total normal years than you have in the first half of the year. That is something which gives you a guidance. Then, as I said, it all depends also on what happens with some of the sectors. Just think about the travel sector, which is very much exposed to the pandemic. We assume the less than EUR 1 billion, really, that we can keep the EUR 500 million. If we can't keep the EUR 500 million, that's pretty sure that the loan loss provisions will be reduced by this number.

That is the equation, and we feel at the moment given that the virus is still ongoing, and we still don't know whether there will be a fourth wave, just more comfortable in being a little bit cautious on that. Clearly, as I said before, there is upside on that. I'm pretty convinced. The third question. The Swiss franc, yeah. What does it mean, the non-fundamental change? If we book as we have done some provisions because of changes in the incoming cases, et cetera, I would say that is very much covered by our guidance. If there is a total relief based on the 2nd of September, hopefully the ruling on the September 2nd, then we will have a different story, or if we need to do a large booking based on a potential ruling. Normal provisioning, I would say, is included.

Extraordinary either rebookings or bookings are not included.

Riccardo Rovere
Analyst, Mediobanca

All right. Thanks. Thank you very much.

Operator

Thanks. We'll move on now to a question from Jochen Schmitt, who's calling from Metzler. Over to you.

Jochen Schmitt
Analyst, Bankhaus Metzler

Thank you very much. Good morning. Could you get a bit more specific on the tax provision which you booked in other income? What's the order of magnitude? Also in this context, has this also affected the tax position, for example, because the provision might refer to interest rate payments on potential tax claims? These are my questions. Thank you.

Bettina Orlopp
CFO, Commerzbank AG

Yeah. That's totally correct. You will also see a sentence on that in the interim report. There is a new ruling or guideline out from the Minister of Finance on Cum-cum. What we have done is we have basically considered that in the tax line with certain amount and, as you rightfully say, then there is always also interest rates. Interests we need to basically provision for on the tax claims, and that happens in other income, and those have been reflected.

Jochen Schmitt
Analyst, Bankhaus Metzler

Sorry for following up. You don't want to disclose a number for other income for the order of magnitude of the provision?

Bettina Orlopp
CFO, Commerzbank AG

To be very honest, we now have the guideline out there. We know that our tax authorities will apply that, but the discussions are ongoing, so we booked something just as an, I would say, cautious action. We will definitely see what the final number is when we concluded the discussions with tax authorities.

Jochen Schmitt
Analyst, Bankhaus Metzler

Thank you.

Operator

Thank you. The next question for today is from Jun Yang, who is calling from Barclays. Over to you.

Jun Yang
Analyst, Barclays Corporate & Investment Bank

Hi. Good morning. Hope you can hear me okay. I have 2 questions. The first one is on mBank. Based on the mBank disclosure, I can see the court case number has been increasing by 20% each quarter over the last few quarters. I just want to understand what is your assumptions in your provision guidance, current provision level on the number of the case in the future? How should we think about the impact from the out-of-court settlement versus the court cases? How much difference is that? The next question is on the restructuring. If I hear correctly, you mentioned about 5,000 FTE to be in a signing contract, a volunteering contract with you off the payroll. Just want to understand what is the timing of the saving impact from this reduction. When is that going to come through in the future?

Is that this year or next year? Attached to that, I just want to understand on the branch closure, you mentioned the customer leaving you does not change too much of your revenue. Just want to understand, is there any follow-on impact from the branch closure into the future? How much is in this year's number and how much is in next year? Has there be any change of your financial guidance into 2022? Thank you.

Bettina Orlopp
CFO, Commerzbank AG

Okay. On the ruling, what we have done is basically we have a model at the moment where we take the incoming cases. We make an extrapolation also for the future based on the incoming cases. We also take the size of damage or decision, plus also our win-loss rate into account. That we review together with our auditor quarter by quarter. What you have seen in the last quarters that indeed court cases have increased, and therefore we have also increased provisioning. We would expect if there would not be the ruling now anyhow on the 2nd of September, that court cases would probably slow down because specifically the rulings end of April and beginning of May, which we have seen were rather encouraging for the banks.

These type of processes are always started three months before, you always have a time lag until you see certain decisions also unfolding in the number of cases. We feel pretty much based on current rulings, et cetera, that we have the right level of provisioning. On the impact on what we have now already done today on the restructuring. We said that we now have settled basically agreements with more than 3,400 employees. That doesn't mean that they are leaving right away. Some have left already, some will leave until the end of the year. We also have this part-time retirement programs in there, and some will just leave in 2022 or 2023 or even 2024. You will see the impact in the coming years.

It's different to the voluntary program, which we have just started and launched with the 1,700 FTEs, because there we expect that all of the people who signed this voluntary agreement will leave by the 1st of January 2022, meaning you see the full impact of the 1,700 in the 2022 cost baseline. The last question on the branch closures, we see churn, that's for sure. It's not as high as we have expected. We will also see further churn in the coming months and years. This is what we have basically assumed in our plans. If we remember, we had a EUR 300 million churn negative revenue impact due to churn.

Operator

Thank you. In light of the time, we'll move on to the last question for today from Tobias Lukesch, calling from Kepler Cheuvreux. Over to you.

Tobias Lukesch
Analyst, Kepler Cheuvreux

Yeah. Thank you very much for taking my question as well. I'll be quick, just focusing on one big issue, which is the stop of the outsourcing of the security settlement process. If I read your press release, it pops to me that you are highlighting the risk basically of the complexity of the issue and then saying more or less, and yes, we can do it ourselves and it will be profitable. First, my question basically is twofold. A, what is the risk here also for the rest of your system landscape IT-wise? Is there any further risk visible, i.e., higher IT investment requirements, further write-offs in other segments? Secondly, going for this profitability argument, I would have assumed that with higher volumes, i.e., lower marginal costs, then you would even more benefit from an outsourced IT landscape. With HSBC.

My question here is, if you go through the in-house solution now, what kind of profitability would you expect on the level expectations or volume expectations that you have? Secondly, what kind of margin then do you expect from that business? Thank you.

Manfred Knof
CEO, Commerzbank AG

Yeah. Just the opposite. For us now, with the higher volumes, it's better to have it in-house because we have economies of scale here. For any other things, this is a total hypothetical question. We're pushing our transformation. We're measuring our initiatives and projects and, okay, as you've seen, we are not afraid of taking painful decisions.

Tobias Lukesch
Analyst, Kepler Cheuvreux

It's not hypothetical in the way that I ask for any visibility in the short term. Is there any additional IT investment requirement? Is there further write-off potential in other segments? It's not the hypothetical in three years. It's really what you see now. Should we factor anything in for H2, or is that just another quarter like we have seen that with Commerzbank for years, basically?

Manfred Knof
CEO, Commerzbank AG

There's nothing what pops out right now what we have seen. We have a review of all the initiatives and projects we undertake in the board very much into detail. This was the one project which popped up. There's not more to say than all the others. This is one project where we found this is necessary to do, and we have all other initiatives and projects always under review. I think what we can say is that we are fully in the plan and of our expectations and the transformation is on plan. This is all what we can say now.

Thank you. Since this was the last question, I would say thank you very much for your participation in this call. We are looking forward to our future interactions virtually or hopefully in person sometime.

Wish you all a nice day, a good summer vacation, and thank you very much, and bye-bye.