Please note that this conference is being recorded. I now hand the conference over to Mr. Akash Gopani. Thank you, and over to you, Mr. Akash.
Thanks, Steve. Good evening, everyone. Welcome to the Q4 FY24 earnings conference call of Varroc Engineering Limited. We have with us the senior management, represented by Mr. Tarang Jain, Chairman and Managing Director, Mr. Arjun Jain, Full-time Director and CEO, Business Development One, Mr. Mahendra Kumar, Group CFO, and Mr. Vikas Kukreja, Head of Investor Relations. With that, I would now like to hand over the call to Mr. Tarang Jain for his initial opening remarks. Over to you, sir.
Yeah. Thank you, Akash and team Investec, for hosting the call, and good evening to everyone for joining this call. The global economy continues to go through a significant shift in FY 2024. The initial stability post-pandemic has been taken away by the intensified military conflicts during the year. The recessionary fear across the global economy due to high inflation, central bank tightening at the beginning of the year have moderated now, and now the macroeconomic outlook is improving relatively. We hope that this is not taken away from the geopolitical issues. The Indian economy continues to outperform, and in Q3 FY 2024, the GDP growth was at a robust 8.4%. The automobile production in India during FY 2024 grew on a year-on-year basis for all the segments.
Passenger Vehicles grew by 6.9%, the Commercial Vehicles grew by 3%, Three-wheeler and Two-wheeler registered a strong growth at 16% and 10.3%, respectively. The growing economy and stability in the central bank policy have driven this growth. In Q4 FY 2024, on a year-on-year basis, the automobile growth was strong in two-wheelers, which grew by 26.5%, three-wheelers grew by 8.4%, the Passenger Vehicles grew by 9.7%, and the Commercial Vehicles saw a marginal degrowth at -0.5%. For the full financial year 2024, our India operations continued to outperform the industry growth with a growth of over 14.5%. The India operation helped the company to clock closer to a 10% growth in FY 2024.
Overseas business was impacted in FY 2024, as two-wheeler automotive sales in the overseas market fell, and a dependency on single customer impacted our revenue. The full year revenue was at INR 75,519 million. The PBT was, for the year was at... Excuse me. The PBT- Sorry, just to repeat, the full year revenue was at INR 75,519 million. The PBT was, for the year was INR 3,149 million, which includes profit from a joint venture of INR 444 million. The PBT margin improved by 300 basis points on a year-on-year basis and came in at 4.2% PBT for the year. Was also impacted by several one-timers, like the provision of INR 160 million, created for doubtful recovery of receivables from an EV customer.
In FY 2024, the CapEx spend was only around INR 2,016 million, but better profitability, tighter control on CapEx and working capital enabled us to reduce the net debt to below INR 10,000 million, at INR 9,826 million. The net debt to equity ratio improved to 0.63 in FY 2024 from 1.27 in FY 2023. The loan servicing ability also improved, as our net debt to EBITDA improved to 1.29 in FY 2024 from 2.14 in FY 2023. We continue with win businesses for our focused product lines and increase the capacity utilization levels. In FY 2024, our lifetime new business wins has been over INR 87 billion. The annual peak value is around INR 15 billion.
These wins are likely to generate additional revenue of INR 8.5 billion in FY 2025. It is very encouraging to see that more than 40% of these new wins have come in the EV category. Our revenue from supplying to EV players in FY 2024 was approximately 5.3% of our overall revenue. As indicated earlier, we continue our endeavor to grow better than the industry in India. We are also taking several initiatives to grow our overseas business. We are working with various customers on additional revenue opportunities. We are also driving cost reduction efforts in these markets to improve margins. The margin improvement efforts through backward integration initiatives, like SMT lines, are already in place. With these actions, we expect to see a revival of overseas business in the coming 1-2 years.
We will also continue to strengthen our engineering capabilities and also focus on further cost reduction and working capital optimization for all our operations. More business wins, gradual recovery in overseas markets, and the efforts taken by the company to reduce both fixed as well as the variable costs, are expected to gradually improve the performance of the overseas operations in the coming years. We have uploaded the investor presentation in the stock exchange as well as in the website.
... I will now ask K. Mahendra Kumar, our Group CFO, to walk you through the presentation and give more insights on the financial performance. Thank you.
Thank you, Tarang. Good evening, everyone. Talking about the highlights for full year and also Q4 of FY 2024. As our CMD explained, revenue came in at INR 7,551 crore, with a growth of 9.6%. But the India business growth was much stronger at 14.1%. Q4 revenue grew by 16% year-over-year, but here again, the India business grew significantly stronger by close to 24%. This was of course impacted by the overseas challenges which we have, which we explained in the previous quarter's communication. In terms of the overall profitability, full year PBT came in at 4.2%, a significant improvement compared to previous year PBT of 1.2%.
EBITDA also, we get to the double digit EBITDA, 10.1% for full year, compared to 8.7% we had last year. Q4 PBT was 5.3% versus 2.4%, we had same time last year. Similarly, the EBITDA also was much stronger at 11.1% compared to 9.4% last year. Now, all this also enabled us to strengthen the balance sheet further. The net debt came down below 1,000 crores now, at INR 983 crores, which actually improved the net debt to equity ratio to 0.63, from 1.27, that it was last year. Net debt to EBITDA also improved to 1.29 now, compared to more than 2 that we had last year.
In terms of the business growth, the new lifetime orders now added up to INR 87 billion for full year, with more than 40% coming from EV related vehicles and products. The total revenue from these EV related components is now actually up to 5.3% of our total revenue. Coming to the cost reduction efforts that we communicated earlier, the renewable energy projects which we talked about in the previous quarter communications, they are now nearing completion. So most probably very soon we'll be seeing the benefits of these projects also. Then finally, board also approved the merger of the 100% subsidiary, VPL with VEL. This is expected to give us significant ease of operation. Going to the next slide, which is about the industry trends.
If you really see the Q4 performance of the industry, the Two-wheeler grew by 26.5%, compared to same time last year, and Three-wheeler grew by 8.4%, Passenger Vehicles by 9.7%. But on a sequential quarter-over-quarter basis, Two-wheeler was more or less flat. And Passenger Vehicles, of course, registered a significant strong performance by close to 17.6%. And coming to the full year trends, the Two-wheeler industry grew by slightly about 10%, Passenger Vehicles by close to 7% and Three-wheeler by 16%. So going forward, we are hoping that the good monsoon and the strengthening rural economy will further give a kind of a boost to the Three-wheeler industry and which in turn reflects a strong business growth.
And then maybe later part of the year, we'll also see, inflation easing out further at global level and also the interest rates coming down in the later part of the year. The next slide, we have the summary of the consolidated financials for Q4. As I mentioned earlier, the PBT came in at 5.3% and EBITDA at 11.1%. The overall revenue grew by 16%. In terms of the other items, as our chairman explained, we also went ahead and create provision for close to INR 16 crore for provision for doubtful debts against one of the prominent EV customers we have, and to be on a conservative basis. And then the overall EBITDA and of course PBT derived benefits of operating leverage this quarter also.
This quarter we also could see a reduction in interest cost and depreciation cost compared to the previous quarters. So that should continue going forward also. In terms of the full year numbers, in the next slide, we are talking about a PBT of 4.2% on full year basis. But more importantly, we have been communicating about the operating leverage benefit at every level. So that way, if you really see, the revenue went up by close to 9.6%, 9.6%, but EBITDA grew much stronger at 27%, supported largely by the contribution margin improvement. It all translated into a PBT growth of 280%. So this particular thing continues to be our focus in the near future also.
Coming to the balance sheet and ratios, net debt-
The conference is now being recorded.
Okay, so net debt was INR 983 crore against equity of INR 1,526 crore. So that enabled us to get to net debt to equity ratio of 0.64. Net Debt to EBITDA improved to 1.29. And because of all this good performance, the return on capital employed annualized, it also goes up to close to 29% now. Coming to the revenue breakdown, the important point to be noted here is, of course, the large two segments, 37.8% coming from electrical and electronics lighting, with plus the 32% comes from polymers. So these two add up to close to almost 70% of the total. And in terms of geographical distribution, 87% comes from within India, 13% coming from outside.
Segment-wise, product segment-wise, two and three wheelers add up to close to 75%. And, in terms of customer profile, Bajaj, this is 42% of the total revenue. Then in the next slide, we also added one more point of analysis based on the earlier discussion. We are now giving the breakup of the order, the order book, the new lifetime value of the order book, how it's going to help us in the revenue build up in the coming year. So from this existing 87 billion of order intake, which we took, nearly INR 8,500 million of revenue comes in FY 2025 itself, which is about INR 850 crores of revenue for this year. Which will add up to INR 1,450 crores and INR 1,750 crores in the next two years.
Of course, always assuming that the start of production, as indicated by the respective OEMs, hold good and, they actually happen on time. In terms of the lifetime revenue by customer, if you see, 52% of this new order intake comes from, Bajaj products and the rest from others. And another interesting point here is EV constitute nearly 43% of the new order intake, which is a positive sign. And most of it is two-wheeler and three-wheeler related, which is close to 81% of the total. And then we have these awards also, some of the prominent awards which we got, have been displayed here. So let me stop here. We'll take questions. Thank you so much.
Thank you very much. We will now begin the question and answer session. Anyone who wishes to ask a question may press star and one on their touchtone telephone. If you wish to remove yourself from the question queue, you may press star and two. Participants are requested to use answer while asking a question. Ladies and gentlemen, we will wait for a moment while the question queue assembles. The first question is from the line of Krishna Kukreja from Lucky Investment. Please go ahead.
Hello?
Hello.
Hi, sir. Congratulations for a good set of numbers, and thank you for giving me the opportunity. My question was, based on CapEx, if you could give us an idea of what kind of CapEx we're looking for for FY 2025 and FY 2026. You had guided over that this will be less than the depreciation. If you could also give us some color on what the depreciation for us is going to look like. Is it going to be in this INR 330 crores-INR 340 crores kind of range for the next couple of years?
Yeah, Krishna, so like what we communicated earlier, we continue to keep CapEx in the range of about close to INR 200 crore this year. Most probably, maybe around these levels next year also, or maybe slightly up, depending upon the requirement. But directionally, if you really see, against our depreciation bill of close to INR 380 crore, thereabouts, the CapEx spend, going forward for the next two years also is going to be significantly lower only. So that should actually result in a gradual easing of depreciation bill further. How much exactly, it's difficult to compute or comment at this stage, but directionally, yes, it should come down.
Right. And another one would be on the interest cost situation. Where do we see in terms of debt repayment? What are we kind of looking to repay in this couple of years? Will it be similar to last year? What kind of interest costs are we looking at? If I can get some idea on that as well.
Yeah, gradually, that should come down because we hope to generate a good amount of free cash flow this year and next year also, which should obviously go to repay the debt only. So our idea is to bring it significantly down, to half of EBITDA, maybe by next year.
Right. And just a final one. On these EV products that now make up 5% of our revenue, if you could tell us exactly what these products are and what sort of segmentation we should look at them as, and what kind of growth we're looking at here based on our order book?
When we say 5%, that is the, that, that is all products, whether EV powertrain products or engine agnostic products, but that we supply into the, the, that we supply into EV models. In terms of its, in terms of the split, in terms of, you know, what is engine agnostic versus what is EV, I don't think we share that. But I think if you just look at the price points of the different product lines, EV powertrain products will definitely make up a large portion of that.
Right. And the growth, if you could just comment on that.
So growth, of course, is dependent on, it depends also on how much EV grows. But I think the trend of growth that you see already through the course of this year-
... I think it's a trend that I think we can definitely be comfortable in saying that over the next couple of years, that is a trend that will sustain.
Great. Thank you so much, and again, congratulations on a great set of numbers.
Thank you.
Thank you. The next question is from the line of Basudeb Banerjee from ICICI Securities. Please go ahead.
Thanks, sir. Congrats for good set of numbers. A couple of questions. One is in this lifetime order win slide, where in the very first chart, you have put FY 2025, INR 8,500 crore, FY 2026, INR 14,500 crore. So is that the ITL revenue situation in INR crores for those years as per the order book you have received?
Yeah, that's the additional revenue we are expecting from this order book for this year. These numbers are in millions, not in crores.
That's right. Yeah, million additional revenues which you secure this year.
Yes, correct. From the order book, which to secure this year.
Sure. So which means, other than the organic growth of the business which could have happened, this can be the additional revenue to that on the organic growth?
Correct.
And second question, sir, in the reported numbers this quarter, your gross margin has jumped significantly sequentially or even compared to past many quarters. So did I miss out in your initial comments anything there, is it sustainable or just accounting change or one-off? How to look at it, sir?
Yeah. So, it's a good question. So the, what we would like to suggest here is maybe you should look at the full year gross margin improvement. I think you can still notice about 1.6% improvement there year-over-year. But out of that also we have some of these one-timers, like, the government incentive of last year or last two years was accounted in one year. So there is a one-year extra benefit which we, which we have taken. At the same time, there were certain other one-timers also, which we actually provided for, on the cost side. So net-net, if you really see out of 1 point, close to 1% improvement, will continue going forward also is what we are estimating. The other, the remaining points, it could be because of all these other one-timers.
So for this quarter, specifically, this 11.1% margin, how much would have been one-off?
My suggestion is don't look at it on a quarterly basis because there are several things which we accounted for on full year basis also, in terms of provisions and one-timers also. But directionally, we actually touched 10%, on full year basis. So out of that, close to about 0.5%-0.6% could be because of these one-timers. The rest of it is the regular thing.
Okay. Okay, so 10% reported full year, including 0.5 one-offs. So directionally, next year, one can expect it to operationally cross double digits.
Yeah, we don't want to give any guidance like that, but, yeah, our direction-
Sure, sure.
and our efforts.
And I missed out on your earlier question. You said CapEx outlook for FY 2025 in absolute INR terms?
Sorry, CapEx outlook.
CapEx plans for FY25.
Yeah. That will be close to INR 200 crore.
200. Ok. Thanks, so great. Okay, that's all.
Thank you.
Thank you. The next question is from the line of Ankur Poddar from Swan Investments. Please go ahead.
Thank you for taking my question, sir. Sir, there are, I have, two set of questions. There has been increase in the long-term debt, compared to last year. So, why is that increase? The long-term debt has increased by almost, you know, from INR 416 crore to INR 651 crore. So why is that increase?
Yeah. So, basically, you should look at the total debt profile. So if you really see, from I think 1,655 crores or thereabouts, we brought it down to 1,200 crores. If you really see last year balance sheet, it was more of short-term than long-term, which was also creating significant stress on our liquidity also. And that included the NCDs, which we actually repaid earlier last year, that is in FY 2024. So what we did was we replaced some of the short-term debt with long-term debt, just so that the liquidity pressure eases out over a period of time. So but in terms of the total debt, there was a significant reduction.
Okay. Okay. So, sir, in terms of total debt also, there has been sharp reduction, but on interest costs, we have not seen that, reduce. In fact, interest cost has remained similar, compared to FY 2023.
Yeah, yeah. So most of these reductions happened only in the recent times, so you should see that, going forward. I think you, you would have already seen some good reduction this quarter, in Q4.
Yes.
That trend should continue going forward, assuming the business continues with this kind of performance.
Okay, okay. Sir, also, there has been sharp increase in the other expenses. Is there some one-off there? What run rate should we assume on a consistent basis?
Yeah. So that includes some of these, one-timers, which we talked about, the provision which we created for, some of the, I mean, one of the prominent EV customers, plus a few other, provisions also, which we provide on conservative basis.
...Okay, okay. And sir, employee costs have remained on a similar level to the, the last quarter. So, should we assume there will be some increase, going forward in Q1 and so forth?
There may be some increase because Q1 anyway takes this merit increase impact and all. But otherwise, this should grow more or less in line with the top line.
Okay, okay. Sir, can you share what would have been our revenue from EV customers in FY 2024 as a percentage?
We mentioned earlier in the call, 5.3% was the total revenue from EV related projects.
INR 7,500 crores.
Close to INR 500 crore.
5.3%.
5.3% of INR 7,500 crore.
Okay, okay, okay, okay, okay. Fine, sir. Thank you, and, I'll call back in a queue, sir, and congratulations for a great set of numbers.
Thank you.
Thank you. The next question is from the line of Akash Gopani from Investec Capital Services. Please go ahead.
You highlighted, you believe that it is for over 10 years. So-
I'm sorry to interrupt, Mr. Akash. We couldn't hear you. Could you go once again with your question, please?
Can you hear me now?
Yes, sir, we can hear you now.
Yeah, yeah. So I just wanted to understand regarding the state incentives which you highlighted. So the duration is, if I'm correct, 10 years? So any total incentive amount over here, which will be, we will be receiving over the next 10 years?
Yeah. The period of benefit is 10 years. So yeah, it is distributed equally or recognized equally over 10 years.
Would it be fair to assume around INR 50 crore every year for the next 8-9 years thereon?
Correct, correct.
Okay. Okay, understood. And sir, the next question is, can you please give us some update on the China JV? Where are we in that process?
Yeah. So there's no significant progress on that particular matter. As we indicated earlier, the arbitration proceedings on the final verdict is likely to come out maybe by end of H1. So that's when around that time we will have something to communicate on this.
Okay. And, lastly, on the EV order wins, over the last quarter or so, have you seen any slowdown in order wins over there, just because of general slowdown in the EV volume offtake or change in subsidies? Any incremental thing you would want to highlight over there?
From a quarter perspective, okay, if I answer the question little differently, I don't think there is a drop in engagement or a drop in interest from an EV product line perspective. Of course, maybe market is a little bit slower, and I think we know in the you know subsidy is also reducing. But OEMs look to continue to optimize also, right? Which definitely creates opportunities, which definitely creates opportunities for us. So I would say the engagement is still strong, and I think at this stage we are, I think, quite happy with the amount of the amount of programs and the amount of work that we have to do.
Okay, understood. I'll call back in the queue. Thank you.
Thank you. Before we take the next question, participants, we would like to remind you that you can press star and one to ask a question. The next question is from the line of Sonal Gupta from HSBC Mutual Fund. Please go ahead.
Yeah. Hi, good evening, and thanks for taking my question. Just around on this, just clarifying, I think this INR 989 million of government incentives that you recognized this quarter, how much would be FY 2023 related?
It's 50/50. Equally distributed over these two years.
Going forward, would we be taking it on a quarterly basis, or will it still be like you'll take it as a lumpy number?
Yeah, we will do it on a quarterly basis.
Right. And just on the INR 16 crore, and the, I think the INR 16 crore receivable write-off, I mean, that's all coming in other expenses?
Yeah, that's right.
Would you be able to quantify? Because you said there are other write-offs and provisions as well. Could you highlight what is the total quantum of the one-offs?
I don't want to call it out, but they're spread across multiple line items, but this is the most prominent one.
Okay, sir. And, okay, fine. I'll join back again. Yeah. So thanks.
Thank you.
Thank you. The next question is from the line of Abhishek Jain from Alf Accurate. Please go ahead.
Thanks for the opportunity, and congrats for a strong set of numbers, sir. Sir, in this quarter, tax rate has gone up significantly. So just wanted to understand what would be the effective tax rate for FY 25 and 26.
Yeah. So this quarter, we again took some conservative calls, because we were also considering the deductibility of some of the expenses relating to R&D, which we incur for overseas, plus the normal deferred tax charge, the asset charge that comes anyway. So in terms of the cash payout, if you really see, like how we communicated last quarter, we don't have to pay anything out in cash, in the next few years. But the normal deferred tax charge will of course continue to come, in the P&L for the next few years.
What would be the effective tax rate for FY 2025?
Would be maybe around 25%-27%.
Okay. And, sir, you have guided incremental revenue growth of around INR 850 crores in FY 2025 and INR 1,450 crores in FY 2026. How much would be from the EV side?
First of all, the INR 850 crore revenue is not a guidance. Second thing, it is not the total revenue growth we are aiming for. This is only what is coming from the order book. Other than that, there will, there should be regular organic growth anyway.
Right.
Coming to the EV-related revenue, right now it is 5.3%, but gradually it should move up to 10%, maybe by end of next year.
Okay. And as the mix will change of ICE versus EV, so what would be impact on the margin side, especially on the gross margin side? Because that in EVs, most probably that, yeah, gross margin would be lower in the initial years. So can you give some colors on that part?
So see, I would say Gross Margin depends a lot more on the product line rather than on the vehicle into which the product line is going, right? When I say that, what I mean is now, let's say in a forged part or in an engine valve, the Gross Margin is always fundamentally superior. Versus if you look at an electronic assembly, the Gross Margin would naturally be lower. So, I think, I don't think it would be healthy to guide on a Gross Margin per se. But for sure, I mean, like we said before, we assess from a PBT standpoint, right? So from a PBT standpoint, we believe our growth will be healthy.
Okay.
So also, as we communicated in the earlier calls, we continue to focus on these cost reductions and other initiatives. So our effort is always to improve contribution margin steadily over a period of time, close to about 1% per annum is what we are targeting.
So, basically when it comes to the EV, it's not that the EV gross margin is superior. Because eventually, whereas IC engine parts or EV parts, overall, the trends are quite similar, you know. So the pressures are there both. But with whatever our cost initiatives are on a bill of material or on the variable costs, we do expect, you know, our gross margin and the contribution margin, like what our CFO said, a 1% improvement, what we look to achieve, you know, year-on-year, at least for the next couple of years. That's what we are targeting.
Okay. And, in this quarter, what is the adjusted EBITDA margin, excluding the government incentives?
We can compute it. 11.1% is the total adjusted EBITDA margin, which we showed in the slides also. But you shouldn't exclude the entire government incentive. What pertains to last year was only about half of it, which is close to about INR 50 crore. So that you eliminate maybe about 0.2%-0.3% will be the correction.
So we will be anyway over 10% if you were to adjust it, you know, to the previous year's, you know, the, the incentive. And, so it would be around 10% in our view.
Okay. And, sir, in this quarter, we have seen a very strong mix, geography mix and the segment mix, because growth in the fourth quarter was very much strong in the domestic side. Further, in the segment side, also, four wheelers growth was stronger. So how much benefit you got because of this mix? And will this EBITDA margin performance continue once that there will be change on the mix?
Yeah. So the growth, like we've always said, that see, we are going to be 6%-8% ahead of the overall market growth, you know, in the country, on the automotive sector. So we and definitely we will see, you know, that our EBITDA is improving only, you know, as we move along. So this 10% will definitely go up as we go along. We are very confident, and we are also confident of our sales growth moving forward in FY 2025.
Okay, sir. Thanks, sir. That's all from my side.
Thank you. Before we take the next questions, we would like to remind participants that you may press star and one to ask a question. Participants who wish to ask a question may press star and one at this time. The next question is from the line of Vinay Jain from Karma Capital. Please go ahead.
Yeah. Good evening, sir, and congratulations on a good set of numbers. I just had one question: so if you see the revenue pie chart, which you have displayed in the presentation, there is a change in the mix. So now we are disclosing the domestic, electrical, and electronics business separately, along with lighting and overseas business. So if you could just give us a like to like number of how has been the growth for the full year for each of the two business segments? And maybe throw some color on how has been the sequential recovery in the overseas business? Those were my two questions, sir.
Yeah. So, coming to the sequential recovery in the overseas business, it was, it was good, better than the previous quarter, but not significantly better. So we'll have to give some more time to it.
Right.
In terms of the segment by segment growth, maybe you should look at it on full year basis.
Yeah.
...Most of the segments grew strongly, strongly well. The electrical, electronics, lighting and polymer business grew pretty, pretty well in strong double digits. The other businesses are moderate, maybe single digit kind of growth.
Yeah, just to add to what Mahendra has said, you know, see, our focus in India has been more on electrical, electronics, lighting and polymer side, which has all grown very well in this previous year. And our metallic business has not grown as much by design. It's not that something, you know, it is not if we wanted to, even that could have grown more. But by design, we have, you know, decided not to really invest too much on the metallic space, at least for the present. And when it comes to the overseas, you know, we have a very strong drive for new business wins, both in our two-wheeler lighting business out of Europe and out of Vietnam, and also on the electronics business in Romania.
I think there we are making very good traction in our new business wins. I'm quite sure that going forward, at least from the second half of this financial year, we will see a good increase on the revenue side.
Please correct me if I'm wrong, but Mahendra, sir, did he, did he mention that it will take us 2-3 years to get back to our previous numbers when it comes to overseas business?
Yeah, I said 1-2 years. So that is to see the full kind of recovery. What our CMD was mentioning was, we will see signs of positive recovery starting from-
From the second half of this year, we will see, because we are really very focused on the business wins there. And we are able to, you know, meet with some success, you know, and and we will see better numbers now in this from the second half.
Understood. And lastly, on the China JV, so again, like, there is this volatility in the share of profit which you have recognized. How do we go about it, as far as the China JV is concerned and the profit number?
Yeah. So China JV, of course, is somewhat seasonal in nature, particularly, the Q4 had the Chinese New Year holidays and all.
Right.
So because of that, there were also lower volume. But I think we should see the full year number as a better picture of China numbers, if you want to see it that way.
Understood. Thank you.
Q4 normally actually is the strongest, I think, quarter. I mean, for them, it's Q4. For China, it's more like Q4, and for us it's Q3.
Mm-hmm.
That's normally the strongest quarter, and the Q1 for them and our Q4 is actually the weakest quarter because the Chinese holidays, February. It's very little revenue.
Yeah.
Maybe it's 50% or lower. You know, so that definitely impacts, you know, the overall, you know, kind of business as such. But there also, I think there's a lot of, there may be a lot of very important business wins in the previous year, and we will see good growth in, FY 2025 as well, when it comes to the China, the, the Chinese, the China JV.
Understood. Thank you so much for answering my questions, and all the best.
Thank you.
Thank you.
Thank you. The next question is from the line of Basudeb Banerjee from ICICI Securities. Please go ahead.
Yeah, thanks, again. A couple of questions. One, is how much the receivables discounted end of this year?
See, on the average, you can say close to about INR 600 crores of receivable discounting we have. It varies from week to week or month to month. But on the average, you can say it's about INR 600 crores.
Okay, so no major change from that year?
Yeah.
And second question, sir, I, if I missed out, is one of write-offs, which you accounted in the other expense for EV business. So which was the client's name?
Well, it's not appropriate on our part to disclose the name, but it's a prominent EV player, so you can guess the name, but we don't want to talk about-
Could you discuss the reason behind writing off, if I missed that?
Yeah. So we have waited long enough. In fact, as per the policy, we start providing for it after one year, 100%. So going by that logic also, it is enough if we provide for half of it, INR 8 crores versus INR 16 crores.
Mm-hmm.
But looking at the current scenario, we wanted to take a conservative call and provided for entire INR 16 crore.
Okay. So by assuming they are not in a position to pay you that amount?
Correct. Correct.
Last question.
We are still making efforts to recover it, so if it comes back later, then definitely that's going to help.
We are still not given up. I mean, it's just that from an accounting angle, we've just been little conservative here. But we are hopeful that, you know, there is some solution here, on us recovering our amount.
Sure. And, last question, sir. From 5.3% of revenue being EV mix, and on the other side, out of incremental order added, I suppose you said almost 40% is from EV. Am I right?
Yes.
So this whole transition from current category mix to 40%, so what are the key areas which is driving this significant mix? Is that motors or it's solutions or what? If you can analyze that.
So I'll clarify. The 40% number is to do with the new business wins.
Mm-hmm.
So of our total new business wins, more than 40% is going into EV models.... We are not saying that from 5.3% of total revenue-
No, no, no, no, no, sir, I'm not, I'm not, I did not mean that. I did not mean that, sir. I said incremental order, that 40% is a significant number. So can you highlight which are the key area products of, from which this 40% of incremental order under is coming from?
So, I can, I'll tell you, if I were to divide between two-wheeler and four-wheeler, two-wheeler would be largely the, the electric powertrain, where the motor and some of the electronics is major for our biggest customer, as well as, you know, there are a couple of other customers, you know, where we have won the business win last year, where the production will start, later, later this year. And in two-wheeler also, there are, there would be other products like lighting and some of the other, you know, regular products we do on the EV, like seating, plastics, painting, you know, so those kind of parts are there.
When it comes to four-wheeler, it's to do with the lighting business, as well as the plastic interiors, largely like the door panels or, you know, the consoles or some of the painted parts, you know, so that kind of, that kind of business.
So basically, there are various parts which are powertrain agnostic, but you are supplying to EV-specific models, and those products that you are separately classifying under EV orders. Am I right?
Yes. So it would be both. It would be, of course, the EV powertrain products, which are largely two and three-wheeler driven.
Yeah.
There would also be... Then there would be the other products which are common to the ICE, you know, also would be in the EV-
Understood.
Also, but the content of, I think, plastics, I think, in you know in EV products is, of course, significantly more because of the light weighting. So there we see a bigger business potential whenever we win a business.
Would it be possible for you to highlight, out of this 40% number of incremental order, how much is purely EV-specific thing and not seating or lighting or common agnostic of ICE product part?
So rationally, it'll be more than two-thirds is EV-specific components. EV powertrain, that is.
EV-specific components.
Yeah, which is largely powertrain, yeah.
Okay. Sure. Thanks.
Thank you. Ladies and gentlemen, a reminder to all participants that you may press star and one to ask a question at this time. As there are no further questions, I would now like to hand the conference over to the management for closing comments.
No, so I think thank you for all the questions, and thank you to everyone for joining this call and for your continuing support, and see you again, once again, after one quarter.
On behalf of investors.