Good morning, everyone, and a very warm welcome to AFRY's Capital Markets Day 2025. I'm Johanna Halstedt from Investor Relations, and we're glad to see so many of you here today and look forward to sharing this day with you. At the beginning of this year, we initiated AFRY's next chapter, turning a new page in our 130-year history. Over the past months, we have worked intensively to shape a clear strategic direction for AFRY. Today, we are excited to present our new strategy, Unlocking AFRY. This morning, we also announced new financial targets for 2028, which we will, of course, talk more about today. Now, let's take a look at the agenda. We'll start with a presentation from our President and CEO, Linda Pålsson. Following that, Daniela Spetz, our Head of Corporate Development and M&A, will take us deeper into the key elements of our new strategy.
Next, we'll move into the global divisions presented by their respective heads, Elon Hegg and Nicholas Oksanen, while Linda Pålsson will present Transportation and Places. After another break, our CFO, Bo Sandström, will walk us through AFRY's value creation journey. We'll wrap up with a Q&A session where you in the room will have the opportunity to ask your questions, so please save them until then. Finally, Linda Pålsson will conclude with some closing remarks before it's time for lunch. Let's get started. I would like to welcome our first speaker, our CEO, Linda Pålsson.
Good morning, and also from me, a warm welcome. Today, I look forward to share our perspective on AFRY's strategic direction going forward. Our path towards profitable growth and our new financial targets. In short, how to unlock AFRY. Let's dive in. I have actually been with AFRY for 12 years now, but when I stepped in the role of CEO in January this year, still my first priority was to fully understand the full scope of AFRY's current position. Because AFRY is a much larger and very different company than it was 10 to 15 years ago. We have experienced strong growth, both organically and through acquisitions. The acquisitions have ranged from various small ones to the large platform acquisition of Pöyry in 2019. This growth has significantly broadened and diversified our footprint. This has, in many ways, served us well.
At the same time, our business and delivery models have shifted. We have moved from being primarily a professional service organization selling our time to one that increasingly operates through a project-based delivery model. The key insight for me in this was to what extent this has added complexity to our business. Over the last years, we have seen that our profitability and our utilization levels have dropped. A clear signal that we need to adapt and refocus. An equal key insight to me was the huge potential that we have within AFRY. Our starting point is that we have top-tier expertise. 18,000 highly skilled employees that offer our clients world-class technical expertise and deep sector knowledge. We hold leading positions in several key segments, providing a strong platform for continued expansion.
We have many strong client relationships, clients that we have worked with for many, many years. However, our broad range of offerings has diluted our attention across too many projects and too many clients. We have sometimes struggled to adapt to changing market demands due to limited transparency and inefficient resource management. This hinders us from fully leveraging our capabilities across the business, and it makes it difficult to run a cost-efficient operating model. I think it is evident to all that we have not met our financial targets for a long time and that our organization has not been operating in an efficient way. This was the result of a very decentralized organization with limited focus on steering. You can imagine my frustration when seeing all of this untapped potential. That was also the starting point for our work with this new strategy.
Today, you will hear me and my team talk about how to unlock AFRY's potential going forward. Since January, we have taken significant steps towards simplification and greater focus. This is AFRY today after the initial reorganization. At the core of our business is a clear ambition to lead the energy and industrial transition and to contribute to the development of resilient societies. We achieve this by delivering engineering, project management, and advisory services across three global divisions: energy, industry, and transportation and places. While the majority of our 18,000 employees are based in the Nordics, AFRY has a truly global footprint. We have offices in 50 countries, and we execute projects in over 100 countries worldwide. In 2024, our net sales was SEK 27.2 billion, and our EBITDA margin was 7.8%.
Of course, one reason why we are here today is to talk about how to improve these numbers going forward. The three global divisions have chosen strategic segments. There are two in transportation and places. There are five in energy, and there are six in industry. These segments all share something. A large transition need. Each plays a vital role in the energy and industrial transition and supports the development of resilient societies. These segments all represent areas where we see strong long-term growth potential and where AFRY is well positioned to capture a significant share of the addressable market going forward. While each of these segments addresses different aspects of the transition, the diversity enables us to mitigate cyclicality. In addition to these segments, we have the management consulting segment. It is organized under the energy division.
They deliver advisory services across the group, but with the main share within the energy division. Sustainability is in the core of the solutions we provide and how we operate as a company. It starts with our people, our most important assets, promoting health and safety, and promoting diversity and inclusion. This also includes our efforts to reduce climate impact within our own operation, as well as ensuring responsible business conduct. Our greatest impact comes from the projects we deliver. By making conscious decisions on which clients and which projects we engage with, we actively contribute to energy solutions, efficient material usage, and to resilient societies. By steering our project portfolio towards more sustainable solutions, we stay relevant and we stay competitive. Now let's look into our three global divisions. Energy is currently our smallest division.
It stands out with the strongest growth momentum and the highest profitability levels. Our expertise in energy spans production, distribution, and storage across all energy sources and throughout the entire energy value chains. This is also our most global division. With operations in offices in 45 countries and project executions in more than 100. We have a particularly strong footprint in the Asia-Pacific region, reflecting our ability to deliver advanced engineering solutions on a truly global scale. Turning to industry, this is our largest division. Our portfolio here spans across advanced processes and manufacturing industries. In industry, we support resilient supply chains and enable access to fossil-free material and commodities. These are critical components in driving the transformation of advanced industries and the energy transition. Our capabilities span the entire project and asset lifecycle by combining the deep process know-how with strong project management.
We deliver world-leading industry expertise on a global scale. Last but not least, we have our global division, Transportation and Places. This division plays a vital role in shaping efficient mobility and transportation systems and in the development of sustainable places that meet evolving needs of the population. We lead large-scale complex infrastructure projects across transport, real estate, and urban development. Here we have a strong presence in the Nordics and Central Europe, with Switzerland and Germany as key markets in addition to the Nordic countries. Already today, AFRY has a strong global footprint with leading market positions in many of our industry and energy offerings. The largest part of our business is in the Nordics, and this strong base has served as a stepping stone for our international expansion.
Over the last three years, we have seen strong growth in markets outside the Nordics, driven by the solid position that we have established in many of our segments. In the important global ENR ranking, AFRY overall ranks number five in industry and number seven in energy. On a sector level, I would like to highlight our number one position within pulp and paper, but also strong positions that we hold in areas such as food, chemicals, metals, and mining. On the energy side, we hold top 10 positions in thermal, hydro, and wind. On the transmission and distribution segments, where we see large growth potential going forward, we are ranked as number seven worldwide. In transportation and places, we are one of the top five players in the Nordics, both within the road and rail and in the public and commercial segments.
This strong global market position across AFRY's portfolio reinforces AFRY's role as a trusted partner in our selected segments, which is a key driver to win new business and to build profitable growth on a global scale. Of course, our strong market position is a result of the strong client relationships we have established over the year. Today, we are proud to be trusted partners to clients that are leaders in their respective industries in all of our divisions. Here you see a strong representation of some of them. There is an untapped potential in these relationships. Going forward, we will increase our focus on clients like this because a diverse client base with international presence enables us to expand to new markets, expand across lifecycle phases, and across offerings.
We can also generate recurring projects for the same client more effectively and increase the value that we deliver to these clients. Clearly linked to our clients is our order backlog. These are the projects that we have sold but not yet delivered. This is a very important KPI for us. During my years as Head of the Energy Division, we worked actively with building our order backlog and improved the quality. This is something we now bring forward to the whole of AFRY. We do this by coordinating our sales activities more effectively across the business. By that, we can deliver projects more effectively, and we can optimize our own resource management over time. I'm happy to say that we have already taken significant steps in this direction. Our order backlog has grown also on a group level in the recent years.
Continuing this development will be even higher on our agenda going forward. This is a key component for profitable growth. Now I want to give you two real-life examples of how this will work in practice. In Taiwan, our client is developing one of the country's largest offshore wind farms, which is expected to begin commercial operations in 2026. AFRY here plays a key role as an expert advisor throughout all phases of the project. By combining AFRY's deep technical expertise and extensive experience in offshore wind power, in this case from the Netherlands, with the local competence in Taiwan, we deliver world-leading capabilities to our client. This approach is a strong example of how we can effectively expand to new markets by leveraging our deep sector knowledge and a scalable global delivery model. Another example.
This is a state-of-the-art greenfield pulp mill in Uruguay, which went successfully into operations in 2022. Here we partnered with UPM and supported them from early-phase feasibility studies to detailed engineering services to operational maintenance and operational excellence and maintenance. With our pulp and paper expertise and deep local insights into South America, we can support our clients in all phases of this project. This is a great example of AFRY's strength as a partner to leading clients across the lifecycle. Okay, let's broaden our perspective and look at the forces shaping our clients' need and thereby also the demand for AFRY's services going forward. Decarbonization is a key driver. From scaling low-carbon energy sources, the transformation of industries, and advancing carbon capture technologies. Closely linked to this is the electrification of transport, heating, and industrial processes.
There is a push for greater resilience in the current geopolitical situation. This links to securing access to raw material sourcing as well as circular solutions. Artificial intelligence is a potential transformative force in most of the industries. This complex development, of course, also means that the needs of our clients are evolving. We see that there is a growing demand for multidisciplinary services for the same client that are broader and span the entire project lifecycle and involve several of our disciplines. From early-stage studies to the implementation and to the operation. This also results in our clients increasingly needing our support in project management, and the need for advisory services is growing. The rapid development of technologies, digital technologies, in this case particularly AI, is creating new expectations for our engineering solutions to increasingly include new intelligent capabilities.
We established by now that AFRY is a trusted partner in the industrial and energy transition. Backed by deep sector expertise in areas corresponding to the global trends and evolving needs, this enables us to support our clients in navigating complex transitions. I have described where we are today, the changes that we have made so far this year, what the world looks like, and what our customers are looking for. Let's move on to where we take it from here, to AFRY's new strategy. Unlocking AFRY for us is about more focus, being more global, and having more focused client relationships to build stronger project delivery capabilities. Let me explain what I mean by this. There are five areas that will be critical drivers to our success moving forward.
By focusing on businesses on selected segments with large transformation needs, we can grow our business and operate more effectively to enhance the value to our clients. The segments that we have chosen represent areas where AFRY is well positioned to take leading market roles and where we see strong long-term growth opportunities. While our current business is concentrated in the Nordics, our ambition is to expand and position us as a global player. This strategic shift will unlock new growth opportunities and increase the long-term resilience of our business. We will prioritize large leading clients within our segments. This will build a diverse client base with an international presence, enabling us to generate recurring business across the project lifecycle. This in turn reduces sensitivity to business cycles and that we can leverage our existing client relationships to build and expand to new geographies.
By developing the full lifecycle offering and expanding our strategic advisory and project management services, we will enhance the overall value to our clients. We will also continue to build deep sector knowledge while building a structural knowledge that can be reused globally and adapted to local requirements. We believe that these strategic efforts will also strengthen our ability to attract and retain the best-in-class experts. This is our most valuable asset. By engaging in cutting-edge projects and collaborating with the most exciting clients in the industry, we can offer meaningful development opportunities and reinforce AFRY's position as one of the most attractive employers in the field. With these strong market drivers supporting us, combined with our market position and the strategic initiatives that we now are implementing, I am confident that AFRY has a bright future ahead.
Since taking on the role of CEO in January this year, we have worked intensively to set the foundation for AFRY's profitable growth journey. This has included an extensive portfolio review across all parts of our business, as well as a thorough assessment of our operating model. We have already introduced a new group structure and implemented operational measures, including the ongoing restructuring efforts that we communicated in Q2 this year. Today, we are proud to present our new strategy, Unlocking AFRY. Over the coming three years, we will execute on the strategic foundation we have established to reach our targets by the end of 2028. This includes focusing and growing our core segments to fully leverage our expertise and operate more effectively.
We will increase our share of advisory and project management services, enable us to better support our clients throughout the entire lifecycle, and capitalize on our high-value offering. In addition to this, we will implement a unified global delivery model across the business, allowing us to expand our global footprint. These strategic initiatives are underpinned by a strong margin expansion, driven both by strategic priorities and operational improvements across our organization. This will unlock the full potential of AFRY. For us, this means becoming a large-scale global powerhouse and competing with the major global players. We are building a business model with global-scale sales and delivery capabilities. Our strategic focus on high-value segments and services will fuel profitable and sustainable organic growth. This also opens up opportunities for value-adding M&A to further strengthen our long-term value creation.
This new strategy is actually built on the strength we already have. We will stay firmly rooted in our core strengths and values that serve us well. Make no mistake, this is a strategy that will transform AFRY over the coming years. We will actually shift from an unfocused and complex organization to a focused, segment-driven approach, concentrating on areas where we have the strongest market potential. Scattered positions in non-core segments are being phased out as we concentrate on the segments where AFRY has the best conditions to lead. We will transform from a diluted client approach to prioritizing large leading clients in our segments. We will simplify our cost base, moving away from a cost-intensive setup to a leaner structure that better supports our business. We will break down silos and enable cross-staffing across the entire group to maximize utilization.
We will also streamline our data and application landscape, creating a more harmonized system environment that includes AI-enabled delivery capabilities. By doing this, we will pave the way for increased value creation and for profitable growth. As a part of this strategic journey, we today announce new time-set financial targets for 2028, replacing our previous financial targets. We have set new absolute targets for sales in 2028 by SEK 35 billion. This target aligns with our strategy period and the initiatives that we are now launching. It clearly shows our priorities, but also how we view the market going forward. Our EBITDA target for 2028 also affirms our commitment to deliver improved profitability within this strategy period. We reiterate our target for net debt. Our CFO will come back to these targets in detail later this morning.
We are also updating a few of our sustainability targets to better align with the strategic drivers going forward. We stay committed to our target of net zero CO2 emissions by 2040. We have introduced a target for our project portfolio to better align more closely with the solutions that support the green transition. Our target of 40% female leaders by 2030 remains. We are adding a target of achieving an employee net promoter score in the top 25% of the engineering and advisory service sectors. This is actually a key metric for ensuring employee satisfaction and engagement, and this is essential for our long-term success. To reach our financial targets in 2028, we will execute our strategy in two phases: a growth path and a profitability path. In the first phase, which we started earlier this year and will follow throughout 2026.
Our focus will be on margin improvement across AFRY, paying particular attention to the low-performing segments. This will be complemented by organic growth in high-performing segments that already have satisfactory margins. M&A activity will be selective. It is a firm ambition that we will reach sufficient milestones in the first phase by the end of 2026 to be able to enter the second phase starting 2027. With the improved margins as the foundation, the second phase will be about accelerating growth, both organic and inorganic. We will also continue to expand the margins across the business. To conclude, we have now established a solid foundation by reviewing our portfolio, our operating model, and our organizational structure. This has set the foundation for profitable growth. Today, we launch a new strategy to transform AFRY to unlock the full potential. The strategy builds on focusing on.
Leading clients in selected segments, growth to a global delivery model, and to leveraging our deep sector expertise. As you saw, we have a clear phased path towards reaching the 2028 financial targets with decisive actions on cost utilization and on profitable growth. With that, I would like to hand over to Daniela Spetz, who is Head of Strategy and M&A, to go deeper into our strategy and to the growth path.
Thank you, Linda, and good morning, everyone. I joined AFRY about two years ago, and earlier this year, I joined the executive team, and I'm responsible for strategy and M&A at AFRY. I've been part in setting the new strategic direction for us, and I'm really excited today to present the path to profitable growth. I will go through some highlights of our market and competitive outlook.
The new strategic direction, and deep dive into what unlocking AFRY really means. I'll also provide some insights to our strategy execution path and give an update on M&A. Let's dig into it. Let's start with the market and competitive landscape. When looking at where AFRY is today, where we play, who we compete against, and where we're going, we need to take a step back and also look at the journey we have had today. I want to take the time to, as Linda mentioned, go through the journey. We note that AFRY today is very different from where AFRY was 15 years ago, or even 10 years ago. Fifteen years ago, or if I should say 150 acquisitions ago, we generated around SEK 4 billion. We represented predominantly a Swedish professional services business with an expansion journey ahead.
Today, we generate around SEK 26 billion, and we represent a leading engineering, project management, and advisory firm with global operations. Over the years, we have expanded our business not only to geographies, looking at Europe, Asia-Pacific, and Americas. We also added new services and new offerings. Today, we are building on that to create the future of AFRY. We are focusing our efforts to unlock AFRY. With the base we built over the years, we have a unique opportunity to build and become a large-scale global powerhouse in our industry, unlocking transitions and resilience. Let's dig into how we will do that. If we start with our offering today, it all starts with engineering. We provide advisory services, project and program management services, engineering and design, product design and development, and operations and digital solutions. It all stems from our engineering heritage.
Looking at the trends that we as well as our competitors face, we see substantial market opportunities for AFRY to capture around transportation and logistics, driven from enhancing resilience in society and supply chains. Energy and power, driven by the green energy transition and increased electrification. Digital and social infrastructure, driven by the merge of AI and technology. Water and waste, driven by, for example, our climate change actions. We also see large transition needs in our industries related to decarbonization and the need for new sources of raw materials. Needless to say, we see large market opportunities and large transformation needs that are here to stay. To capture the market opportunity, we meet with both local and global players, as well as specialists and generalists in the market. Local competitors include players such as Sweco, Norconsult, and Ramboll. Global players include WSP, Jacobs, and Arcadis.
Generally, more and more, we compete with global players also on our local home markets, as well as on the global base. In our field, we usually meet with both engineering and design firms, as well as management consulting firms, especially within our management consulting segment. Even though we see some consolidation in the market in recent years, new players continue to arise, and even the largest player today still holds a fairly small market share. This indicates both the market size as well as growth opportunities for AFRY. With our portfolio and foundation, the long-term trends and market opportunities we see, and our global leading position in key segments, we believe AFRY is in a unique position to continue scaling globally and building on existing platforms and positions. Start diving into the new strategic direction of AFRY and what unlocking AFRY is all about.
Our new strategy is all about focusing AFRY and harmonizing the company towards a joint and unified strategic direction, as well as implementing a fit-for-purpose operating model. I'll spend some time digging into each of the pillars today. Let's start with focus on segments with large transition needs. With a broad portfolio as a starting point, we performed a portfolio review earlier this year, and we narrowed down the focus for AFRY forward. In essence, by focusing on selected core segments, AFRY unlocks the transition towards a sustainable society and represents markets with large and long-term transformation needs, not only today but for the foreseeable future. They represent markets where AFRY can leverage our solid foundation and secure a leading position in each segment.
Clarifying our focus will also sharpen our offering, and we will be even better to capture market opportunities and become a better partner for our clients in the selected segments. Structuring ourselves organizationally in segments is a key element to enable our strategy. By organizing ourselves in global segments, we have a client-centric model combined with a global delivery model. Each segment can build deep sector knowledge, references, and practices, which can be scaled on a global basis. We enable cross-segment collaboration through efficient staffing and ensure segments are operating effectively. As we operate through segments now, we also see that some segments are specifically building now their own; we are building all strategies now for each segment under the group umbrella. We have some segments that are positioned for growth, while we have some segments that are more focused on.
Profitability improvements, we have segments that are ready to capture the market and to continue to build. And a few selected of them you see here: road and rail, transmission distribution, mining and metals, and nuclear. I'll deep into a little bit some of them in this presentation today. Going into our second pillar, competing on a global scale. AFRY's portfolio is currently tilted towards the Nordic, and we have an ambition to grow that footprint relatively to strengthen our position as a global player. Throughout our journey, we have built a global base over time. We have offices in 50 countries and projects in over 100. What's really different this time? When we are assessing our global footprint, it's clear that we are subscale in certain markets, where our platform for existing in the market costs more than our operations generate.
We will prioritize and focus our geographical growth to markets where we have the ability to create a complete and competitive offering and secure a leading position, either globally or through a niche offering. To clarify, we will continue to grow in absolute terms in the Nordics, which will continue to be a core market for us, but we will fuel that growth with extra growth on a global basis. We are also looking into the long tail of our countries to evaluate potential exits where AFRY is not in the position to win long term. Even though we do not believe that this will be a long list of countries to exit, we still believe that this is essential as part of the strategy to focus our efforts where we can win.
Our segments today have a different level of geographical footprint and market growth outlook until 2028. Here, we're tapping into pockets of growth for segments with high market growth potential and further expansion. Even though some segments might seem to have moderate growth outlook, markets such as mining and metals are massive, and here AFRY has a large potential to tap into the market and profitably grow its market share. Other such segments represent road and rail and life science. Instead of each segment growing everywhere, our strategy is to focus on specific growth markets for each segment and build on our existing footprint. To provide an example of what we mean by this, I'd like to present mining and metals. Our mining and metals segment offers primarily engineering and project management offerings, with a large base of its employees in the Nordics and in Brazil.
We operate on projects on a global basis. Growth potential includes adding early-stage offerings into our portfolio, as well as geographically expanding into key mining and metals markets such as within the Americas, Canada and Chile, within the APAC, including Indonesia and Australia. This also represents countries where AFRY has an existing footprint today. These countries are key markets within the segment, and by adding AFRY's global services into the local market, our offering becomes more competitive and complete. Further to it, we build scale into our existing footprint. Going into the third pillar, partner with leading clients. Starting with our client needs that continue to evolve, we also continue to develop our offering to meet the needs of our clients. We see that our customers request full life cycle offerings and complementary services across disciplines.
Further, they want a solid partner, regardless of industry cycle or project type. They want to request both strategic advice, but they also want it from a reliable partner who also has an edge in engineering. For example, our strategic management assessments within the energy transmission and distribution field become even more reliable when we partner up our engineering and management consulting teams to serve our clients. We see that projects become more and more multifaceted, with more stakeholders involved, which requires stronger project management services from us. Lastly, we see an increasing demand for integration of AI and digital tools into our offering. As we are gearing up to meet the client demands, we need to strategically assess our offering and how we continue to evolve it, but also how we should focus on our client base going forward.
Both to ensure that our offering is sharp, but also that we are competitive to the right client group. We are also effective in our operating model as we go to deliver the services. I'll go into an offering in a little bit and now focus on our client base. In our new strategy, we set out clear focus to focus on our leading clients in each segment. Our strategic client base will be diverse. It will include a mix of private and public clients, naturally representing top-tier clients in each segment. The total client base will then be diverse across our segments and provide opportunities for recurring projects and the ability to scale projects from one country to another through our clients. If we look at our starting point today, we currently have a base of 18,000 clients. That base includes.
Leading and large clients in our segments, and about 100 of our clients represent 50% of our revenue base. However, looking at our long tail, 11,000 clients represent less than 1% of our revenue. While we highly value our clients, administrating small, non-recurring projects drives cost. Administrative tasks and is ineffective to manage. This has further implications on our operating model, where systems and processes have to be applied for multiple business models. As part of the new strategy, we will focus on prioritizing large clients and leading ones, and build a strong client relation. Reduce the long tail of small clients, and gain a more effective commercial model. We see strong proof that this strategy is already working today. I'll give you two examples, one within Pulp and Paper and one within Hydro, when AFRY has a leading position.
Such as in Pulp and Paper segments, even in market downturns, we are the preferred partner to take on operations and maintenance projects, providing recurring projects to AFRY, as we have originally engineered and designed the original pulp mills. The second example in Hydro, we see that where AFRY established state-of-the-art installations, such as in Hydro projects, the leading question for the next installation is: who designed and engineered the market-leading hydropower plant? Since the answer is AFRY, we will continue to perform the next and the next hydropower projects around the world and scale knowledge assets from one country and one client to the next. Moving into our fourth pillar, evolve product delivery across the full life cycle. For over 130 years, AFRY has developed deep sector knowledge to unlock transitions.
Today, we are a trusted partner to deliver and develop the world's largest road and rail tunnel projects. We have been involved in 90% of the largest pulp mills designed globally, and we have enabled over 44,000 kilometers of transmission lines. We have contributed to 15% of the global hydropower capacity. It is clear that we are a trusted partner with deep sector knowledge to unlock transitions. How should we go about doing that forward? AFRY is successful when we build deep structural knowledge. To do so, we think that we need to focus on building a business model based on project delivery. This is rather than what we call professional services, which is rather providing the client with a person for a certain activity. We focus on projects that are team-based delivery efforts.
By focusing on the project-based delivery model, we will continue to build structural knowledge for AFRY. We will enhance client relations. We will enable stronger upselling as a part of our delivery, enable efficient resource management, and also strengthen the value for our employees to be part of AFRY. In addition to focusing our delivery model to the project form, we're also shaping our offering even further. In the new strategy, we're also taking actions to balance our offering and further strengthen our project life cycle coverage. Today, we are heavy in the engineering and design offering. We're especially heavy in the mid to later stages of the project life cycle. As part of the new strategy, we will increase early-stage offerings, such as strategic assessment and feasibility studies. We will increase the share of advisory and project management services across our portfolio.
We will reduce our overall share of product design and development services. We will, to a greater extent, leverage AI in our delivery model, which is enabled by harmonizing our operating model and system landscape. Lastly, we will put emphasis on driving a global delivery model to gain cost efficiencies and take advantage of cost arbitrage. Moving into our fifth pillar, being the home of best-in-class engineers and advisors. Our business is all about people. People that come together every day to bring extraordinary value to our clients. Our success relies on our capacity to attract and retain the best-in-class experts. As part of the strategy, we will continue to prioritize development opportunities for employees, strong performance management culture, secure market compensation levels, and drive internal mobility and global exposure for employees. Today, we have high employee engagement. We have healthy retention rates.
We are one of the most attractive employers in the Nordics, and we will continue to value and empower diversity, inclusion, and equal opportunities. By delivering cutting-edge projects to leading clients in the industry, we believe that this is the best possible way for us to both attract and retain employees over time. We can develop strong and attractive practices and provide development opportunities on a global scale. We will continue to secure a thriving culture and strong connection between the purpose, the values, and our work. An inclusive culture and leadership that nurtures collaboration and innovation. With this, we have put forward an emphasis on our leadership principle as well as employee principles, which is very well tied to our new strategy.
To sum up the new strategy, we are setting a clear direction of focus for AFRY, and we are with this reaching the full potential of us as a company. To sum up the strategy part of this session, I'd like also to put emphasis that we are also looking into the resilience of AFRY as a company for the long term. Part of building the new strategy is also to ensure that AFRY is set up and geared for the future and that we are managing our risk exposures properly. We can conclude, as we go live with the new strategy, that we are building stronger resilience for AFRY as a company. In the new strategy, we are well balancing the segments, big geography spread, client and project types, and offerings throughout the life cycle of the projects.
This creates a better risk exposure for us, and we bring stronger resilience for us as a company. Now I'll talk a little bit about the strategy execution path and where we are heading. Linda already introduced the framework to our execution path. The two phases and the two paths. It is clear that we will unlock significant value as we embark on the new strategy. Our CFO, Bo Sandström, will talk more about the profitability path in just a bit. I'll now provide some highlights into the growth path. Growth is not only a natural part of our business, but it's a fundamental element. Reviewing our portfolio. We have segments today with healthy margins and a good outlook. Combined with a favorable market, growth becomes an enabler for us to expand our profit base and strengthen our position in the market for the future.
Our segments are in different shape, and the markets are in different cycles. Going into 2026, low-performing segments are prioritized to recover and yield significant margin improvements, while we are capturing pockets of growth for high-performing segments. Some of the high-performing segments where we see growth potential include, for example, transmission, distribution, and nuclear. We have further identified profitable growth opportunities within mining and metals and life science, as well as road and rail. This is fueled by the investment in resilience and mobility for both industry and society. We further expect to grow the share of our advisory and project management offerings across our segments. We also look to capture cross-segment opportunities, such as within the markets of total defense and resilience, data centers, and water.
During this phase, we will also continue to add selective and strategic bolt-on M&As in high-performing and high-growth segments. That said, our main focus during the period is to recover and yield significant margin improvements across the group. As margins are expected to improve and we move into 2027, we will continue to accelerate growth across well-performing segments and high-growth markets and continue to add both organic and inorganic growth efforts. With that, I'd like to take the moment to talk a little bit about M&A at AFRY. We use acquisitions as a vehicle to execute on our group strategy. It's not for all. It's a complement to our organic growth journey. At AFRY, we work proactively with strategic M&A. That means that we build.
Pipelines in performing segments and growth markets where AFRY has M&A as the right lever to accelerate reaching wanted position. We are disciplined in our target assessment. We have clear criteria of the potential acquisitions we evaluate. Lastly, we go for full integration into AFRY. Our M&A strategy is fully aligned with our group strategy and follows clear lines of targeted geographies, segments, and offerings. We have clear requirements on the delivery model, size of the business, and assessing the culture of the company to secure smooth integration to AFRY. To highlight some of the parts of our M&A strategy, we generally look to acquire and expand globally outside of the Nordic to build on our current footprint in the Americas, rest of Europe, and Asia-Pacific. Here we can continue to create a complete and competitive offering for AFRY.
We specifically look to acquire within the energy segment, multiple of our industry segments, including mining and metals and life science, and within transportation and places, primarily within road and rail. We have updated our integration approach, looking at best practices, AFRY's strategic agenda, and learning from our previous M&As. With that, our new and clear integration approach secures capturing synergies upfront. Full integration into AFRY's operating model, and transferring into AFRY's brand. We also upfront address cultural integration matters to secure long-term success of the acquisitions. Also here, we have clear requirements and time plans that we followed, and we have high focus on business enablers and synergy gains. I would like to take the opportunity to provide three key takeaways from the session.
Firstly, we are in a unique position to win in core segments by leveraging our deep sector knowledge and global delivery model. Second, we put forward a clear strategic objective and drive profitable growth with disciplined execution measures for each phase in our execution phase. Lastly, we have built segment-specific strategies, balancing margin improvement and organic growth, while M&A acts as a selective strategic lever to reach our wanted position. Thank you very much, and over to you, Johanna.
It is time for our next session, where we will explore AFRY's three global divisions, and we will start with energy. With that, I am pleased to hand over to our Head of Global Division Energy, Elon Hegg.
Thank you, Johanna. Good morning, everyone. Modern lives run on energy. Electricity powers hospitals, keeps trains running, and keeps data centers in operation. It also helps us decarbonize our industrial processes.
The task for the society is twofold. Cut emissions, but keep the supply rock solid. I'm here to talk about Global Division Energy and how we're driving change in the energy landscape. Before I do that, I would like to show the full picture, starting with this slide. Global Division Energy is accelerating the green transition, helping energy, production, distribution, and storage towards more sustainable solutions. As mentioned before, we're active in 45 countries. We have projects in more than 100 countries. A very global division. With our strong financials and global reach, we have a good position, currently ranked as number seven in power, according to the ENR. We are very proud of that. Regarding sales, approximately one-third in the Nordics, more than 50% in EMEA. APAC clearly smaller, but growing fast. Our division holds six segments.
Five with a clear engineering profile, and one more advisory profile that is management consulting. Not only delivering energy, but also to other industries. Our strength lies in delivering local projects with global expertise. We take great pride in our project execution. We often talk about trends and what will change. Equally important in our business is to ask the question, what will not change? For us, delivering big projects out there, it's about that our clients in the future, they want to have their projects delivered on time, correct quality, and according to budget. That's why we are investing a lot in project management and have been doing in the energy division. What more? Clear focus on building on our existing geographical footprint that we have been addressed before by Daniela and also Linda. Regarding market opportunities, we focus on the trends, of course.
Building on our key offers where we know we are strong. We focus on strategic clients. One example of this is that we have now a segment called Renewable and Energy Storage, a new segment to capture the high growth potential and drive development and expansion within this segment. We are also focusing on building strategic advisory services with the introduction of management consulting. As a dedicated segment across AFRY. We believe strengthening our ability to deliver strategic value for our clients even more. What is driving the energy market today? The energy market is undergoing rapid transformation that we can hear about in the news. We also can see it in various projects. Driven by electrification, decarbonization, and integration of renewables. We outline four trends. Decarbonization and climate change, expansion of grids driven by electrification, high demand for energy storage. Hybrid projects with integrated solution.
For example, grid expansion, we see strong momentum as more renewables come online. When it comes to hybrid projects, we see a combination of renewables and batteries in the projects. These trends are creating opportunity for AFRY since we have a strong competence in production, distribution, and storage, and working in the full life cycle in projects. We also have a strong ability to deliver tailored solutions, combining technical expertise with the strategic advisory and sustainability to help clients navigate in this transformation that we are seeing. Building on these trends and how we can capture the market, we have selected the six segments. These are the six segments where we can see the greatest opportunity for value creation. These segments are now shown in the picture. It is hydro. We have been mentioning it before. Here we have a very solid footprint, 130 years of experience.
Nuclear, growing interest. Thermal, also a market potential and a solid, you can say, ENR ranking in thermal for AFRY. Renewable and energy storage. High growth potential, transmission and distribution, high growth potential, and management consulting. These segments have a lot in common. At the same time, we see differences when it comes to project size, regional differences due to client priorities in terms of technology. We started this journey years ago with the global segments. Some are already well advanced, like hydro, transmission and distribution, and renewable and energy storage, while others are still developing the global journey. Transmission and distribution is a good example in many ways. We have a slogan that says, "There's no transition without transmission." We see both the need for grid refurbishment, upgrade, and existing infrastructure.
The global need is accelerating investment across markets, and we can scale the business using the existing footprint that we have. Very important. We can see growing interest in nuclear. Alongside life extension and decommissioning, new build projects are picking up, especially in the feasibility stage. In Europe, but also beyond. AFRY is in an ideal position to support both established and emerging nuclear operators. We have some core competence within this field that we will utilize. Now, coming to clients and order backlog. Also mentioning some technologies. In the picture, you see a double curved arch dam. This is a tough design. And it is really state of the art when it comes to hydropower and generation. The curve, perfectly shaped. Can withstand high water pressure. This solution can be very effective for large reservoirs when you have a narrow valley.
This is a good example of what we are doing within the technology and the segments, how we can adapt to a specific location to the need that the client is asking for. We are proud to work with the largest energy clients in this picture. Our relationship with leading energy companies is built on a strategic key account management approach. Staying close to the client, understanding need, and how it evolves over time gives us the opportunity to address the full spectrum of our services, from engineering to advisory. This proactive engagement not only strengthens our position as a trusted partner, but also we can do cross-sector collaboration among us. In the picture, you also see our backlog development. The backlog includes both big, medium, and small projects, which is important to balance the workload over time.
The segments' compositions of the backlog differ somewhat, but overall, the reflection is the volume, the secured projects awaiting to be executed, providing visibility and stability for our division and also for our segments. We are also working a lot with sales and a healthy sales pipeline to support the profitable growth journey. We are focused. We make priorities. Now, let me come to a client case. This is Kopioenergia, an existing combined heat and power plant in Hapanniemi in the middle of Finland. It is expected to reach the operational lifetime in around 2035. The client is exploring solutions after the end of lifetime. What should we do? SMRs, small modular reactors, are among the alternatives under consideration for future heat production. AFRY is delivering then Finland's first environmental impact assessment for SMR district heating project solution, along with a high-level execute study.
This work involves investigations, survey, and close engagement with stakeholders. It will be completed in spring 2027. With many other countries also looking in new build nuclear and SMRs, we can, with the global team that we have in nuclear, with decades of experience, believe that our position is attractive to many clients when it comes to navigating the regulatory, financial, and environmental landscape in the nuclear space. Talking a little bit about our core markets and global presence and how we're focusing. Our core markets are Sweden, Norway, and Finland. As I mentioned before, one-third of the sales. We see growth opportunity in Europe and high growth potential in APAC. Global energy division and AFRY's global footprint continue to be a key strength for us. In Europe, we see strong growth in central and eastern regions, particularly within thermal, where our expertise comes in use.
Recent wins, including a major nuclear district heating design in the Czech Republic, reflect our ability to deliver complex solutions across diverse markets. In APAC, we support renewable integration, sustainable baseload solutions like hydropower projects, such as a 3,000 megawatt pump storage project in India. The Americas remains an emerging market for us in energy, with close collaboration with the global division industry. Final remark regarding geographical footprint and market focus. Across all regions, our ability to combine the local knowledge and insight with the global expertise positions us to capture growth opportunities and is very important for us. Key takeaways and closing remark. The green energy transition continues. Two, we have a long history in energy, and we are well positioned. Due to our capabilities within production, distribution, and storage, and how we execute projects. We focus on building strategic advisory across AFRY through management consulting.
By that, thank you for your attention. I will now leave over to Nicholas Oksanen, EVP and Head of Global Division Industry.
Good morning, everybody. Yeah. Thirty years in the company. It has been an amazing journey. You know why? Because this company is so great. It has such an expertise and great people. Now we are even accelerating the journey that we have done so far. I am really happy to walk you through the Global Division Industry profitability. Growth journey. What are we? You saw the figures already earlier. Linda presented those. There is, of course, one. It is this EBITDA margin. I come back to that later. We will improve that. That is key priority one. We have a global division in 20 countries, offices, and hubs, and serving 50 markets.
Of course, that needs a lot of expertise and cultural knowledge and also a strong project delivery platform that we have in place. ENR ranking number five in process industries. Now I must say that it is calculating only the international market. If we take also the home market, we are number four. A pretty strong position already now. We will even more accelerate internationally. Strong base in Nordics. I take Americas here because you can see that it is the second strong position here. It also shows our future potential. I come back later to that. Our segments: pulp and paper, life science, mining metals, food, chemicals, and bio refining. We have a leading position, as Linda presented in her presentation. I am really proud of that. The food is number one, as Linda had in the presentation.
In life science, we are also number six. That was not earlier mentioned, but also coming back to the growth path. Unlocking industry. First of all, I want to say the modern industry transformation is really happening. Although there are some hiccups, as you know, on the political scheme, it is really happening. The decarbonization is happening. The production will be decarbonized. The supply chains will become more resilient. The digitalization is driving the operational efficiency as well and in the assets. That is a strong message for us as AFRY. How we will build up our expertise and what kind of expertise we have to support our clients in that journey. Of course, I am very happy that we have now in our AFRY company the full industry together so that we can leverage together the global growth.
Of course, as I said, the profitability is the key priority number one. We will improve that through utilization improvement. We need in some certain segments and locations the right sizing. That will happen. We have as well some business model shifts where we have the intention to change the low margin businesses towards higher value-added services like project deliveries and also advisory services. Our product development and R&D will change part of that portfolio towards the project business as well. These are, of course, the two last segments. The parts here are related to automotive and other industry segments. The market and industry trends. Yes. The global geopolitical situation is, of course, currently challenging to think about long-term investments. There is for sure a strong demand for resilient supply chains.
That is also seen in our market and needs for services. Of course, this industry of decarbonization and digitalization is there and will continue. We have multiple examples for our projects that we are currently executing. This is a clear trend forward. As well, there are diminishing sector boundaries and emerging technologies. It is quite interesting that, for example, the pulp and paper companies are actually getting bigger and bigger in their assets, and they are becoming energy producers. A huge pulp mill is a big energy producer. That, of course, then affects also the environment around the pulp mill. Also, the energy companies have the CO2, which they want to capture. There is a lot of renewable energy, and with that, they become the e-fuel producers.
There, of course, we have great opportunities with the Elon Energy division to work together. Also, integrated solutions. The clients do not want just reports. They want the continued support to execute the business idea or operations improvement in their assets. Of course, since we are in the full life cycle of the operations, we are in a pole position to support our clients in the path forward. That, of course, gives us also a strong position globally. How do we capture the market? Yes, we have the strategic advisory. We have the advisory services. We know the markets. We know the technology, the trends, etc. It gives us a good opportunity to create the business cases to our clients together with our engineering people. Then we can, of course, expand these ideas and scale it also globally, as.
Linda and Daniela were saying. Quite interesting are these growth sectors. A couple of years ago, quite many startup companies were established around these sectors to create the green transition opportunities. Of course, since we have the technology and process know-how, we were in a pole position to develop that concept and the innovation together with our clients. There were many companies putting a lot of efforts to that. Yes, of course, now, as we know the situation, there has been a little bit—I come back later back to that—but a little bit of cease, but the trend is clear. They will continue, and there will be a bright future for us to support them in the different mature technologies like power to X and e-fuels. Of course, it is always a balancing issue between the large investments and the operational improvement services.
Close to clients' assets. Definitely, when you have a life cycle, different sectors, segments, yes, they will stabilize each other, but we need as well a right balance between the large investments and the operational improvement services. I come back a little bit later. You can see it from the order backlog, how we are prepared and how we have done in this little bit, I say, market-wise difficult couple of years now. Of course, for us, I'm really proud, I must say, of our industry people, because we are in the whole life cycle of the investment. We start from the strategies. We are creating the business case for the asset with our innovation. Then we are doing the technical stuff around the business case, meaning then the investment cost estimate, pre-engineering, and getting prepared for the client to make the investment decision.
We are helping in the whole project delivery, all disciplines. Meaning also the procurement, construction management at site, and helping the client in the project management to implement the project. Finally, when we have implemented the project, we are normally establishing the office close to the asset so that we can support the client locally in different kinds of operations and maintenance issues. That has been a successful concept for us for a long time. Therefore, we have also established operations in quite many places close to our clients as well. Now, our segments: pulp and paper, number one in the world. In the U.S., we are actually number two. Our target is number one. I show you one client case a little bit later, which is great evidence how we tackle the U.S. market as well.
Mining and metals. Daniela explained already quite nicely the mining and metals strategy forward. One. What you certainly have seen also is this RETA MFA, what we did. This year. And RETA Engenharia is a Brazilian-based mining. Early-stage. Engineering company. I visited them, and I must say that this is a great hub together with our AFRY hub. To go forward in the Americas market and also expand to North America. Then from the metals side, in Europe. We are in all of the three green steel projects currently. Life science, number six. In the world. And life science, we have a very strong base in the Nordics. As already earlier was mentioned, we will expand to life science as well. The early first initial steps have been taken to go into Americas. Currently we are.
Involved in one interesting project, executing that and building the platform forward to expand in Americas. Food, yes, we are number one in the world. Food certainly is a lower margin business, and we need to still improve our operational efficiency in the food sector and then also find the angle to utilize the different platforms and segments locally in the different regions to serve our customers and the food. Chemicals and bio refining, of course, very interesting as well to support the pulp and paper because of the chemicals, so the bleaching chemicals that are done for the pulp and paper mills. There we have an extremely good potential to also globalize our chemicals and bio refining through the pulp mill chemicals experience. As well, taking into account the e-fuels market in the Nordics and Europe, we will also have their expansion potential.
Automotive and other industries, we have in that segment, we have the automotive, the defense, digitalization. Also we have, as I earlier mentioned, product and software development. For sure we have in this segment. Certainly a bigger part we will fine-tune with the value creation services towards project services. As well, we will select the profitability path for automotive and others so that we improve the total profitability of the industry division. Our clients, you can see strategic key accounts as the energy division as well has many, you know, here long-term clients. We have had them, trusted partner for their long-term investments. We have frame agreements with them. It is a partner relationship, as already Daniela was as well saying. Related to the order stock, you can see that the +3% improvement over the years. Definitely the market.
With the lack of larger investment projects, have been challenging, but we have still been able to increase the order stock. Of course, the jump from the quarter four 2024, you can see here, and there we booked the two big projects, the SSAB and then the Arauco pulp project. The jump is in there in the order stock. Principally we have taken the larger investments from the market, what have been there, and we have been pretty good, and we are pretty good, well prepared for the next investment cycle to come. Here is the client case, Green Bay Packaging in the US. It's a pulp and paper mill. We started the cooperation already some five years ago with the strategic advisory and helping them in the early stage field studies.
The trusted partner supporting them in creating this business case and the engineering case and now implementing that project. It is about sustainability and then preparing as well them for the next growth path. Roughly 100 people working with this project. Of course, as I said earlier, number one target in the U.S. market, and this is one way to it. On top of that, there is one interesting curiosity because we are doing this in cooperation with our U.S. and Brazilian resources. Since we have a very strong platform in Brazil with the EPCM delivery potential, this gives us a cost competence foundation towards the North American market. You can also certainly think about this RETA Engenharia related to mining and metals. We for sure use the same idea to extend to mining and metal delivery potential in North America.
Waiting for the startup. Our growth path. You can see we are international. We want to become even more international. We have the high-value growth segments. For sure, Americas is a very important market. Europe will stay an important hub for us in technology and know-how. We have a great opportunity with the one project delivery platform to support from Europe the different projects in Americas and also in Asia. You saw also from the presentation of Daniela the growth region, so North America and Americas was a big part in it. Certainly it is one of the industry priorities as well. In Europe, yes, we have interesting operational efficiency projects, data centers. We are waiting for the green transition, larger investments to come in a couple of years. We are very nicely prepared to implement those in the EPCM mode.
To conclude. Number one, profitability journey. We will improve our profitability. Number two, we are prepared for the next life cycle. Investments. Of course, the high-value segments are the base for that. We will selectively select the projects which best suit for us and bring the best turnover and the margin, and in which we can, in the best way, support the clients. Number three, we are prepared for the international growth. I am really happy for that because I have been seeing the international competitors, what Daniela also mentioned. We are well prepared to compete. Our mission: we have great expertise, great people in the company. I must say that combining that with the strategy and advisory, engineering, creating business cases for clients, it is really, really great.
That supports the mission in the industrial transformation for the decarbonization and digitalization and resilient supply chains. That is what the people also want to do. Of course, everything is about expertise. Combining the expertise and getting teams together. We have tools for that and people for that. We have a much more clear organization, which then allows the people to work together. That makes the success. One thing to mention, to be honest, infrastructure needs to keep the pace as well, right? There we have the transportation and places. Of course, the efficient mobility and fancy places, right, Linda? Great. Thank you.
Hello again. As you might know, we are currently in the process of recruiting our future Head of Global Division, Transportation and Places. I am happy to present the division today.
Just wanted to say here that we have Tukka Sormonen with us here. Tukka actually yesterday stepped into the role as acting or interim Head of the division. I think you met all Tukka out there and you have the opportunity to meet him in the break as well. Thank you. Okay, starting with an overview of this division in figures. As the headline suggests, AFRY's global division, Transportation and Places, is about shaping the future of mobility and creating places that stand the test of time. With around 6,500 experts across Europe, we bring together deep competence in transport infrastructure, real estate, water, environment, and urban development. Our strength here lies within integrated services within engineering, architecture, design, and advisory. The division is built around two segments. It's the road and rail, and it's the public and commercial places.
We will explore them more in just a minute. The footprint here spans 10 countries in Northern and Central Europe, with projects in an additional five. It is the combination between local insights and international expertise that positions us among the top five players in the Nordics. This division leads a variety of smaller and larger projects that contribute to resilient, inclusive, and future-proof cities and communities. We are proud to be part of this solution, accelerating the transition to more sustainable societies. We do it one project at a time. Let's take a look at the strategy and the direction for the division. This division, transportation and places, has already taken significant steps in its strategic refocus to maximize the value creation and the profitability. Here we are shifting focus in our sales efforts to concentrate on large key accounts in each country.
Ensuring that our resources are aligned with the most impactful opportunities. We also recognize that part of this business, especially in the segment places, have developed overcapacity over time. This has been due to market shifts. However, we are now actively addressing these areas, making the necessary adjustments to ensure that our teams going forward are fit for purpose and agile. By doing so, we now rapidly respond to the market demands. At the same time, we are seeking and leveraging on the growth opportunities that we see, especially in the transport infrastructure market. Ultimately, our goal is to unlock the full potential of this division. We are refocusing our client base. We are optimizing our capacity, and we are expanding our advisory services, and we are targeting growth areas. Setting the stage for profitable growth. Yes, the position is now positioned for profitable growth.
We have done this by addressing the urgent need for sustainable transportation, for resilient infrastructure. With defense and with energy-efficient urban environments. Here we also see a growing maintenance depth across our markets. Yes, the division offers engineering, project management, advisory, architecture, and design, as well as environment, water, and sustainability services. By leveraging our international expertise and expanding the advisory services, we are positioning ourselves for early engagement in the opportunity life cycle. With an increased focus on larger recurring clients, we will tailor our offering and position ourselves to be the preferred partner in supporting the transition towards a more sustainable future. The global division, transportation and places, is quite easy. It consists of two segments. We have the road and rail. Here we deliver cutting-edge mobility solutions across tunnel, bridges, and transport infrastructure.
We have our public and commercial places where we provide architectural and building solutions for public, private, and commercial sectors. The global division, transportation and places, has a robust order backlog and strong relationships with clients across Europe. You see some examples here. I would say, despite the recent fluctuations that we have seen, the focus on our key accounts and strategic partnerships ensures a continued resilience and positions us for long-term sustainable growth, also in the infrastructure sector. Again, we will concentrate on larger recurring clients and to engage with them in the project life cycle, especially through advisory, architecture, and sustainability services. I would like to give you one example of this. Here you see that our proven expertise in large-scale infrastructure is exemplified by the Swiss Federal Road Authority, where we have planned the refurbishment of the Western Bypass in Zurich in Switzerland.
This project demonstrates our ability to deliver complex, high-value solutions, showcasing AFRY's position as a trusted partner for the public sector clients across Europe. In this project, AFRY was involved in the construction of the original tunnel 20 years ago. Now we have returned this year for the rehabilitation and the modernization work. We plan to deliver planning, supervision, and engineering of the critical operating and safety equipment and traffic systems with the aim of minimizing the traffic in the city of Zurich. I think this is a testament to our long-term partnership with the Swiss Federal Road Authority. When we look at the geographical footprint, this division leverages its strong Nordic roots and the solid Central European footprint to compete successfully in local markets.
We will secure profitability by continuously improving our position across both segments, but prioritizing growth within rail and road. The chosen path is to improve the Nordic position and to continue to grow in Central Europe. I think there are really good prospects ahead also for this global division. Each year, AFRY takes part in thousands of projects, big and small, across the globe. This is a look at four snapshots of what making future actually looks like. In Laos, hydropower already lights up most homes, and the Luang Prabang project will further boost the country's green energy supply. The challenge? Building a power plant that does not flood the UNESCO-listed region, disrupt fisheries, or spark tensions with nations in the Lower Mekong Basin. The solution?
A run-of-river design, no massive reservoir, just the natural flow of the Mekong, generating enough energy for 4 million people in Laos and Thailand.
The import of hydropower energy actually allows Thailand to shut down some of their coal-fired power units. AFRY leads the engineering of this project from feasibility study over implementation until the completion of this scheme. The project will follow the highest international standards of sustainable hydropower. The fish migration used in Luang Prabang has proven its exceptional functionality already in the downstream scheme of Sayabuli.
In Brazil, Arauco is building the world's largest single-line pulp mill. The real story is how it's engineered. Instead of draining rivers, the mill uses minimal water, treats all effluent, and returns 90% to its source. It also turns steam and heat into 400 megawatts of renewable energy, half of which is fed into the national grid.
AFRY has supported the Aralco Super EU project from its early conceptual stages. Today, AFRY leads the project execution under the PCM model, applying advanced technology across engineering, procurement, and construction management. AFRY is very proud to be part of this transformative journey. Sometimes the most complex construction projects happen in the smallest building blocks of the human body. At CCRM Nordic in Gothenburg, the future of precision medicine is being developed: groundbreaking cell and gene therapies, known as ATMPs, with the potential to treat incurable diseases like genetic disorders and cancer.
ATMPs are very promising. For these treatments to be widely accessible, you will need advanced facilities, making sure that production is constantly of high quality and in compliance with GMP standards. Right now, CCRM Nordic is expanding with a new state-of-the-art facility.
AFRY is leading the engineering, design, installation qualification, and validation, making sure that the lab meets the highest standards in the industry.
Berlin's rail commute has been evolving for nearly two centuries. Since 1924, the S-Bahn has carried Berliners through history. Today, it moves 1.4 million passengers every single day. With the I 2030 initiative, Berlin is building a future-ready network. Currently, the railway network is at its limit, and people are facing challenges on their daily commute. We are planning to renew and build more than 100 km of railway tracks, including more than 50 bridges and various railway stations. We are enabling everyone to move towards a more sustainable future. That is what makes me really proud to be part of these projects.
What really excites me about the I 2030 projects is how they highlight what AFRY does best.
We've got talented people all over Germany to tackle the challenges of the projects. There is no doubt that these open a lot of opportunities for us over the next 10 years.
With solutions across different sectors, scales, and materials, we are unlocking transitions that will impact generations to come.
Good morning, because it's still morning, right? I'm almost three years in, and it's still fascinating to see real examples of what we actually do. I will talk about our value creation journey and link it to our financial targets. During this session, I will start with reconnecting to the financial targets and give some background, then going into our profitability path and talk about the priorities to take us to the right profitability level in 2028. I will also spend some time on some selected enablers, also important, although not directly yielding financial benefits.
Finally, I'll talk about AFRY's capital allocation in the strategy period. Let's get to it. We are today presenting new financial targets for AFRY: time-set targets for 2028 on net sales, EBITDA margin, and net debt to EBITDA, replacing our old targets. For 2028, we have a target of SEK 35 billion on net sales, currently at right above SEK 26 billion. That is combined with a target of 10% EBITDA margin, currently at 7.2% on rolling 12 months. On leverage, we maintain our targets on supporting. Targets of around 2.5 times net debt to EBITDA at the end of the year. We're also presenting our targets on supporting KPIs, also for 2028, to serve as guidance on these important metrics. Order backlog should increase materially, and we target at SEK 30 billion by 2028. Utilization, currently at 72% on rolling 12 months, should improve by two percentage points to 74% by 2028.
First and prime focus is on profitability. Let's look at where we're coming from. Unsatisfactory profitability is not new to AFRY. Already when joining three years ago, this was the main challenge for AFRY, and it was our ticket to play. Focus had been almost solely for many years on growth. The company had not been able to leverage on the growth that had been achieved. We have since made significant efforts to improve. The most successful was the comprehensive infrastructure improvement program launched two years ago, setting the previous infrastructure division on a positive profitability trajectory that has been carried since. In addition, we have during the last two years managed a quite mixed market, with several of our large segments being clearly challenging. To secure not dropping even further in profitability, we have made continuous capacity adjustments to secure the downside.
This has then pressured also growth, and we're currently in negative territory on growth last few quarters, although managing to maintain a stable operating margin. Even if it's clear that the market has not helped us along the way during the last few years, it's evident to us that AFRY needs a more comprehensive approach to turn the profitability. I will address in my section some of the key activities that we will undertake during the next years to drive the trend reversal, some of which have already been initiated earlier this year. Our profitability path, as Linda introduced it, is divided in two phases, and we're already well into the first phase. We're addressing a number of items, both as key drivers of profitability uplift and as enablers to, on a run rate level.
Improvement, run rate improvement level, reach as far as we can, as quickly as we can in phase I. In phase II, we will continue to drive margin expansion, but with a fundamental in place. We talk about profitable growth, and we present new time-set targets on net sales and EBITDA margin. In terms of value creation, growth and margin are key value drivers for us. In the project business, it is important to understand the importance of order backlog and utilization. Thereby, we present them as supporting KPIs. Linda already talked about the importance of order backlog, and I'm further stressing the importance of utilization. Order backlog works both as a growth driver and a driver to profitability, whereas utilization is primarily a profitability driver. Cash flow generation, capital allocation, naturally important, and I will address them later on in the presentation.
Order backlog, then, as said, is a key measure for AFRY, being the most important KPI for profitable growth. It is a growth driver by being an indicator for secured work ahead, and it drives profitability through its composition and, to some extent, size. We firmly believe that a sizable order backlog with the right composition is a strong driver for operational efficiency through utilization. From a commercial aspect, there is an underlying margin in the order backlog driving the overall margin directly. Utilization, then, is a key measure of operational efficiency and an immediate driver of EBITDA margin, assuming stable underlying price-cost development. Neither of these measures are absolute or standalone. At the end of the day, it is the EBITDA margin that matters for AFRY in the profitability path, but they work well as supporting KPIs to give more light on our journey ahead.
To drive improvements on these metrics and ultimately the EBITDA margin, I have four prioritized areas, each comprising a set of actions included in the profitability path. The priorities are quite wide in their nature, ranging from commercial leadership to fixed cost optimization. That is a reflection of what we believe is needed to drive the profitability path towards the target. The four priorities are: commercial leadership, portfolio and delivery enhancement, fit for purpose support structure, and fixed cost optimization. I will go through each of these priorities, focusing on actions in each to support our profitability. Starting with commercial leadership, building a solid and profitable order backlog is a key driver for AFRY, as already mentioned. It's equally important to grow in size as to achieve the right composition. It is important for all our three global divisions. The right backlog is about balance.
It's balance between markets, it's balance between projects' length and size, between margin, between various capabilities, and also between clients. With such a sizable portfolio at hand, with thousands of projects, we will take further steps to strengthen bid and execution tailgates to further improve the composition of the backlog to strike the right balances. Supporting our path towards the financial targets. Related to this is to finalize harmonization of our backlog data to improve analysis and predictability, which we're determined to complete well within the strategy period. The leading commercial approach to us is to enhance focus on the strategic client base and even further develop our key account practices to support that, particularly cross-segment and cross-divisions, as you've heard from the division heads. We have many strong examples developed during the last years, and we will continue to build further on these.
In the area of portfolio and delivery enhancement, we have several actions that support the profitability path. Starting then with the portfolio. Portfolio management has its focus in phase I, initiated with a full portfolio review that was performed during the spring. From a portfolio perspective, we will drive profitability improvements across the company, but particularly in segments which are underperforming to their respective potential. Here we will continue to adjust capacity where needed, while those segments that are growth segments will focus on organic growth, potentially boosted by M&A. The portfolio review gives us that approximately 10% of 2024 revenues were non-core, typically in small parts. Here we will diligently reposition, divest, or phase out such business, and those efforts are already ongoing. On the delivery side, we're already having several strong capabilities. We will continue to develop a cost-efficient global delivery model where project-based deliveries are in focus.
We have these capabilities in place already today, but they can be developed further and, more importantly, cover a larger scope than today. Here, resource management is at the core. Efforts to harmonize, reskill, and increase transparency throughout AFRY will provide opportunities for improved cross-staffing throughout the company. This opens opportunities both to improving utilization and also further exploring cost arbitrage opportunities. Activities in this area are generally initiated in phase II or in phase I, but we expect material effects to be more in the midterm. Shifting more internally, one of my priorities relates to our support structure in our operating model. With an efficient operating model in our line of business, significant growth should create scale effects to be visible on the overall company. Looking at our SG&A development over time, it has been flat in relation to revenue over a long period of time.
When the company has grown significantly. To achieve those scale effects, we're executing a number of actions, starting by enabling a scaled model through process harmonization and tool development. Also addressing the organizational setup. In the new group structure, many of these resources are part of a new organization, and we're step by step moving towards an efficient support structure. Included in this priority is also evaluating global delivery options, also for support services, also embedding AI and digital solutions to drive internal efficiency. Aware that it will take some time to get full effect of this transformative approach. We're acting decisively to get a good majority of the run rate effects in place before the end of next year. As a part of phase I of the profitability path. The final priority aims at fixed cost optimization.
Here I want to highlight two areas, both with ample size and each covering approximately 30% of our fixed cost base. Starting with the IT side. We have a developed and efficient core, but scattered system landscape in the business. Here we see potentials to consolidate gradually over the next years. Facility costs is the second area, where we have, over the last five years, done selective efforts to consolidate our lease portfolio. Here we still have a large number of offices, and we see opportunity to consolidate and reduce both the number of offices and size of offices. We're already on this journey today, and we have, the last couple of years, been slowly declining in the number of offices. This will continue and will, as we enter into new facility agreements, gradually provide profitability support.
Where relevant, we will be opportunistic to buy ourselves out of lease agreements, but we do not expect this to be a material portion of the restructuring efforts ahead. Worth noticing, in contrast to many of the other activities, these two areas will support profitability, but not through improvement in utilization. Bringing the priorities together and looking at sizing and phasing. Unlocking AFRY entails a broad and ambitious agenda on the profitability side. My prioritized areas are all material in size, although we believe that the fit for purpose support structure is somewhat larger than the others, and also where we can move the fastest. Many of the actions we execute on will bring gradual effects, but given the expected potential on the support structure, we are committed to, on a run rate basis, close more than half of the margin gap in phase I.
Since some of the actions we're taking are such that many other companies have taken before us. The most difficult part on this journey is not figuring out what to do. It's actually executing it, making it happen, and yield the results. Therefore, I want to spend a bit of time to talk about some of the enablers. One clear enabler for success of the profitability path is a transparent and harmonized organization. Being one of the main reasons why we went so quickly into the new group structure and launched our restructuring program upfront. A harmonized organization drastically improves potential for successful implementation in general, and the restructuring program also reduces internal barriers to execute. With the new structure and the organization behind it, we took big steps towards a harmonized organization, but we will continue to optimize in the new structure.
In general, we're progressing according to plan. With SEK 90 million taken in Q2 and an additional SEK 30 million in Q3, we estimate some further SEK 170-270 million in restructuring cost. As in the first quarters, restructuring cost will primarily relate to redundancies. Looking at the mix of redundancy and restructuring cost, approximately one-third relates to each of the categories: managerial, support, and capacity. When starting the program in Q2, we stated that we estimate the payback of the restructuring costs of approximately one year as they occur, and this still holds. Another enabler to address is steering structures in the company. With the new organization in place, we're now taking steps to improve our performance management model in AFRY, harmonizing what has previously been differentiated. In addition to this, we have already taken first actions to harmonize also the short-term incentive structures in the company.
We will build one consistent incentive framework throughout the organization, where it previously has been scattered, and to some extent, sub-optimizing our overall performance. Focus in the incentive structure will reflect the organization and be built on our organizational global divisions and segments. Also, we will explore options to more quickly be able to adjust incentive drivers throughout. The final enabler to highlight is technology and AI. Technology and AI is one of the enablers for AFRY, both to reach our wanted position. And deliver a significant uplift in profitability. We look at technology and AI from two main perspectives. The first, in client deliveries, both related to project delivery and to providing digital offerings. The second, to streamline operations, both in terms of the business and in relation to support services.
We're already progressing in many areas, and I will share some words on how we apply AI and specifically how we address the core of AI, which is data. We are entering a new phase, which allows us to accelerate the digitalization and automation of our core processes. This is not about isolated tools or pilot initiatives. It's about systematically redesigning how we operate across the business. From project delivery to finance, HR, and engineering workflows, we're embedding digital capabilities and AI where they create measurable value. These efforts will contribute to support improving margins, reducing overhead, and enabling scalable growth. At the same time, our client-facing work continues to benefit from our unique combination of deep sector expertise and rich engineering data. For over 130 years, AFRY has built a knowledge base that empowers our teams to deliver real value.
By combining this with modern technology platforms, we ensure our deliveries are not only technically sound, but also transparent and efficient. Client-centricity remains central. Whether we are streamlining internal operations or using AI to optimize project delivery, our goal is to improve delivery precision and relevance for our clients. To realize the potential of AI and digitalization, we're taking clear steps to build an AI-ready organization. The foundation is already in place: skilled people, valuable engineering data, and scalable technology platforms. To do this, we're focusing on four concrete initiatives. First, opening up our enterprise data platform to enable better access to insights across the organization. Secondly, driving efficiency by rethinking our processes and tools from the ground up for the AI era. Thirdly, upskilling our workforce through tailored AI training programs.
Lastly, equipping and empowering teams and engineers with AI tools and smart agents to automate routine tasks and improve decision-making. Technology and AI are not standalone initiatives. They are integrated enablers that support both our strategic ambitions and our financial performance. As the final section, I want to share some considerations on capital allocation. AFRY is generating a stable and positive operational cash flow and has done so over a very long period of time. We're upholding a disciplined capital allocation. With limited CapEx investments and a stable and unchanged dividend policy, excess capital has historically been used for bolt-on M&A, maintaining a strong balance sheet with a stable leverage at approximately 2.5 times at the end of the year. I will say a few words specifically on the operating cash flow and capital allocation to M&A for the strategy period.
Looking at operating cash flow during the last four years. With the exception of 2022, where we experienced a clear post-COVID working capital rebuild-up. We see a steady EBITDA to operating cash flow ratio. M&A spend has been significantly lower since 2022. Despite this, we have stable leverage given lower EBITDA levels driven by restructuring and particularly weak calendar. Looking ahead, with a stable cash conversion ratio, improving EBITDA performance will drive cash flow generations in years to come and be the primary driver of continued positive operating cash flow development. Some additional words on capital allocation to M&A in the two phases we have described throughout this morning. In the first phase, we will continue to be conservative on M&A and direct any M&A to core segments typically already performing. Directionally, we will maintain our leverage profile while doing this.
When coming into the second phase, EBITDA improvement will drive operational cash flow, and additional M&A bandwidth will also come when growth picks up. In this phase, we expect more intensified M&A activity to support the organic growth. As a final note, I will provide three highlights from the CFO section. AFRY is implementing a focused profitability path. Targeting a 10% EBITDA margin by 2028. Through improved order backlog, higher utilization, and strategic cost reductions. We are addressing multiple enablers to support and secure operational efficiency. Disciplined capital allocation underpins the strategy with stable operating cash flow. Selective M&A, and a solid balance sheet ensuring financial resilience and capacity for growth. Thank you.
Thank you, Bo. Now we will begin the Q&A session. I would like to welcome Linda, Bo, and Daniela up on stage again. Are we ready? Yes.
I think we have a first question over there.
Yeah, hi. Raymond from Nordea. Two questions for me. You said non-core is about 10% of AFRY. Could you help us understand a bit better what portion of this can be converted into other projects and maybe what portion of this you think might be divested potentially?
Yeah. As you saw, that is around 10%. And you followed us in Q3. You saw that we had quite a substantial negative growth in our industry division. That is one of the reasons why we are addressing this non-core element. We're doing this constantly. Also, as Bo said, it's quite scattered, this non-core business that we have. It's almost only small bits and pieces here and there. Would you like to add something to that, Bo?
Yeah, I'll just add, specifying the 10% was 2024 revenues, right?
We are already addressing this to a large extent. That is also one of the reasons why we are experiencing negative growth during this year. A portion of it is already handled, typically then by phasing out. We have not, at this point, divested any of the pieces, but we still hold that as an opportunity. We will, of course, reskill and reposition as much as we can in a sense to cover the growth needs that we have in other segments. I would not specify it more than the 10% of the 2024 revenues, but we are well on our way. Like I said and like Linda also said, it is typically quite small pieces.
No, I think that is great. You also answered my second question, so I will give the mic back.
Okay, let's see.
We have a question in that corner from Fredrik.
Thank you. Thank you for all the presentations. Good insights on your strategy here. I have a question, Bo, on your slides. You stated that you're going to reach 74% billing rate as part of this margin improvement journey. In 2021 and 2022, you had more than 74% billing rate, and you reached 8.8% margin at that point. Is the majority of the improvement more focused on cost this time? Thank you.
Yes. Yes and no, I would say. I think part of it is for sure cost-related, and it's also related to the potential that we see on the support structure side. That is not the full equation to it. I think looking those few years back and doing that comparison that you just did. Just linking that to.
The comment that I had in relation to utilization as a driver, it assumes stable price-cost development, right? I mean, everything else alike, it assumes that. The dependency or the link to the EBITDA margin is dependent on that. I think looking those years back, we've had a falling curve on utilization, but still we haven't fallen all that much on EBITDA margin. We have deteriorated, but not in relation to the deterioration in utilization. That is because taking opportunities on kind of price development during that time specifically. I think the 74% part of it will be cost-driven. Part of it will be related to, most of it will be cost-driven, right? Different types of costs, some actually more in the business and just increasing the efficiency in the business, and some supported then by support functions.
Of course, we will always strive to have a positive balance on the kind of price and cost development from an underlying perspective. That is not included in that metric.
In the front here, we have a question from Don. Great.
Thank you very much, Don from SEB here. I think I'll do two questions here. A little bit on how you're thinking about balancing growth versus profitability. You still have a quite ambitious growth target around 10% per year if you calculate backwards. Just on your thinking about how do you ensure that you don't spread too thin again, and also if it's possible to give a split. This is a 50-50 split between acquired and organic growth in that 10% as you see it.
I can start. As you saw, now this strategy period is clearly into two phases.
First is about fixing the profitability, but already in the first phase. Complement that with organic growth in the already performing segments. We will capture some organic growth in the first phase as well. In the second phase, we are then on a good profitability level, and we will increase both the organic and the inorganic growth by the M&As. I will let Daniela sort of fill in here, but I can assure you that our history of, as I think you said, 150 M&As has made us very scattered. I do not think any of us will like to end up in that situation again. We have a totally different M&A agenda going forward. We will actually be very selective and very focused in our M&As from the very first discussions. Maybe Daniela, you will add to that habits perspective.
First of all, yes, we have now focused segment strategies and also looking at where we should build for the future as well on a geographical market as well. In our M&A strategy, I work very closely with my team together with the divisional heads and the segment heads to very proactively build our pipelines. We do further assessments, and we have very clear requirements on what type of targets we should focus on to make sure that we build on the lessons learned, the previous history, and also that we do not build too much of that scattered position as we had previously. Really building on our core leading position, adding offerings, and adding geographies that actually build a competitive position for AFRY.
If I can follow up with another question, perhaps on you spoke a lot on the Americas opportunity.
Just so I understand it better, I mean, it's a big market, but it also means that there are a lot of bigger industrial players active in that market. It would be interesting to hear and understand a bit more what you think you can bring to the table in terms of the competence you can bring that will separate you from, yeah, the ones that are already active. Absolutely.
Thank you. Very good question. I think here, as you saw, we build very much on the segments where we have a leading global position. For instance, in pulp and paper, as we mentioned, we are number one, and we are already number two in Americas. Of course, that's one natural field where we will continue our structured efforts.
There are other segments where we also have leading positions, looking into the metal and minings, for instance. It is mainly about the industrial segments when it comes to the Americas. One additional sort of benefit for us there is that, and I think maybe Nico, you had some examples on that. We have a strong presence in Brazil. Of course, we can use that competence also going into North America, for instance, on the pulp and paper side then. It is very sort of focused growth on segments where we have a strong position already.
Sounds good. Thank you so much.
Just to add to that, when we talk about Americas, we are not necessarily talking about the U.S., right? I mean, it is, of course, a big part of the Americas, but it is not where we are currently the strongest.
We're not saying that we're going to double down on U.S. expansions in the upcoming years. Not saying that we're not going to continue to grow there, but that's not what we're saying.
Okay. Reassuring. Thank you.
Okay. We have a question in that corner. From Johan.
Yes. Johan from Danske. Thank you for very interesting presentations. Just had two questions. Firstly, on the topic of risk, I guess what you're saying, building more order backlog, expanding globally, I guess there's also, you could argue that sort of more risk, higher profitability. To what extent has that been sort of a factor which you have taken into account in developing this strategy? I.e., do you want the organization to take a bit more risk, or is it sort of unchanged in that respect?
Also a very good question.
You heard us talk about the importance of the backlog, but hopefully you also heard us talk about the quality and the content of the backlog. Because the content of the backlog is what will help us as a company to become more resilient. We are aiming not necessarily for higher risk. We are aiming for a backlog that consists of smaller and larger projects throughout the full life cycle of a client's or a business cycle. Again, when you have a sort of a stop on large CapEx investments, the OPEX investments or the modernization and upgrading projects will continue to be there. For us, building a strong backlog is not about adding more risk or necessarily adding more complexity. It is about adding different projects to the portfolio mix.
Adding to that as well, as you've seen as part of AFRY's resilience, you also see us building clearly a balance of our segments which are in different markets and cyclicalities. We also build on different geographies to also balance the difference between where we are in the world and how policymakers, for example, are driving different economies. We do drive our resilience also by the strategy of being more diverse in terms of both segments and geographical markets.
Gotcha. Finally, just on sort of incremental investments to deliver on this strategy, you talked about improving processes, better control, better system support to get visibility into the order book, etc. What should we think about that in terms of new incremental CapEx or cost to develop that? Thanks.
Thank you. Will you take that, Christopher?
Yeah, I can take that.
I mean, I think linking back to the journey that the company has been on for many years, actually, some of you who've been kind of with us for a long time know that we have been on this journey already for quite some years, starting with ÅF and Pöyry coming together and the kind of formation of AFRY. We started making investments into system landscape, into data structures, and so on. We kind of kept a reasonably similar investment level throughout these years. What we're practically saying is that we will continue on approximately that level for another few years. Not necessarily saying that it's not going to be any changes, but we're not seeing any material increases in investments compared to what we have experienced the last few years.
In the front here, we have another Johan. Thank you.
Johan Sundén from DNV Carnegie. A couple of questions from my side as well. Docking in a little bit on Dan's questions on the global expansion and maybe focus on core client, the ones that represent half your revenue. Just curious to hear how you kind of work with thinking about pricing, I guess, the biggest accounts or the most competitive accounts versus smaller ones, maybe less competition, and not how you play with pricing versus the utilization side.
Yeah, I think building on clients or partnerships that you have had over a long period of time and where we have a structured key account approach is what will enable that resilience within AFRY, different types of services to the same client. Actually, I think that reduces our cost of sales. So necessarily, I don't agree fully with that correlation that you do.
I think we have a more efficient footprint towards our larger clients. I also think it's very good for us when we are able to follow a client to another country. If we have one customer building a factory in Denmark, then they do the next one in Brazil, we can be a partner there as well. Utilizing our or capitalizing on our local presence, but also adding our global competence. It requires quite sizable clients to be able to follow them also on their global expansion journey. It will be a mix going forward, but we will put extra focus on these large key accounts clients.
Clear. A second question, maybe more related to Nicholas's presentation on the industrial side. You showed a pie chart with the various segments within the industrial segments.
It was quite a big portion of that pie chart that was automotive and other. Can you give some more color what's in that and how core that should be for you?
Absolutely. I try, and then you can. Fill in, Nico. Now, true, automotive and other is quite a big one. Naturally, there is the automotive industry, which has been and is quite a sizable business for AFRY and a lot of large clients within there. There are parts of this sort of unfocused business that we are addressing is also in there. There is also this important segment of defense, which we are addressing and that we are currently reskilling and refocusing towards. It is a mix within there with automotive, defense, and some other parts. And ballpark distribution of that part between defense, automotive, and the rest? Maybe you can.
No, I mean, automotive is a very sizable part of that segment. It is a historically strong position that we have had. I would estimate right below half of that segment is automotive related. You have the remaining part distributed between other segments. We have historically not addressed those as segments, but rather through the capabilities that we have within that. That was also kind of part of the reason why it is automotive and others, because the others are not historically addressed typically through the sector competence, but rather by our capabilities as such. I would say that also within that segment from our side, besides the automotive part, which is very clear, defense, which is also quite clear, the other ones will go through kind of a transformation journey also during the next few years.
Finally, if I may.
Related to the non-core part and your kind of 2028 revenue target, in that target, you have included potential divestment of that non-core part, or how should you think about the interplay between divestment and the 2028 target?
Yeah, yes. Any potential divestment that would take place would be principally included in that target. So it is a total size target. It includes any acquisitions or divestments during that time.
Perfect. Thank you. We have a question right behind you. You can pass on the mic, maybe. Perfect.
Thank you, Johanna. Yes, Dalen Jube, Handelsbanken. A couple of questions. Sorry for coming back to the 10% again in 2024, but can you just help us to understand the EBITA percentage given this 10% in 2024 and also how large a percentage of the 10% you should expect that you will bring on into 2026?
You're talking about the 10% non-core in 2024, right? Yes, correct. Yeah. And asking about the profitability level of that.
Yeah, more or less, yes. On the EBITDA, if it was 10% of the revenue, how much was it of EBITDA?
I mean, it's fair to assume that it's a lower margin business than AFRY in general, right? It's fair to assume. Typically, we haven't historically, and we're not now, we're not carrying negative business. That is not what we're talking about. It's more lower margin business on average than anything else. Just to clarify, I mean, non-core does not necessarily mean that it's the lowest margin that we have from a segment perspective putting that into non-core. That's not the full qualification of what segments that we aim to operate in. Of course, there's a correlation.
What's more interesting? What's more interesting?
What happened during 2025. Hence the 10% in 2024? How much is it by end of 2025? We will see, right?
Yeah. Clearly, addressing the non-core part of the portfolio with different tools is a phase I topic for us. By the end of next year, we will be where we are. I mean, for sure, we will have parts of our business that you could classify as a non-core part also in years to come. That is the nature of what we do, right? For material purposes, we aim to handle that throughout 2025 and 2026.
That is fair. I will not dwell on that anymore. A question on this, getting to larger customers and larger contracts. Obviously, I like your ambition on utilization. That was in the details, etc. Do you see any risk that, in my view at least.
The best opportunity for optimizing utilization is to have really large projects that you have like 80% and then you top up with some 20% of smaller contracts that you can always find here and there. Do you see any risk or do you have enough of this tail with the contracts to customers to secure the utilization?
I mean, you're right. I mean, talking about order backlog, that is a balance act. Utilization is also a balance act like you're into. I would say a good combination is not necessarily 80% of the really large projects and then 20% in between. I think it's more, let's say, half and half or some large, mid, and smaller parts in combination. That is the, and I think we have, of course, all these categories today.
I think it's fair to say that in some segments, not all segments, in some segments, we have too few of the really sizable ones. That's also kind of linked also to the overall strategy that we aim to increase that. It doesn't go for all, but it goes for some segments.
A very last for me then. Better aligned performance management and also incentive structures you talked about. Can you just give us the current status and when you expect to get this fully enabled? Is it dependent on ERP systems, etc., to be implemented throughout the group? Thanks.
Yeah. Addressing firstly, I think the incentive structure then. We are taking decisive actions now, and we have already actually implemented partially a new setup for the second half year 2025 to already now take the first steps. We expect that to be.
Clearly aligned next year and then maybe fully aligned in the year after that. We have a very scattered starting point here, but we are taking decisive actions. I think, of course, having joined the incentive structure is very good for us as a company, making us all run in the same direction. I also think one of the big sort of upsides for us is that it enables internal mobility because that has been one of the reasons before that we have not been able to capture that full internal mobility due to incentive structure. It is an important step for us. Thank you. Just a comment on your last part of your question. The ERP journey as such, it relates to many different things, but not necessarily to the incentive part.
Yeah. Tonga Scher from POIRITO.
On the financial targets, especially on the growth, how much is contingent on market development or end market development, say in pulp and paper and automotive industry moving forward? If you can give us any insights there.
The plan that we have made for this strategy period is based, of course, with what we know on the market now. It is based on the current market situation and our presumption of that for the coming three-year period. Of course, a significant downturn or significant upside will have an impact, but we have based it on what we know today.
To flip that around to clarify, I mean, the targets as such, they're not dependent on a kind of a major market upturn.
Of course, we believe that we are in a bit of a downturn, so it's realistic to think that the market will, all in all, kind of be in a better state at 2028 than it is today. It is not a target set that is dependent on something materially different.
Also to add to that, I think some of the markets that we are growing into are already huge markets that we can grab market share from. The market does not necessarily have to grow that much for also us to grow in the market for some of the segments.
Thank you, Tom. I think we have another question from Raymond here.
Yeah, thank you, Raymond from Nordea again. Just two final ones. First on group function staff.
Before your new structure, you had some 530 people in group functions, and after your new structure, you had closer to 920 people. Just curious, how did this come about, and how do you expect this to develop going forward?
Yeah, I mean, it is more a reflection of our organization and how we report that. Since going into the new organization, we have, from a functional perspective, also in the kind of support structure journey, we have included functional resources in the company throughout the company. As a prolongation of the group functions. So it's practically kind of the shift in reporting that you then also see kind of when we went into the new group structure is not adding new people. It's actually a reflection of our changed model, of kind of internal organizational model. Then, of course, looking at the number and the expected development per se.
Of course, we expect that number to rather be lower than higher in a sense on years to come as we progress on some of the profitability levers that we went through.
Finally, just a clarification maybe. Maybe I misheard you, Bo. Did you say that you expect more than half the margin gap to be closed in phase I? Also, the gap that you referred to in that case, is that 2024 against 2028?
Yeah. What I said was that when we exit phase I, our ambition is that from a run rate perspective, we aim to kind of progress to close more than half of the gap. That's what you, in a sense, heard me say. You can't look at the full-year perspective.
You need to look at what have we actually executed, what actions, and what benefits do we have from that. We're quite committed to come far enough in the profitability journey in phase I before we enter into phase II. Given how they are kind of set up, if we're not on a run rate level passing kind of closing half of the gap, then we're not far enough, right? It kind of goes hand in hand.
That's very clear. Thank you.
Yeah, we have Daniel again. That's good. We have time.
I just had two, sorry. Yeah, a question on a little bit. Opportunities in the market. You talked a little bit of total defense and so on, and we know that you work with BAE, Haglunds, etc. We also know that on the NATO, this 5%, 1.5% is infrastructure.
Can you comment a little bit on how you will optimize your ambition here? We know that you're entering Denmark, etc., growing nicely and so on. Just to give our current position, status, and ambitions. Thanks.
I will start, and then you jump in. As you might have heard Daniela mention, we have a couple of these strategic initiatives going across our current segments, and total defense being one of them. What is total defense? It is about energy, it is about infrastructure, it is about access to food, to medicals, and so on. I mean, that comes very much in our already existing segments. Of course, we have the defense capabilities as such, which has been an area that we have developed over the years, and also an area that we see large investment opportunities going forward. We are exploring that path, both in.
Total defense, which is a natural part of our business, and then the defense sector as such. Here, yes, we are looking at both, of course, the defense industry, you could say, but then we're looking at, for example, the military, defense and the civil defense as well. We're building our total defense offering across. Yes, we are very strong in Sweden. We actually have a good offering also in Norway, and then looking into Denmark and also Finland. Starting that kind of Nordic base, which is our stronghold, we continue to build on that.
Do you perceive a lot of, or do you see not invented here in consulting, in products and software we can see not invented here, i.e., that Italian's favorite Leonardo, for example, perhaps or something. Is.
The services side more, especially in NATO countries, possible to work in different geographies?
I think here, first of all, there's a lot of restrictions, you could say. There is, of course, preference to work with local players and have that local defense resilience as well. That we do see. However, there are supply chain needs, and there are efforts to improve also in the supply chain of the defense manufacturers as well. That we face, and we work with the suppliers as well. Here we have a stronghold in the Nordic markets, working with the leading players. Thank you. I will stop there. Great. Thank you. That was our last questions, but let's keep the discussions going outside for lunch. Now I'll hand back to you, Linda, for some closing remarks. Thank you.
Thank you for all the good questions. We are coming to an end of our capital markets day, but I just wanted to take the opportunity to make some final remarks. Repeating what we have said then. Today, we have presented a strategy that will transform AFRY over the coming years. We build on what works, but we become more focused in everything we do. We have selected segments with a clear market potential. We will leverage our position to grow globally, including in our largest markets within the Nordics. We will continue on our strong partnerships with leading clients, and we will evolve our project delivery across the life cycles. The strategic direction that we have chosen will strengthen our resilience as a company. By balancing the exposure that we see across geographies, by expanding our offering throughout the life cycle.
In doing so, we will capture the growth opportunities while we are building agile and resilient AFRY. The keys to this AFRY lie within our own hands. We have already taken significant steps to deliver. We have implemented a simplified organizational structure, and we have measures in place to reduce our cost base. We'll put even more focus going forward on our order backlog, and we will increase our utilization levels because they are key drivers to improved profitability. I'm very proud of the speed and the precision in our execution so far. We have taken great steps as a company in a short period of time. I'm also exceptionally proud of the expertise that we have within our company.
Our people are the foundation of the journey ahead, and I have full confidence that this new and more focused strategy will bring out the very best in all of us. I look forward to the coming years as we position AFRY to become a global leader in driving transitions and strengthening resilient societies. Thank you all for joining us today and following AFRY on our exciting journey.