Good afternoon. This is Kusumi. Thank you very much for joining us today at Panasonic Group Investor Day 2026 despite your busy schedules. Today, I'd like to explain the devices area, which I introduced on May 12th in our Group Growth Strategy presentation, as a key driver of the Group's future growth. I hope to help you understand the strong growth potential of the devices area and deepen your expectations for the future growth of the Panasonic Group. Let me begin with a brief review of the key points I shared last month. This is the same material we showed last month. It shows the Panasonic Group, how it intends to contribute toward 2032. As we said, in 1932, our founder, Konosuke Matsushita, established "Achieve an ideal society with affluence both in matter and mind" as the company's true mission for the next 250 years.
To realize this long-term mission, the Panasonic Group will continue to evolve while supporting social and industrial development by addressing social challenges that change over time. In particular, as 2032 marks 100 years since we embraced this true mission, we will focus on addressing two major challenges: using energy more efficiently and alleviating frontline labor shortages by supporting AI infrastructure and social operations. This chart illustrates the relationship between the Panasonic Group's three business areas and its operating companies. Today, presentations will be given by two companies in the devices area, Panasonic Industry and Panasonic Energy. As for the solutions area, while we outline the overall direction in last month's growth strategy presentation, we recognize, as many of you pointed out, that the level of clarity remains insufficient. For the solutions area, we will further clarify our story at our Investor Day in December.
The devices area will drive the Group's growth over the next three years, achieving significant expansion in both sales and profit through its businesses supporting AI infrastructure. These businesses are focused on the rapidly expanding AI data center market, which is growing dramatically with the rise of AI. For Panasonic Industry, high-performance multilayer substrate materials and conductive polymer capacitors contribute not only GPU, ASIC, and CPU-related circuits that serve as the brain of AI processing, but also an expanding range of advanced and high-speed peripheral equipment used in data centers. For Panasonic Energy, power solutions for data centers support the heart of AI infrastructure by not only providing backup power, but also continuously advancing power peak shaving capabilities, which are increasingly required with the evolution of GPUs and other processors, thereby making an ongoing contribution.
Looking ahead, we'll further expand our contribution into edge applications such as AI-powered autonomous driving and robotics. For our businesses supporting AI infrastructure, we're targeting about JPY 1.4 trillion in sales and JPY 290 billion in adjusted operating profit in fiscal 2029, with further growth beyond that. These targets are based on future demand projections already shared with us by our customers. I think you're most interested in the certainty of these demand. We will later explain that. Ozawa will later explain. In response to this growing demand and our customers' requirements, Holdings will invest about JPY 500 billion in these businesses between fiscal 2027 and FY 2029 as part of the Group's capital allocation strategy. About JPY 350 billion to Energy and JPY 150 billion to Industry.
These investments will be used to advance devices and systems and enhance production capacity, that will be explained in greater detail in the presentations to follow by industry and energy. This is today's agenda. Speakers have been introduced. As I mentioned, there is already strong demand for the businesses supporting AI infrastructure in the devices area. I hope you will gain a clear understanding of the strengths that position us to successfully capture this demand. We would also welcome your candid feedback during the Q&A session at the end of today's program. We intend to incorporate your valuable insights into our management and use them to enhance the corporate value of the group. This concludes my remarks. Thank you for your participation today.
I am Ozawa, CEO of Panasonic Industry. First, I would like to explain the growth strategy of the Industry. This is the vision we are aiming for. Our goal is to be a device manufacturer that continuously create unique value through materials and process technologies. Today, I will mainly explain three points regarding our AI-related businesses, which we position at the core of achieving this goal. The first is strengthening our focus businesses. For our current mainstay products, we will double our supply capacity from FY March 2026 to FY March 2031 and firmly capture expanding demand. The second is expanding our products and areas. By deploying products that leverage the strengths we have cultivated over many years in the automotive field, we will double the number of products we offer for the AI domain and expand our business opportunities.
The third is creating innovative devices rather than simply extending what we already have today. We will pursue the development of breakthrough technologies and create products that will become new de facto standards. We aim to build this into a JPY 50 billion business by 2030, with further expansion over the medium to long term. First, I will explain our medium-term strategy. Having completed the earnings improvement phase that we pursued under the previous medium-term plan from FY March 2024 to FY March 2026, we are shifting to a full-scale growth phase from this fiscal year. From FY March 2024 to FY March 2026, we focused on improving profitability by selecting businesses based on performance and eliminating businesses with issues. We have also focused on three areas where social demand is strong: information and communications infrastructure, automotive, and factory automation. The results are shown in the graph on the left.
Sales have expanded steadily, while profitability has also improved significantly, with the adjusted operating profit margin rising from 3% to 8%. Based on these results, we are shifting this fiscal year into a full-scale growth phase. In our portfolio strategy, we will make focused investments in competitive businesses while transforming our business structure around materials and process technologies. As our core focus area, we will concentrate on the rapidly growing AI domain. This does not mean that the markets we address have changed. Rather, based on changes in the business environment, we have redefined the brain component that is common to the three areas we previously focused on as the AI domain. Through these initiatives, we will drive growth for the group and aim to reach a sales level of JPY 1.3 trillion in FY March 2029. Now, I will discuss the AI domain.
First, let me share our view of the market environment. At present, investment in data centers remains extremely active. As shown in the chart on the left, the market is expected to grow at a CAGR of approximately 20%, nearly doubling from 2025 to 2028. This includes the entire infrastructure domain that we are targeting, including servers, storage, and networking equipment. Please note that these figures are estimated as of January this year. At this point, we expect the actual outlook to have been revised further upward. The chart on the right shows the evolution of AI technologies. In addition to training and inference, AI is gaining new functions such as agents. These functions will not evolve separately, but rather will evolve while interacting with one another.
The semiconductors that support these functions include CPUs, GPUs, and ASICs will also evolve in a way that could be described as orchestration, with each component interacting with the other to realize overall system functionality. As a result of these advances, the volume of data processing will increase rapidly and the resulting rise in power consumption will become the most critical challenge. Next, I will explain the areas where we can contribute and the products we offer in light of this market environment. We will expand our value creation areas from the peripheral areas around semiconductors to infrastructure and further into the edge domain. We will also apply the products we have developed for automotive applications and continue introducing these products into the AI domain. First, let me discuss the areas around semiconductors.
In this field, we will strongly support the performance of evolving AI with our existing products, high-performance circuit board materials, and conductive polymer capacitors. We will also address the new challenge of higher power consumption in servers, specifically by introducing supercapacitors, we will contribute to improving power supply efficiency. In addition, going forward, we will apply and expand products such as inductors and relays, where we have a high share in automotive applications to AI infrastructure. We believe AI infrastructure is an area where our track record in polishing automotive-grade quality and reliability can be fully leveraged as it requires high voltage, high temperature tolerance, and high durability. Edge domain. Going forward, AI brain will increasingly be embedded in applications such as ADAS and robotics. As this brain expands, demand will also grow for the devices that support it. We will capture this opportunity to achieve further growth.
Next, I will explain the business model and strengths. We have built a business model in which we make proactive proposals from the design stage, leveraging our strong customer touchpoint and proprietary technologies in materials and processes. Left-hand side, the customers we work with are in different layers, semiconductor manufacturers and EMS companies. At the same time, we offer products in different layers as well, materials and devices. This enables us to capture industry trends quickly and accurately from a multidimensional perspective that spans multiple layers. In addition, we have built relationships with key industry players over the 20 years. Through the information we obtain from these customer touchpoints, we are able to formulate highly accurate hypothesis about the future. Our strength is in marketing that anticipates technological trends.
We present these hypotheses to customers, use them to draw our customer feedback, and thereby stay ahead of the market. This enables design and reference activities from the customer's design stage, allowing us to provide value ahead of competitors. The proprietary technologies that support this are our materials and process technologies. For example, material formulation design involves chemical reactions that change the properties of the materials, making it impossible to reverse engineer. Our manufacturing process as well are not easily replicated by competitors, such as labor-saving continuous production process. Through these proactive proposal-based business models, we will demonstrate our competitiveness in the AI domain.
I'd like to explain our specific initiatives in the AI domain. The first is the enhancement of our focused businesses. Infrastructure applications such as AI servers are required to operate under extremely demanding conditions, including high-speed processing, large current loads, high temperatures, and severe space constraints. We provide high-performance devices that enable stable operation even in these harsh environments. The products we have focused on in this area are high-performance multilayer circuit board material, MEGTRON, and conductive polymer capacitors. For both, we will double production capacity by 2030 to stay ahead of the growing demand. Let me explain a bit about the products. MEGTRON is a circuit board material that suppresses transmission loss at high frequencies, thereby preventing the degradation of high-speed signals and helping reduce both power consumption and heat generation. Conductive polymer capacitors offer a high level of effective capacitance per unit volume.
Effective capacitance is the amount of capacitance that can actually be utilized under real operating conditions. Conductive capacitors exhibit minimal capacitance degradation under high temperature and high voltage conditions. They're particularly suited for environments such as AI servers, where extremely high temperatures and severe space constraints coexist, and where stable delivery of large currents is essential. For our supply structure, as shown, we will gradually expand MEGTRON production capacity and establish a global network of five manufacturing sites. Taking future market fluctuations into account, we will build a resilient supply structure by assigning complementary roles across Suzhou, Guangzhou, Koriyama, Taiwan, and Ayutthaya. For capacitors, we're already expanding production lines in phases in response to the recent demand surge. Investments are underway in Saga and Kumamoto in Japan, as well as Malaysia and Indonesia, with the additional capacity scheduled to come online sequentially beginning in April 2027.
Next, second initiative, expanding products and domains. Based on the focus businesses I explained, we're expanding both our product lineup and application domains. First, the supercapacitors on the left. These are being expanded into AI server power supply applications by leveraging technologies made in automotive applications. By leveraging the feature of supercapacitors, the ability to supply large currents instantaneously, we help absorb power load fluctuations and improve energy efficiency. We are currently commercializing a capacitor backup unit, or CBU, through collaboration with PEC, with mass production scheduled to start during fiscal 2027. To respond to diversifying needs and provide value to customers in different layers, we'll also launch new capacitor products, the first scheduled for the end of fiscal 2027. The right side shows expansion into the edge area. The AI brain will expand not only in infrastructure but also into edge devices.
We've already secured semiconductor reference wins for AI semiconductors used in ADAS and robotics. Capturing this trend, we will expand globally into areas such as ADAS and robotics. Finally, I'll explain the creation of innovative devices and our business outlook. As explained, we are strengthening focus businesses and expanding products and domains. To accelerate growth further, we will increase CapEx and strengthen R&D. Specifically, we plan cumulative investment of JPY 150 billion in AI-related products from fiscal 2027 to 2029, approximately 3 x the level of the previous medium-term plan. In addition to CapEx for circuit board materials and capacitors, we'll allocate resource intensively to R&D. In R&D, we will shorten development lead times by expanding use of smart labs and accelerate open innovation. For open innovation, we're advancing industry/academia collaboration and cross-industry collaboration. For key themes, we are already at the stage of completing proof of principle.
Through breakthrough technological evolution, we will create innovative devices with the aim of mass production in fiscal 2029. The right shows our business outlook. AI-related sales are expected to expand mainly in infrastructure and expect them to roughly double in fiscal 2029 compared with 2026. By also capturing the edge area, we aim to exceed JPY 500 billion in fiscal 2031. In this way, through the three initiatives of strengthening existing businesses, expanding domains, and creating innovative devices, we will achieve sustainable growth in the AI area. Thank you.
I'm Tadanobu of Panasonic Energy. I will explain our energy storage system for data centers. First, I will provide an overall summary of Panasonic Energy and explain our thinking behind the new medium-term plan. I will then discuss the business strategy for energy storage systems for data center. Today, I will focus mainly on the progress we have made since the IR Day held last December. Let me begin with a brief overview of our progress and achievements. We have focused on the green and digital domains and have steadily evolved our business portfolio in response to major market changes in automotive and data centers. In terms of management performance, sales have grown from JPY 764.4 billion in FY March 2022 to JPY 984.2 billion in FY March 2026, approaching the JPY 1 trillion level.
Although the in-vehicle business has not reached the growth level we initially expected, in the industry and consumer business, we have captured the rapidly expanding demand for data centers driven by Gen AI and achieved significant growth. Progress on our key business initiatives is as shown here. At present, by managing the business with both in-vehicle and industry and consumer as our two main pillars, we have enhanced our ability to respond to changes in the business environment. Under the new medium-term plan, building on this foundation, we will position the data center business as a growth driver and aim to achieve sales of around JPY 2 trillion, an adjusted operating profit of over JPY 300 billion in FY March 2029. We view the new medium-term plan as a phase in which we will fully leverage the assets we have accumulated to date while achieving both growth and profitability.
Next, I will discuss our energy storage systems business for data centers. First, let me share our view of the market environment. As market growth driven by Gen AI continues to accelerate, demand is expanding for advanced power solutions to address increasing power consumption. In terms of trends in the data center market, the real-world implementation of Gen AI is progressing and the revenue of hyperscalers are expanding. For this reason, we expect investment to continue to grow. The chart at the lower left shows capital expenditure by hyperscalers. In 2028, investment is expected to be 2.5 x the 2025 level, approaching $1 trillion. The challenge amid this expected massive investment is to respond immediately to the rapid expansion in demand and to continue ensuring stable supply. In addition, as GPUs and data center systems evolve, optimizing power efficiency will become essential.
The power required per rack is expected to exceed 1 MW in the future. In addition to absorbing fluctuations in power load, power systems will be required to support next-generation platforms, including by improving the efficiency of data center as whole. Going forward, the importance of power-related challenges will only increase further. Advanced power management systems for the next generation will become indispensable. This slide shows the vision we are aiming for the data center business. As we have communicated previously, we will further evolve the unique strengths we have developed to date and maximize the value we provide through our solution proposal capabilities and supply capabilities. Our vision is to become a power solution provider for data centers, offering power systems centered on safe batteries.
Our value proposition lies in proactively proposing solutions to increasingly sophisticated customer challenges and in our flexible supply capabilities to respond to rapid increases and fluctuations in demand. We will continue to maintain our industry initiative. In realizing this value proposition, we believe we have three key unique strengths. First is our strong relationships with industry leaders. Through more than 10 years of development and delivery track record, we have built strong relationships with hyperscaler customers. Second is our design proposal capability to solve customer challenges. We anticipate customers' increasingly sophisticated power-related challenges. Ahead of our competitors, continuously propose systems that translate the required functions into specifications, thereby leading the industry. Third is our ability to bring proposed products to reality. We achieve performance, safety, and reliability through our advanced manufacturing capabilities.
To put it simply, our strength lies in a business model in which we quickly realize design concepts, co-create it with customers, and turn them into industry standards. We have built a robust model, including our supply structure, that is not easily imitated. As a result, we have a market share of 80% in the field of distributed power systems for data centers. Next, I explain the medium-term plan. For our sales, we aim to grow from JPY 320 billion in fiscal 2026 to JPY 550 billion in fiscal 2027 and approximately JPY 1 trillion in fiscal 2029.
As of last December, we had set a target of JPY 800 billion for fiscal 2029, but we now expect to achieve the target one year ahead in fiscal 2028. This revision reflects even stronger customer inquiries than we had seen as of December. In sales, we aim for further growth through next-generation products, in addition to increased sales driven by growing demand for conventional products. In conventional products, we will expand the current BBU series, as well as new high output BBUs, while in next-generation products, we will launch CBUs and BBUs for power racks starting this fiscal year. Almost all products included in our sales projections have already secured awards.
To support growth, we plan total investment of JPY 350 billion over three years. This includes investments in the common infrastructure with in-vehicle products at the Kansas factory. Major investments include repurposing production lines in Japan from in-vehicle to data center applications, ramping up the Kansas factory and converting it for data center applications, and expanding module plants in Mexico establishing developing and prototype production lines to advance systems and devices to strengthen proposal and development capabilities. I explain the details from the next page. First, establishing a supply system. In addition to strengthening supply capacity in Japan, we will accelerate the establishment of a North American-based supply chain to meet strong demand in terms of both quantity and quality. Our approach has two main points. First, we will meet fast-growing demand by effectively using existing facilities, including those for in-vehicle.
Second, we will build a flexible supply network that can adapt to demand changes. The key to flexibility is expanding capacity in North America, where customer demand is highest, and strengthening local procurement of power components. Based on this approach, we formulated our supply policy and are now implementing the measures. In Japan, we will increase cell production capacity by about three times in fiscal 2029 compared with fiscal 2026. We have repurposed the in-vehicle line at the Osaka factory, and shipments of LIBs began this April. We will continue repurposing lines in line with customers' production plans and stabilize operations at the Osaka factory. We will also further enhance domestic module production capacity. In North America, we are preparing cell production for data centers at Kansas, with mass production scheduled to begin in fiscal 2029.
Regarding modules, last December, we said we were considering constructing a new plant in Mexico, but in response to strong customer inquiries, we have decided to establish a third plant in addition to the second plant. The second plant, scheduled to begin mass production in fiscal 2027, and the third plant in fiscal 2028. For supply chain measures, we will accelerate the shift toward a North America-based supply chain in collaboration with power suppliers to improve procurement flexibility. By fiscal 2029, we aim to raise the local procurement ratio for power components to over 50%. Next, I will discuss strengthening proposal and development capabilities for the next generation. As explained in our vision, we will deliver new solutions in a timely manner through the integrated capability of evolving devices and systems.
As a proactive development model for solutions, based on strong partnerships with customers, we work closely on the system side to co-create functions and specs, translate the customer requirements into device specifications, and drive proactive development ahead of competitors. For example, for peak shaving, to support the evolution of AI, we're appropriately designing BBU output per rack and other specs while maintaining high safety and developing battery cells optimized for that purpose. Unlike in-vehicle applications where capacity is required, BBUs for data centers require output or power. Currently, 80 W per cell is the mainstream, but to improve BBU output performance, we have already begun introducing new 120 W cells, 1.5x the current output. Looking toward the next generation, we are integrally developing dedicated high-power cells and BBUs through chemical and mechanical design, which only we can do as a battery manufacturer.
For absorbing power load fluctuations, we're pursuing proactive technology development of supercapacitors together with Panasonic Industry, and we'll begin mass production of first-generation CBUs this year. Also, we've started development of the second generation. Furthermore, to increase power efficiency of an entire data center, we have nearly completed the design of BBUs built for HVDC, or high voltage direct current, and will complete preparations for mass production within fiscal 2027. We expect demand for HVDC to take off from 2028 onward. Beyond that, we'll continue various development activities in collaboration with customers. Finally, our financial targets. For the energy storage system business for DCs, we're targeting sales of about JPY 1 trillion and ROIC over 20% in fiscal 2029. As explained, customer inquiries are extremely strong, and we will achieve high growth, approximately tripling the business scale from fiscal 2026 to 2029.
After that, we'll pursue further growth by responding to next-generation platforms. For ROIC, by maintaining and improving our current high profitability, we will secure above 20%, even after factoring in JPY 350 billion investment. Through the key initiatives explained today, we'll steadily execute the medium-term plan and deliver long-term growth. Thus, we will contribute to realizing an even more prosperous society through the evolution of AI and digital technologies. That concludes my presentation. Thank you for your attention.
From Goldman Sachs Securities, Harada-san, please ask your question.
I'm Harada of Goldman Sachs Securities. Thank you very much. I have two questions. Thank you for the opportunity. AI-related BBU and industry capacitor in those areas, the company has high competitive strength. That I understand. In the past, the company has a history, and BBU, you have 80% dominant share. When we look at the past, the automotive in-vehicle batteries, you had high share, but then the share declined. PDP, the similar path was taken. China and Korean players took shares from the company in the past. In the presentation, you explained about the importance of the customer relationship, and my question is, how can you avoid repeating the same thing that happened in the past? Any lessons internally that you are sharing from the past?
The products are different this time. Is your stance that you don't have to worry about because the product is different? Is that the strategy in order for the company to maintain dominant position? What kind of commitment do you have, and what kind of strategies do you have? That is my first question. My second question is related to supercapacitors. Page seven, I believe, is where you mentioned ADAS and robotics expansion of the edge area. This is a new topic that was introduced this time, the acquisition of reference and BBU winning awards. Similar to these areas, shall we expect very high performance? Can you elaborate some more? Those are my two questions.
Harada-san, thank you for your question. The first question, later, I will ask Tadanobu-san to add more comments. The second question, this is related to industries, Ozawa would add some more comment. In-vehicle batteries, BBU share is very high. We mentioned that. On in-vehicle batteries, the share was taken by Chinese and Korean players. That's what you pointed out. For automotive batteries, we will solidly proceed with the business with customers that we can reach agreement. Even when the EV penetrates as expected in the beginning, our objective was not to set a certain share. If we are to capture share, we needed to build up the capacity at early on. Because we did not do that, our negative impact is relatively shallow.
Supercapacitors and SP-Cap conductive capacitors, how much reference can we acquire? That is the important point. The difference with the automotive battery and our business domain will be explained by Tadanobu-san and Ozawa-san.
First, the position on BBU and our thinking behind, let me cover that topic. As I have mentioned today, BBU itself, the core of our business, at least we look at five years later, customers' situation, the evolution of the semiconductors and system itself. We share the challenges, and within the device, we develop these specifications. We are cell manufacturers. We leverage on our material and manufacturing technology, and we are to develop devices that will become necessary five years later and develop the algorithm to build up the references. In vehicle area, it's not that we're going to manufacture in massive scale on the defined specification, but rather from scratch, we build together on the infrastructure solutions. Second generation, we have made progress to that level, and we already are working on the third generation. We believe we can keep our position.
Just one point to add, investment is limited, very small, and we can deploy capital in an agile manner. Although the environment changes very rapidly in the area of AI, we can follow and manage the acceleration and deceleration. For the time being, we would like to focus on the current model so we can capture this position.
From my side, I would like to answer your question on supercapacitor and edge device. As was mentioned, this domain is mostly conductive capacitors. That is our biggest bet. The conductive capacitor, 20 years ago, Intel's PC, as a reference, was the starting point. CPU was covered by Intel and graphic card, NVIDIA's CPU. We started to get into the reference in the periphery, reference customers and EMS and ODM, Taiwan and Chinese players.
With these players, we have been maintaining the relationship for a long time. Every time the design is changed, we followed through. From PC, it became server, base station. Now it is AI data center. That is the explosive demand source. We have constructed similar business model to secure our position. MLCC and conductive capacitor, what is the difference? That is the question we are asked. Those two are handled quite similarly, but we believe they are complementary. MLCC has low resistance and good for around CPU and GPU. The conductive polymer is strong at the corner. Regardless of the edge device, this design basically is unchanged. This structure, the design, we will be quick in developing and introducing, in pursuing various exits for the application.
Just to add some more comment, I think the audience heard the word "reference" from Tadanobu-san and Ozawa-san. It's rather difficult to understand. Tadanobu-san's reference refers to standard of the industry. Ozawa-san's reference refers to CPU vendor and GPU vendor. In order for each CPU and GPU to function properly for peripheral circuit, there is a reference design being disclosed. Whether to be adopted or not is the major point. EMS will design according to the reference. That was just additional information.
Thank you very much. I understood quite clearly robotics and autonomous driving. Partially, your products are already used.
In the brain part, GPU is used. In the GPU, our conductive polymer capacitor is in the reference design. Humanoid robot brain, those are the areas that our products are adopted.
Understood quite clearly. That's all from me. Thank you.
Thank you very much. From UBS Securities, Yasui-san, please ask your question.
Yasui from UBS. First question about the data center BBU and CBU. In the future, like in 2028, maybe when there's a second-generation CBU coming out, in terms of market size, what would be the ratio between BBUs and CBUs? Do you have an outlook? That would be appreciated. BBU share is high, so I think that ratio will be higher in your sales plan. 80% share in both BBU and CBU, is that your assumption? Include that in your answer, please. That's the first question.
Do you only have one question?
Excuse me. May I ask the second question later, or should I say it now? BBU and CBU market size and ratio.
In terms of our strengths, for CBU, we have a unique design of our capacitors. That's our strengths. In that sense, I would say we would like to, we hope to maintain the share. About the ratio, please.
Yasui-san, thank you for the question. In a certain year, what will be the ratio? It's difficult to say, but it's around power source. There's been this shift from first to second generation. If it comes to third generation, then from the rack, power rack, IT rack, those racks may be divided. Then the GPUs that will be placed on it, what would be those GPU? That would determine CBU. It's going to become necessary for the load variation. What we are assuming is that not just in the power racks but also in the IT racks, our batteries haven't been used there, but depending on the noise situation, it might become necessary.
For the entry point to what Ozawa-san is doing, those things might become necessary. Our assumption is that the 2028, billions or tens of billions of JPY. I think that's what each of the companies are saying. Potential should grow so that with new generation of GPUs, then that would be several hundreds of billions of JPY. That's the potential. Based on the current situation, what will happen, by around 2030, it should reach that level or even higher. In terms of our position, as we explained today, from this fiscal year, we are going to complete our setup for mass production. We would like to maintain a similar share as BBU. One clarification. Various things will be put on it. You say for CPU or LPU, Cerebras, new compute device has come out. Non-GPU area, there's a possibility you will enter, and also tens or hundreds of billions .
You're talking about the CBU market size?
Yes.
On the power rack side, that's the power source. Also on the brain side, there are various or several exits, and depending on the load, technically, there could be a need for the CBU. There's that possibility, and I think each of the companies are thinking about that. We really can't say at this point, there is or/and there could be various possibilities there. In terms of market size, what I mentioned is that the CBU, the unit market share is what I was just talking about.
Thank you. Second question, same area. About the business projection. Based on the assumption, the factors for variation. What's the big component? Current customers investment change, is that the big factor, or the addition or lack of new customer, is that the big factor? 800 V HVDC, the sidecar may become SSD. Is it mostly the technology change? Can you talk about the interaction between these three or amongst the three factors of variation?
Tadanobu will explain.
In terms of the business outlook, we're basing that on the award acquisition. New customers, well, certainly, we'll approach that's not included in the outlook. That would be a positive addition if we're able to acquire. As for the technology factor, certainly for HVDC, there's a trend, and for GPU, we are responding together with the customers. That's already incorporated. The trend, based on the ordinary set timing, it would be like what we presented.
There could be component shortages, and there's a lot of talk about that. How this would actually ramp up is an issue. What we are showing is that we're already factoring the possible partial delay, and that's reflected in these numbers. In terms of the true potential, we actually believe it's larger even with our existing customers. For SSD, we do recognize that. For the power-related, even if there's SSD, then on the power rack side, demand would not change significantly. The area where we can cover how that will change is something we'd like to closely watch 2030 and beyond. I hope that answers the question.
That was clear. Thank you very much.
Thank you very much. Moving on to the next question. Nikkan Kogyo Shimbun, Ono-san, please ask your question.
I'm Ono from Nikkan Kogyo. Can you hear?
Yes.
Thank you. I have two questions. My first question is to Panasonic Energy. At the time of financial result announcement, the data center battery storage forecast of FY March 29 was JPY 950 billion, then you revised upward to JPY 1 trillion. In the short period, you made upward revision by JPY 50 billion. Does that mean you have finalized a concrete project?
Thank you for the question. Tadanobu will answer on the details. Tadanobu-san mentioned that the award went from 80% to 100%, and that is included. Tadanobu-san, can you share your view?
Related to the question raised by Yasui-san, JPY 950 billion reflects the semiconductor shortage in the world, and the award-based commitment is the basis of JPY 950 billion. On top of that, high voltage is also included, such as PBU, and the probability and progress improved. It's not that we revised upward to JPY 1 trillion, but in terms of the potential as an internal target, we recognize that there's an expectation to reach JPY 1 trillion, so internal target is JPY 1 trillion. As for the guidance, JPY 950 billion is the number we commit to. JPY 950 billion is a commitment number. The granularity of the society and the semiconductors timing, once those are clearer, then we would like to revise the numbers.
Thank you very much. My second question is both to Energy and Industries. This time, you disclose the management target, and that is backed by award wins. The external factors, the risks still exist, I believe. In the interview in the past, you talked about AI infrastructure. The issue of the power supply may become one risk. At the operating company, you are CEOs of operating companies, so can you once again talk about the existing risks? Also, in your presentation, you talked about market share. In the past, there was a topic of whether Chinese and Korean players are taking your share, but you mentioned strong relationship from existing customers. Looking from a different angle, you may be reliant too much on specific customers.
From the perspective of stability of the revenue, I believe it is important to diversify the revenue source. If you could elaborate on that as well.
On the revenue source, building up multiple revenue sources, let me comment on that first. It's true that for in-vehicle batteries with various customers, we will agree wherever possible. That is the approach. Even in that environment, the EV market growth itself is slowing down. However, e ven in that environment, as certain strategic customers, we can expect a strong performance for FY March 27. In terms of diversifying customer source for the Energy business, in addition to in-vehicle, we have data center business, so that is the diversification. If it is just for in-vehicle batteries, then we are exposed to the deceleration risk of EV. Including each risk, I would like to ask Tadanobu-san and Ozawa-san to comment.
This is Tadanobu. Let me answer first. As Kusumi-san mentioned, depending on the industry, we need to judge whether we should have parallel customers. We are concentrating on the cylindrical batteries, and today, we talked about the importance of power for data center application. As an exit, is it going to be EV, data center, or humanoid? Once we invest and have capacity, we will have flexibility. On global basis, we are making progress in that preparation rather than multiple customers. Against the various changes in the society, our products will be able to adapt and apply. If we did not have the production capacity that we had for automotive application, we couldn't catch up with the massive growth of AI-related demand. We need to look at the exit very closely. As the basis, we have product concept. That is also important, so we will be able to diversify our customers and cater to those needs.
In the industry domain, let me answer. We operate around semiconductors. Exit application-wise, there are products for data center, but there are other areas, other applications, PCs, edge device, and others. How can we diversify the exit since our product is device? Thinking about diversification will lead to stability of the management. Also, for SSD, related to memory, the order taking is rising, and our capacitor is also being used and the order is very high. Demand is high. We constantly search for various exit, and we would like to operate our business so that we can respond to technically high requirements. For external factors, we provide devices, and for customers, they need to be able to procure all the necessary devices, otherwise they cannot manufacture. That became evident due to the recent Hormuz trade incident. We constantly monitor the changes.
Thank you very much. I understood.
Let me add some more information. I have been requesting Tadanobu-san and Ozawa-san constantly to hone the operation. That means to reduce the lead time as much as possible. Change can happen any time. When we look at the overall data center, for example, there's a shortage of the optical fiber and the installation will be postponed. That kind of situation may happen. As much as possible, we will manufacture with as short lead time as possible. We focus thoroughly on that, and that is a measure to reduce the risk.
Understood. Thank you very much.
Thank you. Let's move on to the next question. Nikkei. Misumi-san, please.
Misumi from The Nikkei Newspaper. Thank you for the opportunity. Do you hear?
Yes.
I have two questions. First, business risks is what I want to ask about. You talked about the shared dash, and if you look at the battery as a whole, inclusive of those for data centers, there could be oversupply so that the storage battery price is reduced. I think that's what's happening. In terms of price drop of storage batteries, could that lead to lower margin at your company or to be replaced by lower priced products in the future? Do you have any such concerns? I want to ask that question to Tadanobu-san. The second question, this is again for Energy, about future investment. You talked about Kansas as a common platform together with the in-vehicle.
In-vehicle and for data center, you'll be able to manufacture flexibly for both of those application. Is that understanding correct? If you should expand this, then the data center battery, if demand is stronger, you'll be able to make for that. If automotive recovers, flexibly, you can shift production to that. Is that what you are going to establish?
Okay. Two questions. Tadanobu will respond. If you look at the demand and supply balance for batteries, there is this gap in the neighboring country. What kind of impact would that have globally, and would that lower our margins? That was the question.
In that sense, as Kusumi said, as a strategy, we want to focus on the North America in terms of regional strategy, where impact of that will be less. Not just the sales, but as a solution, we want to have more sophisticated layer. For data centers, want to focus on business where it cannot be easily imitated. Just because there is cell over capacity, we're not going to compete on those grounds. Currently, there is no such impact. For those areas where there is impact, that would not be an area we would want to cover. We make that distinction and promote the business. Of course, we have to enhance our cost structure, COGS structure, and so we want to do that to make sure that the threat can be minimized.
As for investment, those of you listening are probably wondering what's JPY 350 billion, what is that comprised of? This common platform, how much of the JPY 350 billion is it? I think you're wondering. This common platform, Kansas, we are doing the ramp-up. There's the building and infrastructure. There are those common areas that are developed together. For automotive and data center, it's distributed based on the area used. Of the JPY 350 billion, about 1/3 is for data center, and so that it'll be depreciated for the data center. There will be the shared platform as for the infrastructure. Finally, for the cylindrical battery, well, we are doing it with cylindrical battery. For automotive and data center, with some modification, we can respond to both in our production system. We have a flexible system.
If I may add, to begin with, this BBU for the data center, the cells necessary for that, those will be very mission-critical. AI servers within the racks within the AI servers, or it's placed next to them, so it never should combust. Also, as mentioned in Tadanobu's presentation, so cells, maybe we do it 200 W. It's a high-output one that is being worked on. It's not that we can use any battery. That's what this distributed, this amount. The more centralized method, so next to the data center, there's a big building, and you place a battery in a big building. In that case, there is a risk that that will be subject to price competition. That is why we really focus on the distribution, concentrate in a distributed system.
Maybe the words are contradictory. The cells for the data centers, cells for automotive. Tadanobu-san said we should clarify even more. One day, we make a battery for automotive. Next day, we make cell for the data center. That cannot be done because the electrodes structure is a little different, and when you switch materials, you have to clean all the equipment. Even if we say flexibly, it does take some lead time, not that long, but needs some time to switch over. With that, we can switch from one to the other.
Thank you. Thank you for the very easy to understand explanation. Thank you.
Moving on to the next question. JP Morgan Securities, Ayada-san, please go ahead.
Thank you. I'm Ayada from JP Morgan Securities. I would like to ask two questions. First question is related to the previous topic, Panasonic Energy's production capacity. Sales for FY March 2029, you talked about JPY 1 trillion. When you achieve JPY 1 trillion, the production capacity between Kansas and Suminoe, what would be the image? I don't think you can give us a clear number, but if you can provide a range. If you cannot comment on BBU alone, you can include automotive application to share certain range. You just talked about the repurposing of the production lines between BBU and automotive by FY March 2029. Will that timing come, or is it more long-term until FY March 2031? I think the automotive demand will come in the FY March 2029. That is my first question.
The second question is on MEGTRON under Industry. MEGTRON's current sales content. When you look at that, for example, generation by generation, the M8 and M7, what is the composition and switch tray? Is it partially included? What is the content of the sales currently? Based on that, towards FY March 2031, the destination and generation, how will they change? The M9 and M10 spec in is taking place right now, and can you enter into those areas in high probability? Is that the current capacitor situation, switch tray, in addition to that, mid-tray, the midplane, can you also get into that area as well?
Thank you very much. Ayada-san, let me answer to your first question. First, the snapshot of FY March 2029, Kansas and domestic, and what would be the U.S. production. I cannot give you a clear breakdown right now. FY March 2029, from the first half, we are to ramp up very rapidly in domestic and the U.S. Maximum will reach 50%. That has to be the angle. In terms of the surface area, the model is slightly different between Kansas and Japan. GPU switchover will be the basis, and up to 50% can be possible in March 2029 period. Bringing it back to automotive application scenario-wise, it's possible, but considering the volume, currently, there is a strong demand.
We will discuss with the customers, but we do not assume in March 2029, but towards March 2031, we will discuss with automotive and data center customers to strike the right balance. Once it's repurposed from automotive to a data center, it's easier to repurpose back to automotive application. Domestic and U.S. maximum 50%, you're referring to BBU capacity to have. No. Within BBU, domestic cell and overseas cell, the number of cells, that is the number I mentioned. The type that we manufacture differs depending on the generation and GPU type, so that ratio will vary.
Thank you very much.
Let me talk about MEGTRON. The details, the numbers cannot be disclosed, but up to MEGTRON 6, mostly they are used for general purpose servers. General purpose servers, the volume is rising significantly up to MEGTRON 6 and 7 and 8. It's 60%-40%, or MEGTRON 9 or MEGTRON X. Already from customers, we have received a request and partially production has happening and continuous low loss or halogen-free or various additional specifications are added. That is the situation. Our MEGTRON manufacturing facilities themselves, for MEGTRON 6, 7, 8, the facilities can be shared without any modification.
Even if the generation changes from six, we are flexible in our production facility. When general server volume increases or when the high-performance substrate request comes up, we can follow towards FY March 2031. Partially optoelectronic technology, future technologies are emerging, but the periphery of MEGTRON, such as substrate and others, RDL, we are expanding our technology so that we are hoping to establish our unique position that cannot be replicated by the competitors.
Thank you. In terms of the customers, will midplane increase the application? In the future, midplane application will likely to increase or not?
The material themselves, well, our materials are for circuit boards, so in terms of the application, I think we can cater to the demand flexibly. In terms of the industry, we are in the information technology infrastructure, including switch and data centers. Our weight is concentrated almost entirely to this industry.
Understood. Thank you very much.
Thank you. Moving on to the next question. BofA Securities, Hirakawa-san, please.
Thank you. Hirakawa from BofA Securities. One question for industry and energy each. First, for industry. For the full year results, for AI, it was about JPY 50 billion sales for industry. Now, you've redefined that to JPY 230 billion. In terms of margin, listening to you speak, for JPY 230 billion, OP margin 20% is what you have in mind. What I want to ask is, for over JPY 50 billion, this is for the multilayer circuit board and the conductive capacitor, but the remaining JPY 107 billion, JPY 180 billion, that block, how is that broken down? Is for relay, for capacitor? It's difficult for us to understand, so can you break it down so we have a clearer image? Also, the margin for that, is it the same level as the overall level of 20%?
This is my first question. Second is about energy. You explained to us that you have a new system combining CBUs, and during this fiscal year, you will start shipping. For the next generation, for the power rack, you have really obtained awards, is how I understood it. For CBUs, clearly, value will be added with the CBUs. For the 800 V, as you go to HVDC, there, what kind of value add will be included into the system leading to the current award wins? Give us a clue there. Our expectation is that further, you will enter into power supply unit, you can enhance the value add further. Next generation, starting around 2028, where you are starting to win awards. In terms of increasing the value add of those products, what can you say?
About the AI related, the JPY 230 billion breakdown, Ozawa would respond. As pointed out, JPY 50 billion, initially, that was just the circuit boards for the GPUs. The part on the computing board, like the capacitors or the MEGTRON, those electronic components, that is what this covers. There is the switchboard or the serving is increasing with the general purpose servers. Take that into consideration. Certainly, there are those that you can place near memory, CLNs, we handle. To operate AI server, there are the necessary peripheral parts. If you include all of that and convert it, that would amount to about JPY 230 billion. In terms of profitability, I cannot give you the details, but the FY 2026, about half came from this area. You can calculate from there.
Let me follow up. 230 billion is talked about materials and components of capacitors. That is what I just heard. Can you give us a sub-segment breakdown? That would be appreciated, because JPY 230 billion increasing to JPY 400 billion, what area is going to increase how? That would be relevant for this topic. JPY 230 billion as of now, what is it comprised of? We want to have a clearer image there.
Ozawa-san.
It is not going to increase suddenly, you have changed the scope of what you cover, right? Originally, the GPU peripheral, like AI servers, has multiple GPUs, and there is a CPU to orchestrate the GPUs. CPU was not included previously. We looked at the whole of the data center, and we found that we had already captured markets. Adding all that up, this is what we have. The detailed segments that were mentioned.
Of the JPY 230 billion, about half is circuit board material. The remaining JPY 110 billion or so, that is polymer capacitors. SP-Cap or POSCAP or hybrid capacitor. Those would be included in that bucket. As Kusumi said, originally, we have positioned GPU as a core of the AI data center. Around that, there are several reference designs. This part is easier to chase at a later date. That would be our contribution to the AI data centers. CPUs and ASICs, all of that are included. If you calculate or convert the reference there, you have to look at where it is all used in totality, or else you will not be able to see a contribution. We just took a different angle, it is not that it has suddenly increased four or fivefold.
Understood. Thank you.
About the HVDC, how much value increase, and the BBU, high voltage BBU positioning is what I'd like to talk about. Gradually, the whole of the system layer is going to increase. You cannot have a sophisticated integrated system if you don't design early at the high level. HVDC, we think that it's going to increase FY March 29 onwards. Before that, we have BBUs and the shelves that combine the BBUs, and also for new issues, we have a CBU that responds to the load change. We should complete all of them and then think about what to do in terms of the overall integrated system, because the base is going to change to 800 V . That's going to be very important.
In that sense, expectations for us is that we make not just the individual units, but we are asked to make a more comprehensive, integrated proposal. CBU, BBU. For the high voltage, it's almost complete. We want to provide a more comprehensive solution. Also we have to do a lot of different power sources. Power source design. Partially, we have already started. Power source, where we have designed internally, we want to utilize based on partner strategies. That we will start to do from next generation. We're moving forward to further widen our approach.
Thank you very much.
We have been receiving many questions. Many people are raising hands, I would like to limit to one question per person. Next, Takeuchi-san of NHK, please.
I'm Takeuchi of NHK. Can you hear me?
Yes.
My question is related to Panasonic Industry. The breakthrough technology is to be developed, is how you put it. What kind of image do you have? Any requirement from the customers that you have? I would like to ask about the image. The structure reform took place and headcount reductions were taking place in Panasonic Industry, do you have any impact of that?
This is Ozawa. I will answer your question. The breakthrough technology and devices, as I have said in the beginning, the company Industry has strength in materials and process, and we are a unique company. The conductive polymer capacitors, especially in high-temperature environment, the property change is limited. It has been adopted as reference design from long time ago. We manufacture products that cannot be replicated by other companies, and we want to develop unique products. In an innovative device, the stable property under high temperature is the image. In the past, many devices were used under 100 V, but in high-temperature domain, high voltage can be applied in the device.
The verification of the principle is now completed, we are aiming at FY March 29 in launching the product. To be more specific, it's going to be capacitors. The second is the impact of the structure reform. Already in various areas, we have announced that we are working on portfolio management to identify areas of focus and defocus, defocused areas we sell to best owners so that the precious headcount will be allocated to our core businesses. For our core targeted business, we have sufficient resources. We are to strengthen R&D. We are also thinking of further strengthening resources in the core areas.
Thank you very much.
I'd like to move on to the next question. Mizuho Securities, Nakane-san, please ask your question.
Thank you. Nakane from Mizuho Securities. Tadanobu-san, fiscal 2029 and 2031, GPU and others, give us the ratio. DC/DC. You talk about power source. Is it going to be internally designed or produced? That's the DC/DC converter where you collaborate with outside partners. AC/DC, the power supply unit, you don't plan to handle that. Is that understanding correct? If that's the case, I think the market side interest and concern, or rather the interest, is the BBU and the CPU. In those systems, your position will not be challenged. But for the sidecar rack, the power source companies, they may incorporate a BBU and get orders in that way, like with 800 V sidecar, there is such a development or effort. ± 400.
It seems that in some projects, your position is threatened. With power suppliers, what kind of collaboration are you going to have, or how are you going to compete with them? Indirect or competitive relationship, should we not be too worried, or is that something that we need to watch? Give us some clues, please.
Thank you. Simply put, Panasonic Energy. How are we going to collaborate or compete with the power source manufacturers? I think that's the gist of the question. Let me give you some explanation. The first part of that, the semiconductor part. That will change to 10. NVIDIA, we're basing our comments based on what NVIDIA has announced. Hyperscalers themselves, they have their strategies. We respond to that, and we cannot disclose those strategies. At the time, we can say that will be timing for NVIDIA. 2028, that's where there will be high voltage. There's going to be issue of power shortage.
There's going to be acceleration there. We think that the GPUs to respond to that will become available. For DC/DC, as you said, for that, well, several power supply companies, we have strong partnerships, and we're expanding those partnerships to more partners. In order to deal with various situations and also to enhance our power source design capability, we have been taking in-house the design capabilities. For DC/DC, we would not compete or collaborate. As partners for various models, we will work with the power supply manufacturers. For AC/DC, we're not thinking of that. In the future, based on need, we might think about it, but no concrete projects ongoing there.
Also mentioned earlier, power source companies, we're working together with them. Globally, the power supply companies that can deal with the global data centers, I think it's very few within one hand, and we have fingers of one hand, and we have good relationships with them. We talked about local procurement ratio, raising that. Their roadmap and our roadmap, based on that, we've agreed to build a supply chain based on that. We're steadily working on those initiatives. It's not one or the other. Hyperscalers are providing the specs, and then we provide that to the partners. Co-creation relationship is further evolving instead of just pure competition. Please understand that way.
Thank you very much.
Next, Fujiwara-san from Citigroup Securities.
This is Fujiwara of Citigroup Securities. I would like to ask about conductive polymer capacitors. This area is almost entirely dominated by the company, but it seems that there are competitors entering this market. The competitive landscape of the industry and new entrants, how much of a threat are they? The product may be little different. You talked about the complementary position of MLCC, but there's a concern that there will be a replacement to MLCC. What is the company's view?
I will answer the question. The conductive capacitors, the chip type, there is a cylindrical type and prism type. The cylindrical type, the prismatic type. The cylindrical type, there is a competitor from the past, and the prismatic type is based on aluminum and tantalum, and for aluminum type, there is a Chinese player that has 80% of the share.
In tantalum type, there is 50% share. The other half is KEMET, and in the cylindrical type, there are many new entrants, such as Chinese players. Our technology on the conductive capacitor is becoming a standard. This standardized technology, in the past, was held partially by the suppliers, but from last year, this part is replaced by our in-house developed technology, so we would like to heighten the entry barrier. The replacement with the MLCC, it has been talked about during the past decades. As I have explained in the beginning, the effective demand for our product is so-called large capacity. In terms of MLCC, it is 47 micro, and very small capacity MLCC does not compete with us at all.
MLCC's shift to large capacity for them and to develop the technology, that may become a competitor, but as I have said, in terms of the material property, when temperature is high or the voltage is high, the capacity declines for MLCC. We have a strength in that. With a smaller surface area, we can offer the same functionality. That is the value we would like to continue to provide and strengthen and secure the market share.
Thank you very much.
Thank you very much. Toyo Keizai, Yamashita-san, please.
Thank you. Yamashita from Toyo Keizai. I hope you hear me.
Yes.
Thank you. I want to ask about the energy business, the operating margin to fiscal March 29, your thinking behind that. You say you will utilize the existing facilities, you'll ramp up in a speedy and a light-footed manner. At the same time, you're going to make a substantial investment as well. Fiscal March 29, ROIC more than 20%, you have that goal. The high margin for the battery storage system, you will maintain that? That's the basis for those numbers, or is it coming from new measures in capital expenditure? What's going to be the trend?
Thank you for the question. Fiscal March 29, ROIC 20% or higher, we want to ensure that happens. Let's talk about the assumptions behind that.
Today, as we explained, fiscal March 29, the investment for the Kansas plant is going to be very large. For the data center, there's going to be full mass production according to plan. For the automotive batteries, although we didn't touch upon this in terms of its timing, the remaining lines would operate, that has been confirmed with our customers. Against the invested capital, we make sure that we operate the facilities. Domestically, we will have a robust business for data center and others. The orders from the existing customers, if we are to ramp up to meet that demand, it may look like a big investment number, but we think that we'll be able to increase the ratio of data center where the high margin is maintained. With that, we think we can achieve those numbers.
We should ramp up with that ratio that we just talked about. I think that is the key.
Understood. Thank you.
Thank you very much. We are coming closer to the scheduled time to close, I would like to take one more question. Katsura-san from SMBC Nikko Securities, please.
I'm Katsura from SMBC Nikko Securities. I would like to ask about industry. New business. First, CBU solution and capacitor new product launch, supercapacitor. Can you explain the relationship of them? CPU is a module type, ordinary ones, is that the case? In supercapacitor, you're also going to sell standalone product in your business, on page eight, innovative devices are shown, LIC or next generation areas. Is that the goal you are aiming at in JPY 50 billion will be the scale in the year 2030. Is this what you are referring to? There's inductor and relay application products. Do you also include these products, and are they mostly in-house developed products, or have you done M&A, or shall we think about M&A? The breakdown of the JPY 150 billion investment, can you also provide deeper information on the future?
The details will be explained by Ozawa-san later. The supercapacitor, whether to sell externally or not. Naturally, between operating companies within the Group, there would be some negotiations. My thinking is that if hyperscalers recognize the superiority of our CBU, and if we can maintain high share, then from Group optimization perspective, whether to sell supercapacitor as a component or sell as CBU. As I said, the pricing will be different, and the per-unit profit will differ. As much as possible, we would like to maintain high share under CBU. Hyperscalers, they have a tendency of a multi-supplier policy.
How are we going to sell supercapacitors externally? That we need to think about. During this weekend, I was discussing with these two members exactly on that topic. Ozawa-san, over to you.
Within operating companies, the negotiation, I would like to refrain from making a comment. Industry, we are focused on sell. That is the core business. The supercapacitor, you may think that it came up suddenly, but 20 years ago, we have a track record as a backup of automotive application, including LIC and EDLC. There were other supercapacitors that we have handled, and we can design in a unique way and large current can be accepted and released. That principle was the basis of developing the supercapacitor. Basically, this is going to be a new business. There was a question on inductor and relay, whether they are included or not.
Inductors and relays, already inductors are adopted in vehicle and AI server tuning by changing it. Next fiscal year, we are scheduled to launch the product. In the two-year period, EV 800 V and -400, they repurpose the product that was used in EV's circuit. We have visibility of this application. The question was also on JPY 150 billion investment. JPY 60 billion is for the circuit board and the same amount for the condenser and new R&D investments. Those products are the target of the CapEx of JPY 160 billion. New device, LIC, and EDLC. Are they different? Sorry, I forgot about that. LIC and EDLC. They are not LIC nor EDLC. As I have said, from the power grid to semiconductor chip, we are thinking of our contribution between them, and high voltage area is where we do not contribute sufficiently.
MLCC high voltage product is also being provided, our unique product we would like to introduce targeting fiscal March 29. When that is the timing of high voltage HVDC.
Thank you very much. Thank you.
With that, we'd like to conclude the Q&A session. Thank you so much. This concludes today's program. Thank you very much for joining us despite your busy schedules. With that, we would like to end today's session.