Thank you very much for joining us today despite your busy schedules. We will now begin NTT financial results briefing for the nine months ended December 31, 2025. I am Akaishi from the Investor Relations Department and will moderate today's session. First, let me introduce today's three speakers: Hiroi, Senior Executive Vice President; Nakamura, Senior Vice President and Director of Finance and Accounting Department; and Hattori, Senior Vice President and Director of Corporate Strategy Planning Department. This briefing is being live-streamed. Please note that an on-demand webcast will be available at a later date. Today's session will primarily focus on Q&A. For materials related to the financial results, please refer to the presentation materials available on our IR website. We also disclosed the notice regarding revision of full-year consolidated earnings forecast today, so please take a look. We will now proceed to the Q&A session.
Please register your questions in advance. Those who have pre-registered, we will take questions from the web conferencing system. If you have a question, please press the raise hand button on the web conferencing system. To cancel your question, press the raise hand button again, please. When we call on a questioner, please state your company name and your name. When requested, please unmute yourself on the web conferencing system. After asking your question, please remain unmuted until our response is complete. We will now take questions. From Nomura Securities, Mr. Masuno, please unmute and ask your question.
This is Masuno from Nomura Securities. I have two questions. The profit plan for the overall company, how we should look at it. Last year around this time, I did ask about it because it ended lower than the plan, and this time you're going to revise downwards again.
So next fiscal year, at the press conference held before, DOCOMO, they want to improve the efficiency of the average revenue of the sales promotion. So I think the premise should be that the situation is going to continue for a while. And for the network quality improvement, there's going to be depreciation as well as the disposal expense that will come out. So I think you should make a plan that is more aligned to the reality. What do you think about that?
This is Hiroi speaking. The revision downwards of the guidance this time that we have conducted, we have been causing tremendous trouble to our shareholders, and we really take this seriously. And as you have correctly pointed out, regarding the trend of the business performance, continuance from last fiscal year, the performance has not been strong. And we deeply apologize for that.
As you pointed out, Mr. Masuno, how we plan and how we run the business, maybe it's better that we should do it in a more conservative way is probably what you have said. And what you have pointed out, we will like to take it in as it was stated and as soon as possible. We would like to come up with a thorough plan for next fiscal year that can be trusted by our investors. Having said that, the situation from last year this year and towards next year, there are some areas that have the possibility that it's going to change. Well, you will be having the briefing session with DOCOMO after this, so at that time, I believe that there will be some explanation provided to you and you will probably be asking the question. But on the revenue side, is ARPU bottoming out?
We are starting to have visibility of that. Telecommunications, well, compared to our competitors, the mobile telecommunications business, compared to the competitors, the billing plan revision, the timing was late. That is why our bottoming out plan timing was later than them. But we are starting to see signs that it is going to bottom out. Therefore, that is a positive factor in terms of the business performance going forward. And the cost side, what are we going to do when the competitive environment becomes even more severe? We would like to create the plan that is going to be more aligned to the situation and thoroughly make the plans. That is all. Thank you.
Thank you very much for that. My second question is related to the overall direction. The group companies on the individual basis have the direction they want to go. The data, the press conference said it's like digital AI. Doko Mo said the finance, they want to create a they're going to create a holding company, etc. And for the holding company yourself, you have the quantum computing is what you are talking about. So as a group overall, the vision three years from now, four years from now, what is that going to be? For example, in the industry, there's a strategy option that you'll concentrate on AI or you're going to improve your financial positioning and do more investment or you're going to have AI implemented in all businesses and have AI combined with mobile? I can understand the strategy of each of the operating companies, but as the holding company, as a company-wide perspective, how do you look at things three years, four years from now? Thank you for that.
This is Hiroi speaking. In the future, what we envision is that within we are operating our business based on our medium-term management strategy. The strategy that is in that plan, what we're doing the strategy we have is not that deviated from the medium-term plan. We're saying we're going to make proactive investment in the growth area of JPY 8 trillion. Digitalization, data center investment, and Smart Life business in DOCOMO, reinforcing the personal business. We are going to allocate up and doing that. However, the return becoming visible towards the investment that we have made, that coming visible timing may be slightly behind what we have expected. However, regarding the investment towards growth, we would like to thoroughly continue it. The total business performance, it is not doing as well as expected regarding that.
Compared to the starting point of the medium-term management strategy, the business model that we have planned is not reflecting the existing situation. We would like to rebuild up the especially Doko Mo's business. Regarding the growth investment that we have shown you at our medium-term plan, we would like to continue that investment and actually accelerate the return that we can enjoy. We have revised downwards this time, so there are some difficult points regarding the leverage and others. Of course, we would like to keep a close eye on those factors and continue the business operation.
Okay. Thank you very much. Those were the two questions I wanted to ask.
Thank you very much. Next, SMBC Nikko Securities, Kikuchi-san. Please unmute yourself and ask your question.
Kikuchi speaking. I have two questions. This year, we have only two months left, and so I think you are working on being in line with the plan. For next fiscal year, I'm sure the numbers are not ready yet, and you will not refer to any numbers, but want to know the general direction of each company. What is your view, Hiroi-san?
Of course, I know that it will not be a commitment. So, for example, in Doko Mo, I will ask the question again in the next session, but network expense will increase next year, but overall, we will try to improve. NTT DATA group, i think it's strong generally. And I think it's about finance, data center, capital recycling, how we should look at the profit there, and what to do with east and west, and overall. So if you could just give me the general direction, I'd appreciate it.
Thank you for the question. So it's difficult to answer because it may imply things for next fiscal year, but generally speaking, as you mentioned, Kikuchi-san, Doko Mo, data, and regional communication, my take or my general impression I'd like to share with you. First, for Doko Mo, we want this year to be the bottom and the performance to improve. So improvement of the performance will be the key point. And whether we can do that has not been decided at all at this point, but we hope the financial results will improve even by a little margin. By maintaining the pace of sales, we will improve efficiency. So to repeat myself, Doko Mo sales, the strengthening of sales, the outcome will be the subscribers and our ARPU trend. I think we have some silver linings, so we want to build on top of that.
Next, regarding data, AI, cloud, in many areas, the market is growing. So now that it is a wholly owned subsidiary, we want NTT DATA to continue growing. And data center will be one key point. But overall, financial leverage is still difficult. So in terms of the expansion of data center, we will use outside capital to grow. That will be one key point. And next, NTT East and West, the optical consumer base, the demand remains strong. So we are pursuing our investment and strengthening our sales. So this robust demand for optical will be captured as we run our business. And enterprise business in East and West are growing now. We have GIGA School and other solution-type businesses. And network is now connecting data centers. And so we're seeing various types of enterprise demand, so we will capture them to grow strongly at any rate. The details will be fleshed out going forward.
Thank you. My second question is I don't know if I can take this seriously as I listened to you earlier, but the president said in the Q&A about IOWN, you said you are still in the price negotiation on IOWN, President Shimada said. So the product, are you already at that stage? Are customers already at that stage? So you are now negotiating price, and if you come to an agreement, you can announce something. Is that how much you've progressed already? Are you already at that stage? Well, this is about business, and we have the counterpart. So under our sales strategy, we will refrain from saying anything in specific terms, but we want to commercialize in FY26. So the message is correct.
So there are concrete business progressing, but at this point, I would like to leave it at that. Thank you. A while ago, three months ago, in IRPR Day, you said that in Q4, the commercial samples will be released, I think you said. That remains unchanged based on your current forecast? Commercial samples, we have business negotiations with our customers, and we use the material. We have the material already available, and we use that to be more specific on the terms and businesses.
Thank you very much.
Thank you very much. Next, from Daiwa Securities, Mr. Tokunaga, please unmute and ask your questions.
This is Tokunaga from Daiwa Securities. I have two questions. The first is regarding the strategy for Doko Mo's share. In order to not lower the shares, one option you can take is inorganic, invest or have an alliance or a partnership with an MVNO, or have a low-price plan on the internet. I'm sure that there are other options other than inorganic, but for your company, instead of doing that, you want to acquire subscribers and organically maintain your shares. Is that better is what you think? Well, regarding the increase of the subscribers, how we will do that?
We always pursue various options. In fact, you said inorganic. So within our past various transactions, how to apply inorganic options. And regardless of the scale, being small or large, we have been doing such a thing in the past. So it's not that we are ignoring that option or we are not going to take that option.
However, if we were to do such a thing, there is the situation of the counterpart that we have to consider. Also, when we acquire it, we need to look at the price added. It depends on the condition at that time. Therefore, for us, looking at the market now, acquiring customers or subscribers in an inorganic way, we are thinking the organic way is what we need right now. But that's why we're doing this. But as an option, of course, that still exists.
Thank you for your detailed explanation. My second question may overlap, but regarding when we look at your interest-bearing debt in your financial positions, with the data acquisition, the leverage went up. But when you want to conduct your strategies, for the individual operating company, how much of an investment facility is left? I want to know about the discipline, financial discipline.
For DOCOMO, it seems that there's a lot of investment towards a Smart Life business. However, this investment room that you have, looking at the current financial situations, how much of it do you have is what I would like to know?
Well, regarding this fiscal year, the interest-bearing debt currently is becoming larger. And as you have pointed out, EBITDA multiple is deteriorating. Regarding this fiscal year, wholly owning NTT DATA occurred, and we had to use a large amount of cash. That was the situation we had. And regarding the investment, as I have mentioned before, under the medium-term management strategy, we were thinking of JPY 8 trillion investment in the growth areas. Therefore, regarding the increase of investments, that was already incorporated in our outlook. Well, DOCOMO acquired the bank this time, and others as well were reflected.
But what we have to recover is the EBITDA. The investment amount towards the growth areas, the return, I did mention, is slightly delayed. But of course, there are investments that are showing effectiveness already. But the foundation business that we have, the cash flow of those or the EBITDA of those or the cash generation capability of those foundational businesses is lower than when we created the medium-term management strategy is what we're facing right now. So if we improve this part, the EBITDA multiple is going to start to improve. However, in various aspects, of course, we have to maintain our credit rating as well. So depending on the degree of the improvement of EBITDA multiple, how we're going to accelerate our investment, I'd like to do it in a way that we do not damage the attractiveness from our investors by controlling it. Thank you very much.
I just wanted to confirm, the investment towards the growth area, there's still room for Doko Mo and NTT DATA.
We are still in the growth market. Therefore, in that way, regarding the very promising investments, we would like to thoroughly do that. And in a way that even though we do that, we can still maintain the trust of our investors by having thorough control and the financial position.
Thank you very much. That is all.
Thank you very much. Next, Goldman Sachs Securities, Tanaka-san, please unmute yourself and ask your question. Tanaka-san, can you hear us? If you could please unmute yourself and ask your question.
This is Tanaka from Goldman Sachs. Thank you very much. Please go ahead. Thank you. This fiscal year and next fiscal year, I have one question each on the financial results. Doko Mo and Data will be next.
So I have a question on NTT East and NTT West, how we can look at the financial results this year. Q3 operating profit was up. So on quarter basis, up and down, it was up and then down. Q3 NTT East and NTT West, year-on-year profit increase, was there a one-off factor included? And if you look at the breakdown, legacy business decline seems to be smaller. Was there a change in the trend? So that's my first question.
Thank you for the question. This is Nakamura speaking. One-off factor, no large one-off factor, but if you look cash-in timing, some differences. So it's about accounting treatment, universal service, subsidy, the way it's posted was changed. So slight change, but largely it is as usual. We will follow up on this later, the details.
Thank you very much. Legacy business, any changes in the trend of legacy business?
If there are no large one-off factors, then including the cost restraint, you are now recovering the mild profit recovery trend. Next year, price will increase.
But is that the general trend now, underlying trend?
Thank you, Nakamura speaking. Tanaka-san, you are right. No change in the trend. So it is now trending stably.
Thank you very much. My second question has been raised a few times, but once again, the revision of the medium-term plan is necessary, I think. So as much as you can say, what are you discussing in revising your medium-term plan? In the past discussion, you will keep the direction of the growth investment unchanged, but the way you think about profit and M&A, anything you can touch on the discussion that you are having right now?
Thank you, Hiroi speaking. I may repeat myself, but the medium-term plan may need to be partially revised. Yes, you're right. So we are now discussing internally. But at this point, I don't know how the discussion will turn out. We have to look more in detail in each company. But at this point, the large medium-term framework, this direction of investing for our future growth will be maintained. The key is how we can show this growth. That is the key to our discussion. If I could leave it at that, I would appreciate it. Yes, understood.
Thank you very much.
Thank you very much. Next, from Okasan Securities, Mr. Okumura, please unmute and ask your question.
Thank you very much. This is Okumura from Okasan Securities. Can you hear my voice?
Yes, we can hear you.
Thank you. I have two questions. The first is related to the operating income guidance for next fiscal year. This is just confirming the answer towards Mr. Kikuchi's question. So you are having the policy or direction to aim for increase in profit? And the increase and decrease sorry, the effect after selling the data center, I want to know what the impact is going to be.
You're talking about the next fiscal year's business performance. It's difficult to give you any specifics. Generally speaking, of course, all the time, we would like to aim for an increase in profit, meaning that we want to respond to your expectations. Therefore, as a very basic policy, of course, we have that. However, having said that, within each business segment, how that is going to come about, the details of that is something that we will be narrowing down from now onwards.
But as I have been mentioning from before regarding NTT DOCOMO, your concerns exist is what we are aware of. So for us too, we need to surely show you the path towards a recovery. And we are quite aware of that.
Thank you very much. My second question may be related to that. Regarding the asset sales, what are your thoughts regarding selling assets? Last several years, the real estate sales of NTT East and NTT West and NTT DATA center sales and recently Doko Mo towers. So more than from the perspective for growth, but it seems that you're making the decision of asset sales to fill in the gaps of the business performance. So moving forward with the holding company taking the lead to dispose of the dormant assets and others, what are you going to do with the assets? Are you going to show that, your direction to the investors? Can you talk about that?
Thank you very much for your question. The way we think regarding the asset sales, to simplify everything and it's narrowed down to one way of thinking, that is not the case. There are various ways of thinking because we have a lot of real estate on hand. Conventionally or historically, held assets, especially in NTT East and West, regarding those types of real estate, the basic thought is how we can utilize that and use that to generate cash is the way we think about those assets. So of course, the telecommunications equipment and network facility type of real estate, it's making money through the businesses utilizing those real estates.
But the real estate, if it's not utilized fully by us holding it, we sell it to a real estate company or development company. And if we decide that it's better for us to maximize the value of the real estate that is idle or dormant, then we will sell that. So those types of assets in the past to now, we have been selling those types of assets. But regarding the telephone telecommunications facilities, regarding the facilities that we are trying to consolidate, of course, we're trying to improve the network itself. We would like to sell those assets ahead of time, consolidate these telecommunications facilities, open up that real estate, and actually hand it over to the buyer. So these types of transactions, it's a way of thinking as well.
So all this is based on the way of thinking that we would like to utilize these real estates in the most efficient way. But the way of thinking towards the data center is slightly different. There's a very strong demand towards data centers. And we would like to increase the investments towards these data centers. However, as you have been asking, EBITDA multiple is becoming quite high. Therefore, at this part, how can we expand the data center business is thought of from the perspective of how we can conduct the capital recycling for the data centers. So for the data centers, partially, we will be selling it and acquire the new opportunities for the data centers is what we're doing now. So basically, maximizing the enterprise value is why we're doing these things or selling the real estate.
It's not to fill in the gaps of the business performance. Maybe as a result, it may seem that way. But that is not the final goal of us selling off the assets. I hope you understand it in that way. Understood it very well. Sorry, it was quite a rude question towards you. That is all. Thank you.
Thank you very much. We do not have any more hands raised. It's about time. We would now like to close the financial results briefing. We will next move on to NTT DOCOMO's session. Please stay connected. Thank you very much.
Thank you very much for joining us today despite your busy schedules. We will now begin NTT DOCOMO financial results briefing for Q3 of FY 2025. I am Wakuie from IR office and will serve as the moderator. First, let me introduce today's three speakers.
Mr. Kobayashi, Senior Executive Vice President; Tsuboya, Senior Vice President and General Manager of Corporate Strategy and Planning Department; and Fujiki, Senior Vice President and General Manager of Accounting and Finance Department. For materials related to financial results, please refer to the presentation materials available on our IR website. Today, we will focus on Q&A session. If you have questions, please use the raise hand button on the web conferencing system. When we appoint you, please unmute yourself. We will now take questions. SMBC Nikko Securities and Mr. Kikuchi, please unmute and ask your questions.
This is Kikuchi speaking. Hello. I have two questions. The first question is regarding next fiscal year. What is your outlook towards next fiscal year? Of course. The plan is something that you will be creating from now onwards. I'm sure there is an increase and decreasing factor. So I wanted to confirm with that. Listening to Mr. Maeda's presentation, I have listened to Mr. Maeda's presentation. So I'd like to ask questions as a follow-up or deepen my understanding. First of all, sales promotion expenses. First of all, the sales promotion expenses other than the smartphone program, according to your explanation before, you can't decrease it. I didn't understand whether you can increase it or decrease it. And regarding the smartphone program, if it's the other carrier, at some quarter is a peak. But for the other carriers, it's been continuing for years. So where is the peak going to occur? And are there going to be any peaks next fiscal year? Is that what I would like to know. And also, regarding the network, next fiscal year's P&L is going to increase is how I heard it.
But from FY 2027, as cost-wise, it's going to be reduced. But CapEx, this year is the peak. But cost, P&L is next fiscal year is the peak. So sorry, I'm repeating myself. But I just wanted to confirm whether these sales promotion expenses are included in next year as well. And you don't need it next next year? I would like you to clarify those points. That's my first question. Thank you very much.
I would like to answer each question one by one. This is Kobayashi speaking. First of all, towards our shareholders, apologies for revising downwards. Therefore, as you said, Mr. Kikuchi, we have not established next fiscal year's plan. But I would like to share the current thoughts. The main factor for the revision downwards, you mentioned about Mr. Maeda's presentation. So I would like to include that.
First of all, the number one reason of the revision downwards is due to the sales promotion expenses increase. Of course, before, I've said that it's increasing as well. But MNP, against the previous year, it's been increasing by 20% and the competition becoming more severe. And the price that we provide at the storefront, the other carriers are competing. And also, the replacement, Kaedoki, the replacement program, it's the same way as the MNP market. The total sales or volume is increasing. So there is an increase in subscribers to a certain extent and port out, same as the MNP, it is increasing by 20% as well. So the guidance is something that I would like to touch upon later on. However, with what's happening to the subscribers that we have acquired, I'm sure there are people who listen to the explanation of Mr. Maeda.
But there may be some overlap. So I would like to explain. What's in the material of the financial results is that, first of all, the ARPU is starting to surely turn around. And this is very important is how we look at it. And as you said, Mr. Kikuchi, the irumo's 0.5 GB existed in the past. And you're actually continuing to acquire not-so-good users. And with that, you're trying to expand the subscribers. I would like to mention two things about this. First of all, irumo is gone now. And we created DOCOMO Mini. And if all the users are migrating to DOCOMO Mini, that is not the case. Well, eximo and last year's eximo, when you compare that, the acquisition ratio of eximo for the new SS cards as well, they have a higher percentage.
Mini and ahamo, well, ahamo in the medium pricing plan range, we're seeing an increase. So eximo more than eximo has a design that is stickier. Therefore, in that sense, we have more users joining that plan. So having that visibility, we decided that we should continue the sales promotion expenses being injected. And towards the increase of this expense, we are selling the assets. And that's not large. But if we do that, we're looking at the LTV as well. But we think we thought that we are going to have a certain outcome. And that is why we have come up with this plan. And we have revised downwards. So sales promotion cost next year, are we going to increase it, decrease it? Conclusion first, nothing has been decided.
But basically, if the current competitive arena situation is going to continue, we would like to continue to do so. The sales promotion expenses last fiscal year, MNP, especially the second half, FY 2024 second half, we did reinforce it. But FY 2025, the market competition was more severe than what we thought. If this situation is going to continue to FY 2026 and if we are going to have to increase the sales promotion expense. And as Mr. Maeda said, we need to thoroughly look at the customers and convey what we're trying to do. At the channels, we can do that. But at the mass retailers, the staffs there, their sales capability, the number of staffs and the number of supervisors, this is actually important. And finally, these areas, we were finally able to caught up with the other carriers.
From the time we start FY 2026, we probably will be able to establish the same structure as the other carriers, is what we think. And also, this is repeating myself. And also, at the commercial facility, the number of shops we have out there, we are behind the other carriers. So we are catching up. And for the areas we are lacking, we do have a space that we create to surely thoroughly sell. So this sales capability is steadily increasing as well. And if there are areas that we're spending too much or we can lower the price, if that becomes possible, of course, we'll be cautious of determining this. If that is so, it is going to work towards the direction of lower sales promotion expenses.
So the sales promotion expenses will probably be at the level not different from this fiscal year. And Kaedoki, and of course, this year, we did make a lot of adjustments of also creating the reserve for this. And the sales promotion expenses were the outstanding. Maybe the ones that are not used at the peak or the people who did not replace it this year, the peak may show next year, next next year. What we're trying to say is that this year is a one-time, we reserve it. And it's not that next year it's going to be lighter. But this fiscal year, we're looking at the level of how much we're reserving. So next year, we are going to allocate this reserve part for this more that is not expected. And we are not expecting a lower revision downwards. And Kaedoki, we're looking at about JPY 20 billion.
But actually, it deteriorated to JPY 30 billion. So we would like to incorporate we are incorporating the trend we're facing right now and looking at next fiscal year. So Kaedoki or the handset replacement timing and also the sales promotion expenses, we are looking at it thoroughly. Sorry, I'm speaking too long. But regarding the network, to begin with, FY 2025, FY 2026, and the two years, we wanted to reach the same number base station as the other carriers. In a normal situation, we have 1.3 x of users than others. And that if that is equivalent to the investment amount, that means that about JPY 50 billion per annum is what we are investing. So in two years, it's JPY 100 billion. And depreciation period is very long for this. So it's not going to largely change the network cost.
But on the other hand, the network itself, at the initial stage of 5G, the equipment that is used at base stations is not good. So we are replacing them. And with that, we have the disposal cost that is arising. And there's a disposal expense in FY 2025, FY 2026. Each is about JPY 50 billion respectively for each year. Depending on the construction procedure, it will differ. But the image is around JPY 50 billion yen to replace those equipment or replacing the network is not done. But the more globally competitive equipment at a globally competitive cost is procured. So we'll have the equipment set up at the base stations with quite a competitive one. And that timing that we don't have to do any more further will be around FY 2027. Then the disposal will go down. Depreciation will slightly go up is how we look at it.
But for your reference, in the past appreciations, it's not moving around $50 billion as I mentioned right now. But in FY 2024 ahead of time, we started the network reinforcement. And there are some disposal expenses that occurred at that time as well. And the base station construction, how it is going to progress, depending on that, maybe the disposal timing may occur in FY 2027. But from FY 2027, the overall network cost, we believe, is going to go down. And the current cost balance right now, what is it? FY 2026 is not going to change that much. And the sales promotion expense may slightly increase is what I mentioned. But this was not included in your question, Mr. Kikuchi. But design-wise, what we keep an eye is what is going to happen to the growth areas.
The Smart Life and Enterprise Business, each one of them annually, it's about JPY 30 billion or together JPY 60 billion yen increase in profit. They have that capability to achieve that is how we look at it. So whether it's going to be at that range, it will depend on it. For asset sales moving forward, the details, please apologize, forgive us for not giving you a detail. But for asset sales, there are some in the third quarter, fourth quarter, we have the largest number of asset sales there. And you have pointed out last time. But it's not to fill in the gap. But for network, we have to have a network equipment at where land price is high. If we're able to consolidate it, then we should because in the long term, it is going to increase the efficient and photonics network.
We need to look at that, the possibility of implementing that, and also the quality of the equipment itself as well. Not just for this fiscal year. We should sell the real estate when the real estate price goes up. We believe that we have a certain level of that for next fiscal year as well. To secure profit, I have been mentioning various measures. AI implementation for cost efficiency improvement, of course, that works. In the Smart Life area, what we're doing there is to revisit the services. We will stop doing the businesses that are loss-making or depending on situation, selling the businesses within the Smart Life. Well, recently, the expense to do that is going to come about first. It is not incorporated in the income improvement. These types of measures will also work in the positive direction.
So where it says the asset sales and others, this fiscal year coming up at one time. And next year, nothing's going to come about. So there's going to be a reactionary decline. And that is not the case. So this is how we think regarding the question you have given us.
Thank you very much. Sorry that I asked you a lot. So I'm sure the others will ask other questions. But my second question is that the DOCOMO SBI Sumishin Net Bank, it's a JPY 4.6 billion or JPY 10 billion per annum for upward revision factor for fourth quarter. So the profit is this much, depreciation this much, and next fiscal year, should we look at it the same way? Or from next fiscal year, various measures are going to show their effect. So is it going to increase more?
Sumishin Net Bank is what I would like to know. But we're reflecting the numbers. Probably you're saying that the number is too small. This may be preaching to the choir. But when we acquired them, consolidated-wise, the purchase price allocation was done. And they were assets that we needed to depreciate at an early stage. And for the acquisition stage, that's booked as a premium. So with that, the first year, that's quite a bit is going to be effective. So money amount-wise, I cannot quote that right now. But next fiscal year, it's not that it's going to become a full year. There's going to be more, a little bit more. Okay, understood. So even though the business doesn't grow, technically, accounting-wise, the expense is going to go down. And with that, the next fiscal year, we could expect an increase in profit.
Well, of course, we have the expected synergy. And we want to, of course, we want to work together with them to increase the number of accounts that will be open. But not even including that, the numbers itself that is incorporated for this year alone will show an increase. Is that a large number? Whether well, what's the degree of quite large? Well, it is fairly large is how we look at it. JPY 30 billion yen profit, annual profit, or is it going to be that level? Looking at the individual components, I don't want that to just walk on their own. So at the end of the fiscal year, we would like to disclose those details.
Thank you very much.
Thank you very much. Next person, Daiwa Securities, Tokunaga-san, please unmute yourself and ask your question.
This is Tokunaga from Daiwa Securities. I have two questions. First is how I look at the material, Page 10 and Page 30. So if I compare the two Pages, so mobile and network strengthening expense, are they trending in line with your expectation? And the network, JPY 113 billion, this was a shortfall. So compared to last year, how much sales promotion price push-down factor are you envisioning? That's my first question.
Tokunaga-san, you're right. Network, we have the plan and the investment. So it is in line with the plan. And ARPU, mobile communication services, MNP is now net addition. And so it is not way off. It is in line. So how much in sales promotion? I cannot mention numbers, values. But if eximo come in, DAZN can increase its value, or various sales promotion channels can be strengthened earlier. So that was an impact of a few tens of billions of JPY.
$113 billion is just right. Sales promotion expenses, I thought was flat year-on-year. But it is negative JPY 113 billion. Or on a full year, you thought this will push up the profit but not? Or what was the nuance? Last year, in the second half, we did quite a bit, as I mentioned at the full year forecast, full year result. But in the first half, we did not do much sales promotion. For full year, we strengthened in the second half. And that continued. And that is the basis for FY 2025, eximo, and other contents, attracting customers. So we incorporated some reduction. Compared to FY 2024, we had fewer in the first half. And it is JPY 100 billion higher than that. Q4, you have abundant budget. And that is the revised plan. Well, not because you are an investor.
But it's not abundant. From competitive reasons, we are preparing the right amount to be able to compete with other players. And we did that last year too. MNP market is now 1.2 x bigger. So it is about 1.2 x. Thank you. Next question is turn rate, Page 13. The competitive landscape is worsening. Your turn rate is rising. But looking at the increase in eximo, you have low turn rate users too. So on a year-on-year basis, is turn rate improving? When do you think turn rate will turn around? The absolute level we know is worsening. But we have eximo. And irumo 0.5 GB is discontinued. And we have OCN, so OCN Mobile ONE. So once this settles, we think it will start turning down. So next year, we will start seeing flat and then preferably go down. But this also has to do with the sales promotion. So we will issue the guidance in the next quarter. Please wait.
Thank you.
Thank you very much. Nomura Securities, Mr. Masuno, please unmute and ask your question.
This is Masuno from Nomura Securities. I have two questions. The first question is regarding the increase and decrease of the profit. I just wanted to confirm some detail points. Just before, you were talking about the disposal expense of the network facilities. This year is JPY 50 billion. Next fiscal year is JPY 50 billion as well. So it's not going to increase. So it's a plus minus of zero. Is that correct? And including the asset sales, it's JPY 50 billion. So this JPY 50 billion, out of that, there's some assets for next fiscal year. And others are advanced expenses that are required. And that's going to disappear. So JPY 50 billion going down minus JPY 50 billion down, meaning that there's not a large negative number. Is that the correct understanding? That's the point that I want to confirm first.
I think that is quite a concerning point. So I would like to accurately explain that. First of all, the JPY 50 billion, JPY 50 billion for the disposal removal cost, well, the construction progress slightly being delayed. Looking on a monthly basis, well, this fiscal year, it may be slightly lower. And next fiscal year, increasing more. But the large trend is that this JPY 50 billion is not going to disappear next fiscal year. And once again, newly adding JPY 50 billion, that's not going to happen as well. So the network cost itself, we are slightly increasing the investment towards that. And the removal process is going to increase next fiscal; the largest will be next fiscal year.
So there's going to be a slight increase. But it's not going to be $50 billion, is what I think at this point. However, from the trust relationship we have with you, it's not that we have created the plan for next fiscal year. So how we look at it, it's seen like this right now. Regarding the asset, it's more than that. How I think about this, this is the way I think as a CFO personally. The Smart Life and Enterprise business is a $60 billion increase in profit can be done. That is, if we consider this as a base organic growth, then the mobile telecommunications negative, we want to keep it under than that because the network is not going to increase that much. And whether we can keep that within the $60 billion, that is the crucial point.
If possible, this JPY 50 billion, we included the asset sales and others. And even though included this, that there's a reaction to that. So without lowering from this JPY 50 billion, the final number adjustment, even at that part, we would like to aim for an increase in profit. We don't have the details more than that. But the way of thinking are these two.
Thank you very much. And SBI Sumishin Net Bank, you have dropped your interest. And you paid JPY 370 billion at the end. So, of course, it should be profit because you're paying JPY 370 billion. Of course, that's a given that you're going to gain profit. But NTT Holding Company, they paid JPY 110 billion to sort out the relationship with them. And then after that, then SBI Sumishin came and said, "We want it." It's like it was a waste of sweating.
I think you're going to manage it as the finance professional. The professionals became as the professionals of finance. Your company being able to manage it is becoming smaller and smaller, cultivating new customers. Maybe you can work on that. But managing the finance business, it seems like it's not that type of an atmosphere. But once it becomes a holding company, then it's going to be different. It will change. I can be definite about that. Well, Sumitomo Mitsui, to deepen the relationship, we made some adjustments. But the essence of this is that this net bank is something that we need. It's a piece that we need. That's how we started from the start. So how we look at it as Tokunaga has not changed.
Even though NTT made the investment from the NTT perspective as the group overall, I think it was the optimized investment. It's been that way for both sides. What we'll be working moving forward is implementing AI and creating agents. If that is so, what's going to happen on the customer side is that the agent service is not going to be launching individually. There's a d Pay and d CARD included. At that time, the behavior of the customers, there's a professional financial group there, of course. But we are looking at the customer's behavior very closely as well. So looking from that perspective, designing the lifestyle of the customers, we both one side cannot be missing. We need both sides. They're very strong at the BaaS, business as a service. Team up with the center B and have the B2B2C. NTT had a B2B2X business.
But with the center part, partnering up, it is the ex-NTT Communications. So including that, both sides were able to acquire the missing piece for each other. So to accelerate this, this is not officially announced. But the professional finance group, our head is mentioning about that as well. We would like to create a structure where we can have a quick decision-making. So we would like to put our efforts so that we can respond to your expectations. Can let me confirm. From that side to the net bank, are you going to send in about 5 or 10 people as directors? Please, I'd like to refrain from answering details. Well, I think that you won't be able to run the business if you don't have people of yours in their organization. Including those factors, we will be looking at the organization structure. But we would like to listen to your feedback.
Thank you.
Next, Goldman Sachs, Tanaka-san, please unmute yourself and ask the question.
This is Tanaka from Goldman Sachs. I have two questions. First, is sales promotion cost the way you think about the cost? You were originally aggressive. You said you will be aggressive in the second half. And I think you did exactly that. Compared to three months ago, the way that you're thinking on sales promotion cost may have changed. How has it changed? And by spending more in the second half, any changes in the peers or the competitive landscape? So that's my first question, your view on the sales promotion expenses. Our thinking has not changed much. MNP market, how is it moving? How is the peers pricing? Are the key points? And are sales channels, strong and weak, channels existed?
So we supplemented that financially. So in the first half, we tried to compete. But from the second quarter onward, we're looking at the competitive landscape and trying to compete effectively. MNP, not trying to take excessively, but trying to maintain the positive and trying to control the channels. So no big change.
Thank you. So now that you're aggressive, any changes in the environment of the industry and competitive environment? As far as we've seen, the pricing has not changed much. Now it's the selling season. So we're watching closely. But we don't want to be the only one running fast. It's February. But we have not seen much change. That is my take. Thank you. Second question is network investment. So quality improvement, where are you seeing quality improvement in your network? When you procure your base station, NEC, the important supplier, is now withdrawing from the base station. I think you are mostly procuring from the oBaaSas players. So base station procurement strategy has no problems?
Thank you. Short answer is no problem. We are procuring globally competitive products at a right price, reasonable price. We are the latecomer trying to strengthen the network. So we are trying to utilize this position and procuring the base station at a competitive price. So 5G and Sub-6, I think we can complete this. 700 MHz band and the existing spectrum, how we change them, I think we'll see big progress in 2026. So we are now shifting gears and moving in the right direction. In February and March, we will have about half planned for this year and can maintain that in the first half of next year. We are having the right arrangement with the vendors. So I think we are now really changing.
Thank you. That is all from me.
Thank you very much. Morgan Stanley MUFG Securities, Mr. Tsusaka, please go ahead and please unmute.
This is Tsusaka from Morgan Stanley. I have two questions. The first question is, when are you going to turn around for an increase in revenue? This is quite a rough question. You have to turn around to a revenue increase situation. You're trying to undo the very complicated puzzle. We have to think about the very complicated puzzle and think what your performance is going to be. And probably, you won't be able to concentrate in the growth areas. The sound way is that you turn around to the revenue increase situation.
When is your service revenue going to increase and create a structure where it's not going to decline anymore? Is that going to be next fiscal year? Next fiscal year, you originally already said that it is not going to turn around. However, this part, as a structure of a P&L, this is not a situation that you can feel safe and secure yet. So I'd like to know about this part. And the second point is NTT Com, the organization, the role that you play towards NTT Group is to generate cash. And NTT Group can allocate that cash to the growth areas. However, the cash generation capability going down seems like affecting the overall group's cash situation. What do you think about that?
First of all, what you have said first, you are correct, meaning that we have to turn around to the growth trajectory. This time, looking at the consumer business ARPU, we are not disclosing the details. However, on a year-on-year basis, finally, of a positive. Towards second and third quarter, it is increasing. Looking at the content, Poikatsu ARPU is not the only one that is increasing. From there, even though we need to detect some things, it is still on the increase trend. For next fiscal year's guidance, we have the 3G spectrum suspension that there's an impact. It's difficult to provide the guidance. The d CARD PLATINUM right now is strongly performing. So there is the reduction for the d POINT reimbursement from the final revenue. So maybe that is strongly showing up more. At the actually pure base consumer ARPU, it is starting to turn around finally. We would like to use that as an engine, eximo included.
We would like to accumulate various services. For the comprehensive ARPU, the definition of the ARPU differs among the carriers. However, how much can we increase in this area is the key. We are seeing a steady growth here. The mobile communications as this revenue, we would like to stop the declining. That will be supported by the inclusive years. It's not just the decline in revenue and revenue and what are we going to do about that. We are finally able to come about from that situation. The second question of how we can generate the cash within NTT Group, yes, we consider that as one of our roles within the group. However, at the same time, it's our role as well to seek growth, especially in Japan domestically, the Smart Life business area and the Enterprise business area.
Because we have that growth, the presence in Japan NTT Group can maintain their presence. So, of course, we would like to strike the appropriate balance of that. And so the SSNB acquisition this time within the group, investing JPY 8 trillion, of course, in our area, we are told to look at that. And we need to grow as well. So we are going to put our efforts in generating cash. But at the same time, we will be investing in the growth area as well. We believe that is our role. And probably, you are asking that question, thinking of that. But I'm very serious about that. So thank you very much.
Thank you.
We will have the next one as the last question. Okasan Securities, Okumura-san, please unmute yourself and ask your question.
Thank you, Okumura from Okasan Securities. I have one question, just the way of your thinking. Mobile base price increase, what is your view at this moment? If SoftBank decides on the base price increase next year, what will be your management decision? I know you cannot say anything definitive. But if you could share with us your policy or your way of thinking.
Thank you. Our thinking is not definitive. But what we are watching the most is user base. NTT Group wants to maintain the largest user base. So we don't want a simple price increase. It may increase the numbers, but it may sacrifice the user base. We don't want that. We will watch the competitive landscape to maintain the user base. But it's not a competitive landscape where we can be the sole winner. The costs are rising. And competitors will follow us. So our ARPU is rising now.
So we're not thinking of a simple price increase at this moment. By the way, there were old tariff plans. So we want to sort them out. And we may need to make the decision to raise prices partially. So by taking these means, we will try to maximize our profit. Thank you. So I know one company hesitates to raise price. But it depends on how much price increase. But it may increase your profit by tens of billions of JPY. If others are raising and you don't, there may be other values. So you are balancing the two, not raising the price. Yes, I mentioned the integrated ARPU, total ARPU. It's not just mobile communication that we offer to our customers. So we will try to see what has the biggest growth potential.
But when other competitors raise their price and when we're aligned, we just stay with the same price and not maximize the price? No, we will not do that. We will not be stubborn and not raise the price if others do. No, I'm not trying to sound negative. Thank you.
Thank you.
Thank you very much. With this, we would like to conclude the financial results briefing session of FY 2026 third quarter. Following this, there will be an explanation from NTT DATA group. so please stay connected. Thank you very much for today.
We will now like to start the presentation of the third quarter FY 2025 third quarter financial results of NTT DATA. My name is Endo from the IR office. I will be serving as the moderator today. Regarding today's materials, please refer to the financial results briefing session materials posted on our company's IR website.
I would like to introduce the attendees today: Nakayama, Representative Director and Senior Executive Vice President; Nishimura, Director and Senior Vice President, Head of Corporate Planning General Headquarters; Kusakabe, Senior Vice President, Head of Finance Headquarters. Total of three will be attending. Today, we will start from the Q&A session. Those of you who have questions, please press the raise your hand button on the web conference system. Without further ado, we would like to take questions. First question, SMBC Nikko Securities, Kikuchi-san. Please unmute yourself and ask your question, please.
Kikuchi speaking. Thank you very much. I have two questions. First is, this fiscal year in Q2 July, data center shift to REIT, it was a bit off from the initial assumption. And so you revised. But since then, there has not been any revision. Are you trending as planned in Q4? How much profit are you expecting for the full year? Thank you.
Thank you. I will go one by one. Nakayama speaking. Thank you very much for the question. So this time, the performance forecast was revised. So about the gain on sale of data center was revised downward. Others are in line. No change from the initial forecast. Q3 financial results, if I could explain a little. In data center, the fee income was a bit large. There were some one-off positive factors. So including that, Q4 for other areas, it's not that we have much headroom. But especially on the oBaaSas side, we had a stretch target year-on-year. So there is a downside risk. But we want to somehow achieve the target for this year. So that is the key focus.
In Japan, in the public sector, in Q3 and year to date, we are negative year-on-year. We are trying to come close to the target as possible. And in other financial and enterprise, we will try to cover the shortfall. Thank you. That's all.
Thank you. I think this is a question by others too. Second question, I asked this question to the holdings too. In the new year, I'm sure you will discuss further. But in Q4, you may not be planning a capital recycling. But other than REIT, you may have some capital recycling in Q4. So what is your forecast? If not, and even not in Q4, what is your thinking on REIT and non-REIT capital recycling in the next fiscal year? What is your policy? Thank you. Capital recycling disposal. So gain on sales? So how much gain you can get and whether you will do it or not is also my question.
First, data center gain on sale. We have nothing planned for Q4. Next year, FY 2026, data center gain on sale. We have nothing fixed yet. As we've mentioned from the past, FY 2025 data center gain on sale was Singapore REIT IPO. So to form the REIT price, we had to have the liquidity. So we had quite a big sale for that. So the second and third offering are usually smaller than the IPO amount, a fraction of IPO amount in normal cases. When we launched this REIT, we considered the portion for IPO and for the follow-on. We've thought of so the ones that are mature and can have certain level of yield. And we also think of the regional balance.
Our plan for next year is not fixed. We understood by doing this IPO in FY 2025, depending on the market trend, we get impacted. The initial plan, it may be good or bad to mention the amount that we plan upfront. Our general thinking is not do IPO and put an end to it. We want to do some more deals to realize the cash flow early on and prepare for the next investment. If I mention the amount, the number, it will help the analysts, I know. That's not the nature of what we're trying to do. Once we have a clearer number, we will share it with you. Thank you. One clarification. Next fiscal years, data center investment, I will ask you again three months from now. But JPY 300 billion or JPY 400 billion.
And then you recycle and also finance debt. So asset and debt will increase more next year. So you cannot help but increase. Yes. Data center investment from FY 2023 to 2027, we say over JPY 1.5 trillion. So that's the general trend. And the data center demand, given the strong demand, we now do business with hyperscalers. But we get orders and try to address those orders. So data center sales and profit will become sizable in the medium term. Of course, the key is the balance with the leverage. And cannot mention the numbers, how much next year. But the general direction is no change from the past. So most likely, we will move forward like we've done in the past. Thank you very much.
Thank you very much for your question, Mr. Kikuchi. We'd like to take the next question from Goldman Sachs Securities. Mr. Tanaka, please unmute and ask your question.
This is Tanaka from Goldman Sachs. I wanted to ask the three questions, including confirmation of the numbers. The first is regarding the fee income of the data centers. The one-off factor, how much of a plus or negative impact did it have on the third quarter on a quantitative manner? Can you quote on that in a quantitative manner?
This is Kusakabe speaking. I would like to answer your question. The data centers, what it's sold as an asset and from where it's into joint venture, if it sells, we are going to receive the revenue. That's the one-off situation. But the third quarter is about JPY 5 billion. And I believe that in the first half, I believe, was about JPY 5 billion. So nine months total is about JPY 10 billion.
Okay. So the one-off factor is about JPY 5 billion. Is that the correct understanding? Limited only to the data center, yes. Because there are other factors. So may I mention that?
This time, the oBaaSas, well, North America, we were able to receive subsidy from the government. That was about JPY 3 billion. So that's about it for the large number factors.
Thank you. My second question, Japan domestic situation. Overall, I think it is steadily performing. However, for the public and social infrastructure, what is the background on the strength of new orders? And I think there is a reactionarily a decline this year. So when is that going to turn around? Is that what I would like to confirm with you?
This is Nishimura speaking. I'd like to answer your question. The reason why the new orders performance is as strong, the Digital Agency showing their policy, the facilities advancement to improve the convenience of the people and increase investment in this area. So CAGR, it's about an 8% growth market is what we expect. That is the factor behind this. And the other point is that what was the other question? The reactionary decline. Whether it's only this time only, toward the upcoming social infrastructure, there's quite a large-scale system development. And this continues for multiple years. So once in several years, there's such a timing that occurs. So whether it's just only this time, well, such a timing arises every several years. That's all.
So there's a decline, reactionary decline.
Well, it's not regular. It happens on an ad hoc basis.
But the impact of that for this fiscal year—is that going to continue onto next fiscal year?—is what I wanted to ask.
From next fiscal year onwards, whether it is that we will have a reaction decline. Last year, we had a very high margin project. Due to that, this year, as a reaction to that, it's declining. But this is not going to carry over to next fiscal year.
Thank you very much. Lastly, the oBaaSas business. The orders received environment, overall, what is the trend? It seems that there's quite a drop in North America. Is that just a difference depending on the quarter? But I wanted to confirm that situation. And recently, which is the hot topic, this is the disruption type of topic in the AI, especially in the oBaaSas market. It is considered to be an issue. Because you have a notable growth in the oBaaSas business, what is your take on this part? This is what I would like to confirm as the third point.
Regarding the oBaaSas new orders received, did you want to know by region?
Yes, roughly speaking.
North America, first of all, regarding this fiscal year, well, last fiscal year, we had a large-scale project. Even though such a project existed, this third quarter, regardless of that, we were able to receive orders regarding quite a large-scale project as well. So the growth we use this dedicated team for growth projects. They are going out there to receive the orders. Therefore, we are seeing that effect of that at an early stage. So North America, this quarter has turned around to an increase in revenue.
Those efforts actually were the factors for the turnaround for North America region. Europe, depending on the specific region in Europe, it differs or the country differs. The U.K., we brought in a growth office that we've done in North America. U.K., in the new orders received, we're seeing a positive impact from this establishment of this office. Germany, in terms of orders received, there are areas that they're struggling still. Starting from last October, the top management has been replaced. And in Germany as well, they are utilizing the Indian resources, which is well, it's like a North American model that they have applied. So the multinational corporations in Germany, they are proactively conducting their activities towards those companies. This fiscal year, the orders have not been fixed yet.
However, from this fourth quarter onwards, we can expect orders coming in or it is becoming firmer. So in that sense, moving forward, we will start to see improvements in the new orders received side. And EMEAL, up to now, they were steadily performing. And so they are progressing as usual. And lastly, APAC, Australia is not doing well quite a bit. So regarding Australia, regarding the orders received side, we have not seen a turnaround in the actual terms. However, Australia as well, reinforcement of the sales force is what we are doing. By industry, we are thoroughly responding to this situation. So the outcome of these efforts for Australia, we are having expectations towards that and waiting for it. And India within the APAC region are quite steadily performing. And the Indian economy itself within the APAC region, they have a high growth rate as well.
Therefore, in India, we're able to acquire quite a level of orders. The other remaining areas, APAC, the cloud and security, they are strongly performing due to the high demand of tech areas. The advanced team of the US is taking the lead. The know-how is utilized in the APAC. We are seeing the positive factor. So those are the positive materials for this area. So regarding AI disruption, what kind of a perspective do you have? So Nishimura would like to answer that question. Using AI and improving the efficiency, the cost reduction pressure probably is going to be becoming stronger is the outlook we have. Globally, when conducting the BPO business, the improvement of efficiency incorporated type of contract is starting to show up. So on the customer side, the AI efficiency improvement that they do internally, they're outsourcing it.
That is the situation. So specifically speaking, by the rise of AI disruption, we have expectations for the new business being deployed. So that part, we are positively receiving this. The negative part is looking at the other companies' financial results. With this rise, it's not that they are experiencing a decline in their revenue or sales. That is our understanding.
That is all. Thank you. Understood. Thank you very much.
Thank you, Tanaka-san. So next question. J.P. Morgan Securities, Henderson, please unmute yourself and ask your question.
Thank you very much, Henderson from J.P. Morgan. Can you hear me?
Yes.
Thank you. About the financial results, Q3 segment by segment, so there's a reactionary fall from last year in the public sector. But good impression on your business. OBaaSas profit margin may flip next year. You will continue your structural reform expenses, although lower than this year.
So Q3, worldwide profit margin, EBITDA margin may improve by 2-3 percentage points. It's improving by 2-3 percentage points. But in Q3, will you continue improving at that rate and next year and enter the 10% territory? Are there any changes internally? Thank you.
Nakayama speaking. Thank you for the question. First of all, for Q3, as Kusakabe-san said earlier, oBaaSas, there were some one-off positive factors. But at the underlying basis, by region, we're seeing an improvement. So you are right. Now, profit margin, will we have the same level of profit margin in Q4? Q4 volume is quite large. And there are some unique treatments we need in the end of the year. So our forecast is we don't know if the Q3 profit margin will remain unchanged in Q4. I cannot give you a clear-cut answer there.
On Page 12, profit margin trend is shown. This line graph is shown. But because we're showing this, we want to work hard to give you some positive results and numbers. That is our view on Q4. Thank you. My second question is on data center. There was a big order in Q3. Looking at the external environment, data center demand remains strong. Are there risks that you cannot execute your current orders like the utility or power shortage or construction capacity or the raw material cost increase? Any risks that may hinder the order execution? Or can we be optimistic? According to what you hear from the on-site, is that there are no risks, really, no such risks. As I mentioned earlier, large hyperscalers deals account for more than 80% of the new orders. These are made to order.
We do after we receive orders. The term is 10-15 years, very long. The customers have financial strength. So there is small risk that this gets canceled or deviated due to customers' situation. Now, the former NTT Communications, North America, Germany, and India, so that was the start, purchasing those companies in the region. Initially, the operation was independent by region. But now, we work with hyperscalers. So the raw material procurement and design are now unified and centralized globally. So raw material delivery is now optimized. And I try to exchange and interchange when necessary. So we don't have the risks that you just mentioned.
Thank you very much.
Thank you. We have high expectations in Q4 and next year.
Thank you very much, Mr. Henderson. The raise your hand button that they were received. The next question will be the last one of Nomura Securities. Mr. Masuno, please unmute and ask your question.
This is Masuno from Nomura. I have simply three questions. The first is on Page 13, the structural reform of the oBaaSas business from next fiscal year onwards. If you have about two years, this JPY 151 million will disappear in two years. The synergy is going to be JPY 30 billion. In total, about JPY 50 billion is going to contribute to the profit. If you have one or two years, there's about JPY 50 billion of contribution to the profit. Is that the correct understanding?
Nishimura would like to answer that question.
First of all, regarding the integration of the oBaaSas businesses, we have been working on it up to now as well. As you can see here on the chart, the upgrade of the business processes and optimization of business operation. Moving forward, we have the ERP integration. From next fiscal year onwards, what is the budget for it? We're still considering it. There's nothing that I can share with you that is clear. But to a certain extent, we will spend a certain extent of expense to business transformation by integration. The synergy, was it non-synergy? The categorization of that, because integration is progressing, it's difficult to say that. But if you look at the overall growth, we will grow more than the expense that is required. Whether it's around JPY 50 billion at this point, I cannot give you a clear answer.
Thank you. My second question is regarding the sales of the data center. Truly, I think it is a waste of actually selling a very crown jewel asset. So end of the last fiscal year, the non-current asset, the others is JPY 2.2 trillion. And the equity depreciation or amortization itself is JPY 1.2 trillion. So I think you should sell about JPY 50 billion and have the cash go into your company. And then you don't have to sell data centers. And that part to the holding company ask them to sell their treasury shares and create that cash.
This is Nakayama speaking. At the second quarter, I think, Mr. Masuno, you did give us a similar comment. So we are taking note on that. We have been taking note on that. So I do understand your opinion very well. Having said that, at the end, the EBITDA number, how much are we going to increase that?
How much investment are we going to make towards the data center? Well, the data center is quite a long-period project or business. So there's an immediate profit. But how it's going to be 5 years from now, 10 years from now, when we think about that, how are we going to think about the balance with the cash side or the factors that we need to consider and make the final decision? I do understand your opinion very well.
Thank you very much. Lastly, AI business , you're going to have your Top Gun team do this. But every day, there's a new announcement made from the US. So you can't spend that much of a long time. What I'd like to ask is that if you have about 12 months, will the first platform be completed? Is that the sense of speed that you are taking in? Because if you take too much time, what you created at the initial stage is going to become obsolete. So at what timing will the first phase of the first platform be completed?
This is Nishimura speaking. Thank you very much for your question. You are correct. Because the changes occur so fast, and how we can come about with something quickly is going to become the key. So next fiscal year, we would like to come out with a certain deliverable. And this company itself is not a large-scale company. It's about between 30-50 headcount-sized company. And there's sales specialists that are very well-BaaSd in the industry that exist in each country. So utilizing this talent, we would like to create a new business case. So by next fiscal year, we are working on so we can come out with a certain deliverable. So please look forward to that.
Okay. Thank you very much.
Thank you, Masuno-san. So we answered all the questions that were raised. So we would like to close NTT DATA's Q3 financial results briefing. Thank you very much for your attendance.