Good morning, everyone. We need to introduce ourselves first. This is Q2 results call for ORLEN Group in 2026. We gathered here together in a meeting room at Warsaw offices of the company, together with company CFO, Mr. Sławomir Jędrzejczyk . Damian Wieczorek, who is Head of Controlling. Jacek Matyjasik, Head of Finance. My name is Jakub Frejlich, I'm Head of Investor Relations. Together with Marcin Piechota and Konrad Włodarczyk from investor relations team. As usual, we'll hand over to Sławomir, who will go through the deck, then we'll hand over to yourselves for you to ask questions. As usual, please raise your hand, and for the sake of streamlining the discussion, please do not ask more than three questions at a time. We will have follow-ups after. Sławomir, the floor is yours. Thank you.
Thank you, Kuba. Good morning, ladies and gentlemen. It's a pleasure to welcome you to our second quarter results call. The second quarter remained characterized by volatile and uncertain market environment. Geopolitical developments continue to affect hydrocarbon markets, supply chain, and commodity pricing across our industry. Against that backdrop, I am pleased to confirm that ORLEN delivered another strong quarter of operational and financial performance. The key message from today's presentation is that our diversified business model once again demonstrated its resilience. Strong macro conditions, combined with disciplined operational execution and prudent financial management, enabled us to generate solid earnings, robust operating cash flow, and maintain one of the strongest balance sheet in the European energy sector. Let me begin with several key developments highlighted on slide number two. In upstream and supply, we continued to strengthen the group's resource base and security of supply.
We acquired an interest in the Goliath field and advanced the development of the Cerisa project in Norway. Together, these projects add approximately 70 million barrels of oil equivalent to our resource base and support our long-term objectives of maintaining stable production levels despite the natural decline of mature fields. We also continued to expand our LNG deliveries. During the first half of the year, we received 40 LNG cargos to Poland, including deliveries executed by vessels from our own fleet. Currently, we have eight of them. In downstream, we reached an important milestone in the new chemicals projects. The scope, timetable, and budget were finalized and agreed, allowing us to move forward with further implementation. We also achieved further progress in the acquisition process of Grupa Azoty Polyolefins. We secured the required antitrust approvals, and we are currently awaiting the final approval of the restructuring process by the court.
In energy, the most important achievement was the delivery of the first electricity from two strategic investments, Baltic Power and Grudziądz CCGT project. These milestones mark a significant step in the execution of our growth strategy and demonstrate our ability to deliver large-scale infrastructure projects. At the same time, we continued the development of our renewable energy portfolio and added approximately 300 MW of new renewable capacity in the first half of this year. In consumer end products, we further expanded the ORLEN VITAY ecosystem. That's our loyalty program, which now has more than 5.6 million active users, which is more than 10% increase as compared to last year. We also continued our fuel promotion program while maintaining growth in non-fuel retail and electromobility services across our markets. Let's now move to slide number three. Revenue for the quarter amounted to PLN 76.5 billion.
EBITDA reached PLN 13.9 billion, while operating cash flow totaled PLN 15.2 billion. These results were supported primarily by the favorable macroeconomic environment, particularly in refining and petrochemical, as well as by disciplined operational execution. CapEx amounted to PLN 9.3 billion and reflects the continued acceleration of our investment program. Net debt to EBITDA remained exceptionally low at 0.1x, underlining the strength of our balance sheet and our financial flexibility. As regards our operational indicators shown on slide four, the second quarter was heavily affected by plant maintenance shutdown, in Downstream segment. As a result, crude throughput and refining utilization were lower compared with the prior year. Nevertheless, we maintained strong sales volumes and continued to improve operational efficiency across the business. Hydrocarbon production increased to approximately 200,000 boepd , supported by strong performance in Norway and Canada.
Electricity generation, electricity distribution, and gas distribution also increased year-on-year, while the share of zero and low-emission generation assets in our installed capacity reached 65%. These results confirm continued progress to achieve our strategic objectives to increase zero and low-emission percentage. Let us now move to slide number five, on EBITDA by segment. Upstream and Supply delivered EBITDA of PLN 3.8 billion. The results benefited from higher oil and gas quotations, as well as increased production volumes. However, these positive factors were partially offset by lower margin in gas trading and higher logistic and storage-related costs. In Downstream, generated EBITDA of PLN 5.9 billion, representing the strongest contribution among our business segments. The result was driven primarily by favorable market conditions in refining and petrochemicals. Higher refining cracks, strong inventory effects, and improved trading performance more than offset the impact of maintenance shutdowns and lower throughput.
Petrochemicals returned to positive profitability, supported by stronger margins and hedging effects. We deliver in petchem PLN 0.5 billion, which is the highest number since many quarters. Energy delivered EBITDA of PLN 3.4 billion. High electricity sale, lower fuel costs, and increased distribution volumes all contributed positively to the results. Our distribution business continued to benefit from strong underlying demand. Consumer and Products generated EBITDA of PLN 1.5 billion. Although fuel margins in Poland remain under pressure due to our customer-focused pricing policy and promotional programs, that was, to a large extent, offset by higher sales volumes and strong contribution from international operations. Let's move to slide number six. Capital expenditure reached PLN 14.7 billion during the first half of the year, including PLN 9.3 billion in the second quarter. The majority of the expenditure continues to be directed to our growth projects, while maintenance spending remains under strict control.
We continue to focus on projects that strengthen LNG security, support the transition, and generate attractive long-term returns. At this stage, I can confirm that our full-year CapEx target is approximately PLN 36 billion. Turning to slide number seven. Operating cash flow amounted to PLN 15.2 billion in the quarter, and PLN 23.7 billion the first half of the year. This strong cash generation demonstrates both the quality of our assets and the resilience of our operating model. During the quarter, we funded our investment program, and we managed to pay a record dividend and continued to preserve a highly conservative balance sheet. One item on this slide should be explained. That's PLN 5.1 billion investment for Energa shares. As Energa shares were not registered by the end of June, that's why we included that as a shorter investment, so it's not included as a cash position.
In the beginning of July, the shares were registered, so this will be offset, and our net debt position will decrease by PLN 5.1 billion. On slide number eight, you can see that ORLEN's financial position remains exceptionally strong. Rating agencies confirmed investment grade with stable outlook, while net debt remained only at PLN 4.5 billion, and our net debt to EBITDA ratios stood at 0.1x . We continue to maintain diversified financing sources, an appropriate currency structure, and a long average debt maturity profile. Finally, let me conclude with slide number nine and our priorities for the second half of the year. Our focus remains unchanged, and it's concentrated around three areas. Firstly, operational, then growth and financial discipline. In operations, following completion of our maintenance shutdowns, our priority is maximizing asset utilization and capturing the benefits of the current macro environment.
From the growth perspective, we continue to execute our key projects, including Baltic Power, new chemicals, Grupa Azoty Polyolefins, and our LNG deliveries. From financing perspective, we remain focused on cash generation, disciplined capital allocation, and maintaining strong balance sheet, while securing attractive sources of funding for our investment program. In summary, despite the continued market uncertainty, ORLEN delivered another quarter of strong performance. Our diversified business model, disciplined approach to capital allocation, and robust financial position continue to support both growth and shareholder returns. That's all from my side for the beginning. Thank you for your attention, and we are now ready to take your questions.
Yes, we will. Now turning over to you. We will begin with Łukasz Prokopiuk from BOŚ. Please, the floor is yours.
Yes. Hello, can you hear me?
Yes.
I have two questions. Could you please try to quantify the EBITDA loss attributed to maintenance shutdowns in the second quarter in Downstream and Upstream? The second question, could you tell us anything about U.S. LNG hedging? How much is hedged? Are you happy with the hedging, considering the current prices? Any details would be very helpful. Thank you.
Thank you, Łukasz. As regards the first question, we don't calculate and we don't provide a kind of detailed EBITDA loss from our shutdowns. I can only add that in the third quarter, you should expect similar shutdowns level as in the second quarter. As you know, we have this large turnaround which happens every four years. Basically, distillation unit and hydrocracker and steam cracker and PVC mill and polyethylene in BOP stopped. That shutdown lasts till August. Third quarter will be to some extent affected as well from the production point of view. Just to continue maybe to just cover this topic in detail, in the fourth quarter, we plan to have some small shutdowns in Unipetrol, which is steam cracker and in Mažeikiai, which is reforming and is breaking. Some shutdowns still in progress.
However, they are not going to be as major as this turnaround. As regards TTF Henry Hub hedging, of course, we communicated that we have this policy that we hedge for the short term. Basically, majority, almost 100% is hedged, and across the years, it's going down to the level of 20% or 0%. The 2026 is fully hedged you may say. Of course, we take advantage of these great spreads. However, you know that our hedging policy is designed to reduce volatility rather than maximize short-term upside. That's why this effect for this year is limited. Next year, partially is hedged as well. That's all I can provide you at this stage.
Regarding the first question about the maintenance shutdowns, I expect the third quarter to be much stronger in refining throughputs in comparison to the second quarter. Is that true?
I would not say so. Of course, we don't provide the precise utilization of our refineries. Our big turnaround extended till August, we are going to conclude these shutdowns just in August. You may assume that the impact of this big turnaround is similar to the second quarter.
Okay. Thank you.
Thank you.
Thank you very much.
Thank you, Łukasz. We're turning over to Anna from UBS, please.
Thank you very much for taking my question. First, around the maintenance, but on the upstream side, you're flagging that there will be some shutdowns in third quarter. Can you please quantify the impact on the production of what will be the loss from that? Second is the follow-up to the LNG question, I would say. What is your outlook for the wholesale gas margin? What do you see for the developments in third quarter? Is it improving comparing to the second quarter, and your outlook overall for the rest of the year? Probably the final one regarding the energy business, the distribution network result was very strong. Can you quantify the impact of the reversal of provisions, please? Thank you.
Okay. Thank you so much. As regards upstream, that's a usual maintenance season for upstream, so our production in the third quarter will slightly drop. However, after the maintenance, the production increases, so the fourth quarter will be increased. I would not expect a very significant impact of this maintenance. As regards U.S. LNG situation, of course, as we all probably, we look at the long-term curves. Still this year it seems that it's supportive. Next year, we are around mid-30s, and 2028, we are below 30 as regards TTF, I mean, Europe for megawatts. That's our view as well, that we are following those curves. We are applying hedging policies accordingly. That's all I can say at this stage. As regards distribution networks, that's true that we generated very positive results, PLN 0.5 billion from distribution.
The reversal of the provision is up to PLN 0.4. That was provision set in the contract between EUROPOL GAZ and Gaz-System. EUROPOL GAZ is the owner of Yamal pipeline, and Gaz-System is the operator of this pipeline. Due to decrease, the tariffs basically will release that provision. From the volumes point of view, distribution network, you may say, improved the results by more than PLN 100 million for this lot.
Thank you very much.
Thank you.
Thank you, Anna. Tomasz, Erste, please. We can't hear you.
Yes. Hi. Tomasz Krukowski, Erste. Two questions. The first one is on upstream. Could you please once again walk us through the drivers of the profitability in the segment in the second quarter? What I'm struggling to understand it is why the earnings actually decline, why the macro was much better in the first quarter. The second question is on capital allocation. This year, definitely this is the year of windfall profitability for you. There's no windfall tax in the picture right now, so what are your plans when it comes to the extra earnings you generate? How are you going to deploy this capital? Do you think your shareholder remuneration could increase, or you may think about some M&As?
Okay, fair enough. Thank you so much. We have one segment which is upstream and supply, we should look one by one. From the pure upstream point of view, we delivered PLN 1.3 billion higher number than last year, and that's the impact of this macro environment, PLN 1.2. You may say even that majority of this is this better macro and the remaining part is more production. That was offset by supply, which was negative by PLN 1 billion. We have a supporting slide describing that. You may say that those businesses are correlated. That's why we always repeat that we build a resilient business model with a kind of natural hedges in flight. Once we deliver better results in upstream, our hedges work differently, and the gas quotations affect our margins in supply part.
That's why supply minus PLN 1 billion, upstream, pure upstream PLN 1.3, altogether PLN 300 million better results than last year. As you probably know, we have quite significant investment program in place. Majority of this program is set, our key focus is basically operational project management excellence to deliver those projects on time and within the budget, which was not the case in the past. However, we set those programs in a new timetable and a new stream. As we discussed this new chemical project, for example, which was not really agreed, finally, we have full visibility on the project. From capital allocation point of view, segment more or less, it's similar as last year, we don't change our view. If you look, that's true that we generate extra cash.
If you look into the cash flow I described during my speech, you can see that that's why we recommend that record high dividend of PLN 8 per share. Looking from the cash flow point of view, generally, our key focus is cash, then we allocate that cash for growth and for distribution to shareholders. Definitely, it's not the time to discuss any dividend payout for the next year. M&A, we always discuss that this is an option. We have very strong balance sheet, one of the strongest in European energy sectors. We have definitely the possibility for M&A. We discuss these M&A opportunities, we discuss mainly in upstream and subject to the project, the profitability of that project.
If I could follow up. Mr. Bajtek tweeted that you not being interested in Żabka is a wasted occasion. Do you share this view, or would it be in your interest?
Could you repeat this tweet?
Well, Mr. Bajtek tweeted that you, with PLN 50 billion net profit, could easily buy Żabka.
We are not interested in that transaction, and we are not progressing with that transaction.
Okay. Fair enough. Thank you.
Thank you.
We'll go to Ricardo from Morgan Stanley. Ricardo, please.
Hello. Good morning. Thanks for taking my question. If I may, couple of questions. The first one, on the LNG supply, if you look at assuming it's still going to take a while for a normalization in the Middle East and the low inventory levels in Europe, are you concerned whatsoever with the supply for the second half of this year and early 2027? Second question, I think yesterday we saw a few more headlines on windfall taxes in Poland. If you could comment on that as well. Thank you.
Thank you. Definitely one of the priorities, and that was in my summary part, is making sure we have delivery of hydrocarbons, both of oil and gas, and we have diversified sources of delivery, we feel quite comfortable. As you know, we had, or still we have a contract with Qatar, 2.7 billion cubic meters. However, only four deliveries were delivered in the first quarter, now we don't see any. We can easily get those energy deliveries from the spot transaction. We all know that our long-term contracts will be in place. The second contract, Venture Global, in the fourth quarter this year, 4.5 billion cubic meters. Sempra, additional contract from LNG, 1.3 billion cubic meters. We may say that end of 2027 and 2028, we will have full long-term contracts operational from the LNG market.
Around 80% of our LNG needs will be secured by long-term contracts. We are on a safe side here, I believe. Of course, we deliver gas, as you know, from North Sea, from long-term contracts with Equinor, so we have production of gas in Poland. Quite a diversified situation. As regards windfalls, I'm not in a position to comment. We will fulfill and follow all the regulations that are implemented in Poland. Definitely we generate cash, you may say extra cash, due to this macro environment. How the regulations will be finally set, let's wait.
Thank you very much.
Thank you.
Oleg Galbur, please, the floor is yours .
You hear me well. I have two questions. First one about the outlook. The Q2 benefited from a strong, supportive refining and petchem environment. Could you comment on how market conditions have evolved so far in Q3, and what are your overall expectations for the remainder of the year? Secondly, as a follow-up on your distribution policy. ORLEN has delivered very strong earnings and cash flow in the first half of the year while maintaining a conservative balance sheet. At the same time, yes, your focus is to keep delivering on your promises in terms of investment projects, but I hope there will be large deviations in investment budgets for those projects. Given this financial position and the record level of earnings that you generate, I was wondering what is management thinking about shareholder distribution going forward?
Specifically, would stronger than expected 2026 earnings increase the likelihood of another special dividend being considered next year? Thank you.
Thank you so much. Starting from the macro, of course, we can comment what was the situation so far. Definitely we have still better refining, and petrochemicals slightly lower. However, in refining, definitely better macro environment. It's so difficult to comment for anyone how the situation can develop. It's so volatile. I would say that the third quarter so far is very good from the macro point of view. Please bear in mind those shutdowns we discussed, how the situation develops in the long run, I'm not kind of ready to comment that. Definitely, we believe, at least in our plans, we should not include that great macro environment for long run for our company, so we expect, in the long run, stabilization to the kind of normalized situation. As regard distribution, I slightly kind of repeat what we always say.
Our key focus from the financial point of view is cash generation. This cash generation is distributed among future growth of the company and shareholder distribution. How management thinks, I believe we proved in the first half of the year where we proposed the record high dividend of PLN 8 per share. That's our view. What's the level of dividend is going to be for the 2026? As I said, it's definitely too early, and M&A is always an option. We have strong balance sheets, so there is a room for M&A as well, I believe. However, we are very cautious on that, so we will see if we find the right projects to invest. Final comment, of course, our growth projects are clearly defined in downstream segment especially, and energy segment as well.
The next two years, we have still two, three years, we have still very significant CapEx, similar and higher than these years. The range between PLN 30 and PLN 40 billion . We would like to be secured, and we would like to have strong balance sheets so that we have money flexibility for these growth projects and for any unpredictable situation which is on the market.
Understood. Thank you.
Thank you so much.
Thank you, Oleg. We'll hand over to Piotr from Citi.
Hi, yes, good morning, everybody. I wanted to ask you a couple of things. Firstly, you were meant to update your strategy, and I wonder if and when you will be ready to do so. The reason I ask this is that a year and a half ago, ORLEN was meant to spend a lot of money on CapEx and was guiding a much lower EBITDA. Now, the situation is that the overall CapEx spend, especially on M&A and renewables, is significantly smaller than the strategy, and the cash flow you generate is much higher. I just wanted to understand when you plan to give a market a new direction of where the company is, given all the changes. Second, I wanted to ask you about the details about the results. You generated a very high EBITDA, but there's a crude layers effect and the hedging effect.
I just wanted to understand what's the recurring number you think of as a normal number now. Shall we take it out or not? Because that's important. Thirdly, on the windfall profit tax, I understand there's a, let's call it a political blockage of implementing it, but I wonder on your upstream, historically, it comes down to a historical argument, but you don't pay a royalty like all other companies around the world on the domestic production. If the government was about to think how to collect a little bit more money from ORLEN, do you see any way that government could implement a royalty structure on domestically extracted gas and crude oil without impacting the production level? Could that be 20%-30%? How would you think about the risk like this? Thank you.
Thank you so much. As regards our strategy, generally, you're absolutely right that the key component of any strategy update is cash flow generation. We need to have more visibility on the long-term macro view. It's so difficult in those days to create a kind of view for the next five years, what kind of cash we can generate, what kind of investment program we can put in place so that we have still room for dividend, et cetera. That's why we are a little bit delaying this process. Definitely, we are in this process. You should not expect any significant kind of major changes from the kind of priorities in particular segments.
However, how much EBITDA and how much cash CapEx outflow we should include in this strategic update, let's wait a few more months once we believe that we are ready with the macro assumptions. As regards windfall, of course, looking from the upstream point of view, and upstream and supply, we should remember that we have Polish activities and foreign activities. For example, Norway and Canada contributes a significant part of this upstream profits. In Norway, as you know, we have 78% taxation. I don't think that Polish activity in upstream is so significant that it's going to be a kind of meaningful taxation, having in mind that our resources are matured, and it's a challenge to keep the production on the same level. Of course, subject to the discussion, but we need to look for any possible windfall on upstream from that perspective.
The third question, sorry.
Historical layers.
Historical layers. Sorry. We always say that if there is a fluctuation of pricing, like crude oil is 60, then 100, then at 60 again. Of course, there is fluctuations in this revaluation of inventory. I believe, depending on the future development of crude oil price, of course, you may see some fluctuations between quarters. However, if prices stabilize again, we will stabilize the situation. If you look into the first quarter and second quarter of this year, you will see some upsides and then downsides. We should look from the average point of view. I would not give you the number for the next quarters and the next years to kind of stabilize the EBITDA position, because as we're coming back to the first question, basically the macro is crucial here.
Sure. Can I have a last follow-up? Can you comment on selling ORLEN Paczka? There were some articles about you potentially selling it. Where are you in this process?
I can confirm that Paczka is not our strategic assets. If there is any opportunity to sell for the decent price, we are ready to do it. Far, we focus on improving the results of ORLEN Paczka. ORLEN Paczka grows quite well and improving the results. It's delivering the number of parcels and then EBITDA contributions. That's all I can comment.
Okay. Thank you very much.
Thank you.
Thank you. Hand over to Michał from Trigon, please.
Hi, do you hear me?
Yeah.
Okay. I have two questions. The first one, could you please comment on crude oil flows from Saudi Arabia? Have you seen lower volumes from the Yanbu port in the recent weeks due to Houthi attacks in the Red Sea? What is the current share of Saudi crude in the refinery throughput, and what is ORLEN current average crude differential, when we look at entire crude slate? This is the first question. The second question, are you considering a potential divestment of ANWIL? Would such a move be consistent with your strategy? Is it your strategic asset in the longer term? Thank you.
Thank you so much. We don't see any problems as regards delivery of the crude from Saudi. Nominations are as in the contract, we are keeping around 40% of our crude delivery from Saudi. The average differential, for this third quarter, we should assume around mid one digit. It's lower than it used to be in the second quarter. So far so good, and let's believe the situation will continue like that. As regards ANWIL, we don't progress with any projects, so far, ANWIL stays and is our strategic asset, especially PVC, which is low A kind of combined with our ethylene unit. That's definitely strategic part from our side. That's all I can say. ANWIL is a strategic asset and it is within our group.
Thank you very much.
Thank you.
Thank you very much, Michał. Now we hand over to Pekao S.A., Krzysztof, please.
Hello, everyone. Can you hear me well?
Yes, go ahead.
I have two of the technical questions. Both about CapEx. The first one is could you please reconcile the figure that you have shown in the second quarter in your presentation? It was PLN 9.3 billion, yeah, about CapEx. In your financial statements, in the acquisition of fixed assets was PLN 6 billion or PLN 7 billion, and then there was this item, from Energa, paid in shares. Would you please explain the difference between those PLN 12 billion and PLN 9 billion in your presentation?
Sorry, I need to double-check what figures you are talking about. Definitely, there is a difference of this PLN 5 billion in the financial statements. We included that in the cash flow from investment activities, which is going to be reversed. There are some differences always because there is a CapEx, which is a kind of booked CapEx, and cash flow is different due to liabilities balance. Let me double-check if you allow us and we will come back to you.
Could you direct us with the 12 number, what you're referring to? Because that's where we are struggling. You mentioned PLN 12 billion to reconcile with PLN 9 billion.
Yeah. I mean, PLN 12 billion is in your financial statement, in your books. PLN 7 billion in fixed asset investments and, PLN 5 billion for that operation regarding Energa.
Let's double-check. If you can give us the precise note you are referring to in the financial statements, we'll double-check and come back to you. Thank you.
Okay. The second question, also about CapEx, does that PLN 36 billion figure include that operation regarding Energa and the acquisition of PDH from Grupa Azoty?
No, this PLN 36 billion was created at the end of last year and, in polyolefins, Grupa Azoty Polyolefins is a kind of on top of that.
Okay. Thank you.
We will see because, of course, PLN 36 is our target. We will see how much we will deliver from the kind of normal CapEx we agreed at the end of last year, and if there is any room here to optimize, then it may happen that this gap will be finally within this range we are saying.
Okay, fair enough. Thank you.
Yeah.
I'll see we have a full round done. We have a follow-up from Oleg, please.
Yes. Thank you. I would like to ask for your view on hedging of fuel cracks, because you're doing it for gas, you're doing it for crude oil, but now with the rather high level of fuel crack spreads, would it make sense for you to hedge at least part of your production? Are you considering it? Are you doing it? If not, why? Just to share your view on this issue. Thank you.
Yes, definitely. We started to do it. Of course, we are selling crude, we are buying products, and basically, we spread, we have 20% currently hedged. We have a special note on that, and you can see that in the financial statements. We provide each quarter in the special notes, we have all our hedged open position. We are doing this.
Thank you.
Yeah.
Thank you so much. All right. Dawid, please. We can't hear you, Dawid.
Good morning. Can you hear me now?
Yeah. It's fine. Thanks.
Okay. You used to provide such information about premium or discount you pay over brands. I haven't noticed it in your current statement or in your current presentation. More or less, I understand the reason why you decided not to publish any more benchmarks, could you tell us something more what happened in this second quarter in terms of premium that you had to pay for crudes? As Michał asked, probably they are much lower right now, but can you quantify it somehow? How can we look at this issue?
Thank you so much. Of course, in our presentation, there is a supporting slide. It's slide number I just opened that. It's slide number, I believe, 716. We provide this CEE refining margin indicator. It's 14.5 as compared to 10.1 last year, $4.4 per barrel increase. We decided to change our view and present you the CEE refining margin indicator because of this volatile market environment. As we all remember, the differential used to be ±$1, ±$2. Currently, it's very significant. In May, it's very significant. That's why the CEE refining margin indicator includes almost everything, meaning both refining margins and then differential frac costs and hedging, et cetera. That's why we have, in this number, 14.45, around $10 is basically differential.
For the third quarter, I said that this is a kind of single-digit mid-range, we may assume around 5 so far. It's lower than the second quarter.
All right, Dawid. Thank you very much. We'll come back to Łukasz from BOŚ. Please.
Yes. Hello. Thank you for the follow-up. Would it be a problem if you split this CEE refining margin into the refining margin, into freight costs, and differential?
Of course, officially, we decided to have a kind of standard policy, and we will follow that policy. Of course, as during that call, if there is any question to follow up and if there is a necessity to deliver you that number, of course, we are ready.
Okay. One final question. About the HOG unit in Płock, what is happening with it? Is it online? Is it planned to be online? Could you give us an update on it?
HOG unit in Płock? It's operational, yes. It's okay.
When did it start operation?
Last year. Yes. I'm a little bit surprised of your question because everything is fine so far. We are doing this. We have small shutdown in the third quarter, but I didn't discuss that there is distillation unit and heavy residue unit, but this is a maintenance shutdown, but it's operating normally.
It's operating. Okay.
Oh, yeah.
That's all from my side. Thank you.
Okay. Thank you so much.
We do have an answer for the question regarding CapEx, however, it is a very detailed one, so it needs to run through the numbers, so we will not discuss it, I guess, because it is 20 lines to discuss.
Okay.
We will share it with Krzysztof offline, and anybody else who directly asks. For the time being, it seems that we had quite a substantial discussion, which we are very grateful to you. Thanks for your questions. Thank you for your attention for this morning call pre-trading. We will be concluding for today. Thank you very much once again. Thank you to all gathered here and to all who contributed to these financial statements on our end. We will see you on the road, if not before. Thank you very much.
Thank you very much. Have a nice time. Yes, thank you.