Great. Hi, everyone. Thanks for joining. I'm Lilly Lozada. I'm part of the MedTech team here at JPMorgan. Very happy to have the Envista Management Team with us here today. I'll pass it over to CEO Paul Keel for a presentation, and then we'll do some Q&A.
Okay. Thanks, Lilly. You know who I am because Lilly just told you. Sharing the stage with me is our CFO, Eric Hammes. Quick reminder that the presentation will be on our website later. You can find it in the Investor Relations section. It contains some forward-looking statements and some non-GAAP measures. Let's see. In terms of today's agenda, we'll cover four points. Many of you will be familiar with dental, so you'll know that it has a number of structurally attractive growth drivers related to it. Those of you who do follow our industry know that Envista has been a leader in it for better than 100 years now. But there are some new faces in the audience, so I'll start with a quick primer on the market and our company. We'll then get into the meat of the presentation.
In Q1 of last year, we had a capital markets event. We laid out a new value creation plan for Envista. So I'll recap that plan for all of you, and then we'll give you an update on how progress is going. As a preview of all that, the plan centers on three priority areas: growth, operations, and people. With respect to growth, year- to- date through Q3 of 2025, which is our last reported quarter, the company was growing organically 5%. And we had all of our major businesses reporting two consecutive quarters of positive growth. Our operations priorities center around the Envista Business System. That's our continuous improvement methodology. We focus on a number of operational priorities around safety, quality, customer service. Also, keep a keen eye on productivity and capital efficiency. With respect to people, Eric and I joined the company in the summer of 2024.
Our people priorities focus on talent development, employee engagement, and building strong collaborative teams. All of this work has contributed to early but encouraging financial performance. In addition to the 5% organic growth that I mentioned through the first three quarters, we have strong double-digit growth in EBITDA and in EPS. Okay. With the agenda out of the way, let's talk a bit about the market. As I mentioned, dental is structurally attractive across the full landscape, from patients to clinicians to suppliers. It's about $400 billion in annual spend, making it one of the bigger healthcare categories. I'm going to highlight three things from this page. The first is that, curiously, in dental, over time, demand is not the primary limiter of long-term market growth. Dental demand is everywhere. Of course, every person on the planet is a potential patient and customer.
To bring that into maybe a little more focus, as you can tell from the left side of the page, roughly two-thirds of the people on the planet suffer from some form of malocclusion or misaligned teeth. And to further illustrate the point, for all of us in the room, on average, one of us will lose at least one tooth by the time we reach the age of 60, and an unlucky 20% of us will lose all our teeth. So you add to that other drivers like aging populations, ever-increasing demand for aesthetics, rising middle class, et cetera, and you can understand why dental tends to be a very consistent grower over time. Now, I mentioned that demand wasn't the primary long-term constraint. Supply is. It's the number of licensed clinicians or registered products in any given market available to treat the various forms of patient needs.
That brings me on to our second point. Like other MedTech categories, the manufacturing community works with the clinicians to increase available supply. You can do that through product innovation or digitization, allowing clinicians to treat more patients with their available chair time. You can also do it through supplier-led education programs, teaching new procedures to clinicians. For example, today, maybe a quarter of all orthodontic cases are treated by general dentists. That's up from less than 5% 20 years ago. And about a third of all general dentists today now place at least one dental implant. That's up from a little under 10% also 20 years ago.
Third point to note on this slide is that, unlike some other categories in healthcare, where there'll be structural pressures to various parts of the value chain, think hospital systems on the medical side, in dental, all of the participants have the opportunity for pretty good economics. Dentists, as a group, do pretty well. Specialists do even better. The well-run multi-site operators, the DSOs, all do pretty well. Dental manufacturers, as a group, do pretty well. And in the one-third or so of the industry that goes through distribution, relative to medical distributors, the dental distributors also do pretty well. All of this underpins that stable, long-term, kind of prosperous nature of the category. For those of you who are newer to our story, Envista is a global leader in dental. We report through two segments. Specialty products and technologies represent about 2/3 of our revenue.
Our equipment and consumables business is the remaining third. We have earned a top-three position in every major category in which we compete. Some of our brands, like Nobel, Ormco, or Kerr, have nearly 100% awareness in their respective clinical segments. We operate in over 130 countries. Roughly half our sales come from the U.S., which is the world's largest dental market, and the balance is pretty equally spread across Europe and developing markets. New products have long been central to Envista's growth strategy. We've now served dentists for more than 130 years, and we have more than 1,500 patents to our name. Many of the more interesting inventions across all of dentistry, Envista has had a hand in. We invented the endodontic file. We invented dental implants. We invented panoramic X-rays, self-ligating brackets, and custom orthodontics.
Now, while all of dental is a pretty good industry to participate in, there are some parts that are more attractive, and we try to focus on those. We've been in and out of different parts of dental over the years, and we like the four that you see on the left side of the slide for a couple of reasons. The first is that there is a continuum of care that exists across dental. Nearly every dental procedure has the same three steps. There's an upfront diagnostic step where the anatomy is captured and the care is designed. There's a treatment planning step in the middle where you design the case. And then there's a therapeutic step at the end where you actually treat the patient.
Now, it's difficult to serve customers across that full continuum of care, but for the small handful of suppliers who can do it, there are certain clinical, financial, and operational benefits that accrue. So we are one of just a small handful of folks who do this on a global scale. A second thing we like about specialty categories, in particular, is that they're typically sold directly to clinicians, meaning there isn't a distribution layer in between. And so the margins and growth rate for specialty categories tend to be a bit better. And we participate in consumables and diagnostics because, while they do go through distribution in most cases, they're also products consumed by nearly all clinicians around the world. So if you want to serve that full continuum of care, you have to be in consumables and diagnostics.
And we're leaders in both, and we think we generate competitive advantage because of that full portfolio. Okay. Last slide here on the market. You can pick pretty much any five, 10, 15-year period that you like. You'll get the same CAGR for the global dental market. It's about 3%-5%. You'll notice a couple of things from the chart on the left. This is U.S. data. So dental spend is in orange, and GDP is in blue. The first thing you'll note is that the orange line is above the blue line every year pre-COVID. Dental always outgrows the broader market. That's true in times of economic softness. The last three recessions are noted in gray. That's because about two-thirds of all dental is covered by insurance. So even in soft periods, dental still does relatively well.
And about a third of the market has some consumer influence to it or is a discretionary purchase. And so in expansionary economic periods, it also tends to outgrow. Think clear aligners as an example of that. Now, as we all know, you see a big disruption in the right third of the chart. That's COVID. The market had the largest ever one-year contraction in 2020, followed by the largest one-year expansion in 2021. And then, in retrospect, a very predictable couple of years of below-trend growth while the market worked through that distribution. You'll note that while there's a pretty big gap between the orange and the blue line pre-COVID, for the first couple of years post-COVID, they're almost on top of each other. That's when dental and GDP grew about at the same rate.
Only recently now are the two lines beginning to diverge again, with dental moving back out in front. Most people who follow the industry believe that dental will return to that decades-long, consistent 3%-5% growth. Nothing has structurally changed in dental in the two or three years post-COVID. There's quite a bit of debate on when the timing of that inflection will happen, with all of the macro volatility remaining high. I don't pretend to know when that'll happen myself, but I can point to a couple of green shoots that give leading indicators. Patient demand now has stabilized, and clinics are once again opening new sites. Low unemployment and lowering interest rates are both supportive of dental market growth. We saw a sharp increase in private equity interest in dental in the last two years.
The last quarter of available market data had U.S. clinic revenues increasing mid-single digits in Q3. Nearly all the public players also reported positive growth in Q3, and you put all that together, and we think there's good reason to believe that the building momentum in dental here will continue in 2026. Okay. Having covered the market and our position in it, let me say a little bit about our value creation plan. This is a slide we showed in Q1 of last year at that capital markets event that I mentioned. As you can see, the plan is grounded in four components. It's guided by our purpose. It's centered on our values. We focus on those three priorities I mentioned: growth, operations, and people.
And then it's framed by our medium-term financial objectives: 2%-4% organic revenue growth over time, or what we call core growth, converting to 4%-7% EBITDA growth, and 7%-10% EPS growth. And all that is underpinned by 100% or better free cash flow conversion. Now, we're only going to have time today to go through the right side of the slide. So let me just say a bit more about our priorities here on the next slide. As mentioned, we're focused on the three areas you see here on the chart. With respect to growth, in blue, laser-focused on customers. We leverage our global reach to serve individual clinicians around the world. And then we also take advantage of that full portfolio to serve multi-site operators, like a DSO or a university, a hospital, or a government network.
Very focused on commercial execution, in particular for our two largest businesses, implants and orthodontics. And we keep innovation and portfolio highly visible and well-resourced. With respect to operations, our attention and resources are centered on manufacturing and service excellence and capital efficiency. With respect to the former, we're committed to maintaining our industry-leading levels for safety, quality, and customer service. And with respect to capital efficiency, that's a pretty capital or cash-generative business. CapEx in our business runs a bit under 3% of sales, and working capital turns typically run above five. Very proud of our people. They make all of this progress possible. We pay particular attention to talent development in order to drive employee engagement and high-performing teams. As you can see from the chart, all of these priorities are enabled through our Envista Business System, and everything we do is underpinned by our CIRCLES values. Okay.
That's the plan. Let me say a little bit about how we're doing implementing it. Beginning again with growth at the top, I already mentioned the 5% organic growth through the first three quarters of last year. All of that was propelled by double-digit increases in both R&D and sales and marketing investment to ensure that the good momentum continues and accelerates further in 2026 and beyond. All of our businesses, of course, benefit from that investment, but our implants business, in particular, has after contracting in 2023 and the first half of 2024, it's now had four straight quarters of positive growth. Spark is the name we use for our clear aligner business. It has delivered many consecutive quarters of positive growth and market share gains. It's now, at a scale, it's about a $300 million business, that it also has turned profitable.
A lot of that profitability expansion has been driven by the use of AI and automation in our manufacturing. It's a material contributor now to earnings growth in Envista. It was a consumer of cash for the previous five years, now turning profitable. It should be a material at the enterprise level. As I mentioned, we invest aggressively in R&D, starting to see good returns on that. We had major product launches in each of our key businesses last year. With respect to operations, we reduced G&A spending by 12% in the first quarters of last year. We fully offset all tariff impacts through our price actions and through supply chain agility. As I mentioned, it's a highly cash-generative business. It generates more cash than it consumes. So our board gave us authorization for a $250 million share purchase program that we started at the beginning of last year.
We deployed just over half that amount in the first three quarters of last year, and we're making good progress on reducing our effective tax rate. In terms of people, we saw an uptick in employee engagement in 2025. We saw it against all major employee groups: the management ranks, the salaried group, and the production employees. With respect to talent development, we renewed our focus on promoting from within. Last year, a little better than half of the management promotions were given to existing colleagues. That's up from just under 10% the year prior. In addition to taking care of our customers, colleagues, and shareholders, we stepped up our investment in communities last year. We have a charitable arm called the Envista Smile Project, touched 19,000 underserved patients, and donated a little over $2 million last year. That's a big part of what we try to do.
Now, as you would hope to find, the impact of all this activity is also showing up in the financials. In addition to the 5% year-to-date growth, you can see there's four straight quarters of generally accelerating growth. Below that, you have EPS, strong double-digit growth in EPS, not shown as EBITDA, but also double-digit growth on the EBITDA line. These are the same four medium-term financial objectives that I showed on the value creation plan. Beneath each, you can see our year-to-date Q3 performance against it, the 5% core growth a bit above our 2%-4% target range, the strong double-digit performance in both EBITDA and EPS that I just mentioned, and then cash flow conversion right on plan at about 100%. Still early days, of course, but we're encouraged by our early progress. We'll announce full year 2025 results on our earnings call on February 5th.
So we hope you guys will tune in for that. By way of wrap-up, I'll quickly just touch on the same main themes that I've already shared. First, Envista is a leader in the structurally attractive global dental market. Second, after a couple of years of below-trend growth, we think the dental market shows signs of returning to that long-term consistent 3%-5% rate that I illustrated. We're making good progress against the value creation plan that we communicated at our capital markets day at the beginning of last year. And our early financial performance in executing that plan is encouraging. With that, I will thank you for your kind attention and ask Lilly to take us through the Q&A. Thanks, everyone.
Maybe we can start with a state of the union on the dental market.
I think the way that you've been characterizing it the past few quarters is soft but stable. So is that still a fair way to characterize the market and any color on what you saw entering 2025?
Yeah, I think that's still the right way to think about the market. Maybe I'd be a touch more optimistic than we were on our Q3 call for the reasons that I mentioned. If we spin through our portfolio, as I mentioned, we've had now two straight quarters of growth across all four of the businesses. We tend to have pretty good positions in these categories. So if we're growing consistently, chances are the market is improving as well. So we see signs of momentum building.
Interestingly, this time last year at this conference, most people thought 2025 was the year that dental was going to return to that 3%-5% rate. Many of the same trends we're observing now were evident. All of the publicly traded players had a good Q1. We were kind of off to the races. Then we had Liberation Day and the disruption from that. But it seems the market has kind of digested that, and we're back on that improving kind of trajectory, catching some traction.
Maybe we could dig a little bit deeper into capital. This is where you've been most impacted.
But do you think this is a segment where we could start to see things pick up even before we see a broader change in consumer sentiment, just given the fact that some of these products do need to be replaced eventually and have lowering interest rates had an impact at all on purchases?
Yeah. So let me answer it by category, but also by geography. So true, in the U.S., consumer confidence is low. But in other parts of the world, other than China, consumer confidence is actually pretty good. Europe, Japan, Southeast Asia in particular, consumer confidence is at a good level. And that seems to be helping the global dental market. Now, specifically to the categories that we mentioned, you asked about interest rates. Interest rates impact dental in three ways. It impacts multi-site operators. Typically, that's how they finance the expansion for a DSO.
It impacts an individual clinician in terms of equipment purchases. A CBCT, call it $50,000-$60,000, that typically gets financed, and then for those elective categories that I mentioned, like clear aligners, usually there'll be consumer finance that plays in, so yes, as rates continue to come down, it's supportive across all three categories, and diagnostics, the equipment category, has been kind of the hardest hit over the past couple of years. That category declined for three straight years, and now, in the second half of last year, the last available category data showed that diagnostics was returning to growth, so another green shoot that maybe the market here is recovering.
Aside from interest rates, any other leading indicators we should be keeping an eye on that could point to a broader turnaround?
Yeah.
I mean, aside from GDP, of course, which all categories look at, there's two other macro indicators people follow for dental. They look at unemployment rates, look at interest rates, and look at consumer confidence. We talked about consumer confidence and interest rates, and of course, unemployment levels. Although there's a lot of noise in the system, they're still at historically low rates. So all that is good news for dental.
Maybe we can shift gears a little bit and talk about Spark. Revenue recognition changes the last few years made it a bit tricky to get a pulse on what underlying trends look like. So revenue aside, can you talk a little bit about what you've been seeing on a volume basis for Spark through 2025 and how we should be thinking about this business this year?
This guy perks up if you say revenue recognition.
Kind of let him answer that one. Yeah, so let me hit the aligner, the underlying primary case growth piece first, and then maybe just to settle everybody up on the impact of revenue recognition, which is material and important. So if you just strip everything away and look at primary case growth, that's our best underlying indicator of how we're performing and, of course, how the market's performing. We have gained share for the last many, many years, probably since the inception of Spark. We've gained share, as far as we can tell, for every quarter since the inception of Spark, and our underlying primary case start growth is around mid-single digits to high single digits. That's also how we see the business going forward.
Back this year, so if you just listen back to a few of our last earnings calls, we've had a really, really good flow of new product introductions. We could name many of them here today. That's part of the yield from us putting some of the benefits we're getting in areas like G&A into R&D and helping to launch a good pipeline of new products. And again, mid-single digit, high single digit growth is how we see our Spark primary business going forward. That's sort of different from what we report on a revenue basis. If we just talk revenue recognition and deferred revenue, we made a significant change back in Q2 of 2024. That was basically to defer a higher amount of our initial upfront revenue for our Spark business. It cost us about $45 million in revenue in 2024. We've unwound about two-thirds of that in 2025.
That leaves a small amount still to come in 2026. And that's why we're also seeing a little bit more robust growth as we see on a reported basis here today.
And when do you think we can have that last $15 million behind us and have revenues track more closely to the start?
Yeah. So first two quarters of 2026. So we're getting down to the maybe not immaterial, but let's say smaller level of materiality by the time we're through Q2 of 2026. You won't likely hear us talking about it and putting it in all of our quarterly bridges.
Spark reaching profitability was a big milestone for you. How do we think about the trajectory of further profitability expansion from here, and what are the levers that continue to drive Spark profitability?
Yeah.
We've communicated that we expect Spark to continue to expand margins until it reaches about fleet average for Envista, which for this year we've guided to, or for 2025, we guided to around 14%. The primary driver of margin expansion for Spark has been factory automation. We have factories in three different parts of the world, and we have a pilot plant near our headquarters in Southern California where we design all the lines and step by step, in a very organized fashion, identify the next step in the process that would benefit the most from AI or automation. We implement it in one of the lines in our Mexico facility, migrate it across the plant, go to the Czech Republic, go to China. That very consistent quarter-over-quarter reduction in our unit cost has been driven in a very predictable fashion. We expect that to continue.
How would you characterize the state of your implants business today? We've seen some nice traction in recent quarters as you've put more focus and investment on this segment. So how satisfied are you with what the implant business looks like today, and do you think there's any other gaps or room for improvement in this portfolio?
Yeah. I mean, I guess I'd say we're pleased with our progress, but far from satisfied. After I think it was six quarters of contraction, job one was to get it back to positive growth. We now have four quarters of positive growth and are basically growing at the market. Now, in that period of contraction, we donated a lot of share to Straumann. And so next job here is to grow a little bit quicker than the market, or at least quicker than our peers, and claw back some of that share.
Our focus on doing that basically sits in three buckets. First was around commercial execution. We put about $25 million into our implants business in 2024. About half of that went into sales coverage, marketing programs. About a quarter of it went into upping our customer education, and about a quarter of it went into new products. We saw an immediate benefit on the commercial execution side. We're starting to see traction from the customer education. And then we have a number of launches lined up for 2026 that we're hopeful will make an impact.
And when we're talking specific products, I feel like implants and Spark get a lot of the attention. But is there anything else that you'd call out as a key driver for 2026 or anything that you think is underappreciated in the portfolio?
Yeah.
The tallest man in the room, the tallest man in our company here is in the second row. He runs our diagnostics business. So I'll take this opportunity to applaud Robert and his team. They had a full relaunch, next generation of their industry-leading CBCT platform at the end of 2024. That's called OP 3D, getting great traction in the market. And then not to be outdone, they launched a new version of their intraoral scanner called DEXIS Imprevo in Q4 of last year. That has a different architecture for how it processes images. It's about a 4x increment in speed of capture. And that's off to a really good start. So I would point to that. And then I would also say our consumable business is pretty active. They have an infection prevention business that launched a hydrogen peroxide-based antimicrobial last year. And that's growing very, very quickly.
So as I mentioned in our prepared comments, we had big launches across all of the major businesses.
There's been some chatter around further rounds of VBP in 2026. So can you share the latest on if and when this is coming and how impactful this can be relative to past rounds?
Yeah. I think most people will be familiar with VBP. Value-based pricing, it's the healthcare reform in China. It's gone through many, many healthcare categories over the past couple of years. It started in dental two years ago with implants. And so it has two pricing steps to it. The first is the Chinese government lowers the price that the government hospitals can charge a patient for that procedure with the idea of expanding care in China.
In the case of implants, they lowered the procedure price to patients by about 50%, which led to a doubling of the number of patients in China who demanded or wanted a dental implant. The second step in the process then is they let suppliers bid on that increased volume, and for the large market share players like ourselves, that's a big opportunity to grow your unit volume meaningfully. We basically doubled the number of units we sold in China as a result of that. The government now is talking about the second category for VBP, which would be orthodontics. They had originally communicated that that would take place last year, and it has gone through a series of delays.
The current communication is that it's likely to occur in the first half of this year and that they'll then do a second pricing round on implants, a smaller, not as dramatic reduction in implant pricing. That is expected to happen later in 2026. That's the latest on VBP.
I guess outside of VBP, price has been a nice tailwind for Envista in 2025, which is sort of in contrast to other parts of MedTech where we've seen those pricing tailwinds start to moderate a bit. So what's your thinking on price as a contributor to growth in 2026? And is there more room for price taking given the still soft end market dynamics?
Yeah. And the data we showed in our prepared remarks, you saw that dental always outgrew GDP. A portion of that is that dental historically has always been a pretty price-accepting category.
Clinicians, on average, would raise procedure price about 3%, reimbursing from insurance. Always had been around 3%. And then the suppliers would come under that ceiling. One, one and a half points of price would be typical for many years in dental. That changed in that period post-COVID where the market had below-trend growth. Clinicians were more reluctant to raise price. Suppliers were more reluctant, so when Eric and I joined a year and a half ago, we started to rebuild that muscle for capturing price in Envista, all the blocking and tackling you'd expect to do that. Put price on the P&L, put price in people's objectives, make sure your ERPs are configured to calculate price, et cetera, et cetera. And we started to get price at the beginning of last year. Then with tariff activity picking up, we took another round of price increase in the middle of the year.
As far as we can tell, most of our peers have done the same. So right now, pricing is a tailwind for most of dental. The last numbers I saw in procedure price increases is that they've now returned to that same sort of 3%-4% increase. So we'll see. I wouldn't expect 2026 to be as supportive to price as 2025 unless the tariff activity heats up again. But I think it will be above that lower pricing level that we saw in that kind of 2023-2024 period.
Maybe elsewhere in the P&L, R&D expense has increased pretty meaningfully the last few years. So where have those dollars been going in the portfolio? And how should we be thinking about R&D spend moving forward, either on a growth rate basis or percentage of sales?
Yeah.
I mean, this is a kind of a classic MedTech business, high gross margin business. And if you can accelerate the growth, you can't spend the extra gross margin dollars that get thrown off. For us, across our careers, the two mechanisms to best accelerate growth in MedTech businesses are R&D and customer education. So we've had double-digit increases in both of those. And we think that's probably the single biggest contributor to the accelerating growth that we showed on that chart. We'll continue to do that moving forward. It's that kind of self-driving cycle that everybody wants. You get the growth, you get the extra gross margin dollars, you make the more investment, you have leftover dollars for returning to shareholders, doing more investment, et cetera, et cetera. And that's kind of the momentum you want to get. We're early into that.
But as you saw from the slides, there's some evidence that it's working.
Last year, you announced a restructuring program focused on cost savings. So can you tell us a little bit more about where you stand in that process? What changes have you made so far, and where is there still room to go?
Yep. I can take that. So fourth quarter 2024, I guess we got to reorient ourselves with what last year means at this point in time. So fourth quarter 2024, we announced a restructuring. It was like a mid-teen charge that we took in the quarter. And at that point in time, we committed to about $20 million on an annualized basis to get out of the business to help bottom line, to help 2025 earnings. I think at the time, we said about three quarters of that would yield benefit in 2025.
That's what we've seen happen. If you just look at our third quarter year-to-date results, we're down about 12% in G&A. That'll continue to be a tailwind for us as we go through the end of Q4. And we expect a little bit of benefit still to finish as we go into 2026. I think that's important because that showed sort of our first ability to be able to do multiple things. One was to be able to leverage our service centers around the world to sort of rebuild capability centers in part for our back office. Paul just mentioned R&D. It was one of the reasons we were able in 2025 to be able to invest in R&D. And as we were a little ahead of schedule on our program, we invested even a little bit more as we came through the fourth quarter of 2026.
As you refer to sort of that cycle, that's something we will continue to work on, basically turning continuous improvement in the reinvestment in the business for what we know will be increased organic growth.
Maybe just one last question in the minute that we have left. You've talked about line of sight to tax improving in 2026. You eliminated the intercompany loan that was putting some pressure on that tax rate, and you've improved profitability. What are the pieces that get you to a more normalized tax rate moving forward, and what does a more normalized tax rate look like for Envista?
Yeah. So just to kind of orient everybody, we talked about two things very specifically in our third quarter earnings relative to tax. One was that we gave an updated guide for full year 2025, a tax rate of around 33%.
That was about four points from how we originally saw the year. And most of that came from improved U.S. profits. And then the second that we talked about was the resolution of an intercompany loan. We had a very significant intercompany loan between Europe and the U.S. We pay interest on that loan. And per U.S. GAAP, there's a deductibility cap relative to U.S. interest relative to your U.S. earnings. So two things happened. We resolved that loan. That means we restructured and eliminated that position. But we've also got the improving U.S. earnings that's helping to improve deductibility. We'll talk about it very specifically as we get into 2026 earnings, but it's a meaningful reduction for us next year and as we go forward.
And then we'll also talk about a little bit of the sort of finality to get back to a tax rate that's in sort of the mid-20s%.
Great. With that, I think we're out of time. So thanks, Paul and Eric, for joining. And thanks, everyone, for listening in.
Thanks, Lilly. Thanks, Robert. Thanks, everyone.