0400 Hours, we welcome viewers to this live broadcast of Investor Update, where we are joined by White Pearl Technology Group. Joining me here in the studio is the company's Chief Investment Officer, Oskar Carling. Welcome.
Thank you so much.
Joining us via a link in the digital studio, we have the company's founder and strategic advisor, Ebrahim Laher. Welcome, Ebrahim.
Thank you.
So, I will begin this interview, but before I do, I do want to remind our viewers to please ask your questions in the live chat, and I will be keeping an eye on it during this broadcast. So, Ebrahim, if we talk about your most recent report, your Q4 for the full year, you managed to report revenue of SEK 510 million. Can you break this down for us, how much of that revenue is recurring and how much isn't?
Sure. I think, out of that, revenue, approximately 25% of our revenue is classified as recurring revenue. Primarily, this comes from subscription of our own IP, our own products, managed IT services, as well as then infrastructure monitoring and support.
Mm. How much of that recurring revenue, the 25%, can we expect to carry over into 2026?
Yeah, I mean, I think basically all of it will... carries over into 2026. Some of them are quite long-term contracts as well, and I think that's the value of, of, of the recurring model we currently have.
Mm. Can you tell us more about the long-term contracts? By an average, how long do they usually run?
Yeah, I mean, I think they'll run anything between three-five years, and there's also renewals that, I mean, take place, but I think that's the average timeline for these contracts.
We'll talk a little bit about geography, and I turn then to Oskar. A sizable portion or a majority of your revenue comes from Africa and Middle East. Europe is a rather sizable portion, and you want to accelerate growth there. How dependent is White Pearl on emerging markets versus Europe?
So Sweden is important because we're a Swedish global tech company listed in Nasdaq First North Stockholm, and a lot of our shareholders are based here in Stockholm. Investors and market often value Swedish and European revenue and profits higher. At the same time, in the Middle East, Africa, and Asia Pac, and other regions, valuation of target are often lower. It's higher margin, and we can achieve a higher IRR, and.
Mm.
At the same time, the combination between this is good. Right now, we have 28% of the revenue comes from Europe, and we want it to grow up until 40%-50%.
Why is the European market so important for White Pearl to grow?
Because we are based here in Stockholm, and it's an important thing to tell our shareholders that our governance come from here, and also that we really think it's important to achieve this market. Last year, we take a really kickoff to do this acquisition to Lumin4ry, to the Spotr Group companies, and right now we have also really good LOI. So I think we want to show the market that we... Yeah, we want to grow here.
Speaking of that acquisition, we have a question from a viewer. Last year, you acquired your first two Swedish companies, Lumin4ry and Nuport. Can you share us the achievement or challenges in cross-sell/upsell strategy and implementation of them so far?
The thing with Lumin4ry, it's a good company. It's a good contract with the finance and banks. So we have did a pretty good implementation. So, from scratch, we don't want to do anything, we want the companies to continue growing by themselves. And, from this year we want to look into the cross-selling and upselling for them.
Moving on then to your 2026 targets, you aim to grow by 20%. How much of this growth is expected to be organic, and how much of it is expected to be through acquisitions?
Yeah. As we said in the report, it's about 70% from the acquisitions and 20% from organic growth. Organic growth comes from cross-selling and winning more work with existing customers. Our main acquisition focus going to be Sweden and Europe, but we will continue to grow in the global world as well.
I turn to Ebrahim now. With that growth in mind, when looking through your EBITDA margins, for 2025, it was 17%, and with these targets in mind, for 2026, what margin level do you see as sustainable?
Sure. I mean, look, we believe that the 16.9% delivered during the year is of a strong level for a company like us. I think for 2026, we believe that a sustainable range will be around the 16%-18% of EBITDA, of EBITDA. I think with integration synergies, higher software content sales as well, I think there's a potential for us over time to still expand that. Now, I think it's important to understand that peers in the market that we have are not nearly at these levels, okay? I think, like, Oskar was adding, I think even though 70% of our revenue growth in 2025 was inorganic, 68% of our profit growth actually was organic, and I think this tells you that the margin quality in our operations is increasing, and it's not just coming from acquisitions, right?
So I think our focus remains cross-selling within the group, increasing higher margin digital software and revenues, as well as then leveraging shared services in Sweden and beyond. So I believe that margins should remain comfortably around the 16%-potentially 18%-... above 17%-18% in 2026.
That sounds very good, of course, but what are some of the operational risks that you see as perhaps dangerous here in the moving 12 months?
Sure. I mean, I think every business like ours, when you, when you're operating at the scale we are, there will be some operational risk. I think three that I'd maybe like to highlight at this point is integration, execution. We have grown through acquisitions quite, actively over the last 12-18 months, and I think the main risk always in such a scenario is the execution of the integration and the cross-selling. However, we believe that most acquisitions we've done are small, profitable, and founder-led, hence, integration is focused on finance, reporting, and sales alignment. So we are not doing large transformational deals, so we believe that's how we'll mitigate that one. The second one is currency and emerging market exposure.
I think given where currencies have gone globally, it's actually worked a little bit the other way, but a portion of our revenue, as you know, does come from emerging markets. How do we mitigate that? I think increasingly we're focusing on European revenue share, as Oskar was saying. A lot of our contracts now are denominated in either USD or in euros, and I think centralized financial foresight in terms of the treasury function within the group. The last one then, I believe, is talent and delivery capacity. As an IT services group, we are growing significantly, and I mean, the pool for talent is limited. I think the mitigation is that our delivery model is across multiple countries, multiple geographies. We've got large delivery centers in the emerging market.
We've got internal training programs and shared resources, which allow us to focus on higher value services as opposed to volume staffing.
Mm. Can you elaborate on the talent that you're currently looking for and what it is that makes the pool so small and the challenges you're facing there?
Yeah, I mean, I think it's competition. I think IT is now driving a lot of the world of business, and I think our... not just our own competitors in the world of IT are, are fighting for IT talent, but a lot of the large enterprises globally are hiring significant amount of IT talent and pools. So hence, I think that's why it makes the war for talent such an important step. We've got 950 people in the group, almost 1,000, and I think, our biggest asset remains our people, and hence a lot of activity around that.
I turn to you, Oskar. What is the capital allocation strategy in the coming 24 months?
We will use capital mainly for acquisitions, but we will be very selective. The focus is cash flow and our ability to unlock hidden value in the companies that we acquire. We also track predictable revenues, like recurring revenue, and we look at IP and platform potential because that makes earning more stable. We structure deals with a healthy mix of shares, cash, and earn-out, and we want to reduce risk and align entrepreneurs with long-term incentives.
A viewer in the chat asks if you ever consider a stock buyback scheme as a counterbalance to share dilution?
Right now, it's not allowed in the SME list in Sweden to do it. It's maybe going to be a new rule in Sweden that you can do it after 2026, but right now we can't do it.
If we continue to ask about the cash, what is the real leverage and cash generation profile?
For us, the most important thing is Free Cash Flow. We want a healthy capital structure and a sustainable leverage. The logic for us is simple: long finance acquisitions. Acquisition generate cash flow, and the cash flow supports the balance sheet and the future growth. And because we use a mix of shares, cash, and earn-outs, that I said before, we protect the cash and reduce the risk while keeping flexibility.
What KPIs are relevant to track, both for investors but also you internally?
IRR, free cash flow, also EBITDA, because we want to grow sustainable, so we don't just want to grow on top line, we want to grow on the bottom line as well, as well as the organic growth as well. So we want to keep it this way, 70% on the acquisition side and 30% on the organic side.
We filter out fully the acquisitions and focus only organically, what will White Pearl look like in three years?
So, you know, even without acquisitions, the group will be stable. The companies are not dependent on the parent. Acquisitions accelerate growth, but the base business stands strong on its own. Like we showed in the report, around 30% growth is organic. That's pretty good, actually.
I turn now back to Ebrahim. What are the three coming milestones that the investors should look forward to in the next 12 months?
Oh, interesting question. I think the first one is continued European expansion. Okay, we are building a stronger base, as you've seen in the Nordics, in Europe. Like, Oskar said, LOIs have been signed. Some of them have already been announced to the market. I think investors should really expect selective acquisitions or partnerships continuing in Europe, the Nordics specifically. I think increased share of our revenue from mature, higher multiple markets, stronger local customer base in key European regions. I think that's number one. Number two is really around the integration and margin stability. I think that the next phase for WPTG is really about execution rather than rapid expansion. What do we want to demonstrate? We want to demonstrate stable, improving EBITDA margins, strong cash conversions, as Oskar was talking about, and then clear cross-sell impact across the group.
We're already seeing that in our improved margins. We believe this will validate the platform model we have and show that growth is translating into sustainable profitability as well as cash flow. The third one, I believe, is in the area of governance, reporting, and global audit enhancement. I think as the business has grown and continues to grow significantly, in scale and geographic footprint, we are now strengthening our governance and financial oversight. I think we've announced some changes to our structure. We've enhanced our advisory board in this area as well. So I think, investors should be looking for some key steps during the next year. I think the first one will be partnering with the global group auditor that will align with our size, as well as international operations.
I mean the scale that we've achieved, enhancing those reporting structures across all of the subsidiaries, strengthening internal controls and financial processes. We believe this is a very important milestone, because strong governance is the key requirement, we believe, to attract the kind of long-term investors we want, institutional investors in the business, as well as it certainly improves confidence in our reported numbers, as well as then potential re-rating of ourselves according to... or at least compared to our peers.
Continuing on the peer discussion, how do you currently view yourself against them, both operationally in terms of competition, but also in valuation?
Look, I mean, I think we compare very, very well to peers, especially in the Nordics. I think if you look at our growth rate, our EBITDA margins, our organic profit contribution, like I said, 68% in 2025, I think we are definitely out-delivering our peers, and I think we are delivering a leading example. I think generally, many Nordic IT services companies like ours grow maximum 5%-10% annually, so I think we're growing faster. I think our EBITDA margins are definitely in line or higher than all of our peers.
Mm.
Okay? I think in valuation terms, unfortunately, we are trading at a significant discount. I think on a PE basis, we are closer to six at the moment, while a lot of our peers in the Nordics are trading between 10-18 x. So I think the gap for us is not operational. We believe it's market perception and coverage, so our focus remains on focusing on our business, consistent reporting, strong cash flow, fewer but higher quality acquisitions, and we believe over time that the valuation will close with regards to our peers.
And with comparing yourself to peers, which, which companies, and I know you burst into KPIs a little bit there, but which companies and which KPIs are relevant?
Yeah, I mean, I think, you know, we really compare with the Nordic mid-cap kind of IT service providers, digital consultancies, software-led IT platforms. I think those are the companies where I think our peers are currently sitting. For us, the KPIs that we track internally and externally, I think Oskar mentioned some of them, but I think really it's organic growth, the EBITDA margin, cash conversion, and then lastly, revenue mix. I think the question you asked in terms of recurring subscription revenue, software versus services, Europe versus emerging markets, I think these are the four key drivers that, I mean, we basically look at in terms of measuring ourselves.
Thank you very much, Ebrahim. That was all my questions, but there are a few more unanswered questions in the chat. So I'll think I'll simply throw them up, and either of you can sort of jump in. First of all, could you share a bit more detail on the current progress in the Phase 1 with SALGA, and how do you see the potential for a longer term agreement developing? Ebrahim?
Sorry, can you repeat that question? I...
Yes. Could you share a bit more detail on the current progress in Phase 1 with SALGA, and how you see the potential for longer-term agreement developing?
Yeah, I mean, I think we're actually doing some really amazing work with regards to local municipalities in Africa. I think the AI work that we're currently doing there remains really of a very high standard. We're doing things like revenue collections. We're doing things like clean up of the accounts as well. We're contacting customers. We're verifying meters. So there's some really high level detailed work, which, I mean, we continue to do with the local government authorities.
A follow-up question there: Is the integration for Nexus to be rolled out across multiple municipalities through SALGA, or is the platform primarily being used central SALGA level?
No, I think, I mean, we're basically using Nexus throughout the world, actually, not only just in Africa. I mean, currently we rolling out the Nexus platform in the Middle East as well as then Asia and India. And I think we see that as our play going forward around Nexus.
The same user asks that he understands that you can't report every single contract, but what criteria determine whether something is too close to the market or not?
Yeah, I mean, I think it's obviously materiality, in terms of sometimes the financial value, as well as then sometimes maybe the solution as well, in terms of maybe it's a strategically new solution, like in this case, our own AI solution, which, I mean, we are, we are building and taking to market. So I think that's really that, and over and above that, it's the regulatory requirements, which are basically defined by Nasdaq.
Thank you very much, Ebrahim. Oskar, a question for you, no doubt. What will happen with Spotr Group? When will you send out the stocks from White Pearl?
So, we haven't decided yet what we're going to do with that, so that's the question of that.
All right. Well, thank you very much, Oskar, and thank you very much, Ebrahim, for being here and answering our questions.
Thank you.