Bank Polska Kasa Opieki S.A. (WSE:PEO)
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Earnings Call: Q2 2022

Aug 4, 2022

Operator

Dzień dobry. Good afternoon, ladies and gentlemen. We would like to welcome you at the presentation of our financial results after the Q2. At the beginning, I will introduce our presenters, Magdalena Zmitrowicz, Vice President for Enterprise Banking Division, Leszek Skiba, Paweł Strączyński, CFO, and Ernest Pytlarczyk in charge of digital transformation. I give the floor to the CEO, Leszek Skiba.

Leszek Skiba
CEO, Bank Pekao S.A.

Thank you very much. We are meeting here to discuss the results of our Q2. In the slide that you can see now, there are four key points that we have identified as a good summary of this quarter. If we go one by one, the first is about the scale of growth that we recorded, both in our enterprise segment, corporate banking, including enterprise segment. Magda Zmitrowicz will discuss in details. We are very proud of having achieved volume growths that were the highest among our key competitors. A separate part of our presentation will focus on that.

As for the second point, with regard to retail banking, we are extremely happy with the high rate of growth in digital channels. It matters to us, and it is a key theme of our entire strategy to make sure that digitization, especially of retail banking, takes place at the right pace. Briefly, this will be presented in the slide concerning our PeoPay application. As for operating efficiency and higher interest rates, we reduced the cost-to-income ratio, and then we made our deposit offer more attractive. The last element here regards responsible, as is always the case in Pekao S.A., approach to risk.

This quarter, we had material one-off event or material one-off events, but also a write-off related to mortgage loans. Those one-off events had a strong impact on the results of this quarter. We will discuss details of these. Let's go through the presentation. In this slide, you can see the result in the Q2, 23% lower than in the Q2, 2021. To a large extent, mostly, as Paweł Strączyński will discuss in his part of the presentation, this stemmed from two criteria, loans in Swiss francs, and the second contributor was the contribution to IPS, that is, this Institutional Protection Scheme, which we established together with other leading banks.

As for corporate banking and enterprise banking, we experienced very significant growth in volumes that we recorded, along with improvement of the result on profit on interest and commissions throughout the whole bank. Additionally, we managed to maintain the cost of risk between 50-60 base points. Also, regulatory charges and loans in Swiss francs method. The 4 pillars of our strategy are our guidelines and reference framework. It matters to us to increase the number of active clients in mobile banking. 3.2 million is the target we are aiming at. 2.6 million have already been achieved. We can see that we will deliver our target within the time horizon of the strategy. The second element is the cost of risk. Based on quarterly data, 8.2, slightly below the target.

However, taking into consideration the entire six months, that is a better result in the context of high interest rates. Cost of risk at 51 basis points and cost-to-income below the target of 42%. Actual number is at 37%. As for the increase in volume in loans to large corporations, 16%. In the enterprise segment, as much as 27%. We are also growing in terms of new current accounts of retail customers, and the increase was 45%. It is also relevant that we recorded a high rate of growth in digital channels. That is seen through the increase of activity of mobile customers, 19% up. Digitization rate increased to 63%.

I would like to remind you that this is one of the KPIs in our strategy indicating the proportion of processes in retail banking that can be completed in digital channels. We are talking about 63% here. 63% of processes that the customer can complete in digital channels. Of course, our target within the strategy horizon is 100%. As for cash loans, the increase was up to 73%, 17 percentage points up, that was in retail. Our PeoPay application. As we already signaled last time, it is very important to us to make sure that digitization is not only something that takes place in our back office, but also is experienced and visible to our customers.

We modify the PeoPay application to such an extent that the latest changes can be made available to customers as they are introduced. For example, loan repayment holidays and PeoPay application. This was not something that all banks did. Here we also have suggestions of payments, subscriptions. We can see what our competitors are doing. In this regard, we want to be better than them, so our functionalities are more flexible, allowing greater personalization of services. With regard to companies, we are proud of being with our clients. We are involved in ESG projects, Goldbeck Solar, that is a syndicated loan for a photovoltaic farm. We were the loan agent, the security agent in this project. Magda can share more details of this transaction.

It was also very important for us to sign the European Bank for Reconstruction and Development for PLN 200 million. With respect to transactions that will be given to small and medium enterprises. Also, women entrepreneurs will be the beneficiaries of this project. We have seven-year bonds where we were the co-organizer here with construction loan. On the right-hand side in the slide, you can see the awards. As usual, we try to make sure that we keep the highest standard in investment banking. We are awarded on this account as the best investment bank. Also for the second year in a row, Złoty Bankier for the best personal account.

That is also a Business Protector Award for support to enterprises in combating the pandemic effect and also Euromoney Award. Very briefly about the development in Ukraine. As we signaled earlier, we are making great efforts to support refugees from Ukraine to make sure that people who come from Ukraine and live in Poland have access to banking services in a very simple, flexible format. It is not only the availability of Ukrainian in applications as a language. We canceled fees for bank transfers, support in public services such as applying for 500+ benefits through digital channels. Also, previously we talked about our charity activities, but it should also be said that we support Ukrainian refugees through voluntary activities.

Volunteering is extremely popular in our bank. Support of employee volunteering where they offer their support is something that is very high on our agenda. We make sure to increase the volunteering activity of our employees who worked for Ukrainian refugees. More than 3,330 hours were offered as volunteer hours in support to victims of war. Almost 70,000 accounts were opened for Ukrainian citizens. In total, the accounts that we have today stand at more than 223,000. A brief summary. ROE in the first half of the year at 11.1%. That is above our target. Cost-to-income 40.4%. That is a better result than the target in our strategy.

We are aiming at achieving the target in terms of the number of active hours of mobile banking, 2.6 million, and in digitization, 63%. I give the floor to Magda. Good afternoon. Warm welcome to all of you. Indeed, when we watch the developments in enterprise banking, we have two segments there, small and medium enterprises, and mid-enterprises. We could see an increase in sales at the end of last year and in the Q1 this year. In the Q2, we also recorded growth, PLN 6.5 billion new services, new sales, loans, leasing, factoring. We also maintain high dynamics of acquisition, that is at the level of last year. Both new sales and acquisition translate into the balance.

Current balance after the Q2, almost PLN 33 billion. We grow in all lines. Also, it should be added that clearly Polish companies are beneficiaries of disruption in supply chains that we saw during the COVID pandemic. A lot of orders from foreign companies directed to Poland, but not only Poland, also the Czech Republic, Hungary are the beneficiaries. Our companies are clearly the winners in spite of the increase in employment costs, energy and cost of raw materials, we have more orders. Also, thanks to the fact that we are a stable bank, we have long-term relationships with customers and we respond to customers' needs, supporting the growth. Our loan policy does not change. Clearly companies show good results.

I would like to show you here that the Q1 we didn't have data. Segmentation shows sometimes divergences, but our quarter-to-quarter comparisons us versus other banks show our portfolio development dynamics is at 22%, after the Q2, 27%. It is extremely important, something to which we pay particular attention at Pekao S.A., is the quality of our portfolio. That is the security of the portfolio and NPL is low. The cost of risk is at 2%. Something that matters to us very much, that has always mattered to us very much, and in particular since the COVID pandemic, is that we are looking for guarantee products for our customers.

I can say that we are the leader in sale of guarantee products, in particular FG POIG and guarantees, PLN 7 billion of secured portfolio, but also the de minimis and Biznesmax guarantees. There is a new guarantee, unique, in the Polish market, with EIF for almost PLN 5 billion with new guarantee products for our clients. The agreement that Leszek has already mentioned with the European Bank for Reconstruction and Development at PLN 200 million for leasing that we signed not long time ago. That is an agreement for small and medium enterprises and support to women entrepreneurs. Also in the offer we had Pożyczka.

Magdalena Zmitrowicz
VP of Enterprise Banking Division, Bank Pekao S.A.

We've also had liquidity loans, on click products. We keep speeding up the loaning process as well as interest loans that enjoyed a lot of interest because these were practically loans at zero cost in cooperation with the BGK. We're talking about the large growth of the portfolio. What is important, and probably every banker pays attention to this, other than growing in the loan portfolio, we're also significantly growing the banking portfolio through transactionality, both in terms of currency, the turnover. We're talking about 43% in terms of currency spot turnover. There was a lot of volatility in Q1, also in Q2, hence probably the result, but also a lot of work when it comes to hedging instruments, forwards, derivatives, 19% of growth year-on-year.

When it comes to interest rate hedging, 70 + 73%. We're not only growing on FX, but also on the volume and number of transaction customers as well as volumes, basic drivers, volumes of national and international bank transfers. We're also very happy about this because we can see that our clients bank more and more with us and there's a lot of increasing cross-sell on the portfolio. Consequently, we're consistently developing the enterprise banking segment. The self-servicing segment, Pekao24, is being expanded by new functionalities. We're also working on with the newly electronic loan application.

The selfie solution that we implemented during the pandemic, and we're trying to make sure that this way of cooperating with the customer should be as intuitive as possible and as comfortable for the customers as possible. What we're also paying attention to when it comes to renewables funding, RES, we're emphasizing this. We can see a lot of interest from the customers when it comes to renewables. This is also definitely part of our energy strategy, transformation strategy. We're supporting those projects, expanding our teams. I'd like to take this opportunity to thank our clients for their trust, cooperation. I'd like to thank our employees for the very good Q2, and also invite those people who are not our clients to join our bank.

You're all kindly invited. Thank you very much. Hello, that was my part. Briefly about the macro situation presentation and forecasts. Looking at the situation of hard data for the last two months, we can clearly see that the economy is entering into a slowdown period. Technical recession is almost certain. We have the Q2-to-quarter decrease, but it's in effect of a high starting point. Notwithstanding as we look even further ahead, those scenarios that seem to be alternative negative scenarios, they are becoming more and more probable owing to the fact that the influx of energy resources to the West might simply be stopped. It's an element of geopolitics and the gas blackmail.

We can see on the right-hand side the aftermath that could be triggered for Germany's economy. As we know, this economy is key for Euroland, also for Poland when it comes to their trading partnerships. This scenario is what we more want to increasingly adopt as the baseline scenario. These risks are not internal to Poland. They are rather beyond our eastern or western border, and they might result in the scenarios presented by us being more negative. The chances are that we might not be very precise when it comes to our forecast. It all depends on the factors that we mentioned on the provision of natural gas. Germany is the largest economy also with a large proportion of chemical industry.

What we can also observe is the deterioration of hard ratios, also soft ratios which when it comes to the economic cycle for the banking sector run by the National Bank of Poland, here the scenario is even very negative. Of course, history shows, even recent history from several years, several months back at the beginning of the conflict, that it might also be overrated. What we'll be observing will be a tug-of-war between what we can see, maybe not in the commodities market, but in terms of the inflow of energy resources, the increase in energy prices, gas prices, and the impact on disposable income to customers, and also fiscal policy, well, which is trying to protect the customer. The consensus is beyond the soft landing.

However, it's shifting systematically towards hard landing and a significant recession in Western Europe. What we can see in terms of interest rates and inflation, this is the factor determining the interest rate pathway. Inflation has achieved a plateau of 16%. Then we have the beginning of the year, and the risk is that it might go higher up because we have a translation of the tariff decisions when it comes to the retail recipients of gas, energy. We cannot estimate it precisely. Then we were talking about a decrease owing to the slowdown and in the slowdown or recession period, because we're rather into a recession. We will be talking about GDP growth year-over-year at the beginning of next year for various reasons.

In the period of a worse economic cycle, also, it should have an impact on inflation. 6% of inflation is what we're talking about. 6% would be a real positive real interest rate, and probably the interest rate hikes should be reversed. Interest rates should be lowered by that time. What the governor of the National Bank of Poland has been saying also in global terms, those scenarios are very benign. The long end of the curve is reversing. If we're talking about the short-term scenario, we think that the hikes are still feasible this year because of the inflation, because of the market pressure and the PLN rate, it might be under pressure.

We don't think it's the beginning of the cycle of hikes, but as the case can always be at the end of the cycle of hikes, it's hard to guess whether it's this moment or slightly later. I would guess that we might still expect one or two hikes and then it would be reversed. Over to Paweł.

Paweł Strączyński
CFO, Bank Pekao S.A.

The results for Q2 was marked by four main drivers. One of them obviously very positive and three negative factors. The first positive factor was obviously the significant increase in net interest income by PLN 1.2 billion, whereas the three negative factors that impacted the net result as compared to Q2 of the previous year was, first of all, the net IPS institutional protection schemes contribution that we made a decision to participate in this voluntary scheme. Another factor is the provision related to the Swiss franc portfolio. That's about PLN 402 million.

After the in-depth analysis considering the FX rate changes, the changes in interest rates for the PLN loans, as well as the potential interest rate hikes in Switzerland, as well as in analyzing the so far actions filed when it comes to their numbers and average amounts, we decided to update the model calculating the CHF denominated loan provisions, and this new calculation resulted in additional write-down of PLN 402 million. At this moment, our Swiss franc portfolio valued at PLN 2.8 billion is provisioned almost at 40% because the total provisions amount to roughly PLN 1 billion.

The third one-off factor that had an impact on the results compared to the previous year was the recognition in the operating costs of the results of the review performed and the reclass in IT of expenditure between CapEx and OpEx. That review that we performed in Q2 showed that some of the expenditure incurred so far that had been recognized in the balance sheet should have been reclassed to the P&L as operating expenses. We're talking about a relatively insignificant amount compared to the balance sheet total assets or the materiality level. We decided that this amount of roughly PLN 180 million.

Sorry, PLN 83 million would be recognized as a one-off. The dynamics, if we're talking about the comparison between the quarters, we're talking about a decrease, first of all, owing to the one-offs. We're talking about a decrease of 23% and vis-à-vis Q1 of this year by 48%. The ROE in Q2 was at the level of 8.2% and Tier 1 at a stable level of 14.8%. The cost to income, including BFG and excluding IPS, was at the level of 37%. The gross operating income semester to semester grew by 80% from, well, to PLN 3.8 billion.

In the case of quarters, comparison between quarters, also the dynamics were positive vis-à-vis last year almost by 68%, vis-à-vis the Q1 of this year by 8.5%. Operating income, 1H 2021 to 1H 2022 by almost 44%, quarter to quarter by almost 45%, and then compared to Q1 this year by over 9%. In terms of operating costs, the increase was by 4.7% and excluding the provisions for employment optimization by 9.9%. This is net of BFG and IPS. Quarter to quarter, 16% +16% vis-à-vis Q2 last year, and Q1 this year by almost 11%.

Leszek Skiba
CEO, Bank Pekao S.A.

Result on interest achieved thanks to high interest rates above all. Net interest income semester to semester higher by over 73% from PLN 2,673 to PLN 4,636. Quarter to quarter, compared to the Q2 last year, growth by over 91%, compared to the Q1 this year, up by 24%. Net interest margin for our semester, 379 basis points. That is, 149 basis points up. With the average WIBOR 0-29 with 6.25 versus previous quarter last year, 183 basis points up on net interest margin.

Compared to the Q1 this year, up by almost 70 base points from 334 to 412 base points. During the conference to journalists, I also mentioned that in our assessment we have achieved a certain peak in net interest margin at 412 points. I quoted a rather broad range where our net interest margin should stabilize. This will be driven by both macroeconomic situation and the actual share of the cost of loan repayment holidays that will be recognized in the Q3. This is something that I will discuss in a moment. Loan volumes. In retail, we are at the level of last year. Compared to the Q1 this year, a decrease by 1.3%.

Mortgage loan portfolio is more or less at the level of the end of the first semester 2021. Compared to the Q1, it is lower by PLN 1.1 billion. If we look at the factors that contributed to this, we had higher sales by about PLN 1 billion additional sales planned, repayment also at a level of about PLN 1 billion. At the same time, surplus payments or early repayments of loans to the tune of about PLN 1.2 billion. In a moment we will discuss deposits. Here we have more or less the level by which we saw deposits in retail segment decrease. That leads us to the conclusion that some customers used their deposits in our bank to make earlier repayments of their mortgage loans.

In the corporate segment, very high dynamics in loans, 12% year-on-year and 3.3% compared to the Q1. Loan portfolio at almost PLN 99 billion. In deposits, we recorded a decrease year-on-year in retail by about 3%. That is over PLN 3 billion. Compared to the Q1 this year, the decrease was by about PLN 1.3 billion, which is 1.2% down. We have also seen a significant decrease in investment funds of over PLN 4 billion. Caused by the macroeconomic situation, but also by the improving situation with regard to deposits, not only in our bank, but in the entire banking segment as well.

As for corporate deposits, here growth's very high, 17 percentage points year-on-year from less than PLN 85 billion to almost PLN 97 billion. If we compare the Q1 to the second one, we see a decrease by PLN 500 million, so we can say that this is practically negligible change. As for results on fees and commissions, semester-to-semester dynamics, that is more than 10% up. The most positive driver was an increase in currency Forex transactions related to high volatility of currencies in the market in the Q2. We also recorded a decrease in fees on management and brokerage services. If we compare quarters compared to the Q2 last year, an increase in fees and commissions slightly over 6%.

The comparison to the Q1 this year shows an increase of about 1.5%. We have significant dynamics of operating costs caused mainly by an increase in regulatory costs. That is our joining of the IPS. There are two further factors. One is recognition of PLN 83 million as a one-off event. One-off write off from CapEx to OpEx, but also coming into force of the remuneration increases negotiated with our social partners and effective since the first of April this year. Dynamics of operating costs without provisions for optimization of employment almost 10% and reported dynamics 4.7%.

If we compare quarters, compared to the Q2, 2021, 16.4% up in operating costs and compared to the Q1 this year up by 10.9%. Capital position remains very good. Tier 1 at 14.8%, 5.5 percentage points higher than the regulatory minimum and safely higher than a dividend criteria. The total capital ratio 16.6 versus the minimum of 11.3, which is also over five percentage points higher than required and on a safe level in terms of dividend criteria. MREL 16.6, set by the regulator for this year, target is 16.8. For next year, that is, 17.7. The situation in potential MREL issues has not changed.

We are monitoring the situation and any decisions that are issued. We will decide depending on how the situation develops, bearing in mind the obligation to meet the requirement of at least 16.8. Cost of risk in the Q2 at a higher but stable level of 51 points. The conference summing up the Q1, I mentioned that we expected an increase in cost of risk, but we did not expect this growth higher than other costs increase expected in the strategy. We estimated that between 50 and 60 basis points in the strategy. Obviously, here we have the additional impact of the additional provision for Swiss franc loans.

We had an improvement in coverage ratios NPL to 4.8% without the assets from the former Idea Bank. In total 5.6%. That is lower than the Q2 2021. Swiss franc coverage ratio puts us as number one. In other banks, as percentages range between 13%-36%. The reasons behind the increase of the provision for Swiss franc mortgages were also discussed and the regulatory factors. Of course, there is this governmental program of the so-called loan repayment holidays. We estimated our cost of participation at 85%, and we estimated the cost of this program at 2.4 billion PLN. This cost will be recognized as a one-off item in the Q3 this year.

We did not publish any estimates regarding Borrowers' Support Fund because the range in which we expect to participate is very broad. The PLN 210 million that we quote here in the slide is our estimation, the middle of a pretty broad range. Once details of this program, details of the banks involved in the program are known, we will share such information based on more reliable calculations. The third factor that I have already mentioned, recognized in the Q2 this year, PLN 440 million of our contribution to the voluntary protection fund, that is this Institutional Protection Scheme for commercial banks. A brief summary now. We increased very significantly our scale of operations in the corporate segment.

That was both in corporations and in enterprise banking segments. We have continued high pace of growth in digital channels. We introduced more functionalities and improved our applications. We have improved our operational efficiency. We are making our deposit offer more attractive by responding to both macroeconomic indicators and the steps taken by our competitors. We have demonstrated a responsible approach to the risk associated with Swiss franc mortgage loans. We also actively participate in the governmental programs to support borrowers. We represent the position that the costs that we are to incur today compared with the cost of Non-introduction of such programs and non-participation in this kind of support to borrowers would in the future result in much higher costs, be those for the banking sector, or be that for our bank. I think here about the general situation of the sector. On the other hand, a significant deterioration of the loan portfolio quality.

Magdalena Zmitrowicz
VP of Enterprise Banking Division, Bank Pekao S.A.

This closes the first part of our meeting. Now let's pass on to the Q&A session. Thank you very much for your participation in person or attendance in the room. This is the first time that we're holding this meeting on a hybrid basis, certainly since the pandemic. Previously, we only had it online. Let's start with the questions from people in the room, and then we'll pass on to the online questions. Good afternoon. It's nice to see you in person. I have a question about the capital adequacy and what sort of profit, what proportion of profit has been included in it, and what proportion of dividend, if any, has been accrued in the regulatory capital. As of today, we have included half of the result in the ratios. The dividend for this year is at the level of 51. The dividend policy is also defined at between 50 and 75 points. I'm not sure if this information is sufficient.

I would perhaps add to this, because we're showing the details for Slide 53 in the backup. In, as we compare ourselves to the competition, we're showing it on a different basis because we have a different portfolio. Due to a different approach to the portfolio, securities portfolio, and in our case, it has a very insignificant impact, well, 0.1%. We had an increase in the operational risk because of the CHF. Mind you that these drivers have not significantly shifted the ratio on a quarter-to-quarter basis.

My question was rather moving towards understanding whether this year you'll be able to circumnavigate the MREL issuance. Because I understand that if this ratio is at 16.6% and MREL is at 16.8%, then next year you won't be able to pay the dividend. At least in line with the currently binding rules. I think this is too far-reaching a conclusion. 6.6, well, 6.8, this is the ratio to be met at the end of the year. We're not precluding the issuance for the purposes of MREL. We're not precluding it. However, we'll be deciding on the issuance and the size of it as well as the timing. We'll be making the decision on it, having observed what's going on, both in the market and in terms of our ratio. It is the board's goal to adjust the potential issuances to meet the MREL requirements to keep the dividend policy in the next years as assumed.

Okay. Thank you. If there are any further questions, please ask them. Let's pass on to the online questions. I think the presentation has addressed most of them in the course of the meeting, so perhaps it would make sense to develop what sort of impact we can see on the cost of risk of a shock scenario when it comes to the natural gas supplies.

Leszek Skiba
CEO, Bank Pekao S.A.

Let me start. Generally, as was discussed by Magda, from the point of view how we perceive our customers, Polish companies, be it from the SMEs or the mid-sector as well as large corporations, they are in a very good shape. Very good shape when it comes to liquidity, when it comes to the debt-to-income ratio.

From this perspective, we can see the shield effect that was for certain form of increasing the capital or protection from the risk of bankruptcy. Even given various disturbances or turbulences, they should, by principle, not significantly impact the condition of the companies. They might probably, I mean, the problems, potential problems with the supplies, which are also not the baseline scenarios. Most analysts assume that the gas price will be high, but there should be no problems with access to gas, to natural gas in Poland. I mean, we're talking about Poland because it can be different in various countries. The baseline scenario assumes that the gas supplies will be there. They might be at a very high price probably, so given the turbulences in the European market and the shortages in some countries.

From this point of view, in some segments, this might be problematic, but it should not hit our customers significantly. Yes, we're talking about wide tail scenario. It will be mostly negative for Germany, and the spillovers might be negative for us. We know from various episodes of slowdown or recession that Poland does not respond on a one-to-one basis. The specificity of our economy is such that we tend to perform better than our main partners in the slowdown periods, both as we know the COVID period and the 2008, 2009 financial crisis period. We just know that it works this way. At this moment, also the main ratios, be it industrial production or others, look better than in the West. If we look at PMI, we're talking about a difference, a gap of 42%. There's a lot of worries, a lot of fear, except that it doesn't fully translate into the final business.

Magdalena Zmitrowicz
VP of Enterprise Banking Division, Bank Pekao S.A.

There are not very many questions about our results. Well, let me perhaps comment on CapEx or Swiss francs. I would like to draw your attention to more issues that caused some divergence between our results and the expectations we had at the small TSUE. That was a total of PLN 60 million, PLN 40 million real estate and PLN 20 million small TSUE. Last week, the program of loan moratoria has been implemented. We started preparation for this. In our case, we made an assumption of 85%, which was quite conservative. You will realize vis-à-vis other banks and perhaps our first comments on this. Thanks.

From this point of view, we estimate, of course, this stems from the fact that per the data that we have, I mean, what we have is certain as of yesterday. We can see that it's roughly one-third of our customers have filed applications for repayment moratoria. We estimate that this is a result which is pretty much aligned to what we observe in the sector. In terms of the volume, it's slightly more. It probably surpasses roughly 40% because the average loan amount is higher for those who decide on the repayment moratorium.

Which means that the volume, cases are significant from the point of view of the end results for the bank. What we can see is that the rate and the fact that we should be at the beginning of the path means that we still assume the level of 85% as correct. We believe that our estimate is credible. These are the three most important things that should be mentioned. There's a couple of questions. Well, maybe let me group them. These are questions that can be answered easily and quickly. We have informed the market that we're not using our T2 instrument.

Of course, you know that a smaller proportion of this instrument will be included as effective Tier 2, which is aligned to the market practice predominant in Europe, as well as the regulators' expectation. There is also a couple of questions while we have this coverage of Stage 2. We have opened the provisions of 60%. These are not loans, well, these are Stage 2. They're not non-performing. Do we have any other questions from the room? Yes, please.

Kamil Kamyszewski
Equity Research Analyst, Santander Bank

Hello. Kamyszewski, Santander Bank. I'd like to ask you how you perceive your experiences, how you estimate your experiences with Idea Bank, and are there positive enough for you to be interested in a potentially larger transactions or perhaps not? That's my first question. The second one, now that we're talking to investors, the main topic in our conversations with investors are potential regulatory changes and charges to the banking sector. What are your thoughts of this potential risk?

Magdalena Zmitrowicz
VP of Enterprise Banking Division, Bank Pekao S.A.

When it comes to Idea Bank, our experience is such that this is a process that could be compared to. I mean, it's quite possible, despite various risks and turbulences that we have identified, this is something that we have passed in a very good shape. Of course, the key events take place at the beginning, at the moment of the acquisition that took place on New Year's Eve at the turn of 2022. What we have observed in the next two days was the acquisition of the entire structure, infrastructure, people, portfolio in a streamlined way.

The next risky stage was the data migration, which we also accomplished in a very smooth and rapid way, very efficient way. From this point of view, this is a process that was quite cumbersome in terms of our resources. However, from the time perspective, we can see that it has not caused any major turbulences when it comes to the processes of changes, digitization, and digital transformation of our bank. This is not a process that would have hampered us. This portfolio has yielded the accomplishment of our assumptions. Although this is, it's slightly remote from our risk profile. This business has appeared, however, it was not particularly profitable.

Generally, this transaction has been profitable, and from this point of view, we perceive this transaction as positive, as a sort of experience, but also an experience that has allowed us to streamline various processes and it also gives us a competence going forward in a horizon or where that we'll be trying to pursue in the horizon of a couple of years, although we might not be fully ready to do it right now. We're talking about an accomplishment of another M&A transaction that PKO will probably pursue by 2030 owing to the demand for urban banks in the horizon of a couple of years. It shows that we have competencies in this terms. I understand that your question is about here and now, the perspective of several months. Such an M&A transaction is not currently significant from our point of view because we perceive the digital transformation as much more significant for us. We have accomplished the M&A project. We have this competence in place, but as far as we know, there are others who are very close to finalizing this transaction.

Leszek Skiba
CEO, Bank Pekao S.A.

Regulatory risks, that's a difficult question indeed. I think that the experience with the credit holidays moratoria will show the extent to which this scheme is attractive to customers. In general, we find it quite difficult to predict the future for the upcoming several quarters. There is one topic that evokes very high emotions. Why we recognized this contribution to the Banking Guarantee Fund, while other banks did not do that. We will finally decide on this once the decision of the fund is made. We will see how the situation develops with the contributions to BFG. One more clarification. We do not have any average corporate income tax rate. We know that some banks do that at the averages, but we think that it is better not to do so, given so many changes happening during the year. Unless there are general questions, we will return with answers to the specific ones on one-on-one basis. We hope to have more talks with investors in September, October. Thank you very much for participation. Have a nice day today.

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